Tejas Mk2 Medium Weight Fighter: News & Discussion - 23 February 2019

[Nsmith]

HAL has been much worse than anyone had thought in terms of pulling their socks on the LCA program.

Fact that NaMo/Ninda Turtle haven't given danda to the MoD babus and HAL leadership to fast-track Mk1A and Mk2 is shameful.

Think safe to say there's going to be no rollout of Mk2 in calendar year 2026.

[Prem Kumar]

The Tejas Mk2 has yet to fly. Only post IOC of the Mk2, can discussions begin between Air HQ and HAL on orders. That has not stopped speculations on estimated production runs. Initially it was 200 air frames, now it has changed to ~ 100 aircraft as a first tranche and then a follow on order. When the discussions do begin on the Tejas Mk2, the Govt must commit towards 200 air frames at the onset.

I think Tejas-Mk2 will end up getting only an order of 100

1) IAF has ensured all our CAPEX will go into Rafales
2) By the time Tejas-Mk2 arrives, they will ask for AMCA
3) If Mk2 is delayed, they will clamor for more Rafales
4) Some nonsense like "force mix: combination of light, medium, heavy; stealth vs non-stealth" will be used

TEDBF is dead. Tejas-Mk2 is not quite there yet, but its induction % will be somewhere between Mk1a & TEDBF

[bala]

Sorry to say this: there is no pride of ownership by the IAF top brass. Maybe the lower level and pilots appreciate the desi aircraft. I am yet to see any reports coming from IAF praising features on the new Tejas which their motley crew of videshi crafts don't support, e.g. self diagnosis suite. We constantly hear about delays and this and that not integrated from IAF. Once the desi kaveri engine is fitted there will be more complaints, no adequate power, engine life and so on. All of these are growing pains and instead of complaints need an attitude change which says I will wait for next generation design iteration. Look at how the Chinese airforce lumps up their own crafts and continue to work on improving things.

[williams]

The Tejas Mk2 has yet to fly. Only post IOC of the Mk2, can discussions begin between Air HQ and HAL on orders. That has not stopped speculations on estimated production runs. Initially it was 200 air frames, now it has changed to ~ 100 aircraft as a first tranche and then a follow on order. When the discussions do begin on the Tejas Mk2, the Govt must commit towards 200 air frames at the onset.

I think Tejas-Mk2 will end up getting only an order of 100

1) IAF has ensured all our CAPEX will go into Rafales
2) By the time Tejas-Mk2 arrives, they will ask for AMCA
3) If Mk2 is delayed, they will clamor for more Rafales
4) Some nonsense like "force mix: combination of light, medium, heavy; stealth vs non-stealth" will be used

TEDBF is dead. Tejas-Mk2 is not quite there yet, but its induction % will be somewhere between Mk1a & TEDBF

I don't know. The current Rafale orders can only fill up 6 squads. MK1as can fill up another 10 squads. If they are planning for 42 squads there is room for Mk2.

TEDBF may be allowed to go all way to prototype stages to gain some experience.

[williams]

Sorry to say this: there is no pride of ownership by the IAF top brass. Maybe the lower level and pilots appreciate the desi aircraft. I am yet to see any reports coming from IAF praising features on the new Tejas which their motley crew of videshi crafts don't support, e.g. self diagnosis suite. We constantly hear about delays and this and that not integrated from IAF. Once the desi kaveri engine is fitted there will be more complaints, no adequate power, engine life and so on. All of these are growing pains and instead of complaints need an attitude change which says I will wait for next generation design iteration. Look at how the Chinese airforce lumps up their own crafts and continue to work on improving things.

Current top brass may not see it. But the next gen pilots may have different attitude if HAL can deliver on the quality. expectation.

[bala]

Current top brass may not see it. But the next gen pilots may have different attitude if HAL can deliver on the quality. expectation.

On Quality: HAL's tejas crafts are well built since the private players like L&T provide sub-assemblies. All the airshows have shown Tejas in good light and agility while flying.

