India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Hindu gods forgotten in India revered in Japan - Krishnendu Bandopadhyaya, ToI
Did you know that at least 20 Hindu deities are regularly worshipped in Japan? In fact, there are hundreds of shrines to Goddess Saraswati alone in that country, along with innumerable representations of Lakshmi, Indra, Brahma, Ganesha, Garuda and others.

Even deities forgotten in India are worshipped in Japan. A unique exhibition at Indian Museum here is set to throw light on the country's long lost history that survives in a foreign land.

The Japan Foundation and filmmaker and art-historian Benoy K Behl have collaborated to hold an exhibition of rare photographs that will be inaugurated on Monday and will continue until January 21.

"The exhibition will be a rare treat for the eyes and the mind," said Indian Museum education officer Sayan Bhattacharya.

The research that accompanies Behl's photographs reveals startling facts about the importance of Indian heritage in Japan.

For instance, the 6th century Siddham script is preserved in Japan, though it has disappeared from India. 'Beejaksharas' (or etymology of alphabets) of Sanskrit in this script are regarded as holy and given great importance. Each deity has a 'Beejakshara' and these are venerated by the people, even though most of them cannot read it. Some Japanese tombs are adorned with the Sanskrit alphabet.

At Koyasan, they still have a school where Sanskrit is taught in Siddham, Behl's research revealed.

A number of words in the Japanese language have their roots in Sanskrit. In Japanese supermarkets, a major brand of milk products is called 'Sujata'. The company's personnel are taught the story of Sujata who gave sweet rice-milk to the Buddha, with which he broke his period of austerity, before he achieved enlightenment. "All this and more are revealed through Behl's photography," Bhattacharya added.

Apart from the language, there are deeper civilizational connections that can be traced to early developments of philosophy in India, he said.

Behl wrote in his research, "In many ways, this philosophic understanding is most well preserved in Japan. Japan has not had the breakdown of cultural norms which India suffered when a colonial education system was created. Therefore, most Indians learnt about our own culture from the Western point of view. The dominant and admired language was English, which it remains till today."

The National Geographic had carried an 18-page story on ancient Indian art revealed through Behl's photography to the world. The exhibition will also explain how India's relationship with Japan.

"The deep-rooted spirit of the Buddha's teachings energizes the Japanese people. Buddhist temples are numerous and vast numbers of people visit these every day. Besides the Buddha, many ancient Indian deities and practices (prevail) in their temples. An Indian feels quite at home in Japan," Behl wrote.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Indo-Japan Coast Guard exercise from January 15 - The Hindu

Earlier report posted here talked of the exercise starting on Jan 12.
Japanese Coast Guard ship ‘Echigo’ will reach Chennai coast on Monday for a joint exercise with the Indian Coast Guard in the Bay of Bengal on January 15 and 16.

A press release said the exercise, aimed at strengthening bilateral relationship, will involve simulated hijacking of merchant vessel and rescue through a join coast guard operation.

The drill would involve Operation of Indian Coast Guard helicopters from Japan ship, cross deck landing, interdiction of private vessel, cross boarding and external fire fighting. In addition, Indian Coast Guard ships and aircrafts will be demonstrating their prowess before a Japanese delegation.


Apart from the operation, a friendly volleyball match between the two forces would be organised on January 14.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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http://www.india.com/news/world/india-j ... al-856400/
India, Japan to focus on clean energy: Piyush Goyal
India and Japan will focus on renewable energy, clean coal and energy efficiency during the Strategic Energy Dialogue between the two nations in Tokyo, Power Minister Piyush Goyal said today. Goyal, who is on a three-day visit to Japan, told before leaving for Tokyo that the Strategic Energy Dialogue between the two countries is not about specific targets of investment but building technology partnerships and engagement for investment in different areas of energy, including coal and renewable energy.
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http://www.thehindu.com/todays-paper/tp ... 108578.ece
Japan lends Rs.1,000 crore to clean river
Japan signed a loan agreement with the central government to provide Rs. 1,000 crore to facilitate pollution control and decline of Pune’s Mula-Mutha rivers, a statement said. Under the National River Conservation Plan, a loan agreement was signed between Japan International Cooperation Agency and the central government. Forests and Environment Minister Prakash Javadekar termed it a “historic agreement”. The loan has to be repaid by India in a period of 40 years. The project is scheduled to be completed by January 2022.
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http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/i ... 112017.ece
"India, Japan conduct joint exercise ‘Sahyog-Kaijin’ off Chennai coast"
Ships and aircraft of the Indian Coast Guard and the Japan Coast Guard came together to train for the 15th edition of ‘Sahyog-Kaijin’ joint exercise in the Bay of Bengal off the Chennai coast on Friday.

This is the second time in three months a ship from the Japanese military forces is participating in a military exercise along with India. In October last year, Japan Maritime Self-Defence Force’s ship FS Fuyuzuk participated in exercise ‘Malabar’ with ships and aircraft of the Indian and the United States navies.

While India was represented by ICGS Samudra Paheredar, ICGS Sarang, ICGS Vishwast, ICGS Rajtarang, ICGS Rajkamal and a Dornier Do 226 and chetak helicopters in ‘Sahyog-Kaijin XV’, Japan Coast Guard’s JCGS Echigo with its integral helicopter took part in the exercise.

Addressing the media along with Vice Admiral Hideyo Hanamizu, the Vice Commandant of the Japan Coast Guard, Director General of Indian Coast Guard Vice Admiral H.C.S. Bisht said the exercise was aimed at fine-tuning the coordination between the forces.

Vice Admiral Hanamizu said he was “extremely satisfied” with the coordination of the forces and hoped that the exercise in the future would not only be wider but also deeper. He also also expressed his condolences to the damages caused to human lives and property during the floods that ravaged Chennai last month.

Replying to a query, Vice Admiral Bisht said though the Somali pirates’ menace was “nearly extinct” the force continued to keep its guard up and was prepared to face any threat.

Both the heads of Indian and Japan Coast Guard refrained from giving a direct answer to a query on their opinion on the freedom of navigation in the South China Sea, contending as Coast Guard, their mandate was to protect the territorial waters of the respective countries.
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One more desalination plant for Chennai - The Hindu
The ball has been set rolling for Chennai’s fourth desalination plant to be set up at Perur along East Coast Road to meet the increasing drinking water requirements of the city.

It is estimated to cost over Rs. 4,000 crore.

A 14-member team from Japan Government’s Funding Agency – Japan International Cooperation Agency is here in the city as part of preliminary arrangements relating to the setting up of the plant at Perur village along East Coast Road.

The team’s visit too was to scrutinise the project and finalise funding, officials told The Hindu.

There are currently two plants in operation at Nemmeli on ECR near Mamallapuram and Minjur. A German team had recently inspected the site where the third desalination plant is earmarked at Nemmeli near the existing plant.

