J&K Union Territory-2019

[CRamS]

Despite the many defence, and govt to govt collaboration between Israel and India there is very little people to people exchange or interaction between Israeli civil society and India's. I hope NaMo sarkar works to change that.

Boss, this has it own diminishing returns. I have many, many Jewish friends. Some from Israel. While there is some diffuse camaraderie, remember, at the end of the day, they are Europeans, and many of the fault lines between TFTA Europeans and us SDREs kick in. So no harm in persisting with that, but we must be aware of the limitations.

Also, note the wold card: TSP RAPE are such evil b@satrads when it comes to us Hindus, they truly believe that they are destined rulers of the subcontinent, that they will eat the the humbles of humblest pie to perpetuate their war with us. What this means is that at some point, I see TSP making overtures to Israel. When that happens, Israel will also become like TSP's current 3.5, doing profuse equal equal.

The current sorry state is open invitation for pathological liars like IK Niazi to paint a false picture of RSS being a neo Nazis organization. Nobody is correcting that perspective in Western media.

I respectfully disagree. No need to suck up to westerners. They will never understand RSS. RSS IMO should continue to do what it does best: grassroots Hinduthva cultural inculcation. Need to bring as many Dalits and OBCs into the Hindu fold as possible. That will undercut all this RSS demonization.

[Suraj]

Besides there are plenty of people outside China writing and speaking against them including academics I'm sure, but no one inside China will ever hear them or see what they write.

In general, this concept has repeatedly proven itself to be wrong. It's not that the Chinese don't know what's happening. Many of them have access to ways around the gleat filewall of cheen. It's that they don't care, and that the government has been very good about describing the issue as one of Chinese honor, and been very consistent about applying it.

India can and should deny access to visas for such types, and at least temporarily - after communication with the school and potentially affected students, subject all applicants who accept to go to that school an ECNR denial on their passport, such that they cannot depart. 'Pick another school' for a semester or two. ~15% of their student body is international. Maybe 30% of that body Indian ?

[UlanBatori]

Something like that will be needed to shake up the admins (I mean of the offending schools).

[MurthyB]

But it would be a shame if something adversely, permanently impacted your ability to visit, research, and gain access to primary sources of information about your chosen field of study... no? Especially in this competitive environment where many others would like that chance at achieving tenure.

This is the one weapon we have. GOI needs to be firmly on board, of course. But if GOI effectively bans her from entering the geographical space which she claims is her "area of expertise", while at the same time we (on the ground) continue to expose her as an intellectually dishonest broker who dispenses Islamist and Hinduphobic propaganda at Pakistan's behest... goodbye tenure. At Rutgers or anywhere else.

That's the thing; she is such a complete fraud that it's highly doubtful she does anything off primary sources. Her entire thesis doesn't have a single akshara of Samskrita in Devanagari font; so much for being able to "understand" Samskrita. And AFAIK, the only thing she's published is that Aurangzeb pamphlet, based off her thesis work. That's already 7 years old. Haven't seen anything else of substance or note.

Even everything in her thesis work is based off translations done by others, sometimes even fellow graduate students.

On the Indology mailing list, the only "contribution" she and the others of her ilk, like that execrable ananya vajpei, make is some shrill hysterics about hindutva and some latest outlook blather they have published. Neither of them has the competence to construct even one word in Samskrita and have any technical discussions on the subject matter.

She also left that list in a huff after b***ing about sexism because the mailing list has 4 male admins and only 2 female admins.

In the current climate, it's likely that even if this witch is denied tenure, she will make a big stink about sexism and will probably prevail. The standards in these fields are pretty much gone.

[chetak]

Despite the many defence, and govt to govt collaboration between Israel and India there is very little people to people exchange or interaction between Israeli civil society and India's. I hope NaMo sarkar works to change that.

Boss, this has it own diminishing returns. I have many, many Jewish friends. Some from Israel. While there is some diffuse camaraderie, remember, at the end of the day, they are Europeans, and many of the fault lines between TFTA Europeans and us SDREs kick in. So no harm in persisting with that, but we must be aware of the limitations.

