India-US Relations : News and Discussion

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 01 Oct 2014 06:13

Those who watched the coverage of Modi's visit, especially Arnab, I thought it was surprising he didn't line up Fair Didi as one of the many US guests he had on. She would have piled it on TSP. I wonder if she was there on any of the channels at all?

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 01 Oct 2014 06:43

That is a racist cartoon - obnoxious to say the least -

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 01 Oct 2014 06:47

I am wondering how it is NOT a racist cartoon. If snake charmer is a racist caricature, then that one definitely is racist.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 01 Oct 2014 06:57

http://www.indiawest.com/news/global_in ... b0402.html

Bera is a member of the American Sikh Congressional Caucus, founded last year by California Reps. Judy Chu and David Valadao. The congressional caucus has largely focused on domestic issues affecting Sikh Americans.

On Oct. 11, Dhillon will be leading a precinct walk through Sacramento on behalf of Ose; she expressed her hope that members of the Sikh community would join her on the walk to express their disapproval of Bera on his noncommittal stance on the 1984 riots.

After a flood of media erupted this month on the issue, Amar Shergill, co-founder of the American Sikh PAC, told India-West in an e-mail: “Since Congressman Bera is a member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, it is not unreasonable to ask him to take a moral stand against the genocide of Sikhs by the Indian government in 1984.”

Avarachan · Post by **Avarachan** » 01 Oct 2014 07:26

ramana wrote:Philip First time India is getting a chance to carry the fight into Araby. After Qasim's razza in Sind here is a chance to settle account. Fighting ISIS India can support Iran and Syria.

I would recommend that India stay out of this. There are certain countries involved which are experts in spoofing communications, running disinformation campaigns, etc. I imagine that one of those countries could deceive India into bombing the wrong target, and then a PR nightmare would ensue. Besides, Russia sees Syria as its turf and is already deeply involved there.

If India wants to get involved, it could do so later, on a humanitarian basis. That could earn India a lot of goodwill in both Iraq and Syria.

Pulikeshi · Post by **Pulikeshi** » 01 Oct 2014 07:40

The recommendation to keep ones hands clean, but at the same time become a powerful nation always cracks me up!
Guess the only way to make that happen is to combine the 36 stratagemic with sun tzu tacticurry.

The Vijigishu has neither such definitional nor executional luxury - all options are open till they become optional!

PS: I am not advocating action or inaction... my grouse is with the non-alignment tainted edumacated intellects.
Either have a policy of not defining alignments or be aligned with a few... stating non-alignment is oxymoron.
Similarly, saying hands have to be clean, lives lost, is incongruence with great power - please to recognize onlee.

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 01 Oct 2014 07:45

^^^ Plenty of powerful nations not in the coalition

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 01 Oct 2014 07:48

^+1.

The last time US asked for Indian troops, they were to be under US command, which ultimately caused the idea to vaporize.

I see nothing different this time. We'll have troops but under Indian command in the Gulf, if at all. Sure, support services, comm, ordnance, supplies, logistics etc we can co-ordinate with others on. Perhaps.

An yes, the IPKF experience shows such things don't always end well for India. But hey, no risk, no gain, no?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 01 Oct 2014 07:51

Medical aid and education supplements but does not build fear and awe.
We need to send a squadron of su30 and give the Isis a taste of our bombs.
Nobody has any fear of India in mid east. That needs to change.

Right now any dog can piss against our car tyres and we retaliate with a shower of meds and books.

Sure some collateral could ensue but well behind king khan who has already killed some lakhs there directly or indirectly.

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 01 Oct 2014 08:32

Singha wrote:Medical aid and education supplements but does not build fear and awe.
We need to send a squadron of su30 and give the Isis a taste of our bombs.
Nobody has any fear of India in mid east. That needs to change.

Right now any dog can piss against our car tyres and we retaliate with a shower of meds and books.

Sure some collateral could ensue but well behind king khan who has already killed some lakhs there directly or indirectly.

