Wuhan Coronavirus Resource Thread

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 04 Dec 2020 14:19

^^^ For more details about the Manu Praksah's (Prakash Labs) see the news story (recent) in the link I ..
posted above.

Yes, there are *many* innovation - many very impressive from many places.
What drew my attention was Manu Prakash and his group (which is very good, world renowned etc) with past successes in very low cost and successful medical devices....

With Covid - this lab has produced/help_produce/designed other things like masks, PPE type equipments, ventilators etc.. with various kind of successes.

For details see, for example http://web.stanford.edu/group/prakash-l ... e/covid19/
(worth reading).

***
For me quite impressive has been IITK team which started after the challenge of Covid and within months now resulted into *actually* manufacturing/providing/distributing 5,000,000 PPE's and masks *per* day. A year ago, virtually all N95 masks and PPE were being imported in India.. Now there are few hundred companies (all started with using that plan producing hundreds of thousands per day... (And these masks are worn by our PM, and even film stars).
There are similar stories about ventilators and many other innovations..

Team work (even among Indian and US scientists) during this time has been really impressive.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 04 Dec 2020 14:30

@chola - In Ohio, more than 1/3 (and in rural place about 1/2) of all IUC beds are occupied by covid patients..and it is a real emergency (like many other places) as the hospitals are getting full. Some parts have declared lock-downs...(100% of ICU beds in Massachusetts’ northeast region are full, according to the state department of public health.)

(Meanwhile our governor is being impeached because he is asking for masks

)

In other news - few days ago Scott Atlas finally resigned - in sheer number of lives, he is one of the most destructive, deadly policy advisors in recent American history - A person who will live in infamy .) Vivek Murthy is going to get the top job in Biden admin with Fauci as critical adviser etc.. But we still have at least few *very* dark months.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 04 Dec 2020 14:52

^^^Today I am also going to attend IIT2020 meet..will be interesting to listen to Modi, Vivek Murthy..I am sure Covid will be one of the top item..

DavidD · Post by **DavidD** » 04 Dec 2020 16:06

disha wrote:
brar_w wrote: ...That's enough for just around 22 million people and does not even fully cover healthcare workers and seniors residing in nursing homes. Assuming some inefficiencies in actually vaccinating people (as opposed to having doses in hand) we are probably going to have to wait till the spring or possibly later to get vaccinated...
That is where a rapid antibody test kit would have helped. If you already have antibodies, why would you need a vaccine? Frontline or not?

Also, look at data on case rates. I pick up NY and CA since they are large states on opposite ends of the coast. Both with some reliable data and high population densities and both have dense to very dense urban clusters and counties where population density is very low.

The total positives in NY so far are ~650k. And 1.2 million in CA. So between NY and CA if 2 million additional are vaccinated, and only those who have not contracted coronavirus in the past, what is the effect on transmitivity? Does it not slow down the spread?

Take a look at NY data again. The CFR in the under 19 population is 0.1%. So give vaccinations first to people over 50 and the categories of spreaders. If both CA and NY do not have data on which categories of professions or people are spreaders and super-spreaders in the last 9 months then shame on the administrators of the state!

Case loads have been too high for any effective contact tracing, so no, there is no data on which segment of people are superapreaders, only data on which groups are the most vulnerable to catch and/or die from the infection.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 04 Dec 2020 16:13

We have been hearing about vaccine efficiency, is there any data yet on how long the vaccine efficiency lasts ? Or is it too early to tell ?

DavidD · Post by **DavidD** » 04 Dec 2020 16:19

Cyrano wrote:We have been hearing about vaccine efficiency, is there any data yet on how long the vaccine efficiency lasts ? Or is it too early to tell ?

Not yet, too soon for that.

Primus · Post by **Primus** » 04 Dec 2020 19:48

^^

According to Paul Offit (who is the guy that developed the rotavirus vaccine and is on the FDA committee for COVID vaccines), he believes that the virus will not mutate and shift genetically as much as influenza does, more like how measles behaves. Therefore the vaccine should provide immunity for a 'fairly long' time. He has stated that he will take the vaccine (Pfizer or Moderna) but he wants to look at all the data first. This was in a podcast just before the Pfizer data actually came out (i.e. about four weeks ago).

Our local hospital has already sent out a policy and is preparing to start vaccinations as soon as it comes in. You can bet I will be the first in line.

brar_w · Post by **brar_w** » 04 Dec 2020 20:47

Cyrano wrote:We have been hearing about vaccine efficiency, is there any data yet on how long the vaccine efficiency lasts ? Or is it too early to tell ?

