India's Border Security with China and Pakistan-2020 - Part 2

williams · Post by **williams** » 22 Sep 2020 05:57

suryag wrote:what do they discuss over 12 hr sessions and that too having about 8-10 iterations of these sessions. Isnt it clear, you vacate or not vacate, we vacate or do not vacate, heck even if they want to discuss the map in detail it wont take so many of these long sessions, in a sense this tires out the Corps leadership as they have to debrief with Delhi once the discussion is over.

Chins think they are master strategists. They have very complex negotiating drills that they think will help them gain a better deal. Here are some tactics I can glean in from google.

Act in the open, but hide your true intentions.
Exercise patience and wear them down
Turn something that is not substantial into reality.
Pretend to care about an issue and later give it up to get what you really want.
Do not arouse their spirit to fight back.
Play Dumb, then surprise them. Let them underestimate you.

So with all these art of war BS, our generals have to endure these long useless sessions for these comical characters to hone their negotiating skills.

BajKhedawal · Post by **BajKhedawal** » 22 Sep 2020 06:47

williams wrote:Chins think they are master strategists. They have very complex negotiating drills that they think will help them gain a better deal. Here are some tactics I can glean in from google.

Act in the open, but hide your true intentions.
Exercise patience and wear them down
Turn something that is not substantial into reality.
Pretend to care about an issue and later give it up to get what you really want.
Do not arouse their spirit to fight back.
Play Dumb, then surprise them. Let them underestimate you.

So with all these art of war BS, our generals have to endure these long useless sessions for these comical characters to hone their negotiating skills.

This is no Art of War, this is rather the Art of Cowardice. And it makes perfect sense that the wimpy chinese came up with this defense mechanism shit given their weak body, mind, and soul. Every single couplet from the suntuziapa reeks of desperation borne out of diminutive timidness of that ethnicity. Even their so called wonder of the world "The great wall" is a testament of the very same cowardice, built high and long to keep the big bad blood-drinking mongols and vodka-drinking cossaks out. This wall of shame is even visible from space least the universe forgets where wimps live.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 22 Sep 2020 06:55

BajKhedalwaji - amazing take on this tzutiyapanthi - will rephrase

Sun Tzutiyapanti is a treatise towards cloaking Cowardice arising out of weak body, mind, and soul. Every single couplet reeks of desperation borne out of diminutive timidness of that ethnicity. "The great wall" is a testament of the very same cowardice, built high and long to keep the big bad blood-drinking mongols and vodka-drinking cossaks out. This wall of shame is even visible from space least the universe forgets where wimps live.

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 22 Sep 2020 07:02

https://tfipost.com/2020/09/after-losin ... -prove-it/
After losing face in Ladakh, China is desperate to look strong in Taiwan and it’s using Hollywood visuals to prove it
Sanbeer Singh Ranhotra, 21 September 2020.
Having been beaten black and blue continuously by the Indian Army since June, the People’s Liberation Army (PLA), which is a personal militia of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP), has ramped up its propaganda operations, since evidently, these are the only ones which they can carry out successfully. As per latest reports, China is looking to distract attention of the international community from Ladakh and the extremely hot Line of Actual Control (LAC) with India, to the South China Sea and Taiwan, while also activating its military theatre commands which face the Korean Peninsula and Japan.
To showcase itself as a formidable military force, the PLA is now taking to outright plagiarism, with no shame whatsoever. As per an SCMP report, the PLA’s publicity team, which seems to have a disproportionate obsession with Hollywood films, has released a propaganda film showing the PLA Air Force bombing an American military base in the Pacific. Several of the scenes in the new video produced for the PLA Air Force – showing a simulated bombing exercise on an American military base in the Pacific region – look like they were lifted directly from the 2008 Oscar-winning The Hurt Locker and the 1996 action-thriller The Rock.
In the film released on Saturday, H-6K long-range bombers are shown flying from bases in western China to the Pacific, where they drop their payloads on a naval base that has a striking resemblance to the US facility on the island of Guam. Military sources told SCMP that it was not new for the Chinese military to ‘borrow’ scenes from Hollywood films for propaganda purposes in China, revealing also, “Almost all of the officers in the department grew up watching Hollywood movies, so in their minds, American war films have the coolest images.”
The plagiarised propaganda film on the part of the Chinese was necessitated due to the utter lack of face which they are being made to suffer by India in Eastern Ladakh, especially along the tense Pangong Tso Lake, where, over the past three weeks, the Indian Army has carried out pre-emptive and swift operations to secure dominating heights, directly overlooking the PLA troops and their camps, thus pushing them into an extremely disadvantageous position. To add to China’s woes, India has also recently secured six new dominating heights, including the Magar hill, Gurung Hill, Recehen La, Rezang La, Mokhpari and the dominating height over Chinese positions near Finger 4.
......
Gautam

