2019 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

Vips · Post by **Vips** » 19 Dec 2019 19:01

chetak wrote:something big seems to be brewing

They are desperate and know the capability differential between India and Pakistan is going to be very big and getting better (in India's favour) going forward, so they think they can try to do something now.

banrjeer · Post by **banrjeer** » 19 Dec 2019 19:32

chetak wrote:twitter

The Indian citizenship law amendment brouhaha.

Take a look at this chart: the bottom part in grey is the amendment.

Does this merit the hyperbolic reaction?

I support the CAA and all but the wording is poor and provided leverage to opponents. It should have been called amnesty act. they should have said minorities of enumerated countries. not listed religions. heartening to see police carrying out directives but they need better training for the future.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Dec 2019 19:36

pankajs wrote:’ taunts the judge openly after being dissatisfied with order on the Jamia violence.
‘Shame on you’ cries echo inside the courtroom[/b].TIMES NOW’s Priyank & Bhavatosh with details. | #LobbyBulliesLaw

Most hopeful neuj I have read for many saal. Looking forward to Their Honners conducting soccer practice.

Even in Bollwood movies I can't remember any where kaanoon has been disrespected. What next? A ShahRukh Khan dance with lawyers and judges lifting their robes and the Plainiffs as portable POboxes?

Anticipatory Bail applications from lawyers may now be deferred to 2035... with chappati-making practice until then.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Dec 2019 19:42

The very sad thing here is that no such Act was needed. Just slash the Waiting Time from 11 year to 11 days for minorities of Pak and BD to get accepted as Permanent Legal Residents, with citjenship in 5 saal automatic unless there is some reason not to give them citjenship. Kick baboon butts.

vinod · Post by **vinod** » 19 Dec 2019 19:44

I think you have to wait until 11 years to apply itself.

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 19 Dec 2019 19:48

Banrjeerji, I agree. Take for example OCI. This is not a second citizenship, which India does not allow for anyone. It is only an unlimited visa for Indian origin people. India did not take away the Indian citizenship of Mr. Aatish Taseer for his attack on Modiji. It took away his unlimited visa for visiting India for misrepresenting facts, which as a sovereign nation India has the right to do. Some Babu may have come up with a misguided term like OCI and this was used to hammer the Indian action. CAA is turning out to be a similar case.
Gautam

Vikas · Post by **Vikas** » 19 Dec 2019 20:04

chetak wrote:something big seems to be brewing

Knowing Pakhis, It is just bluster and nothing else. COAS of terrorists army is trying to save his almost lost Gaddi while Dim gets slapped and kicked by KSA. On top starting next year, lenders will start asking for the EMI.
In Pakhi world, If you want free publicity, Just mention India.

SMQ is angling for the job of PM hence all this dance and drama. Pakh Army now is good for only running business, Sex rackets for Chinese and act as Land mafia. Being army men was lost to them after getting kicked by Tehrik-e-Taliban.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 19 Dec 2019 20:14

g.sarkar wrote:I agree. Take for example OCI. This is not a second citizenship, which India does not allow for anyone. It is only an unlimited visa for Indian origin people. India did not take away the Indian citizenship of Mr. Aatish Taseer. It took away his unlimited visa for visiting India, which as a sovereign nation India has the right to do. Some Babu may have come up with a misguided term like OCI and this was used to hammer the Indian action. CAA is turning out to be a similar case.
Gautam

taseer has no Indian citizenship because he has purposely never applied for the same.

he was born in the uk, holds a britshit passport and is a citizen there all the while enjoying whatever privileges that a britshit passport may get him.

He also holds a us green card because of his "husband", a white ameriki lawyer who may be appreciative of an exotic TFTA like taseer.

taseer is trying to game the system and extract the maximum possible personal benefit from all three countries because he thinks that he is an entitled lootyens sperm dynast like pappu and also by virtue of him allegedly being an "intellectual" so no rules should apply to him.

It would not be surprising to anyone if some tame baboo(n) or lootyens contact was "arranging" free airline tickets for him.

the lootyens celebrities are all known to be notorious freeloaders.

mahadevbhu · Post by **mahadevbhu** » 19 Dec 2019 20:18

chetak wrote:
g.sarkar wrote:I agree. Take for example OCI. This is not a second citizenship, which India does not allow for anyone. It is only an unlimited visa for Indian origin people. India did not take away the Indian citizenship of Mr. Aatish Taseer. It took away his unlimited visa for visiting India, which as a sovereign nation India has the right to do. Some Babu may have come up with a misguided term like OCI and this was used to hammer the Indian action. CAA is turning out to be a similar case.
Gautam
taseer has no Indian citizenship because he has purposely never applied for the same.

he was born in the uk, holds a britshit passport and is a citizen there all the while enjoying whatever privileges that a britshit passport may get him.

