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Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

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Dipanker
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Dipanker » 10 Jan 2017 02:53

Suraj wrote:Indira Gandhi nationalized the banks in 1971 claiming she wanted to bring about financial inclusion. And yet in 2014 40% of households had no bank account. In 2016 almost every household does. and also in 2016, the black economy that grew dramatically from the IG era, was crippled by demonetization.


You got your history mixed up.

Nationalization of banks happened in 1969 and main reason among others was that private banks were not giving loans to the farmers in the proportions they were asked to. Nationalization of banks contributed significantly to the Green Revolution.

The event of 1971 was Bangladesh war.

Between 1971 - 72 ( ? ) she also completely broke the back of Naxalites from which they did not recover until late 80's/early 90's.

Indira Gandhi also nationalized most of the coal mines in 1973 that lead to the formation of Coal India Limited, and streamlined coal production and lead to expansion of coal industry.

1974: Smiling Buddha

She imposed emergency in 1975, again a very gutsy decision! Incidentally corruption is considered to be lowest during this period.

In 1984, to combat Khalistani terrorists she launched Operation Bluestar and despite being advised to remove her Sikh bodyguards from security duties she stuck with them ( ultimately the same bodyguards killed her ).

So IG does have her fair share of gutsy decisions and hers are big shoes to fill.
Last edited by Dipanker on 10 Jan 2017 05:39, edited 3 times in total.

UlanBatori
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jan 2017 03:09

^^ +100
For a time there, even the Opposition was gracious. ABV described her as "Durga" following the 1971 pleasantries.

But I think the point made above was that 50 years after Nationalization of banks, only 40% of the population had bank accounts, which does not say a great deal about the work ethic or initiative of the Nationalized Banks. Ppl may not have noticed, but NaMo essentially doubled or tripled the No. of accounts at the NBs w/o any great increase in # of staff (I think they did get a massive pay raise). Until the deMo, it was hard to think of NB staff as "stressed by QUANTITY of work".

Inside 2 years, India went from 40% with bank accts to 98% theoretically with bank accounts and digital access to them, (and then to 145% with bank accts inside a month). The "cash crunch" perhaps exposed the reality that many were not using the bank accts, and many employers were too crooked/lazy to use them to deposit wages as is probably required by law.

I have still not understood the Kerala Commie :(( on how a 24K/wk withdrawal limit PER ACCOUNT (not per PAN!) was such a horribly insurmoutable obstacle - for anyone with legit interests.
Last edited by UlanBatori on 10 Jan 2017 03:18, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby nachiket » 10 Jan 2017 03:14

Dipanker wrote:She imposed emergency in 1975, again a very gutsy decision! Incidentally corruption is considered to be lowest during this period.

Making a mockery of democracy and becoming a de-facto dictator is a not a "gutsy" decision. It is a downright criminal one. She was a megalomaniac who humiliated the country and turned India into a banana republic for a brief time.

UlanBatori
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jan 2017 03:19

But.. corruption by others DID pale into insignificance compared to that by Sanjay Gaundie. :)

Plus, the Opposition of the time, all due saashtanga pranaam etc to them, were a bunch of :(( oiseules who richly deserved a few jhapads, with even the esteemed JPN publicly calling for the Armed Forces to mutiny. That was the trigger for the Emergency IIRC (or at least as reported in The Indian Express which was my source of news in those days, and Dom Moraes was no slouch at attacking the govt.).

No leader can afford to allow ppl to call for the armed forces to mutiny and go back to scratching their musharraf and saying "chalta hai".
Last edited by UlanBatori on 10 Jan 2017 03:24, edited 2 times in total.

Dipanker
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Dipanker » 10 Jan 2017 03:23

nachiket wrote:
Dipanker wrote:She imposed emergency in 1975, again a very gutsy decision! Incidentally corruption is considered to be lowest during this period.

Making a mockery of democracy and becoming a de-facto dictator is a not a "gutsy" decision. It is a downright criminal one. She was a megalomaniac who humiliated the country and turned India into a banana republic for a brief time.


