India-US relations: News and Discussions IV

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 11 Oct 2020 07:24

Thakur_B wrote:Barring the initial panic in first 2-3 weeks, I have been using ISI marked N-95 masks since lockdown began.

Exactly. There is no shortage nowadays

Zynda · Post by **Zynda** » 11 Oct 2020 11:08

Totally OT, but AFAIK, among Indian manufacturers, Venus & Magnum respirators are genuine NIOSH N95 certified masks. The rest of them claiming to be N95 are misrepresenting the truth. KN-95 is supposedly Chinese equivalent of N95 standard.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 11 Oct 2020 19:55

N99 offering based on ATIRA provided fabric is also in the mix. I believe that couple more companies have come up apart from Venus and Magnum. Swasa is one to compete in KN-95 regime which I believe may be Korean standard and not chinese.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 11 Oct 2020 20:47

vimal wrote:I could get 2 made in China N95 in India after scouring multiple Pharmacies, where did these million come from?

Like many other products coming from India, the sale of N95 masks to the US brings hard forex in USD. Those N95 masks may have been sold for nearly $2M. Or it was traded for other health equipment such as RT-PCR machines which can analyze thousands of samples at once.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 11 Oct 2020 21:09

The wholesale prices are around $1 a piece and consumer retail around $3 a piece. Certainly there's an opportunity to recover some cost involved for ramping up the capacity. Hopefully, govts issue nudges overtly/covertly to buy non chinese as first preference.

Raveen · Post by **Raveen** » 12 Oct 2020 02:24

Zynda wrote:Totally OT, but AFAIK, among Indian manufacturers, Venus & Magnum respirators are genuine NIOSH N95 certified masks. The rest of them claiming to be N95 are misrepresenting the truth. KN-95 is supposedly Chinese equivalent of N95 standard.

KN-95 is much more lenient versus the N-95 and is not NIOSH

Thakur_B · Post by **Thakur_B** » 12 Oct 2020 07:35

India uses EU standards. Indian and EU standard equivalent to American N95 is FFP1-S. Venus and Honeywell are selling masks with BIS certification. Plenty of other quality manufactureres like 3M also exporting masks from India.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 15 Oct 2020 03:34

Not sure if this was cataloged before.

INDIA’S DEMOCRACY UNDER HINDU FUNDAMENTALISTS:
THE QUESTION OF MINORITY CONDITION
Shaukat Abbas
Lieutenant Colonel, Army, Pakistan
MMAS, University of Balochistan, Quetta, Pakistan, 2009
Submitted in partial fulfillment of the
requirements for the degree of
MASTER OF ARTS IN SECURITY STUDIES
(CIVIL-MILITARY RELATIONS)
from the
NAVAL POSTGRADUATE SCHOOL
December 2018
Approved by: Anshu N. Chatterjee
Co-Advisor
Carolyn C. Halladay
Co-Advisor
Afshon P. Ostovar
Associate Chair for Research
Department of National Security Affairs

https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/AD1069794.pdf

Senior Lecturer
Expertise: South Asia, Insurgencies, Public Sphere, Civil Society

Dr. Anshu N. Chatterjee teaches political economy and developments in South Asia. She received her Ph.D. from University of California, Berkeley in 2003. Her current research examines the development of protest groups in relation to identity politics and state-society relations in disturbed regions in South Asia. Her past research includes globalization and civil society, specifically political parties, and the media. She has also worked as a journalist in India.

Mollick.R · Post by **Mollick.R** » 15 Oct 2020 17:14

Back in 1992, Joe Biden made sure that India does not get access to cryogenic tech for its space programme
by Akshay Narang, October 2020

The Democratic US Presidential candidate Joe Biden wants us to believe that he is a close friend of India. Is he? A 1992 Los Angeles Times report suggests otherwise. Back then, Joe Biden turned out to be the biggest saboteur of India’s ambitious space programme. In the 1990s, India was looking to get the Cryogenic technology from the Russian Space Agency, Glavkosmos, at $250 million, which would have played an important role in missions involving heavy satellites going deeper into Space.

However, the US Senate Foreign Relations Committee imposed a condition on the $24 billion international assistance that the US was providing to Moscow. The Senate Committee voted to block further American aid to Russia if Moscow went ahead with the $250 million deal with India. The man who moved the amendment in US aid to Russia was Joe Biden himself. Russia, which was passing through a deep economic crisis, following the Soviet breakup at the time, had to comply with the US Senate’s amendment.

