Indian Space Program: News & Discussion - Sept 2016

Vivek K · Post by **Vivek K** » 08 Sep 2016 17:51

Great job ISRO!!

Kashi · Post by **Kashi** » 08 Sep 2016 18:11

Jingo Khus hua. More naarmal launches please!!

Suresh S · Post by **Suresh S** » 08 Sep 2016 18:17

Jingo khus hua . continue the naarmal launches. isro is boring us with success

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 08 Sep 2016 18:19

Yaaawwn! Naarmal only!

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 08 Sep 2016 18:33

Though a novice wrt to this dhaaga,
Internalising that naarmal is new word for successful boring launch.

Kudos to ISRO for yet another fine job.

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heard that majority of the isro recruits are from naarml sdres from naarmaal colleges and universities and not from hifi stuff like IIT or foreign pedigree.

shravanp · Post by **shravanp** » 08 Sep 2016 18:47

As the saying goes 'Never underestimate the power of common people'

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 08 Sep 2016 19:12

Congratulations, ISRO!

prasannasimha · Post by **prasannasimha** » 08 Sep 2016 19:13

krisna wrote:Though a novice wrt to this dhaaga,
Internalising that naarmal is new word for successful boring launch.

Kudos to ISRO for yet another fine job.

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heard that majority of the isro recruits are from naarml sdres from naarmaal colleges and universities and not from hifi stuff like IIT or foreign pedigree.

Just not true. There is a large mix and incidentally they are allowed to do in-service PhD's only in IISc /Main 5 IIT's or IIST. So saying that they are not accomplished is worng een on the academic front.

SBajwa · Post by **SBajwa** » 08 Sep 2016 19:38

Congratulations!! Great JOB ISRO!!! Keep it going!

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 08 Sep 2016 19:42

prasannasimha wrote:
krisna wrote:Though a novice wrt to this dhaaga,
Internalising that naarmal is new word for successful boring launch.

Kudos to ISRO for yet another fine job.

-----------------------
heard that majority of the isro recruits are from naarml sdres from naarmaal colleges and universities and not from hifi stuff like IIT or foreign pedigree.
Just not true. There is a large mix and incidentally they are allowed to do in-service PhD's only in IISc /Main 5 IIT's or IIST. So saying that they are not accomplished is worng een on the academic front.

Thanks for clarification.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 08 Sep 2016 19:58

GSLV has a 20-year past and a long way ahead - Madhumitha D.S, The Hindu

The GSLV-F05 launch on September 8 will be routinely low-key but is of immense significance in India’s Space journey. The country started on the GSLV rocket plan in the late 1980s and early 1990s so as to be able to put its 2,000-kg communication satellites to geosynchronous orbits at 36,000 km in space from its own soil. It suffered a setback from geopolitics combined with high-technology commerce: Russia, at the behest of the USA, went back on a deal to transfer critical cryogenic technology for the last and crucial stage of the rocket. Starting in the mid-1990s, ISRO has developed its own cryo engine and has tested it on three vehicles since 2010.

Twenty years on, that old dream vehicle is about to become ready for regular work. On the eve of its flight carrying the weather satellite INSAT-3DR, A.S.Kiran Kumar, ISRO Chairman and the fifth to preside over the GSLV programme, speaks to Madhumathi D.S. about what it means to our country.

Q: Do you feel a sense of achievement or closure as the vehicle is about to become operational?

A: Actually our thoughts are on the backlog that is to be completed! We must make sure that we are able to put them together and bring them up for launch.

This would be the fourth vehicle to fly with our own cryo engine. From now on the target is for two GSLV launches a year, which means a launch every six months. It took us a year between the last one and this. We want to improve that. Currently we are looking forward to streamlining and making the GSLV operational.

Q: How is it to be done?

A: Everybody is being pushed to improve deliveries and time schedules. We are ensuring the supplying industries are able to provide their part. They have to gradually gear up. That is one of the reasons why we are not able to fully implement our plan. Also, for some time there was a lull [in GSLVs between 2010 and 2014] including problems with the launch vehicle itself.

Q: In these 20-odd years, what was lost and gained?

A: Whenever there is technology denial, when something is not [made] available there is that extra effort to make it happen within a certain time. In terms of technology, materials and others. [Which we achieved.]

[Had there been no technology hitch,] We would have moved ahead much earlier and faster on our higher capacity project. (The higher GSLV MarkIII can lift up to four-tonne satellites, or double the GSLV capacity.) However we will be doing its first launch only in December.

Our need for going outside to get many of our communication satellites launched would not have been there. They would have happened right from here [saving several hundred crores of rupees in launch fees.]

Q: What lessons have India and ISRO learnt?

