India's R&D in Defence DRDO, PSUs and Private Sector

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 22 Jan 2018 16:39

http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/mm/Item ... zation.pdf

ITEMS/COMPONENTS BEING IMPORTED /TO BE INDIGENISED
(Updated as on 01-01-2018)

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 22 Jan 2018 16:40

http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/vendor_meet.pdf

posting only for records and info.

dinesh_kimar · Post by **dinesh_kimar** » 22 Jan 2018 18:45

^ From Jayasimha's post:
it's bleddy unbelievable. They want to indigenise BMP 30mm ammo , after building it from 1989.

Other items listed are "baseplate" and " springs". There's even a searchlight.

This isn't deep slumber, its coma.

And the solution isn't to privatize. Didn't work in Latin America, Africa and other places.

My suggestion: Throw out the people and put in fresh blood, and professional managers with power to hire and fire. Same method worked in France for their giant auto PSU,Renault. Let board of directors be Public and Govt nominees.

Naysayers pls note that the Indian Army is also a government organisation, just like OFB. But its internal system is gamed for results. No option to fail.

Please please stop this social service scheme of government holidays, LTA, ration, schooling within the PSU, hospital within the PSU, drivers, Gardner's, cooks, peon class 1-4, etc. If the system was truly dharmic, like bringing in foundrymen, metalworkers, etc to keep core tech with us, I would be first to defend it. I understand BEML has indegenised the TATRA overnight, after rumblings were made in media about closing down BEML. We know its possible.

dinesh_kimar · Post by **dinesh_kimar** » 22 Jan 2018 18:50

^ Tatra ToT was acquired in 1986 from Omnipol of Czechoslovakia. Neither Omnipol or Czechoslovakia exist anymore, but we still pay abt 60% Foreign exchange per truck to some entity bases in Europe collecting on its behalf.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Jan 2018 02:29

jaysimha wrote:http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/mm/Item ... zation.pdf

ITEMS/COMPONENTS BEING IMPORTED /TO BE INDIGENISED
(Updated as on 01-01-2018)

Interesting list. Looks like they have not made a make or buy decision for some of the items. The numbers are very small. Maybe if same material is used in many OFB factories could have opportunity for scaling.

Over all many small and medium industrial houses should be bale to make these.
However ammo filling etc. has to be big houses for the infrastructure reasons.

However such a list is there so soon after NS took over means MoD means business.

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 23 Jan 2018 10:42

DRDO Technology available for transfer update

Radar Absorbing paint Jan 6th 2018

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/English/97 ... MR-RAP.pdf

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 23 Jan 2018 12:49

http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/product ... alogue.pdf

OFB product catalog published june 2017

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 23 Jan 2018 12:52

http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/pr/pr_dgof_air.pdf

OFB-Russia Defence Cooperation

Russia has been extending technical assistance in all spheres of activities for indigenised production of main battle tanks and infantry combat vehicles

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 23 Jan 2018 13:02

System indigenously developed/produced by OFB

Weopon System
http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/make_in ... Weapon.pdf

Ammunition
http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/make_in ... a_AMMN.pdf

Armoured Vehicles
http://ofbindia.gov.in/download/make_in ... dia_AV.pdf

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 23 Jan 2018 19:34

dinesh_kimar wrote:^ From Jayasimha's post:
it's bleddy unbelievable. They want to indigenise BMP 30mm ammo , after building it from 1989.

Other items listed are "baseplate" and " springs". There's even a searchlight.

This isn't deep slumber, its coma.

I can't dispute this statement, but as always my mind searches for "explanations"

It appears that in the process of licence manufacture the OFB have behaved like a high-tech man servant at home - the guy who washes the cars, waters the garden, walks the dog, fetches the groceries etc. They do exactly what they are told. No more. They are told "you make X, and we import Y and Z and you then assemble X+Y+Z and say "Made by OFB"". No incentive to do anything more and a typical gormint job where people come, work for x years earn pension and retire. No innovation. No change. Just a routine steady (and probably pretty well paid) job - yes for gardener and driver also.

