India-US Relations : News and Discussion- II

[RajeshA]

there's no we. check post above.

Sorry saar, did not get the point.

Without the 'we' there is no nation. Anyway, may be OT here.

[Agnimitra]

the US has changed also.

ancient history aside, the US remains one of the most open societies and economies in the world, back then and now.

I'm glad the US has changed, but it is a blatant lie to say the it was one of the most open societies back then as well. In terms of race or language policy, the US was one of the most brutal regimes for the major part of its history until the 1960's.

It was so bad that even colonial Euro soldiers during WW2 were shocked at the contempt white US soldiers showed to black soldiers. Remember all those incidents recorded of Brit or NZ soldiers jumping to the defence of Afro-American soldiers getting treated like dung by their white American comrades?

It was so bad that other languages like German and Spanish were forcibly banned and actively discouraged for the better part of US history.

And we're not even going to talk about the Native Americans, or "Indians" as some dolt decided to call them.

But I'm happy the US became more open, as ShauryaT pointed out, AFTER it became expedient to do so. But even today, in terms of language policy and other measures of real tolerance, the US is behind India. Long way to go before American civilization can compare with India's, beyond superficial political correctness.

[TSJones]

40 years ago? the US was far more open than India. Lie to yourself.

[NRao]

I'm glad the US has changed, but it is a blatant lie to say the it was one of the most open societies back then as well. In terms of race or language policy, the US was one of the most brutal regimes for the major part of its history until the 1960's.

And the US will continue to change - circumstances will force the US to do so.

So, will India, circumstances will force certain changes.

In teh area of defense they will get close and they will fight with each other on other topics - Venn diagram. It will be a more open relationship than with other nations, so it will appear more contentious. Not so, it is how nations behave. US-Israel?

Which is what I have been saying for ages.

It is good to see India behaving like a nation. In the process there is a need to take a few bad punches, fall and get up. The last is most important. Modi - it seems to me - is doing just that. Giving a few and taking a few. That is the way it is. There are no "Friends" among nations. And nations throw wild punches.

On Brutal, yes, you are right. It was actually worse prior to that. But that is how nations behave. Check out China today - she is brutal. IF India were to climb India will get brutal too - she has to to survive in that silly game. Watch as India gets to twist some arms in her 'hood in coming years - India wants to be the broker in the IOR. I would keep a close watch on Nepal and SL. BD to some extent, followed by Maldives.

[ranjbe]

40 years ago? the US was far more open than India. Lie to yourself.

certainly nobody was trying to move to India back then. other than hippies.

I was living in the USA then. The Indian ambassador to the USA was refused service in a Maryland restaurant in the 1960's because they thought he was a "colored", George Wallace was on a rampage against "you know who" in Alabama and the "you know who" were discriminated against in the South when they tried to get their legal voting rights. Perhaps TSJ is too young to remember the Civil Rights movement, KKK and Martin Luther King. TSJ should talk to some African-Americans who are familiar with their history, before making such comments.

[TSJones]

40 years ago? the US was far more open than India. Lie to yourself.

certainly nobody was trying to move to India back then. other than hippies.

I was living in the USA then. The Indian ambassador to the USA was refused service in a Maryland restaurant in the 1960's because they thought he was a "colored", George Wallace was on a rampage against you know who in Alabama and the "you know who" were discriminated against in the South when they tried to get their legal voting rights. Perhaps TSJ istoo young to remember the Civil Rights movement and Martin Luther King. TSJ should talk to some Afro-Americans who are familiar with their history before making such comments.

perhaps you should do your arithmetic. 40 years ago was in the middle of 1970's.

[ramana]

40 years ago? the US was far more open than India. Lie to yourself.

certainly nobody was trying to move to India back then. other than hippies.

I was living in the USA then. The Indian ambassador to the USA was refused service in a Maryland restaurant in the 1960's because they thought he was a "colored", George Wallace was on a rampage against "you know who" in Alabama and the "you know who" were discriminated against in the South when they tried to get their legal voting rights. Perhaps TSJ is too young to remember the Civil Rights movement, KKK and Martin Luther King. TSJ should talk to some African-Americans who are familiar with their history, before making such comments.

And under Obama , the first African-American President, US police forces in cities gun down blacks with impunity. Even in liberal San Francisco where the crime lords are Chinese Americans.

