Operation Balakot: News & Discussion

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Mar 2019 00:19

Today’s WSJ has an article about Huawei. They’re putting in an underwater fiber optic trunk location point off coast of Gawadar or Karachi. That needs to be hit. Let Chini know about that.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 14 Mar 2019 00:24

https://twitter.com/NayanimaBasu/status ... 5300378626
>>India's statement after China's backing Paki Terror<<<
(I am fairly happy with India's statement.. specially the last para -- India will do it's thing with or without China)

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 14 Mar 2019 01:18

^^^As one of the comments stated. The GoI didn’t publicly call out China or Pak.

SidSoma · Post by **SidSoma** » 14 Mar 2019 01:20

Having a label as supporter of terror is not a nice thing in these days..and price China paying to please Pak will not be worth it. We will see.

What price is china paying. Really its nothing on the global scale. There is no major change in its markets and its munna is happy. There is really no way to hurt china other than a Govt sponsored, whatsapp driven boycott of China maal (not trade sanctions or trade war).

India often does not walk the talk. We have not even declared PAK as terrorist state !!?? Why ?? We have the might to take on the dragon (sub conventionally for now). Its time to walk the talk

Vivasvat · Post by **Vivasvat** » 14 Mar 2019 01:24

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 14 Mar 2019 01:27

All's well. India is COUNTING on China to veto. Imagine if they all voted yes, and Pak actually hands over that creep. What a disaster!!!!

sudeepj · Post by **sudeepj** » 14 Mar 2019 01:33

https://www.ccn.com/pakistan-nuclear-wa ... superpower

Pakistan Prime Minister Imran Khan has threatened to hit India with “aggressive” action, hinting at the full weight of its nuclear arsenal. Khan extended his threat to “any superpower” that provokes his country. Are his words pointed at Donald Trump, who has shown support for India over Pakistan in recent events? With 145 nuclear warheads in its bunkers, it’s time to take this conflict seriously. The danger of nuclear war is real and present, and the US, Russia, and China are all involved. In a speech in Chachro, close to the border with India, Khan said:

Strategic messaging, he chose chachro because 10 Para Commando raided this town and took the towns garrison as POW. The recent well publicized meetings between US Special Operations commander with Indian Chief has rattled them up.

https://www.deccanchronicle.com/nation/ ... enges.html

On his official visit to India, General Raymond Thomas, Commander, US Special Operations Command, US Army, on Thursday called on the Army chief General Bipin Rawat.

“Both the Generals deliberated on the developing regional security environment, the issue of global terrorism and Pakistan’s continued support to terrorism was also discussed,” said the statement.

https://www.news18.com/news/india/the-c ... 36153.html

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 14 Mar 2019 01:59

Chinis are going for bargain-basement goodwill from the Pakis IMO. Pakistan is almost totally isolated, with all other P4, plus the UNSC non-permanent members, plus many non-member states backing India's stand on MMA.

China, of course, wants to keep its leverage in Pakistan. In better times for the Terrorist State, this could get expensive... Beijing would have to give Pakis aid and loans that would never be returned, because they had to compete with the US, Saudis, etc. for leverage. Today it's as simple (and inexpensive) as blocking a motion in the UNSC and Pakis will be desperately grateful for the scrap.

In addition, Chinis are getting a ringside view of how things might have gone for them had they decided to up the ante in Doklam. Balakot and the days after that have rattled them nearly as much as the Doklam standoff itself. Also, the Balakot demonstration has not been lost on other countries in SE Asia, who may be rethinking their acceptance of a unitary Chinese hegemony in the neighbourhood now that a resurgent India is proving its military ability and political will.

So-- anything the Chinis can do to avoid strengthening India's hand when it comes to dealing out punishment to the Pakis, they will do. This includes derailing UNSC sanctions against a terrorist, which would provide diplomatic cover for any further actions by India.

Y I Patel · Post by **Y I Patel** » 14 Mar 2019 02:39

I would argue that they might have been a lot more credible in calling for restraint on India’s part had they voted with the rest of the international community. Now shackles are off for India

China has just been cornered into a no win situation for itself.

nam · Post by **nam** » 14 Mar 2019 02:51

I am now wondering about the sun tse or whatever stuff we associate the chini to be..

Why is this joker so useful? Pak can produce 100s like him.. The sanctions will make no difference...

The only thing i can think of is this was not about masood azhar or Pak.

