Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion - June'14

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 07 Apr 2015 15:59

yeah its not a big black secret. the location of the two swordfishes will be though.

aadiverma · Post by **aadiverma** » 07 Apr 2015 16:19

My first post....looooonggg time lurker....speaking of this radar the amazing thing is that there are massive multi story apartments across this site....saw this from one of the houses that i visited and like Singha sir said no big secret at all visually..

KiranM · Post by **KiranM** » 07 Apr 2015 17:45

Karan M wrote:
Singha wrote:enroute to gurgaon on metro rail, there is a section where the pillars are really high, giving a commanding view. there is a vast scrubland upto the edges of urban gurgaon. on a hillock near where the urban buildings ends , I saw a radar (parabolic) of vast size slowly rotating away on its perch atop the delhi ridge (offshoot of aravalis). it must be the big old 1000km range 3D search radar we have covering delhi region.

p.s. when I went, gurgaon looked hot dusty and deserted in middle of day. I saw the line of malls near iffco chowk from the train itself....then without leaving the stn, did a U-turn and returned on another train all the way back to cashmere gate
This?
THD-1955
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Image ... HD_003.jpg

Similar radar at AFS, Chimney Hills can be seen from a section of the road skirting the station in Jalahalli .

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 07 Apr 2015 18:44

can anyone id these radars? said to be on jaigarh hills jaipur

http://www.panoramio.com/photo/33076627

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 07 Apr 2015 19:22

look like troposcatter antenna for communications
http://www.g4ftc.co.uk/troposcatter/tropo4.jpg
http://wikimapia.org/2835936/Cabuyao-Mo ... -commolink

sudhan · Post by **sudhan** » 07 Apr 2015 19:46

<Ahem>Mijjile Dhaaga</Ahem>

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 07 Apr 2015 20:09

Damn I was hoping for a meaty ABM radar thing...but soon brothers...soon....

member_23370 · Post by **member_23370** » 07 Apr 2015 21:28

Let the Swordfish-2 be ready first. No news about it. 1500 km will let us monitor into Iran and persian gulf.

kit · Post by **kit** » 08 Apr 2015 09:23

Don't think india will advertise the full capabilities of its radars ..swordfish itself has greater range than green pine in the ranges exceeding 1500 km

nikhil_p · Post by **nikhil_p** » 08 Apr 2015 15:26

Guys Mijjile dhaga. Please to take discussion on Radars to appropriate dhaga.

karan_mc · Post by **karan_mc** » 08 Apr 2015 17:10

Bheeshma wrote:Let the Swordfish-2 be ready first. No news about it. 1500 km will let us monitor into Iran and persian gulf.

It should be ready when Phase-II of India's BDM is ready

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 08 Apr 2015 18:36

Karan M wrote:
Singha wrote:enroute to gurgaon on metro rail, there is a section where the pillars are really high, giving a commanding view. there is a vast scrubland upto the edges of urban gurgaon. on a hillock near where the urban buildings ends , I saw a radar (parabolic) of vast size slowly rotating away on its perch atop the delhi ridge (offshoot of aravalis). it must be the big old 1000km range 3D search radar we have covering delhi region.

p.s. when I went, gurgaon looked hot dusty and deserted in middle of day. I saw the line of malls near iffco chowk from the train itself....then without leaving the stn, did a U-turn and returned on another train all the way back to cashmere gate
This?
THD-1955
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Image ... HD_003.jpg

But Singha-ji you might also have seen the troposcatter comms dishes - Those are HUGE, and this hub controls all the sites in the country. India even has a link with FSU - perhaps a relic of the past, perhaps still active.
This is a known Radar site, south of Delhi, there used to be a THD1955 there, now under upgrade
This controls over 7-8 SAM sites around Delhi which provide SAM coverage, and ABM coverage in the future to the national capital territory.
All these sites are easily visible on google earth

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 08 Apr 2015 19:13

>>This controls over 7-8 SAM sites around Delhi which provide SAM coverage, and ABM coverage in the future to the national capital territory.

Again, guys why do we need to publicize all this on an internet forum?

