India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 Feb 2020 10:44

Mort Walker wrote:No SSS.

Trade is important because it is not small relative to GDP. There are far fewer Indians willing to bend and bow compared to 40-50 years ago. Many colleges and universities have Indian origin pro-India faculty, administration and staff. Some of them are on this very forum. The relationship has changed which is what Coupta was referring, but that's okay, please continue your whinefest.

you are hell bent on trusting someone who has proved repeatedly untrustworthy in the past and there are all indications that they will continue to be repeatedly untrustworthy in the future as well. This is what a superpower like the US or even china does routinely with India.

trade etc is all well. It will have ups and downs. Trump cannot win always like he obviously wants to.

when trump is patting Modi in the back, the deep state is looking hard to find the right place to stick the knife in.

you haven't faced the business end of some sanctimoniously imposed US sanctions.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 24 Feb 2020 11:11

^^^No one gives handouts and there are no free lunches. If you don't want to engage with the US, that is fine, but understand who India's largest trading partner is and who can deliver weapon systems on time and on budget. The Europeans can't and the Russians can't. Ultimately all weapon systems will have to be made in India to become a world power, but until then India has to engage with the US.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 24 Feb 2020 11:37

Trust is a strange term to use in this context . In interpersonal relationships we use the language of trust . When we deal with the context of trillion dollar major world powers interacting, the language used is that of self interest .

Modi and Jaishankar do not speak the language of trust . They explicitly speak and exercise the language of self interest . In this language it is expected that countries will seek to pursue their interests even to the detriment of those they simultaneously engage positively with .

To muddle this with the interpersonal notion of trust, is a mistake .

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 24 Feb 2020 11:42

Here's the list of who will be India from the US side:
U.S. Ambassador to India Kenneth I. Juster
Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross
Energy Secretary Dan Brouillette
Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney
National Security Adviser Robert O'Brien
Adviser to the President Ivanka Trump
Senior Adviser Jared Kushner
Senior Adviser Stephen Miller
White House Social Media Director Dan Scavino
Chief of Staff to the First Lady Lindsay Reynolds
Special Representative for International Telecommunications Policy Robert Blair
Press Secretary Stephanie Grisham
FCC Chairman Ajit Pai and National Security Council members Lisa Curtis and Kash Patel are also slated to attend bilateral meetings during the trip.

I'm surprised that right-wing racist Stephen Miller will be coming.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 Feb 2020 11:49

Mort Walker wrote:^^^No one gives handouts and there are no free lunches. If you don't want to engage with the US, that is fine, but understand who India's largest trading partner is and who can deliver weapon systems on time and on budget. The Europeans can't and the Russians can't. Ultimately all weapon systems will have to be made in India to become a world power, but until then India has to engage with the US.

we are being railroaded and that is not good for India.

no none gives a rats for US trade when they are primarily interested in amazonizing all trade and crippling the Indian developed resources to supplant, supress and in the medium term replace India's indigenous supply chains.

quintessentially, they still remain the ugly americans of yore.

amerikis who are most concerned about some russkis allegedly meddling in ameriki politics are often the least concerned about their own ameriki govts toppling foreign governments or ill treating the democratically elected CM of a huge Indian state.

Is their democracy so very different and superior to ours or do they racially think that they are superior to us.

the very same guys who denied a democratically elected Modi a US visa are busy in boisterously feteing him now, all for some few measly buck$ in trade and some Indian diaspora votes.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 24 Feb 2020 12:05

chetak wrote: we are being railroaded and that is not good for India.

no none gives a rats for US trade when they are primarily interested in amazonizing all trade and crippling the Indian developed resources to supplant, supress and in the medium term replace India's indigenous supply chains.

quintessentially, they still remain the ugly americans of yore.

amerikis who are most concerned about some russkis allegedly meddling in ameriki politics are often the least concerned about their own ameriki govts toppling foreign governments or ill treating the democratically elected CM of a huge Indian state.

Is their democracy so very different and superior to ours or do they racially think that they are superior to us.

the very same guys who denied a democratically elected Modi a US visa are busy in boisterously feteing him now, all for some few measly buck$ and some Indian diaspora votes.