The State government had sought funding under JICA to construct the plant with a capacity to treat 400 million litres a day. A detailed project report prepared to establish the plant at a cost of Rs. 4,070 crore has already been submitted to the Centre. On Thursday, the team from JICA visited the city to study the proposal in-depth and extend financial assistance for the project.

Chennai Metrowater plans to implement the project within 42 months after they award the contract for building it.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Japanese agency to lend Rs 4,000 crore for two northeast highway projects - Dipak K Dash, ToI
The Japan International Cooperation Agency (JICA) has pledged a loan for around Rs 4,000 crore for two major highways projects in Mizoram and Meghalaya.

The bilateral funding agency approved this loan immediately after Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe visited India last month.

These two projects will be implemented by National Highways and Infrastructure Development Corporation (NHIDCL), an entity set up by the government to execute works in hill and border states.

The first project in Mizoram is to improve 380km of NH-54 between Aizwal and Tuipang. The second project is improvement of 40km of NH-51 between Tura and Dalu in Meghalaya.

"The approvals came quickly. We are pursuing more loans from JICA and Asian Development Bank as well.

"Government's focus is to improve connectivity in the entire region and all the projects undertaken must be completed within the deadline," an NHIDCL official said.

He added that Cabinet approval will be sought for the projects and signing of the loan agreement. About 19 road projects have been posed for JICA loan assistance. A road transport ministry official said that they are also seeking a loan from Asian Development Bank for the Imphal-Moreh road, which will improve transport network in the region.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Japanese firms may skip ‘Make In India Week’ - Arun S, The Hindu
Japanese companies may skip the first ‘Made in India Week’ to be held in Mumbai next month as they don’t want to participate in an ‘image building exercise’ and rather concentrate on setting up industrial townships in various cities in India, a foreign official said.

Naoyoshi Noguchi, the chief director general of Japan External Trade Organization (JETRO) told The Hindu that the poor response from Japanese firms could be because they are currently focused on setting up 12 ‘Japan Industrial Townships’ across nine states in India.


Japan's Prime Minister Shinzo Abe had last month announced a $11 billion ‘Make In India’ fund, mainly to back the India-related operations of Japanese corporations. Japanese firms, citing time constraints, have so far not shown much interest in taking part in it, while there was an encouraging response from US, Europe, China, Taiwan and Korea, official sources said.

They added that separate pavilions are being set up for companies from Sweden (companies including Ikea, Saab, Volvo and Ericsson), Germany (firms such as Thyssenkrupp AG and Merck) and Korea (Hyundai, LG and Samsung).

The ‘Make In India Week’ event in Mumbai will feature innovative products and manufacturing processes. It will showcase the potential of Indian and global companies as well as states in the manufacturing sector.

Mr. Noguchi said work on setting up industrial townships was progressing. These townships will be in the form of integrated industrial parks with world-class infrastructure facilities and plug-in-play facilities for factories, with the states offering many incentives for Japanese firms.

These incentives include power, roads, water and single window clearance, and in most cases exemptions of stamp duty, entry tax, land acquisition tax and electricity duty. Some of these states have also assured to make land acquisition easier and bring in better labour laws.
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http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 809244.cms
NEW DELHI: Japan's ShinMaywa Industries, the manufacturer of US-2 amphibious aircraft that India is eyeing, is betting big on the 'Make in India' initiative and has offered to set up a plant here to cater to international demands.The move comes as the Navy plans to procure six such aircraft, under a government to government deal, between 2017 and 2022. Six are proposed to be bought in the next phase.The deal when inked will have a 30 per cent offset clause. Under this offset clause, ShinMaywa wants to set up a plant in India to cater to the global market since the demand for the aircraft is high," defence sources said.The project has been in the works since 2011 but got a renewed push following Prime Minister Narendra Modi's visit to Japan in 2014 and a return trip by Japanese PM Shinzo Abe here last December.Sources said the deal could be be a "government to government" exercise with the initial purchase being off the shelf."It is not simple to start manufacturing here. There has to be the necessary infrastructure and expertise," sources said.If the deal goes through, it would be the first major export of Japanese defence item after it lifted decades-long self-imposed embargo on export of weapons.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Japan extends visa validity for Indian nationals to 10 years - PTI
Japan is set to relax visa norms for Indian nationals as multiple-entry visa terms are to be doubled for people from the country to 10 years, Foreign Minister Fumio Kishida said today.

The easing of visa rules, effective from February 15 and also for Vietnamese nationals, will initially benefit businesspeople, academics and artists from the two countries, Japanese Kyodo news agency reported.

The Foreign Ministry said that the move was part of the government's drive to increase the number of foreign tourists to Japan, as well as people-to-people exchanges.

The 10-year validity of multiple-entry visas is the longest issued by the Japanese government, the ministry said.

"We hope that the relaxing of visa will increase repeat visits to Japan and enhance convenience in businesses," Kishida said.

Holders of such multiple-entry visas will be restricted to visiting Japan for business and academic exchange purposes on their first visit but can enter Japan for tourism or to meet friends and families on subsequent trips, the ministry said.

Prime Minister Shinzo Abe announced the planned visa relaxation in his summit with Nguyen Phu Trong, general secretary of Vietnam's ruling Communist Party last September, and in his meeting with Prime Minister Narendra Modi last December.
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Japanese firms prefer to invest in TN: survey - The Hindu
Japanese manufacturing, services and automobile companies prefer Tamil Nadu over other Indian states such as Gujarat and Maharashtra to set up shop due to ease of doing business, according to a state government official.

Talking to The Hindu , a Tamil Nadu Government official said a study conducted by Japan External Trade Organisation (JETRO) and Japan Bank for International Cooperation (JBIC) showed Gujarat and Tamil Nadu as the most promising states for doing business. However, Tamil Nadu had overtaken Gujarat in logistics and friendly business climate.

“Apart from teaming up with the Japanese Government agencies, the Tamil Nadu Government attracted two big banks and this worked in our favour. Most of the Japanese firms are customers of these banks and hence, they did not have any problem in coming to Tamil Nadu,” he said.

In the last 12 months, Tamil Nadu had also attracted several Japanese automobile vendors such as Nissan, Toshiba and Yamaha.

As of October 2015, Tamil Nadu had 471 establishments in manufacturing, services and automobiles followed by Maharashtra with 449.

However, in finance and insurance sectors, Maharashtra had 188 establishments and Tamil Nadu 106, he said.

As many as 73 new Japanese companies got registered in India in the 12-month period ended October 2015, taking the total number of companies to 1,229 from 1,156 in the year-ago period, showing an increase of six per cent, according to JETRO Director General, Chennai, Hidehiro Ishiura

“India is a developing economy and we believe in its growth story. Insurance is a long-term business and we are here to stay,” said a representative of an insurance firm that opened its branch in Chennai recently.