What the hell does ISIS have to do with us? Plijj explain saar. Let them piss. They are going to be getting 10X more in the form of virulent pure islam. The ME will fear us when we get our act together and industrialize and develop.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 01 Oct 2014 08:33

Today's Jon Stewart (Daily Show's) coverage of NaMo was quite enjoyable.
Check it out.

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 01 Oct 2014 08:35

RoyG wrote:
Singha wrote:Medical aid and education supplements but does not build fear and awe.
We need to send a squadron of su30 and give the Isis a taste of our bombs.
Nobody has any fear of India in mid east. That needs to change.

Right now any dog can piss against our car tyres and we retaliate with a shower of meds and books.

Sure some collateral could ensue but well behind king khan who has already killed some lakhs there directly or indirectly.
What the hell does ISIS have to do with us? Plijj explain saar. Let them piss. They are going to be getting 10X more in the form of virulent pure islam. The ME will fear us when we get our act together and industrialize and develop.

Shouldn't we work closer home first. Go to Pakistan first for instance, liberate Tibet

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 01 Oct 2014 08:35

Hari Seldon wrote:^+1.

The last time US asked for Indian troops, they were to be under US command, which ultimately caused the idea to vaporize.

I see nothing different this time. We'll have troops but under Indian command in the Gulf, if at all. Sure, support services, comm, ordnance, supplies, logistics etc we can co-ordinate with others on. Perhaps.

An yes, the IPKF experience shows such things don't always end well for India. But hey, no risk, no gain, no?

Our people are very vulnerable in the gelf states and other malsi countries where they have gone to work. We cannot afford the blowback and will not be able to handle it.

No Indian boots outside of India ANYWHERE for ANY CAUSE or ANY REASON.

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 01 Oct 2014 08:39

^^ Did not think of it. Blowback in entire Muslim world

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 01 Oct 2014 08:40

Avarachan wrote:
ramana wrote:Philip First time India is getting a chance to carry the fight into Araby. After Qasim's razza in Sind here is a chance to settle account. Fighting ISIS India can support Iran and Syria.
I would recommend that India stay out of this. There are certain countries involved which are experts in spoofing communications, running disinformation campaigns, etc. I imagine that one of those countries could deceive India into bombing the wrong target, and then a PR nightmare would ensue. Besides, Russia sees Syria as its turf.

If India wants to get involved, it could do so later, on a humanitarian basis. That could earn India a lot of goodwill in both Iraq and Syria.

We don't need their goodwill. They hate us anyway for obvious reasons. why should we care about their medical condition or any other condition. Stay home, guard your borders and get down to nation building and securing prosperity.

gandharva · Post by **gandharva** » 01 Oct 2014 08:42

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 01 Oct 2014 08:47

chetak wrote:We don't need their goodwill. They hate us anyway for obvious reasons. why should we care about their medical condition or any other condition. Stay home, guard your borders and get down to nation building and securing prosperity.

+1008.

The bold part is most important. We need to fix ourselves, find and destroy the enemies within and nearby (Pakis). Develop, strengthen and prosper.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 01 Oct 2014 08:49

Any reactions from the discredited UPenn lot who were instrumnetal in getting the NaMo invitation withdrawn??

A Loomba, T Ghose and S Kaul et al??

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 01 Oct 2014 08:54

chetak wrote:Any reactions from the discredited UPenn lot who were instrumnetal in getting the NaMo invitation withdrawn??

A Loomba, T Ghose and S Kaul et al??

The game is up. Not much they can do now. Once we have a matured dharmic academic architecture we will be able to graduate 1000+ Modi's a year in different fields including the social sciences.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 01 Oct 2014 09:07

Surya wrote:That is a racist cartoon - obnoxious to say the least -

Surya - its an honest one an not a pseudosecular politically correct one. The stock impression of India has been portrayed as well as the reaction on the faces of the fatsos inside.