ks_sachin · Post by **ks_sachin** » 22 Sep 2020 07:28

suryag wrote:BajKhedalwaji - amazing take on this tzutiyapanthi - will rephrase

Sun Tzutiyapanti is a treatise towards cloaking Cowardice arising out of weak body, mind, and soul. Every single couplet reeks of desperation borne out of diminutive timidness of that ethnicity. "The great wall" is a testament of the very same cowardice, built high and long to keep the big bad blood-drinking mongols and vodka-drinking cossaks out. This wall of shame is even visible from space least the universe forgets where wimps live.

Suryag I would say that they have been pretty successful over the years WRT India don't you think?
Take China out of the equation and the statements make a lot of sense. What do you disagree with here? Just interested to know..

Act in the open, but hide your true intentions.---
Exercise patience and wear them down
Turn something that is not substantial into reality.
Pretend to care about an issue and later give it up to get what you really want.
Do not arouse their spirit to fight back.
Play Dumb, then surprise them. Let them underestimate you.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 22 Sep 2020 07:29

So much for Chinko propaganda about their hot food.Bats,rats,snakes, lizards and cockroach Han style.They can have it all! But the logistic challenge for us will be immense through the winter.Good point though about drone delivery, we too have the desi tech. and capability,more needs to be done in this manner of supply especially when our soldiers are atop peaks and ridges.

One golden rule when dealing with the Hans.NEVER trust them.
They are liars through and through.An example only yesterday.Wifey wanted a clothes hangar.Lovely Italian name," Designed in Italy" in big letters.Fine print, "Made in China"!
Another example Wellberg cooking utensils claiming to be Austrian. Address Austrian,lettering in German,importer Indian,but in a tiny corner in microscopic size," Made in PRC",not even China!

Davidrock · Post by **Davidrock** » 22 Sep 2020 07:54

^ so true, its so hard to get stuff that is not made in china.
There is talent in India and cheap labour to manufacture at a lower price, but bribing and corruption is a big show stopper.

This is one thing we cant match them in near future. They have advanced a lot in manufacturing and ease of business.
I was hearing that they have conferences for companies looking to invest and they get all the approvals in 1 day under 1 roof. We have massive talent just need the right channels to translate that into economic power.

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 22 Sep 2020 08:19

williams wrote:
suryag wrote:what do they discuss over 12 hr sessions and that too having about 8-10 iterations of these sessions. Isnt it clear, you vacate or not vacate, we vacate or do not vacate, heck even if they want to discuss the map in detail it wont take so many of these long sessions, in a sense this tires out the Corps leadership as they have to debrief with Delhi once the discussion is over.
Chins think they are master strategists. They have very complex negotiating drills that they think will help them gain a better deal. Here are some tactics I can glean in from google.

Act in the open, but hide your true intentions.
Exercise patience and wear them down
Turn something that is not substantial into reality.
Pretend to care about an issue and later give it up to get what you really want.
Do not arouse their spirit to fight back.
Play Dumb, then surprise them. Let them underestimate you.

So with all these art of war BS, our generals have to endure these long useless sessions for these comical characters to hone their negotiating skills.

The chinese hardly talk during negotiations and let the other party do all the talking .. the problem with other side talking too much is that the opp party occassionally slips something stupid which they like to latch on to and play on it .... much time is lost in translations...

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 22 Sep 2020 08:20

ks_sachin wrote:
suryag wrote:BajKhedalwaji - amazing take on this tzutiyapanthi - will rephrase

Sun Tzutiyapanti is a treatise towards cloaking Cowardice arising out of weak body, mind, and soul. Every single couplet reeks of desperation borne out of diminutive timidness of that ethnicity. "The great wall" is a testament of the very same cowardice, built high and long to keep the big bad blood-drinking mongols and vodka-drinking cossaks out. This wall of shame is even visible from space least the universe forgets where wimps live.

Suryag I would say that they have been pretty successful over the years WRT India don't you think?
Take China out of the equation and the statements make a lot of sense. What do you disagree with here? Just interested to know..