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 08 Apr 2015 21:12

^^ any adversary ajint trying to keep notes would be in for some shock.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 08 Apr 2015 22:06

Karan M ji, if I can know this, in 2009, the enemy knew this when these were being built.
Geographic location is visible to all and sundry on google earth.

The real secret is capability.

Another aspect of all this is deterrence aspect. I have a big danda and I want everyone to see that danda !!!
We are mango abduls onlee, who ever listens to us...

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 08 Apr 2015 22:07

I want to attend BRF meets and show everyone, what all there is to see on google earth. It is all so amazing !!!

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 08 Apr 2015 22:12

Gagan wrote:Karan M ji, if I can know this, in 2009, the enemy knew this when these were being built.
Geographic location is visible to all and sundry on google earth.

The real secret is capability.

Another aspect of all this is deterrence aspect. I have a big danda and I want everyone to see that danda !!!
We are mango abduls onlee, who ever listens to us...

The issue is not with knowing all this on G-earth and what not.. we all track that.. the issue is with statements like these:
>>This controls over 7-8 SAM sites around Delhi which provide SAM coverage, and ABM coverage in the future to the national capital territory.

Why should we draw attention to ANY site & even mark it up the targeting list? Are we serving national interests by doing so?

By linking it with ABM coverage and moving it up a possible targeting list, is that good?

Suppose this radar or whatever was just another IAF radar. Have we not drawn attention to it so that any and every developments around the site are now monitored?

Please don't underestimate OSINT. It comprises 90% of what's being used to track assets which are then targeted on priority basis.

I for one practice self censorship, because true deterrence is in having the capability as versus tom tomming it, when we have limited amounts of it.

kit · Post by **kit** » 08 Apr 2015 22:47

I am pretty sure there are redundant backup systems for control and tracking too !!

..i find it funny when some one says oh this one controls all things around it since they are near to it

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 08 Apr 2015 22:51

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 08 Apr 2015 22:53

or when the actual system is elsewhere.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 08 Apr 2015 22:53

I don't think Gagan wrote anything which is already not known to everyone. We got ~ six S-300 batteries (all wiki info), hence it won't take a rocket scientist to guess number of SAM sites for a combo of S-300 + Penchoras. Plus they are road mobile TELs, meaning even if they are captured on GE they may not be at the same location when hostilities begin.

On occasions when people do post insider stuff, admins do promptly delete that info.

John · Post by **John** » 08 Apr 2015 23:28

S 300 were "never" purchased publically lets leave it at that.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 Apr 2015 06:20

Next we will have posts on S-300s at BARC.. std BRF operating procedure...

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Apr 2015 06:43

official line is we purchased a couple of big radars from the S-300 system for surveillance and thats it, no SAMs.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 09 Apr 2015 07:08

Karan M wrote:Next we will have posts on S-300s at BARC.. std BRF operating procedure...

Errr...

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 09 Apr 2015 07:14

KaranM,

Some of the stuff that people post after talking to people at ARDE, HAL, about ongoing military programs would never make to public domain either.
Each of us have a different view of security.

I won't post anything that is truly classified.
I understand and respect your concerns, all of us do.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 Apr 2015 07:30

Singha wrote:official line is we purchased a couple of big radars from the S-300 system for surveillance and thats it, no SAMs.

Tin Shield ST-68/U. More than a couple.. a bunch. These would have been our standard MPR/LLTR and even mass produced in India but for the fact that things post FSU dissolution became hard for a while.
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Image ... 2.jpg.html

Very capable sets per IAF officers. Our other MPRs are the PSM-33 Mk2 (Thales design locally adapted by BEL).

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 Apr 2015 07:36

Gagan wrote:
Karan M wrote:Next we will have posts on S-300s at BARC.. std BRF operating procedure...
Errr...

I sometimes think India should just purchase a few S-300s, a few Tu-160s and Tu-22M etc - just so that BRF can be happy and move on to other stuff.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 09 Apr 2015 07:39

With that, lets close the OT on the thread. Move the radar stuff to the radar thread..