The efficacy and appropriateness of the decision is certainly debatable, but I would still consider the the decision gutsy.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Rishirishi » 10 Jan 2017 03:24

The banks were in the hand of industrialists. I doubt if India would have escaped the financial crisis had the banks been under the control of powerfull business houses. The High and Mighty would have lobbied and managed to deregulate the markets like they did in the US.....The rest we know.

Private banks would never interested in farmers, or people without money.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Suraj » 10 Jan 2017 03:29

Dipanker wrote:
Suraj wrote:Indira Gandhi nationalized the banks in 1971 claiming she wanted to bring about financial inclusion. And yet in 2014 40% of households had no bank account. In 2016 almost every household does. and also in 2016, the black economy that grew dramatically from the IG era, was crippled by demonetization.


You got your history mixed up.

No I don't. I may be off by 2 years, but the fact is that 40+ years after nationalization, more than 40% of households remained unbanked. That problem has been essentially fixed in 2 years since 2014. The rest of the stuff is off topic and irrelevant to this thread.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Raveen » 10 Jan 2017 03:53

Dipanker wrote:
nachiket wrote:Making a mockery of democracy and becoming a de-facto dictator is a not a "gutsy" decision. It is a downright criminal one. She was a megalomaniac who humiliated the country and turned India into a banana republic for a brief time.


The efficacy and appropriateness of the decision is certainly debatable, but I would still consider the the decision gutsy.



Ha - so is strolling naked down a busy street in broad day light.

Gutsy and wise have a few astronomical units of distance between them my pedantic friend.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby ramana » 10 Jan 2017 04:37

From Spinster

Mrs IG nationalized banks in 1969.

When IG split the Congress,the treasurer of Congress party was Venkata Subbiah prior to the split into Cong I and Cong O ( Congress Indira Gandhi And Congress Organization) the Congress party constitution allowed only Treasurer of the party to with draw money and fund elections.

All the big banks were owned by industrialists like Tata's Goenka's Kirloskarsand Birla's
Indian Bank by Chettiars Andhra Bank by Gupta's

She was mad Venkat Subbiah defected and also nationalized the banks to choke Nijalingappa, Kamraj Morarji lead Congo.

xxxxxxxx

Thanks
Spinster


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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Primus » 10 Jan 2017 04:55

JohnTitor wrote:
pandyan wrote:
https://rbi.org.in/scripts/FAQView.aspx?Id=60

2 business hours and fee is like 0.025% and drops quite a bit for larger amounts (0.0125%). So, it is probably the fastest and cheapest electronic transfer scheme.
For 2 hour service, you have to pay through the nose in other countries.

Errr No. In the UK/EU, bank transfers are done within 2 hours and are free. Actually, although they quote 2 hrs, transfer is pretty much instant. Depending on the bank and type of account, you can transfer upto £250k free & pretty much instantly. Heck, you can even send to a UK phone number for free and instantly through the same method.


Sigh....... The US falls behind again. Same day transfer (at least in Bank of America) costs $25 in transaction fees. Of course this is for an account in a different bank. For transfers to an account in the same bank (but to a different person) it is less, but not free (for same day).

UlanBatori
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jan 2017 04:58

Had it not been nationalized, Indian Bank for sure would have gone under about 15 years ago, then again, that was due to non-performing loans forced by political leaders. I think the Bank's President went to jail. The nationalized banks ultimately had a lot to do with the success of the deMo, even if it was because they were forced to follow orders or else. (yes, it has succeeded, all the yowling notwithstanding, and the nation is not going back to the pre-Nov 8 situation).

Now if they would stock more 100 rupee notes in the ATMs...
(BTW, young driver advised us that the trick is to always ask for 1900 rupees at the ATM. Who says India has deficit of STEM skills hain? )

Rishirishi
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Rishirishi » 10 Jan 2017 05:02

How is the currency situation now? has it started to ease

Primus
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Primus » 10 Jan 2017 05:06

UlanBatori wrote:^^ +100
For a time there, even the Opposition was gracious. ABV described her as "Durga" following the 1971 pleasantries.



UB Ji, actually he did not and it is a concoction of the media that has continued ever since. Here is the man himself denying it:



However, I do agree that IG was indeed a gutsy PM in many ways, though nowhere near LBS, who IMHO was the best we've had until the seminal events in 2014.

