2021 Strategic and Political Analysis-1

[Adrija]

I realize that a lot of us strongly feel that BJP’s behaviour w NS has been a let down. But FWIW let us stop a minute to consider

1. “Sabka sath, sabka vikas, sabka vishwaas” is NOT appeasement but in our national interest. We cannot afford to not attempt to bring equally into the mainstream ~ 16% of our population which has deliberately been kept backward and in the grip of mullahs and for affecting demographic change. Progress and prosperity has meant – howsoever slowly- for the muslim women fertility levels to start showing decline as well. Granted, it is still uncomfortably much higher than for rest but the only solution is faster rates of education and economic welfare, not shutting them out.

2. That is what NaMo has been doing, but reversing 70 years of appeasement and Indian muslims being held hostage to mullahs takes time to reverse. And the mullahs precisely and accurately know what is happening- hence their vested interest in hijacking that journey. But from our side let’s stay the course folks

3. In that journey, there are red lines by which mango Abdul and Ayesha get hijacked and play into the mullah's game of wresting back control of this segment. That is also in the context of heavy propaganda about “islam khatre me hai”. NS crossed that red line, and offered them a handle to (falsely) hijack the entire conversation, promote heavy social unrest and derail the India story. In that, the BIF are all aligned- NO ONE, repeat NO ONE, in the world wants to see India prosper, and they are all united in trying to bring this government down. Any opportunity to see India burn will be seized globally with both hands. The fact that it is not happened so far and India has remained strong and getting stronger has been in spite of daily and heavy attempts- think we in BRF at least can all agree to that

4. They of course regularly cross ours and abuse our gods and get away with it. Is that fair- NO. But life is not fair… the only course there is for us to – as a society- do social and economic boycott of these elements and pursue all levers of law. Slow and unsatisfactory, yes… but we have no choice

5. For all talk of promoting a “harder Hindu” party- let ‘s please consider for just a minute that BJP today get ~ 35% voting. Assuming India to be say ~ 70% hindu, and assuming- fair based on recent news- that no non-Hindu votes for BJP inspite of all the benefits and welfare, that means that perhaps not even half of Hindus vote for BJP. Is that a fair time to start splitting our votes from the one party which has both national and cultural interests?

6. Till when are we at risk culturally and till when do we need to be cautious? IMVVHO, we risk annihilation as a society and culture if this journey gets derailed till such time we have at least three generations of children brought up in having samskrut as their second language and hence are proficient and familiar with our ancient heritage- that will mean that we have for now managed to preserve it for future posterity and done our duty

Thanks and apologies for the long post

[Nihat]

Adrija ji. Tend to agree with you regarding the larger picture. Sometimes, we need to retreat from a battle to win the war.

The line of thinking is changing albeit very slowly, this line of thought comes around from deep conversations with my relatives in azamgarh (but perhaps that is OT).

The government of the day is not perfect and nor can it ever be but its the best we've had in a get long time. Competitive federalism, non appeasement and economic equality are the Pillars on which this change will stand. Our overarching focus on social faultlines and welfare in 70 years has got us here. It'll take a long long time to stabilize, so let's be patient.

And as for the reaction of Arab nations. These good for nothing camel riders can go take a hike. Once energy independence becomes a global trend and that has never been more obvious than now, they will be shown their place in the world because no matter how much they attempt to modernize, they can never compete with the cultural modernity of the west and hence can never hope to replicate their allure.

[Tanaji]

Adrija-bhau,

Your whole argument is predicated on the assumption that “Sabka saath…” will bring prosperity to Indian Muslims which in turn will cause a change in their behaviour vis a vis Hindus or at the very least contribute more towards Indian ness than the global Ummah. Nowhere in the world has prosperity been shown to bring such a change in that population. Therefore what is the basis for this optimism?