“Maharashtra, Tamil Nadu and Karnataka are already home to large number of firms dealing in automobile and accessories. It is easy to enter Middle East and African markets from here. The success story of Toyota, Nissan and Yamaha made the vendors to follow suit,” said an Indian automobile manufacturer.

Mr. Ishiura said the increase in number of Japanese business establishments was largely due to reasons such as forming joint ventures with Indian partners.

The annual survey for October 2014-15 was carried out by Japan Embassy in New Delhi with its Consulate General, JETRO and various Chambers of commerce and industry in India.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Japan is hurting, economically.

If India wants to really do something with the US and perhaps Australia too, it would be to start Japan centric imports.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Sounds like Abe-Modi-Rajnikant trio will sling-shot TN economy! Japanese love Rajni.

Amma JJ is the only a small road-block
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Safety biggest deterrent for Japanese students in India: official - The Hindu
The Head of the Consulate of Japan in Bengaluru has expressed concern about the safety of Japanese students in India. It is one of the reasons why they do not pursue their higher studies here, said Jun-ichi Kawaue, Head of the Consulate, on Sunday.

He did, however, say that Bengaluru was safer than most other cities in India, including Delhi.

Mr. Kawaue was talking to presspersons on the sidelines of the Japan Habba, 2016 organised by the Japan Habba Trust in association with Bangalore University.

Recent events such as the attacks on international students and the violence against women had created a lot of buzz in Japan.

“The safety of their children is a major criterion for all parents, which is why only a small number of Japanese students come here to study. The students prefer studying in the U.S. or Australia,” he said, adding that there was a need for the Indian government to improve its public relation activities to promote the country and attract students from Japan.

However, when The Hindu spoke to many Japanese students studying in the city, they said that while they had some initial “adjustment” problems, Bengaluru was a relatively safe place.

Shunosuke Hiraoka, a M.Sc. student who is pursuing a yoga therapy course, said: “Bengaluru may not be very safe, but at the same time I would not term it a dangerous city,” he said.

He pointed out that he did have adjustment issues as he his college was located in Jigani and they were cut off from the city’s cosmopolitan nature.
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Centre to train SMEs in Japanese technologies - The Hindu
Coimbatore: ABK-AOTS and Coimbatore-based KGK-TI have joined hands to set up a centre here to train employees of small and medium-scale enterprises (SMEs) in Japanese technologies.

According to R. Krishnamurthi, Managing Director of the KGK Group, there is a challenging business environment now and industries are facing shortage of manpower. The centre will develop talented manpower for the SMEs. Japanese management techniques are useful to MSMEs.

M.R. Ranganathan, chairman of ABK-AOTS Dosokai, a voluntary organisation set up by professionals, engineers and entrepreneurs trained in Japan, said one-third of the Japanese companies in India are in Tamil Nadu (about 550). SMEs are the backbone of an economy. ABK-AOTS has a Japanese language training centre here. KGK-TI has the required facilities and is into training for several years.

The centre will train students in Japanese language and will develop skills of employees in SMEs. It will address the pain points in industries and will offer consultancy, handholding and training. Initially there will be one-day training programmes.

S. Shanmuga Priya, director of ABK-ATOS DOSOKAI, a Japanese Language Learning Centre here, says this year, the centre has crossed 400 students. Almost every college wants to train its students in Japanese language and small companies that have business with Japanese customers also want training in Japanese language.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Japan's population fell nearly 1 million in 2010-15,

Japan's latest census confirmed the hard reality long ago signaled by shuttered shops and abandoned villages across the country: the population is shrinking. Japan's population stood at 127.1 million last fall, down 0.7 per cent from 128.1 million in 2010, according to results of the 2015 census, released on Friday. The 947,000 decline in the population in the last five years was the first since the once-every-five-years count started in 1920.

Unable to count on a growing market and labor force to power economic expansion, the government has drawn up urgent measures to counter the falling birth rate. Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has made preventing a decline below 100 million a top priority. But population experts say it would be virtually impossible to prevent that even if the birth rate rose to Abe's target of 1.8 children per woman from the current birthrate of 1.4.

Without a substantial increase in the birthrate or loosening of staunch Japanese resistance to immigration, the population is forecast to fall to about 108 million by 2050 and to 87 million by 2060.

Tokyo's rush hour trains are just as crowded as ever: Japan's biggest cities have continued to grow as younger workers leave small towns in search of work. The census showed Tokyo's population grew to 13.5 million, up 2.7 per cent since the 2010 census.But a visit to any regional city will find entire blocks of small shops shuttered, the owners usually either retired or deceased. In rural areas, even just outside Tokyo, villages are mostly empty, fields overgrown and bus and train services intermittent thanks to scant demand.

The rate of population growth peaked in 1950 and has fallen continuously since 1975. By 2011 it had hit zero, the census figures show.Though Japan is leading this demographic shift, the rest of Asia is following. In South Korea, China and elsewhere in Asia, improved life spans and falling birthrates are raising worries over how to provide for the rapidly expanding ranks of seniors with shrinking labor forces.

A World Bank report issued late last year forecast that health and pension spending will rise sharply at a time when elders can count on less support from their families."The rapid pace and sheer scale of aging in East Asia raises policy challenges, economic and fiscal pressures and social risks," the report said.

It recommended that governments facilitate more participation in the labor force by women and seniors, provide better childcare and elder-care, and revamp their pension and health systems to cope.For Japan, the demographic crunch is one of the biggest challenges to a postwar economic model based on rising incomes and consumption.Nearly a third of all Japanese were over 65 years old in 2015. By 2050, almost 40 per cent will be older than 65, according to projections by the National Institute of Population and Social Securities Research.

Richard Katz of Oriental Economist forecasts that by 2045 there will be 13 per cent fewer workers per person in Japan. That means each worker would need to produce 13 per cent more in terms of economic value to offset the decline and maintain current living standards.

Japan's economy has stagnated for most of the past two decades partly because companies are reluctant to invest in a market they are convinced will continue to shrink.

Abe took office in late 2012 vowing to spur growth through massive stimulus and sweeping reforms to improve Japan's competitiveness. So far few of the reforms have been realized, though corporate profits soared thanks to the resulting weakening in the Japanese yen against other currencies.

Meanwhile, Abe's growth agenda has stalled, as companies have opted to invest their cash piles overseas, in faster growing markets, instead of upgrading factories and raising wages — moves that might stimulate demand inside Japan.
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Japan non-committal on supply of strategic amphibious aircraft to India - Kallol Bhattacherjee, The Hindu
India’s plans to acquire amphibious aircraft from Japan, in the first big military deal between the two countries, is facing serious challenges, senior diplomatic sources told The Hindu on Saturday.