On expectation: BBC - best of brochure claims is what is happening with IAF. HAL can only deliver based on R&D work being completed properly and tested/certified. These expectations will not happen overnight and take time, no timetable driven stuff will work.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/Defencematrix1/status/188 ... 26203?s=20 ---> Tejas Mk2 Cockpit High-Resolution Pictures.

[Kartik]

Tejas Mk2 cockpit looks really good. The wider HUD, LAD display's layout, brightness and background look great and when combined with the side stick will really improve pilot experience. It's a real step up from the 3 Smart MFD layout of the Tejas Mk1A.

Now to finally be able to see the Tejas Mk2 prototype.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/Defencecore/status/203900 ... 62440?s=20 ---> After what GE did to Tejas Mk1A, going back to them for Mk2 is concerning. I know the production line will be in India, but the issue will be the supply chain of critical parts coming from outside to sustain production and MRO. Hope MoD understands this Gap, it's better we start looking for alternatives of F404 & F414.

https://x.com/MacaulaysMonkey/status/20 ... 40054?s=20 ---> As per the HAL CMD, the F-414 deal was also to have been closed by March end.

Whither Mk2?

[uddu]

https://x.com/Defencecore/status/203900 ... 62440?s=20 ---> After what GE did to Tejas Mk1A, going back to them for Mk2 is concerning. I know the production line will be in India, but the issue will be the supply chain of critical parts coming from outside to sustain production and MRO. Hope MoD understands this Gap, it's better we start looking for alternatives of F404 & F414.

https://x.com/MacaulaysMonkey/status/20 ... 40054?s=20 ---> As per the HAL CMD, the F-414 deal was also to have been closed by March end.

Whither Mk2?

The F-404 is not getting supplied, why we must go with the F414? Other than few engines for the prototype testing, which probably is there. We must not go with the F-414. It will be another bad decision. Need to be looking at alternatives.

[Manish_Sharma]

https://x.com/TheLegateIN/status/204142 ... 69396?s=20

Tejas Mk2 will have 120 mins combat patrol endurance with 8 BVR missiles compared to 57 mins of Tejas Mk1A with four BVRs.

[uddu]

Chai Biscoot
https://x.com/i/status/2041843602356392171
@HALHQBLR
A high-level delegation from GE Aerospace, led by Rita Flaherty, VP Sales & Business Development, visited Hindustan Aeronautics Limited in Bengaluru today. The team met Dr. D K Sunil, CMD, HAL, Shri Ravi K, Director (Operations) & senior leadership to discuss progress on the GE F404 engines & ongoing discussions on the GE F414 programme.

[Manish_P]

Finest american Bourbon and cookies i would imagine Sir... the Americans are trying to avoid paying the penalty for delayed/non delivery.

But realistically speaking they hold all the cards, including the Trump card (pun intended)

Chai Biscoot
https://x.com/i/status/2041843602356392171
@HALHQBLR
A high-level delegation from GE Aerospace, led by Rita Flaherty, VP Sales & Business Development, visited Hindustan Aeronautics Limited in Bengaluru today. The team met Dr. D K Sunil, CMD, HAL, Shri Ravi K, Director (Operations) & senior leadership to discuss progress on the GE F404 engines & ongoing discussions on the GE F414 programme.
...

[Rakesh]

Big boost to IAF: GE Aerospace, HAL seal technical pact on jet engines
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 218096.cms
13 April 2026

^^^
https://x.com/shreedharsingh9/status/20 ... 56184?s=20 ---> ToT for GE F-414 India will get:

- Coatings for corrosion
- Casting, machining & coating for turbine blades (Single Crystal)
- Nozzle guide vanes & hot parts
- Blisk machining
- Forging/power metallurgy discs for turbine
- Machining thin-walled titanium casing

[Rakesh]

Big boost to IAF: GE Aerospace, HAL seal technical pact on jet engines
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 218096.cms
13 April 2026

Image of the above article...

https://x.com/manupubby/status/2043549341403726077?s=20 ---> Pact on technical matters for F414 co-production in India reached between GE and HAL. Final contract likely this year. GE Aerospace also announces contract to set up depot facility in India for F404 engines.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/AdithyaKM_/status/1969432 ... 01390?s=20 ---> Safran M88 derivative (M88-4?) on offer for LCA AF Mk2 as an alternative to GE F414, thoughts:

- The news of its consideration may primarily be signalling to indicate that India isn't as helpless regarding the engine situation as one might imagine.
- Safran is also the partner for the 110+ kN engine. Putting a lot of eggs into the Safran basket instead of the GE one may be safer but still not optimal. So it's not black and white, in my opinion.