Joe Biden pulled back India’s Space programme by several years if not decades. He had even called Indo-Russia agreement for the supply of two cryogenic engines to India ‘dangerous’. Biden had then said, “I am confident that the Russian leaders will recognize the wisdom of stopping this sale once they see the risk of losing their economic aid.” He had added, “this is no minor sale; this is dangerous.

https://tfipost.com/2020/10/back-in-199 ... programme/

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 15 Oct 2020 19:36

Yesterday, a group called Muslim Advocates hosted a fundraiser for Biden.
https://www.muslimsmakingchange.org/

The details of the meeting are not out yet, and unlikely the ADM would report about it. However the organizers are dubious and most likely targeted India in the meeting. Kamala Harris sister was in it, Maya Harris who is a SJW.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 19 Oct 2020 23:47

No one in US would have hurt sentiments of islamists. India is par for anything.

Watch: Antifa anti-Trump protesters spread Hinduphobia, eat US President’s heart in symbolic ritual while chanting ‘Kali Maa’
https://www.opindia.com/2020/10/antifa- ... nduphobia/

Tanaji · Post by **Tanaji** » 20 Oct 2020 12:11

darshan wrote:No one in US would have hurt sentiments of islamists. India is par for anything.

Watch: Antifa anti-Trump protesters spread Hinduphobia, eat US President’s heart in symbolic ritual while chanting ‘Kali Maa’
https://www.opindia.com/2020/10/antifa- ... nduphobia/

I think it is more a re-enactment of Indiana Jones and temple of doom movie’s Amrish Puri scene than anything else.

Yes, that movie itself was hurtful.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 23 Oct 2020 18:19

Watched the Trump-Biden debate last night. It was quite disappointing to see Trump say filthy China, Russia, India in a casual manner just to get back at Biden. There are already those who are saying is this the guy we did Namaste Trump and Howdy Mody with and using this utterance to criticise the Govt.

To those, I would say the Govt engaged strongly with GOTUS, despite any misgivings they had with the person Trump currently occupying that position. We made these efforts to further the relationship after coldly calculating the benefits of doing this, and accounting for Trump's eventual mis-pronouncements. It doesnt really matter if Trump wants photo-opps with Putin, Kim or some other dictator. Our needs are ours and India doesnt need to be woke about it. We havent made a trade deal with the US, and will not, despite jamboree events and bear hugs, unless the terms do not compromise India's interests.

So lets attribute the "filth" remark to Trump being Trump (kanakapu simhasanamuna... and all that) and not loose sleep about it

KL Dubey · Post by **KL Dubey** » 23 Oct 2020 19:02

Cyrano wrote:Watched the Trump-Biden debate last night. It was quite disappointing to see Trump say filthy China, Russia, India in a casual manner just to get back at Biden. There are already those who are saying is this the guy we did Namaste Trump and Howdy Mody with and using this utterance to criticise the Govt.

To those, I would say the Govt engaged strongly with GOTUS, despite any misgivings they had with the person Trump currently occupying that position. We made these efforts to further the relationship after coldly calculating the benefits of doing this, and accounting for Trump's eventual mis-pronouncements. It doesnt really matter if Trump wants photo-opps with Putin, Kim or some other dictator. Our needs are ours and India doesnt need to be woke about it. We havent made a trade deal with the US, and will not, despite jamboree events and bear hugs, unless the terms do not compromise India's interests.

So lets attribute the "filth" remark to Trump being Trump (kanakapu simhasanamuna... and all that) and not loose sleep about it

I agree. Trump has done a lot of good work, but many of the actions and policies over the last year - as well as his generally intemperate nature - has begun to anger a lot of the 'good guys' in addition to the 'bad guys'. This, and the COVID mess, will hurt him in the election.

As far as India is concerned, I think a level-headed approach to either Joe or Trump would continue to work. I think the China threat will continue to unite India, US, the Quad, etc.

Whoever wins, looking ahead to 2024 I think Pompeo would be a strong candidate. The man seems level-headed, not impulsive, and certainly keen to partner with India.

Regarding the 2020 election: things have shaken out quite a bit. Most of the states have chosen their side. At this point, Trump will be relying on his "silent voter base" to get him through the toss-up states.