I am eternally reminded of a BSNL (land line) office from 1992 where lady at desk had to pass a file to lady in the desk adjacent to her. For that she had to call out "Seethamma!" - and Seethamma had to appear from somewhere after her tea break to pass the file 2.5 feet. This is what the government does.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Jan 2018 23:49

Vidur should start a business process mapping of OFB and have a Kaizan to improve them.

jayasimha I think those are aspirational pdfs.
We have not seen any reports of the ammn pdf being completed development.

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 24 Jan 2018 09:53

aapko ba. ba. dhanyavaad....

lo ji .......ek or...

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/prodhy ... mar_18.pdf TBRL chandigarh envisage self-reliance in the development of technologies related to warheads and provide state-of-the-art diagnostics facilities for assessment of terminal effects of armaments stores.

Will post as and when I get.

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 24 Jan 2018 13:02

From Tarmak007's FB post:

#BreakingNews

#Saras PT1N maiden flight successful. The flight was piloted by ASTE Test Pilots Wg Cdr B Panicker and U P Singh (rank not known). Also on board was FTE Bhat (rank not known). It flew for 35 minutes. Details awaited.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 24 Jan 2018 22:54

Test Pilot is Deejay's batchmate

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 Jan 2018 23:28

putnanja wrote:From Tarmak007's FB post:

#BreakingNews

#Saras PT1N maiden flight successful. The flight was piloted by ASTE Test Pilots Wg Cdr B Panicker and U P Singh (rank not known). Also on board was FTE Bhat (rank not known). It flew for 35 minutes. Details awaited.

From the deccan herald

The aircraft was piloted by Wg Cdr U P Singh, Gp Capt R V Panicker and Gp Capt K P Bhat from the Indian Air Force's Aircraft and Systems Testing Establishment

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 25 Jan 2018 00:25

jaysimha wrote:aapko ba. ba. dhanyavaad....

lo ji .......ek or...

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/prodhy ... mar_18.pdf TBRL chandigarh envisage self-reliance in the development of technologies related to warheads and provide state-of-the-art diagnostics facilities for assessment of terminal effects of armaments stores.

Will post as and when I get.

can we have the English version too please?

Thanks, ramana

Katare · Post by **Katare** » 25 Jan 2018 02:57

shiv wrote:
dinesh_kimar wrote:^ From Jayasimha's post:
it's bleddy unbelievable. They want to indigenise BMP 30mm ammo , after building it from 1989.

Other items listed are "baseplate" and " springs". There's even a searchlight.

This isn't deep slumber, its coma.
I can't dispute this statement, but as always my mind searches for "explanations"

It appears that in the process of licence manufacture the OFB have behaved like a high-tech man servant at home - the guy who washes the cars, waters the garden, walks the dog, fetches the groceries etc. They do exactly what they are told. No more. They are told "you make X, and we import Y and Z and you then assemble X+Y+Z and say "Made by OFB"". No incentive to do anything more and a typical gormint job where people come, work for x years earn pension and retire. No innovation. No change. Just a routine steady (and probably pretty well paid) job - yes for gardener and driver also.

I am eternally reminded of a BSNL (land line) office from 1992 where lady at desk had to pass a file to lady in the desk adjacent to her. For that she had to call out "Seethamma!" - and Seethamma had to appear from somewhere after her tea break to pass the file 2.5 feet. This is what the government does.

Indian public defense industry works mostly on top down approach where we want to be the integrator and platform builder unlike Israel which appears to be building more components than platforms.

The items listed here can be all made in India but they would probably cost a lot more than imported ones. Building 2000 springs of military grade every other years is not a business that anyone's going to bend backward for. one way to ease this problem (economy of scale) is to get a few small Indian companies into global supply chain of large vendors through offset deals.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 25 Jan 2018 06:41

Katare wrote:Building 2000 springs of military grade every other years is not a business that anyone's going to bend backward for

Of course. But looked at in another way this is just another excuse for continuing to sleep on critical national security issues when I can, off the top of my head name two of possibly thousands of instances when component supply crunches have grounded entire IAF fleets.

If we must invest we must invest. We can't keep on with this excuse for another 7 decades

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 25 Jan 2018 16:41

ramana wrote:
can we have the English version too please?

Thanks, ramana

Surely sirji,,,

tab tak e samachar aapke liye

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/samach ... Jan-18.pdf

Zynda · Post by **Zynda** » 25 Jan 2018 16:57

^^Link still is pointing to a document in Hindi.