Act in the open, but hide your true intentions.---
Exercise patience and wear them down
Turn something that is not substantial into reality.
Pretend to care about an issue and later give it up to get what you really want.
Do not arouse their spirit to fight back.
Play Dumb, then surprise them. Let them underestimate you.

TRUE !!

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 22 Sep 2020 08:28

Hopefully when discussing, Indian side is using all Indian languages plus dialects plus Tibetan one.

arshyam · Post by **arshyam** » 22 Sep 2020 08:49

Going by the (our) Army's recent actions despite (our) insistence of talks, some version of ^^ is what is happening - talk in one of our many languages, let them waste time getting them translated, while we keep sipping on our chai. I doubt they like our chai given that it is milky and sweet with milkmaid, and sipping that for 9-10 hours - who's at a disadvantage here?

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 22 Sep 2020 11:43

vijayk wrote:
shyamd wrote: Interesting to see the new 15 Corps Commander join the talks. I presume the MEA chap will know the 1993 agreements inside out - read chapter and verse. Making things joined up - bodes well.
bodes well for whom? Can you give little more info or not now?

Trying to play off PLA vs Wang. The mea official spoke of treaty meaning signed into Chinese and Indian law... bodes well meaning it’s a good thing to try.

pushkar.bhat · Post by **pushkar.bhat** » 22 Sep 2020 11:46

The fact that 15 Corps commander joined in was for very clearly signaling that we have 2 Corps deployed and any act of mischief will be suitably responded to with readjustments.

RCase · Post by **RCase** » 22 Sep 2020 11:56

shyamd wrote:
vijayk wrote:
bodes well for whom? Can you give little more info or not now?
Trying to play off PLA vs Wang. The mea official spoke of treaty meaning signed into Chinese and Indian law... bodes well meaning it’s a good thing to try.

Huh? Chinese follow laws and treaties?

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 22 Sep 2020 12:38

Brahma Chellaney
@Chellaney
HT reports China has now deployed intermediate-range ballistic missiles (IRBMs) in Aksai Chin, which it occupied in the mid-1950s. IRBMs generally are nuclear-armed, but China has also built conventional warheads. In a non-nuclear role, IRBMs can scarcely cause massive damage.

Hope Brahmos and Prithvis are deployed in numbers.....Standoff weaponry, Missiles in qty, SPHs etc. are sorely needed in this confrontation.

chola · Post by **chola** » 22 Sep 2020 12:55

^^^The greatest weapons will be roads, engineers and persistence. Each day that passes without offensive action, the lines will solidify which in turn makes offensive action even more risky and less likely.

It is a matter of who can build up structures to house forces in the winter and the roads to supply them.

madhu · Post by **madhu** » 22 Sep 2020 13:07

pushkar.bhat wrote:The fact that 15 Corps commander joined in was for very clearly signaling that we have 2 Corps deployed and any act of mischief will be suitably responded to with readjustments.

as per the news reports the reason for 2 corps commander is because current 14 Corps commander will retire in October.

The Indian side is led by Lt. Gen. Harinder Singh, 14 Corps Commander who was accompanied by Lt. Gen. P.G.K. Menon, set to take over as the 14 Corps Commander in October. The Chinese side is led by Maj. Gen. Lin Liu, South Xinjiang military commander.

For the first time, Naveen Srivastava, Joint Secretary handling East Asia division in the Ministry of External Affairs (MEA), is part of the Indian delegation.

probably signaling that we are ready for long halt on the mountains.

schinnas · Post by **schinnas** » 22 Sep 2020 14:24

Missiles are useful only for select scenarios, only for precision strikes at high value targets such as key bridges, ammo depots, high value enemy leadership, etc. Otherwise, it would be stupid to burn millions worth missile for target that may at best be a fraction of its cost.

What would really help are artillery that is mobile and in numbers and laser guided munitions coupled with air superiority or dominance. Works out lot cheaper, scalable and flexible than missiles.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 22 Sep 2020 14:31

On Newschannels they were showing the Oil Depot in Ladakh (near Leh?) from where fuel is being supplied to forward areas. All that is needed are the coordinates.

Why they had to show it beats me.....

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 22 Sep 2020 14:37

Paul wrote:On Newschannels they were showing the Oil Depot in Ladakh (near Leh?) from where fuel is being supplied to forward areas. All that is needed are the coordinates.

Why they had to show it beats me.....

Who knows how many Rajeev Sharma's and 2008 type MOU with CCP are there.

nam · Post by **nam** » 22 Sep 2020 16:17

As expected, Chinis have been brushing up old runways in Tibet and Xinjang and modernise it. Their lack of PLAAF jets, can be easily rectified with building more runways and ALG, with field support setup.

