Understanding the US - Again

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 09 Jun 2020 17:42

One more check mark. Chinese at the helm of election manipulations. Not sure why Russians keep being blamed when they don't have anywhere close to penetration and money that Chinese do.

TikTok Pivots From Dance Moves To A Racial Justice Movement
https://www.npr.org/2020/06/07/87106591 ... e-movement

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 09 Jun 2020 18:28

The enduring whiteness of the American media

greatde · Post by **greatde** » 09 Jun 2020 21:53

Surely, Trump has little case of re-election, he is struggling big time, and maximized his core support base. Where is the new votes going to be from? And Blacks will be out in greater numbers. In 2016, Black turnout was 7% less than 2012.

Imo, Trump has to make it a national security election, with Russia/China oriented. He cannot win it if elections and narrative is on local issues. Similar to Modi in 2019, where the narrative changed towards national security with Pak and Balakot strikes.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 09 Jun 2020 22:27

greatde wrote:Surely, Trump has little case of re-election....

Please change your username. If you are unable to, please advise and I can change it for you.

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 09 Jun 2020 22:38

ShyamSP wrote:
Gyan wrote:Has anyone recently calculated chances of Trump to win elections based on how many electoral votes he can get, compared to simple generic opinion polls?

Some of the states he won were by very narrow margins, is he likely to get any more marginal state or lose some?
Once Democrats finalize VP pick and put the initial narrative of the campaign, we can start the right assessment. As you said some were won with narrow margins, so analysis entails whether Democrats can flip a few narrow-margin states back and gain any Red states. Trump has to deal with 2 obvious problems to retain with narratives around them built by the Democrats -

1. Covid19 economic woes
While Fed pumping pushed stock market back up but the real economy is going down with unemployment problems. He has the challenge of managing or mitigating effects of downturn till elections and, in other words, if the Mainstreet economy catches up as quickly as wallstreet economy. By October unemployment figure such as >15% doesn't look good for Trump to spin away in any other way.

2. BLM
This is new problem post Floyd's killing. Democrats are spinning and pushing BLM and racism against Trump. Last time Trump won because of the blacks' indifference for voting to Clinton. Democrats are charging them back to vote at this time and at the same time creating a sense of guilt among white voters to be indifferent to voting Trump. This may result in picking a black VP. If they start replicating the performance of Midterm elections, they can take the Whitehouse. Losing narrow margin states back and some red states such as Arizona, Trump will have no numbers to win.

Trump was increasing his traction among Black & Latin voters due to successful economy. Now everything is up in the air. The thing is, how many American voters will see through the carnage done by Democrats to topple Trump.

The beauty of politics is that Democrats can get poor voters to vote for them while sending their jobs to China. Core of Abrahamic policies for 2000 years, is to play the poor against the middle class while the Elite shall Rule.

By end of June; Covid Scare, Riots & Economic Recession should all end. So, by end of August, there might be more visibility about election Results.

KL Dubey · Post by **KL Dubey** » 10 Jun 2020 01:47

Vayutuvan wrote: Biden is leading by 7 points in a very recent Fox poll - I repeat Fox poll.

Means next to nothing. Waste of time...Trump's campaign completely up-ended the credibility of polls. Lots of people are voting for Trump but are not in a position to show their support. This will intensify further in this election.

In Aug 2016 Lomdi showed Clinton leading by 10 points, in Oct 2016 still leading by 7 points, and still leading in Nov (eve of election) by 4 points.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fox-ne ... -as-flawed
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fox-ne ... y-7-points
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/elections/2016/polls

Furthermore, the electoral votes are all that matter. Sleepy joe getting more votes in MPS, SFO, LA, DC, NY etc will make no difference. Trump will just need to focus again on OH, PA, MI, FL and he will be home dry.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 10 Jun 2020 01:51

greatde wrote:... Similar to Modi in 2019, where the narrative changed towards national security with Pak and Balakot strikes.

