Terror Attacks in Mumbai - III

[CRamS]

His commandos exercised caution and restraint in the face of enormous challenges.

What is this with we Indians that we love to exercise constraint all the time.
I would like to see no constraint and total carnage of the piglets at least once dammit!!

I am not an expert on commando operations, but I must tell you, sitting from this far and glued to all the latest news, I was fearing the worst: Both Taj and Oberoi going up in balls of flame taking 100s of lives in the process. I think this was the possibility that NSG was faced with, and they proceeded ever so cautiously.

But that said, it was a massive intelligence failuer no doubt. I mean how did 20 odd pigs with so much meticulous planning, execute their diabolical plan to near perfection, and how did they manage to rake in so much ammunition undetected. This really stinks and heads ought to roll.

[Nayak]

Zardaari-al-dementi,

Todays information technology brings all your pain into our bedrooms.



He calls Karan Thapar - Sir !!!

It would have been better if we had called up Ass-phuck Kiyanahi.

Karan Thapar oiseaule needs to be put out of his misery.

[Prem]

I have been crying hoarse since satyug to see this kind of action but no one is listening. Piglest over there deny Indian constitution so there is no issue of legality , just fry them and export the halal bacon. This is the 2nd God send oppertunity to send 72 lovers to imaginary brothel up in clouds.

In one of my conversations with Uneven, until I lodt gavor with him, he also suggested that if India wanted to, it can pluck the low hanging KM fruit by the 1000s and solve the problem, but it is too civilized to do that.

But its a mistake we are repeating for the last thousand years. Let them wash their sins with prolonged Chenab isnan all the way to baki side.

[parsuram]

I would like to see no constraint and total carnage of the piglets at least once dammit!!

I am with u on that - but of course not inside an Indian city. Islamabad, Muridke, Peshawar, Lahore.

And I am beginning to see the sense in a direct chair-lift facility in Kashmir. 200 flights a day, non-stop to Houristan, 7 days a week, year-round.

N: Such charity begins at home. Specifically in the valley in Kashmir. Slow, steady, and constant - 3,5-8 or so every day. It will work wonders.

[R_Kumar]

UNSUBSTANTIATED RUMOURS - DELETED

[shiv]

But that said, it was a massive intelligence failuer no doubt. .

NO!

NOOOOOOO!

This is the favorite whipping boy of our politicians

Security is a state responsibility

And the state politicians are divisive and incompetent

EVERYONE will blame the intel agencies or the security apparatus

the buck must end with our netas.

[Sudip]

Despite spending billions on defense mango abduls get chopped down by el-cheapo made in Pakistan bullets.

Can it get any more depressing ?

defense budget allocation needs to be revised. i think the focus need to be moved from weapons of conventional wars and force projection weapons (such as refuellers to sukhois to Aircraft Carriers) to internal security maintenance infrastructure (such as guns, NVGs, Light Combat Helicopters, Better police and sodier gears, maybe even high resolution satellites to monitors maritime and land borders). In such an age things such as fighter planes are becoming more and more obsolete as chances of full fledged wars are vaning.

[klein]

Now that whole thing is done, I really think we as Bharat Rakshaks should be looking at what we can do to chip in. Firstly , I think somebody needs to address the enemy at home. Ghar Ka Bhedi Lanka Dhaaye .. Something needs to be done about the quisling journalists and "intellectuals" who seem to be the first line of the defence for the enemy.

Is there any law that can be applied agains the Arundhatis, Setalvaads and Barkha Dutts ? Anyway to discredit them in a way that they can be publicly humiliated and get them out of public life ?

Any of you guys come up with something .. count me in. Anything I can do , you have it.

[Rahul M]

R_kumar or Raju, I've NO intention of giving airtime to unsubstantiated hearsay on BRF.

Do NOT take this further.
We'll discuss it if it appears in the media. better ask the person to contact one.
Rahul.

defense budget allocation needs to be revised. i think the focus need to be moved from weapons of conventional wars and force projection weapons (such as refuellers to sukhois to Aircraft Carriers) to internal security maintenance infrastructure (such as guns, NVGs, Light Combat Helicopters, Better police and sodier gears, maybe even high resolution satellites to monitors maritime and land borders). In such an age things such as fighter planes are becoming more and more obsolete as chances of full fledged wars are vaning./

oh dear !

the ONLY reason we are attacked by a bunch of AK-47 toting gunmen and NOT Nuke toting F-16s are those very conventional weapons.
secondly, it is NOT a question of money.