[Adrija]

Tanaji bhau, my only assumption is that prosperity will bring a reduction in the TFR of the muslims and a deeper stake in continued economic prosperity and hence bias towards stability. That is also evidenced by recent trends in India

For the rest- change in behaviour towards the kufr- I am not hopeful as there is no evidence. But with TFR declining to replacement levels (or even below as is the trend for other communities in India) at least we can then live in reasonably stable equilibrium and that is progress enough

Will the muslims ever hold their Indian identity above that of their global ummah? I am not sure if that will ever happen, there has been no such evidence at all

And I am not even holding by breadth for the decline in the money flows to the MiddleEast and hence consequent reduction in their importance globally. Even if we get large scale movement away from oil for energy requirements (say by nuclear and others), we cannot do away w petrochem... so the importance of the petrostates will endure

[Maria]

I realize that a lot of us strongly feel that BJP’s behaviour w NS has been a let down. But FWIW let us stop a minute to consider

1. “Sabka sath, sabka vikas, sabka vishwaas” is NOT appeasement but in our national interest. We cannot afford to not attempt to bring equally into the mainstream ~ 16% of our population which has deliberately been kept backward and in the grip of mullahs and for affecting demographic change. Progress and prosperity has meant – howsoever slowly- for the muslim women fertility levels to start showing decline as well. Granted, it is still uncomfortably much higher than for rest but the only solution is faster rates of education and economic welfare, not shutting them out.

2. That is what NaMo has been doing, but reversing 70 years of appeasement and Indian muslims being held hostage to mullahs takes time to reverse. And the mullahs precisely and accurately know what is happening- hence their vested interest in hijacking that journey. But from our side let’s stay the course folks

3. In that journey, there are red lines by which mango Abdul and Ayesha get hijacked and play into the mullah's game of wresting back control of this segment. That is also in the context of heavy propaganda about “islam khatre me hai”. NS crossed that red line, and offered them a handle to (falsely) hijack the entire conversation, promote heavy social unrest and derail the India story. In that, the BIF are all aligned- NO ONE, repeat NO ONE, in the world wants to see India prosper, and they are all united in trying to bring this government down. Any opportunity to see India burn will be seized globally with both hands. The fact that it is not happened so far and India has remained strong and getting stronger has been in spite of daily and heavy attempts- think we in BRF at least can all agree to that

4. They of course regularly cross ours and abuse our gods and get away with it. Is that fair- NO. But life is not fair… the only course there is for us to – as a society- do social and economic boycott of these elements and pursue all levers of law. Slow and unsatisfactory, yes… but we have no choice

5. For all talk of promoting a “harder Hindu” party- let ‘s please consider for just a minute that BJP today get ~ 35% voting. Assuming India to be say ~ 70% hindu, and assuming- fair based on recent news- that no non-Hindu votes for BJP inspite of all the benefits and welfare, that means that perhaps not even half of Hindus vote for BJP. Is that a fair time to start splitting our votes from the one party which has both national and cultural interests?

6. Till when are we at risk culturally and till when do we need to be cautious? IMVVHO, we risk annihilation as a society and culture if this journey gets derailed till such time we have at least three generations of children brought up in having samskrut as their second language and hence are proficient and familiar with our ancient heritage- that will mean that we have for now managed to preserve it for future posterity and done our duty

Thanks and apologies for the long post

Thank you for the post Adrija ji, this is like Day 3 and I feel more calmer after heavy bouts of Yoga.

I completely agree with all your points except Point number 4. We too need our rage boys when our Red Lines are crossed or when sh@t hits the pankha.

D

[vijayk]

Whatsapp ...

Why was it so difficult for Bharat to retaliate against Qatar IMMEDIATELY after it opened diplomatic campaign against PM Modi's Bharat after Nupur Sharma Case?

Let me give you deep insights.
It was not that tiny Qatar acted on its own but it was a pissed off "Uncle Sam" who fired the shot from Qatar's Shoulders.
PM Modi showed US the Middle Finger and bought Russian oil (which helped in easing prices of fuel a bit) ,didn't sanction Russia and EAM Jaishankar was roasting Europe on their own soil.

This wasn't taken lightly by Washington DC.
Bharat stopped Export of Sugar followed by Export ban on Wheat.

After we stopped exporting Wheat citing domestic reasons there were serious concerns exhibited by IMF.

(What was real purpose?... answer in a seperate thread)
In March 22, Victoria Nuland, an career diplomat of 32 years & widely believed to be mastermind behind Feb 2014 Ukraine Regime change was in Bharat & that wasn't definitely a coincidence. She is last resort for Deep State whenever it wants to throw any country in Anarchy.
In short, PM Modi showed spine to stand against Deep State & it's Masters...."Oil, Pharma & Arms Lobby"

This is SUPPOSED to be a grave crime.

So why did US choose Qatar to fire bullet?
Because Doha (Qatar) isn't Just a Nobody!!!

Is it because Bharat is dependent on Qatar for Liquid Natural Gas (we import 41% of total imported LNG from Qatar)???