Still very early days and more needs to be done to ascertain this, but the preliminary data seems to point to about 3-months (at least).

Researchers at the National Institute for Allergies and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), which co-developed the drug, studied the immune response of 34 adult participants, young and old, from the first stage of a clinical trial.

Writing in the New England Journal of Medicine, they said that the antibodies, which stop the SARS-CoV-2 virus from invading human cells, "declined slightly over time, as expected, but they remained elevated in all participants 3 months after the booster vaccinatio ..

LINK

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 04 Dec 2020 20:58

Primus wrote:^^

According to Paul Offit (who is the guy that developed the rotavirus vaccine and is on the FDA committee for COVID vaccines), he believes that the virus will not mutate and shift genetically as much as influenza does, more like how measles behaves. Therefore the vaccine should provide immunity for a 'fairly long' time. He has stated that he will take the vaccine (Pfizer or Moderna) but he wants to look at all the data first. This was in a podcast just before the Pfizer data actually came out (i.e. about four weeks ago).

Our local hospital has already sent out a policy and is preparing to start vaccinations as soon as it comes in. You can bet I will be the first in line.

Few days ago, when Fauci was asked this, answer was similar - it probably is fairly long (order of years) but even if one has to take a booster shot after 2-3 years - one can cross that bridge later.
All the people I know (doctors) are ready to take it.. (Results - more one looks at data - are impressive - intersting part is, eg for Moderna, no one, it seems got seriously sick)

Dr. Vivek Murthy (Biden admin's covid-task force leader) will be speaking a few hours from now, I am sure this question will be asked.

brar_w · Post by **brar_w** » 04 Dec 2020 21:05

From a global health and immunization perspective, after the initial few billion or so doses are delivered (across all vaccines) then the industrial capacity to deliver long term should be easy to manage so even if one needs to take another shot say 6 months out because cases/risk is climbing then I think the supply chain for most of these big pharmaceutical and vaccine producers can handle that. I think by mid 2022 they should be able to catch up to that after the initial doses are supplied for first-time vaccinations.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 04 Dec 2020 21:53

FWIW - Posting a very informative video - about 1 hour - how to beat a pandemic by Manu - details about some of the work done by scientists.
(For those who are interested in technical informations)
https://youtu.be/YQRcXXfNWwE

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 04 Dec 2020 22:50

IIT2020 Meet: Vivek Murthy is speaking / panel discussing right now - quite impressive. I hope this is covered by mainstream media. (Q&A are really good).
Narendra Modi's speech was pretty nice.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 05 Dec 2020 03:45

brar_w wrote:
[url...=https://www.npr.org/sections/coronaviru ... -on-camera]Obama, Bush, Clinton Say They're Willing To Get Coronavirus Vaccine On Camera[/url]

I think this is a good move. I think influential figures across the spectrum of society should follow suit.

Biden and KD Harris also need to get the vaccine. They are the ones who sowed doubt about the efficacy when they politicized by saying that "Trump is trying to push the vaccine to come out before the elections".

Whether Trump takes it or not is irrelevant now. He will be out on Jan 20, 2021 anyways.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 05 Dec 2020 08:21

Vayutuvan wrote:
disha wrote:... we desis have the propensity to drop in all these four-letter universities like IITs, Stanfords, MITs ... hollow'ed institutions.
"Institutions don't make people. People make institutions" --- anonymous

Following my own post with a reference for the quote:

Sheila Khama, Director of the Africa Natural Resources Center at African Development Bank, states: “institutions don’t make people, people make institutions” (Khama)

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 05 Dec 2020 08:26

Yayavar wrote:There has been news of saliva test since August.FDA approved it. It was in news in ToI as well.
...
Perhaps the stanford team has some modificaiton.

My alma mater developed and had been administering a saliva test for ~50K students/facutly/university staff starting the Fall Semester 2020. It is being developed into a home test. As of now the test costs $10 per test. With economies of scale of value mfg. and self-administration, I expect the costs to be ~$2, much lower than the Stanford test (a little less than $5, IIRC).