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 09 Apr 2015 12:20

The Hindu ‏@the_hindu 4m4 minutes ago

India successfully test-fires nuclear weapons-capable Dhanush missile from ship. http://thne.ws/1HTL22Q

Whats up now?

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 09 Apr 2015 13:59

Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor 4m4 minutes ago

Indian Army test-fires BrahMos supersonic cruise missile from Andaman Islands, operationalises new regiment.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 09 Apr 2015 17:00

Dhanush missile successfully test-fired from ship - Y.Mallikarjun, The Hindu

India successfully test-fired nuclear weapons-capable Dhanush missile from a ship, off the Odisha coast on Thursday.

The ship-based missile was launched at 11.02 a.m. by personnel of the Strategic Forces Command (SFC) from an Offshore Patrolling Vessel (OPV), which was deep inside the sea, for its full range of 350 km, according to Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) missile scientists.

It was a perfect mission and the missile splashed down near the target point with high degree of accuracy, they said.

Dhanush, a manoeuvring missile is a naval variant of Prithvi-II, and can carry a nuclear payload of 500 kg.

It can target both land-based and sea-based targets. The missile has already been inducted into the armed services and the SFC personnel randomly picked up the missile from the production lot for Thursday’s trial, which was carried out as part of regular user training.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 09 Apr 2015 18:18

Why only 300s? $00s and 500s too in future! As for bombers,why not the stealth bomber too after the FGFA?! One wouldn't mind a sqd. or two of (upgraded) Backfires though1

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 09 Apr 2015 18:21

pankajs wrote:
Shiv Aroor ‏@ShivAroor 4m4 minutes ago

Indian Army test-fires BrahMos supersonic cruise missile from Andaman Islands, operationalises new regiment.

✈Anantha Krishnan M✈ ‏@writetake 31m31 minutes ago

Army withdraws statement on BrahMos release!

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 09 Apr 2015 18:25

SSridhar wrote:Dhanush missile successfully test-fired from ship - Y.Mallikarjun, The Hindu
Dhanush, a manoeuvring missile is a naval variant of Prithvi-II, and can carry a nuclear payload of 500 kg.

It can target both land-based and sea-based targets.

So testing system/s that will ultimately go into making a ASBM?!!

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 09 Apr 2015 18:26

Just one post OT

There are a few websites which give a fairly accurate location of some of the strategic sites of India.

Fly down to any airport which has is also an air base. You may see a lot of interesting things.

I have seen

a) Indra radar
b) P 19 radar
c) P 15 radar, NATO code name 'Flat Face'
d) SNR 125 NATO code name 'Low Blow' radar
e) SA 3 Pechora launch sites
f) TropoScatter radar antennae

If you know the location you can even see some of these from outside the airport / air base

As long as Google Earth is concerned, less said the better. One can see a number of SA 3 launcher sites at AFBs and elsewhere.

K

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 09 Apr 2015 18:28

pankajs wrote:
SSridhar wrote:[url=http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/d ... epage=true][/b] is a naval variant of Prithvi-II, and can carry a nuclear payload of 500 kg.

It can target both land-based and sea-based targets.

So testing system/s that will ultimately morph into a ASBM?!!

[/quote]

It is time we starting shouting that we now have a ship borne anti aircraft-carrier ballistic missile.

K

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 09 Apr 2015 18:40

Saurav Jha ‏@SJha1618 3h3 hours ago New Delhi, Delhi

India is implementing an A2/AD strategy via the A&N islands. IA Brahmos units and future ASBMs (under devpt) will be based there.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Apr 2015 20:30

ameen brothers. finally our vision of A&N as a unsinkable aircraft carrier cum pearl harbour might come true.

a mighty naval anchorage to rival pearl and scapa flow needs to come in southern andaman.

sounds like bay of bengal will be our initial SSBN bastion and the eastern flank will be strongly secured.

arshyam · Post by **arshyam** » 09 Apr 2015 22:00

^^ Time to rename it to Fortress Andaman! Given that it dominates the shipping route from both sides, I am reminded of those fictional guns placed on an island called Navarone...