I strongly disagree with this statement and advise that you look at the facts of the 2019 India's general election. The BJP won a majority as it improved the lives of vast numbers of people. Roughly 1 person per second from 2014-2019 came out of poverty, defined as less than $2/day, in this period. Water, electricity, roads, education and more. So please do not draw false analogies.

greatde · Post by **greatde** » 10 Jun 2020 02:02

Mort Walker wrote:
greatde wrote:... Similar to Modi in 2019, where the narrative changed towards national security with Pak and Balakot strikes.
I strongly disagree with this statement and advise that you look at the facts of the 2019 India's general election. The BJP won a majority as it improved the lives of vast numbers of people. Roughly 1 person per second from 2014-2019 came out of poverty, defined as less than $2/day, in this period. Water, electricity, roads, education and more. So please do not draw false analogies.

That is a true and a big reason, but not always crucial, else why have BJP lost various other elections?

Elections are about momentum, and Balakot strikes was significant for it and the narrative. And this is a different topic so not the correct place for further discussion.

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 10 Jun 2020 02:17

greatde wrote: That is a true and a big reason, but not always crucial, else why have BJP lost various other elections?

Elections are about momentum, and Balakot strikes was significant for it and the narrative. And this is a different topic so not the correct place for further discussion.

So go to the correct place for further discussion, the 2020 strategic and political analysis thread.

But before you start a new discussion there on this topic, please start with page 32 of that thread, post number 5 (sorry, I don't know how to link to specific posts on threads) dating back to January of this year. Starting with that post, please read the next 10 to 15 posts. After that, please feel free to continue the discussion in that thread, addressing any points which have not yet been covered in those posts (if you have anything fresh to add which hasn't already been covered there).

This topic has already been discussed and refuted multiple times, the pointer above is just to the latest instance of this discussion that I know of.

EDIT: I guess one can link to specific posts like this?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7788&start=1244

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 11 Jun 2020 04:40

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 11 Jun 2020 05:00

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 11 Jun 2020 05:11

banrjeer · Post by **banrjeer** » 11 Jun 2020 05:38

The black vs white fault line in the US is potentially massive, a result of more than 100 years of international slave trade.
Today things are held together because of relative prosperity and since the world still bets on the US. A slight shift can destabilize.

In contrast, fault lines in the former Soviet Union seem smaller but still has impact, One of them is the Holomodor famine of Ukraine. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor.

While not as drastic as slave trade, I wonder if it played a role in Ukranian identity, desire to join NATO etc

Putin was quick to assess. He only bit-off what he could chew and annexed Crimea from Ukraine.
Earlier he did then same with Abkhazia and south Ossetia when Georgia flirted with NATO

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 11 Jun 2020 05:48

ricky_v · Post by **ricky_v** » 11 Jun 2020 06:00

https://www.thestranger.com/slog/2020/0 ... rogramming

The six-block radius around Seattle's East Precinct began life as "Free Capitol Hill" on Monday, after the Seattle Police Department packed up and left the building, letting protesters freely march past the station for the first time in a week.

By early Tuesday, demonstrators had established a perimeter with improvised barriers and deputized scouts. In the afternoon, the "No Cop Co-Op" popped up, slinging kebabs, snacks, and free water to passersby. A teach-in square was established at the intersection of 12th and Pine. Tents were pitched near the precinct, where people were encouraged to stay throughout the night, or even just for two or three hours to hold the space. And by nightfall, they'd even built their own outdoor cinema.

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 11 Jun 2020 06:07

amritk · Post by **amritk** » 11 Jun 2020 10:00

darshan wrote: Please don't tell me that just because they are black that they are not racist and believe in standing in solidarity with other colored people. Or believe in not getting off the negotiation table till all the issues affecting colored people is covered.

In all my years across the US, nearly all cases of overt racism against me have been by blacks. With the sole exception of one hillbilly woman storeowner in rural NC. Of course, maybe the whites are just more sophisticated.