Also, note the wold card: TSP RAPE are such evil b@satrads when it comes to us Hindus, they truly believe that they are destined rulers of the subcontinent, that they will eat the the humbles of humblest pie to perpetuate their war with us. What this means is that at some point, I see TSP making overtures to Israel. When that happens, Israel will also become like TSP's current 3.5, doing profuse equal equal.

The current sorry state is open invitation for pathological liars like IK Niazi to paint a false picture of RSS being a neo Nazis organization. Nobody is correcting that perspective in Western media.

I respectfully disagree. No need to suck up to westerners. They will never understand RSS. RSS IMO should continue to do what it does best: grassroots Hinduthva cultural inculcation. Need to bring as many Dalits and OBCs into the Hindu fold as possible. That will undercut all this RSS demonization.

We need to understand that the RSS is an organisation that the west fears and needs to denigrate so as to render it ineffective. This is also the congi/commie/naxal game plan.

The BIF have been building up to it for the longest time to declare the RSS as a terrorist organisation and ban it, most likely after trying to get the UN to declare it as a global terrorist organisation. The others, like the majority of the big five, will just keep quiet, with maybe Russia in our corner as usual.

Once the RSS has been tarred like this the Hindus and the Modi image will take a massive hit on the world stage.

while we argue semantics, we, as usual, miss the big picture.

without the RSS, the adharmic conversion mafia will run riot and the congis will think that they have a chance again.

The entire commie, naxal, and BIF lot will breathe easier.

Without the RSS, it will be impossible to bring the Dalits and OBCs into the Hindu fold and the conversion vultures are eagerly waiting in the wings. The RSS has already been banned once before and the BIF will spin that to their advantage.

Do not underestimate the vital importance of and the crucial role that was played by the RSS in Modi's rise and the BJP's win.

The BIF already know very well what the RSS is and what it can do just like every abrahamic NGO in India does and so the question of never understanding the RSS simply does not arise.

It is the grassroots Hinduthva cultural inculcation that the RSS does so well that actually scares the piss out of these guys and they just cannot counter it.

[chetak]

CRamS wrote:

Boss, this has it own diminishing returns. I have many, many Jewish friends. Some from Israel. While there is some diffuse camaraderie, remember, at the end of the day, they are Europeans, and many of the fault lines between TFTA Europeans and us SDREs kick in. So no harm in persisting with that, but we must be aware of the limitations.

I have many jewish friends too and they are all israeli.

what CRamS ji says is a hundred percent correct assessment.

the jewish society in israel is riven by sharp differences brought about by european, non european, asian, arab and african considerations.

the white skinned europeans are the cream of the society there and they have the highest status. It's like the caste system all over again. What interests them is Indian money and not the Indians. There will be no usual people to people contacts with these guys.

They just don't like us enough to mix easily and joyfully.

If they see your money, they will smile and come to you and at the same time, if they don't see your money, they will still smile but from a distance and will just not come to you.

[Suraj]

In the current climate, it's likely that even if this witch is denied tenure, she will make a big stink about sexism and will probably prevail. The standards in these fields are pretty much gone.

"It will not change her" is a standard boilerplate that discourages motive to act. Further, it constructs the argument around a positive effort to rehabilitate her. That's not the goal here.

The goal must be punitive. There will be a financial and opportunity cost to this action, to the person and the institution she works at. It does not matter if she ultimately finds harbor with some entity who will pay her to spout her bile. That can be assumed to be always true.

What is required is a structure by which the Indian state can financially punish such entities on their own lands itself. Repeatedly. Humans are creatures who are easily taught to behave certain ways when repeatedly punished for acting against something.

Universities considering giving positions have to become used to the reactive thought process 'uh oh, this person has a history of getting her institution in trouble with the Indian government. I'll pass - I need those Indian students to attend in fall so we can build that shiny student center'. It's taken for granted that any act of this kind against Chinese interests will cost the person and the institution $$$, regardless of how much they spin it as 'freedom of speech'. Same for anyone going on a tirade against Jewish interests.