THINK a little, use the BRAIN that has been given to you before you post such idiocy.

[Nayak]

Arghhh!! the fonts they are killing me.....

But on a serious note, any news on the meeting held by rajmaata and the eunuchs ?

I am glad BJP is keeping quiet. Had they criticised, Kangress rats would have accused them of taking advantage of the situation.

[ramana]

A point I have been repeatedly making is that this is TSP Terrorist attack and not local variety. All the grievances dont hold water. So dont tell me about all the local IM greivances.

We shoudlnt let this be called intel failure. thats passing the buck.

[Sudip]

R_kumar or Raju, I've NO intention of giving airtime to unsubstantiated hearsay on BRF.

Do NOT take this further.
We'll discuss it if it appears in the media. better ask the person to contact one.
Rahul.

defense budget allocation needs to be revised. i think the focus need to be moved from weapons of conventional wars and force projection weapons (such as refuellers to sukhois to Aircraft Carriers) to internal security maintenance infrastructure (such as guns, NVGs, Light Combat Helicopters, Better police and sodier gears, maybe even high resolution satellites to monitors maritime and land borders). In such an age things such as fighter planes are becoming more and more obsolete as chances of full fledged wars are vaning./

oh dear !

the ONLY reason we are attacked by a bunch of AK-47 toting gunmen and NOT Nuke toting F-16s are those very conventional weapons.
secondly, it is NOT a question of money.

THINK a little, use the BRAIN that has been given to you before you post such idiocy.

i think the agnis and prithvis that we have would keep pak and china away from carrying out full fledged wars. I think our misslie ranges are sufficient to not send sukhois if we needed to fire a nuclear bomb. Yes we need a balanced defence inventory BUT while watching these operations, I was desperately feeling the need of more small coast guard ships, coast guard helicopters, bigger coast guard manpower. These items are not as advanced and extravagant as the aircraft carriers and submarines but i think they will make a big difference. The first thing we need to set in order is our own house and then do things like aquire aircraft carriers to poke stick in other's a$$. I read the developments and test runs of LCA, and Dhruv every fortnight or so, I wish these smaller but crucial issues are taken care of too.

[Rangudu]

Even after the most horrible attack on our soil, we have people who cannot resist the temptation to pursue their favorite conspiracy theories. This is just sad, forget pathetic.

[R_Kumar]

Kelin, having your own media is a good start. It may have small viewership in the beginning but it doesn't matter.
I believe some of the BR members are working on this direction. I am ready to contribute financially annually if it materialize.

[Nayak]

The play of 'intelligence failure' is given more and more air-time.

Ratan Tata has admitted that specific intelligence was given, putting the twit CM Deshmukh in a spot.

Rajmaata is upset with Patil.

As a part of post-terror tough response, Patil will be given the boot,

Expect a committee to be set up to examine how 'co-ordination' between various state and central intelligence agencies can be 'improved'.

[Rahul M]

i think the agnis and prithvis that we have would keep pak and china away from carrying out full fledged wars.

well, you are wrong aren't you ?

I think our misslie ranges are sufficient to not send sukhois if we needed to fire a nuclear bomb. Yes we need a balanced defence inventory BUT while watching these operations, I was desperately feeling the need of more small coast guard ships, coast guard helicopters, bigger coast guard manpower. These items are not as advanced and extravagant as the aircraft carriers and submarines but i think they will make a big difference. The first thing we need to set in order is our own house and then do things like aquire aircraft carriers to poke stick in other's a$$. I read the developments and test runs of LCA, and Dhruv every fortnight or so, I wish these smaller but crucial issues are taken care of too.

whatever, it is not a question of conventional weapons OR security gear.

we NEED and can AFFORD to have BOTH.

[enqyoob]

My take is that if US security guards needed to carry the US consul-jarnail by his hands AND LEGS, that is DEFINITELY due to an overindulgence in Thanksgiving Cheer, as opposed to any sudden revelation in Dupli City. Probably created an unacceptable security hazard in the sense that the guy was about to blurt out all sorts of ITAR-controlled info with 80 Aliens around. Like the baksheesh percentages attached to the FA-18 offer. Or the phone numbers of the ladies hired by certain large corporations to "service" the Mantris as they conscientiously evaluated "proposals".