Bit OT, all this.

UlanBatori
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jan 2017 05:47

:(

sum
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby sum » 10 Jan 2017 06:12

shiv wrote:
Yagnasri wrote:https://scroll.in/latest/826262/demonetisation-may-summon-narendra-modi-if-rbi-governors-reply-is-unsatisfactory-says-pac-chief

Leftist wet dreams.

Small men with little minds.

Knew about this before the news even hits the papers since all the usual suspects in my groups were jumping up and down as if in sync with glee about how the actual fun would start now and why judgement day will come for this govt :|

Some people have really lost it going by the sheer glee they find to prove everything is going wrong in India!

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby shiv » 10 Jan 2017 06:56

sum wrote:
shiv wrote:Small men with little minds.

Knew about this before the news even hits the papers since all the usual suspects in my groups were jumping up and down as if in sync with glee about how the actual fun would start now and why judgement day will come for this govt :|

Some people have really lost it going by the sheer glee they find to prove everything is going wrong in India!


Did you read the stupid reasons quoted by that dung-brain? He says digital economy can't work because of call drops. I bet he thinks Mao and Djinns work together to make ATMs work. All India interlinked ATMs are the biggest evidence of a powerful digital base to the e-khanomy.

UlanBatori
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jan 2017 07:52

This is so funny. I thought in India they have a Parliamentary system where the leader of the party that wins democratic elections becomes the Prime Minister, and s(he) decides who and how to rule the country. Not the pissant corrupt flea-bearded sh!t that gets elected chair of some petty committee.

Obviously I am wrong. "Summon" the PM. :eek: :shock: NaMo must be beeing in his chaddis.

O I c what happened with their plan to "summon" the RBI chief for a Dec. 27 trial.
The RBI governor has been given until January 20 to respond to 10 questions. “If there are no laws that you can cite, why should you not be prosecuted?”, the panel asked Patel in a questionnaire dated December 30.


Oh, yuwar stinkin' honner, I cyain't cite no law. I'll wait until you launch your false prosecution and THEN show you why that was a sh1tbrained idea.


I think after Dr. RaGa scooted to Bilayat after his exposee of Sheila Dixit, they didn't have any Authorities to draft that Questionnaire.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby rahulm » 10 Jan 2017 08:01

Yesterday evening I met a pub owner friend in Pune at his venue and this is the story.

Pre DEMON , the government one off rate for a liquor licence is Rs 6L. The total one has to pay Excise parasites is Rs 22L to get a licence.Thats more than 3+ times the official rate.

The point of my post is, according to him, post DEMON the rate has remained unchanged. It's the bar owners problem to find cash from anywhere. The only adjustment the licensing authority has made is for the bar owner to pay in EMI's :roll:

The excise parasites also need to paid about Rs 15k monthly for a no hassles operation. Then the local revered beatbpolice police around Rs 1000 per visit.

In addition to cash, free food and booze is SOP.

There are about 30 different licences one has to apply for and acquire. A separate licence each is required for English music, Hindi Music, live music, bottled beer, IMFL, draught beer, shops and establishment licence, fire department licence he gave me a whole,laundry list. This is sheer madness.

According to him, post DEMON, absolutely nothing has changed for him from a corruption perspective except payments by EMI. In fact , due to customers moving to cashless, he says, it's difficult for him to find cash. This is a good thing but I doubt the sarkari parasites will change their behaviour due to this one simple fact.

-----

In a few separate stories, earlier in the day, I drove from Pune to Urli Kanchan to inspect a used Gypsy that I want to plonk in my Goa house. On the way, I bought 2 bottles of water using payTM drom a small shop.

If you are offended easily please don't read any further. You have been warned.


The piece-de-resistance - There are certain ahem sections of the Pune populace who are ahem well known and made fun off. They are usually refrerred to as sxxxxxxxv pethis :D due to their err 'unique' behaviour.

in December, post DEMON, I visited a typical hotel owned by one such Punekar and upon my inquiry he flatly refused any movement to cashless.

Yesterday, I went again to have sabudana khiccdi for breakfast and nearly fell off my chair. Not only did he have payTM signs everywhere, he was also accepting card payments.

