Pakistan Armed Forces: News & Discussion

[Rakesh]

Pakistan’s Multi-Domain Military Modernization Blitz
https://medium.com/@amirhusain_tx/pakis ... 0dcb396f2f
29 Jan 2024

[Rakesh]

VIDEO: https://x.com/DfIlite/status/1758006071585853749?s=20 ---> Video of yesterday, 6th Hangor Class Submarine, being constructed.

https://x.com/DfIlite/status/1758006076455412090?s=20 ---> So this is sixth Hangor Class Submarine they are making. Soon, IN will get shock of their life when 5-6 Pak submarines will come. Our Project-75I submarines is taking its own sweet time. No one is in rush.

[Manish_P]

If civilians know via OSINT won't the IN/MoD be aware via their channels...

And they were cool when the Chinese were churning out their subs and surface ships

[Rakesh]

If civilians know via OSINT won't the IN/MoD be aware via their channels...

And they were cool when the Chinese were churning out their subs and surface ships

"No expense shall be spared in the defense of the nation!"
- Standard line from every Raksha Mantri

Hollow words onlee. Will invest in nothing (especially local maal), but wants to be regional superpower.

Will hum, haw and throw up every bureaucratic excuse to delay the acquisition of platforms.

Our politicians are clueless and our Generals, Admirals and Air Marshals play gulli danda with the system to import. From Artillery to Armoured Corps to Infantry to Air Force to Navy, it is a mess. These senior military personnel only want to import and give lip service to self reliance. Local maal is ordered in piece meal. 10 units here, 20 units there. And they expect foreign and local OEMs to keep lines open for them, for eternity.

See this video from Field Marshal Sam Manekshaw on the ignorance of our politicians (from 0:30 in the video). Nothing has changed since that tiime.

[Manish_P]

...
"No expense shall be spared in the defense of the nation!"
- Standard line from every Raksha Mantri
...

We are a soon to be $5 Trillion economy looking to purchase 2nd hand fighter jets, converted airliners for AEWACS platforms,...

[basant]

Conversion of airline to AEW is okay.

[Manish_P]

Conversion of airline to AEW is okay.

2nd hand fighters are also OK sir, but that was not my drift...

[sanjaykumar]

There is very little wrong and much that is right about second hand goods.

These people are being paid by the tax payer to be careful with their money.

Perhaps my standard of living is vastly higher than it would be otherwise because I have no hesitation buying used. I can drive an exotic $200,000 car but pay half as much. So some aficionado can recognise that it is an old model. Doesn’t bother me.

This is the consumerist model driven by the capitalist paradigm. Perhaps we need to recognise it. I may think of myself as a recycler and better for the planet.

[Jay]

There is very little wrong and much that is right about second hand goods.

These people are being paid by the tax payer to be careful with their money.

Perhaps my standard of living is vastly higher than it would be otherwise because I have no hesitation buying used. I can drive an exotic $200,000 car but pay half as much. So some aficionado can recognise that it is an old model. Doesn’t bother me.

This is the consumerist model driven by the capitalist paradigm. Perhaps we need to recognise it. I may think of myself as a recycler and better for the planet.

Sanjay ji, kudos for you on the recycling aspect, but this consumerist & conservationist principle becoming the guiding principle of armed forces is a step in the wrong direction and clearly lays bare the muddled mindset from which the forces are not able to extricate themselves.

The argument against these used planes is not about saving a paisa here for the benefit of taxpayers, but the hapazard and illogical way the forces plan or do not plan their requirements & procurement strategy and at the last moment will punt the decision to buy a used ware as a subtitute for a planned, well organized, inventive structure of their inventory.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/alpha_defense/status/1765 ... 03264?s=20 ---> Licensed Production of Chinese VT-4 Main Battle Tank (MBT).

https://x.com/Defense_Talks/status/1765 ... 86788?s=20 ---> Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) unveiled HAIDER Tank, indigenously manufactured with NORINCO China and Pakistan. General Syed Asim Munir, NI (M), Chief of Army Staff (COAS), visited HIT as chief guest at the rollout ceremony of HAIDER tank (Pilot Project). The ceremony was attended by Ambassador of the Peoples Republic of China, key officials of Chinese state company NORINCO, high officials of Government of Pakistan & Pakistan Army, and various military and civilian officials of HIT. During the ceremony, HIT unveiled its new Tank HAIDER, which has been indigenously manufactured through collaboration with NORINCO China and various industries of Pakistan.