He also holds a us green card because of his "husband", a white ameriki lawyer who may be appreciative of an exotic TFTA like taseer.

taseer is trying to game the system and extract the maximum possible personal benefit from all three countries because he thinks that he is an entitled lootyens sperm dynast like pappu and also by virtue of him allegedly being an "intellectual" so no rules should apply to him.

It would not be surprising to anyone if some tame baboo(n) or lootyens contact was "arranging" free airline tickets for him.

the lootyens celebrities are all known to be notorious freeloaders.

What a tremendously judgemental and insulting post.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Dec 2019 20:23

^^? I found it quite informative. Any factual errors?

KL Dubey · Post by **KL Dubey** » 19 Dec 2019 20:24

g.sarkar wrote:Banrjeerji, I agree. Take for example OCI. This is not a second citizenship, which India does not allow for anyone. It is only an unlimited visa for Indian origin people.

OCI is much more than an unlimited visa. It gives the holder almost all the same rights as citizens. It is more like a US green card, plus the added convenience that the holder does not have to satisfy any yearly residency requirements. It is a very significant document to grant to a foreign national, and I hope that GOI evaluates each case carefully. I agree 110% that it shouldn't be given to trash like Atish Taseer. Additionally, I think GOI should conduct checks that look at the individual's history and their public opinions about India before granting OCI (or even temporary visas).

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 19 Dec 2019 20:25

mahadevbhu wrote:
chetak wrote:
taseer has no Indian citizenship because he has purposely never applied for the same.

he was born in the uk, holds a britshit passport and is a citizen there all the while enjoying whatever privileges that a britshit passport may get him.

He also holds a us green card because of his "husband", a white ameriki lawyer who may be appreciative of an exotic TFTA like taseer.

taseer is trying to game the system and extract the maximum possible personal benefit from all three countries because he thinks that he is an entitled lootyens sperm dynast like pappu and also by virtue of him allegedly being an "intellectual" so no rules should apply to him.

It would not be surprising to anyone if some tame baboo(n) or lootyens contact was "arranging" free airline tickets for him.

the lootyens celebrities are all known to be notorious freeloaders.
What a tremendously judgemental and insulting post.

Thank you.

I was rather proud of it myself.

when you get a full toss (or tosser, if you prefer) like taseer, you simply have to hit it right out of the park.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 20:28

pankajs wrote:Seems like the Liberandu Activist & Lawyers have been hit for a SIX by the Dehli HC and they were so upset that they started sloganeering inside the court as the order was read by the Lards.

https://twitter.com/TimesNow/status/1207596793422217217
TIMES NOW @TimesNow

#Breaking | High drama in the Delhi High Court. ‘Lobby’ taunts the judge openly after being dissatisfied with order on the Jamia violence.
‘Shame on you’ cries echo inside the courtroom.

TIMES NOW’s Priyank & Bhavatosh with details. | #LobbyBulliesLaw

Further details ..
https://twitter.com/utkarsh_aanand/stat ... 1589279746

Utkarsh Anand @utkarsh_aanand

After #SupremeCourt asked petitioners to go to jurisdictional high courts, #Delhi HC today took up a plea on #JamiaProtest but said no to protecting students from arrest until next date, Feb 4. #DelhiPolice & Centre have been asked to file replies. Lawyers, others chant 'Shame'

Manio meo! Next hearing set for Feb 4th, 2020 with NO interim protection for the students! No wonder the activist & students were upset.

Deans · Post by **Deans** » 19 Dec 2019 20:28

UlanBatori wrote:The very sad thing here is that no such Act was needed. Just slash the Waiting Time from 11 year to 11 days for minorities of Pak and BD to get accepted as Permanent Legal Residents, with citjenship in 5 saal automatic unless there is some reason not to give them citjenship. Kick baboon butts.

