Military Flight Safety

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 22 Jan 2009 05:28

http://www.hindu.com/2009/01/22/stories ... 051100.htm

The mangled remains of the Surya Kiran aircraft at Bellura village near Bidar, Karnataka, on Wednesday. At right, Wing Commander R.S. Dhaliwal, who was killed in the crash.

Surya Kiran pilot killed in crash
M.B. Girish

The incident occurred during a routine practice session by IAF’s aerobatics team

BIDAR: The pilot of a Surya Kiran of the Indian Air Force was killed when the aircraft crashed on an open field at Bellura village close to the Air Force Station (AFS) here on Wednesday.

Wing Commander R.S. Dhaliwal (37), a native of Punjab, was on a routine practice session along with members of the aerobatics team when the incident occurred.

According to police, the team began the practice at 8 a.m. and the incident occurred at 8.35 a.m.

AFS officials said the “black box” of the aircraft was recovered and an enquiry ordered to find the cause of the crash.

In the impact of the crash, the aircraft’s engine and wings got separated and the pilot’s body strewn across the area. A youth from a village near Bellura said two aircraft were engaged in practice and when they came near a lake, one of them turned upside down and “crashed” moments later.

“There was an explosion after the crash and the pieces of the aircraft went high in the air. The sound of explosion was deafening,” he said.

Another villager said by the time he and other villagers arrived at the spot, the aircraft was in flames.

Air Officer Commanding Ramesh Rai Air Commondore, Air Force Station, Bidar, rushed to the spot after the crash. Bidar Superintendent of Police and Deputy Commissioner Harsh Gupta were also at the spot.

Officials of the AFS, Bidar, cordoned off the site and erected tents to conduct examination of the area.
------------------------------
Pilot killed in aircraft crash
January 22nd, 2009
By Our Correspondent

Jan. 21: An Indian Air Force (IAF) aircraft of the Surya Kiran aerobatic team crashed here on Wednesday killing the pilot.
The incident took place behind the Bidar Air Force Station (AFS) near Bellur village on the outskirts of Bidar city at about 8.45 am. The aircraft was being piloted by Wing Commander R.S. Dhaliwal when it crashed during a regular training sortie, AFS air officer commander (AOC) Ramesh Rai said.

The flight data recorder, generally referred to as the Black Box was recovered from the accident spot. The reason for the accident will be known only after an investigation into the data in the black box. A court of inquiry has been ordered into the incident, Mr Rai said.

The wreckage of the indigenously made Kiran Mk-II aircraft, with the body of the pilot was found lying about 150 metres from the impact site. According to eye-witnesses the accident took place when three Suryakiran aircraft were on a formation manoeuvre.

“The three planes were flying in a formation. Two of the planes took an upward thrust while the third left the formation, took a dive towards the ground and crashed,” said Syed Khayyum of Bellur village who witnessed the tragedy.

Eye-witnesses claimed that the fateful aircraft, flying at a low altitude, caught fire in mid-air before crashing into the ground. The Suryakiran aircraft during their aerobatic formation were operating between a height of 30 to 1,500 metre at speeds ranging between 200 and 600 kmph.

Wednesday’s accident is the second in the history of the Surya Kiran team. On March 18, 2006 two pilots, Wing Commander Dheeraj Bhatia and Squadron Leader Shailendra Singh were killed when a Surya Kiran aircraft crashed on the outskirts of Bidar city.
Wing Commander Dhaliwal hails from Punjab.
------------------------------------------
IAF pilot killed in Bidar plane crash

DH News Service, Bidar:

An Indian Air Force fighter pilot, Wing Commander R S Dhaliwal, 35, was killed when his aircraft crashed behind the Air Force station compound near Belur village on the Bidar city outskirts during a routine flying training exercise on Wednesday.

Confirming the death of Dhaliwal, IAF officers said a formation of three Surya Kiran aircraft were on a routine flying exercise when the mishap occurred.

The black box of the aircraft was retrieved from the crash site and the area cordoned off.
Senior IAF officers said the exact cause of the accident was not known and a court of inquiry had been ordered into it.

Syed Qayum Saheb, a resident of S M Krishna Nagar near the crash site, told Deccan Herald that he saw a three-aircraft formation flying when one of them suddenly came down low, crashing and bursting into flames.
Wing Commander Dahliwal, a MiG-29 fighter pilot, was flying in preparation for the upcoming Aero India scheduled to be held next month at Yelahanka in Bangalore.

A native of Patiala, Punjab, he was the son of a retired IAF officer and a member of the Surya Kiran Aerobatic Team (SKAT) with 2,100 hours of flying experience. He joined the team recently and is survived by two sons, a daughter and wife Rubina.

Aerial survey

Air Commodore Ramesh Rai and senior IAF officers visited the spot. It was also learnt that a team of Air Force officers from Air Force Station Hakimpet, Hyderabad, made an aerial survey of the crash site, as the aircraft wreckage was spread over 100 metres.

An IAF pilot said: “It is unlikely that an engine failure could have caused the crash, because on a Kiran Mk II aircraft flying at high speed the pilot would have had adequate reaction time to make a transmission, eject or attempt a ‘dead stick’ landing.

“Evidently, the pilot was suddenly incapacitated either due to a bird-hit or because of a health problem. Alternately taking a tight turn after a ‘crossover’, any fouling of the aircraft controls would have made it hit the ground.”