This means PLAAF will not be restricted by low fighter numbers. They add five more ALG type airbases, they can deploy 5-7 sqd more.

It is time we come out of slumber and increase fighter numbers. More LCA FOC, Taiwanese M2K, Mig29 etc.

But then our obsession and money is towards getting 36 more of "Plan A"

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 22 Sep 2020 16:29

Crouching tiger (biskoot) and hidden dragon (chai) strategy is at work. Unfortunately for the Chinese no one in the universe can beat our babus in that game.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 22 Sep 2020 16:32

Zhou en Lai lulled us into complacency for 5 years before October 1962. Compared to that time PRC's diplomatic preparations seem amateurish and puerile.

Looking back 2013 was best time to strike us as our WWR reserves were down, preparations incomplete etc. They studied Modi ji in detail and thought they could manage him on their terms. More so as they saw how the US had treated him. In contrast Modiji made multiple trips to PRC as CM of Gujarat and he was treated well.

Diplomatic preparations incomplete, Misreading Modi ji, etc. it appears PRC non military preparations are woefully lacking this time.

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 22 Sep 2020 16:48

Read out from the talks -

Friction areas
PLA wanted IA to disengage and move back first. IA said no you guys made the first move, my security was threatened, you move back first... However, the talks then shifted to the roadmap.

Roadmap to drawdown
Majority of the meeting focused on updating the old roadmap to de-induction/drawdown that was pulled together in the last set of meetings. IA asked for PLA IRBMs in Aksai Chin to be withdrawn.

More meetings planned by IA/PLA at 3* level to finalise the detailed roadmap.

This will just drag on until Xi decides to reduce the temperature. It serves his purpose.

RajaRudra · Post by **RajaRudra** » 22 Sep 2020 17:02

shyamd wrote:Read out from the talks -

Friction areas
PLA wanted IA to disengage and move back first. IA said no you guys made the first move, my security was threatened, you move back first... However, the talks then shifted to the roadmap.

Roadmap to drawdown
Majority of the meeting focused on updating the old roadmap to de-induction/drawdown that was pulled together in the last set of meetings. IA asked for PLA IRBMs in Aksai Chin to be withdrawn.

More meetings planned by IA/PLA at 3* level to finalise the detailed roadmap.

This will just drag on until Xi decides to reduce the temperature. It serves his purpose.

Hoping we will not be climbing down from the newly occupied heights as it can give tactical advantage of observing the Chenese side and also denying the same advantage over our area to chenese.

rpartha · Post by **rpartha** » 22 Sep 2020 17:27

nam wrote:As expected, Chinis have been brushing up old runways in Tibet and Xinjang and modernise it. Their lack of PLAAF jets, can be easily rectified with building more runways and ALG, with field support setup.

This means PLAAF will not be restricted by low fighter numbers. They add five more ALG type airbases, they can deploy 5-7 sqd more.

It is time we come out of slumber and increase fighter numbers. More LCA FOC, Taiwanese M2K, Mig29 etc.

But then our obsession and money is towards getting 36 more of "Plan A"

I think IA wants the numbers but more than that they want specific fighters.. if they are not getting it then they are ready to wait... even in the current flare up, I havent heard any back door or rumours talk about how IAF is suffering due to lack of fighters.. from the word go they are to take it up... which means atleast for my eyes - they are ok with the current numbers for both front.. yes more the merrier...

samirdiw · Post by **samirdiw** » 22 Sep 2020 17:46

Guess with the winter setting in, if they want to teach us a lesson they will do it now. If they want to grab land and push us off the mountains they will do it in April. Gives us 6 months to prepare. What can be done during this period since road construction cannot possibly continue?

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 22 Sep 2020 18:14

India-China faceoff: Worst-case scenario becoming 'new normal' in eastern Ladakh?

...
The divergences are plentiful. From preposterous Chinese requests for the Indian Army and ITBP to move its bases westward from Finger 4 at Pangong Tso to refusing to even discuss the Depsang standoff, to no acknowledgement of failure to adhere to promises made in earlier rounds of talks, the Chinese have all but made it clear that the five-point consensus arrived at by the two foreign ministers earlier this month meant little by way of forward movement on the ground.

On the Depsang issue, which China has simply refused to engage on, India Today TV recently reported on China's duplicitous mobilisation in this sector just weeks after the first-ever Major General-level talks were held between both sides in that sector.
...

