Russian-Ukranian War: Geopolitical Fallout

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 23 Dec 2022 23:04

Go figure. Guess they have lost all hope of winning on the battlefield, let Elensky give his silly farewell speech.

Lindsey Graham Says Ukraine War Won't End Unless Russians Take Out Putin

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 23 Dec 2022 23:07

And, from the Senator's official website:

Graham, Whitehouse Russian Oligarch Asset Seizure Amendment Unanimously Passes Senate

So, officially the West can take your wealth even if they are not in direct conflict with you.

Confidence-building material.

eklavya · Post by **eklavya** » 23 Dec 2022 23:26

The Graham-Whitehouse amendment allows the sale and proceeds from assets - including seized mega-yachts, private jets, mansions, and expensive art - from sanctioned Russian oligarchs and entities supporting Putin to be used to the benefit of the Ukrainian people.

I can see why it passed the senate unanimously.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 24 Dec 2022 00:00

The Graham-Whitehouse amendment allows the sale and proceeds from assets - including seized mega-yachts, private jets, mansions, and expensive art - from sanctioned Russian oligarchs and entities supporting Putin to be used to the benefit of the Ukrainian people.

That by every account is illegal. And, pretty much every legal authority in every nation (EU is preparing a similar bill)(van der Layen has asked her EU lawyers to work around the legal aspects to pass the bill) and every financial authority (IIRC, even Yellen) have been opposed to this. More because the confidence in the West will erode - granted by how much is TBD.

What this Graham episode tells us is that the collecting Neocons (and Graham is the lead in the US Senate) having no reverse gear have shifted to a higher gear - asking for a Ukraine-style Maidan in Russia and ultimately China,

Recall Biden himself called Modi "shaky". India will be next. And, with plenty of Indians willing to oblige India's falling will happen in a week or less.

Personally, I think the "reserve currency" mentioned by Putin will be the key. If Putin is able to convince BRICS to float one then the stakes go through the roof. And, it just may mean the removal of some major Neocons in the US and EU to restore some semblance of normality. Else IMO we are certainly headed for a major world conflict.

There will be a cost to pay for remaining silent and letting this slide. The cost to take a position will, IMO, be much, much cheaper than remaining silent.

___________________________________

Should have said this earlier: this Graham statement is NOT a "US" position. It is a very Neocon position - a very small, but extremely powerful section of the US political landscape.

The DoD does not support what Graham says - support Ukraine with unlimited arms (and funds). In fact, I may not be too far off if I state that the DoD opposes this position.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 24 Dec 2022 00:24

They are attacking the very foundations of their much vaunted bill of rights.

eklavya · Post by **eklavya** » 24 Dec 2022 01:07

NRao wrote:
The Graham-Whitehouse amendment allows the sale and proceeds from assets - including seized mega-yachts, private jets, mansions, and expensive art - from sanctioned Russian oligarchs and entities supporting Putin to be used to the benefit of the Ukrainian people.
That by every account is illegal.

Should have said this earlier: this Graham statement is NOT a "US" position. It is a very Neocon position - a very small, but extremely powerful section of the US political landscape.

Congress makes the laws, does it not? So, it just became legal.

The bill passed unanimously, sounds like support for it is about widespread in the US political landscape as possible. A North Korean style 100%.

eklavya · Post by **eklavya** » 24 Dec 2022 01:10

Cyrano wrote:They are attacking the very foundations of their much vaunted bill of rights.

I don’t think the bill of rights was about the rights of foreign oligarchs working with adversaries of the United States.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 24 Dec 2022 01:55

Cyrano wrote:They are attacking the very foundations of their much vaunted bill of rights.

Neocons enforce only their rights. They have no other rights to follow.

Brezinky had a "chessboard", no rights.

So too Kisenger, Kagan, Crystol, etc. Albright, when she was SecState, asked Colin Powell, when he was the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, why the US does not use her armed forces to enforce what her dept wants!!! Hilary did what she pleased. So did Biden as VP, in Ukraine. All Neocons.

It is just that - today - it is the perfect storm. In the past, a few of these actors had the authority to act. Today the prez, NSA, SecState, Deputy Sec of State, Senators, a few Congressmen have all come together. The rest who "voted" have either been bought out (Mitch M and gang) or their political positions have been compromised. This is nothing new - it has happened in Greece, Rome, ...... Britain, ..... now the US.

Even the very institutions they created to maintain world order (UN, IMF, WB, etc) are of no use today. No nation can go to the UN and make a case. Not happening. And on the flip side, they create situations where they will "vote" what they please to get what they want - ever heard of oil price cap?