A: We still have issues, such as the many critical materials [of a launch vehicle]. You have to make sure that nobody affects your programme and stops it.

A significant amount of R&D is going on to ensure that critical alloys and materials are taken up. If you take the PSLV we get 8 per cent of its critical materials from outside.

We are continuously identifying those items and raw materials and working towards them. We are putting in place specific programmes to overcome their requirement.

This is a continuous process.

Q: What is on the cards next for this vehicle, GSLV MkII?

A: There is an increasing demand for the GSLV. We are looking at possible opportunities for it to provide commercial launches, just as the PSLV has done.

Yes, even for full launches. A few discussions are going on. We have to wait for the talks to firm up.

(Note: Nine GSLVs were test flown since April 2001; six of them used the Russian cryo engines, the last of them was in December 2010.)

SSSalvi · Post by **SSSalvi** » 08 Sep 2016 20:05

A very informative and collectible article enumerating good factuals about GSLV.

http://thewire.in/64280/gslv-mk2-cryogenic-insat-3dr/

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 08 Sep 2016 20:59

Badam halwa time! Reminds me though of Adm.Koshy's unkept promise of tonnes of mithai when the Akula arrived!

Frederic · Post by **Frederic** » 08 Sep 2016 21:29

Great news! Congrats ISRO

dkhare · Post by **dkhare** » 08 Sep 2016 21:54

Awesome news! Proud of ISRO!

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 08 Sep 2016 22:07

All eager for GSLV Mk III ! hip hip hooray!

Bheeshma · Post by **Bheeshma** » 08 Sep 2016 22:10

Hoping for GSLV-III launch in 2016 itself. No more delays. Any idea when the semi cryo engine will be tested?

vina · Post by **vina** » 08 Sep 2016 22:12

A.S Kiran Kumar Chairman ISRO said/ wrote:We would have moved ahead much earlier and faster on our higher capacity project. (The higher GSLV MarkIII can lift up to four-tonne satellites, or double the GSLV capacity.)

. If 4 ton is all that they wanted, wouldn't they have been far better off in fixing MK1/2 design defect to reach Ariane 4 /Long March 3 series benchmark (both comparable vehicles with similar technology level) of 5 tons GTO , rather than developing a brand new vehicle with clustering 2 liquid engines,and a new cryogenic stage, a new class of solid boosters and all that ?

Bheeshma · Post by **Bheeshma** » 08 Sep 2016 22:14

With L110 stage it can do 4-4.4 tonne max. But with SCE-200 coming in it should increase to 6 tonne or so.

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 08 Sep 2016 23:16

I am now looking forward to two new boring things: GSLV MkIII launch and the electric propulsion on GSAT-9

deejay · Post by **deejay** » 09 Sep 2016 00:00

Congratulations ISRO. Super effort.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 09 Sep 2016 00:26

Yaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwn. Oh badai ho ISRO!!!

dhiraj · Post by **dhiraj** » 09 Sep 2016 00:33

this time too on board camera it seems. hope they share the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbxSgfGWyFc (at 15:56 console seem to show on board camera video in cryo stage)

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 09 Sep 2016 01:00

indranilroy wrote:The antariksh-space blog has a new post (after two years).

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-sC-PNoTGW8o/ ... STOHLV.jpg
As regards heavy-lift vehicles, we are in the process of discussion. It will be a TSTO vehicle whose first stage, like SpaceX’s, will be a five-engine semi-cryo cluster. This will have a modular structure. With one core semi-cryo stage, we can simply go on adding any number of strap-ons, and different payload requirements can be met. The second stage will be a cryo-stage. After the first stage is separated, it can be recovered in sea, like SpaceX has done.

Dr. Sivan, Director, VSSC

Is this a departure from the RLV architecture with a winged first stage flying back and landing like an aircraft on a runway?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 09 Sep 2016 01:10

a bit dated but right time to discuss

http://www.newindianexpress.com/cities/ ... 693939.ece
The semi-cryogenic engine will facilitate applications for future space missions such as the Reusable Launch Vehicle (RLV), Unified Launch Vehicle (ULV) and vehicles for interplanetary missions

http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/Thi ... 262881.ece
ISRO is toying with the idea of adding a semi-cryogenic stage to the GSLV Mk3 to generate a lift up to six tonnes. A more powerful cryo upper stage is expected to add the required muscle to handle satellites up to 10 tonnes. “What we have in mind is a progressive development to come up with need-based variants of the Mk3 instead of coming up with a new rocket altogether,”

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 09 Sep 2016 04:00

sooraj wrote:Webcast Link

Congrats to the ISRO! In the video at 28:47, for the first time I see shock diamonds / Mach rings forming out of the boosters . I don't recall seeing these before. Cool visuals!

symontk · Post by **symontk** » 09 Sep 2016 06:30

GSLV launches are also now naarmal, will wait for exciting LVM3 ones

Congrats everyone who contributed to the success

SriKumar · Post by **SriKumar** » 09 Sep 2016 07:38

Suraj wrote:
sooraj wrote:Webcast Link

Congrats to the ISRO! In the video at 28:47, for the first time I see shock diamonds / Mach rings forming out of the boosters . I don't recall seeing these before. Cool visuals!