Kati · Post by **Kati** » 11 Jun 2020 10:30

Save this for future reference when the Khan's media comes to Bharat and laments (erroneously) how media in India has been throttled...blah blah blah ....

'Not acceptable': USA TODAY Network reporter covering George Floyd protest jailed, released in Delaware

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nat ... 331163002/

m_saini · Post by **m_saini** » 11 Jun 2020 11:01

^ It wouldn't matter. They'll keep showing us as throttling the media in desh or as snake wranglers trying to get into the white man's space club. The only thing we can do is continue to better ourselves and only that will stop the hypocrisy, only for them to start showing as an existential threat to the safety and security of the free world instead.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 11 Jun 2020 16:12

Police brutality and high handedness in the US is not limited to blacks or browns only, though they get a disproportionately large share of it.

At the same time, racism in the US is not just limited to police brutality and high handedness towards blacks or browns only, it goes much beyond that.

Policing reforms will address the part where these intersect, but will not be enough eliminate racism from the society.

chola · Post by **chola** » 11 Jun 2020 16:49

amritk wrote:
darshan wrote: Please don't tell me that just because they are black that they are not racist and believe in standing in solidarity with other colored people. Or believe in not getting off the negotiation table till all the issues affecting colored people is covered.
In all my years across the US, nearly all cases of overt racism against me have been by blacks. With the sole exception of one hillbilly woman storeowner in rural NC. Of course, maybe the whites are just more sophisticated.

I have the same experience. Blacks are more overtly racist towards desis than whites. I had been sworn at, pushed and assaulted by blacks. That had never happened with whites to be perfectly honest. I can also honestly admit that I am afraid of their areas especially when I am driving through with family. The racism from whites is far more subtle and the fear factor is not really there. Most of the racial tension that I feel from whites come when I am with my wife and especially from the frat boys when we were dating in college. But that is more disapproving looks than actual words or physical confrontation. (The funny thing is she isn't even white which I could understand.)

Shameek · Post by **Shameek** » 11 Jun 2020 19:03

Developments in Seattle. Note how quick the west is to label anyone including their own citizens as terrorists. If this were in India the news would run always using the word "Alleged".

But President Trump suggested another term for the demonstrators late Wednesday: “Domestic Terrorists.” Trump blasted Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan (D) and Washington Gov. Jay Inslee (D) on Twitter, threatening federal action if local leaders don’t “take back” the city.

“Radical Left Governor @JayInslee and the Mayor of Seattle are being taunted and played at a level that our great Country has never seen before,” Trump tweeted. “Take back your city NOW. If you don’t do it, I will. This is not a game. These ugly Anarchists must be stooped [sic] IMMEDIATELY. MOVE FAST!”

Link

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 12 Jun 2020 04:27

Antifa vs "Patriots" street brawl

Seattle Autonomous Zone gets a Warlord, Raz Simone

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 12 Jun 2020 09:43

Rony wrote:Antifa vs "Patriots" street brawl

Somebody needs to suggest uniforms for each group. In the fight between radical/Antifa whites and patriot/right-wing whites, it is confusing who is who in the American "civil war" when we watch those videos

Rony wrote:
Seattle Autonomous Zone gets a Warlord, Raz Simone

The question may be rhetorical, but what is the reason for the fetish of some Indian-American women to join radical left-wing groups? In this video, there is an Indian city council member, Kshama Sawant, (who also sponsored anti-Indian resolution on CAA in that radical Seattle city). There is an Indian lady, Varshini Prakash, in Sunrise movement on the east coast. On a milder side, there is the other lady, Vinita Gupta, in ACLU.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 12 Jun 2020 18:49

This is a grotesque form of interference in the forthcoming US elections and malicious external forces are involved in precipitating a regime change.

expect the very same modus operandi in India too.