NO!!!
Bharat NEEDED Doha in Afghanistan. And Americans knew that.

Remember, in Aug 2021, Ambassador of Bharat to Qatar, Deepak Mittal, met Sher Mohammad Abbas Stanekzai, the Head of Taliban’s Political Office in Doha just after Taliban taking over Afghanistan.
There are two factions in Afghan Taliban.
One is controlled by Pakistan and the other by Doha. But Qatar has much deeper pockets.

And this Qatar is controlled and protected by the Americans.
Now notice the timing of Qatar blowing Nupur Sharma Issue out of proportion.

MEA Joint Secretary J.P. Singh led Bharat's Delegation met Senior Taliban Ministers in KABUL (Afghanistan) on 2 June 22.
You have to be "Too Innocent" to think that it was to discuss Humanitarian Aid to Afghanistan (as was said).

So....What's there to worry about in this for Qatar?
Bharat engaging DIRECTLY with Taliban has not sent shivers down the spine Only for Qatar, But for US too who was engaging with Taliban till day with meetings held in Qatar. Bharat bypassing Qatar was Warning to BOTH.

That's why, Shot was fired by US from Qatar's Shoulders
I know that you won't still believe me. Let me remind you one more COINCIDENCE.

US has criticised Bharat in a recent report on "Religious Freedom". When was the report released?....3 June 22.

Just 1 day after Bharat holding meeting with Taliban.
When did Qatar start Barking against Bharat?....4 June 22.

1 day after US started barking.

Now, you have to be completely insane to believe that these connections aren't anything more than Coincidence.
Why did Saudi, UAE, Oman, Jordan join Chorus with Qatar inspite of being Great Friends with Bharat?

It's their compulsion of being part of I$£amic World. Mind you....there is a constant race among these Nations to prove who is Real Leader of OIC.
Qatar taking lead in "Protection of I$£am" is detrimental to Saudi who is holding this position since ages & Saudi can't afford it's ADVERSARY Qatar to take lead as it will Bolden Kuwait also against Saudi.
For Saudi & it's Allies, It's not a stand against PM Modi's Bharat as a policy/religious matter, but....Out of Compulsion.

Now again back to same question. Why does PM Modi's Bharat NEED these "Good Weather Friends"?

In interest of Larger Picture!!
Just a few days back Imran Khan Niyazi was on record saying Pakistan is about to disintegrate. Probably just fear mongering for domestic reasons, but "IF" an oppurtunity(Created/Grabbed) presents...
Bharat will need support from OIC.

I won't say Anything Louder than this.
Do remember that it's not Pakistan which is real enemy of Bharat. It's CHINA!!

To counter China's expansion plans like OBOR..Bharat is developing a shortest Trade Route via Saudi, UAE,Oman,Jordan,Israel,Cyprus & Greece.

PM Modi can't afford to send this in disarray.
Having given all connections, let me conclude by saying that...

It wasn't Qatar which acted on it's own volition but I strongly believe it was compelled.
After all, they too know they need Bharat for food security.

They have ONLY Oil & Gas....Bharat has EVERYTHING Else
The Americans were waiting to have a go at us & we tripped thanks to Irresponsible Statements by Nupur Sharma.

Always remember, "Timing is Important EVEN WHILE saying some TRUTH"!!!
Geo Politics and Geo Strategy ain't as simple & easy as it appears.

The Matrix is complex & Dynamics in a Constant Flux.

The top bosses in New Delhi know their job. No need to teach International Politics & Hindutva to PM Modi Ji,NSA Ajit Doval Sir & EAM Jaishankar Ji.
And...THEY have already started. Just Yesterday,Bharat started placing orders with Rosneft DOUBLING Russian Oil Imports.
Direct Loss to Gulf Countries.

I won't be surprised if Bharat starts getting reconciliation signals from Gulf as early as from Today/Tomorrow itself.

Special thanks to tweeter handle @mumbaichadon Bhiku Mhatre.

[Cyrano]

Just connecting some dots doesn't always give an intelligible or useful result. And doesn't explain what sky would have fallen if BJP did nothing.

[Ambar]

..we continue to fish for complicated answers for simple questions. Rationalizing every weakness and every mistake is a sure way of never correcting oneself. Wonder why these things never seem apply to China or Israel or even the tiny Singapore (remember the US teen Michael Fay case). I'll continue to look for 56DD moves for "strategic restraint" when within the last 24 hrs a drone carrying IEDs entered Kashmir, 2 LeT terrorists have been killed and the army says more are entering each day. All the while Al Jazeera, The Wire, The Caravan and every two-bit propaganda outlet gives islamists fire cover and we go on elaborating why the government is helpless against them.