Avarachan · Post by **Avarachan** » 01 Oct 2014 09:10

chetak wrote:
Avarachan wrote: If India wants to get involved, it could do so later, on a humanitarian basis. That could earn India a lot of goodwill in both Iraq and Syria.
We don't need their goodwill. They hate us anyway for obvious reasons. why should we care about their medical condition or any other condition. Stay home, guard your borders and get down to nation building and securing prosperity.

Actually, a lot of Iraqis and Syrians don't hate India. Both countries, curiously enough, retain memories of their pre-Islamic civilizations. In my opinion, India should encourage that tendency. It's very useful. But I do agree with you that the priority for India should be on developing India.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 01 Oct 2014 09:11

Here is an infographic depicting the funding of ISIS
http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/poli ... nfographic

What i find hilarious is that the US is reacting to ISIS exactly like India reacting to terror fom Pakistan. We hit the terroists who are active but only send dossiers to their main sponsors in Shitistan

The US is hitting ragtag groups but doing nothing about the people funding them from Saudi and Kuwait.

The more things change, the more they remain the same. Unless we need to bomb Kuwait, I think we should keep out of this.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 01 Oct 2014 09:14

sanjaykumar wrote:That's hardly a racist cartoon. Kinda funny and pithy.

Racist it is not. In bad taste and perpetuating negative and condescending stereotype? Heck, yes. No that I care. I bet none of these people know how to operate a bullock cart even if their life depended on it which might very well if they do not get off of their dependence on the fodder their A/C heated leather horseless carriages quaff a few million barrels a day and belch out greehouse gases to stink up whole continents.

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 01 Oct 2014 09:14

shiv wrote:
Surya wrote:That is a racist cartoon - obnoxious to say the least -
Surya - its an honest one an not a pseudosecular politically correct one. The stock impression of India has been portrayed as well as the reaction on the faces of the fatsos inside.

Yes, it's honestly obnoxious. It seems as India rises, the odiousness, racism, condescension and hatred which was well masked by a "gentlemanly" veneer, is crumbling. The more we rise, the faster the more belligerent and slanderous this class will become.

"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win."

Sounds cliche, but appears to fit here to the T.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 01 Oct 2014 09:16

Just leafing thru @bdutt's twitter posts.

She is ingratiatingly saccharin sweet to NaMo.

Realization (bitter) has finally dawned on her that her khana peena is solely dependent on NaMo.

turdesai and his worse half seem to be finding it tough to get a new jobs suitable to their imagined exalted station in life and have only landed some rather mediocre sinecures in some dopy channel.

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 01 Oct 2014 09:20

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 01 Oct 2014 09:21

chetak wrote: turdesai and his worse half seem to be finding it tough to get a new jobs suitable to their imagined exalted station in life and have only landed some rather mediocre sinecures in some dopy channel.

It's a big fall from sitting in the studio and remote controlling people to doing the street beat.

habal · Post by **habal** » 01 Oct 2014 09:24

Singha wrote:Medical aid and education supplements but does not build fear and awe.
We need to send a squadron of su30 and give the Isis a taste of our bombs.
Nobody has any fear of India in mid east. That needs to change.

Right now any dog can piss against our car tyres and we retaliate with a shower of meds and books.

Sure some collateral could ensue but well behind king khan who has already killed some lakhs there directly or indirectly.

I think American expats in Saudi stay in Aramco city, it's a fenced-out gated community, you may have seen how the Indian expats live, in the most dubious circumstances.

That does not mean nothing can be done, but there needs to be more preparation.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 01 Oct 2014 09:26

Kashi wrote: Yes, it's honestly obnoxious. It seems as India rises, the odiousness, racism, condescension and hatred which was well masked by a "gentlemanly" veneer, is crumbling. The more we rise, the faster the more belligerent and slanderous this class will become.

"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win."

Sounds cliche, but appears to fit here to the T.