For such a typical Punekar to shed his attitude and stubbornness and move to cashless is, for me, a huge win by NaMo and made my day.

Finally, visited Ravivar and Rasta peth. Want to buy a used 2 wheeler for Goa. I visited no less than 10 shops. Without exception all 10 were accepting card and UPI payments. Very pleasing.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Hari Seldon » 10 Jan 2017 08:17

^rahulm saar.

The least we can do is let @CMOMaharashtra know. In generalities, about the liquor license corruption. We'd have done our (v basic) dharma that way.

Just like in '91 PVNR closed several rent-seeking baboo(n) ops by abolishing MRTP, why not Phadnavis do a similar surgical strike on some of the more egregious rent-seeking opportunities indulged in by sarkari 'servants' (savants, rather)?

I understand Dev.P would (like, NM, perhaps), want to first focus on common man's basic necessities as they interact with sarkari interface (and maybe daru ain't high on that list).

But that aside, wasn't removing inspector raj one of the tenets of what was proposed by modi sarkar? Or was that for big business alone? Or maybe i'm rambling now ...

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jan 2017 08:20

Cashless Is King as E-Money Stocks Surge From India Currency Ban
by Santanu Chakraborty
January 8, 2017, 1:33 PM EST

Government offer rebates, discounts to spur digital payments
Digital economy seen growing to $1 trillion in 3 to 4 years

Prime Minister Narendra Modi may offer another gift to India’s electronic cash companies. An index of the stocks has gained 12 percent since November’s surprise currency ban, and may further rally after the government introduced tax rebates on digital transactions from Christmas Day.

The gain in the gauge of 23 companies that make the devices and offer cashless services compares with the S&P BSE Sensex’s 3 percent drop since Nov. 8, when Modi invalidated 86 percent of the nation’s currency in circulation. Modi rolled out a slew of measures including rewards, tax rebates and discounts for digital transactions on Dec. 25.

E-commerce software makers Vedavaag Systems Ltd. and Intense Technologies Ltd. have rallied more than 50 percent in the past month, while Aurionpro Solutions Ltd., R S Software India Ltd. and Tanla Solutions Ltd. have gained 20 percent.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby madhu » 10 Jan 2017 09:51

rahulm wrote:The point of my post is, according to him, post DEMON the rate has remained unchanged. It's the bar owners problem to find cash from anywhere. The only adjustment the licensing authority has made is for the bar owner to pay in EMI's :roll:

even I have heard the same.
latest rumor is one account for one person :rotfl:

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Yagnasri » 10 Jan 2017 09:55

MH like AP is one of the most corrupt places. The problem is the manner in which liquor business is viewed and done in this country. Why there is a need for this kind of licencing and other permits type rubbish. We all know that such things lead to bribes only. Let us remove all this licence permit quota rubbish on liquor sale etc. People will drink anyway. The loot from that will stop at least.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Rishi Verma » 10 Jan 2017 10:10

Mayawati Brother, Anand Kumar, being Investigated for 1300cr

For all the seditious, anti-national, anti-harmony false things this Thugtress Mayawati has uttered, If her literally bh*nch*d brother has milked Dalit's money for personal gain then Dalit's should rise up and barbeque him at the nearest banyan tree. No less punishment should be acceptable.

NEW DELHI: His name may not figure in the list of top Indian industrialists, but that's how Anand Kumar, Mayawati 's brother operates: low profile, hardly photographed. His swift rise, however, may not just be a coincidence.

His fortunes grew exponentially between 2007 and 2014 — when his sister was chief minister of Uttar Pradesh. His net worth rose from nearly Rs 7.5 crore to Rs 1,316 crore.

Times Now is in possession of income tax probe details which reveal a clear paper trail of round tripping through shell companies, taking mysterious multicrore loans and huge real estate investments.

The first clear case of alleged round tripping is that of Aakriti Hotels Pvt Ltd — a company in which Anand Kumar is a major player through debenture shareholdings.

Aakriti Hotels is a Delhi-based company which, as per records with the Registrar of Companies, has three directors and close to 37 equity shareholders, but not all of them seem legitimate. Some of the firms listed as their shareholders are shell companies that exist only on paper.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby shiv » 10 Jan 2017 10:12

Yagnasri wrote:MH like AP is one of the most corrupt places.