There has to be a reactive understanding that these actions will have costs. The ability to impose such costs, is a measure of potency and power.

[A_Gupta]

Influential writers on India who have never stepped on Indian soil:

1. Max Müller - needs no introduction
2. James Mill - author of The History of British India. Per Wiki - "The work itself, and the author's official connection {East India Company} with India for the last seventeen years of his life, effected a complete change in the whole system of governance in the country". But Mill never set foot in India.
3. Perhaps all of the German school of Indology of the 19th century.

No need to add to this list, though I'm sure people here can. India needs to be the leader on itself, that is, to have any influence about matters Indian, you have to have studied in India, or else people consider you second rate.

-----

Reflecting on the NY Times which does do some excellent investigative reporting, I think I see an outline of their strategy -- they build their credibility with some good work; and then they use their credibility to push their specific agenda and worldview. This is the game played by western academia as well.

[MurthyB]

In the current climate, it's likely that even if this witch is denied tenure, she will make a big stink about sexism and will probably prevail. The standards in these fields are pretty much gone.

"It will not change her" is a standard boilerplate that discourages motive to act. Further, it constructs the argument around a positive effort to rehabilitate her. That's not the goal here.

I am not saying we shouldn't act. I am saying that she isn't going to change probably. She is not motivated by research or access to sources it looks like.

Of-course, if we find a way to punish the institution, withdraw sources of funding, convince others to withdraw support etc, it will motivate others in that place to take a hard look at having vermin like her around. In these situations, I often imagine someone of wealth pretending to be about to make a large donation to their endowment and then publicly withdrawing based on events like these...

There should also be a website that ranks and grades various universities by a "hinduphobia" and "marxist-o-meter" type of metric---look at all the departments, consider their professors publishing and "activism" record etc and derive a metric. Indian students could get a good idea of the kind of place they are going to. Good project for machine-learned type of inference from scrapping information, or manual curation if the former is too difficult...

[Suraj]

"It will not change her" is a standard boilerplate that discourages motive to act. Further, it constructs the argument around a positive effort to rehabilitate her. That's not the goal here.

I am not saying we shouldn't act. I am saying that she isn't going to change probably. She is not motivated by research or access to sources it looks like.

We're talking past each other. I stated that the purpose of the actions is to impose costs on people and institutions, regardless of whether they change. For example, antisemitism hasn't disappeared despite the best efforts of AJC etc. You respond by stating she won't change.

The ability to cultivate and punish interests useful and inimical to us, is part of the process of developing great power. It's a far bigger goal than one loudmouth evanjehadi lady masquerading as a professor.

[Vayutuvan]

If they see your money, they will smile and come to you and at the same time, if they don't see your money, they will still smile but from a distance and will just not come to you.

That most assuredly is not my experience in my 34+ years in the US. I have a lot of close Jewish friends from my grad years. They are no different from Chinese, PIO, or European ones. But then that was in an academic environment. I have no idea how it works in big corporations, academia, and research labs, etc., all of which are riven by politics and crab-pit environment.

[Vayutuvan]

RSS IMO should continue to do what it does best: grassroots Hinduthva cultural inculcation.

Their main objective is to do service, not Hindutva cultural inculcation. By doing this service, they are actually practicing the central dictum of snaatana dharma which is attaining mOksha through dharma - selfless service to the society. They are practicing sanaatna dharmees, not trying to inculcate this or that.

Abrahamic NGOs fear RSS because they see RSS as their competitor in "the service and charity" space which they dominate world over through firstly through Red Cross and now Red Crescent. ICRC has put lot of obstacles and not recognized "The Red Star of David (Magen David Adom)".

[UlanBatori]

From all this I conclude that Audreyji is a RAA Agint.