There is always the simple solution that one must not ignore in leaping to conspiracy theories.

if there had been a real emergency notification, they would just have whispered the dreaded words in his ear:

The beer-mugs are lovely, dark and deep,
but you have beepers to beep
And emails to read b4 u sleep, and emails to read b4 u sleep

[Sharma]

Mumbai - Aaye Hain Samjhane Log - http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=j4N_Y7tMNzs

I hope Indian Govt will not jump the gun and order another "Op Parakaram (Full Military mobilization against Pakistan after infamous attack of Indian Parliament on 13 Dec 2001)" like the previous BJP Govt. Reason of my saying this is not because I am anti counter-terrorism but because Indian Govt do not have balls to take Op Parakarm to its anzam (Final Objective). Instead Indian Govt removed a Lt General of our crucial strike formation during Op Parakarm just becasue his tanks mistakenly moved too close to border.

India must understand that she has to fight for her own cause. It is foolish to wait till the War-against-Terrorism show of Uncle Sam gets over. It is to be noted that US had assured India to solve Pakistani terrorism problem once they take out AL-Quida from Afghanistan and Iraq. Rubbish!!!!! And our successive govts took this bait and India is continuously bleeding.

Upon that our leaders went a one step ahead and told the world that we both (India and Pakistan) are suffering from terrorism so we both are poor victims. They did not care to elaborate the kind of terrorism we both are suffering. Pakistan is facing her own home grown terrorism and India is threatened by Pakistani exported terrorism. By this declaration India leaders have lost whatever case we had made against Pakistan for all those years.

And now India is waiting for the war in Afghanistan to get over. And even then India does not want to act on her own. They are expecting US to do someway for them.

I think we have just few more years left before this will go out of hand for anybody and India will be wounded beyond healing. This is very conservative of me not calling that India will be disintegrated.

Already so called "Hindu Terrorism" has started to crop up giving the excuse of Islamic Terrorism" and very sadly those Hindu terrorist are getting supporting voices from with in India same as their Islamic brothers get. Islamic terrorism has excuse of continuous oppressions from Hindus and Hindu terrorism has excuse of continuous torture from Islamic one. So dies have been cast for catastrophe and very soon we will be looking down the barrel.

We are on cross roads. We love to grow by 10% every year with a strong economy but we also need to have security to enjoy that financial well being. This is the time to take the fight in the heart of terrorism. Strike inside Pakistan and destroy the infrastructure. We may not be as well equipped as US to do so but it is the will power which is required most.

Strike them before we find a Delhite applying for Visa to visit Mumbai.

[enqyoob]

Gentlemen:

Time to stop the weapon systems discussion, pls? Get back to the Mumbai blasts? Or lock the dhaga and move on to other pastures to chew the cud?

[Arun_S]

For Indians in San Francisco Bay Area.
[Click to enlarge]

• Pay homage to the Victims
  Save Democarcies
  Rally In Support Of Terror Victims Of India
  
  Sunday 30'th Nov 2008 @2.30PM At Intersection of Market St. and Powell St, San Francisco
  
  Support by joining with Family & Friends
  
  Oraganized by: A coalition of community organizations united against terrorism.
  
  Car Pools from Sunnyvale and Fremont Temple at 1.00PM
  
  For more information call 408-737 7930 or 510-299-0906

[arun]

The Guardian where else :

Mumbai atrocities highlight need for solution in Kashmir

[Shreeman]

For Indians in San Francisco Bay Area.
[Click to enlarge]

• Pay homage to the Victims
  Save Democarcies
  Rally In Support Of Terror Victims Of India
  
  Sunday 30'th Nov 2008 @2.30PM At Intersection of Market St. and Powell St, San Francisco
  
  Support by joining with Family & Friends
  
  Oraganized by: A coalition of community organizations united against terrorism.
  
  Car Pools from Sunnyvale and Fremont Temple at 1.00PM
  
  For more information call 408-737 7930 or 510-299-0906

Those who go, kindlee take a

"Give peace a chance, ..."

banner/placard.

[Raju]

R_kumar or Raju, I've NO intention of giving airtime to unsubstantiated hearsay on BRF.