In principal, that's the best way - apply and let GOI decide on case by case basis, as other countries do it, However, this will put too much discretion in the hands of babus and in the end the wrong kind of people (with bribe money) will get in. Hence, the need for rules and no room for discretion. In the case of Sri Lankan Tamils, existing law has made most of them citizens - while some have returned (which refugees from Pak/ Afg cannot do).

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 20:30

Act was needed because there was no legal path to citizenship for "illegals". They could settle down with fake paper, as many have done, but anytime they were detected they were liable to deportation per law. This gives them citizenship without any sword hanging over their head.

The BD/Baki excluded have exactly the same problem. Settled all over Bengal and India with fake papers but can be deported if caught. Doesn't matter when they came and hence the angst in TMC/Bengal.

All other changes via the bill are incidental.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 19 Dec 2019 20:35

Am seeing multiple videos of mobs assaulting cops. One frustrating part of NM and AS is that they let security forces face the physical assault of such mob. I mean look at this:

https://twitter.com/Brahmeme/status/1207665497631625218

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 20:40

pankajs wrote:
Further details ..
https://twitter.com/utkarsh_aanand/stat ... 1589279746

Manio meo! Next hearing set for Feb 4th, 2020 with NO interim protection for the students! No wonder the activist & students were upset.

Scrolled down a bit to read the comments ...
https://twitter.com/_pallavighosh/statu ... 5590963201

pallavi ghosh @_pallavighosh

Feb!!

A CON beat jurno, who in the past has written glowing tribute to PG Vadra. too found it unbearable injustice. Indeed, Delhi HC seems to have hit the activist lawyers and students for a six and has given Delhi bolis all the time it needs to smoke out every one behind the Jamia riots.

More detailed ..
https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1207596395726639104

ANI @ANI

Jamia matter: After the Court set February 4 as next date of hearing, the petitioner's counsel requested for an earlier date. After the court denied, the lawyers raised 'shame shame' slogans in court. High Court also denied interim protection from arrest to students

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 19 Dec 2019 20:45

If police comes under state govt and MAD can't control them, which other forces that they can deploy that the state govt can't deny deployment of?

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 20:47

There are multiple things GOI can do but why the worry ...

GOI is sitting cool ... they haven't even issued an advisory on the L&O to the states like Bengal, at least none that is in public domain.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 19 Dec 2019 20:53

I wonder what musharraf did to so piss off their serene and sharia pasand hizzonners

But its probably a lot less than musharraf actually deserves

twitter

This is shocking- Pak Court Order on #Musharraf says if he is found dead, his corpse be dragged to Islamabad and be hanged for 3 days...

Lekhraj · Post by **Lekhraj** » 19 Dec 2019 20:55

Tauba Tauba

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 19 Dec 2019 21:07

twitter

jamia millia islamia confers doctorate on Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan for his contribution to world peace — I'm not surprised.

The butcher of Kurds, sworn enemy of Armenians, Greeks and Jews honored by an Islamic University in secular India.

Jamia Millia Islamia confers doctorate on Turkish President Erdogan for his contribution to world peace

New Delhi
May 2, 2017

The convocation was attended by a 90-member strong Turkish delegation accompanying the President were Turkish Ambassador to India, Shakir Ozkan Torunlar, Saudi Ambassador Saud Mohammad Al-Sati, officials of the Ministry of External Affairs and heads of various diplomatic missions in Delhi.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 19 Dec 2019 21:10

darshan wrote:If police comes under state govt and MAD can't control them, which other forces that they can deploy that the state govt can't deny deployment of?

These mob attacks happened in Gj as well.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 19 Dec 2019 21:15

Guys, I need to catch up on all the news this morning, but very quickly, anyone can update on whether or not the so called CAA protests were big or were they a thussss pataki or something in between?

madhu · Post by **madhu** » 19 Dec 2019 21:17

List of Persecution/ethnic cleansing of Hindus after our independence. How many of them did we naturalize into India?