Just couple of things 1. Europe's 30+ yrs of "sabka saath sabka vikas" experiment through immigration, training, welfarism, jobs for muslims have failed spectacularly, and an average European country has per capita GDP 15x to 20x that of India. 2. Weakness is never the answer. That's why a hostel fees increase protests and rioting by JNU/DU/Jamia soon morphed into anti-CAA riots which turned into Shaheenbagh, and later the same emboldened people lay siege to Delhi on four sides during farmer bill protests.

[Hari Seldon]

Modi sarkar was less than ruthless with BIF. Results are showing now. One can always say that its hard to overcome a BIF-cong ecosystem built over decades, but where there's a will there's a way and when it comes to the tools a govt has, multiple ways to go after BIF networks, org, funds, key personnel and collaborators (amongst the alleged 3rd & 4th pillars, and assorted 5th columns).

The examples of how heavy the hand of a pawar is in Mumbai is instructive. Same with jihadidi and Stalin in their states. Will is needed for a full majority sarkar, organs of the state will fall in line. That will is missing. A dirty tricks dept needed in lotus - a pramod mahajan type needed perhaps.

[vijayk]

Modi sarkar was less than ruthless with BIF. Results are showing now. One can always say that its hard to overcome a BIF-cong ecosystem built over decades, but where there's a will there's a way and when it comes to the tools a govt has, multiple ways to go after BIF networks, org, funds, key personnel and collaborators (amongst the alleged 3rd & 4th pillars, and assorted 5th columns).

The examples of how heavy the hand of a pawar is in Mumbai is instructive. Same with jihadidi and Stalin in their states. Will is needed for a full majority sarkar, organs of the state will fall in line. That will is missing. A dirty tricks dept needed in lotus - a pramod mahajan type needed perhaps.

100% agree ... That's where Yogiji is different. Probably they were focussing on economy and wanted to fix bank frauds, currency manipulation

[Adrija]

Ambar ji,

I agree with your views and am not trying to "explain away" BJP's actions. And fully accept that one can explain away pretty much anything, at some point one has to stand the ground

FWIW, I personally think the GoI did tell Qatar et al to go take a hike (please check the response to the OIC), and that the suspension was driven more by domestic considerations as I have mentioned above.

I also understand that it is easy to fall in the trap of rationalizing all actions

Are they doing all that "we" would like them to do? No, of course not.But they are not us (and I am referring to all of us here generally). But are they taking steps which are more consistent with the overall "vichardhara"? Yes of course. So we can either be angry that they are not doing 100% EXACTLY what we would like them to do, or be happy that they are doing at least (say) 60% of the agenda and keep our faith that they are the best judge of what to do when and that they will achieve the 100% even if not in the time frame we would like

Will this battle ever be over and we can declare "victory"- howsoever defined? IMVHO, never. My view as mentioned above is that we can at best hope for an uneasy coexistence but with a stable demographic balance as close as to current, as it is in Malaysia between the Chinese and Malays......... even that is good enough.

Yes, Modi sarkar is certainly less ruthless than BIF. At least publicly. But are they slowly and steadily moving in a direction that strangulates these BIFs using the due process of law. I would like to believe so. I am not asking for you to do the same blindly, call is yours

[suryag]

For all those people who claimed NS was thrown to the wolves

Nupur ji gets security cover

The GoI wasnt prepared for the comments made by Nupur ji. while managing that fallout, they have also ensured that there is no harm happens to her with security.

[Cyrano]

What a saving grace!
May be they realised if anything happens to her, a good part of captive electorate will turn away from this pseudo Hindu party.

[vimal]

Even Kamlesh Tiwari was jailed to save him! We know what happened next. It’s clear that our government has little control even inside its borders. By constantly ignoring BiF, they’ve provided them with the ability to coordinate and fine tune their toolkit which they can use at a moments notice.

[chetak]

India has made progress..................


From a foreign minister who stole silver spoons to a foreign minister who makes goras lose their appetite.

[chetak]

[chetak]

commies invent new method to augment votebanks

[Ambar]

India has made progress..................


From a foreign minister who stole silver spoons to a foreign minister who makes goras lose their appetite.