Do NOT take this further.
We'll discuss it if it appears in the media. better ask the person to contact one.
Rahul.

defense budget allocation needs to be revised. i think the focus need to be moved from weapons of conventional wars and force projection weapons (such as refuellers to sukhois to Aircraft Carriers) to internal security maintenance infrastructure (such as guns, NVGs, Light Combat Helicopters, Better police and sodier gears, maybe even high resolution satellites to monitors maritime and land borders). In such an age things such as fighter planes are becoming more and more obsolete as chances of full fledged wars are vaning./

oh dear !

the ONLY reason we are attacked by a bunch of AK-47 toting gunmen and NOT Nuke toting F-16s are those very conventional weapons.
secondly, it is NOT a question of money.

THINK a little, use the BRAIN that has been given to you before you post such idiocy.

Rahul,
I well understand the media-approval fetish.
But let's say if I myself saw something and reported it on this forum. You would not accept it until media said "yes, what he said is correct".

this is a tragedy, and this is the power of psy-ops.

tomorrow Rahul himself would have seen something, or his close relative would have but you too would wait for media approval.
otherwise it would be a 'conspiracy'.
will you tolerate it ?

[shynee]

CNN-IBN Ticker - Home Minister Patil offers to resign at CWC meet.

Why this bugger still hanging on to the ministry ?

[Raju]

Why are we allowing 'media' to exert undue influence over our lives or the spread of truth ?

Why do we no more trust in the human narrative ?

[enqyoob]

B nice. "Destroy the Pak Army" is halal. So is "Let Cheney Reconstruct Pakistan" is OK too.

"Partition Pakistan" is a good one.

anything starting with "nuke" etc, is haraam.

[enqyoob]

Raju: Pls note fallacy in the story above. If the Consul had to be CARRIED away, it had to be because he was too drunk to walk and was making an ass of himself.

[faraz]

Shynee, Patil was just joking. He is a shameless guy. He would not do it on his own. He would be kicked out by Rajmata or MMS.

CNN-IBN Ticker - Home Minister Patil offers to resign at CWC meet.

Why this bugger still hanging on to the ministry .?

[anishns]

Taj Mahal hotel owner: We had warning

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiap ... index.html

The Taj Mahal hotel in Mumbai, India, temporarily increased security after being warned of a possible terrorist attack, the chairman of the company that owns the hotel said Saturday.

But Tata Group Chairman Ratan Tata said those measures, which were eased shortly before this week's terror attacks, could not have prevented gunmen from entering the hotel.

"If I look at what we had ... it could not have stopped what took place," Tata said in an interview with CNN's Fareed Zakaria that will air Sunday.

"It's ironic that we did have such a warning, and we did have some measures," Tata said, without elaborating on the warning or when security measures were enacted. "People couldn't park their cars in the portico, where you had to go through a metal detector."

However, Tata said the attackers did not enter through the entrance that has a metal detector. Instead, they came in a back entrance, he said.

"The general manager lost his whole family in one of the fires in the building," Tata said. "I went up to him today and I told him how sorry I was, and he said, 'Sir, we are going to beat this. We are going to build this Taj back into what it was. We're standing with you. We will not let this event take us down.'"

Tata added, "And that is the feeling that they have, and I have a feeling that that's pretty much echoed throughout the country."

[jmaxwell]

i think the agnis and prithvis that we have would keep pak and china away from carrying out full fledged wars.

you are kidding right?

never did i envision a day where a speech from Bush would sweep me off my feet. His words on Indian resilience were more reassuring than anything the entire babudom has said so far.

[Rahul M]

Rahul,
I well understand the media-approval fetish.
But let's say if I myself saw something and reported it on this forum. You would not accept it until media said "yes, what he said is correct".

this is a tragedy, and this is the power of psy-ops.

tomorrow Rahul himself would have seen something, or his close relative would have but you too would wait for media approval.
otherwise it would be a 'conspiracy'.
will you tolerate it ?

not a fetish, just a system of acceptable filters so that anybody can't just come in, say anything and subvert the whole idea of BRF.

[Shreeman]

B nice. "Destroy the Pak Army" is halal. So is "Let Cheney Reconstruct Pakistan" is OK too.

"Partition Pakistan" is a good one.

anything starting with "nuke" etc, is haraam.

Lets stick to the old favorites, I insist:

"give peace a chance,..."

The rest is quite obvious, parchments speak of destroying something.