[ranjbe]

I was living in the USA then. The Indian ambassador to the USA was refused service in a Maryland restaurant in the 1960's because they thought he was a "colored", George Wallace was on a rampage against you know who in Alabama and the "you know who" were discriminated against in the South when they tried to get their legal voting rights. Perhaps TSJ istoo young to remember the Civil Rights movement and Martin Luther King. TSJ should talk to some Afro-Americans who are familiar with their history before making such comments.
TSJ says:
"perhaps you should do your arithmetic. 40 years ago was in the middle of 1970's."

Yes, siree. A miraculous transformation took place between 1965 and 1975, and all discrimination disappeared. I am older than at most living Americans, and it is my peers living in the USA then, whatever their race, who really know how things were.

[Agnimitra]

40 years ago? the US was far more open than India. Lie to yourself.

Ok if history only begins 40 years ago then I admit you're right... America was the beginning of openness and fairness...

[TSJones]

And under Obama , the first African-American President, US police forces in cities gun down blacks with impunity. Even in liberal San Francisco where the crime lords are Chinese Americans.

and an American woman can get on a bus in India and have her belongings searched by a cop. he found a sat radio.

how many of you have been searched down on a trip inside the US(and not at an airport)?

[sanjaykumar]

Well one thing is that the Red Indian don't complain.

[prahaar]

And under Obama , the first African-American President, US police forces in cities gun down blacks with impunity. Even in liberal San Francisco where the crime lords are Chinese Americans.

and an American woman can get on a bus in India and have her belongings searched by a cop. he found a sat radio.

how many of you have been searched down on a trip inside the US(and not at an airport)?

Two times. Once in front of Albertsons store and second time after leaving an ATM. Also a gun pointed at me for approaching a cop to ask directions. My European colleague joked, it is dangerous to travel with you .

[A Nandy]

Well one thing is that the Red Indian don't complain.

The ones that did aren't around "nomore".

They got rid of those complainers during "road-trips" in the 19th century.

[ramana]

Divine intervention? Indian Hindus ask gods to help Trump



Now we are going overboard!

60Million Xian Fundoos supporting Trump are overshadowed by six lungi wearing Hindus in Delhi!!!!

[ramana]

Sat phones are used by Paki terrorists.
Are you sure its a sat radio and not a sat phone disguised as the other?

[RajeshA]

Divine intervention? Indian Hindus ask gods to help Trump



Now we are going overboard!

60Million Xian Fundoos supporting Trump are overshadowed by six lungi wearing Hindus in Delhi!!!!

The cons of it are that we are seeking saviors outside and not within.

The pros of it are that Democrats who are trying to paint Trump as being scary for the rest of the world except in Russia, are going to have to their narrative punctured by such reports.

[ramana]

This is fearmongering and othering by whoever printed that story.

In 2012 Ombaba wanted to visit Haridwar on private visit for havan/shavan. Was told private visit by US President wont happen. Some proxy did the pujas.

So this has been going on for sometime.

[TSJones]

Sat phones are used by Paki terrorists.
Are you sure its a sat radio and not a sat phone disguised as the other?

it was a sat phone.

[arshyam]

^^ Sat phones are banned in India. Unless the woman had an INMARSAT phone duly declared and licensed when entering the country, possessing it, or any other type of sat phone is illegal in India. The cop was within his rights, looks like.

http://www.dot.gov.in/carrier-services/ ... lite-phone

[Raja Bose]

And under Obama , the first African-American President, US police forces in cities gun down blacks with impunity. Even in liberal San Francisco where the crime lords are Chinese Americans.

and an American woman can get on a bus in India and have her belongings searched by a cop. he found a sat radio.

how many of you have been searched down on a trip inside the US(and not at an airport)?

Why don't we ask the frail Indian grandfather who got body slammed onto the pavement by a 200 lb cop for no reason and is now paralyzed for life. And the cop was found not guilty by the jury coz he claimed he 'slipped'. Real slippery these US sidewalks....

[Lilo]

Frank Islam, From Azamgarh, A Big Face Of Team Hillary Clinton - Rana Ayyub



The first thing I asked Frank Islam when I met him at his luxury suite in a seven-star hotel in Delhi was about his family's ancestral home in Azamgarh. At the risk of sounding parochial, there was an immediate kinship with the 63-year-old, also a fellow Azmi. He belonged to my neighbouring village in Azamgarh, the constituency of Samajwadi Party patriarch Mulayam Singh Yadav.

But Azamgarh ought to be famous for far bigger reasons - as the land of Shibli Nomani who set up the iconic Shibli college and poet and progressive writer Kaifi Azmi, a land of culture and education before it was associated with questionable politics and underworld gangsters.