After all, this is the same direction in which the externally induced and funded shaheen dramatics was heading until the chinese virus derailed it.

Democrats are seemingly backing CHAZ, mirroring the identical role of aap and the congis during the CAB "agitations".

soros and the hans in play with mullahs and other bit players fronting the Indian venture.

This has all the elements of an evolving startup.

Welcome to CHAZ: ‘Protesters’ in USA establish autonomous zone in Seattle, demand abolition of police and courts, local ‘Warlord’ takes control

The situation in the United States of America has escalated massively in the wake of the death of George Floyd at the hands of a policeman. What were meant to be protests turned out to be an orgy of looting, rioting and wanton violence. Since then, matters have transcended into the realm of the bizarre and now we have the Country of CHAZ in our hands.

Protesters in downtown Seattle occupied a six block area surrounding the East Precinct of the Seattle Police Department on Monday. Following violent clashes with the ‘protesters’, the Police abandoned their position amidst calls to ‘defund the police’. The objective of CHAZ was to establish some form of socialist utopia which epitomises social justice ethos but it doesn’t appear to be going too well.

The protesters have installed blockades around themselves to mark their territory. A sign on one of these blockades says, “You’re now leaving the USA.” The social justice protesters appear to have finally realised the importance of borders. These borders are also being manned by an armed militia that is demanding identification from people before letting them enter.

The Country of CHAZ was supposed to be an ‘anti-racist zone’ without a Police, however, order appears to have risen spontaneously from the anarchy and the said armed militias are already enforcing the law within the territory. The man-in-charge, who is being referred to as a ‘warlord’ in online circles, a designation he prefers himself, is one rapper called Raz Simone.

Warlord Raz Simone takes control
Raz Simone and his affiliates are manning the streets of CHAZ and they have also allegedly thrashed people for defying orders. As per the Police, they are demanding that businesses and residents pay up a fee to maintain the new social order. Assistant Police Chief Deanna Nollette said, “While they have a constitutionally-protected right to bear arms, and while Washington is an open carry state, there is no legal right for those arms to be used to intimidate community members.”

Nollette also confirmed that the police have heard ‘anecdotally’ that businesses and residents have been ordered to pay a fee if they wish to operate within the area, which is a “crime of extortion” according to the police. The Police have not yet taken any action against the self-declared autonomous zone and are in the process of resolving the matter amicably.

Individuals have been making their dissatisfaction with the state of affairs known on Reddit. They are angry that Raz Simone has assumed supreme authority over the collective without due process.

The demands of CHAZ
The protesters, on their part, have made quite radical demands to abandon their occupation. One of the propositions in the Charter of Demands states, “The Seattle Police Department and attached court system are beyond reform. We do not request reform, we demand abolition. We demand that the Seattle Council and the Mayor defund and abolish the Seattle Police Department and the attached Criminal Justice Apparatus. This means 100% of funding, including existing pensions for Seattle Police. At an equal level of priority we also demand that the city disallow the operations of ICE in the city of Seattle.” ICE is short for Immigration and Customs Enforcement.

Other demands include the abolition of imprisonment and “a retrial of all People in Color currently serving a prison sentence for violent crime, by a jury of their peers in their community.” US President Donald Trump has made his opinion clear on the matter. He has referred to these people who have created an ‘autonomous zone’ within the USA as ‘domestic terrorists’.

Raz Simone shot back at the US President and claimed that a death warrant had been placed on his head. ‘If I die, don’t let it be in vain,’ Raz told his supporters.

Meanwhile, life has not been easy for the citizens of the Country of CHAZ. They have apparently run out of food and are requesting sympathisers to donate Vegan food for the cause. If their social media communique is to be believed, the homeless people they invited ran off with all the food they had gathered.