Like I said earlier - these impressions of India and Indians are not "in the past" they are still alive and just below the surface. We need cartoonists who can portray things in perceptive ways. I liked the way this cartoonist has shown fat guys in suits. the "fat" is important. The US for example can be portrayed as a nation of fat people. This appearance has developed in the last 30 years even as I watched.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 01 Oct 2014 09:28

When Rome wanted to destroy Carthage it attended to destruction of Carthage in Africa. Peaceful have their base in middle east and it need to be destroyed there first.

We are hated because we live. Peaceful will kill attack bomb etc for that reason alone. Expecting their good will is suicidal at best.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 01 Oct 2014 09:58

Wall Street JournalVerified account ‏@WSJ

Today's Page One stories:

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 01 Oct 2014 10:02

Regarding petroleum America or the West is still going to be dependent on West Asia for at least another 10-15 years. By that time, the promise or demise of Shale rock fuel or alternative energy will be known. So Saudi is not going anywhere. Pakistan, China and Afghanistan are not going anywhere either. America could leave the region, but not India.

Boots outside India or not, humanitarian help or not; Pakistan and China are never going to sit tight and mind their business. They would avail of every opportunity to use a non-state actor to torment India. India will get hit, it is only a matter of time. Intelligence and security will decide the intensity and damage of such hits.

Islam is an itch that India has to scratch, vice versa. Tough call for India - should it wait or go and meet the enemies outside. India has been sitting patiently for more than 1000 years now; and only reacting to horrific actions.

Balochistan & Sindhustan as buffer states would serve better before boots get outside. Anyways, India contributes soldiers to UN Peace Keeping activities. And India could unglify Tibet after the creation of Balochistan and Sindhustan.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 01 Oct 2014 10:12

The only place that Indian troops should venture out is in defence of our borders in the neighbouring states .Further afield only as UN peacekeepers.We sent millions of Indians to fight the white man's wars in both WW! and WW2 and also to Africa to fight the natives in the colonies.My old school had a few of its students even fighting the Masai in Kenya with MGs while they attacked with spears and were mowed down like vermin. Indians did the dirty work for the white man in the past,NEVER again!

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 01 Oct 2014 10:26

Avarachan wrote:
chetak wrote:{quote="Avarachan"}
If India wants to get involved, it could do so later, on a humanitarian basis. That could earn India a lot of goodwill in both Iraq and Syria.{/quote}

We don't need their goodwill. They hate us anyway for obvious reasons. why should we care about their medical condition or any other condition. Stay home, guard your borders and get down to nation building and securing prosperity.
Actually, a lot of Iraqis and Syrians don't hate India. Both countries, curiously enough, retain memories of their pre-Islamic civilizations. In my opinion, India should encourage that tendency. It's very useful. But I do agree with you that the priority for India should be on developing India.

Sirjee,

A malsi is a malsi is a malsi. Never forget. They, as a "civilization" hate us for what we are and what we stand for.

There will be a massive blowback in the gelf countries and in any and every "islamic republic" including violent protests in India itself of the islam khatrey me hai variety. This is a given.

Sunnis will object violently in India and shias may tacitly support the GOI or it may be vice versa but offence will be taken for sure.

Soon the fakers will join together and target the GOI. Like I said, a malsi is a malsi is a malsi.

We should stop forever more using pussy words like civilization, humanitarian, age old and / or historical ties. We are only fooling and deluding ourselves. There will never be any reciprocation from the other side.

Get a bigger and meaner dog than them. In the end, this is the only language such "civilizations" really understand.

We have been using the wrong language all this while trying to appease a very mean and willfully deaf dog.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 01 Oct 2014 10:27

http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/09/3 ... 8A20140930

Interview - Pentagon upbeat on U.S.-India bid to deepen defense ties

A top Pentagon official said on Tuesday he had "high expectations" for a joint U.S.-Indian effort to deepen defense ties, but it could take a while to reach agreement on specific weapons to develop or produce together.