China has also openly demonstrated it has no intention to move positions back in any substantial measure. It has instead used the time spent in talks to bolster logistics and infrastructure in aid of these positions, from road heads to supply lines to optic fibre cables.

As anyone in the military will tell you, there is nothing more permanent than an investment in infrastructure. If the worst-case endgame was a change in the status quo, then that is precisely what the Chinese are now attempting to utilise the meandering passage of time to achieve.

A growing view is that the rhythmic equilibrium of a 'tense calm' has merely favoured China in achieving its designs in creating more facts on the ground.
...

This may have been an early miscalculation by the Indian side and explains why the Indian Army finally took matters into its own hands only late in August and began preempting Chinese movements instead of merely reacting to them. China's open fury at the time confirms this, and India has taken close note.

It's also one of the reasons why the Indian Army expanded the campaign to access heights, codenamed Operation Snow Leopard, and impose reactions from the Chinese side. The multiple rounds of firing between August 29 and September 8 were a result of China's disbelief that the Indian military had left its historic defensive posture behind and adopted a far more aggressive bent. There is reason to believe that this preemptive posture will continue in scale and regularity going forward.
...
...

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 22 Sep 2020 18:28

RajaRudra wrote: Hoping we will not be climbing down from the newly occupied heights as it can give tactical advantage of observing the Chenese side and also denying the same advantage over our area to chenese.

In some areas both IA and PLA will reduce manpower due to logistic/sustainment reasons during winter. If twitter is to be believed, since yesterday (temperatures have reduced) PLA has started reducing manpower in some hills/features. Overall, IA/IAF will not let their guard down.

The question in the war rooms is if Ladakh is a distraction for something else in the eastern location.. Eastern side is better logistically for PLA due to proximity to cities like Lhasa, Kunming etc.

IA/IAF can interdict G219 supplies due to terrain/geography. Highway is only maybe 60 miles from the border.

Vips · Post by **Vips** » 22 Sep 2020 18:30

Video shows Chinese soldiers crying as they allegedly head to Sino-Indian border.

As tensions continue to simmer on the Sino-Indian border, a video surfaced on Sunday (Sept. 20) showing People's Liberation Army (PLA) soldiers crying as they are allegedly deployed to the border.

On Sunday, Pakistani comedian Zaid Hamid uploaded a video showing several PLA recruits crying on a bus as they are allegedly "transferred to Ladakh Border to face Indian Army." Hamid then wrote that China's one-child policy is "seriously hurting the motivation level of our Chinese brothers." He then added, "We Pakistani support you China. Stay Brave." Although Pakistan is an ally of China, Hamid appeared to be poking fun at the tender, green recruits.

The footage was originally posted on the WeChat page of Fuyang City Weekly, but it was soon deleted. The original post shows 10 fresh recruits from Fuyang City's Yingzhou District in China's Anhui Province.

All of the new troops were reportedly college students, and five of them had "proactively volunteered to serve in Tibet," which borders the Ladakh region where the bloody Galwan Valley skirmish took place in June of this year. The video was reportedly filmed at the Fuyang Railway Station as they prepared to head to a military camp in Hebei Province.

In the video, the soldiers can be seen sobbing hysterically as they struggle to sing the words to the PLA song "Green Flowers in the Army" (軍中綠花). A Chinese netizen who goes by the handle @waynescene reposted the video on Sunday and wrote "They were told that they would be going to the front lines after they got on the bus. The cannon fodder are crying!"

See the video in the link.

nam · Post by **nam** » 22 Sep 2020 19:25

I think the Chinis want us to announce first that we are withdrawing.. and chinis will say, their troops will move out for winter but will continue to patrol or something like that... probably dragging it towards winter to find the right excuse.

Want the cake and eat it as well. We are not ready to give the face saver.. Even a announcement from our side that both have ,moved from the position would mean a loss of face.

RajaRudra · Post by **RajaRudra** » 22 Sep 2020 19:55

Leaving aside the economic trouble, China is creating trouble in LAC and also Taiwan.

Any one could be a diversionary to conceal the other thing. Or they had started it but not sure how to finish it without fight and save face.
Either way, there must be a cost for this. At least some advantageous heights should be in the hands of IA 24/7 even after the disengagement happens(if at all)

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 22 Sep 2020 19:59

Cheena is inscrutable but evenb within CPC, things are hardly homogeneous.

Am sure they're multiple factions within CPC all jostling for this or that.