I highly doubt that story. V K Menon was many things but not a thief. As India's High Commissioner in UK he was criticized for his expensive tastes including Saville Row tailored suits and renting Rolls Royce cars for the embassy. He also spent much of his youth in Europe and was known for his intellect and articulation. We sing praises for S Jaishankar's retort, articulation and wit while putting the cocky yanks and Europeans in their place but V Krishna Menon was notorious for bare knuckled candor and intellect while dealing with the sanctimonious and preachy west. Some of his interviews are still available on youtube.

[chetak]

India has made progress..................


From a foreign minister who stole silver spoons to a foreign minister who makes goras lose their appetite.

I highly doubt that story. V K Menon was many things but not a thief. As India's High Commissioner in UK he was criticized for his expensive tastes including Saville Row tailored suits and renting Rolls Royce cars for the embassy. He also spent much of his youth in Europe and was known for his intellect and articulation. We sing praises for S Jaishankar's retort, articulation and wit while putting the cocky yanks and Europeans in their place but V Krishna Menon was notorious for bare knuckled candor and intellect while dealing with the sanctimonious and preachy west. Some of his interviews are still available on youtube.

cowschitt basu is a very staunch mafia famiglia parivaari and a diehard congi house negro.

his tweets against the sangh and Modi are frequent and always vile.

jaishankar recently said in parliament that he, jaishankar, could say in six minutes what menon had taken so many long hours to say at the UN.

menon was a gasbag and a psychopath.

[krithivas]

This is a ruse, and the reservation is for resettled illegal/dangerous Rohingya/Bangladeshi muslims.

commies invent new method to augment votebanks

[bala]

https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/ ... 503819.ece
June 07, 2022

India looks forward to joining the NSG, says External Affairs Minister Jaishankar

External Affairs Minister S. Jaishankar was speaking on the foreign policy achievements of the government

In a message aimed at China blocking India’s membership at the Nuclear Suppliers Group (NSG), External Affairs Minister S. Jaishankar on June 7, 2022 said that India looks forward to joining the NSG, overcoming “political impediments.

Mr. Jaishankar was addressing foreign diplomats in Delhi, on the foreign policy achievements of the Modi governemnt in the last eight years.

[madhu]

Schrodinger’s hadith
Posted on 10/06/2020 by scientificmiraclesmyarse
The law of hadith
1) a hadith is strong if quoted by a Muslim
2) a hadith is weak if quoted by an atheist
3) a hadith is Schrödinger’s if quoted by both a Muslim and an atheist in the same argument, depending on the observer

So apt in the current NS case...

[vijayk]

Mahua Moitra
@MahuaMoitra

So BJP spokespersons get “preventive security” for breaking the law while others get jailed under UAPA for far less.
New India. Jai Shri Ram.

Look! There were many Islamist scums along with TMC filthy scum baying for the head of Nupur along with Jihadis.

No one files a murder incitement charge against them. So they are getting emboldened and emboldened to threaten and incite murders. They are legalizing blasphemy but only for Muslims

Already Jihadi-led Mumbai Govt. filed charges on Nupur in Mumbai and Thane

I am not giving the link. But PBMehta of Indianexpress advises "don't stop with this half victory" indirectly saying Kill Nupur. He advocated riots in CAA. BJP didn't take any action. They are getting more and more violent advocates

[kit]

commies invent new method to augment votebanks

almost all of them are beedis !!

[arshyam]

We keep going in circles stating the obvious - why GoI did not do something about (fill in BIF activity of your choice). Yes, we all know and agree that GoI hasn't been ruthless. But have we paused to consider if there is some reason for this? This is clearly a nationalist govt (hopefully no one disagrees about this, otherwise we are done talking), yet they seem powerless at times. Why?

Serious Q. Not trolling.

[vimal]

arshyam, I don't think anyone except BJP can answer that question. For a party that has absolute majority for 8 years to be unable to control any pillar of democracy and being shown the middle finger by every two-bit babu seems like a strange phenomenon. It's almost seems like they don't have the requisite mental capacity for long term institutional building or wielding political power. They just lurch from one crisis to another daily.

I thing that I have slowly realized is that the RSS itself is too secular and not the type of Hindu org that we'd expect it to be. They sat out of the entire RJB movement and latched on to it much later when it became popular. Their attitude towards Gyanvyapi mosque remains the same to this day. I have to say BJP was a political movement that ran on the coattails of Hindutva much later. The roots of this party was the socialist Jan Sangh and remains the same largely to this day.