Indicating at a longer waiting period for India’s plans to acquire the amphibious aircraft, US-2, in a deal involving 12-18 aircraft, senior diplomatic sources from Tokyo said on Saturday that Japan had no immediate plans for “selling or delivering” the capacity-multiplier aircraft to India.

“There is no decision about its delivery nor did the Foreign Secretaries discuss the timing of the delivery”, Yasuhisa Kawamura, Director General of Press and Public Diplomacy of Japan told The Hindu after India and Japan held Foreign Secretary-level talks in Tokyo on Friday. Mr. Kawamura said that though Friday’s bilateral dialogue, which was held on the sidelines of a trilateral meeting of India, Japan and Australia, discussed a wide range of maritime security-related issues, the issue of supplying US-2 amphibious aircraft to India did not come up during the talks.

The absence of diplomatic progress on India acquiring the aircraft is significant in view of the fact that during Prime Minister Shinzo Abe’s visit to India in December 2015, the two countries had concluded agreements on Transfer of the Defence Equipment and Technology, and, Security Measures for the Protection of Classified Military Information, aimed at deals such as the one on the US-2.

The joint statement issued during Mr. Abe’s visit had also mentioned that both sides were to work on the US-2 deal. The US-2 aircraft has been part of a long-pending demand from India and was specifically mentioned by Prime Minister Narendra Modi during his 2014 Japan visit. During Friday’s dialogue, the two countries discussed enhanced maritime security and freedom of navigation-related issues in the East China Sea and South China Sea as well as security-related issues of the Indo-Pacific Ocean.

The Ministry of External Affairs, however, refused to respond to Mr. Kawamura’s comments on the aircraft deal. However, strategic affairs commentators sense a looming crisis regarding the deal.
We know that the Japanese take a long time to decide. But, even by their standards, the US-2 issue is overdue. The delay is baffling, to say the least because it appeared to have been all but sewn up last year.

The other point to note in the above is the trilateral Foreign-secrtary level meeting between India, Japan & Australia. This seems to be a new development. We had the India-US-Japan trilateral dialogues upgraded to ministerial level last year. And, now this one. I expect very soon a quadrilateral annual foreign-minister level dialogue among these four nations, especially with the rapid militarization of the Indo-China Sea by the Chinese. This was originally in the offing but did not get traction because of the Chinese objection to the maritime exercises etc.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by NRao »

Aussies have wanted to join the party, but nothing has been decided yet.

I would think it will take some time and plenty of grease. Not an easy task to iron out differences, which are plenty.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by Philip »

Pl read my post in the In td.The Japanese about turn is becos of the huge OZ 12 sub contest worth anywhere upwards of $25B,where it is no secret that the US is pushing OZ towards buying the 4000t Soryus.These subs are supposed to have significant US tech,making it easier for the US to integrate then into its order of battle, against China.hus establishing a powerful Asia-Pacific military "triad" of the US,Japan and OZ

Now it is no secret that OZ is exceptionally jealous of India's mil prowess,it condemned our N-tests,navl buildup ,etc., and only in very recent times is it mentioning India in a more positive light in Asian security affairs,as the Chinese agro and threat increases. Nevertheless,it strangely does not want us to get the Japanese LRMP amphibs,which would give the IN a key advantage in the IOR,as it also possesses US P-8 Poseidons (which OZ is acquiring too),and Russian TU-142 Bear LRMP and modernized IL-38 aircraft. This appears to be one of the secret pre-conditions of the deal which japan appears willing to oblige. France too openly said that it would never give India the advanced sub tech that it was prepared to give OZ should its Barracuda sub be selected. Both Japan and France are trying to win the OZ sub contest by denying the advanced mil tech to India! And we call them friends.

Something for Mr.Modi,MP and the GOI to chew upon.We're granting Japan huge civilian orders for rail tech,etc,etc.but the cooperation from its side is clearly of a second-class (cattle class?) nature!
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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^ That's the reality we have to face. There are no 'friends' any longer in international relationship after the end of the Cold War and the start of the Economic War. All relationships are becoming transactional. The 'Blue Ice' type of very deep-rooted relationships would survive but not much else.
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Besides, modi can never neglect the economy. Civilian projects can never be a tool to bargain military products. Not at this point in time.

And if India were to continue neglect of R&D in the military areas, these scenarios will repeat every 5 years with regularity.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by member_22733 »

SSridhar wrote:^ That's the reality we have to face. There are no 'friends' any longer in international relationship after the end of the Cold War and the start of the Economic War. All relationships are becoming transactional. The 'Blue Ice' type of very deep-rooted relationships would survive but not much else.
I agree, and it is exactly why such advanced technology should never be ignored as well. We have to build what we are denied, and make it better than those who have it already.

The message should be: Deny it, and we make sure you lose your edge.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by Pulikeshi »

SSridhar wrote:^ That's the reality we have to face. There are no 'friends' any longer in international relationship after the end of the Cold War and the start of the Economic War. All relationships are becoming transactional. The 'Blue Ice' type of very deep-rooted relationships would survive but not much else.
Any serious student of strategy would then have to question if the pivot to Asia is against:
India not China!

As in keep your enemies closer from US perspective! Wish I were only half kidding! :P :mrgreen:
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Pulikeshi wrote:Any serious student of strategy would then have to question if the pivot to Asia is against:
India not China!

As in keep your enemies closer from US perspective! Wish I were only half kidding!
The 'Pivot to Asia' involves other players also. Players like Japan, Australia, South Korea, Vietnam, Singapore, Philippines & Malaysia who all have maritime disputes with an aggressive China and who are all part of the Pivot in one way or another. The US may have a subsidiary objective of 'Pivot against India' too masked under the Pivot against China for all we know but that can be only subsidiary. The Pivot against China is just another transaction. The pivot against India under the rubric of China reduces the transactional cost for the US. Indian and US interests may converge on that transaction but that cannot be taken to mean that the US and India (or for that matter any other nation) are allies beyond that project, in terms of the Cold War concept of 'Allies'. That type of alliance, for example, continues between the US & the UK or the US & Australia. I was reading the Australian White Paper on Defence (2016) and the contours of that alliance are clearly spelt out.

Pakistan understood the American transactional game a long time back.

Anyway, this discussion would need to be carried out elsewhere.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Chennai Metro Rail gets Rs 1180crore loan from JICA - ToI
apan International Cooperation Agency (JICA) on Friday provided a loan of Rs 1,180 crore to Chennai Metro Rail Ltd (CMRL). An agreement was signed in this regard between JICA India Office and the ministry of finance.

The official development assistance (ODA) loan has been provided at 1.4% interest rate and 30 years of repayment period, including 10 years of grace period. The assistance from JICA will facilitate construction of underground tunnels, rail-tracks, electrical, telecommunication and signaling systems, procurement of the trains and consultancy service.