Heck Merkel herself admitted that the Minsk accords were a distraction.

. What more do you want/expect?

Par for the course.

______________________________________

Just BTW, in the past few days, the estimates for printing $$$ has gone from billions to 2/3 trillion.

______________________________________

Neocons cannot ask for peace. Therefore war is the only way out. Except that "Americans" will not be participating and Russians need to conduct something to throw Putin out. Then balkanize Russia (which they failed to do in the 90s). Then, on to China.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 24 Dec 2022 05:39

NRao wrote:And, with plenty of Indians willing to oblige India's falling will happen in a week or less.

Not a chance. @NRao gaaru, I am sure you yourself don't believe in that prediction. Was it tongue-in-cheek and sarc at some of the Lutyens journos/JNU scum?

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 24 Dec 2022 07:58

Vayutuvan wrote:
NRao wrote:And, with plenty of Indians willing to oblige India's falling will happen in a week or less.
Not a chance. @NRao gaaru, I am sure you yourself don't believe in that prediction. Was it tongue-in-cheek and sarc at some of the Lutyens journos/JNU scum?

OT:

I do not think so.

Today:
* The memo that India claims to be a pole in a new world order has certainly not reached the Indian armed forces. That is a strike against India
* Economy cannot support the ambitions to be a pole. Strike two
* In private I have been arguing that India is being balkanized. Perhaps to accelerate that Blinken has opened the sub-national dept in the US SecState and hired a person to lead it. It is India centric
* Yellen - on Indian soil gave a to-be-cashed ultimatum when she announced the oil cap. India could do nothing. That ultimatum is supported by Japan and Australia. Push comes to shove so will Taiwan and SK (whom India is relying on for arms)
* India has war reserves of some 3/4 weeks. Some may argue it is more, but India cannot sustain a war for months. Not happening

Simplistic future (with assumptions):
* Russians overthrow Putin. No war, certainly no nukes
* Russia is balkanized (into 5 parts I am told)
* China is throttled - sanctions, etc. Some Chinese yahoo overthrows Xi, ...... balkanized, ......

* India is next. India has neither the economy nor the armed forces to resist a bunch of G-7 naval ships around India. Who in India is going to stand up to the Neocons?
* India will have no friends by then too
* I have bet that the Neocons already have IDed Indians to lead the balkanized India - take a peek at the Trilateral Commission. I will not be surprised if the Neocons are laying parallel systems to those of the GoI - that will ultimately weaken the GoI
* And, finally Indians are extremely busy with data collection and analytics. What good has that done?

That is a nutshell
/OT

eklavya · Post by **eklavya** » 24 Dec 2022 09:59

NRao wrote: * Yellen - on Indian soil gave a to-be-cashed ultimatum when she announced the oil cap. India could do nothing.

* India is next. India has neither the economy nor the armed forces to resist a bunch of G-7 naval ships around India. Who in India is going to stand up to the Neocons?

The oil cap is working out quite nicely for India. Russia is selling oil to India below the oil cap. The discount received by refineries in India has increased since the oil cap came in.

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy ... 022-12-14/

India has friendly relations with the G7 countries. All of them. Key members of the G7 (US, France, Japan, etc.) are an important source of support against CPC/PLA aggression, which is a common threat to global security.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 24 Dec 2022 12:29

India has too many peoples who cannot make a distinction between the PM and the nation. In order to hurt the PM they will hurt the nation.

I am not talking about JNU crowds.

What is France going to do, if the PRC attacked India?

What is Japan going to do, if the PRC attacked India?

For all we know that the PRC attack will have the blessings from the US and UK combination.

India must develop the ability to deal with the PRC in the 2045 timeframe. Along with the ability to protect our shipping around the world.

A Russian victory over the west will provide us with immediate relief against the west agression. We have to hold against the PRC in the meantime.

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 24 Dec 2022 17:52

Why so much gloom and doom NRao garu?!
None of your scenarios seem probable to me. Energy starved Europe can't even defend itself now. US has become, from being the global policeman to the global thug. But it's reach is not unlimited. China has its own internal woes.

India is consolidating as a society, as a nation. If we are seeing divisive forces getting hyper it's because they are getting desperate. The overwhelming popular support is NOT with them.

What is being challenged is the west driven global political and economic order. India remains loosely coupled with the global economy. We are not critically dependent on FDI or exports. Our Achilles heel is energy. We have built good relations with ME nations, and Russia is closer to us than ever, even a bit dependent on Indian oil purchases now. That's the best we can do for energy security.