HAIDER embodies cutting-edge technology and impressive capability in the domain of tank warfare having remarkable firepower, protection and manoeuvre characteristics. Crafted with state-of-the-art advanced technologies, HAIDER stands as a testament to Pakistani defence industry’s relentless pursuit of excellence in defence innovation. COAS was briefed in detail about the technical capabilities of the HAIDER tank and the progress being made in achieving indigenization in arms and armament. COAS also visited other manufacturing facilities within the Heavy Industrial Complex and appreciated the commitment of the officers and workforce in successful achievement of another technological milestone. Earlier on arrival, COAS was received by Chairman HIT.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/BharatShaktiBSI/status/17 ... 92611?s=20 ---> China-operated Gwadar Port Attacked, 10 Killed. Armed assailants strike Gwadar Port in Pakistan, raising security alarms. @CaptDKS (retd) explains the chain of events.

[Manish_P]

https://x.com/alpha_defense/status/1765 ... 03264?s=20 ---> Licensed Production of Chinese VT-4 Main Battle Tank (MBT).
...

Why for is there no mine plough on the tank hain?
Why for a photo of a lion when the only lion in Bakistan is an old emaciated one in a zoo?
Why for only 3 chini gentlemen hain?
and finally
Why for is the Tank Cmdrs danda fairer and thicker than Moonirs?

So many questions...

[Rakesh]

The PAF's DGPR (Director General Propaganda Relations) wing has come out with a video on Pakistan Day (March 23rd).

Some eye-raising moments in this video See you if you can spot them.

VIDEO: https://x.com/DGPR_PAF/status/1771140389254127884?s=20 ---> Air Chief Marshal Zaheer Ahmed Baber Sidhu, NI (M) Spearheads PAF's Modernization Drive.

P.S. After seeing Zaheer Saab sitting so nonchalantly in the J-10CE, he must be thinking ---> "I did the video! Can I now please have my 72 hoors?"

[Rakesh]

Another unreal video. This stuff is hilarious!

VIDEO: https://x.com/DGPR_PAF/status/1771138889652027784?s=20 ---> Air Chief Marshal Zaheer Ahmed Baber Sidhu, NI (M) Leading Flypast 2024.

Shahbaz-1's real call sign is Fraud-1.

He has emulated his service to a T and lived up to the PAF's carefully crafted image. Good one Air Chief!

https://x.com/AirOpsSyndicate/status/17 ... 38130?s=20 --->

[Rakesh]

^^^

Image Source: https://in.pinterest.com/pin/592364157233984130/

[Chinmay]

Looks like the Pakis were gifted a SIGINT ship

The ship looks to be dimensionally comparable to Norway’s intelligence gathering vessels Eger and Marjata, Sweden’s Artemis, or Germany’s Oste class, he added.

But Koh doubts Rizwan “has the onboard power capacity for telemetry missile tracking, like those found on the Chinese Yuan Wang series.” Instead, he explained, Rizwan is likely focused on gathering electronic and signals intelligence thanks to “onboard signals processing and analysis capabilities.”

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/TBPEnglish/status/1772317 ... 12723?s=20 ---> Breaking: Pakistan’s second largest naval air station, PNS Siddique in Turbat is under heavy attack. Gunfire and multiple explosions have been reported from the area. Chinese drones are also stationed at this base.

[VKumar]

Wasn't Gwadar attacked recently?

[Manish_P]

^^

Begging pardon from the Admiral for lazily using his post for the above khabar

[Rakesh]

The 18 F-16C/D Block 50/52 models will serve for another 40 years. They were delivered around 2010. There is an option for another 18 more, which will be exercised in due course. To be quite honest, there will be a sale of the F-16 Block 70/72 variant to the PAF in the years ahead and their Block 50/52 models will also get the Block 70/72 upgrade. That is going to happen. The Block 70/72 will come, along with a batch of AIM-120C7/8s (among other weaponry) as they already have the AIM-120C5. America will not sell the F-35 to Pakistan, because of China. And thus the next best route is the Block 70/72.