Indaresding video....the kundry is broud of the ajeevemend....

Around 0:54:00 the speaker mentions that a lot of the systems were sourced from industry partners..... assemblies, structure, engines....it seems like a _lot_ of it was made outside ISRO. At 1:07:00 , a speaker Tapan Misra makes it a point to say how Insat-3 saved the lives of thousands of people. In the '99 cyclone in Odisha, he watched as the cyclone caused over 10,000 to be killed. But in the 2013 cylclone, thanks to the information from Insat-3D, the storm was tracked accurately and lives were saved due to evacuations (I recall the death toll in Odisha was in single digits, about 14 were killed in WB due to electrocution). Goes without saying, many of the people in the path of the storm who were saved would have been poor people living in ramshackle huts.....so next time anyone mentions poverty vs space program, here is a direct cause for lives saved.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 09 Sep 2016 08:34

http://www.thehindu.com/sci-tech/scienc ... 087070.ece
ISRO eyes Venus mission

The ISRO is mulling over missions to Venus or an asteroid and is under discussions for these, apart from a second mission to Mars, ISRO Chairman A.S. Kiran Kumar said on Thursday.ISRO also has a number of launches in the coming years including the Chandrayaan-2 and a joint mission with NASA, Mr. Kumar told a press conference.Following the successful launch of GSLV-F05, Mr. Kiran Kumar said ISRO plans to launch at least two GSLV Mark II missions every year.Asked whether the space organisation is now comfortable with the indigenous cryogenic stage, a complex system compared to solid and earth-storable liquid propellant rocket stages, S. Somanath, Director, Liquid Propulsion System Centre, ISRO, said the scientists were very confident about it.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 09 Sep 2016 08:48

ISRO Release

In its tenth flight (GSLV-F05) conducted today, (September 08, 2016), India's Geosynchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle, equipped with the indigenous Cryogenic Upper Stage (CUS), successfully launched the country's weather satellite INSAT-3DR, into a Geosynchronous Transfer Orbit (GTO). The achieved orbit is very close to the intended one. The launch took place from the Second Launch Pad at the Satish Dhawan Space Centre SHAR (SDSC SHAR), Sriharikota, the spaceport of India. This was the first operational flight of GSLV equipped with CUS and the fourth to carry the indigenous CUS. Today’s GSLV flight was the third consecutive success achieved by GSLV carrying indigenous CUS and the 2211 kg INSAT-3DR is the heaviest satellite to be launched from the Indian soil.

In its oval shaped GTO, the INSAT-3DR satellite is now orbiting the Earth with a perigee (nearest point to Earth) of 169.76 km and an apogee (farthest point to Earth) of 36,080.5 km with an orbital inclination of 20.62 deg with respect to the equator.

After a 29 hour 40 minutes countdown, the 415 tonne, 49 m tall GSLV-F05 carrying INSAT-3DR, lifted off at the rescheduled time of 16:50 Hrs IST. The 40 minute delay in the launch was due to an anomaly observed in the functioning of a pressure release valve in the liquid Oxygen filling ground segment which was resolved later.

At 4.8 seconds before the countdown reached zero, the four liquid propellant strap-on stages of GSLV-F05, each carrying 42 tonne of liquid propellants, were ignited. At count zero and after confirming the normal performance of all the four strap-on motors, the 139 tonne solid propellant first stage core motor was ignited and GSLV lifted off. The major phases of the flight included the core motor burn-out, strap on burn-out, ignition of the second stage, separation of the core motor together with strap-ons, payload fairing separation, second stage separation, CUS ignition and its timely shut down after satisfactory performance. About seventeen minutes after lift-off, INSAT-3DR was successfully placed in GTO.

Soon after its injection into GTO, the solar array of INSAT-3DR was automatically deployed and the Master Control Facility (MCF) at Hassan in Karnataka took control of the satellite. Like its predecessor INSAT-3D which is providing service from orbit since 2013, INSAT-3DR is an advanced meteorological (weather observation) satellite built by India to provide a variety inputs essential for accurate weather forecasting. For this, it is equipped with three payloads (instruments), namely, a Multispectral Imager, Sounder and weather Data Relay Transponder. INSAT-3DR also carries a satellite aided Search and Rescue Transponder that picks up and relays alert signals originating from distress beacons of maritime, aviation and land based users.