Also, with half the Congress in BJP what exactly remains of the moral compass of this party? Think for a second, Hardik Patel called Amit Shah a "Gunda" and Modi a "Feku" before joining BJP recently. Imports like Scindia and Pilot bring their Congressi roots and will slowly make it the next Congress party.

[Rudradev]

We keep going in circles stating the obvious - why GoI did not do something about (fill in BIF activity of your choice). Yes, we all know and agree that GoI hasn't been ruthless. But have we paused to consider if there is some reason for this? This is clearly a nationalist govt (hopefully no one disagrees about this, otherwise we are done talking), yet they seem powerless at times. Why?

Serious Q. Not trolling.

If the GOI does not do anything about a particular issue, that's because the issue is not their priority at the given moment. So in any given case it becomes a question of: why is Issue X not a priority for the nationalist GOI?

Possible answers (three broad categories):

1) The range of options currently available to the GOI to deal with Issue X is unsatisfactory, because the available options will not solve (and may actually exacerbate) the deeper, underlying problem of which Issue X is a manifestation. So it needs to wait until the problem as a whole can be dealt with, at the appropriate time. Example: Article 370 vs. individual incidents of stone pelting or terrorist attacks in Kashmir.

2) The range of options currently available to the GOI to deal with Issue X may include some options that could actually work. However, seen in context of GOI's many internal and external priorities, none of those workable options can be undertaken right now without incurring more costs than the price of waiting. So again, it needs to wait until a given option can be suitably applied to Issue X (or further instances of Issue X) in future. Example: no military response to Pathankot attack, but surgical strike and airstrike in response to subsequent attacks.

3) Most cynically: The GOI currently regards Issue X as not a threat but a 'useful irritant'. Issue X is something that creates a strong emotional response in BJP voters, but not strong enough that most of them would turn away from BJP (given the alternatives) because of failure to immediately address it. Yet, the pronouncements of the opposition (the Left, INC, AAP etc) about Issue X will prove more counterproductive to the opposition than to the BJP by further triggering the emotions of BJP voters. So by leaving Issue X unaddressed, BJP gets to have it both ways-- voters will be irritated but not turned off by BJP, and voters will also be strongly repelled by the antics of the opposition on Issue X. This leads to a net overall consolidation of votes in favor of BJP.

Depending on what Issue X is, GOI's calculations could be based on any one of these things at any time. Or a combination of more than one.

The important thing is: as the overall picture changes, the nature of these calculations can also change at any time. Remember the days of 2012-13, the Nirbhaya outrage, the Lok Pal agitation, the original Modi Wave, etc. If Issue X brings out vast droves of voters into the streets, GOI can (and will) revise the prioritization of their options above... because failure to do so threatens the ability to win another election.

Of course, this does not happen with 99.999% of issues that we about on BRF, Twitter, Youtube etc. Public memory is short and public attention spans are shorter. That is what social media has done to the electorate, and it will always be a factor in any political calculation-- not just the GOI's, but of every party and every government in every country.

Finally... and we must always be aware of this... there is the possibility that Issue X IS actually a priority for the GOI, and they are actively taking measures to address it. But, for reasons that we cannot and may never know, the specific measures being taken do not operate at a level that is publicly obvious or visible.

[kit]

https://twitter.com/vonbrauckmann/statu ... 6449130497

Clearly the boot of colonialism is still pressed on the throat of India.
@NupurSharmaBJP
echoed the hadith which says a 53 yr old man married a 6 yr old & had sex with her at 9. India needs to cultivate a culture of free speech, that right’s been $old to Qatar & other Islamists.

https://twitter.com/shaila_dugala/statu ... 6390035456

It is indeed hilarious … Muslims are so upset about their own true fact .. what would happen if the entire book gets openly discussed on social media !!

[arshyam]

We keep going in circles stating the obvious - why GoI did not do something about (fill in BIF activity of your choice). Yes, we all know and agree that GoI hasn't been ruthless. But have we paused to consider if there is some reason for this? This is clearly a nationalist govt (hopefully no one disagrees about this, otherwise we are done talking), yet they seem powerless at times. Why?

Serious Q. Not trolling.

If the GOI does not do anything about a particular issue, that's because the issue is not their priority at the given moment. So in any given case it becomes a question of: why is Issue X not a priority for the nationalist GOI?