Why are you discriminating and leaving out Ka here?

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Neshant » 10 Jan 2017 10:23

Rishirishi wrote:The banks were in the hand of industrialists. I doubt if India would have escaped the financial crisis had the banks been under the control of powerfull business houses. The High and Mighty would have lobbied and managed to deregulate the markets like they did in the US.....The rest we know.

Private banks would never interested in farmers, or people without money.


The danger of fiat money is once control of it falls into the hands of private banksters, the country is effectively back under colonialism.

This is true of paper fiat money and more so of digital money.

When some entity has a monopoly over the creation & value of money which society is forced to use, inevitably that power is used to rob the nation.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby habal » 10 Jan 2017 11:01

shiv wrote:
Yagnasri wrote:MH like AP is one of the most corrupt places.

Why are you discriminating and leaving out Ka here?


the whole belt of MH, KA & AP is rife with corruption. Mumbai & surroundings used to be obscenely corrupt when mumbai was boomimg, now mantle switched over to KA.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby habal » 10 Jan 2017 11:11

Rishirishi wrote:How is the currency situation now? has it started to ease


the lines in banks are back in my grazing area. RBI is back to supplying cash in dribbles. There seems to be a serious shortage of cash for daily transations. One popular restaurant owner in my town passed away around 50 days ago and thus that place shut shop. Another archies outlet, sole operational archies in town shut shop a week after demo. Rest are hanging on for now. I really hesitate to ask around for more details because I fear a lot of negative news, & am not ready to hear that, neither do I have explanations for it. Really difficult to see ₹500 and ₹2000 with shops, * I do quick peek at their cash register * and it seems most trade is happening in ₹100 multiples.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby nandakumar » 10 Jan 2017 11:28

ramana wrote:From Spinster

Mrs IG nationalized banks in 1969.

When IG split the Congress,the treasurer of Congress party was Venkata Subbiah prior to the split into Cong I and Cong O ( Congress Indira Gandhi And Congress Organization) the Congress party constitution allowed only Treasurer of the party to with draw money and fund elections.

All the big banks were owned by industrialists like Tata's Goenka's Kirloskarsand Birla's
Indian Bank by Chettiars Andhra Bank by Gupta's

She was mad Venkat Subbiah defected and also nationalized the banks to choke Nijalingappa, Kamraj Morarji lead Congo.

xxxxxxxx

Thanks
Spinster


It is incorrect to say that nationalisation of banks was prompted by the inability of Indira Gandhi to access Congress Party funds because the Treasurer Venkatasubbiah teamed up with the Syndicate Congress (Kamaraj, Nijalingappa et al). Post 1967 Gen Elections, the fault lines between the Old Guard of the Congress and IG had deepened. Mrs Gandhi then used the Young Turks to snipe at the old guards to push the party towards a more radical leftist economic policies. Bank nationalisation and abolition of privy purse were two pet themes. At the 1967 working committee meeting of the Congress Party the proposals were shot down which was widely seen as a political defeat for Indira Gandhi. She swallowed it. But in 1969 when her candidate for the post of President (VV Giri) was shot down and the Congress Parliamentary Board chose Sanjiva Reddy that is when Indira Gandhi knew her own political survival was at stake. She decided to fight back. She announced bank nationalisation and abolition of privy purse.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Sachin » 10 Jan 2017 12:23

Local dailies report that RBI is now doing the "recounting" of money deposited by SBI in Kerala state. They talk about "double counting" done by the bank staff. Did not find any English media reporting this, so not giving a link.

madhu wrote:Demonetisation: PAC Can Call PM if RBI's Reply Not Satisfactory

The PAC is not just a Congress private property. Their are BJP MPs also in the said committee. Only if both parties agree can this commitee as any one to appear in front of it. And this committee also do not have any judicial powers or impose any punishment on Modi. It is another form of "fact finding commitees" which the commies specialise in.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Yagnasri » 10 Jan 2017 12:40

I left KA out because when I lived it was far better and personally liked Kannadigas. Now Siddu ensured that KA goes down the drain. MH and AP loot is more institutionalised and in AP it became awful with YSR coming to power. Taking bribes is one thing, and loot and criminal enterprise by rulers are another thing or may be the next logical level.