One point I agree is critically important is strengthening our military, stocks, and dissuasive means that can reach any part of the globe. We need both progress and big numbers. We need an RM who delivers on these as impressively as Gadkari delivers highway kms. Hard to imagine the govt is ignoring this despite the glaring lessons from Ukraine conflict.

dnivas · Post by **dnivas** » 25 Dec 2022 14:54

fanne wrote:
Gyan wrote:Russia cannot succeed as :-

1. Does not have vibrant Financial structure (Eg HK, London, NY, CI)
2. Military industrial complex unable to ramp up, look at absent UAV swarms
3. No ideology. People support Putin but will not die for him & his oligarchs.
4. No technology push. Nothing like Silicon Valley
5. IT sector also very limited

India needs to turn towards hard towards US (but on its terms)
Sorry I have to call out BS when it is staring in your face

I started laughing then I maybe thght that it was some 4d chess.
1. Financial structures do not build tanks, missiles and dromes. It is all vaporware
2. Why does Russia need to keep hitting infrastructure everyday. They have been methodical in going from highest priority to low priority. every major non producing electrical node has been hit. They wait a week, see which ones are being fixed and then hit them again. This is consuming all the generators that NATO countries have. for the US to ramp us HIMARS to double the capacity, it is going to take four to five years. Russia has doubled or even tripled many consumables.
3. Same can be said abt the west.
4. Again silicon valley is all about vaporware and monetizing ads. US has come with a 2.1 billion B-21 bomber, Russia already has the tech to see and take it out. Has you seen the videos of small town Russian supermarkets. it is filled with stuff. products are three to four times lesser than what I buy here in the US and they are organic as well. Russia has built or building 13 new subs in the last six or seven years. What has the US built. Russia is sending hundreds of tanks to the front. Imagine this country has been shooting artillery at the rate of 20-40K / day. So far just on average they have consumed around 9 million pieces. Based on just reserves , they can keep shooting at the same rate till 2032. This is not counting new production.
5. They have pretty much banned every service from their market and Russia now is divorced from the insidious western ad based propaganda model. I wish India would have a fully indigenous IT sector. we are getting there. Russia can easily switch to local software applications. Some big companies have SAP and other enterprise applications that will be hard to repllicate, but predominantly everything western has been switched out for many daily use apps.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 25 Dec 2022 21:31

ks_sachin wrote:
NRao wrote:BTW, late last night Garland Nixon mentioned that India has no choice but to join Russia and China. And, that Russia was trying to broker between waring India and China.

India cannot straddle this divide.
NRao

Why do we not have a choice?

Is there something preventing us from joining the US camp?

Which "US"?

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 25 Dec 2022 21:35

India is next. India has neither the economy nor the armed forces to resist a bunch of G-7 naval ships around India. Who in India is going to stand up to the Neocons?

one inconsequential bill by lindsey graham and we are already imagining US marines singing start sprangled banner from lal quila

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 25 Dec 2022 21:45

1. Financial structures do not build tanks, missiles and dromes. It is all vaporware

One of the reasons why western sanctions backfired and made europe poor instead of russia was because they were centered on the fact that financial stuctures mean something when in fact they are just fancy fairy dusts.

[OT]
Some people put Black Scholes equation (the theoretically inspiration for modern financial trading structure ) on Par with landmark scientific discoveries of the 20th century like relativity or quantum mechanics. Its a 2nd order parabolic PDE which a third year STEM major should be able to understand. And it is overtly simplistic. To ad to the fact Myron Scholes collapsed 2 companies he was working for and has never successfully predicted any crisis or wave.
[/OT]

Now unkil/NATO ammo stocks are at dangerously low levels. German tanks are a disaster . And Russia is producing massive amounts of Ammo and stuff.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 25 Dec 2022 21:49

Cyrano wrote:Why so much gloom and doom NRao garu?!

Just a model. Models do not have emotions.

Besides, I have posted opposing ideas - one was that IAF would thank the PLA for building up in Tibet.

Models. That is all they are. But more later - I do have a lot more on this topic: Models.

None of your scenarios seem probable to me. Energy starved Europe can't even defend itself now. US has become, from being the global policeman to the global thug. But it's reach is not unlimited. China has its own internal woes.

This model operates way above these levels. I have mentioned in the strategy thread dead bodies do not matter. Actually, bodies do not matter. 300,000 have died in Sudan (the past year or two). How many analysts here know about that? Sunak serves breakfast to a homeless person and asks that homeless person if he works in the business sector!!!! That is the current PM of the Great UK.