Thanks RD-ji, these points summarize the situation succinctly and we on BRF should apply this framework to understand the govt's response (or lack thereof). Otherwise, we will end up with anger and emotion and high BP all the time - issues like this will keep happening, and responses may not be to our liking. At the same time, no harm in keeping the public pressure on a few areas, so the value of outrage does not diminish. We on this forum should seriously consider this when responding to the next outrage.

arshyam, I don't think anyone except BJP can answer that question. For a party that has absolute majority for 8 years to be unable to control any pillar of democracy and being shown the middle finger by every two-bit babu seems like a strange phenomenon. It's almost seems like they don't have the requisite mental capacity for long term institutional building or wielding political power. They just lurch from one crisis to another daily.

Vimal-ji, I am not too convinced of this, given the movement we have seen in 2/3 core issues and some other surprise moves like 3T, the Hijab ban, bulldozer, etc. They could have made the same excuses here too, but didn't.

I think RD-ji has summarized it well, and trying to not be cynical, I think it is a combination of his first two points, and to an extent, this (I was alluding to this when I posed the question in my previous post):

Finally... and we must always be aware of this... there is the possibility that Issue X IS actually a priority for the GOI, and they are actively taking measures to address it. But, for reasons that we cannot and may never know, the specific measures being taken do not operate at a level that is publicly obvious or visible.

I think there are points where GoI realizes the limits of its powers and so does not pick the battles that will constrain it. Tactically, it makes sense, though it is hard to digest from an emotional PoV (I too was amongst those clamouring for a lathicharge on the farmers pre, and especially post Jan 26, and was left puzzled by the non-action).

[sanjaykumar]

The lathi charge was loud in its absence.

The moral pendulum swung decidedly away from the poor farmers. The ugliness of their rage is forever captured on celluloid. The visuals were meant for those sitting on their manjis in dusty Panjab.

The statement by Sharma seems to have been innocuous- quotidian on social media, but the Quran is in a privileged position in western mainstream media. Exalted and thus not fit for rational enquiry.

The MSM has lost credibility over the decades-remember when the western democracies were in great anticipation for eight weeks on WHO would be TIME's man of the year? Nobody gives an intercourse.

[ricky_v]

We keep going in circles stating the obvious - why GoI did not do something about (fill in BIF activity of your choice). Yes, we all know and agree that GoI hasn't been ruthless. But have we paused to consider if there is some reason for this? This is clearly a nationalist govt (hopefully no one disagrees about this, otherwise we are done talking), yet they seem powerless at times. Why?

Serious Q. Not trolling.

What comes before determines what comes after, to start off it is important to understand the nature of bjp, moderator Suraj's revelatory swarajya piece where he compares it to germany's cdu party is most illuminating in this regards. I have a slightly different take on the matter, ergo that our mannerisms, thought-processes are enthralled by the aftereffects
of the independence movement and the institutions (systems such as the constitution) established during that time, which were chiefly concerned with 2 things:
1. provide welfare (establish esteem and self-respect) to a large population with limited means
2. ensure that the country does not get duped ever again
What this gave us was a mix of personality that is uniquely indian and comprises of:
- good boy indic values
- gandhian sense of taking only what is required
- hostility of outsiders' values
- a sense of social upliftment permeating all sections (in the days following independence, when aspirations and reality were non-aligned, our books, culture always took an inward view on this issue)
- normal alignment with views mentioned in the directive principles for state policy
This in combination of vasudaiva kutumbhakama, has led india to be the messiah of the poor and disenfranchised everywhere (global south), it is simply trying to govern by the directive principles which are again a legacy of pre-republicanism.
Every party tries to (or at least portrays to) outdo the other in the first aspect, but given a diverse population with zero self-control over things like religion, it becomes a difficult situation. The bjp, has stated numerous times on its goals and views, it is sabka saath, sabka vishwaas, but still people are stumped when it adheres to its values, it a genuine party in a post-modernistic ironic world which may partly explain this confusion, but it is simply following its outlook as defined by a society and customs crafted after a long fight for independence.
tl;dr the bjp is for the betterment of the indian state as defined by and adhering to the rules in the constitution of india, which may or may not be related to the hindu civilisation.

[chetak]

This is Nupur Sharma's factual condition as well as predicament today...


The incomparable RK Laxman said this in 1962, as true then, as it is today

[vijayk]

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1534 ... 17728.html

On the surface, the #BoycottIndianProducts appears to be a reaction from Arab world to the ongoing disputes in India. When we took a closer look, we saw that this is a much wider game, and the participants are almost identical to those behind the #BoycottFrenchProducts.