The degeneration of entire Telugu people happened in front of us. While bribes were there even up to the fall of CBN in 2004 the manner in which the GoAP did its business and now doing in TS at least is unparallel in Telugu history. I had some hope for AP, but i fear CBN gang is too going down the same path.

MH went wrong long time sick with Sugarcane crop/Mill, Co-Op Banks, Eng Colleges/Medical colleges, water co-op societies, Agri Marketing organisations, etc. Present GoMH is slowly deregulating things and removing NCP INC mafia from some of these things. But it takes a lot of time. The first thing shall be stopped sugar cane cultivation form MH which will improve the lot of farmers and rural areas of MH a lot. But who will bell the cat?

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby rkirankr » 10 Jan 2017 13:12

habal wrote:
Rishirishi wrote:How is the currency situation now? has it started to ease


the lines in banks are back in my grazing area. RBI is back to supplying cash in dribbles. There seems to be a serious shortage of cash for daily transations. One popular restaurant owner in my town passed away around 50 days ago and thus that place shut shop. Another archies outlet, sole operational archies in town shut shop a week after demo. Rest are hanging on for now. I really hesitate to ask around for more details because I fear a lot of negative news, & am not ready to hear that, neither do I have explanations for it. Really difficult to see ₹500 and ₹2000 with shops, * I do quick peek at their cash register * and it seems most trade is happening in ₹100 multiples.

I have had a different experience. In past few weeks, was able to withdraw 4500. Could do so within 15 mts. No crowds or long queues seen

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Austin » 10 Jan 2017 13:59

Demonetisation: IT Dept Scrutinizing Rs 3-4 Lakh Crore in 'Suspect' Deposits

http://www.news18.com/news/india/demone ... 33666.html
New Delhi: The Income Tax Department suspects that nearly Rs 3-4 lakh crore of evaded income has been deposited in banks post the demonisation drive that began two months ago and is scrutinising the details, PTI reported quoting an official.

Reports indicate that nearly 95%-97% of the Rs 15.44 lakh crore that was demonetized on November 8 is back in the banking system. The expectation of the government is that even assuming that 20% of this amount was black money, it would be extinguished because it would not be returned.

Out of the total currency demonetized, there are indications that only around Rs 14,000 lakh crore is back in the formal banking system. Hence, the Income Tax Department suspects that some portion of the returned currency may be unaccounted cash.

The IT department also suspects that more than Rs 2 lakh crore was deposited in over 60 lakh bank accounts post-demonetisation and that around Rs 10,700 crore cash was deposited in bank accounts in north eastern states, some of which are exempt from paying income tax.

The income tax department, along with the enforcement directorate is also looking into over Rs 16,000 crore deposited in cooperative banks, PTI reported.

Holders of the old currency were given an option to exchange or deposit them in bank accounts until December 30.

"Starting from November 8, 2016 various reports were called for from the banks based on different threshold of cash deposits made by different categories of persons. The reports were collated and analysed based on intelligence which has been available in the Government data bases," the official said.

After in-depth analysis, these reports have been disseminated to Income Tax Department, the Enforcement Directorate (ED) and other Law Enforcement Agencies.

The deposits of more than Rs 13,000 crore in Regional Rural Banks have also been disseminated.

Besides, "cash deposits in terrorist affected states have also been disseminated to the concerned law enforcement agencies and appropriate actions have been taken in such cases," he said.

The official said cash deposits of Rs 2 lakh to Rs 2.5 lakh per account, totalling to Rs 42,000 crore, are found to have common PAN, mobile number or address. The same would be looked into in detail by the Income-Tax Department.

The government has got analysed the deposits in Pradhan Mantri Jan Dhan Yojana (PMJDY) accounts in detail and amounts of cash deposited under a different threshold in various regions of the country and shared it with I-T department.

"All cash deposits of more than one lakh rupees in cash under PMJDY accounts would also be looked into, based on the intelligence inputs," he said.