Frank Islam, who owns one of the biggest mansions in Maryland in the United States where the Clintons, among other prominent Americans have dined, moved to the US in his teens to study after having been identified on the AMU campus as a bright student. He started his career with just about 500 dollars in his pocket and one employee. "This country allows you to dream and let you fulfill it, however big it is. I am proud of my Indian roots that have been an able contributor in the future of America and the Indian-American dream," he says with a twinkle in his eyes.

Islam was in the news early this year when he donated two million dollars to build a new building for the school of management at the Aligarh Muslim University, his alma mater before he moved to the United States to build a multi-million dollar IT empire.

Former US president Bill Clinton with Frank Islam and his wife Debbie Driesman at a fundraiser at their home in Maryland
Currently, however, Islam earns headlines as a significant face of Hilary Clinton's team, one of the few Asian faces driving her rather successful campaign against the Republican Presidential candidate Donald Trump. In his active support for top-rung Democrats Barack Obama, Joe Biden and the Clintons, and as a White House regular, Islam has raised millions for the Clinton campaign in the current cycle.

Can one call him the minority face of Hilary Clinton's campaign, I ask in an email conversation, to which he replies "No one should construe that I am the minority and Indian face of Hillary Clinton's campaign. There are minority faces of all types - African-Americans, Latinos, Indians and others - involved in her campaign. I am proud of my involvement, and I am pleased that there are so many other Indian-Americans who are actively involved as well."

Another diplomatic response comes in when I question him about Hilary Clinton's expectations of PM Narendra Modi as the leader of a conservative party, and if she has any reservations regarding him and the attitude of American and Indian Muslims towards him.

"Secretary Clinton is extremely popular with minorities and the Democratic Party is not a conservative party but one that has advocated aggressively for and done extremely well with minorities dating back to the presidencies of John F. Kennedy and Lyndon Baines Johnson," he said.

Frank Islam moved to the US in his teens to study after having been identified on the AMU campus as a bright student.

He deliberates on Donald Trump's regressive and racist remarks in his presidential campaign, and believes that Indians should not give much attention to those or the promise to rid America of immigrants and outsiders.

"Trump is not a representative of the American dream and is expressing the views of a minority segment of the American population. The turnout for the Republican primaries is about 20% of registered voters, of which he has received in total less than half of the votes cast. This means he is getting only 10% of Republican voters. As far as Secretary Clinton is concerned, I am confident that she will devote considerable attention to deepening economic cooperation between the United States and India; establishing collaborative initiatives and partnerships between the two countries in health care, higher education, and clean energy; and strengthening defense and security cooperation. In a phrase, when she is President, I believe that Hillary Clinton will make India an indispensable partner dedicated to making the United States, India and the world a much safer and saner place for all."

In the past, industrialists Lakshmi Mittal who has had strong ties with the Clintons, Aron Govil and Sant Singh Chatwal have been prominent in strengthening Indo-American business and industry and have also added to the glamour quotient by introducing the White House to link with events based on Indian cinema, culture and arts.

However, Islam, who is keen on strengthening Indian-American ties, believes it's the Education and Health sector in India that he wants the United States to focus on. Islam who was honoured with a doctorate by the Aligarh Muslim University this year wants to repay India and be an inspiration for young students to aspire where he has reached today. On his recent trip to India, at an award ceremony where he honoured achievers from the minority community he asked students and youth to write to him as he was most accessible for those who had similar dreams like him.

If Clinton does emerge the winner, chances are Islam will be a major Indian representative in the White House scheme of things. From Azamgarh, where he was born in a peasant family to working for Obama, he also has a message for the minority community in India that he belongs to. In one of his interviews while receiving a doctorate from Aligarh Muslim University, he said "I know that the young Muslim generation confront hostility and open prejudice because of who they are. They see a dark and desperate world. They share a city but not a community. They share a common dwelling but not in a common effort. They share a common fear. But all of us in this country, Hindus and Muslims or anyone, or any other what I consider a religion or race, we lived together in a peace and harmony for a thousand years; we should set aside our differences to work for a shared goal, shared responsibility and shared sacrifices. So I told the Muslim youth, all of them, get an education, become an entrepreneur, give back to your community and your country, and be inspired by my story."

Irrespective of Clinton's victory, Islam's story remains a truly inspiring one.

(Rana Ayyub is an award-winning investigative journalist and political writer. She is working on a book on Prime Minister Narendra Modi, which will be published this year.)