Instead of getting confused by national polls and other stuff, just watch the following six states: AZ, FL, GA, NC, OH, PA. Trump MUST win in ALL of these states. Lose any one of them, and Joe will get to "sleep in" at the white house.

saip · Post by **saip** » 23 Oct 2020 20:26

What has Trump done for India? Increased Tariffs on Indian goods, removed the GSP status, restricted H1 Visas (mostly Indians affected), poked his nose into Kashmir by imagining a request from Modi, made fun of Modi's accent at every opportunity and now calls India filthy. But we still love Trump. Said would Punish Pakistan because it is lying thieving country, but never did and even sent some military aid free of cost. How srong our relations are with USA, depend on us and US (not USA) alone.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 23 Oct 2020 20:30

Trump has shut up about article 370 and anti CAA riots, been verbally against China, he has not blocked any arms sales etc. Sure he plays to his audience, and ha made statements words but overall there has been no anti India action in the last 4 years. He has also kept shut on FCRA crackdown. Overall he is no great friend but has not been an enemy of India. He does not pander to the Paki crowd.

chola · Post by **chola** » 23 Oct 2020 20:42

Trump has been fairly good for India though not for Indians.

But he has been a complete disaster for the USA. And will not win a second term. I say this as someone who voted for him.

You cannot overstate the damage he has done in allowing the chini virus to take hold and run rampant in the US. Except for the demographic of older white men, there is no other that will vote for him.

India has to be ready for a Democratic President and, because of the trainwreck Trump has wreaked on the GOP, a Democratic House and Senate as well.

saip · Post by **saip** » 23 Oct 2020 20:46

All that may be true, but all the steps Trump has taken have hurt India financially (at personal level my taxes went up because of his 'Tax cut'). In 2016 I too was fooled by him. As they say sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me. Again it is India that has to be strong and it does not matter who is in the white house or black house.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 23 Oct 2020 21:19

I think this thread needs to start looking ahead. Trump/Biden will not run in 2024, so who are the candidates to watch on both sides? We should begin to track 3-5 people from each party and see how talk about India.

KL Dubey · Post by **KL Dubey** » 23 Oct 2020 23:59

KJo wrote:I think this thread needs to start looking ahead. Trump/Biden will not run in 2024, so who are the candidates to watch on both sides? We should begin to track 3-5 people from each party and see how talk about India.

See below, with India-specific ratings:

Donkeys: Harris (terrible), Obama (terrible), Warren (could be OK...desi daamaad in tow), Gabbard (could be good)

Elephants: Pence (ho-hum), Pompeo (not bad), Haley (could be OK), Jindal (terrible)

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 24 Oct 2020 00:54

I'm not sure why people continue to think US foreign policy towards India will be hostage to the personal views of whoever is the president. Past experiences do not bear this out. Trump's record has been mixed as pointed out by people earlier, his personal rapport with Modi notwithstanding. The records of Obama, GWB and Clinton were mixed as well. You have to go back to Nixon to find a US president who truly hated India and his actions bore that out. That too had the element of people like Kissinger enabling him and egging him on with the anti-soviet cold war sentiments towering over anything in the Nixon admin, including basic humanity.

Whoever the president is, you have to keep in mind that the only thing that matters is if the interests of India and the US converge or diverge. Do not expect blanket support or opposition in anything regardless of who the president is. Also, Indian ethnicity of a politician will have little positive effect on US-India relations. He/She cannot appear to favor India due to their heritage, lest that be used by their political opponents (and it will). It might actually have a negative impact if they try too hard to prove their MUTUness and impartiality. We have examples galore.

One good thing is that China's belligerent attitude in the SCS seems to have both the US State Department and DoD concerned. That is unlikely to change regardless of who's in power next year and in that aspect at least our interests will converge for now. But they may not in other places like AFG.

vimal · Post by **vimal** » 24 Oct 2020 01:28

It's not easy to separate politics and Indo-US relations. Our weak MEA has given up all the space to Paki handlers.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 24 Oct 2020 01:36

What is our MEA supposed to do about this? This is internal US politics. Does not affect India one bit.

vimal · Post by **vimal** » 24 Oct 2020 01:42

nachiket wrote:What is our MEA supposed to do about this? This is internal US politics. Does not affect India one bit.

?? Internal US politics? Is that wy RSS, BJP, HSS are all named in that poster/
There are Paki handlers pushing this narrative sucessfully for decades now. The least our foreign office mandarin can do is to take some offensive and create pressure groups. How do you think pakis survive after all the damage they've done to US for so long.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 24 Oct 2020 01:45

A More Prosperous Future for the Indian American Community: Op Ed by Vice President Biden

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 24 Oct 2020 01:50

chola wrote:India has to be ready for a Democratic President and, because of the trainwreck Trump has wreaked on the GOP, a Democratic House and Senate as well.

+1. Barring miracles, the three wings will be led by a Democratic majority. There are too many people in need of help at the moment, and a divided government helps no one.