It was about India getting support of 4 members of the SC behind the vote, specially 3 western countries. Chinis clearly rattled by India's ability to corner majority in SC...

khan · Post by **khan** » 14 Mar 2019 03:04

This China thing is great for Jingos IMO.

If the UNSC wont act, India has gone the Diplomatic route, the only thing left is military. It has opened the door for more attacks against terror.

Added Later: This is a golden opportunity to cut Pakistan down to size. Destroy their air force, navy and cut their Army to size. Then move the troops to then Chinese border and aggressively patrol Akashi Chin.

Raveen · Post by **Raveen** » 14 Mar 2019 03:16

khan wrote:This China thing is great for Jingos IMO.

If the UNSC wont act, India has gone the Diplomatic route, the only thing left is military. It has opened the door for more attacks against terror.

That door was decidedly open based on the GOI statements and 3 service chief's statements

khan · Post by **khan** » 14 Mar 2019 03:18

Raveen wrote:
khan wrote:This China thing is great for Jingos IMO.

If the UNSC wont act, India has gone the Diplomatic route, the only thing left is military. It has opened the door for more attacks against terror.
That door was decidedly open based on the GOI statements and 3 service chief's statements

Yes, but India had to give the Diplomats an opportunity to do their thing or these same Diplomats could have done India Pakistan equal equal and sanctioned India. Now that threat is much reduced if not gone.

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 14 Mar 2019 03:21

Agreed YIP. Had the Chinis gone along with nautanki of "Pakistan govt promises to undertake strong action against proscribed terrorist", and allowed MMA to undergo 6 months' house arrest with biryani and dialysis, they would have shown themselves a "responsible leader of the international community" (along with other P4) and maintained the gloss of existing on a higher plane of superpowerdom than India-Pakistan. Being in on the consensus would have enabled them to plead Pakistan's case with more credibility the next time we decide to do a Balakot.

In fact this is exactly what the PRC of Deng or Jiang Zemin or Hu Jintao would have done. Ingratiate itself with the P5, seem to "go along with the programme", and sabotage later from the exalted P5 backrooms. Xi is a different beast. I think he has absorbed too much Pakistaniyat up the CPEC enema-bag.

Nam I think you're right, it's an H&D thing for Xi Jinping. It was a different matter to pretend to go along with the other P5 members when India was in general viewed as a regional power (i.e. as no potential threat to China). After Doklam that has changed. Chinis are rattled and will openly use every advantage they have, including UNSC veto, to confront India from now on.

saip · Post by **saip** » 14 Mar 2019 03:48

How come all these pigs need dialysis? This suar, then that one eyed guy Omar and even Osama. What crap they eat? I know they say they do not eat pork but then again may be they should (it is healthier).

Ardeshir · Post by **Ardeshir** » 14 Mar 2019 03:50

Next step would be to let these Chini scum know that economic assets of terror supporters are fair game.

Guddu · Post by **Guddu** » 14 Mar 2019 04:18

Ankit Desai wrote:
Ankit Desai wrote:I asked it earlier. Let me try again

Any news about other two targets ?

Total 12 Mirages took off to drop payloads with Su30 & MIGs for air support.

Each Mirage was carrying 1000kg bomb to be dropped. There is no news saying Balakot was hit by 12 bombs. Each news was saying 4-5 bombs were dropped.

So other Mirages dropped their payload some where else. On the day of Balakot, news channels were talking about 3-4 targets so what did happen to at least other two targets ?

-Ankit
Answering my own question. Please start watching from 53:47 Nirmala Sitharaman's interview on AAJ TAK and many more answers.

-Ankit

What a fantastic interview, very rare to see a politician speak truthfully with no spin.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 14 Mar 2019 04:30

Regarding UNSC veto ....

Pakis have 3.5 fathers (who have for 60+ years, paal poske bada kiya tha paki baccha ko - by sharing their burdens together, youngest father being China).

All 3 fathers are in UNSC
All 3 fathers need not veto together - just one father vetoing is enough to defeat the motion

So leaving out Russia & France, the 3 Paki fathers could have decided that only one father revealing their hand as "bad parent" is sufficient and that father is the same father who revealed the hand in the previous Masood Azhar vote.

So by all means Chini pork bun needs to be cooked but lets also keep some in the oven for Massa and Briturds who do the good parent bad parent thing for the sake of their paki baccha getting off the hook.

banrjeer · Post by **banrjeer** » 14 Mar 2019 05:14

CPEC seems cash strapped and delayed.

it maybe ok for china to proceed with CPEC smoothly for now. A tantrum needs to be timed well closer to completion before its fully operational.