More F-16s for PAF are coming! Thank goodness, the SE contest was never awarded to LM.

https://twitter.com/INTELPSF/status/158 ... PWXfM5GDRQ ---> Pakistani diplomats in Washington D.C. have started exploratory discussions with the U.S. state department for acquiring more F-16s, either from the existing U.S. fleet or from mutually friendly countries, according to two Pakistani officials.

https://x.com/Chellaney/status/1775412674018390357?s=20 ---> Biden has not only embraced Pakistan's new military-backed government but also pledged to "continue to forge a strong partnership" with that country, a mecca of terrorism. The US is helping keep Pakistan afloat while modernizing its F-16 fleet to make it more potent against India.

[Khalsa]

Why sell on one side, when you can sell to both?
America is not the first one to do this (Britain, Germany, France, Russia too)
America won't be the last one to do it.

This is just plain commerce. Lets move and counter move commercially whenever possible for us.

[hgupta]

Why Sell on one side, when you can sell to both.
America is not the first one to do this (Britain, Germany, France, Russia too)
America won't be the last one to do it.

This is just plain commerce. Lets move and counter move commercially whenever possible for us.

Except America doesn't want anyone else selling to countries that America don't approve of and sanctions them if they do so while America is free to sell to anyone it wishes to. It won't allow India to trade with Iran but US gets to sell weapons to Pakistan that would only be used against India and hosts anti India terrorists.

I am sick of this hypocrisy. GoI seriously needs to tell US and Biden to STFU.

[MeshaVishwas]

and a $508m guaranteed loan to Pakistan Air Force (PAF) by China National Aero-Technology Import and Export Corporation.

- Yawn
New acquisition of UAVs?
Anyways, China arming up the terrorists with shadily crafted credit deals.
But I will give it to the TSPA, Khan stops all military aid and they find a suitable replacement in no time.
Benefits of having multiple fathers, I suppose.

[MeshaVishwas]

First(?) look at the Hangor class submarine.
Looks like she has flank sonar arrays.
The boat superficially resembles the EKM

Screenshot taken from DGPR-Paki Navy video

[sanman]

New Pak sub from China:

[VinodTK]

Five Pakistani soldiers killed in gunbattles with militants, army says

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/MB_EjectEject/status/1795402567305834923 ---> On 21 May 2024, a Pakistan Air Force Mirage 5 aircraft crashed whilst on a routine training mission near PAF Airbase, Rafiqui. The pilot successfully ejected using the Martin-Baker PRM6 seat.

https://x.com/alpha_defense/status/1795405642360062002 ---> Again no statement from @OfficialDGISPR, tell us about their professionalism and credibility.

[MeshaVishwas]

I think this has something to do with the Hangor class SSK deal.
Need to wait for more info though.

Court halts execution of five ex-naval officers - Tribune Pk

According to the order, the lawyers for the petitioners claimed that their clients were not provided with adequate representation and that the trial was unfair.

They continued that the evidence against the petitioners was not shared with them as well as they were denied access to the documents and records of the court of inquiry.

The lawyers further told the court that an appeal, which filed against the death sentence without access to these documents, was dismissed.

He(Asst. Attorney General, Paki Govt.) added that the naval chief believed that sharing the details of the proceedings, including the findings recorded by the general court martial and the order passed in appeal upholding the death penalty, would be detrimental to the interests of the State.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/Resonant_News/status/1799460688416612517 ---> A PAF JF-17 crashed on 05 June 2024, at about 0940 hours, in Jhang District due to technical fault. The PAF has not publicly claimed this incident, however images of the pilot are available. Based on the rough image of the patches, on the pilot the JF-17 might belongs to the 14th - Tail Chopper Squadron.

[Aditya_V]

https://x.com/Resonant_News/status/1799460688416612517 ---> A PAF JF-17 crashed on 05 June 2024, at about 0940 hours, in Jhang District due to technical fault. The PAF has not publicly claimed this incident, however images of the pilot are available. Based on the rough image of the patches, on the pilot the JF-17 might belongs to the 14th - Tail Chopper Squadron.