It has come to the notice of the government that more than Rs 25,000 crore have been deposited in cash in re-activated dormant bank accounts and the details have also been shared with the Income Tax department.

Similarly, nearly Rs 80,000 crore of repayment of loans in cash above a certain threshold post demonetisation has also been shared with law enforcement agencies.

"The Income Tax department has undertaken numerous actions, both intrusive and non-intrusive, based on the intelligence and in turn referred a number of cases for parallel investigation by the ED and CBI. The actions have unearthed non-filers, huge amounts of unaccounted income and shell companies," the official said without giving details.

The Income Tax department is also undertaking data analysis and comprehensive matching of the huge intelligence inputs with government databases to have a more effective and focused intrusive and non-intrusive actions in the coming days.

"It is already taking actions in cases where cash deposits above Rs 50,000 have been made without quoting of PAN," he said.

"The Income Tax Department is using tools and its sources to identify each of these persons and is confident that there would a big expansion in the tax base and a quantum jump in direct tax collection," the official added.

prahaar
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby prahaar » 10 Jan 2017 14:03

When we talk about corruption, Gujarat is not too far behind. The difference is that delivery of services happens (improved roads + electricity is primary driver). When Modi was CM, he started notifying prices of land to ensure compliance. After he left Gujarat and became PM, additional land prices have not been notified. Apparently during Modi's tenure 30% work got done but the balance 70% is stuck. Anyone familiar about the details about this, please elaborate.

For example, there is a nice website https://anyror.gujarat.gov.in/Info712Page.aspx to authenticate any land record in selected cities. But I doubt if it covers the whole of Gujarat.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Prasad » 10 Jan 2017 14:48

Mongol yak-herderji
Triggering of self-preservation instincts in BM holders when such a campaign is launched is a valid point. So for secrecy pain was a must. Agree.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby pankajs » 10 Jan 2017 15:43

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 437532.cms
Since November 8, Rs 80,000 crore of loan repayment in old notes, says Income Tax department
NEW DELHI: The income tax department said on Tuesday that more than 60 lakh bank accounts saw deposits of over Rs 2 lakhs each since the November scrapping of Rs 500 an Rs 1,000 notes.

About Rs 80,000 crore of repayment of loans was done in cash since November 8. And Rs 3-4 lakh crore of evaded income was deposited in banks post that date, an I-T official said.

More than Rs 16,000 crore was deposited in cooperative bank accounts since demonetisation. As much as Rs 25,000 crore was deposited in cash in dormant bank accounts post demonetisation. And in the troubled North Eastern states, more than Rs 10,700 crore in cash was deposited in various bank accounts, the official said.

Meanwhile, the I-T department and Enforcement Directorate also said they are scrutinising the Rs 16,000 crore that was deposited in cooperative bank accounts+ .

The deposits of more than Rs 13,000 crore in Regional Rural Banks have also been disseminated.

Besides, "cash deposits in terrorist affected states have also been disseminated to the concerned law enforcement agencies and appropriate actions have been taken in such cases," he said.

The official said cash deposits of Rs 2 lakh to Rs 2.5 lakh per account, totalling to Rs 42,000 crore, are found to have common PAN, mobile number or address. The same would be looked into in detail by the Income-Tax Department. {As speculated long back, these guys were sucker punched by announcing 2.5L as a threshold for investigation.}

The government has got analysed the deposits in Pradhan Mantri Jan Dhan Yojana+ (PMJDY) accounts in detail and amounts of cash deposited under different threshold in different regions of the country and shared it with I-T department.

"All cash deposits of more than one lakh rupees in cash under PMJDY accounts would also be looked into, based on the intelligence inputs," he said.

It has come to the notice of the government that more than Rs 25,000 crore have been deposited in cash in re-activated dormant bank accounts and the details have also been shared with the Income Tax department.

Similarly, nearly Rs 80,000 crore of repayment of loans in cash above a certain threshold post demonetisation has also been shared with law enforcement agencies.

"The Income Tax department has undertaken numerous actions, both intrusive and non-intrusive, based on the intelligence and in turn referred a number of cases for parallel investigation by the ED and CBI. The actions have unearthed non-filers, huge amounts of unaccounted income and shell companies," the official said without giving details.