As for porkies crying wolf about Indian subs , it will backfire since the Chinese may raise interest rates or delay the project.

Nikhil T · Post by **Nikhil T** » 14 Mar 2019 05:48

Amber G. wrote:https://twitter.com/NayanimaBasu/status ... 5300378626
>>India's statement after China's backing Paki Terror<<<
(I am fairly happy with India's statement.. specially the last para -- India will do it's thing with or without China)

Disagree. This statement was very weak.

"on account of a member placing the proposal on hold"
-> Why not name China? I mean, is there a MORE core national interest for us than Kashmir and a more heinous attack than Pulwama, that we are willing to give a figleaf of anonymity to China?

"we will continue to pursue all available avenues to ensure that terrorist leaders who are involved in heinous attacks on our citizens are brought to justice"
-> If China had relented and UNSC proscribed this suar, we would have not pursued any other option? We know squat nothing has happened to the other suar (Hafiz Saeed) who was banned ages ago. There's no need to link this proposal to OUR actions.

More broadly, I don't know why we've made such a hue and cry about UNSC banning OUR enemies. On one hand, we consider UNSC P5 to be self-appointed, arbitrary, discriminatory and ineffective. On the other hand, we give it so much importance that we're willing to forego picking up arms because of a statement that was signed by all of them unanimously.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 14 Mar 2019 06:22

saip wrote:How come all these pigs need dialysis? This suar, then that one eyed guy Omar and even Osama. What crap they eat? I know they say they do not eat pork but then again may be they should (it is healthier).

That would be cannibalism, hain?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 14 Mar 2019 07:53

Nephotic syndrome.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 14 Mar 2019 08:18

perhaps lack of exercise, drinking sugary tea all day in strategic meetings with cadres and a diet high in carbs, processed sugars and meat.

DrRatnadip · Post by **DrRatnadip** » 14 Mar 2019 08:21

saip wrote:How come all these pigs need dialysis? This suar, then that one eyed guy Omar and even Osama. What crap they eat? I know they say they do not eat pork but then again may be they should (it is healthier).

I think high animal fat in diet is cause for this.. This leads to diabetes and high blood pressure which are two leading causes of nephropathy.. also high protein diet can lead to elevated uric acid levels which is known to rapidly damage kidneys..

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 14 Mar 2019 08:54

any form of street food video in pakistan on youtube shows there is hardly any preference for veg in the diet.
its always some form of meat + naan.
perhaps meat is cheaper than tomatoes there

all that burned meat done on open flame coal sigri cannot be too good long term. volatile organic compounds will come out of the coal and attach themselves on the meat.

a more active horse borne lifestyle of old in the steppe , could perhaps sustain such a diet. not the indolent life of a jihadi leader roaming in toyota fortuner.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 14 Mar 2019 08:58

Singha wrote:perhaps lack of exercise, drinking sugary tea all day in strategic meetings with cadres and a diet high in carbs, processed sugars and meat.

Lol

habal · Post by **habal** » 14 Mar 2019 09:19

Singha wrote:any form of street food video in pakistan on youtube shows there is hardly any preference for veg in the diet.
its always some form of meat + naan.
perhaps meat is cheaper than tomatoes there
all that burned meat done on open flame coal sigri cannot be too good long term. volatile organic compounds will come out of the coal and attach themselves on the meat.

a more active horse borne lifestyle of old in the steppe , could perhaps sustain such a diet. not the indolent life of a jihadi leader roaming in toyota fortuner.

and the afghans accuse pakistanis of being 'dal eaters'.
Me thinks only pakistani street food is majorly non-veg so as to attract customers.
food cooked at home is more in Indian style of saag, daal, choley, haleem, katlama, nihari, paya, biryani etc.

If one eat meat in all meals, kidney and/liver will give up one after the other.
this is also reason why in most hospital wards treating liver and urology sections, the patients admitted are disproportionately from one community.

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 14 Mar 2019 10:40

a friend of mine who was in paki land said even the dal and gajar ka halwa had meat !!

Kritavarman · Post by **Kritavarman** » 14 Mar 2019 11:08

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NESCOM_Burraq

UCAV equipped with imagery and motion sensors flying towards Talagang, a recce flight? to find out whats visible to outer world?

