Johann,
Let me start off with the easy parts:
My citizenship or origins changes none of those ground truths
This statement is the crux
1) Ground truth? How do I know YOU are speaking that? Or should I believe it because it is YOU, of a certain citizenship and origin?
2) Your citizenship and origins matter to any Indian, because your citizenship and origins, to put it bluntly has been the root cause of a lot of crap for people of colored origin for centuries. We politely said "enough!" back in 1947, but that doesnt mean we both are cool enough to try such condescending advices in a time of national anger.
3) India is defiant at this moment. NONE of what you say in defense of your societies matters to us. That said, we shall grieve when such deaths as Mumbai's happen anywhere in the world and we shall wish the law enforcement forces in your countries well.
Johann wrote:
(a) The level of media attention to Mumbai has everything to do with the fact that Western citizens were amongst those targetted - which matters a great deal to the consumers of news back in the home countries of western media outfits.
Yes, we are in agreement on that part right from the beginning - the jihadis who till now were targeting Indians, suddenly went dumb. I am as sad as ever. Nothing changed for me. Maybe for you.
(b) I have not said anything that any number of Indians have not already said for decades regarding political inertia, and the weakness of rule of law in India.
I have not suggested for one second that India ought abandon liberal democracy - in fact that is what has allowed India to survive all of its challenges.
India needs more democracy, not less, and that means all sorts of things, from sensitivity to public concerns, to a government that takes the court system seriously. The issue is not the model, but its application.
To describe the response to Western societies as creating police states is a very poor joke. The right to civil disobedience remains - in fact there's no better way to become an instant hero - Cindy Sheehan or Brian Haw for example are instantly recognised, and are very much untouchable.
In fact I have personally heard retired Indian intelligence officers bitterly complain about the vast resources allocated to political intelligence instead of national security, which exactly mirror what has been written by other retirees in the Indian press. They expected their revelations to create a sensation, instead there was public indifference, which to them was far more crushing than the behaviour of the politicians who ordered them to spy on their opponents in the first place. Watergate simply wouldnt be a scandal in India big enough to bring down a government.
I have been to Chicago last June-July and I personally heard Obama say that white people oppress black people. See? I too got instant credibility for my Colombian dark matter.
Here is another. I know Cindy Sheehan - poor lady never exerted any influence other than that exerted by Jennifer Anniston. She ended up as a sick propaganda peace both inside and outside US. My proof? You are using her here! Tell me what material difference did her brave campaign do to change the fatcats of DC from their ways? None.
(b) You have misunderstood absolutely everything I ever said about MS-13, or similar gangs.
The point was that gangs do not operate out of ideology, or as defenders of community. They operate for profit.
If you think the Cripps are the Black Panthers, or proto-Black Panthers, its sheer fantasy.
They kill anyone weaker than them who stand in their way. Typically that means individuals in their areas who stand up to them (e.g. business or community leaders), or attempt to compete with them for the drug trade. Hence inevitably, the majority of their victims come from *exactly* the same background as them.
Cripps=Black Panthers with a good financial model. Try joining Cripps and get back to me with how the interview went.
I never said ideology, you did. Ideology is something that can be quashed easily in the west. The Chicago univ types make sure of that. But money, now that is an awesome tool. A fact that the "gangs" since Black Panthers found out. BTW, take that as a non-white's viewpoint.
MS-13 started off as a protection racket. Let me drop a name - an officer who later became a Police chief in a US metro area and I used to train for a certain certification (purely sports affair) together. Did his stint with homicide/violent crimes and SWAT at a biggish metro area. Said MS13 was initially very protective of El Salvadorean youth, who were targeted by other gangs and law enforcement.
Again you might also have missed my earlier point: these gangs find that they are being snitched upon by their own community and start going on a rampage against their own kind. They are conveyed in no uncertain terms that gora and only gora is off limits for violence. end result? peaceful "Martha Stewart Living" ambiance for goras, hell for the rest (including central/south americans). Divide and rule, in my books.
If you think that the majority of Latinos in America live in gang contolled areas, that too is fantasy. Spanish Harlem, or East-Central LA are not the kinds of places where the majority of Hispanics in America live. For that matter, the majority of African-Americans do not live in deprived inner-city ghettos - they live in small towns and suburbs throughout the American south occupying every niche in the socio-economic ladder that exists in those areas.
Which is why the most powerful and effective minority leaders have been civil society leaders who represent those perfectly normal communities, people like Ceasr Chavez, or Martin Luther King, not criminals or radicals.
Ceaser Chavez was never threatening. He worked his ass off inside the Latinos, but conformed to dhimmitude. MLK is a different story. He started challenging the spin. And he promptly died of violence "inflicted by his own community member".
All of this is perfectly irrelevant to the thread.
And yet you air dropped a huge load of names and strawmen to my original post
Any other time, I dont really care, because I love the warm feeling of sunshine being blown up my ass. But not today.
You are accusing OUR government of continuous ineptitude leading to a huge loss of Indian lives and subtly sowing questions into our mind about some stuff that you are saying is the truth. Your claims of Indian intel chiefs confiding with you just confirms that.
George J, I heard worries about long lead times in US too. Though in public they never say that.