JICA had earlier provided approximately Rs 7,697 crore in concessional ODA loans over three tranches since 2008 for development of the 45 km metro rail system in Chennai. With the loan sanction on Friday, the cumulative loan amount for Chennai Metro Project becomes approximately Rs 8,877 crore.

JICA has provided a total amount approximately Rs 59,071 crore as loan for metro projects in India, including Delhi, Bengaluru, Kolkata, Mumbai and Ahmedabad.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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The truth about Fukushima and the dangers of an N-plant meltdown.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... ister.html
Fukushima: Tokyo was on the brink of nuclear catastrophe, admits former prime minister

Five years on from the tsunami, the former Japanese prime minister says the country came within a “paper-thin margin” of a nuclear disaster.

Bags of radioactive contaminated soil piled up along the coast near the Fukushima nuclear plant Photo: Julian Simmonds for The Telegraph

Andrew Gilligan
04 Mar 2016
Japan's prime minister at the time of the 2011 earthquake and tsunami has revealed that the country came within a “paper-thin margin” of a nuclear disaster requiring the evacuation of 50 million people.

In an interview with The Telegraph to mark the fifth anniversary of the tragedy, Naoto Kan described the panic and disarray at the highest levels of the Japanese government as it fought to control multiple meltdowns at the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power station.

He said he considered evacuating the capital, Tokyo, along with all other areas within 160 miles of the plant, and declaring martial law. “The future existence of Japan as a whole was at stake,” he said. “Something on that scale, an evacuation of 50 million, it would have been like a losing a huge war.”

Fukushima five years on - Former Japanese Prime Minister Naoto Kan.
Mr Kan admitted he was frightened and said he got “no clear information” out of Tepco, the plant’s operator. He was “very shocked” by the performance of Nobuaki Terasaka, his own government’s key nuclear safety adviser. “We questioned him and he was unable to give clear responses,” he said.

“We asked him – do you know anything about nuclear issues? And he said no, I majored in economics.” :rotfl:
From a very early stage I had a very high concern for Tokyo
Naoto Kan, former PM

Mr Terasaka, the director of the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, was later sacked. Another member of Mr Kan’s crisis working group, the then Tepco chairman, Tsunehisa Katsumata, was last week indicted on charges of criminal negligence for his role in the disaster.

The 9.0 magnitude quake, the largest ever recorded in Japan, triggered a gigantic tsunami which broke through the plant’s flood defences, cutting off power to its control room and the coolant systems of its nuclear reactors.

Deprived of cooling, radioactive fuel, in three of the plant’s six reactors melted down. Explosive hydrogen gas built up, blowing holes in the reactor containment building and allowing radioactivity to escape.

Fukushima five years on
The town of Futaba is still sealed off in an exclusion zone Photo: Julian Simmonds for The Telegraph

“When we got the report that power had been cut and the coolant had stopped working, that sent a shiver down my spine,” Mr Kan said. “From March 11, when the incident happened, until the 15th, the effects [of radioactive contamination] were expanding geographically.

"From the 16th to the 20th we were able to halt the spread of radiation but the margin left for us was paper-thin. If the [fuel rods] had burnt through [in] all six reactors, that would definitely have affected Tokyo.

“From a very early stage I had a very high concern for Tokyo. I was forming ideas for a Tokyo evacuation plan in my head. In the 1923 earthquake the government ordered martial law – I did think of the possibility of having to set up such emergency law if it really came down to it.

“We were only able to avert a 250-kilometre (160-mile) evacuation zone [around the plant] by a wafer-thin margin, thanks to the efforts of people who risked their lives. Next time, we might not be so lucky.”

Dramatic CCTV footage from the plant, released in 2012, showed a skeleton staff – the so-called “Fukushima 50” - struggling to read emergency manuals by torchlight and battling with contradictory, confusing instructions from their superiors at Tepco. At one stage, an appeal went out for workers to bring batteries from their cars so they could be hooked up to provide power for the crippled cooling systems.

Total disaster was averted when seawater was pumped into the reactors, but the plant manager, Masao Yoshida, later said he considered committing hara-kiri, ritual suicide, in despair at the situation.

Five years on, the decontamination and decommissioning process at the Tokyo Electric Power Co.'s embattled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant continues
Five years on, the decontamination and decommissioning process at the Tokyo Electric Power Co.'s embattled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant continues Photo: Christopher Furlong/Getty Images
Mr Kan said he had to retreat to an inner room after the atmosphere in the government’s crisis management centre became “very noisy”.

He said: “There was so little precise information coming in. It was very difficult to make clear judgments. I don’t consider myself a nuclear expert, but I did study physics at university.

"I knew that even based on what little we were hearing, there was a real possibility this could be bigger than Chernobyl. That was a terrible disaster, but there was only one reactor there. There were six here.”

Although the Fukushima disaster caused no immediate deaths from radiation, it did force the evacuation of almost 400,000 people, most of whom have still been unable to return to their homes. Hundreds of thousands more fled in panic and much of Fukushima province ceased functioning.

Fukushima five years on
Derelict buildings in Futaba locked in an eerie time capsule Photo: Julian Simmonds for The Telegraph

An area within 20km (12.5 miles) of the plant remains an exclusion zone, with no-one allowed to live there. Some studies have identified a higher incidence of child cancer in the wider region.

Mr Kan said that the nuclear accident is “still going on” today. He said: “In reactors 2 and 3, the radioactive fuel rods are still there and small amounts of [radioactive] water are leaking out of the reactor every day, despite what Tepco says.”

He said the experience had turned him from a supporter of nuclear power into a convinced opponent. “I have changed my views 180 degrees. You have to look at the balance between the risks and the benefits,” he said. “One reactor meltdown could destroy the whole plant and, however unlikely, that is too great a risk.”

Mr Kan lost the prime ministership later in 2011 amid strong criticism of his handling of the crisis. A parliamentary investigation accused him of distracting emergency workers by making a personal visit to the plant, withholding information, and misunderstanding a request by Tepco to pull out some staff as a demand to withdraw them all.

However, another independent inquiry said his action in ordering the “Fukushima 50” to stay at their posts was vital. “I went to the Tepco offices and demanded they not evacuate. To this day I am criticised for that, but I believed then and I still believe now that I did the right thing and that that was a decisive moment in the crisis,” he told The Telegraph.

Fukushima five years on
Derelict buildings and a destroyed car in Futaba Photo: Julian Simmonds for The Telegraph

He admitted “regret” at his decision not to publish results from a computer system called Speedi, System for Prediction of Environmental Emergency Dose Information, which accurately forecast the spread of radioactivity around the plant and could have saved thousands of local residents from exposure.

“As a result, some areas were exposed to high levels of radiation,” he said.