Way forward?
- Continue with F414 for prototypes while starting a parallel fast-track program to modify the current design for M88 variant. It will take a few years & a decent amount of money.
- By the time Mk2 is production-ready, ideally atleast one prototype should've flown with the Safran engine.
- Ideally the 110+kN engine can also be then fitted in future with more minimal modifications.
- Objective should be to swing towards Safran with minimum time wasted if deemed necessary.
- LCA AF Mk2 has better chances of finding export success with a Safran engine, particularly once Rafale production winds down inevitably. Perhaps F414 for the IAF & M88 variant on offer for any export customer is an option too.

So yes, overall it is a good idea to have a credible engine substitute if we have the appetite for additional investment of time & effort.

[Rakesh]

India, US reach ‘agreement’ on first-ever jet engine tech transfer
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/india ... -transfer/
13 April 2026

Almost 80 per cent of F-414 engine technology, IP rights to be transferred to India.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/ParthVa53135321/status/20 ... 69607?s=20 ---> People need to understand the 80% ToT. It's not --- > IP holding /Know "how" + "why". No one will share the core recipe of the hot core section. What they share is mainly how to "make that part in India".

Very well that the 80% TOT MoU was done with headline that the Single-Crystal Turbine Blades, Laser Drilling for Combustor, Powder Metallurgy all will be done in India which is great.

But Full Authority Digital Engine Control (FADEC), the brain will remain with General Electric.

Also with Single-Crystal Blades and Thermal Barrier Coatings, the exact chemical recipe for the raw alloys or the specific powders used in powder metallurgy will still be sourced from the US. India will learn how to cast & machine them, but the raw material "ingredients" won't be given obviously.

The aim was always to get maximum world class manufacturing facility in India. No one is going to share the recipe for core hot section, but GE has agreed to share the manufacturing of these parts which itself is complex. The combination of some manufacturing ecosystem from GE F414 deal and core tech IP holding from JV x IEH was plan to get to engine independence.

[Cybaru]

India, US reach ‘agreement’ on first-ever jet engine tech transfer
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/india ... -transfer/
13 April 2026

Almost 80 per cent of F-414 engine technology, IP rights to be transferred to India.

I doubt it, but we will see... Very unlikely.

[uddu]

India, US reach ‘agreement’ on first-ever jet engine tech transfer
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/india ... -transfer/
13 April 2026

I doubt it, but we will see... Very unlikely.

Agreement on paper will be there. Delivery as usual once the first few engines delivered, then the components will stop coming. F-404 can repeat. From now itself we need to create alternatives and test it on another prototype. GE and US cannot be trusted.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/livefist/status/2044052526929195355?s=20 ---> HAL & GE announce headway towards their F414 co-production deal in a statement out today:

[uddu]

Start of another episode. Eventually it will reach a stage where HAL will be waiting for components to complete their engine. I hope meanwhile Kaveri gets done and work on Kaveri 2.0 or 3.0 as replacement for F-414 also gets done.

[V_Raman]

i dont get how touch controls on a lcd/led screen is safe for plane. you need to look at them to make them work - cars are now going back to buttons to improve safety

[Rakesh]

US–India seal landmark co-production deal for fighter jet engines with historic tech transfer
https://www.moneycontrol.com/world/us-i ... 89716.html
15 April 2026

General Electric Aerospace and Hindustan Aeronautics Limited agreed to co-produce F414 engines in India, marking unprecedented US technology transfer aimed at boosting India’s fighter jet self-reliance.

[Rakesh]

https://x.com/arunp2810/status/2044702277085335833?s=20 ---> Perhaps there is light at the end of the tunnel….?