The Income Tax department is also undertaking data analysis and comprehensive matching of the huge intelligence inputs with government databases to have a more effective and focused intrusive and non-intrusive actions in the coming days.

"It is already taking actions in cases where cash deposits above Rs 50,000 have been made without quoting of PAN," he said.{I always thought that deposit above 50k into a non-KYC a/c was liable to raise yellow flags}

"The Income Tax Department is using tools and its sources to identify each of these persons and is confident that there would a big expansion in the tax base and a quantum jump in direct tax collection," the official added.{There are many incidental benefits but this is one of 3-4 core ones}

Interestingly, Finance Minister Arun Jaitley, on November 12, had claimed that around 2 lakh crore rupees had been deposited in banks across the country, just four days after demonetisation.

"The largest banker in the country State Bank of India saw deposits of Rs 47,868 crore till afternoon (Nov 12)," Jaitley said at the time.

Added later: This report is same/similar to one posted by Austin but I will let it be otherwise I would have to quote the full post and make the highlights and comments. In the end would take up same amount of space. Mods pls remove if you feel otherwise.

pankajs
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby pankajs » 10 Jan 2017 16:17

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ind ... 440759.cms
Note ban: Cash deals worth Rs 25,000 crore move to digital mode

NEW DELHI: Post demonetisation, cash-based transactions worth Rs 25,000 crore have moved to the digital mode, says a survey.

The Economic Research Department of State Bank of India carried out the survey from December 30, 2016 to January 3, 2017 so as to understand the nuances of demonetisation. It showed that 15 per cent of transactions moved to electronic payments such as m-wallets and Point of Sale machines.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Pratyush » 10 Jan 2017 16:55

habal wrote:
Rishirishi wrote:How is the currency situation now? has it started to ease


the lines in banks are back in my grazing area. RBI is back to supplying cash in dribbles. There seems to be a serious shortage of cash for daily transations. One popular restaurant owner in my town passed away around 50 days ago and thus that place shut shop. Another archies outlet, sole operational archies in town shut shop a week after demo. Rest are hanging on for now. I really hesitate to ask around for more details because I fear a lot of negative news, & am not ready to hear that, neither do I have explanations for it. Really difficult to see ₹500 and ₹2000 with shops, * I do quick peek at their cash register * and it seems most trade is happening in ₹100 multiples.


I though that 50 days was sufficient time for GPRS based POS to be installed in places that want to do honest transactions???

While the suppliers could be paid through cheques.

shyamal
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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby shyamal » 10 Jan 2017 18:04

Report from Kolkata - Things have been normal since last week of December.
The Jan pay-day/pension-day passed without any troubles.
Most of the shops I frequent - not the malls which anyway had card payment - have limped back to near-normalcy.
Change is not really an issue anymore. Lots of 100s and many 500s in circulation as well.
PayTM has been a big success here with many small shops adopting it.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby Uttam » 10 Jan 2017 19:43

habal wrote:
shiv wrote:Why are you discriminating and leaving out Ka here?


the whole belt of MH, KA & AP is rife with corruption. Mumbai & surroundings used to be obscenely corrupt when mumbai was boomimg, now mantle switched over to KA.


You Madrasis have no idea what is corruption :rotfl: . (From: a Bhaiya from UP).

Sorry couldn't resist. The corruption is never localized because it begins at the top. A cop, govt doctor, an irrigation engineer, a land registrar in UP is corrupt because people at the top of the administration are corrupt. Theses people at the bottom of the food chain pay loads of money to buy a prized posting and then send regular payments to retain these. Therefore if the central government is corrupt then that will permeate to every state and every sector. Same way if the CM is corrupt, the entire state machinery will be corrupt. No lesson in moral science will eliminate corruption. To reduce corruption one has to remove the opportunity to be corrupt and that is what demo and cashless economy does.

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Re: Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jan 2017 20:03

^^ So on that excellent note I suggest that it is time to lock this thread and start a new one titled:

WHO'S WHINING ABOUT DEMONETIZATION AND DIGITAL TRANSPARENCY?

Need a record of the corrupt and the lifafa writing/whining for them. With elections coming up, this is really the subject that needs wide national and international exposure.


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