"Prime Minister Modi is very aware of the initiative. His staff is clearly motivated at every level to make it a success and move forward," Frank Kendall, the Pentagon's chief weapons buyer, told Reuters after a meeting with Indian Prime Minister Narenda Modi and U.S. Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel.

"I don't think people should expect instantaneous major announcements. It's going take a little ... while to work out exactly what we’re going to do and how we’re going to do it."

Kendall is the top U.S. official working on the joint Defense Trade and Technology Initiative with India that has identified 17 specific defense projects.

He said India and the United States were still discussing one of those ideas: a joint program for significant upgrades to the Javelin "fire and forget" anti-tank missile built by Lockheed Martin Corp(LMT.N) and Raytheon Co(RTN.N).

He said Washington was also open to a broader agreement on missile development with India, which could benefit both sides at a time when U.S. military spending is declining.

"If we pool our resources, we may be able to do more than the U.S. currently has planned," he said.

India's defense ministry is drafting a framework agreement after what he called a "very constructive" meeting with his counterpart in Washington several days ago, and the two sides agreed to alternate visits every six months.

In addition to several more traditional direct arms sales suggested by the defense industry, Kendall had asked the U.S. military services to put together a list of new smaller-scale weapons programs that India could join from the start.

Kendall gave no details, but said several U.S. Army programs might be good candidates and he planned to take the list of possibilities to India when he travels there in November.

India's military needed to assess its requirements and funding before any specific agreements could be reached.

"There are plenty of grounds for us to get together," he said. "What we do have to find are products that we both want, that we’re going to commit some resources to."

Pulikeshi · Post by **Pulikeshi** » 01 Oct 2014 10:29

I guess Indians have not learnt anything from history and it is still evident in several responses on this topic. When reading Amar Chitra Katha several years ago to some young ones... I was still stuck with a little ones comment... if so many outsiders attacked India, why no Indians went outside and attacked any of them... the clarity of a young mind!

Please to note, those who want to write/right historic wrongs and those who want to not repeat them and become neo-colonized slaves, ignore my remarks. For in doing so, you spare me and yourself the opportunity for righteous indignation.
For the rest who are pragmatic and want to understand my point, please to get out of this 'insular' Sooth Asian mindset onlee.
Eurasia is Indian zone of influence to play with... the only valid argument is that capability is lagging vision. Fix it!

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 01 Oct 2014 10:43

India Won't Join Military Action Against IS, Will Help US Control Terror

NEW DELHI: India will not join the US-led military campaign against the Islamic State in Iraq, a Ministry of External Affairs official said today in answer to a question after Prime Minister Narendra Modi and US President Barack Obama held talks in Washington today.

arijitkm · Post by **arijitkm** » 01 Oct 2014 11:25

And what the China thinks about.
India not a major player in US' plan to contain China

As Prime Minister Narendra Modi received a "rock-star" welcome in the US, China's state-run media today downplayed the visit saying India was not "sufficiently strong" and will not be a major player in America's strategy of containing the communist nation through "rebalancing of the Asia-Pacific".
......
......

member_27991 · Post by **member_27991** » 01 Oct 2014 11:43

"America aur Modi Mile hue hai" - Arvind Kejriwal

Pulikeshi · Post by **Pulikeshi** » 01 Oct 2014 11:46

^^ Chinese are doing a wonderful job containing themselves -
What is China's national power (per their definition) in politics, economy and security?
They are dealing with raging insurgencies with a rigid polity, their economy is in relative decline along with their your age population, and their security is stretched beyond what is economically feasible.

Note, I am not disagreeing with their opinion on India yet, but this is classic puffery!
The real issue is what the heck is containing China? They are in a geographically impossible situation - Japan, Korea, Vietnam, Australia and US all contending for power in their maritime neighborhood. They have not demonstrated control of even one sea, leave alone a ocean. They cannot become neither a Pacific power, nor a Indian Ocean power.

So what the heck is containing China?