Trade is bilateral and each country seeks an advantage for itself. The rest of your comments are bunk.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 Feb 2020 12:33

Mort Walker wrote:
chetak wrote: we are being railroaded and that is not good for India.

no none gives a rats for US trade when they are primarily interested in amazonizing all trade and crippling the Indian developed resources to supplant, supress and in the medium term replace India's indigenous supply chains.

quintessentially, they still remain the ugly americans of yore.

amerikis who are most concerned about some russkis allegedly meddling in ameriki politics are often the least concerned about their own ameriki govts toppling foreign governments or ill treating the democratically elected CM of a huge Indian state.

Is their democracy so very different and superior to ours or do they racially think that they are superior to us.

the very same guys who denied a democratically elected Modi a US visa are busy in boisterously feteing him now, all for some few measly buck$ and some Indian diaspora votes.
Trade is bilateral and each country seeks an advantage for itself. The rest of your comments are bunk.

you dissed the russkis in another thread and are sucking up to the amerikis in this one.

read up before you hit the keyboard.

tell me that jeff bezos is truly benevolent, charitable and trustworthy in the way amazon operates.

They shaft the small guys as a matter of corporate policy.

I am sure that he is good and god fearing guy at heart, or is that bunk too

constantly having one's labia oris glued to someone else's gluteus maximus is quite laborious if not painfully contortionist.

balance is the key, be it trade, foreign policy or even unilateral and unwelcome meddling in another's internal affairs like the
holier than thou USCIRF always does

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 24 Feb 2020 12:56

The Russians have little to offer India in the long run of 10-20 years. Russia is a declining economy and wilting power. Trade is relatively small and offers little growth. They offer some key areas of cooperation which Modi is working on. Basically, Russia is Italy with nuclear weapons. Some really good items in limited quantities.

Who cares about Bezos? Amazon will operate by Indian rules or they go home. How hard is that to understand? Amazon is not GE or Intel. They are a retailer and cloud data service.

I agree having your mouth glued to the Russian's ass will get you nothing.

Has USCIRF done anything for India-US relations in concrete terms? You sound as bad or paranoid as CRamS.

Balance with whom? China who is India's number 2 trade partner? Russia is insignificant going forward for India. They lack the economic base for production and consumption. Period. India and Russia will be friends, but that's about it. A strategic power partnership on paper.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 24 Feb 2020 13:04

Who's asking for Russia,Putin or anyone else to get a ticker-tape parade? I would protest if any Indian leader sucked up to Putin or any foreign leader kissing his backside! It's demeaning.Let's keep a sense of balance here.Trump at Sabarmati to show him the humility of the Mahatma I hope went down well.His try at the chakra I'm sure left an impression on his mind. The tamasha at the stadium to come
really quite avoidable.He could've gone straight onto the Taj where we're told the couple wanted to spend more time.He's seen enough cheering crowds on his campaign trails.

PS: Nevertheless, only Modi could've organised such a stupendous welcome.For that you have to give him 100/100.
The bar has been set as high as it can.
Enjoying Trump's pronunciation of Swami V.,Suchin,etc. though.! It's great entertainment.

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 24 Feb 2020 13:08

US officials puzzled over Trump's diet during India visit

Trump has a salad with a meal every now and then -- but other than that, "I have never seen him eat a vegetable," the official was quoted as saying by CNN.

"I don't know what he's going to do in this case. They don't serve cheeseburgers," he added.

However, the PM is a devoted vegetarian and plans to serve vegetarian food such as veg-burgers, multi-grain rotis, broccoli samosas and coconut water to the US president.

disha · Post by **disha** » 24 Feb 2020 13:52

^Well CNN and other liberals are definitely scared. What happens if Trump turns vegetarian after India trip? The liberals will have to then turn vegans to trump over trump!

Manish_Sharma · Post by **Manish_Sharma** » 24 Feb 2020 14:29

Slap on the face of Obama....

President Trump talks of Bharat's economic growth and reducing poverty.... then says "....AND YOU DID IT WHILE BEING TOLERANT..."