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 25 Jan 2018 17:02

No sirji ..........

english version of the newsletter already posted earlier in
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments by
Postby KBDagha » 28 Dec 2017 18:11.

prodhyogiki... i will post as and when it appears

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 25 Jan 2018 17:03

Here you go https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/newsletter/2018/jan_18.pdf

A Sharma had posted this earlier some pages back.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 25 Jan 2018 23:39

jaysimha and tsarkar thank but what I was really interested was in the Pratyogika Vishesh that was a special issue on TBRL accomplishments.

Once Marten (I don't know if he is still BRF member) had asked for the burst pattern of a 155mm shell. I had referred to a Canadian ammo handbook then.

Page 28 of this issue has a flash x-ray pictures of such a shell burst. I just wanted to point it out for him.

And lots of flash x-rays of explosions and products.

Its like reading a very modern explosives handbook.

I can still make do but its rusty.

Thakur_B · Post by **Thakur_B** » 26 Jan 2018 06:28

jaysimha wrote:aapko ba. ba. dhanyavaad....

lo ji .......ek or...

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/prodhy ... mar_18.pdf TBRL chandigarh envisage self-reliance in the development of technologies related to warheads and provide state-of-the-art diagnostics facilities for assessment of terminal effects of armaments stores.

Will post as and when I get.

That pulse detonation engine vehicle looks semi ready, with pop up wings and all. Under probable usage it's listed anti tank and cruise missile.

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 26 Jan 2018 10:03

सारा प्रौध्योगिकी विशेष हिंदि मे

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/prodhyogiki/pv2013.pdf

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 26 Jan 2018 10:04

prasannasimha · Post by **prasannasimha** » 26 Jan 2018 10:39

^ Do you have the English language links of the PDF's?

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 26 Jan 2018 11:12

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 17_WEB.pdf
https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/prodhy ... sep_17.pdf

got one.. will check for others..

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 26 Jan 2018 11:14

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 17_WEB.pdf
https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/prodhy ... dec_17.pdf

dont know if these are re-post

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 26 Jan 2018 15:46

ramana wrote: can we have the English version too please?

Thanks, ramana

Got it

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 17_WEB.pdf

Emerging Technologies And Advanced Testing & Diagnostic Facilities

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 26 Jan 2018 16:41

Compiled technology focus of DRDO from past 4 years only..

some of them are already posted by by KBDagha, JayS, A Sharma, arshyam

Happy republic day holidays..

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 14_WEB.pdf
NAVAL TEST FACILITIES

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 15_WEB.pdf
"Indigenous defence technologies for Chem-Bio Defence"

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 16_WEB.pdf
DESIDOC: In Support of DRDO's Academic Pursuit

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 17_WEB.pdf
Food Products and Technologies Developed by D

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 15_WEB.pdf
Fire safety technologies

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 14_WEB.pdf
Biomedical technologies

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... ue2016.pdf
2016 anniversary issue

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 16_WEB.pdf
Military Aviation Tyres and Tubes ( re-post)

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 15_WEB.pdf
Water Purification Systems

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 16_WEB.pdf
Battlefield Protection System

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 15_WEB.pdf
Microwave power modules and compact transmitters(Re-post)

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 17_WEB.pdf
Technologies for Underwater Surveillance Systems

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 17_WEB.pdf
Ammunition Systems and Warhead Technologies

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 15_WEB.pdf
Indigenous Technologies and Sub-systems for Armoured Fighting Vehicles

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 15_WEB.pdf
LASER TECHNOLOGIES - I

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 16_WEB.pdf
A summary of the past year, thanks and New Year’s greeting

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 17_WEB.pdf
Biomedical Technologies

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 17_WEB.pdf
Emerging Technologies And Advanced Testing & Diagnostic Facilities

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 15_WEB.pdf
Laser Technologies - I

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 16_WEB.pdf
Optics Technology

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 14_WEB.pdf
"PRODUCTS & TECHNOLOGIES UNDER MATERIAL CLUSTER"

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 16_WEB.pdf
Intelligent Mobile Robotics

https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfo ... 18_web.pdf
Aluminium Alloy technologies for advanced defence system

https://drdo.gov.in/drdo/pub/techfocus/ ... 17_WEB.pdf
Test Facilities for Armoured Fighting Vehicles

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 26 Jan 2018 22:19

jaysimha your join date shows 20 Dec 2017. And post count 110!!!