If there is no info from Martin Baker, then this is from the earlier JF 17s with Chinese seats, quiet a few have not worked and pilots have died.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/Resonant_News/status/1799460688416612517 ---> A PAF JF-17 crashed on 05 June 2024, at about 0940 hours, in Jhang District due to technical fault. The PAF has not publicly claimed this incident, however images of the pilot are available. Based on the rough image of the patches, on the pilot the JF-17 might belongs to the 14th - Tail Chopper Squadron.

If there is no info from Martin Baker, then this is from the earlier JF 17s with Chinese seats, quiet a few have not worked and pilots have died.

Please stop re-quoting IMAGES when replying. Many readers/visitors use mobile devices to surf BRF.

[Aditya_V]

Will do that in future

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/Resonant_News/status/1799460688416612517 ---> A PAF JF-17 crashed on 05 June 2024, at about 0940 hours, in Jhang District due to technical fault. The PAF has not publicly claimed this incident, however images of the pilot are available. Based on the rough image of the patches, on the pilot the JF-17 might belongs to the 14th - Tail Chopper Squadron.

Confirmed by Martin Baker

If the PAF wants to avoid loss of H&D, they can always install Chinese ejection seats. They may or may not work, but the H&D of the Pakistan Air Force can stay intact!

https://x.com/MB_EjectEject/status/1800458129873998164 ---> On Wednesday 5th June, a Pakistan Air Force JF-17 Block 2 aircraft crashed near the Jhang district. The pilot successfully ejected using the Martin-Baker PK16LE Seat.

[drnayar]

Now now .. they will say MB seat flew by itself with F16 in jinn mode

[Manish_P]

How does MB track ejections?

[Jay]

How does MB track ejections?

My understanding is that ejection seats come with satellite trackers so that SAR teams can locate the pilot. Once ejected a status message is communicated via which MB will come to know that an ejection happened.

[Rakesh]

How does MB track ejections?

My understanding is that ejection seats come with satellite trackers so that SAR teams can locate the pilot. Once ejected a status message is communicated via which MB will come to know that an ejection happened.

Thank you Jay. So does each ejection seat have a unique identifier code? So the code indicates which aircraft type that crashed?

MB's website lists all the recent crashes ---> https://martin-baker.com/ejection-notices/

It would have been interesting to know if Martin Baker included the crash of a twin seater F-16B or F-16D (belonging to the Pakistan Air Force) that occurred on 27 Feb 2019. But I doubt that, as the H&D of Lockheed Martin was at stake!

[fanne]

Then I would say MB has the best tracking system in the world. You do not need radar, not even horizon limitation. At any given time they know exactly where each plane is in the world (those that use MB seats, which is almost all non US, Russia and PLAF air forces.

[Jay]

Thank you Jay. So does each ejection seat have a unique identifier code? So the code indicates which aircraft type that crashed?

MB's website lists all the recent crashes ---> https://martin-baker.com/ejection-notices/

It would have been interesting to know if Martin Baker included the crash of a twin seater F-16B or F-16D (belonging to the Pakistan Air Force) that occurred on 27 Feb 2019. But I doubt that, as the H&D of Lockheed Martin was at stake!

I would have to dig up my sources on this and what I remember was from an interview on an airforce forum almost a decade ago, so please take this with some skepticism.

MB does have an unique identifier for each one of its seats and MB can definitely identify in what plane the ejection seat went into. Also, MB has differing end user agreements with different manufacturers, nations, air forces depending on the contract signing authority which purchases the seat. For planes like Tejas, JF-17 since there are not many options out there, maybe it's baked into the contract that every ejection from one of these planes can be notified to and by MB during non-combat ops. American manufacturers might get away with this information dissemination clause because of their heft. Last two sentences are speculations on my part.

[srai]

^^^
US fighter aircrafts typically used ACES II ejection seats manufactured by the Collins Aerospace division of Raytheon Technologies (RTX).

https://www.collinsaerospace.com/news/s ... of-success