He criticised his successor as prime minister, Shinzo Abe, for restarting some of the country’s nuclear power stations, all of which were shut down after the crisis, saying that Japan had “not learned the lessons enough” and was “closing its eyes” to the risk of a second disaster. He has joined protest demonstrations against the plant reopenings.

“There is a clear conflict between government policy and the wishes of the public,” he said. “Additional protective measures against tsunamis have been taken, such as raising the protective walls, but I don’t think they go far enough. We shouldn’t be building nuclear power plants in areas where there is a population to be affected. After the tsunami, Japan went without nuclear power for years, so it can be done.”

Fukushima five years on
A sign in Futaba Photo: Julian Simmonds for The Telegraph
The former leader said that “a lot of the accident was caused before March 11” by the complacency and misjudgment of Tepco, a verdict echoed by the official inquiry, which dubbed the nuclear accident a “man-made disaster”.

The criminal investigation which led to last week’s charges against Mr Katsumata and two other Tepco managers found that they had known since June 2009 that the plant was vulnerable to a tsunami but had “failed to take pre-emptive measures [despite] knowing the risk".

Mr Kan expressed satisfaction at the charges brought last week against a senior Tepco manager and said he would testify against Mr Katsumata if asked.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Japan relaxes visa rules for Indians - ToI
As India gives visa-on-arrival to the Japanese, Tokyo has responded by further relaxing conditions for multiple-entry visas for short-term stay for ordinary Indian passport holders.

Last month, it extended the validity period of such visas from a maximum of three years to five years. It also increased duration of visit on multiple entry visas,including tourism and business, to 30 days from the earlier 15. The relaxation is based on an understanding reached between the two countries during Japanese PM Shinzo Abe's visit to India in December 2015.

After Abe's meeting with PM Narendra Modi, India and Japan issued a joint statement which, among other things, recognised the importance of facilitating exchanges between people of the two countries by "simplifying their visa procedures for nationals of each other". As per the relaxed visa norms, according to Japan authorities, eligibility for multiple-entry visas has been expanded to include people with travel records to Japan for short-term visit in the past three years and those with travel records as temporary visitor to any other G7 countries.

The validity of visas for business purposes and also for "cultural and intellectual figures'' has been extended from 5 to 10 years. Japan had introduced multiple-entry visas for Indian nationals in July 2014 as an acknowledgement that strengthening people-to-people exchanges was important to broaden its relationship with India.

Relaxation of visa norms is important at a time when the two countries are looking to deepen their economic partnership.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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As India collaborates with Japan on Islands, it looks to check China - Ellen Barry, NYT
PORT BLAIR, India: India and Japan are in talks to collaborate on upgrading civilian infrastructure in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands, an Indian archipelago seen as a critical asset to counter China's efforts to expand its maritime reach into the Indian Ocean.

The first project being discussed is a modest one — a 15-megawatt diesel power plant on South Andaman Island, as described in a proposal submitted late last month to the Japanese Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

But the collaboration signals a significant policy shift for India, which has not previously accepted offers of foreign investment on the archipelago. The Andaman and Nicobar Islands are northwest of the Strait of Malacca, offering control of a so-called choke point that is one of China's greatest marine vulnerabilities.

It is also testimony to the unfolding relationship between India and Japan, which is also funding a $744 million road building project in the northeastern Indian border regions of Mizoram, Assam and Meghalaya. Like the Andaman and Nicobar chain, the northeastern region is a strategic area that has remained relatively undeveloped because of its separation from the mainland.

Japan's marshaling of official development assistance in the region has drawn less attention than the effort that China calls "One Belt, One Road," a network of roads, railways and ports intended to link China to the rest of Asia and to Europe.

But it fits logically into the web of strategic projects taking shape as Prime Minister Narendra Modi of India enters into closer relationships with Japan, Australia and the United States, as well as regional powers like Vietnam, to counter China's growing influence.

A senior Indian official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss internal deliberations, said that China's project would be answered by "a more decentralized, local but organic response."

The official described proposed infrastructure projects in the Andamans as "not of a big scale, and not of a big value," but added that New Delhi is intent on developing its "frontier" regions.

"The idea that the frontier should be left undeveloped, I think people have rejected that approach," the official said. "There is a realization that it doesn't help to leave part of any part of India undeveloped."

Japan's vision for contributions in the island chain goes far beyond the proposed power plant. The plan was submitted in Tokyo more than a year after Japan's ambassador made a visit to Port Blair on South Andaman Island and, in a meeting with the territory's top official, offered financing for "bridges and ports."

Akio Isomata, minister for economic affairs in the Japanese Embassy, said the country's aid agency, Japan International Cooperation Agency, could only respond to "formal requests" from the Indian government.

He added that Japan would consider "any other requests" on the Andaman and Nicobar chain or elsewhere and was eager to use official development assistance to enhance India's "connectivity" with countries that are members of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations or the South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation.

"We usually start with small projects and go bigger," he said.


He said construction of the power station could start in the next fiscal year, which begins in April.

The Andaman and Nicobar chain is made up of 572 islands, all but 34 of them uninhabited, stretching around 470 miles north to south.

Used as a penal colony by the British Raj, the island chain was occupied by Japan for three years during World War II, a period that older islanders recall with dread. Jawaharlal Nehru, a former prime minister of India, secured the archipelago for his country in the hurried distribution of property that accompanied the British withdrawal from the subcontinent, beating out bids by Australia and Pakistan.

The islands' importance has increased along with China's naval expansion. The chain's location makes it an ideal base for tracking naval movements in the Strait of Malacca, a long, narrow funnel between Malaysia and Indonesia. The strait provides passage for China's fuel imports from Africa and the Middle East, around 80 percent of its total fuel imports.

Nevertheless, change has come slowly to the islands, where almost all the undeveloped land is set aside for indigenous tribes and wildlife. A plan to lay undersea optical fiber cable from Chennai on India's east coast, so that residents can finally have high-speed Internet access, has been under discussion for more than a decade. Until last year, no flights landed after dark because there were no runway lights at the Port Blair airport.

Defense analysts from the West regard the island chain with envy and a degree of confusion.

"Almost every year, I see some senior Indian military official say we have major, major plans in store for the Andamans, and you're going to see them soon," said Jeff M. Smith, author of "Cold Peace," a book on the Chinese-Indian rivalry. "Everybody waits for the big story to hit on the Andamans, year after year, and it doesn't happen." {Accurate}

A decision to accept Japanese investment there, he said, "would be a sign that the Modi government is getting out of this feedback loop and moving on some of these aspirations."

India has taken "serious note" of the presence of Chinese submarines in the Indian Ocean in recent years, Adm. Robin K. Dhowan, the chief of India's navy staff, told a news channel in 2014. In January, India announced that it would deploy Israeli-made aerial "Searcher" drones and two Boeing P-8I maritime surveillance aircraft, developed for anti-submarine warfare, to the Andaman and Nicobar chain.