KL Dubey · Post by **KL Dubey** » 24 Oct 2020 04:42

Amber G. wrote:A More Prosperous Future for the Indian American Community: Op Ed by Vice President Biden

That is a very good op-ed. I wonder who wrote it ? As long as Joe did skim and approve it after awaking fresh from a snooze, one can't complain too much.

KL Dubey · Post by **KL Dubey** » 24 Oct 2020 04:49

vimal wrote:
nachiket wrote:What is our MEA supposed to do about this? This is internal US politics. Does not affect India one bit.
?? Internal US politics? Is that wy RSS, BJP, HSS are all named in that poster/
There are Paki handlers pushing this narrative sucessfully for decades now. The least our foreign office mandarin can do is to take some offensive and create pressure groups. How do you think pakis survive after all the damage they've done to US for so long.

If you are Indian, write and submit a comment/suggestion to the MEA.

KL Dubey · Post by **KL Dubey** » 24 Oct 2020 04:53

vera_k wrote:
chola wrote:India has to be ready for a Democratic President and, because of the trainwreck Trump has wreaked on the GOP, a Democratic House and Senate as well.
+1. Barring miracles, the three wings will be led by a Democratic majority. There are too many people in need of help at the moment, and a divided government helps no one.

I don't think there is any great preparation required. Most of the agreements and plans teed up with the Trump administration seem like they would continue in the next administration. It's about $$$, global security, and the chinese threat. The rest is mostly noise which will raise people's BP here but won't affect the substantive aspects of India-US relations.

Instead of being reactive, we should be saying "Joe and Kamala better be prepared to deal with Modi and Shah". The latter are the people who we care about/matter to us, the other guys are just revolving-door characters.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 24 Oct 2020 06:37

vimal wrote:
nachiket wrote:What is our MEA supposed to do about this? This is internal US politics. Does not affect India one bit.
?? Internal US politics? Is that wy RSS, BJP, HSS are all named in that poster/
There are Paki handlers pushing this narrative sucessfully for decades now. The least our foreign office mandarin can do is to take some offensive and create pressure groups. How do you think pakis survive after all the damage they've done to US for so long.

And I see an Indian American US House candidate countering that. Let's repost/retweet her and add our own voices (if we are interested). There is no reason for GOI to get involved. Should the US Sec State make an official statement every time some commie in India says that US is the great satan or some such nonsense? Neither the RSS nor the BJP is affected because of this. The people making those posters do not have any effect on voters in India.

mappunni · Post by **mappunni** » 24 Oct 2020 09:33

Today, I got an email from an ID South Asians Vote 2020 which I found in the spam folder

And all those who get it please report it as Spam!

The email I guess is nothing but another ISI fronted organization with no website. The email has a link to a Vimeo Video with an introduction from the musician Jay Sean (never heard of him), followed by a flashy video on why "South Asians" must vote for Biden and how "South Asians" can flip key states.

Looks like ISI is going to the max extent to swing "South Asians" vote for DemoCraps.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 24 Oct 2020 12:43

The US budget for FY2021 has not been approved. There is a Continuing Resolution (CR) until 11 Dec 2020. If Biden wins in November, expect another CR until the 3rd week of Jan 2021. This will ensure the Dems have control over the purse strings of government when they control two branches of the US government. By Jan 2021, budgets of foreign assistance will be put to grant TSP terrorists aid on the order of $300-$400 million of dollars in 2021. This is where aid was in 2015 and planned for 2016, but 2016 was a contentious election year and the Obama administration deferred that aid to TSP to avoid looking bad. This is the first immediate litmus test of India-US relations a new administration which I am watching very closely. It will have direct implications on the death of Indian civilians, police, BSF and IA.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 Oct 2020 13:39

we need to be careful about why the current US administration is pushing India so very hard to sign defence agreements when the election results are only weeks away.

what if trump doesn't get to come back and we get legally boxed in because we hastily signed some stupid agreement with the old trump administration and the new biden dispensation walks everything back by putting quite the new spin on things and leaving us alone and bare assed to cope with china on our own while the biden gang starts to make nice with xi.

we are not going to lose anything of significance if we wait a while to see how things pan out for us.

but we may lose some supporters in the international arena if we do sign hastily leaving us bereft of protections in the security council.

nandakumar · Post by **nandakumar** » 24 Oct 2020 14:22

chetak wrote:we need to be careful about why the current US administration is pushing India so very hard to sign defence agreements when the election results are only weeks away.

what if trump doesn't get to come back and we get legally boxed in because we hastily signed some stupid agreement with the old trump administration and the new biden dispensation walks everything back by putting quite the new spin on things and leaving us alone and bare assed to cope with china on our own while the biden gang starts to make nice with xi.

we are not going to lose anything of significance if we wait a while to see how things pan out for us.

but we may lose some supporters in the international arena if we do sign hastily leaving us bereft of protections in the security council.