His name is Fakhrul Islam , he changed it to Frank as part of mandatory self adjustment to make himself fit to pursue the American Dream.

Frank devotes the majority of time currently to a wide variety of civic and philanthropic activities. He serves and has served on numerous boards and advisory councils including the following:

Artistic Involvement
Board of Trustees of the JohnF.KennedyCenter for the Performing Arts ( 2013 to 2019)
Board of Directors, StrathmoreCenter for the Arts (2008 to 2012)
Kennedy Center International Committee on the Arts (2013 to present)

Civic Involvement
Brookings Institution Council
Woodrow Wilson Center National Cabinet
International Advisory Council of the U.S. Institute of Peace (2009 to present)
National Democratic Institute (NDI) Chairman’s Council (2013 to 2016)
Maryland Governor International Advisory Council (2011 to present)
Department of Commerce Industry Trade Advisory Committee (ITAC) (2010 to present)
Advisory Committee of the Export-Import Bank of the United States (2010 to 2011)

Higher Education Involvement
School of Advanced International Studies (SAIS) Johns Hopkins University Advisory Council (2013 to present)
Member of the advisory board of the University of Maryland Smith School of business (2009 to present)
Member of the JohnsHopkinsCareyBusinessSchool Dean’s Advisory Council (2014 to present)
George Mason University School of Management Dean’s Council (2012 to present)
American University School of International Service Dean’s Council (2013 to present)
University of Malaysia (UTM) International Advisory Panel (2012 to present)
Board of Trustees of the AmericanUniversity in the Emirates (AUE) (2012 to present)
Board of Trustees of the American University of Afghanistan
Board of Trustees of Marymount University.

Charitable Involvement
The Frank Islam & Debbie Driesman Charitable Foundation ( President - 2007 to present)
Board of Directors, Potomac Charities, Inc. ( Founding chairman - 2008 to the present)

Business Involvement
Board of Maryland-India Business Roundtable ( Founding member -2003 and -2004)
Board of Directors, The Indus Entrepreneurs (TiE), Washington, D.C. chapter (2007 to 2009)
SouthAsiaCenter at Atlantic Council (Founding member)

[arshyam]

Another diplomatic response comes in when I question him about Hilary Clinton's expectations of PM Narendra Modi as the leader of a conservative party, and if she has any reservations regarding him and the attitude of American and Indian Muslims towards him.

Look at this reporter's mental slavery, asking about a prospective candidate's expectation of an elected leader, one who has been voted into office by the largest democratic process in the world. If anything, she should be asking what are Modi's expectations of a prospective Hillary presidency.

But hey, it's SDTV err, NDTV, so I guess I have the wrong expectation, and they are asking from their US perspective.

[Austin]

Defence Logistics agreement won’t be signed during Modi’s US trip, little progress on other agreements

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/ ... greements/

[Kashi]

Look at this reporter's mental slavery, asking about a prospective candidate's expectation of an elected leader, one who has been voted into office by the largest democratic process in the world. If anything, she should be asking what are Modi's expectations of a prospective Hillary presidency.

But hey, it's SDTV err, NDTV, so I guess I have the wrong expectation, and they are asking from their US perspective.

It's Rana Ayyub, what did you expect? I am surprised she did not claimed to have asked if Hillary as president had any plans for a "deeper intervention" in India and if not then she very well should have.

[UlanBatori]

Sat phones are not usual personal equipment - I have never seen one though I live in Ulan Bator, greatest metropolis in the whole Dunia. Most Amirkhans would have no idea how to use one.

Ppl who carry satphones are well aware of where they are allowed. India's customs rules very clearly and specifically ban satphones. So someone carrying one inside India is, well, a scofflaw at minimum, but really far worse than that - a deliberate mischief-maker. There must be a powerful reason to take the risk and carry a satphone - and it cannot be anything good.

IOW, terrorist.

If they had searched Dawood Gilani on his many trips to India, 169 innocents would be alive today. And A. Kasab would be playing with his mijjile in LaHore instead of in Houristan.

[TSJones]

I think the US authorities should start stopping and searching suspicious looking foreigners for guns, dope, expired visas and terrorist money as they move about in the US.

oops, I forgot.......... our constitution won't allow us to do that.

[Kashi]

I think the US authorities should start stopping and searching suspicious looking foreigners for guns, dope, expired visas and terrorist money as they move about in the US.

oops, I forgot.......... our constitution won't allow us to do that.