So, I repeat, who cares? Rhetoric.

India is consolidating as a society, as a nation. If we are seeing divisive forces getting hyper it's because they are getting desperate. The overwhelming popular support is NOT with them.

Honestly, and humbly, it really does not matter. Brezinski and Kagans have written books on this matter. To them, the world is a chessboard and their vision is armies moving around to tame those that do not meet their standards. Simple. Sullivan and Blinken are the powers in the current admin. And, they will never let up. Not happening.

Besides, I am amazed that with so much anti-India material in this admin Indians just shove it aside. Very irresponsible IMO. Blinkin, if he can get to India, WILL turn India inside out. Let there be no doubt. These guys are extremely vindictive. Hillary is another.

100,000 humans, never mind they are Ukrainians, have died and these guys (Graham, a US Senator) do not even blink. Kill more, we need to control that chessboard.

Do you really think they care about a billion Indians?

___________________

Kejriwal, Raghuram Rajan, Pichai, Nadella, Ajay Banga (already a member of the Trilateral Commission): 5 Governers of a balkanized India.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 25 Dec 2022 22:02

Hearing Microsoft signed a $100 million deal with Ukraine to support their entire defense software needs!!!

Cyrano · Post by **Cyrano** » 25 Dec 2022 23:18

NRao garu,
While Blinken and Neocons may try various things, we are not exactly wearing bangles and won't take it passively. Among a lot of other things, the ops of thousands of big US companies are run out of India. Things can cut both ways.

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 25 Dec 2022 23:29

Emotional attachment with Russia of some Posters, does not translate into facts on the ground

Financial structure was an Important reason for success of British Empire and now of US

I agree with NRao pessimism. I think we need to strike a deal with US rather than sink with Russia

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 26 Dec 2022 00:56

NRao wrote: Just a model. Models do not have emotions.

Besides, I have posted opposing ideas - one was that IAF would thank the PLA for building up in Tibet.

Models. That is all they are. But more later - I do have a lot more on this topic: Models.

"All models are wrong but some are useful" - George E. P. Box

My modification is "All models are wrong but a small subset of those models are less wrong. A small subset of those less wrong models are useful"

But sire, you are hedging. How can you get two diametrically opposite scenarios from similar models and on the same (similar?) data?

Sometimes models can be too simple and fail to capture important parameters. Anyway we can move to Math thread.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 26 Dec 2022 01:00

gakakkad wrote:
[OT]
Its a 2nd order parabolic PDE which a third year STEM major should be able to understand. And it is overtly simplistic.
[/OT]

Hakim ji, characterizing an equation (or sets of equations) should not be conflated with the ability to solve the same, leave alone solving generally but even getting particular solutions. The ability of a company, especially a financial engineering based company, to succeed depends on factors extraneous to mathematics.

(Again, we can take it to math dhaga)

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 26 Dec 2022 01:01

NRao wrote:Hearing Microsoft signed a $100 million deal with Ukraine to support their entire defense software needs!!!

A new meaning to "Blue screen of death".

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 26 Dec 2022 01:16

Cyrano wrote:NRao garu,
While Blinken and Neocons may try various things, we are not exactly wearing bangles and won't take it passively. Among a lot of other things, the ops of thousands of big US companies are run out of India. Things can cut both ways.

Need some focus here.

Which Neocon has ever cared for logic? Do they care for "US companies in India"? They do not.

And, on Feb 24, 2022, were the Ukrainians wearing bangles? Today neither NATO nor the US can restock them - check out the list their Gen wants - 500 of this and 500 of that. The issue is about sustaining a war-fighting machine. Recall when Pelosi visited Taiwan I had stated the US is not ready - cannot sustain a conflict with China in the 1st island (or whatever they have).

Not about valor. Funds + ability to produce arms to feed an extremely hungry meat grinder. The WW@ grinder sucked in some 40 million people.

But anyways. I think I am done. This is going tangential at this point.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 26 Dec 2022 01:21

Vayutuvan wrote: ..........

But sire, you are hedging. How can you get two diametrically opposite scenarios from similar models and on the same (similar?) data?

Lost you on the "two diametrically opposite scenarios". From my post, what did you see as two? Curious.

On hedging, what did you expect? I have a reputation to protect.

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 26 Dec 2022 02:10

NRao wrote: Lost you on the "two diametrically opposite scenarios". From my post, what did you see as two? Curious.