1946-47: 5 million Hindus and Sikhs fled from what became Pakistan and Bangladesh, to settle in India.
1949: Durban Riots (an inter-racial conflict between Zulus and Asians in South Africa), hundreds of hindus fled Cato Manor
1964: Zanzibar expelled Arabs and Indians from the nation in 1964
1971: Bangladesh War of Independence of 1971, the military of Pakistan carried out genocide killing between 300,000 and 3 million people and around 10 million Bengalis, mainly Hindus, fled the country.
1972: Idi Amin's regime forced the expulsion in of Uganda's entire ethnic Asian population, mostly of Indian hindu descent
1990s there were several riots against Hindus by radical elements in Fiji killed 1000s of them. Prime Minister Mahendra Chaudhry was held hostage abolishing any rights the Hindu inhabitants

1996: over 100,000 Bhutanese (Hindu) refugees were living in refugee camps in Nepal. India did not even take them.
2010: Strategic demographic and cultural cleansing by the Sinhala Buddhist majority of the Muslim and Tamil minorities in Sri Lanka

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 19 Dec 2019 21:20

yaar itni phati huyee kyon hai logo ki? IAF/PF war huya hai hai our plane got shot, our pilot captured, riot huya policeman par pathrav hai hai , bachao bachao…
The choice is you go down quietly in the night with no Hindus/Hindu religion after X years or you make a stand and fight. If you fight, it will never be one sided, and it will take much more than this.
Remember, through out history some 80-100 millions of us were killed for a simple fault - being a Hindu (when population base was much lower, in today's number like 300-400 million killed). Happens today - some are killed other converted. You can choose to be a coward and side with the murderers in name of any ism pick one (secularism, intellectualism...) or stand with truth and dharma and preserve what is yours.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 19 Dec 2019 21:37

chetak wrote:I wonder what musharraf did to so piss off their serene and sharia pasand hizzonners

Lamppost ending in the dictator cycle

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 21:54

https://twitter.com/ARanganathan72/stat ... 8004564993

Anand Ranganathan @ARanganathan72
Replying to @maryashakil

Thanks, Marya. This should end all fear-mongering. Also, the govt CLEARLY states that one of the admissible documents in the event of an NRC is "likely to be the Aadhaar card," meaning that when (or if) the NRC is rolled out, 100% Indians will be declared Indian citizens. WDTT

Still early days BUT this reminds me ..

1. The Liberandus wanted to dodge the Aadhar and went to court and won to keep it optional. GOI wanted to make in compulsory by making it mandatory for all things and it lost it in the courts.

Now, GOI gets to make Aadhar or another Aadhar like NRC registration compulsory for ALL and in the name of NRC. End result, ALL citizens get into the NRC with Aadhar or another Aadhar like process.

2. Aadhar will be used for enrollment and then use that data for verification and complete the loop for NRC. Anyone not able to complete the loop or getting Aadhar done using fake documents will be weeded out later.

3. Aadhar option will make is painless for many folks.

4.GOI will get lawful access to the bio-metrics stored under Aadhar for NRC to do what it wants!

E.g. The GOI will then make NRC linked identity mandatory for all services, from birth to death, that is wanted to do with Aadhar but was stopped by the courts. Aadhar was "optional" by design while NRC will be mandatory as proof of citizenship. Who will win out it the end?

Resistance is futile.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Dec 2019 22:12

I guess Jamia Millis cant read, or they might read the Oh See Aye rules. Specifically excludes paki/BD origins. That is what the yaseer twerp was hiding. He lied on the form because he is Paki.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 19 Dec 2019 22:17

It is not going to be Adhaar. You can get Adhaar for 1000 bucks. All these are speculations as Govt has not decided on procedure. They are studying the Assam NRC to see how nearly 2 million people fudged it and then decide. Most likely scenario is that you will not have to stand in line but during census officials will collect your data and documents and give you a registration number. All this is going to be then put in a database and then verified.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 22:29

Aadhar can be used ...

1. just that the "document" backing it will be verified. It is already been scanned and stored with UUID AND
2. You will still need to link up to a cutoff date, whatever it is, by yourself or via an ancestor.

Getting Aadhar for 1000 buck is the same as getting a fake birth certificate for 1000 buck and submitting it. No use. OTOH, It reduces the pain for genuine citizens by avoiding a re-do.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 19 Dec 2019 22:35

Supratik wrote:It is not going to be Adhaar. You can get Adhaar for 1000 bucks. All these are speculations as Govt has not decided on procedure. They are studying the Assam NRC to see how nearly 2 million people fudged it and then decide. Most likely scenario is that you will not have to stand in line but during census officials will collect your data and documents and give you a registration number. All this is going to be then put in a database and then verified.

Census takers will not be safe in 2021. Hope GoI will have foresight to provide security.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 19 Dec 2019 22:38

Everything will have to be linked to an ancestor who lived in India on or before the cut-off date. It can be linked to any number of documents e.g. Adhaar. But without the former it is a meaningless excercise. So saying Adhaar is enough is not saying it wholly.