Airstrips at the northern and southern tips of the archipelago are being lengthened to accommodate the long-range surveillance planes.

Japan is hardly the only country interested in taking a role in developing the island chain. India and the United States are said to be close to concluding a maritime logistics agreement, meaning that U.S. ships might be allowed to make port calls in the Andaman and Nicobar Islands in the future, defense analysts say.

The chain's location provides a "perfect geographic position" for maritime aerial surveillance, said Rory Medcalf, head of the National Security College at Australian National University.

"If India were more open to allowing friendly foreign countries access and awareness in the Andamans, it would find them more forthcoming as well," he said.

In Port Blair, there is the feeling that the outside world, once distant, is drawing nearer.

The front page of the Andaman Express, a daily newspaper, is typically devoted to small-town news about motorcycle accidents and stove explosions. But a recent report on the presence of a Chinese naval submarine in Andaman waters mentioned, almost as an aside, that the archipelago "would become the primary target of the People's Liberation Army if China and India go to war."

Talk like that has brought an edge of apprehension to the quiet life on the island, said R V R Murthy, a professor of history at Mahatma Gandhi Government College. Murthy lives on a hilltop, and in January, when officials in New Delhi announced the positioning of aerial drones at Port Blair's airport, he could peer down from his house and spot them.

"In the old days," he said, a little wistfully, "this was the safest place in the world."
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Published on Mar 15, 2016
By Robin Harding
Donald Trump’s rise sparks alarm in Japan: Financial Times
According to a number of officials, Tokyo is still fairly relaxed about Mr Trump's views on security, regarding the US-Japan alliance as strong enough to cope, but they are becoming increasingly alarmed by bipartisan attacks on the Trans-Pacific Partnership, a trade deal crucial to Prime Minister Shinzo Abe.

"To start with they just thought 'he's funny'," said Masatoshi Honda, a professor of politics at Kinjo University. "But recently they're starting to worry — what happens if Trump wins?"

Like the political establishment in Washington, Tokyo has been slow to take Mr Trump seriously, not least because his rhetoric seems stuck in the 1980s, before Japan suffered two decades of economic stagnation and its population began to decline.

...

But Tokyo is realizing that even if Mr Trump loses, his rhetoric is seeping into the popular consciousness, and other US politicians are changing their positions in response.
Japan may need to look elsewhere to help it bolster its security needs!
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by Vipul »

It is good they will dump their dumb pacifist policy which has only emboldened China. About time they rise from their self-righteous (and foolish) stupor.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by rsingh »

I came to know some intersting information about Japan
-Japanese society is highly conservative
-They have class and even cast system. There is a cast that does jobs like cleaning blocked pipes and cleaning. They are not educated as most of the school does not accept kids from such cast.
-There are original Japanese who were there before hans. They beaten up to the Northern territories.
-it is a fractured society.
- Kids often dream of a office clerical job.
- Latin American Japanese are counted as 3rd class Japanese.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by member_19686 »

^^

You seem to think Japan of 2016 is Japan of pre-1868, so off by about 150 years in some of your "interesting information".

The burakumin (ex-untouchable group) still exist and suffer some discrimination if their origins are known in matters of marriage. But this is pretty different from having a full fledged system of hierarchical groups as in the pre-Meiji days with the Samurai at the top. Of course Burakumin are educated (Japan has one of the highest literacy rates in the world) and there are legal statutes against discrimination in the public school system, not to mention the fact that its pretty hard to tell someone is Buraku in big cities (where the vast majority of Japanese live) when they look and speak just like other Japanese.

I don't even know what a "fractured society" means here as if there are societies with none of it. Compared to many other countries, Japan has less fractures. You won't find mini Khilafats in Japan for a start (like you do in India or in the UK with its Bradfordistan)

"Kids often dream of a office clerical job"

What is this even supposed to mean?

May be some kids dream that, so?

You don't become the third largest economy (by total GDP not PPP) because everyone dreams of being a clerk. Japan is an industrial powerhouse with some cutting edge science and technology.

"Latin American Japanese are counted as 3rd class Japanese."

huh?

They have the same rights as any other Japanese citizens and they are a minuscule minority (Japan is something like 98%+ Japanese). They have trouble adjusting to language and culture of a country that their ancestors left behind which hinders their job opportunities and also makes them the target of some private discrimination but the same (i.e. discrimination against immigrants or outsiders to a greater or lesser extent) occurs in practically every country. Even in the "land of the free", Mexican immigrants are not treated as being on par with American citizens.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by rsingh »

^^^
Please do not take it too close to your heart. We have quite different perception of Japan and Japanese culture. My information came from university student who is studying Japanese Language and Japanese culture. Some of the things are eye opener. It was 3rd,4th or whatever power ( with the help of USA, just like china) but not anymore. Japanese are hardworking people and no wonder they have advanced society. But when you enter the house hold it is different story. I have never visited Japan (planning to go in June), but the information I am getting is not from casual traveler who go to shining Tokyo. This student has done research in both urban and rural Japan. Will write more.
"Kids often dream of a office clerical job"

What is this even supposed to mean?
It means low expectations,self esteem and not confident about future. I have never seen this in developed countries (not talking about extremely poor house holds). It is as simple as that. Kids hear stories in family and decide about future. salam
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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Osaka governor says Japan should debate need for nuclear weapons - Japan Times
Osaka Gov. Ichiro Matsui, the head of Osaka Ishin no Kai, has voiced support for a national debate on whether or not Japan should possess nuclear weapons.

“With the perfect right to collective self-defense, we should debate whether our troops can completely cover the needs of our own country,” Matsui said during an informal meeting with reporters Tuesday at Osaka’s prefectural office. “If we possess weapons, the ultimate weapon will become necessary.”


The call for a national debate follows comments made by U.S. Republican presidential candidate and front-runner Donald Trump in an interview with The New York Times where he said he would be open to both Japan and South Korea possessing nuclear weapons and the U.S. withdrawing its forces from the two Asian countries.

Touching on Trump’s statement, Matsui said he thought it would be best if Japan did not possess a nuclear arsenal, as it had been bombed by such weapons.

But, in calling for debate on the issue, he added: “What do we do if America’s military strength (in Japan) disappears? Wishful thinking doesn’t get us anywhere.”

Chief Cabinet Secretary Yoshihide Suga, the government’s top spokesman, has said in the past that Japan will maintain the three nonnuclear principles that prohibit it from owning, developing and transporting nuclear weapons.

Matsui’s comments also came the same day the nation’s new security laws — which are expected to bind the U.S. and Japanese militaries even closer together — came into effect. It was also just a few days after the party released its basic plan for constitutional revisions.

Osaka Ishin leaders are close to Prime Minister Shinzo Abe and Suga, who see Matsui and his party as potential allies on a number of issues, including amending the Constitution.