In the coming days, INSAT-3DR's orbit will be raised from its present GTO to the final circular Geostationary Orbit (GSO) by firing the satellite's Liquid Apogee Motor (LAM) in stages. The satellite will be commissioned into service after the completion of orbit raising operations and the satellite’s positioning in its designated orbital slot of 74 degree East longitude in the GSO and in-orbit testing of its payloads.
Today’s flight of GSLV further highlights the success of ISRO in mastering the highly complex cryogenic rocket propulsion technology.

thammu · Post by **thammu** » 09 Sep 2016 09:06

A newbie question: Why is GSLV MK II planned for only 2 launches/year. Why cannot it take PSLV role as we have mastered Cyro and Multiple Satellite launch.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 09 Sep 2016 09:32

thammu wrote:A newbie question: Why is GSLV MK II planned for only 2 launches/year. Why cannot it take PSLV role as we have mastered Cyro and Multiple Satellite launch.

The vehicle's stages (except the first) is fundamentally different from PSLV and is still being shaken up. its launch processes getting streamlined. Streamlining the procurement of parts and materials will take a few more years.

vina · Post by **vina** » 09 Sep 2016 10:11

ISRO is talking about reuse of stages like SpaceX and also multiple restart capabilities of their cryogenic engines so that they can be used for deep space missions and also to fly satellites directly to GEO and not just inject them into GTO.

Well, it looks like the ULA with their new Vulcan launcher is approaching this a bit differently. For one ,they are bringing back via mid air capture, just the engine of the booster and are getting rid of the hydrazine and helium and batteries by having an IC engine in the cryogenic upperstage and pretty much have a cryogenic engine that is probably usable for months together allowing them to do all sorts of stuff.

Maybe the ULA approach seems easier to achieve for ISRO within a shorter time than trying the space X kind of recovery of stage via a flyback and vertical landing (which is complex, failure prone and has a penalty in payload carried.), maybe, we can fix parasails on the engines shed from the stage and fly them to land in northern sri lanka instead of trying to capture it mid air via helicopter like ULA.

AECS Stage Concept Paper

Advanced Cryogenic Evolved Stage

Press conference on Vulcan

juvva · Post by **juvva** » 09 Sep 2016 10:24

^Around 44:15 in the launch video, I noticed, what looks like loss of data, the altitude and velocity plots stopped updating for a few seconds.

prasannasimha · Post by **prasannasimha** » 09 Sep 2016 11:31

juvva wrote:^Around 44:15 in the launch video, I noticed, what looks like loss of data, the altitude and velocity plots stopped updating for a few seconds.

That is jsut a recording glitch we could see it continuously when watching it live

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 09 Sep 2016 11:46

thammu wrote:A newbie question: Why is GSLV MK II planned for only 2 launches/year. Why cannot it take PSLV role as we have mastered Cyro and Multiple Satellite launch.

I don't know what you mean by the 'PSLV Role'. If you mean whether GSLV can't replace PSLV, then the answer is that the GSLV aims to put payloads into Geo-synchronous orbit over the equator at 36000 Kms while PSLV puts the payloads into a polar orbit which is at 90deg to the GSO and at altitudes of only ~700 Kms. Both launchers are needed therefore.

prasannasimha · Post by **prasannasimha** » 09 Sep 2016 12:07

^ The PSLV can launch to GTO also (albeit lower mass) for eg PSLV C4 was the first launch to GTO Just as a frame of reference note that the IRNSS have been launched to GEO or GSO via the PSLV. The GSLV can launch higher mass to GTO

dhiraj · Post by **dhiraj** » 09 Sep 2016 12:09

http://www.deccanchronicle.com/business ... arket.html

So like increase seen in PSLV and as expected GSLV MK.2 will go to 2800 Kg

Isro officials said they were also planning to enhance the GSLV’s payload capacity — from 2,600 kg to 2,800 kilos.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 09 Sep 2016 12:12

Not to mention the significantly higher costs of a GSLV launch - 90+ crores for PSLV vs nearly 200 + crores for GSLV (at this point)

At this point in history, PSLV has struck a golden window of opportunity in space launches for micro-sats taking advantage of "miniaturisation within budgets". It is vitally important to keep the PSLV launch temp up, in parallel to the ramp up of GSLV

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 09 Sep 2016 12:32

hmm...call me in when we put up a few 5 ton radar sats with massive orbit change fuel load and power over the IOR & SCS on parallel tracks...have a whole list of bad guys to beat up.