Close. Tank designed the famed Ta-152 and Ta-154 fighters. The TA-152 was an advanced version of the Focke Wulf 190.Ved wrote:Many years back I heard that Tank was involved with designing the Messerschmit (sp?) 109, Luftwaffe's famed fighter of WW2 - is he old enough?vsunder wrote:Ramana, Tank was a superb engineer.
Refit of any other engine to the HF-24 required a major redesign of the rear fuselage of the HF-24. Why didnt HAL invest time in that? only HAL knows!ramana wrote:
I still am at a loss to understand why after Koraput was making the engines a refit to the HF-2 was not contemplated.
Wow that brought back a flood of memories of that plane and that setting, back in my mind. I always wondered trying to remember the orientation of the hills in the background w.r.t. the hangers of #6 Sqn. Thank you so much.vivek_ahuja wrote:Hmm...Long time since this thread was seen alive. Time to open it up again with some new stuff...
Location: Lohegaon
Number 6 Squadron super connie before its retirement in march 1984, by which time it had been replaced with the IL-38 in the Maritime Reconnaissance role.
Guys,vivek_ahuja wrote:Thanks for pointing that out. I guess I should have been clearer in my statements.Phil Camp wrote:Dear Vivek,
these aircraft saw life after leaving 6 squadron IAF. They went onto INAS315, Indian navy where they were replaced by IL-38.
Regards Phil Camp
In any case, here is an image of the Navy Connies after retirement:
Sorry Brother, I stand corrected.Sree wrote:Chetak, with respect, can you confirm that INAS 312 is operating Dorniers now? If so, which INAS is operating the Tu-142s?
Regards
Folks,
Sorry for not replying earlier. Super Connies (they were never called only Connies in the Indian AF) are kind of my speciality. The page pointed to earlier was written by me over 10 years ago, when I wasn't that much of a aviation writer! (I am only a little bit better now)
My father was the last IAF flight commander of a complete Super Connie flight of 9 aircraft. The aircraft were handed over to the Indian Navy just as he got his Wing Commander rank in 1976. Otherwise he would have commanded 6 Squadron as his next assignment (he went on to become OC Flying of Pune AFB, which had MiG-21s and Canberras besides the Super Connies). He was also one of the last QFIs and examiners on the Super Connie, often having to travel to Pune to train and examine pilots for the last two freighter Super Connies, even as a Gp Capt.
The two freighter Super Connies were converted by Seaboard Airlines for Air India before they were handed over to the IAF. The transfer of the Super Connies was gradual, taking over a year to complete before all the Air India aircraft were handed over. This happened over 1960-1961 period. Air India was responsible for all maintenance except line maintenance till the end (1984 for both the Navy and AF) and held all its spares. Pune is only a 100 miles from Santa Cruz airport where the Air India maintenance facility for Super Connies was.
At first they were all passenger and freight aircraft and during this period they all did what were called "UK couriers" to pick up priority cargo. They flew from Bombay-Djibouti-Cairo-Rome-Orly-Northolt mostly though I think Aden was used before the troubles there got out of hand. At the peak, there was a monthly courier run. (Later only the freighters did UK couriers)
The Super Connies were earlier painted in a standard IAF transport scheme with white top half of fuselage and silver bottom half without the blue stripe running the length of the fuselage. The pictures of them here have mostly been acquired by me from various sources.
Then HAL transformed 7 of them into MR aircraft with retractable dustbin ASV-21 radome fitted into the forward baggage bay (and thus not affecting pressurization). The trials were done by Air Marshal Prithi Singh, an ETPS trained test pilot who had also flight tested the Vulcan when in the UK.
My father had completed his EO (Engr Offr) training in an experimental program where pilots were cross trained in that capacity, and was coming back to flying after a couple of years hiatus. He went to see his friend and colleague on a social visit at Air HQ and that gentleman told him he was being posted to An-12s. My dad asked him for a Super Connie appointment instead. His friend was surprised and said to him "Surely you know that the An-12s are replacing the Connie on the Courier route?" (It was a big deal to be travelling abroad in India in those times). My father said he had seen the tri-tailed aircraft as a young Pilot Officer and thought they were the most beautiful aircraft - and didn't care if he had to remain in the circuit flying them! Also it would be infinitely more exciting to fly them in a Maritime Recce role (which he termed as more "operational") than day to day cargo hauling. Probably not a great career move but he has no regrets about that.