[vijayk]

Amit Shah should more focus on BJP organization and leave HM to someone who can focus on police reforms, intelligence, counter strategy.
BJP should have a more detailed training and co-ordinated strategy on public debates

[sajo]

Dev Fadnavis is eroding whatever support base he had garnered during this tenure as CM, or MH BJP still harbours hope of an alliance with NCP.

BJP leader and former CM Devendra Fadnavis sought action against the actor*. “The comment is unwarranted and highly derogatory for a senior leader like the NCP chief. There should be action against her… the law should take its own course.”

BJP leader and Union Minister Raosaheb Danve, too, said, “Pawar saheb is a senior leader. We don’t agree with the post and we don’t support such use of langauge.”

*Ketaki Chitale, jailed for sharing a post written by someone else on Social Media criticizing Sharad Pawar since a month now.

And now this :

"I saw the video. After watching the video, I feel in no way I or anybody from our party can support or defend such things being spoken against Prophet Muhammad", Former Maharashtra Chief Minister Devendra Fadnavis told The Indian Express

.

Is he slowly but surely turning Dhimmi or what? Will the BJP in MH be all that they accuse the Sena of being in their quest for power alliances?

[V_Raman]

PBUH is usually a no-go area for anyone. That is the rule - atleast in India. If you dont follow it - it is your fault.

[chetak]

Dev Fadnavis is eroding whatever support base he had garnered during this tenure as CM, or MH BJP still harbours hope of an alliance with NCP.

BJP leader and former CM Devendra Fadnavis sought action against the actor*. “The comment is unwarranted and highly derogatory for a senior leader like the NCP chief. There should be action against her… the law should take its own course.”

BJP leader and Union Minister Raosaheb Danve, too, said, “Pawar saheb is a senior leader. We don’t agree with the post and we don’t support such use of langauge.”

*Ketaki Chitale, jailed for sharing a post written by someone else on Social Media criticizing Sharad Pawar since a month now.

And now this :

"I saw the video. After watching the video, I feel in no way I or anybody from our party can support or defend such things being spoken against Prophet Muhammad", Former Maharashtra Chief Minister Devendra Fadnavis told The Indian Express

.

Is he slowly but surely turning Dhimmi or what? Will the BJP in MH be all that they accuse the Sena of being in their quest for power alliances?

He is just toeing the party line and keeping the BJP yardarm clear.

The sooner the BJP gets to disassociate itself from the trap that they have been sucked into, the better it will be for them for them

[vera_k]

IMO, the current laws around freedom of expression cannot be challenged long as the First Amendment exists in its current form. If someone runs into trouble, their fate may very well depend on what breakfast the judge had that day.

[chetak]

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1534 ... 17728.html

On the surface, the #BoycottIndianProducts appears to be a reaction from Arab world to the ongoing disputes in India. When we took a closer look, we saw that this is a much wider game, and the participants are almost identical to those behind the #BoycottFrenchProducts.

With one very big difference.

Quite unlike the frenchies, India is a huge resource for grain, meat and labour as also being almost a captive market for their oil.

India can source alternate oil easier than these camel boinkers can source grain, meat and labour.

let's wait and see just how far they are willing to keep up the charade.

India has little option but to de-risk and second source oil and gas if pushed too far and those second sourcing options will bypass izlamic oil and may tap venezuela, russia, brazil et al but India will mainly concentrate on russia

[hnair]

PBUH is usually a no-go area for anyone. That is the rule - atleast in India. If you dont follow it - it is your fault.

No it is not. Malayalam meme-groups in social media like KuKuCha (a college kids run no-holds barred group) and Troll Malayalam has been running constant trolls that rip Mohammed apart almost hourly. That too in terrible language. These are not pro-Hindu groups, but has a huge contributor base from Hindus, RoPers and RoLers. "PDF-file" has been a term I have seen recently used very openly against PBUH in whatsapp. I am sure other Indian language meme-groups have such irreverent posters. This is same as I used to do back in my college days, when we used to say stuff publicly and loudly about all the abrahamaic prophets, that would make Charlie Hebedo look like a Curious George book for babies.

Then too, the devoted people of all communities complained about the lack of respect from the irreverents. The only difference is that now the butt-hurtedness has been amplified by ummah-money and linkages to terror.