Stanford/MIT or Ivy Leagues are not the only game in town

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 05 Dec 2020 10:16

Vayutuvan wrote:
Yayavar wrote:There has been news of saliva test since August.FDA approved it. It was in news in ToI as well.
...
Perhaps the stanford team has some modificaiton.
My alma mater developed and had been administering a saliva test for ~50K students/facutly/university staff starting the Fall Semester 2020. It is being developed into a home test. As of now the test costs $10 per test. With economies of scale of value mfg. and self-administration, I expect the costs to be ~$2, much lower than the Stanford test (a little less than $5, IIRC).

Stanford/MIT or Ivy Leagues are not the only game in town

I think there is a point being missed here --and it is *very* important .. let me explain--
For example Manu Prakash's saliva test (and other "innovations") is/are NOT "competition" of one institute/country/company vs other. . Fact is all of these are open source with all 100% designs/ideas are free to be shared, other institutes/countries/industry are free to use/improve/suggest_improvement. This is how the cost has come down. .. for example, the saliva test, is already in "use" (varying degrees) in *many* countries, of course, some locally modified/adapted etc.. (There are no patents / designs are on google docs free to be shared etc - even peer reviewed papers etc are freely available etc) (Please do see the youtube video I posted above, it talks about this in detail)

This is a big change which covid has brought in *many* places. People are not waiting to get "credit", rush to publish or patent etc.

The same story is with many Indian Institutes.. I know about some of the IIT efforts because of the people I know but the contribution has come (and come generously and surprising very fast) from all kinds of institutes/people/doctors/industry_experts/people_in_government). India's babudom (DST) etc, instead of being an obstacle, has in many case being very helpful. This has also worked in cases when a) somebody gets a good idea b) It is brought to some prof's attention, (s)he uses his/her network to get right people involved, provide, and/or get some mentorship seed money etc .. I do know some of the innovative "things" have come from anything but Ivy/IIT type names but it did not stop established institutes to help them. (Actually GoI's DST played a key role, IMO to become a nice conduit to enable this).

This is good. Hope this last even after this pandemic is over.

srikandan · Post by **srikandan** » 05 Dec 2020 10:22

I think we can trust the world to return to its money-grubbing patent-lawsuit flinging ways once the immediate danger of the virus is done for. Competition and money will take priority once there is no looming threat of a pandemic. Let's enjoy all this charade of loving and caring for humanity while it lasts.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 05 Dec 2020 16:05

https://www.zdnet.com/article/mit-machi ... -vaccines/
Vaccines may not be as effective in blacks & Asians as in whites
MIT machine learning models find gaps in coverage by Moderna, Pfizer, other Warp Speed COVID-19 vaccines

In the report this summer, Gifford and team had warned that not using enough different parts of the virus could leave gaps in population coverage. That is because humans have different "alleles," versions of genes, in what's called the major histocompatibility complex, the area of the human genome that encodes the cell-surface receptors that are supposed to match the viral peptides. Some alleles produce cell receptors that will bind more or less reliably to some viral peptides.

In the present study, Gifford and team built upon that study to show that the vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer and AstraZeneca have exactly the weakness that the researchers had predicted in their computer modeling.

All the vaccines are using the same bits of the virus, the so-called Spike protein, or S protein, and a special area of the Spike protein, called the Receptor Binding Domain, or RBD. "All reported current efforts for COVID-19 vaccine design that are part of the United States Government's Operation Warp Speed use variants of the spike subunit of SARS-CoV-2 to induce immune memory," Gifford and team write.

That focus on a limited number of viral peptides becomes a common weakness in the vaccines, they argue. "We find that proposed SARS-CoV-2 subunit vaccines exhibit population coverage gaps in their ability to generate a robust number of predicted peptide-HLA hits in every individual." HLAs is the technical term for the cell surface receptors that bind with the peptides.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 05 Dec 2020 16:15

paper says US vaccines may not be equally effective on Asians as it doesn't have all the virus parts, diff race reacts to virus parts differently. Missing parts may not yield optimum result. In which case a full but inactivated virus should do the trick. Hence India should wait for Bharat Biotech COVAXIN which is inactivated complete virus ^^

srai · Post by **srai** » 05 Dec 2020 18:06

chola wrote:
saip wrote:Now I am hearing that funeral homes are getting overwhelmed in the USA because of the COVID19. Hope, like everything, this too will pass.

Worldometer reported :

218,576 new cases and 2,918 new deaths yesterday on Dec. 3.

That's following
206,073 new cases and 2,873 new deaths
on Dec. 2.

The vaccine cannot come fast enough.