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 24 Feb 2020 14:31

Trump is doing well in his speech I am quite impressed (if you overlook his wrong pronunciation of Vivekananda etc)

He has hit notes that no liberal (desi ones) can afford to ignore.

Yes Manish you are correct !!!

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 24 Feb 2020 14:35

He is making a pitch for American defense equipment now ....

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 24 Feb 2020 14:36

mentions radical islamic terrorism liberals will be fuming ....

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 24 Feb 2020 14:38

Left Libs are enemies of both DT and NM. So DT wants to rub them on. As far as US EJ voters are concerned, DT will get their vote no matter what. No EJ is going to vote for todays Dems.

I think we will have good relationship with US if DT wins second term also. Of course there will be problems with trade and security relationship but overall it will be good. I can not say that with Burnee who is most likely candidate for Dem ticket.

nam · Post by **nam** » 24 Feb 2020 14:41

The biggest stick used to beat us: Kashmir, has now 370 removed and finally a solution found. We got to respond back to Pak for the first time in 30 years. Does anyone think all these would have happened without the support from US & Russia?

Could we imagine a US presidential visit when the Kashmiri jokers are still under house arrest? Would this have ever happened? #

Out objective is to make money from US. Money helps to manage friends in the Security Council. Everything else is emotional rhona.

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 24 Feb 2020 14:48

Trump's speech was pretty good. He talked about:

Great people of india,
historic landmarks,
cultural/religious landmarks,
diversity of our country,
even mentioned Sachin and Virat,
mentioned about threat of radical islamic terrorism,
mentioned our economic and scientific progress,
put in a sales pitch for American defence companies

All this happening within democratic set up and with spirit of tolerance

Nikhil T · Post by **Nikhil T** » 24 Feb 2020 14:53

Sumeet wrote:Trump's speech was pretty good. He talked about:
Great people of india,
historic landmarks,
cultural/religious landmarks,
diversity of our country,
even mentioned Sachin and Virat,
mentioned about threat of radical islamic terrorism,
mentioned our economic and scientific progress,
put in a sales pitch for American defence companies

Asks India to stay united - mentions Ganga, Golden Temple, Jama Masjid...Hindus and Muslims.Take pride in the glory of your past.

On the flip side,
- probably not ideal to mention “good friend Pakistan” and that “we’re beginning to see signs of big progress with Pakistan”. Maybe he was selfishly thinking of Afg, not India’s concerns with Pak.
- no mention of America’s continued support for India’s entry into UNSC as a permanent member (which Obama made). That’s something that has completely dropped in such Indo US events.

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 24 Feb 2020 16:04

I think one must note that world is taking a note of Indian civilization our past and present, our progress since we have started to taking it seriously ourselves and take pride in it. Credit for this definitely goes to Modi Shah NDA govt.

mahadevbhu · Post by **mahadevbhu** » 24 Feb 2020 16:57

Important things to hopefully come out of this visit:

1. More arms, better arms for the Indian forces. Second hand drones, Second hand XYZ's
2. A trade deal and restoration of the trade allowances made to India.
3. Visa laxity for Indian businesses and a point based immigration system rather than the random lottery for H1Bs / favorable sourcing norms from India rather than China for US businesses?
4. MMRCA? ~~JSF?~~

Sumeet · Post by **Sumeet** » 24 Feb 2020 17:25

dude you are back with JSF for MMRCA talk

we have already discussed this with you. please don't derail this thread with JSF talk.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 24 Feb 2020 19:17

Someone talked about Modi's hugging. He explained why he does this: he doesn't like the fact that visiting gora heads of states put their arms around an Indian PM's shoulder in a patronizing gesture. So, he pre-empts that by a hug & a strong handshake.

Speaks volumes about the man - there's a lot of thought and civilizational pride that has gone into his greeting!

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 24 Feb 2020 19:45

Good point Prem.Patronising Indian leaders is not on. Body language reflects the mind.A gentle touch to direct the visitor is fine,but "arming" him as if he was your property insulting.
I would even go further by greeting visitors with folded hands," namaste",more hygenic too in the days of the China virus!