"Besides, I have posted opposing ideas - one was that IAF would thank the PLA for building up in Tibet."

Guddu · Post by **Guddu** » 26 Dec 2022 09:21

The success of Europe and industrial Germany was based on cheap energy from Russia. Europe is now being deindustrialized. Yes they can buy oil/gas from the Middle East, but it will have a higher price. This reduces economic competiveness and inflation will spread through the economy. The Euro itself is unlikely to survive for more than a few years. Europe's goose is cooked.

There was a reason that merkel wanted Nordstream II and the US was against it. NS II would ensure Europe/Germany's future. The US made sure that the NS II pipeline was blown up (some news reports of UK doing the job). The US is now selling oil to the EU at high prices and the europeans are complaining!. The US has opened a second front against the EU and many developing nations, by raising interest rates they are now exporting inflation to the world. This I believe is the US trying to maintain its $ hegemony and unipolarity.

In the end, all fiat currencies fail, though the $ will be the last man standing. The issue is what comes after that...but that would be getting off-topic for this thread.

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 26 Dec 2022 13:50

Global Currency Reserves are parked in $ 60%, Euro and Other US allies 30% and then rest.

I think US is targeting this 30%. Enough to fuel US for next 20-30 yrs. But illegal immigration May do in USA. In next 2 yrs Biden might invite around 10-15 million illegals. My Coin is on Biden to win again in 2024. Another 4 yrs of Democrats, then vote harvesting will be so well established that Republicans will be like Pappu Party.

SaraLax · Post by **SaraLax** » 26 Dec 2022 15:48

NRao wrote:
Cyrano wrote:NRao garu,
While Blinken and Neocons may try various things, we are not exactly wearing bangles and won't take it passively. Among a lot of other things, the ops of thousands of big US companies are run out of India. Things can cut both ways.
Need some focus here.

Which Neocon has ever cared for logic? Do they care for "US companies in India"? They do not.

And, on Feb 24, 2022, were the Ukrainians wearing bangles? Today neither NATO nor the US can restock them - check out the list their Gen wants - 500 of this and 500 of that. The issue is about sustaining a war-fighting machine. Recall when Pelosi visited Taiwan I had stated the US is not ready - cannot sustain a conflict with China in the 1st island (or whatever they have).

Not about valor. Funds + ability to produce arms to feed an extremely hungry meat grinder. The WW@ grinder sucked in some 40 million people.

But anyways. I think I am done. This is going tangential at this point.

- As though the USA is still all powerful and is always exempt from blunders which can inflict self-wounds & weaken the platform from which it diabolically orchestrates the other countries in the world. USA also has its own elections and things can look very different if we have a different type of Democrat winner or may be even a Republican winner.
- As though all NRIs & PIOs are 100% India Haters and wish India to be destroyed.
- As though at minimum 50 million talented, skilled Indians (who are aware of the treacherous aims of US as a "friend" & "well-wisher") out of the 1300 million Indians will simply cower, hide and allow India to be balkanized.
- When Free India was at its weakest point in its existence (after losing War against China, when we could not even feed ourselves & US stopped its cheap Food Exports to India & our Ministers were traveling abroad with begging bowls) - we still recovered to where we are now.

The US is strangling the EU more in current scenario than our country. The Germans are in a very tight spot in terms of the weakness in their economy & unsure if they will get cheap energy in the future like how they used to get from Russia. Italy's Debt situation within the EU is alarming. The informed set of EU citizens know what is happening but they are helpless. A bit like how Japan is now waking up with the feeling that it cannot completely depend on the US in its long standing issues with both China (using North Korea as its pawn) & Russia. South Korea is also feeling a bit similar with respect to North Korea.

Let us not panic. Yes - It is necessary to game all the scenarios where the US, EU & China will gang up and hit our weakest points & we need to come up with multiple plans to stave off such situations. Let us not come to a dire conclusion that India will get balkanized if we stand-up to both US & China and simultaneously not behave like how Russia wishes us to do. It is never easy to keep walking on the thin razor edge but it does not mean we cannot continue doing that. We need to do more critical R&D for Western World MNCs & this way India becomes an entity that is crucial for their global competitive posture as well as for our people to get ultra skilled in latest technologies. We also need more skilled, experts (NRIs) from Western world to either return back completely or still set up their companies in India (like how Bharat Biotech created Covaxin vaccines even as other western countries failed in their efforts at that time). The most important requirement for that is for the current central government to continue ruling for one more term at least.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 26 Dec 2022 21:44

@V,

I will get to the model sometime later. Fun, but not important.