Democrats back CHAZ
Democratic politicians, meanwhile, have decided to make no effort to clear the illegal occupation of land by the protesters. There are also fears that the protesters might seek to increase their area of occupation. “We lost a precinct, now, what’s next? Are we going to lose another precinct? The city council has removed our ability to have less lethal ammunition for us to properly protect those facilities and protect ourselves,” Michael Solan, President of the Seattle Police Officers’ Guild told Laura Ingraham of Fox News.

Governor of Washington, Jay Inslee, and Mayor of Seattle Jenny Durkan are not concerned about the spread of the Wuhan Coronavirus among the protesters and the health risk such demonstrations pose. Significant section of the citizens of the United States and western countries around the world are not allowed to organise funerals for the deceased in the family but such mass gatherings are apparently permitted.

Even ‘health experts’ have said that these protests are more important than fighting the Coronavirus pandemic. Despite the rampant lawlessness in CHAZ, Durkan insists that it is “not a lawless wasteland of anarchist insurrection – it is a peaceful expression of our community’s collective grief and their desire to build a better world.”

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 12 Jun 2020 22:05

May as well institute reservation system as in India. I'll support that.

All this noise is going to allow things to go unnoticed. more Soros in making? More manipulation tools? Trojan horses? Next version of Cambridge analytica?

Apple, YouTube unveil $100 million funds to support black causes amid U.S. protests
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-minn ... SKBN23I2UL

Rishi_Tri · Post by **Rishi_Tri** » 12 Jun 2020 22:23

My experience has been same as others posting.. in fact I can never trust blacks.. or take them for what they say.. I think they have a deep seated bias against us and my theory is .. they don't understand how come we are successful despite brown skin.. of course they don't know the deep cultural reasons and they don't understand IT / Technology and are hardly present in IT / Technology..

As to antifa vs patriots.. the patriots came out in huge numbers to protect their neighbourhoods.. armed with assault rifles and what not.. of course Trump also pulled in the Military for show of power.. no wonder the riots stopped.. whoever thinks that Democrats / Chini / Russi combi will drive the protests.. and run the country aground.. well.. wait till the AR15 totting 100,000s come riding their Harleys.. a small city last year had 100,000 patriots with their AR15s protest in city capitol to protect the 2nd amendment.. and we are not talking about an amendment here but a country..

As to Indian american women joining radical left wing politics..
1. perhaps show of rebellion..
2. independence from mainstream..
3. affinity with similar brown skin people but most of who come from Islamic and other backgrounds..
4. also in conversations I have had.. I have found them to be unaware of how democratic administrations have been damaging to India over last three decades.. and they have been happy with Democrats, left wing politics of equality etc. as it serves them well here.. without seeing how it hurts where they came from.. (not vouching for either right or left here, just thinking through it)

and as to why many such women support anti CAA protests in India.. they are Americans.. and Not Indians.. so can't expect them to see the realities on ground in India..

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 12 Jun 2020 22:25

Starts with educational institutions. Same happens in India.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 13 Jun 2020 05:51

ShyamSP wrote:There is an Indian lady, Varshini Prakash, in Sunrise movement on the east coast. On a milder side, there is the other lady, Vinita Gupta, in ACLU.

https://www.zimbio.com/photos/Varshini+ ... pf34WSrzE2

Attention seeking like Ms. A. Roy to start with. She tweeted a photo of her with Naomi Kline, author of "No Logo" who also opposes GOI subsidies to Indian farmers, but she deleted the tweet later. I wonder why.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 13 Jun 2020 05:58

https://www.credoenergy.com/blog/2019/0 ... Necessary/

Posted on April 18 2019 by Varshini Prakash, Sunrise Movement Executive Director

*The Green New Deal Isn't Unrealistic, It's Necessary*

For as long as I can remember, I’ve been scared about climate change.

Growing up, I heard about how my hometown of Boston could be largely underwater by the end of the century. I grew up watching increasingly severe droughts and floods take thousands of lives in southern India, where my family is from, and fearing my family might be next. Every step of my life, fear of climate change has been a potent, tangible force. It feels less like some abstract scientific fact in a textbook and more like knowing a giant asteroid is heading toward my family.