Now as far Pak is concerned,the west / US will never abandon them because they can create so much trouble across the globe.In my opinion, India,particularly under the spineless UPA regimes was not hard enough on Pak.We need to go further than Doklam. After the firefight in the air ,we should've attacked the Paki airbases from which their aircraft came from, or hit at multiple other jihadi centres .The globe needs to know how seriously India views Paki terror. They think that we are a soft state that can absorb casualties in the thousands and do not put pressure upon Pak. We simply have not been tough enough with Pak. Things must change and the military needs must not bd delayed so we can fast forward our grand strategy especially now that China is on the back foot with the China virus pandemic.

Trump's statement that things are good with Pak,etc.,etc., was like thf drop of dung in the pot of milk for India. India and the NDA-2 must realise that where Pak is concerned, NO one will sort it out for us.We have to do it alone and dismembering Pak into 3 or 4 entities must be our avowed goal however long it takes. Once Pak is dismembered the Islamic fundoo disease in India will subside.

Vikas · Post by **Vikas** » 24 Feb 2020 20:22

CRamS ji will be very happy to know that CNN, Foxnews and WSJ have covered PoTUS trip to India very well

Now haters, pls don't comeback and say that they had nothing else to report since it was night in US

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 24 Feb 2020 21:13

sooraj wrote:US officials puzzled over Trump's diet during India visit

Trump has a salad with a meal every now and then -- but other than that, "I have never seen him eat a vegetable," the official was quoted as saying by CNN.

"I don't know what he's going to do in this case. They don't serve cheeseburgers," he added.

However, the PM is a devoted vegetarian and plans to serve vegetarian food such as veg-burgers, multi-grain rotis, broccoli samosas and coconut water to the US president.

Dude's going to be real windy after all that fibre.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 24 Feb 2020 22:29

Vikas wrote:CRamS ji will be very happy to know that CNN, Foxnews and WSJ have covered PoTUS trip to India very well
Now haters, pls don't comeback and say that they had nothing else to report since it was night in US

Yeah! They got in a front pic of polis in camouflage gear (but carrying lathis). Headline "Cop killed in Delhi violence" CAA.. yada yada.
Nothing changes on Cilizza Noise Nutwerks.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 24 Feb 2020 22:54

Can some one get the recipe for the broccoli samosa?

We get multi grain rotis in desi stores already.

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 24 Feb 2020 23:08

Ramanaji,
Here it is:
http://www.peekncook.com/Show-A-Recipe/ ... ir-singara
Just replace cauliflower with broccoli and presto, you got broccoli samosa!
Another alternative:
http://samosastreet.com/broccoli-samosas/
I think the first one is better.
Gautam

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 24 Feb 2020 23:19

CM,I'm sure AF-1 has a gourmet chef aboard and wherever the Donald is bedding down will have a kitchen fully equipped with whatever is his favourite repast. Our PM would love to have Charlie boy for dinner though,dedicated veggie and native health follower to boot.

Media coverage even had the Beeb grudgingly cover it. Didn't ck.Al Jaz.,etc. Would be interesting to see how the Asian channels covered it.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 24 Feb 2020 23:24

I heard from re-lie-able sources that Trump is a teetotaller. Nimbu Pani demand must have gone up in Dilli

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 24 Feb 2020 23:42

UlanBatori wrote:I heard from re-lie-able sources that Trump is a teetotaller. Nimbu Pani demand must have gone up in Dilli

I think that is because his brother was an alcoholic. Also, he is into junk food and has a phobia regarding germs. He must be terrified about the outbreak of corona virus.
Gautam

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 25 Feb 2020 00:08

g.sarkar wrote:Ramanaji,
Here it is:
http://www.peekncook.com/Show-A-Recipe/ ... ir-singara
Just replace cauliflower with broccoli and presto, you got broccoli samosa!
Another alternative:
http://samosastreet.com/broccoli-samosas/
I think the first one is better.
Gautam

Only reason I would support GDF re-opening is the Food and Wine thread!!!