All agreements are agreements until it is repudiated. There are no guarantees in bilateral arrangements. Even if Trump wins another term and we go ahead and sign the BECA, what if there is a new dispensation in 2024? India's problems with China are not going to go away any time soon. We would then be where we are today.

sanjayc · Post by **sanjayc** » 24 Oct 2020 14:33

mappunni wrote:Today, I got an email from an ID South Asians Vote 2020 which I found in the spam folder And all those who get it please report it as Spam!

The email I guess is nothing but another ISI fronted organization with no website. The email has a link to a Vimeo Video with an introduction from the musician Jay Sean (never heard of him), followed by a flashy video on why "South Asians" must vote for Biden and how "South Asians" can flip key states.

Looks like ISI is going to the max extent to swing "South Asians" vote for DemoCraps.

So ISI is rooting for Democrats, while American Hindus are also rooting for Democrats. Since both have diametrically opposite interests, one of these two parties cannot think straight about which side its bread is buttered, and suffers from brain fog. Not difficult to understand which one.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 24 Oct 2020 19:04

It's not only various types of aid to pukes but looking away from various terrorist activities like havala funding will also affect India. Bipartisan support for India is only for Indians to slow chinese down and doesn't translate to stopping islamists. Democrats have openly stated goals in regards to islamists and also the support base for such goals. Any furtherance of islamic goals has direct ramification for India.

Ambar · Post by **Ambar** » 24 Oct 2020 19:48

chetak wrote:we need to be careful about why the current US administration is pushing India so very hard to sign defence agreements when the election results are only weeks away.

what if trump doesn't get to come back and we get legally boxed in because we hastily signed some stupid agreement with the old trump administration and the new biden dispensation walks everything back by putting quite the new spin on things and leaving us alone and bare assed to cope with china on our own while the biden gang starts to make nice with xi.

we are not going to lose anything of significance if we wait a while to see how things pan out for us.

but we may lose some supporters in the international arena if we do sign hastily leaving us bereft of protections in the security council.

Even at the height of US' power, pakis being pakis never shied away from signing treaties - be it the Baghdad pact or the South East asian treaty. In turn the pakis extracted millions of dollars worth weapons, armaments, training, food, oil etc from uncle sam without ever having to contribute a single soldier. So really there is nothing that US can do to box us in these agreements, besides all of the new agreements are China centric .

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 24 Oct 2020 19:50

Ambar wrote:
chetak wrote:we need to be careful about why the current US administration is pushing India so very hard to sign defence agreements when the election results are only weeks away.

what if trump doesn't get to come back and we get legally boxed in because we hastily signed some stupid agreement with the old trump administration and the new biden dispensation walks everything back by putting quite the new spin on things and leaving us alone and bare assed to cope with china on our own while the biden gang starts to make nice with xi.

we are not going to lose anything of significance if we wait a while to see how things pan out for us.

but we may lose some supporters in the international arena if we do sign hastily leaving us bereft of protections in the security council.
Even at the height of US' power, pakis being pakis never shied away from signing treaties - be it the Baghdad pact or the South East asian treaty. In turn the pakis extracted millions of dollars worth weapons, armaments, training, food, oil etc from uncle sam without ever having to contribute a single soldier. So really there is nothing that US can do to box us in these agreements, besides all of the new agreements are China centric .

undeclared sanctions and spares embargo.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 24 Oct 2020 20:19

US bureaucracy will continue to have people with anti India and anti Hindu mindset. Once you add in pro pakistani administration to the mix and problems would prop up on a regular basis. Few days ago I had posted an example of how anti India bureaucracy is introduced at various military affilliated education centers in US. islamists constantly beat their drum to continue to brainwash people. Many from these education centers move on with a mindset that Hindus and India should not have weapons, that they'll proliferate, etc. And, I have personally run into many with such mindset with active roles that have ability to make meaningful decisions. Imagine walking into a presentation where DRDO and ISRO were being portrayed as tomorrow's proliferators and how US needs to build capabilities to counter such threats. Majority of the audience was involved in various decision making processes at this presentation. Now take those same people heading into voting booths and being greeted by anti Hindu organizations with various posters. Brainwashed actors within bureaucracy.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 24 Oct 2020 22:52

saip wrote: (at personal level my taxes went up because of his 'Tax cut'). In 2016 I too was fooled by him.

Since we are talking personal level things, my taxes did go down. Coastal experience may be different from Midwest.