US is a disaster:

200,000+ new cases daily
~3,000 deaths daily (equal to deaths in 9/11 everyday)
285,000+ deaths
100,000+ hospitalization

Winter months and holiday travel seasons
Hospitals at capacity & rationing care
Healthcare workers overwhelmed
COVID-19 fatigue in public
Even basic safety like mask wearing politicized
200,000+ more deaths forecasted by April

Vaccines won’t be available for the majority until second half of 2021. Long way to go!

chola · Post by **chola** » 05 Dec 2020 23:39

IndraD wrote:paper says US vaccines may not be equally effective on Asians as it doesn't have all the virus parts, diff race reacts to virus parts differently. Missing parts may not yield optimum result. In which case a full but inactivated virus should do the trick. Hence India should wait for Bharat Biotech COVAXIN which is inactivated complete virus ^^

We are mostly caucasians with pretty much the same genetic markers as white Americans. So if they mean "Asian" in the American sense (not the British one) then the virus should work on Indians but not the chini-types which is usually what "Asian" in American context refers to.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 06 Dec 2020 00:21

200,000+ more deaths forecasted by April

..
Yes, some models (reputable) show, *unless we change* this could be more than 0.5 Million (around 5,200,000 in USA)
(*edited typo later) deaths. Too many Trump worshipers are still anti-maskers and anti-science which put everyone at risk. Since this is global pandemic the whole world is going to suffer. I just heard Kevin Rudd (Australia's ex-PM) speaking in PanIIT2020 conference (global leaders including PM Modi, Vivek Murthy were some of the speakers and key focus, is of course, pandemic) was quite frank and brutal - he literally called Trump's this policy "Dumb".

Now if we (*all* of us) start using common sense precautions, like wearing masks, and getting vaccines when available etc, things may change. I am optimistic with Biden's new admin - Fauci will now be listened too - People like Vivek Murthy will lead etc... but many dark days are still ahead before admin change.

Vivek Murthy's talk yesterday was awesome but challenges are great. He seems extremely smart, modest and a decent person.

But time will tell, how long it will take before we start listening to science again.

Meanwhile - PLEASE stay safe.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 06 Dec 2020 00:27

IndraD wrote:paper says US vaccines may not be equally effective on Asians as it doesn't have all the virus parts, diff race reacts to virus parts differently. Missing parts may not yield optimum result. In which case a full but inactivated virus should do the trick. Hence India should wait for Bharat Biotech COVAXIN which is inactivated complete virus ^^

If one looks at the data, even for Asians, (fairly smaller total sample) the efficacy is greater than 90%.. (For perspective anything > 70% , as Fauci once said, would have been called extremely successful).
Another point - which people point out - that efficacy is very high especially for "serious disease".. Actually they found it amazing that for Moderna *none* was found to get serious case (worth of hospitalization) of sickness.

srin · Post by **srin** » 06 Dec 2020 00:43

IndraD wrote:paper says US vaccines may not be equally effective on Asians as it doesn't have all the virus parts, diff race reacts to virus parts differently. Missing parts may not yield optimum result. In which case a full but inactivated virus should do the trick. Hence India should wait for Bharat Biotech COVAXIN which is inactivated complete virus ^^

Aren't vaccine trials being conducted in India also ?

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 06 Dec 2020 00:52

^^^ There are many (about 7 in final stages) trials are going in India.

Rishi_Tri · Post by **Rishi_Tri** » 06 Dec 2020 00:54

Amber G. wrote:
200,000+ more deaths forecasted by April
..
Yes, some models (reputable) show, *unless we change* this could be more than 5 Million deaths. Too many Trump worshipers are still anti-maskers and anti-science which put everyone at risk. Since this is global pandemic the whole world is going to suffer. I just heard Kevin Rudd (Australia's ex-PM) speaking in PanIIT2020 conference (global leaders including PM Modi, Vivek Murthy were some of the speakers and key focus, is of course, pandemic) was quite frank and brutal - he literally called Trump's this policy "Dumb".

Now if we (*all* of us) start using common sense precautions, like wearing masks, and getting vaccines when available etc, things may change. I am optimistic with Biden's new admin - Fauci will now be listened too - People like Vivek Murthy will lead etc... but many dark days are still ahead before admin change.

Vivek Murthy's talk yesterday was awesome but challenges are great. He seems extremely smart, modest and a decent person.

But time will tell, how long it will take before we start listening to science again.

Meanwhile - PLEASE stay safe.

You should really tone down Trump related rhetoric. We are talking about a Pandemic and not an Individual.