I doubt opening so many fronts at once is a well thought out strategy. More like left hand not working what right is doing and spome factions here and there fishing in troubled waters have led to this situ today.

Anyway, endgame for any Indo-cheena war is xi demitting office at the end of it. ELse, we'll have an amoral, monstrous regime nursing a grudge against us forever. The only acceptable end to any war with cheena for anybody (unkil, Roos, Japan, us) is change of guard in zhongnanhai.

RajaRudra · Post by **RajaRudra** » 22 Sep 2020 20:42

Yeah..but who ever manages to overthrow Xi will be more authoritarian than xi himself. Some how we need to come out of the previous treaties with CCP. I am hoping China making some more rash and not so friendly moves all over the world to create the environment.

There should be diplomatic cost for this Chinese game, may be an embassy in Taiwan could be the cost(out 1914 treaty is still with them, not with CCP) along with Tibet

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 22 Sep 2020 20:49

Hari Seldon wrote:
Anyway, endgame for any Indo-cheena war is xi demitting office at the end of it. ELse, we'll have an amoral, monstrous regime nursing a grudge against us forever. The only acceptable end to any war with cheena for anybody (unkil, Roos, Japan, us) is change of guard in zhongnanhai.

If India does go to war, then just a change of guard is not enough; it is not worth the human costs.

There needs to be a change in the political system. No more one party rule.
The Great Firewall needs to end and greater freedom of expression

In terms of the 21st century, China plays a very big role, to be left without integrating intellectually with the rest of the world.

So there will be support across the board for political change.

The question is whether within China there are people who can make it happen?

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 22 Sep 2020 21:13

Vips wrote:Video shows Chinese soldiers crying as they allegedly head to Sino-Indian border.

...
See the video in the link.

This is just trolling/Pys ops, the original video is something completely different, allegedly soldiers crying harder than rudalies because they are about to retire from the PLA. The clip is now being used with a different headline to troll the chicomms - which is all good and fun, but I hope we don't start believing the BS that we ourselves came up with.

RajaRudra · Post by **RajaRudra** » 22 Sep 2020 21:20

VikramS wrote:
Hari Seldon wrote:
Anyway, endgame for any Indo-cheena war is xi demitting office at the end of it. ELse, we'll have an amoral, monstrous regime nursing a grudge against us forever. The only acceptable end to any war with cheena for anybody (unkil, Roos, Japan, us) is change of guard in zhongnanhai.
If India does go to war, then just a change of guard is not enough; it is not worth the human costs.

There needs to be a change in the political system. No more one party rule.
The Great Firewall needs to end and greater freedom of expression

In terms of the 21st century, China plays a very big role, to be left without integrating intellectually with the rest of the world.

So there will be support across the board for political change.

The question is whether within China there are people who can make it happen?

If a short border war, then Aksai Chin is fair play.

In a proper full scale war, then china should no more be having any border with India. Tibet should be independent with the region near Manasarover fully under India.

And if war is forced on us when we not fully prepared, even then, our war, should not be for changing the political structure in china, should at least aim for stalemate with some little gains.

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 22 Sep 2020 21:25

^^^
A protracted civil war is probably the best case outcome for us (of course at this point its just a wet dream for us).

BTW there is some news floating around that there might be a Joint statement released, I have low hopes (of us not compromising).

rpartha · Post by **rpartha** » 22 Sep 2020 21:56

nam wrote:I think the Chinis want us to announce first that we are withdrawing.. and chinis will say, their troops will move out for winter but will continue to patrol or something like that... probably dragging it towards winter to find the right excuse.

Want the cake and eat it as well. We are not ready to give the face saver.. Even a announcement from our side that both have ,moved from the position would mean a loss of face.

Agree. I think this is what Cheeni wants.. in fact when I was reading some US articles couple of weeks back (not able to find the link still looking) someone from intelligence was quoted that it has become a ego issue now (atleast from that person perspective)... let's see how it turns out..

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 22 Sep 2020 22:10

abhik wrote:
Vips wrote:Video shows Chinese soldiers crying as they allegedly head to Sino-Indian border.

See the video in the link.
This is just trolling/Pys ops, the original video is something completely different, allegedly soldiers crying harder than rudalies because they are about to retire from the PLA. The clip is now being used with a different headline to troll the chicomms - which is all good and fun, but I hope we don't start believing the BS that we ourselves came up with.

retire !! at the ripe old age of 20 or 22 after serving 30 years in army !! wah wah kya logic hai bhai saheb.