[KLNMurthy]

Influential writers on India who have never stepped on Indian soil:

1. Max Müller - needs no introduction
2. James Mill - author of The History of British India. Per Wiki - "The work itself, and the author's official connection {East India Company} with India for the last seventeen years of his life, effected a complete change in the whole system of governance in the country". But Mill never set foot in India.
3. Perhaps all of the German school of Indology of the 19th century.

No need to add to this list, though I'm sure people here can. India needs to be the leader on itself, that is, to have any influence about matters Indian, you have to have studied in India, or else people consider you second rate.

-----

Reflecting on the NY Times which does do some excellent investigative reporting, I think I see an outline of their strategy -- they build their credibility with some good work; and then they use their credibility to push their specific agenda and worldview. This is the game played by western academia as well.

Add Karl "Kanuman the Monkey and Sabbala the Cow" Marx to the list.

[KLNMurthy]

In the current climate, it's likely that even if this witch is denied tenure, she will make a big stink about sexism and will probably prevail. The standards in these fields are pretty much gone.

"It will not change her" is a standard boilerplate that discourages motive to act. Further, it constructs the argument around a positive effort to rehabilitate her. That's not the goal here.

The goal must be punitive. There will be a financial and opportunity cost to this action, to the person and the institution she works at. It does not matter if she ultimately finds harbor with some entity who will pay her to spout her bile. That can be assumed to be always true.

What is required is a structure by which the Indian state can financially punish such entities on their own lands itself. Repeatedly. Humans are creatures who are easily taught to behave certain ways when repeatedly punished for acting against something.

Universities considering giving positions have to become used to the reactive thought process 'uh oh, this person has a history of getting her institution in trouble with the Indian government. I'll pass - I need those Indian students to attend in fall so we can build that shiny student center'. It's taken for granted that any act of this kind against Chinese interests will cost the person and the institution $$$, regardless of how much they spin it as 'freedom of speech'. Same for anyone going on a tirade against Jewish interests.

There has to be a reactive understanding that these actions will have costs. The ability to impose such costs, is a measure of potency and power.

+108

India needs to get into the mindset of punishing her enemies and making them pay a price. Morality and spiritual growth are private matters within the Indian family. "vinaashaaya cha dushkRitaam" onlee.

[NRao]

Petiton BBC to stop addressing J&K as India Occupied

[Vayutuvan]

^NRao ji, 0 people signed.

what gives?

[vimal]

I signed just now. It's close to 100,000 now.

[chetak]

If they see your money, they will smile and come to you and at the same time, if they don't see your money, they will still smile but from a distance and will just not come to you.

That most assuredly is not my experience in my 29+ years in the US. I have lot of close Jewish friends from my grad years. They are no different from Chinese, PIO, or European ones. But then that was in an academic environment. I have no idea how it works in big corporations, academia, and research labs etc., all of which are riven by politics and crab-pit environment.

we are talking about israelis and India, people to people contacts and racism in the israeli society. I suggest that you find and talk to some brown and black israelis and talk to them privately. It will be quite illuminating for you.

nothing academic about it.

Racism in an academic setting often has unpleasant consequences.

I personally like the israelis but a lot of them do think that they are god's own schitt.

The jewish europeans and non europeans squabble endlessly on every petty matter and are often at loggerheads. They always get the job done though.

[chetak]

i k niazi,

is this true.

TAG TV @TAGTVCANADA

BREAKING: Resources reveal that Saudis were very upset with @ImranKhanPTI over his reckless speeches and statements on Nuclear attacks,Iran Mediation and portraying Kashmir as Islamic Issue.Saudis ordered their pilots to return New York and ask IK to take commercial flight

11:40 AM - 1 Oct 2019

[chetak]

twitter

Replying to @TAGTVCANADA @ImranKhanPTI
Accurate news, as Saudis invited India's NSA Ajit Doval immediately after UNGA speech by Imran.
Imran and party took commercial flight back to Jeddah to mollify Saudis but MBS did not meet Imran and he was asked to proceed directly to Pakistan by a chartered plane from Jeddah

4:57 AM - 2 Oct 2019

[schinnas]

I personally like the israelis but a lot of them do think that they are god's own schitt.