You have been most productive new member.
Thanks for your efforts in collating DRDO published info.

Keep up your enthusiasm and don't let it go down.

sudeepj · Post by **sudeepj** » 27 Jan 2018 00:27

The hindi document is a hoot! Even for a native Hindi speaker, it is extremely difficult to decipher the hindi.. Prime example of bureaucratic waste.. If the goal is to use a native language so its more accessible to a wider audience, that goal is just not met. I suspect the english document will be more accessible to a larger number of people than the hindi document.. Its just.. seriously 'klisht' hindi.

On a different note, TBRL PDE is shown to operate in two modes, an 8Hz mode and a 24Hz mode with three detonation tubes. I thought the PDE was supposed to operate at a much higher cycle time?

SriKumar · Post by **SriKumar** » 27 Jan 2018 06:25

sudeepj wrote:The hindi document is a hoot! Even for a native Hindi speaker, it is extremely difficult to decipher the hindi.. Prime example of bureaucratic waste.. If the goal is to use a native language so its more accessible to a wider audience, that goal is just not met. I suspect the english document will be more accessible to a larger number of people than the hindi document.. Its just.. seriously 'klisht' hindi.

Indeed...it was actually humorous to read technical information in such shudhdh Hindi .. (reminded me of the DD commentary of ISRO launches.... yaan abhi prajwalith hua hai ...antriskh ki ore badh raha hai) .The is second piece of pure comedy posted in this forum today....the honors go to 'Ballway Machine Pikate' paraded on the Rajpath for the Republic Day parade.

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 27 Jan 2018 11:01

I don't understand why you guys find it humorous!

sudeepj · Post by **sudeepj** » 27 Jan 2018 11:05

Indranil wrote:I don't understand why you guys find it humorous!

Most native speakers would find it beyond funny. And I am a guy who actually enjoys DD brand sanskritized hindi.. The document is in such klisht/high falutin hindi as to be nearly incomprehensible.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 27 Jan 2018 11:19

sudeepj wrote:
Indranil wrote:I don't understand why you guys find it humorous!
Most native speakers would find it beyond funny. And I am a guy who actually enjoys DD brand sanskritized hindi.. The document is in such klisht/high falutin hindi as to be nearly incomprehensible.

If we are not proud of our own languages and are quite content with Islamic and Christian languages, then what is the point of even developing cutting edge military technology?

Because we have already surrendered our civilizational soul to others. Why even defend the state now? Let us just become a larger version of Phillipines.

sudeepj · Post by **sudeepj** » 27 Jan 2018 11:59

this is going offtrack fast, but I am a pretty good native hindi speaker/reader.. the document is written in a style that will be **incomprehensible** to 99% of the people who are native hindi speakers. Being proud of hindi, and using hindi does not mean we revert to a style that blocks the message that is being conveyed. I would rather have the document written in a style and language that is accessible to the 9th-12th std student from small town India.. Right now, if that child is able to read that document, he is just as likely to burst out laughing as he is to completely lose interest in the subject.

Just my opinion and two cents etc.

aditp · Post by **aditp** » 27 Jan 2018 17:22

sudeepj wrote:this is going offtrack fast, but I am a pretty good native hindi speaker/reader.. the document is written in a style that will be **incomprehensible** to 99% of the people who are native hindi speakers. Being proud of hindi, and using hindi does not mean we revert to a style that blocks the message that is being conveyed. I would rather have the document written in a style and language that is accessible to the 9th-12th std student from small town India.. Right now, if that child is able to read that document, he is just as likely to burst out laughing as he is to completely lose interest in the subject.

Just my opinion and two cents etc.

Well I just took the opportunity to introduce quite a few new words to my 8 year old.

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 27 Jan 2018 17:36

lighter side of Defence Industry Development Meet on January 18-19, 2018, Chennai

guess what is close to the heart....check what
is in all the pockets of white shirts
....

all photos
https://www.drdo.gov.in/drdo/English/in ... ennai.jsp#