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 19 Dec 2019 22:44

Aadhar or passport or ration card or birth certificate is merely saying you are resident of India. But doesn't prove citizenship or automatically enters your name into NRC. To reduce burden of people they can ask for copies of documents, details of ancestor living on or before cut-off date, perhaps fill a simple form and give a registration number. Then put everything in a database and verify. The data entry process and verification should not be left to state govt employees as chances of fudging data is high in non-BJP ruled states. Data should go through at least 2 levels of filter.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 22:44

Actually, the process can be quite safe.

When enumerates are pushed back, they should just walk away. When the family in question then goes to collect ration or to buy a train ticket or a myriad such common activity, he will be denied service for the lack of the NRC identity card. Remember a few years back, Aadhar enabled PDS was tested. We could have a version of that back in service with tweaks to take care of its weakness.

Lo and behold, he will be required to vizit the nearest enrollment center with his full family to get the full ration or train ticket of whatever else it is. Problem solved. It it the linking with all essential service which will force compliance i.e right from birth to death.

Sridhar K · Post by **Sridhar K** » 19 Dec 2019 22:49

While we expected similar protest after Ram Mandir verdict, a relatively unharmful CAA focussing on a small set of people who sought refuge in India has activated the Jihadi- liberals out in full force. Is this a diversion for something very sinister from ISI

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Dec 2019 22:51

CRAMSji:

1.These Peaceful ppl just want to be treated as respectable citizens: aren't they proving their point?

I heard the blaring noise of loudspeakers from a nearby place of worship of a certain community. It was an announcement, a call – following which the train stopped hard on its tracks just metres away from the said place of worship. As soon as the train stopped, I noticed hundreds of people running towards the train and the railway tracks.

No doubt they were stopping brayers early so that the Congregration could "catch the train".

2. Another Peaceful celebration (hain, what has Guj come down to after they sent AS and Praveen Tout? Present CM seems an idiot?)

3.See "Indian Intellectuals" in action..

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Dec 2019 22:52

And now for the Good News:

In Bangalore, Ramachandra Guha, a pre-eminent biographer of Mohandas K. Gandhi and a critic of the citizenship law, was midsentence in speaking to a reporter when helmeted police officers carrying sticks grabbed his arms and dragged him away. It was all captured on video.
“Our protest is totally nonviolent,’’ Mr. Guha said, seconds before he was detained. “See what is happening. You see we are totally peaceful. Did you see any violence?’’
Mr. Guha was then put into a bus full of other detainees. He was released later in the day.

Polis are clearly not doing their jaab.

Jeffrey Gettleman is the South Asia bureau chief, based in New Delhi. He was the winner of a Pulitzer Prize in 2012 for international reporting. @gettleman • Facebook

Isn't there a good bus for this good twit?

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 19 Dec 2019 22:57

I hadn't seen this b4:

INDIAN POLICE UNEARTH ASSASINATION PLOT (against u no hu) (OLD charges...)

All 19 accused are “active members of [a] banned terrorist organisation and... conspired to wage a war against the government,” the draft says, referring to the Communist Party of India (Maoist), a prohibited political faction. The prosecutors also allege the group conspired to stockpile over $1 million in weapons, along with tens of thousands of rounds of ammunition, as part of the assassination scheme. Few details about the supposed plot have emerged beyond the charges, however, and it remains unclear exactly how the suspects planned to carry it out.

The charges stem from an event held in the city of Pune in 2017, known as Elgar Parishad, which featured a number of cultural performances with anti-caste themes. Police say the festival was bankrolled by the Maoist group as part of an effort to incite violence and overthrow the government, blaming the event for clashes that later broke out in the village of Bhima Koregaon. Last year, however, two retired Indian court justices, BG Kolse-Patil and PB Sawant, came forward to insist they were the sole organizers and funders of the event, denying any Maoist role.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 19 Dec 2019 23:01

Yagnasri wrote:Muntaz began just demanded UN supervised referendum on CAA and BJP has the guts it conduct it.

Now it is totally open BIF activities.

Indians already voted on CAA via BJP election manifesto. She is just trying to rally her "core" base because she desperately needs them plus potential competitors are on the horizon.

Indians did not get to vote their Constitution and they will get a referendum on CAA & NRC?

BUT if it were granted, it would be a straight path to Hindu Rashtra. Think!