___________________________________________________

* Three nations, IMO, are on wartime economies: The US, Japan, and Russia

* MacGregor reporting 2 Polish battalions in Ukraine. Negotiations are in progress if they fight as Polish or wear Ukrainian gear. NATO troops (officially ?) in Ukraine
* Russia has warned Greece not to transfer Greek S-300s to Ukraine. It seems like a done deal
* Macgregor did address the likelihood of Russia striking within Poland!!!!!!!!!!

* Very strong rumors of US Army and AF reserves mobilizing in Mid-2023 (MacGregor)
* US Special Ops to deploy "to protect embassy" (I did not catch to which nation). It is always the Marines, never SO. Something is cooking (MacGregor)

* Swedish Amby to the US: by joining NATO Sweeden's def budget will decline by 2% (currently at 4% of eco). So, Sweeden has determined that they can not sustain military R&D on their own, so they will outsource it to the US

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 26 Dec 2022 22:00

In WW2, US doubled its GDP & by end of war, the defence budget was 50% of GDP

On similar mobilisation Russia can hike its defence budget to a Trillion dollars easily. But in my view, people under estimate importance of financial mobilisation/structuring of war economy and in any case, Russian Central Bank is incompetent.

Russia is a fortress economy but unable to ramp up as it practically gave up manufacturing

Tanaji · Post by **Tanaji** » 27 Dec 2022 00:20

In other news the entitled attitude of Pakraine continues unabated:

https://ukrainetoday.org/2022/12/25/tom ... il-kuleba/

Pakraine is like the spoilt kid of rich parents who never said no to its every demands…

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 27 Dec 2022 00:27

Tanaji wrote:In other news the entitled attitude of Pakraine continues unabated:

https://ukrainetoday.org/2022/12/25/tom ... il-kuleba/

Pakraine is like the spoilt kid of rich parents who never said no to its every demands…

A topic brought up in Sept by EU. They claimed to have found a loop hole in some law.

China will veto it. DOA

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 27 Dec 2022 01:10

Immediately after returning from US , Z holds talks with Mudi, what gives? And what is peace plan of India re Ukraine?
https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-ne ... 53767.html

Zelensky on Monday said he had a telephonic conversation with prime minister Narendra Modi, adding that as the current president of the G20, India should participate in the implementation of the ‘peace formula’ laid out by him during last month's summit in Indonesia's Bali.
Last month, too, the two leaders held a telephonic conversation to discuss the current situation in the east European nation

CalvinH · Post by **CalvinH** » 27 Dec 2022 01:23

Gyan wrote:In WW2, US doubled its GDP & by end of war, the defence budget was 50% of GDP

On similar mobilisation Russia can hike its defence budget to a Trillion dollars easily. But in my view, people under estimate importance of financial mobilisation/structuring of war economy and in any case, Russian Central Bank is incompetent.

Russia is a fortress economy but unable to ramp up as it practically gave up manufacturing

WWII spend was under different circumstances.

Any country (except US) diverting their national resources like that to a war today will bankrupt itself. May be that's what US wants Russia to do.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 27 Dec 2022 01:49

US is actually bankrupt. Just pretending she is not.

$31 trillion in debt and printing. Even the $1.7 trillion "passed" last week is 70% debt-ridden - US revenue covers only 30%.

BUT, ALL war economies run on printing like there is no tomorrow. How else can they survive?

A fun fact I heard recently:
* Russia paid off the Soviet's lend/lease debt, for WW2, to the US, in 1997. And,
* The UK paid its debt in 2020!!!

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 27 Dec 2022 06:08

NRao wrote:….
…
* India is next. India has neither the economy nor the armed forces to resist a bunch of G-7 naval ships around India. Who in India is going to stand up to the Neocons?
…

Let’s see if EU survives 2023-24 first, from energy, inflation, loss of industries, and i$lam, before they can power their ships for a sail to Indian Ocean. Did you see the latest Christmas celebrations in Paris?
Gee-7 is “khatam, tata, good-bye”
https://twitter.com/AdamMilstein/status ... 4326169601
https://twitter.com/UltraDane/status/16 ... 9222170624

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 27 Dec 2022 08:22

Is he kidding or any serious effort to build peace?

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 27 Dec 2022 14:58

The point I am making that it is absurd to underestimate US by calling it financial Economy. India has 1300 year History of its territories being enslaved by much smaller Economy. More Recently we were colony of a Pvt Company. I think we should side with US, support US Dollar and dump Brics.