[milindc]

i think the agnis and prithvis that we have would keep pak and china away from carrying out full fledged wars.

you are kidding right?

never did i envision a day where a speech from Bush would sweep me off my feet. His words on Indian resilience were more reassuring than anything the entire babudom has said so far.

Yes, he wants us to be resilient and strong, not act in haste like sent Sukhoi's across the border. That will strict no-no , what will happen to war-on-terror...

[Raju]

not a fetish, just a system of acceptable filters so that anybody can't just come in, say anything and subvert the whole idea of BRF.

ok. So this 'anybody' will not pester this venerable 'media-approved' thread anymore.
thanks for conveying to me that media is the hero.
And I am a zero.

[Shreeman]

Taj Mahal hotel owner: We had warning

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiap ... index.html

The Taj Mahal hotel in Mumbai, India, temporarily increased security after being warned of a possible terrorist attack, the chairman of the company that owns the hotel said Saturday.

But Tata Group Chairman Ratan Tata said those measures, which were eased shortly before this week's terror attacks, could not have prevented gunmen from entering the hotel.

They did try hard to beef up QUITE a few things. From open sources, the chairman's statements are corroborated, and it would have been near impossible to avoid this.

The source of the problem needs attention.

[milindc]

The only silver-lining is that we didn't get dragged on with negotiations.
Relatives wailing for GoI to release Afzal Guru and Barkha wailing with them.

[skm]

The Indian 'governament' has proved itself to be feckless as usual. The pakis offered to send their DG, then called it miscommunication and took it off the table. Now even if a peon comes from ISI & tells the Chicken Tikka Masala tastes better in Delhi (behind closed doors), babudom & DDM will declare it as major 'victorey' and openness of pakis. Let's not fool ourselves here: whether it's peon or DG of ISI, we don't have anything magical to convert these guys into normal, sane beings.

Best option would be to play the peace card for unkil, auntie & abdul. And give multiple & simultaneous pig-fat-coated nukular offeringS for pakis, with a nice element of surprise. I don't think pakis have second strike capability.

Let's not kid ourselves by calling this India's 9/11. It's our Pearl Harbor in fact. We should start to think outside the boxes & norms we have unnecessarily imposed on ourselves. There is no rule that our response has to be of the same proportion; it just has to be proportionate. Like 10M times. No point in taking knives to a gun fight, especially when we have a better & bigger gun.

[Angre]

... I know this is from Wikipedia, but at least the rest of the write-up is accurate (mostly).

On 29 November, Azam Amir Kasav named his colleagues as Abu Ali, Fahad, Omar, Shoaib, Umer, Abu Akasha, Ismail Khan, Abdul Rahman (Bara), and Abdul Rahman.

The source given was this.

[Surya]

Ha - read morning papers and see fried porki plastered on it. a small pleasure

not a blurry cell cam pic - nice clear pic


Jagan

the feeling is that the terrrorists who took the taxi left the bombs in so that the taxi drivers will not live to provide any info.

not sure which fate was worse

the slit throat or your body parts flung all over.

Ramana

lists are there in desi newspapers - lots of first hand stories

maybe someone can scan and start putting them in some thread
BTW where did our urban kids pick up this habit of giving flowers to the commandos - sigh candle lovers

[animesharma]

I think, this article is a must read.

Don’t come up, I will handle them, said the hero
New Delhi: “Do not come up, I will handle them,” these were probably the last words which Major Sandeep Unnikrishnan told his men as he was hit by bullets while engaging terrorists inside the Taj.

“Major Unnikrishnan rescued an injured commando before he was hit,” Director-General of NSG J.K. Dutt said after he announced ‘mission accomplished’ at the Taj and quoted the slain major as telling his crack team, “Do not come up, I will handle them.”

“During the operation, when a commando got injured Unnikrishnan arranged for his evacuation and started chasing the terrorists himself,” a senior National Security Guard (NSG) official said here.

The terrorists escaped to another floor of the hotel and during the chase Unnikrishnan was seriously injured and succumbed to his injuries, the official said.

The other braveheart, havildar Gajendra Singh, was a specialist in heli-borne operations.

“Gajendra Singh was chosen for the Nariman House operation as he qualified for the job extremely well. He was leading the slithering act and its follow-up action,” the NSG official said, while paying homage to the slain commandos at the NSG headquarters here. —PTI

After reading this and similar articles, my respect for our jawans has reached beyond what a human being can get.