When he arrived at the station (as Engr Offr on Migs!) he checked into training them with 6 Sqn. He encountered a great deal of hostility from the crews there. This was because all the pilots wanted to fly the 2 freighters on UK couriers (the few that remained before the An-12s took over completely) and ignored the MR conversions, and didn't want competition from a senior Mastergreen QFI on those routes! This emphasis on route flying was confirmed by no less an entity than Air Mshl PC Lal, the IAF chief responsible for the great 71 war performance of the IAF. He said that number 6 Sqn was an MR and Transport squadron with all it's emphasis on the transport role! (Since he wrote about this in 1971 and the period I am talking about is 1972, the quote is very relevant).
He had support from an amazing CO Wg Cdr Sadatullah who let him convert while working days at the MiG-21 servicing organization. The matter reached then Air Cdre Dilbagh Singh the Station Master (later Chief of Staff) who roared "I can't stop a keen flyer from flying - if he can do both jobs, bloody well let him!". Wg Cdr Sadatullah was a highly experienced pilot on Packets (C-119s) and had done so many UK couriers he had lost count.
The Northolt incident had happened in the tenure of the previous CO. The pilot in command of that flight was a well regarded acquaintance of my father and had hosted my mother for close to a month at his residence when my dad was hospitalized due to a road accident. So he was a perfect gentleman. (I always knew when my father was being nice - there was more to the story!)
He was a very smooth flyer and was very experienced on Liberators (6 Sqn). In fact he converted the ex-USAF and ex-RCAF crews that came to collect Liberators when they were taken out of service. But his instrument flying under actual conditions was "limited", shall we say.
That Northolt incident nothwithstanding, this gentleman became the CO of the squadron. My father shortly after became the OC of A Flight. The CO was also distracted by "other" matters and the best thing about him was that he let my father run the squadron as he pleased!
That Northolt incident still rankles my father because it makes IAF pilots seem incompetent. He feels that IAF transport pilots have to be trained to far higher standards than most, because they were then flying old aircraft with almost no nav aids in very difficult conditions and then also had to deal with being in sophisticated radar environments around the bigger cities. He himself cut his teeth flying C-47s in the same region as the Hump pilots, supplying Indian troops facing China. Flying instruments was second nature due to the violent weather in that part of the world. Which other Air Force in the world flew routinely where the average peak height was 20000 ft, in un-supercharged Dakotas?
Anyway, to cut a long story short my father started emphasizing the MR role a lot more, and took part in many exercises. He thought the Super Connie was the best aircraft he flew - whether at 50 ft searching for ships or on long X-countries.
However, constant vigilance is the price of competence. I showed him Stephen Piercey's article in Propliner and he remarked that most of the pilots shown there were converted to the Super Connie by him. And one of them had to be examined by him for upgrading to Captain. He was shocked to find that this person could not find out what radial he was on, let alone track one. Suffice it to say this person did not get upgraded.
BTW, I seem to remember that the last UK courier by a Super Connie was sometime in 1974. Can someone confirm that? (My father was supposed to be the third pilot on it, but a directive came down that a supernumery pilot was not required).
Thanks for the trip down memory lane - I can still remember these huge aircraft flying over the residential quarters. Amazing sight and sounds!
Another great pic ! thanks a bunchvivek_ahuja wrote:
The Revathi Mk-I during flight testing at Kanpur...
-Vivek
Rare image of the Vampire with the hinged canopy as opposed to the sliding one?Jagan wrote:Some pictures from recent updates
What is the big deal about the aircraft in this pic?
Jagan Garu:Jagan wrote: ...
Marut with blanked off cannon ports. (a pic of the same ac was already there on BR - but this one is clearer)
vivek_ahuja wrote:
Jagan,Jagan wrote:If I remember it correctly - it was a ferry flight from UK. Hve the crew member names somewhere.
Jagan wrote:http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_jpRroRLCaYc/S ... -Wreck.jpg
The Credit for this ddm-ities goes to Defence Journal of Pakistan
Rahul pl. read the article on our very own site on Gp. Capt. Suranjan Das. Your question is answered there!Rahul M wrote:BTW, what is the story behind the "24" in HF-24 ?
Well, they did shoot down an IAF Canberra over Pakistani airspace in 1959 IIRC. it was supposed to have been a covert flight but a Pakistani mole at IAF HQ gave away the flight details to the PAF and they had Sabres waiting to intercept, which of course they did neatly. The article whose picture is attached above was probably referring to that incident but DDM that they are as well, they cannot distinguish between a Canberra and a early WW-2 bomber!K Mehta wrote:sure as hell isnt a canberra, its engine is a turbojet not a prop engine in the photo and the cockpit too is different.
looking at the wiki photo of Bristol Brigand your guess seems likely.
One wonders though how many friendly fire incidents were called IAF shot down to give PAF a higher "kill ratio"?