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 14 Mar 2019 11:17

Nikhil T wrote:
Amber G. wrote:https://twitter.com/NayanimaBasu/status ... 5300378626
>>India's statement after China's backing Paki Terror<<<
(I am fairly happy with India's statement.. specially the last para -- India will do it's thing with or without China)
Disagree. This statement was very weak.

"on account of a member placing the proposal on hold"
-> Why not name China? I mean, is there a MORE core national interest for us than Kashmir and a more heinous attack than Pulwama, that we are willing to give a figleaf of anonymity to China?

"we will continue to pursue all available avenues to ensure that terrorist leaders who are involved in heinous attacks on our citizens are brought to justice"
-> If China had relented and UNSC proscribed this suar, we would have not pursued any other option? We know squat nothing has happened to the other suar (Hafiz Saeed) who was banned ages ago. There's no need to link this proposal to OUR actions.

More broadly, I don't know why we've made such a hue and cry about UNSC banning OUR enemies. On one hand, we consider UNSC P5 to be self-appointed, arbitrary, discriminatory and ineffective. On the other hand, we give it so much importance that we're willing to forego picking up arms because of a statement that was signed by all of them unanimously.

Agree. A lot of bureaucratese. Should have forthrightly mentioned PRC.

ranneel · Post by **ranneel** » 14 Mar 2019 11:28

[quote="Kritavarman"]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NESCOM_Burraq

UCAV equipped with imagery and motion sensors flying towards Talagang, a recce flight? to find out whats visible to outer world?

/quote]
They did a similar thing before opening the NE-SW flight corridor from Islamabad to Karachi before opening to regular flights.

vimal · Post by **vimal** » 14 Mar 2019 11:39

Isn't Pak just the best enemy. We keep kicking them and they don't make any noise. All we need is some stealth drones with spiced up payload.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 14 Mar 2019 12:55

There’s been a lot of noise about what happened in Balakot on 26th Feb 2019 and on LoC on 27th Feb. There were lots of claims from both sides but nothing definite. Indian officials were tight lipped and issued only terse statements , while Pakistanis released one statement after another.

Media reports from both sides were as usual quite trashy and more noise than substance. In all this noise, there were some recordings, witness statements and less publicised events which provide some hints about what actually happened. There is some new information coming out almost every day and it’s a difficult task to do detailed fact checks and connect all the dots. Following is an attempt to find some answers based upon some of the facts which are seemingly true.

6th Feb. 2:55 am : A Indian Air Force strike team consisting solely of Mirage 2000 fighter jets attacked a JeM terrorist training camp in Balakot in Khyber Phaktunwa province across international border. There were reports of 2 other targets, Chakoti and Muzaffarabad in Pakistan being hit, but no confirmations from either side. But both sides are in agreement that Balakot was bombed.
India announced the attacks later in the day via an official statement made by Vijay Gokhale, Secretary, Ministry of External Affairs
https://youtu.be/DTA3jlTWSWQ

Pakistani Claims:
Pakistanis on the other hand made a number of mutually contradictory claims.

1. “Pakistani National Security Committee strongly rejected Indian claim of targeting an alleged terrorist camp near Balakot and the claim of heavy casualties. Once again Indian government has resorted to a self-serving, reckless and fictitious claim,” 1* 2*

2. Pakistan foreign minister Qureshi said “multi-dimensional intrusion” had been attempted by the Indian fighter jets early on Tuesday. “But the intervention by Pakistani jets forced them to return back within minutes,” he said. The minister dismissed the notion that Pakistan Air Force jets were late in responding to the Indian attack, saying the planes were “ready” and “air-borne”. 2*

3. Director-general of Pakistan’s Inter Services Public Relations, Maj. Gen. Asif Ghafoor, said India had “attempted” to send its combat air patrols (CAPs) “first from the Lahore-Sialkot sector” and they were “challenged” by Pakistani CAP. “They tried to enter from Bahawalpur-Okara and were forced to go back,” he said. According to Ghafoor, “the third (Indian) CAP which was bigger in number made it from Muzaffarabad and they were challenged and were forced to return”. 2*
Maj Gen Asif Ghafoor
@OfficialDGISPR
Payload of hastily escaping Indian aircrafts fell in open.