Today, much of my generation can’t escape that fear even as we make life decisions about whether or not to have children. Is it moral to bring someone new into a planet that’s 3 degrees warmer? How much of our income should we save for retirement? What’s really the point, if the planet’s going to look like Mad Max?

Very childish. She has pictures with AOC and other people of that ilk. Hometown Boston means ~~Harvard/Ivy league pedigree~~ UMass at Amherst (Falg ship State Univ of MA) and all that, maybe. She got "white privilege" extended to her and she started thinking like a Elite 'non-brown' American, i.e. coconut. I may be wrong but not by much.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 13 Jun 2020 06:09

https://time.com/collection/time-100-ne ... i-prakash/

This introduction is by Gov. Jay Inslee (D), Washington.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 13 Jun 2020 06:12

https://www.umass.edu/sbs/news/alumni/n ... e-movement

OK. She is from UMass at Amherst. Nice university, great campus, Berkeley like student body

Y. Kanan · Post by **Y. Kanan** » 13 Jun 2020 07:32

ShyamSP wrote:The question may be rhetorical, but what is the reason for the fetish of some Indian-American women to join radical left-wing groups?

Mainly because feminism is has become very popular with the younger generations of Indian women.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 13 Jun 2020 08:01

Y. Kanan wrote:
ShyamSP wrote:The question may be rhetorical, but what is the reason for the fetish of some Indian-American women to join radical left-wing groups?
Mainly because feminism is has become very popular with the younger generations of Indian women.

There are over 1.38 billion people and even if there are 0.001% of nut cases still means there are at least 13,800 nuts. Which is quite a bit.

A list of these nuts needs to be collected, along with their immediate family members, where the MEA will strip the visas and OCI of these people so that they may never set foot in India again. If some of them happen to be Indian citizens who are on green card, then passports needs to be cancelled. Then send a letter to the US Dept. of State stating that these individuals are associated with terrorists and criminals and should not be given permanent residency or citizenship.

m_saini · Post by **m_saini** » 13 Jun 2020 09:04

I think the opposite. I think we should invite these nuts to desh and grill them on live TV on nutter questions like "what the ideal AC temp should be so there's no patriarchy in workplace" etc. Show the common man how loony their ideas really are.

They're like commies in that regard, exotic to look at from afar but stink like a durian close by.

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 13 Jun 2020 09:59

Hell’s Angels and Mongols riding together on their way to Seattle to scrap with Antifa Terrorists.

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 13 Jun 2020 12:53

Vayutuvan wrote:https://time.com/collection/time-100-ne ... i-prakash/

This introduction is by Gov. Jay Inslee (D), Washington.

I can't pinpoint if some of these are natural or "left-groomed". There may be some hidden "grooming" element to catch kids predisposed towards leftist issues and push them up with "sponsorships".

Her story goes she is from a normal Indian background and went with her own natural exploration of environmental concerns. AOC is another good and successful pop-up from a normal Hispanic background.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 13 Jun 2020 17:37

If you dig deeper you find them rich or at least upper-middle-class people.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 13 Jun 2020 18:30

University entrance apparatus and scholarships provide decent opportunities to identify and groom. Then once on campus additional clubs that are infiltrated where left and islamists would groom them same as their cause. Like saving environment means that you're left. If you come to realization that islamists are not peaceful then you're next Hitler.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 13 Jun 2020 19:14

The debate is still on about whether the 1965 Immigration Law would have been supported by blacks in hindsight or not. In my opinion, today there are many latinos and blacks that lament that law change than whites.

South Asian American activism must go beyond viral stories, advocates say
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/asian-amer ... s-n1230596
In particular, Rajagopal said he wished more Hindu Americans, the majority of whom came to the United States after the passage of the 1965 Immigration Act, realized how instrumental African Americans were in changing U.S. immigration policy .