Nope, your constitution only permits trigger happy cops to body slam a suspicious, foreign "skinny black guy" onto the pavement, paralysing them for life and legally get away with it with a 10-2 verdict in favour nonetheless

[TSJones]

I think the US authorities should start stopping and searching suspicious looking foreigners for guns, dope, expired visas and terrorist money as they move about in the US.

oops, I forgot.......... our constitution won't allow us to do that.

Nope, your constitution only permits trigger happy cops to body slam a suspicious, foreign "skinny black guy" onto the pavement, paralysing them for life and legally get away with it with a 10-2 verdict in favour nonetheless

the city is going to face a massive law suite(as it sure as hell should).

the cop lost his job.

it wasn't a random search and seizure, somebody had called in and complained about him. probably by a hyper paranoid "WW" as the Boss euphemistically puts it.

[prahaar]

I think the US authorities should start stopping and searching suspicious looking foreigners for guns, dope, expired visas and terrorist money as they move about in the US.

oops, I forgot.......... our constitution won't allow us to do that.

Your constitution may not allow that but your police does many such things. Have some integrity to accept the fragile underbelly of a superpower.

[JE Menon]

Sat phones are used by Paki terrorists.
Are you sure its a sat radio and not a sat phone disguised as the other?

it was a sat phone.

Sat phones are problematic. Pak or pak-backed terrorists regularly are apprehended with them. If memory serves David Headley had one too or it may have been the 26/11 terrorists. Unfortunately after Headley, Americans who were never thought of as terror risk can't be excluded now... Can't blame the cops on that one.

And a Pak is responsible for that too!!!

[Singha]

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/how-i ... 140212.htm
http://www.dnaindia.com/bangalore/repor ... ne-1629607

its not just foreigners - goi comes down hard on anyone found using a sat phone.

[Singha]

http://intellibriefs.blogspot.in/2005/1 ... iving.html

Security agencies believed that the use of satellite phones has substantially upgraded the terrorists’ communication network in the country.

They said the Thuraya had become a mainstay of the militants’ communication network as it is the only mobile satellite service in the global market capable of providing voice, messaging, SMSes and e-mail from a mobile.

"Since the size of this phone is as small as that of any other normal GSM (global system for mobile) phone, the terrorists are finding it too convenient to use it anywhere in the country without being detected by the security personnel," said the officials.

[Singha]

when US faces the same threat level we do from lashkars and tanzeems, they will too respond.

[chanakyaa]

Ppl who carry satphones are well aware of where they are allowed. India's customs rules very clearly and specifically ban satphones. So someone carrying one inside India is, well, a scofflaw at minimum, but really far worse than that - a deliberate mischief-maker. There must be a powerful reason to take the risk and carry a satphone - and it cannot be anything good.

Unfortunately, most of the supari and socializing calls with bhais in TSP, Dubai, and Maylaysia, Indonesia are done by Sat phones in Mumbai.

[UlanBatori]

Oh! Then the American woman must have been a prostitute "On Call Oral Decompression Specialist"

[member_22733]

Why are we wasting bandwidth on a noboby lawbreaker who got dealt with SOP procedures in India? Troll is having a field day here.

[vishvak]

Well one thing is that the Red Indian don't complain.

The ones that did aren't around "nomore".

They got rid of those complainers during "road-trips" in the 19th century.

there are shows called Rodeo in USA that gainfully employ natives to enact the discovery and .. uh.. later phase in some convenient way only! The injuns got to play their own ancestors part alright.

It would entertain the Bible belt just as well. Wonder if there are 2-minute breaks during the show wherein the injuns show off the goody boy side by talking well and where the people behave well with the injuns. Or may be, during any 2-minute breaks the injuns get to think about independent strategic plans and strategies and, in retrospect, lack of naval strength when pilgrims came heeding call to discover distant shores.

[TSJones]

Oh! Then the American woman must have been a prostitute "On Call Oral Decompression Specialist"

go ahead treat them American women with search and seizures when they visit and travel around India.

some of them may return the favor when they get back to the US and complain about you when they have to sit near you on an airplane.

kar·ma
ˈkärmə/Submit
noun
(in Hinduism and Buddhism) the sum of a person's actions in this and previous states of existence, viewed as deciding their fate in future existences.
informal
destiny or fate, following as effect from cause.

last on this from me.

fling away at your leisure

[vishvak]

In Hinduism and Buddhism there is no definition of satellite phone!

[member_22733]

Who better to advice us unwashed about the divine laws of karma than a sanctimonious massan who knows of no ills, and no faults in his own past and the present.

What better place to do it than crap on this thread.


Jai Ho.