4. Pakistani Army confirmed attack on Twitter with pictures of craters outside the terrorist training facility. They claimed that bombs missed target and damaged only one civilian who suffered a gash on his forehead and a few trees. “Payload of hastily escaping Indian aircrafts fell in open. pic.twitter.com/8drYtNGMsm”

5. This video shows house of a local “civilian” close to the terrorist camp. It is a bit odd as it shows a small crater about 25-30 meters downhill and narrator claims that the whole house has been severely damaged.
https://youtu.be/qVC6VxQepzU

Actual Proofs:
Following are some videos and pictures which tell a different story.

This video was uploaded on 8th March by a Pakistani media outlet. It shows a senior Pakistani army officer in a village meeting consoling family members of some (200) dead people. Some roughly translated lines below:
https://youtu.be/0WJG5990ds0

Whoever fights alongside rulers of land in name of jihad is fighting for jihad.

Yesterday 200 people died. It was written in their fate, not ours.

Your father is not dead, he is alive. We don’t call him dead,

So this Pakistani army man is definitely admitting that 200 or more “good jihadis” got killed in one go.

2. Indian government and armed forces have release very little information till now. Maybe it’ll change later as it did with Uri strikes. But as of now, one major statement made is that Indian intelligence had detected around 300 mobile phone signals in the terrorist camp. 4*

3. Following interview with some locals deflate official Pakistani claims

a. Access to whole area has been completely blocked off for outsiders as well as locals.
b. Pakistani authorities are prohibiting any information leaks. For this, they’ve blocked internet, enforced no go zones and are actively warning people against talking to anyone.

https://youtu.be/3xtXnS9Fw6g

https://youtu.be/jAIWbb0XjjU

What Happened :

Following are my guesses based upon available information:

1. IAF Mirage 2000s did attack atleast one target at Balakot. Other two possible targets were Chakoti and Muzaffarabad. Both are near to LoC in J&K

2. Earlier reports said that terrorist camp was hit using “1000 kg bombs”. Later it was revealed to be Spice, which is actually a guidance kit for 2000, 1000 and 500 pound bombs in Indian inventory. I believe that it was Spice 1000 used for 1000 lbs (450 kg) bombs which can have 200 kgs of high explosives. A single 1000 kg bomb will have around 450 kgs of explosives which will blow off most of hill top. Considering that avoiding collateral damage was one major mission objective, it’s unlikely that 1000 kg bombs were used.

3. According to local witness accounts, 4-5 bombs were dropped. It should be pretty obvious that these smart bombs usually don’t miss. Even if we believe story of that single injured civilian whose house was damaged, there are still 3-4 other bombs which found their mark. Their impact points have not been made public by Pakistan and access blocked off.

4. There have been atleast 200 causalities including some terrorists, their trainers as well as regular Pakistani army. Pakistan is doing everything in it’s power to hide it. We’ll have to wait for more information to be released by Indian government to have a reasonably accurate number and actual impact.

References:
1. https://www.news18.com/news/world/pakis ... 49355.html
2. https://www.telegraphindia.com/india/da ... id/1685821
3. https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/j ... 2019-03-08
4. http://www.newindianexpress.com/nation/ ... 46650.html

Am I missing anything ?

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 14 Mar 2019 13:00

This rubble from crashed paki drone near Rajsthan border looks a lot like the seeker housing section of Denel drone used with paki Mirages. Rubble of this drone was also found near Nowshera

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 14 Mar 2019 13:12

All we have to do is make another Balakot strike soon after China's stand on Masoor Dhal.
And offer an exclusive chai-biskoot session with Chinese diplomats soon after the strike.

And go back to the UN with a message of peace of stability.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 14 Mar 2019 13:20

TSP knows this. That is why the shalwar browning and sudden retreat creating sonic booms etc.

V_Raman · Post by **V_Raman** » 14 Mar 2019 13:27

TSP might say that China is a non-state actor and we dont have control them on how they vote on masood azhar unsc resolutions!

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 14 Mar 2019 14:10

India should also declare a couple of Brhamos as non-state actors. Babus can later say something like "Saar it suddenly launched by itself and hit random targets in Pindi onlee. SDRE jugaad technology, what to do".

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 14 Mar 2019 14:12

rogue brahmos elements not reporting to head quarters

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 14 Mar 2019 14:26

Singha wrote:perhaps lack of exercise, drinking sugary tea all day in strategic meetings with cadres and a diet high in carbs, processed sugars and meat.

Also inbreeding, many rare type diabetes in porkis due to that