As to masks: You should start following mask wearing pattern in India. Many people have given up wearing masks across the country and for many weeks. Are the cases, deaths rising? No. They are falling. In fact, cases are down 65-70% from the peak and peak was when people were hunkering down and wearing anything / everything that they could.

People should really track and investigate: Why cases / deaths are rising fast across the Western World especially USA? Wearing a mask or not wearing a mask does not totally explain it.

srin · Post by **srin** » 06 Dec 2020 01:05

Amber G. wrote:^^^ There are many (about 7 in final stages) trials are going in India.

Precisely, so we will know the efficacy on Indian population.

srai · Post by **srai** » 06 Dec 2020 01:20

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 06 Dec 2020 03:09

Amber G. wrote:
200,000+ more deaths forecasted by April
..
Yes, some models (reputable) show, *unless we change* this could be more than 5 Million deaths.

Is this projection for the US alone, or for the world?

If it is for the US, that would imply (with a population of 330 million) an Infection Fatality Rate (not a Case Fatality Rate) of >1.5% in the general population, assuming every single person in the US gets infected. Seems like a very extreme projection, right now the CFR is around 1%, with the IFR probably being 1/10th of that.

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 06 Dec 2020 03:10

srai wrote:

Could you also post the source?

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 06 Dec 2020 03:24

sudarshan wrote:
Amber G. wrote:..
Yes, some models (reputable) show, *unless we change* this could be more than 5 Million deaths < this is a typo - should have been 0.5) .
Is this projection for the US alone, or for the world?

If it is for the US, that would imply (with a population of 330 million) an Infection Fatality Rate (not a Case Fatality Rate) of >1.5% in the general population, assuming every single person in the US gets infected. Seems like a very extreme projection, right now the CFR is around 1%, with the IFR probably being 1/10th of that.

Sorry there was a typo (I corrected it) it should be 0.5 Million (= about 520,000 ). Your figures for CFR are thus correct.
(These figures, of course, can be improved and hopefully will be better in real life - if US just starts imposing strict mask rules - some states are doing it - and of course massive vaccinations etc..)

sudarshan · Post by **sudarshan** » 06 Dec 2020 03:32

^ OK thanks, just checking.

srai · Post by **srai** » 06 Dec 2020 04:40

sudarshan wrote:...

Could you also post the source?

https://www.gannawarra.vic.gov.au/News- ... f-COVID-19

Primus · Post by **Primus** » 06 Dec 2020 09:02

I've repeatedly asked all those who are blaming the US deaths on Trump why some European countries have higher number of cases and death rates and why India has such low numbers despite the enormous difficulties it faces in terms of population density, lack of resources, religious gatherings etc.

There does not seem to be a rational explanation. It is disingenuous to blame one individual for all the misery in a democracy.

Initially the recommendations from the CDC and Fauci were NOT for masks to be worn, it came a lot later.

Why are children under 12 far less susceptible?

This virus is more unpredictable than we realize.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 06 Dec 2020 09:35

https://medicalpressopenaccess.com/uplo ... 9_1007.pdf

https://twitter.com/Hoytster/status/1335341527925657601

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 06 Dec 2020 11:02

Scientists Investigate Whether Exposure to Earlier Coronavirus Helped Asia Fight Covid-19

doctors agree that some explanation is needed for why Japan, South Korea, China, Vietnam, Taiwan, Malaysia and Singapore all have experienced at most a few thousand new SARS-CoV-2 infections a day, even during the current surge

“There’s a theory, and I think it’s quite a strong one, that in East Asia a cold similar to the novel coronavirus spread widely and a large number of people caught it,” Dr. Suzuki said. “As a result of having immunity to a similar virus—although it isn’t bulletproof immunity—they either don’t develop it or don’t get seriously ill if they do,” he said, referring to Covid-19.

What intrigues some is the position of China as the origin not just of the current pandemic, but also of the first SARS epidemic in 2002-03 and earlier influenza epidemics. Those viruses got noticed, but others perhaps weren’t.

In a paper published online but not peer-reviewed, they said their analysis suggested East Asians started battling a coronavirus pandemic some 25,000 years ago and might have taken many millennia to conquer it.

Another paper on a genetic risk factor for severe Covid-19 that was inherited from Neanderthals found the variant was almost absent in East Asians.

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 06 Dec 2020 11:14

This is as I posted earlier. The East Asians are hardly some ultra competent people that the suppressed this virulent disease through efficiency. An inspection of the bush meat markets outside of Beijing will demonstrate their efficiency.