Thanks. r

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 25 Feb 2020 00:27

So day 1 of the visit went of smoothly.

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 25 Feb 2020 00:28

g.sarkar wrote:
UlanBatori wrote:I heard from re-lie-able sources that Trump is a teetotaller. Nimbu Pani demand must have gone up in Dilli
I think that is because his brother was an alcoholic. Also, he is into junk food and has a phobia regarding germs. He must be terrified about the outbreak of corona virus.
Gautam

He himself told in one of interviews I watched long back before he was elected as president that he stopped drinking after his alcoholic brother's death. It is one of "Dharmic" characteristics of him. (It is Hindu custom to give up interest in one of items for dear ones after death.)

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 25 Feb 2020 00:39

Sumeet wrote:dude you are back with JSF for MMRCA talk

we have already discussed this with you. please don't derail this thread with JSF talk.

Well you know, all this excitement gets one going Sumeet Saar.

But seriously, a small silver bullet sqd for current Indian Navy carriers might do well to increase they're punch. 18 fulcrums + 6 f35 per CV?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 25 Feb 2020 00:41

Anyone know what the hold up for the trade deal is?
And whats with the GSP benefits cancellation and subsequent retaliation?
For all the "ahead of th ecurve", I haven't seen much discussion on the commodities affected and whats the story?

kit · Post by **kit** » 25 Feb 2020 00:58

Cain Marko wrote:
Sumeet wrote:dude you are back with JSF for MMRCA talk

we have already discussed this with you. please don't derail this thread with JSF talk.
Well you know, all this excitement gets one going Sumeet Saar.

But seriously, a small silver bullet sqd for current Indian Navy carriers might do well to increase they're punch. 18 fulcrums + 6 f35 per CV?

F35 s is likely no can do , requires a alphabet treaty india is not ready to sign ( BECA) ., probably never. lets just stop discussing F35s

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 25 Feb 2020 01:09

ramana wrote:Anyone know what the hold up for the trade deal is?
And whats with the GSP benefits cancellation and subsequent retaliation?
For all the "ahead of th ecurve", I haven't seen much discussion on the commodities affected and whats the story?

On GSP, Suraj discussed it and I mentioned it as well. GSP withdrawal has made no difference to Indian exports, but is a bargaining chip. The US views India as developed, so GSP isn’t coming back.

I don’t think Modi govt. wants to get into a trade deal which will be seen as a political favor to Trump. They would rather wait until Nov., lest India being seen as involved in US elections.

Commodities exports to India must abide by India’s religious customs and food purity laws. No animal byproducts in dairy.

There has been talk of an eventual FTA. That would be something of a marvel, but we will have to wait on it. Let’s see what comes of the talks on Tuesday.

In calendar year 2019, India-US trade in goods and services was $160 billion, or about 5% of India’s GDP. There is no reason why it can’t go up to $200 billion by 2025. I think for 2020, India-US trade in goods will hit the $100 billion mark. It would make India the 7th largest trading partner of the US.

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 25 Feb 2020 01:33

https://www.financialexpress.com/india- ... r/1877858/
Donald Trump India visit: Ex-PM Manmohan Singh, other Congress leaders to skip President Kovind’s banquet in US president’s honour
By: PTI | Published: February 24, 2020.
Manmohan Singh had earlier accepted the invite but expressed his inability to attend the same on Monday.
Congress leaders, including former prime minister Manmohan Singh, will not attend the official banquet being hosted by President Ram Nath Kovind in honour of US President Donald Trump on February 25, sources said. Singh had earlier accepted the invite but expressed his inability to attend the same on Monday. He has conveyed his regret to the President’s office for not being able to attend the banquet, sources close to Singh said.
The Leader of Opposition in the Rajya Sabha, Ghulam Nabi Azad, will also not attend the official banquet as Congress chief Sonia Gandhi has not been invited. She is also the leader of the Congress Parliamentary Party.
The opposition Congress is peeved at the Modi government’s move to not allow its top leaders a meeting with the visiting US president, as has been the tradition.
....
Gautam
What is going to happen to all that left over broccoli samosas?