The jewish europeans and non europeans squabble endlessly on every petty matter and are often at loggerheads. They always get the job done though.

All Jewish think they are God's chosen people. So they do have a sense of superiority inbuilt. Also they think Israel is God's chosen land. So Israeli Jews feel doubly special.

But that has nothing to do with us not cultivating influence over there. Even Pakis are doing it.

[Yagnasri]

Is there any news on the delimitation of the UT? I read nothing in the press even though it was suppose to start in August itself.

[chetak]

I personally like the israelis but a lot of them do think that they are god's own schitt.

The jewish europeans and non europeans squabble endlessly on every petty matter and are often at loggerheads. They always get the job done though.

All Jewish think they are God's chosen people. So they do have a sense of superiority inbuilt. Also they think Israel is God's chosen land. So Israeli Jews feel doubly special.

But that has nothing to do with us not cultivating influence over there. Even Pakis are doing it.

as usual, you missed the point.

one doesn't really give a rat's if god herself came down from on high and chose each one of them personally and then serially numbered them and declared them as kosher. Racism is very different and it is inherent in their society.

we have influence aplenty there but that's only on a govt to govt level and not so much on a people to people level.

as long as you show them the money, they are willing to be "cultivated". It's purely transactional and their costing is consistently high.

and that works for now.

BTW, they really do not trust us because we consistently vote against them in many crucial UN forums. Though we may keep quiet or have some glib explanation, after the fact, the people there keep asking why India does this.

[schinnas]

Wow...so you repeat words from my earlier post on not having enough people to people contact and accuse me of missing the point. Just wow..

Irony died a thousand deaths right here.

[chetak]

Wow...so you repeat words from my earlier post on not having enough people to people contact and accuse me of missing the point. Just wow..

Irony died a thousand deaths right here.

not enough people to people contacts because of their ingrained racism.

we are brown, remember.

[Yagnasri]

Let us shiver in our Dhothis now.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-ne ... z47cJ.html

https://www.news18.com/news/india/over- ... 31487.html

Surprisingly no one speaks about such things when west threaten Russia or even North Korea day after day with war and whatnot.

[Primus]

If they see your money, they will smile and come to you and at the same time, if they don't see your money, they will still smile but from a distance and will just not come to you.

That most assuredly is not my experience in my 29+ years in the US. I have lot of close Jewish friends from my grad years. They are no different from Chinese, PIO, or European ones. But then that was in an academic environment. I have no idea how it works in big corporations, academia, and research labs etc., all of which are riven by politics and crab-pit environment.

Definitely OT for this thread.

Jews will always think of themselves first, this is a given. Yet, they actually find resonance with our way of thinking. My business partner is an Orthodox Jew and more than half of my other partners in my other business are also Jewish. Same for SHQ. Same for my daughter, almost all her closest friends are Jewish. I have a few friends whose sons have married Jewish girls. With some of these families we have a very close relationship.

In the end, they do not want to hurt you just because you are different from them, that is the key difference between what we face with Pakis. If at a societal level Hindus and Jews can get along so well, why not as nations?

[chetak]

That most assuredly is not my experience in my 29+ years in the US. I have lot of close Jewish friends from my grad years. They are no different from Chinese, PIO, or European ones. But then that was in an academic environment. I have no idea how it works in big corporations, academia, and research labs etc., all of which are riven by politics and crab-pit environment.

Definitely OT for this thread.

Jews will always think of themselves first, this is a given. Yet, they actually find resonance with our way of thinking. My business partner is an Orthodox Jew and more than half of my other partners in my other business are also Jewish. Same for SHQ. Same for my daughter, almost all her closest friends are Jewish. I have a few friends whose sons have married Jewish girls. With some of these families we have a very close relationship.