The Osaka governor’s comments are believed to reflect the sentiments of other right-leaning politicians as well.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by Surya »

well rsingh - am sure Suraj and others can tell more - but Japan is nowhere near what your info source has indicated

You will love the trip

of course living in japan is a different thing- its really hard to get accepted as Japanese ... but even there things are changing.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

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rsingh wrote:I came to know some intersting information about Japan
-Japanese society is highly conservative
-They have class and even cast system. There is a cast that does jobs like cleaning blocked pipes and cleaning. They are not educated as most of the school does not accept kids from such cast.
-There are original Japanese who were there before hans. They beaten up to the Northern territories.
-it is a fractured society.
- Kids often dream of a office clerical job.
- Latin American Japanese are counted as 3rd class Japanese.

- Yes the Japanese society is conservative in thinking, they don't like to take big risks and give higher weightage to stability than high-risk-high-gain.

- There is the class system but thats on the corporate hierarchy /which college you studied class. Tokyo graduates are considered as "elite" and are given special treatment to a small extent in promotions. But the more traditional caste system is not visible nor are there any restrictions from social point of view.

- Skip

- Its not a fractured society, its one of the most homogeneous you can find, which is great if things are going great (for eg after the wwII when japan economy boomed because of the US assistance), but not so great as can been seen after 1989 collapse. I was surprised and had a minor culture shock. Its a 80-20 society, 80% everyone has the same behavior and responses, with 20% being individualistic customisation. India is 20-80 if you know what I mean.

- Most kids like to become a Kaishain in the top tier companies(but not all), just like their fathers. Japan companies provide a very stable lifetime job opportunities where once you get into the company, you can retire with a stable pension and lifestyle. This is changing in the millennials generation and they don't want to stick with one job/company for the rest their lives. This is causing problems for older management companies (not the Sony/Toyota/Mitsubishi's).

- Pure blood Japanese are "considered" "Japanese", the rest are not considered Japanese are in the "sato"(outsider) group. This outsider/insider is interesting concept though on a personal relationship level this does not affect much.

- Japanese don't prefer juggad, they like a stable process oriented relationships, jobs, interactions, what not. Most cannot handle surprises, thinking-on-thier feet etc.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by shyamal »

having lived and worked in Japan 3+ years : +100 to Rhytha.
rsingh - the things that student/researcher told you are like half truths. There is a kernel of truth in all of them. But the way you/he present them is about 179 degrees away from present reality :)
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by Suraj »

I find most western portrayals of Japan to have a tinge of bitterness or resentment underneath. Japanese have an enormous 'we are Japanese, we do this our way' not-invented-here mentality. Even a lot of Japanese privately hate that. There's also a clear distinction societally about Japanese vs non-Japanese. Even a blond, blue eyed Euro is clearly made aware they're an outsider and not ever capable of 'going native' and will be treated as such.

While in interpersonal relationships they're warm and welcoming, societally, the enforced homogeneity is very much the case. That leads to astonishment, especially amongst those accustomed to white privilege, at being viewed as just one of the 'better' outsiders, but still clearly outsider. Not all of this 'different' treatment is negative, though it can be interpreted as such. Japanese have a lot of defined decorum for interaction and doing things. Outsiders are not expected to know these, and "you're not Japanese, you don't know these" can sound dismissive. But it need not be.

To Japanese themselves, a lot of these rules are a small emotional burden of being Japanese. There's a small amount of jealousy on their part that outsiders can simply play the outsider card; I've been told I should not bother to follow all the aspects of decorum because it's all quite vexing and I should simply play the outsider card to avoid having to deal with every aspect of formal interaction. Of course, I got that advice in trusted confidentiality because I've family there.

I can see how the average westerner, used to being treated as special wherever they go, find a nice cold bucket of water splashed in their face in Japan, figuratively. Suddenly they're an 'outsider', and not a universally privileged one. They're not a society without warts by any stretch of imagination, but they're also phenomenally well organized in many ways, and a lot of criticisms sound either exaggerated or hypocritical to my ears.
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by Surya »

They're not a society without warts by any stretch of imagination, but they're also phenomenally well organized in many ways, and a lot of criticisms sound either exaggerated or hypocritical to my ears.
or another way - I would rather have some of their problems than the ones we have in other countries
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Re: India and Japan: News and Discussion

Post by Vadivel »

Suraj wrote:I find most western portrayals of Japan to have a tinge of bitterness or resentment underneath. Japanese have an enormous 'we are Japanese, we do this our way' not-invented-here mentality. Even a lot of Japanese privately hate that. There's also a clear distinction societally about Japanese vs non-Japanese. Even a blond, blue eyed Euro is clearly made aware they're an outsider and not ever capable of 'going native' and will be treated as such.

While in interpersonal relationships they're warm and welcoming, societally, the enforced homogeneity is very much the case. That leads to astonishment, especially amongst those accustomed to white privilege, at being viewed as just one of the 'better' outsiders, but still clearly outsider. Not all of this 'different' treatment is negative, though it can be interpreted as such. Japanese have a lot of defined decorum for interaction and doing things. Outsiders are not expected to know these, and "you're not Japanese, you don't know these" can sound dismissive. But it need not be.

To Japanese themselves, a lot of these rules are a small emotional burden of being Japanese. There's a small amount of jealousy on their part that outsiders can simply play the outsider card; I've been told I should not bother to follow all the aspects of decorum because it's all quite vexing and I should simply play the outsider card to avoid having to deal with every aspect of formal interaction. Of course, I got that advice in trusted confidentiality because I've family there.

I can see how the average westerner, used to being treated as special wherever they go, find a nice cold bucket of water splashed in their face in Japan, figuratively. Suddenly they're an 'outsider', and not a universally privileged one. They're not a society without warts by any stretch of imagination, but they're also phenomenally well organized in many ways, and a lot of criticisms sound either exaggerated or hypocritical to my ears.
The whites are still get privilege there. Off course not at the level thats given in other SDRE/Sooth asian countries. I agree on the 'we are Japanese, we do this our way', theres a lot of that. This is because Japanese are process oriented, the process is as important as the end product. While we don't have any process as such so conform to anything thrown at us, the Japanese have have their process stratified and will like to follow them.But no need to be enamoured by it, there are many many rules and process that does not make sense even from Japanese perspective let alone Gaijin perspective.

The jealousy part is true too. While the Japanese are judged by how Japanesique they are, the outsiders are not, even if you have lived your whole life there. I found out very early(thanks to meeting with couple of Indian SDREs) that how much ever Japanesique you become you will be always a sato guy, so don't bother too much and just get along as much as possible to get the work done, don't try to imitate them.
or another way - I would rather have some of their problems than the ones we have in other countries
I would'nt go that far. They have lot of psychological problems, better to have our problems which are aspirational than their problem imho.
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