I use bush meat advisedly. Why reserve that essentially racist term for Africa. Chinese are same same shame shame.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 06 Dec 2020 12:26

Rishi_Tri wrote:...
As to masks: You should start following mask wearing pattern in India. Many people have given up wearing masks across the country and for many weeks. Are the cases, deaths rising? No. They are falling. In fact, cases are down 65-70% from the peak and peak was when people were hunkering down and wearing anything / everything that they could.

People should really track and investigate: Why cases / deaths are rising fast across the Western World especially USA? Wearing a mask or not wearing a mask does not totally explain it.

Mask wearing in many places across India is sporadic including the recent "farmers" protest around NCR. Eventually we're all going to get covid, but can we manage to hold out until next spring when the vaccine becomes available in significant numbers.

I really think the Ayurvedic medicines are reducing the viral load as seen with my relatives in central India:

1. On 10/11, BIL got covid, by 18/11 he was recovering. BIL's wife was covid confirmed on 19/11 and is recovering well, children age 6 and 20 months were exposed to both parents, but showed symptoms of typical viral infection seen in India and recovered 20/11. Interestingly enough, they were being cared by my MIL age 75, but she did not get covid. BIL is age 40 and his wife is 35.
2. On 18/11, my 80 year old FIL was covid confirmed, and has recovered on 01/12. Today 06/12 he has come out of self isolation and is doing well. He's walking on roof terrace. He typically walks 5+ Km per day and does extensive house work as MIL is frail.
3. In another household 2 Km away, SIL 52 yr old and her 24 yr old daughter covid confirmed. Both are recovered and have resumed normal activities.

Manas · Post by **Manas** » 06 Dec 2020 12:32

Rishi_Tri wrote:
Amber G. wrote:..
Modi, Vivek Murthy were some of the speakers and key focus, is of course, pandemic) was quite frank and brutal - he literally called Trump's this policy "Dumb".

Now if we (*all* of us) start using common sense precautions, like wearing masks, and getting vaccines when available etc, things may change. I am optimistic with Biden's new admin - Fauci will now be listened too - People like Vivek Murthy will lead etc... but many dark days are still ahead before admin change.

Vivek Murthy's talk yesterday was awesome but challenges are great. He seems extremely smart, modest and a decent person.

You should really tone down Trump related rhetoric. We are talking about a Pandemic and not an Individual.

Couldnt agree more. Most COVID posts by Amber seem to focus on anti-Trump political attacks. While Trump has a lot of personality flaws and has not set a good example himself wearing a mask consistently - what this reflexive Trump haters seem to forget is that

1. Dr. Fauci that is so admired by the anti-Trump crowd who is supposedly a world renowned immunologist and infectious disease specialist said masks dont work for a good 6 weeks. The cop out excuse when he changed the tune was "we wanted to save supplies for medical workers". At that time regular citizens couldnt buy masks even if they wanted to. All Dr. Fauci and the CDC could have said was wear "improvised face coverings" and they could have put out any number of public service ads demonstrating how to make improvised face coverings.

2. Once masks were officially "encouraged" by the CDC and Dr. Fauci all of COVID task force members have been consistently calling for the use of masks.

3. In a state like California which never really removed any of the restrictions on indoor dining since the beginning of the pandemic and had opened up personal grooming services for barely 2 months before once again shutting down the state - the case rates have remained quite steady through the summer with barely a few dips and now clocking almost 25K cases a day ! This in a state where the residents are supposed to be this govt fearing, science following disciplined lot. The last I checked Trump lost CA by more than 4M votes - so surely the people of the state are not Trump followers and science deniers.

Even Japan is clocking 5K cases a day now (a country, culture known for courteous mask wearing even in a regular flu season for decades).

Trump, Biden, Fauci or the duplicitous democratic mayors and governors who preach "lockdowns" for the masses but violate it themselves - in a free country/democracy that are not culturally oriented towards following govt diktats, no govt can force it citizens to wearing masks.

Mort Walker · Post by **Mort Walker** » 06 Dec 2020 12:49

^^^Exactly. In India, the ministry of Health and Welfare put out instructions on how to improvise masks. How to stitch or staple cloth. Lots of good info on YouTube and other places. This was pretty easy for the CDC and NIH to do. I had access to masks leftover from when SARS was going on a few years back and was using them since I travel by air roughly every 4-6 weeks. East Asia were using masks from the beginning.