In the end, they do not want to hurt you just because you are different from them, that is the key difference between what we face with Pakis. If at a societal level Hindus and Jews can get along so well, why not as nations?

we have a business relationship with them.

Not much beyond that and not that there is anything wrong with that sort of a relationship.

you are talking of an ameriki milieu and the discussion is about israelis who come to India in large numbers as part of some project. And also people to people contacts with the populace both here and there.

The most arrogant guy I met was a jehadi canadian paki who came to my project with a deep madrassa embedded attitude and an ingrained anti Hindu outlook with completely poisoned ideas about India and in a very in your face kind of way, he did namaz many times a day which was OK with us.

he kicked up a fuss about his halal food, the water, the hotel, the car and driver and what not and insisted on visiting mosques during working hours and that too for long periods of time.

He was to come back for the next phase but I did not authorize his return. His company spoke to me and promptly sent a replacement and thereafter, even in video conferences, we never saw or heard from the paki guy again.

Every racist is careful when dealing with Indians in India, be it the french, the britshits or the israelis because the consequences are usually immediate and it affects them individually and personally.

If a complaint is made, the guy gets sent home very quickly.

[UlanBatori]

Cashmore development could reverse Global Warming and reduce Pakistani Terrorist population: Rutgers Study

The study, published in the journal Science Advances, looked at a war scenario that may occur between India and Pakistan in 2025. "Such a war would threaten not only the locations where bombs might be targeted but the entire world," said co-author Alan Robock of Rutgers University-New Brunswick in the US.

Another RAA Agint, no doubt. WTH is the journal "Science Advances"? Another "Open Access Journal" which means the authors PAY 2 Publish. RAA onlee. What legitimate university researcher has money (or need) to pay:

The base APC for articles published under a CC BY-NC or CC BY license is $4,500.
Discounts: Authors who are AAAS members receive a 4% discount on APCs.

So these are clearly paid propagandoos.

[A_Gupta]

https://swarajyamag.com/insta/erdoans-p ... ved-report
Erdoğan’s Pro-Pakistan Speech On Kashmir To Cost Turkey Billions? Indian Navy Contract May Be Shelved: Report

[UlanBatori]

High time. WTH is the "Turkish Navy"? Runs around Turkish Bath tubs? "Ships of the Desert"?

[UlanBatori]

OT but intensely relevant: What the papparazzi HOPED 2 b reporting

[chetak]

https://swarajyamag.com/insta/erdoans-p ... ved-report
Erdoğan’s Pro-Pakistan Speech On Kashmir To Cost Turkey Billions? Indian Navy Contract May Be Shelved: Report

the turks are building ships for the pakis too.


This may become a security issue for us going forward as the crookedness of the turks is well known as is their closeness to the pakis.

why take the needless risks.

[Vayutuvan]

High time. WTH is the "Turkish Navy"? Runs around Turkish Bath tubs? "Ships of the Desert"?

Bosporus straights, Black Sea, Sea of Marmara, Dardanelles, Aegean Sea, and the big one MediterranianSea.

[NRao]

What next, Pakistan? God forbid.

Iraq extends curfew and internet blackout as protest death toll rises to 22

[Vayutuvan]

we are talking about israelis and India, people to people contacts and racism in the israeli society. I suggest that you find and talk to some brown and black israelis and talk to them privately. It will be quite illuminating for you.

I know there is racism in Israel which is similar to background racism in the US. That doesn't mean that they, Israelis, particularly single out Indians/Brown people. Anyways, off topic.

[Vayutuvan]

one doesn't really give a rat's if god herself came down from on high and chose each one of them personally and then serially numbered them and declared them as kosher

That is what Hitler did.

[sanjaykumar]

The issue is not if some Bronze Age god chose one of the most primitive tribes in the then civilized world ( sorry Papuan New Guineans), the stunning roster of achievements in the sciences perhaps entitles them to some hubris.

[nachiket]

Mod-Note: That's enough of discussions about the jewish people and religion here. Further posts will result in warnings.