In March 2006, two SKAT pilots Squadron Leader Shailendra Singh and Wg Cdr D Bhatia, were also killed in a crash.

The Surya Kiran aircraft or Kiran Mk II (HJT-16) were manufactured in Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd, Bangalore, between 1986-88.

Being part of an aerobatic display team, these aircraft generally log a much lower number of flying hours than those aircraft which belong to the IAF operational squadrons, according to sources.

http://www.deccanherald.com/Content/Jan ... updatenews
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shiv · Post by **shiv** » 06 Mar 2009 17:34

One Saras prototype has crashed in Bidadi near Bangalore at about 3-45 PM today (6 March 2009). All 3 occupants killed.

Sadly - I actually saw the beautifully painted Saras approach HAL airport for a landing at about 3-15 PM but was surprised to note that it did not land - but saw it climbing powerfully. I presumed it was a "touch and go" where it touches down and takes off again - I have only ever seen transport aircraft do that presumably in training flights. So it did surprise me a bit to see the Saras do that. I hvve never ever seen any of the prototypes of any aircraft do that at HAL and I see them a lot.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 06 Mar 2009 18:52

Absolutely tragic.My heart goes out to the families of the test pilots.Saras has been a project that has been difficult because it was earlier supposed to have been a JV with a Russian manufacturer,Myasichev.

M-102 'Duet' mockup at MAKS-97, courtesy of Serge Lazukov;
Twin-pusher turboprop passenger aircraft, joint project with the National Aerospace Laboratory of India. It is designed for short-range hot (up to 45o and high (up to 2000m) operations, and may be powered by Pratt&Whitney PT6A-67 engines for export or Mars TVD-20M for use in the CIS.
Expected market is ~300 of the aircraft in India, at a unit cost of US$3.5-4 million.
Project passed through severe financial problems in 1995-1997.
The Smolensk Aviation Plant JSC has produced an airplane mockup, presente

US sanctions were imposed when the project was already passing through the difficult phase. Tremendous delay for the project to get sanctioned and the non-availability of funds affected the project badly. This delay caused cost escalation and made imperative to re-study the relevance of the aircraft in the changing market scenario. Added to this newly imposed sanctions forced the project team to look for alternate systems. Due to this many re-design aspects were thought off and many of the material procurement activities had to start off all over aga

Later on the NAL decided to go it alone and the first prototype flew quite overweight.SARAS registerd its first flight on 29 May 2004. The aircraft took off from the HAL airport just after 8.20 a.m. with Sq Ldr K K Venugopal and Wg Cdr R S Makker, IAF test pilots, in command. SARAS climbed steadily to its maximum altitude. After a 25-minute triangular detour, when the aircraft flew over Anekal and Malur at an altitude of about 7000 feet and at speeds in the range of 110-140 knots, the SARAS landed safely at about 8.45 a.m at HAL airport. Two 'chase' IAF Kiran aircraft and an IAF helicopter flew alongside SARAS during its maiden flight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NAL_Saras

Technical problems

The designed empty weight of the aircraft was supposed to be around 4,125 kg. But first prototype i.e PT-1 weights around 5,118 kg which means it is overweight by 993 kg. This resulted in the originally chosen 850 hp PT6A-66 Pratt and Whitney engine being replaced by a 1,200 hp engine of the same PT6A family in the second prototype.[10]. According to NAL the basic structure and the landing gear have enough margins to handle this increased all-up weight. To cut the weight of the aircraft NAL plans to increase percentage of composite used mainly focusing on wings and tail by the third prototype which is expected to weight 500 kg less than earlier prototypes.

Currently two prototype aircraft are flying. The Saras PT1 aircraft, powered by 850HP P&W engines and 5-bladed 85” diameter Hartzell propellers has made 125 flights and has logged around 70 hrs. This was flown in Aero India 2007 . Currently, work is progressing in all aspects towards building the weight optimized Production Standard Aircraft (PSA), with a targeted weight reduction of 500kg. PSA is expected to have its first flight in the year 2009. [11]

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 06 Mar 2009 18:59

Planes that mysteriously come crashing down mid flight tend to have suffered catastrophic structural failures. This one came down over 10 Km fom HAL - but I don't know if it was on an approach path or heading out or what.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 06 Mar 2009 19:08

tragic , a gent I know (senior retired NAL person) worked as a contractor on the proj well past his official retirement.

vina · Post by **vina** » 06 Mar 2009 22:20

Terrible news.

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 07 Mar 2009 01:32

I dunno if we need a new thread for this. But we may as well collate information here and see how the media responds to this.

Three IAF pilots dead.

"The deceased pilots were Squadron Leader Ilairaj, Wing Commander Praveen and Wing Commander Shah. "

http://www.livemint.com/2009/03/0621523 ... r-the.html

http://sify.com/news/fullstory.php?id=1 ... vsv=TopHP1

Delete if this thread is not required.

James B · Post by **James B** » 07 Mar 2009 02:13

RIP to the pilots

Yogi_G · Post by **Yogi_G** » 07 Mar 2009 02:21

NAL-made Saras plane crashes near Bangalore killing 3

My condolences to the families of those deceased...we have lost fine people from our midst

At the same time I fear that this crash will further delay the SARAS project a la CABS style...

skher · Post by **skher** » 07 Mar 2009 02:28

Cybaru wrote:I dunno if we need a new thread for this. But we may as well collate information here and see how the media responds to this.

Three IAF pilots dead.
"The deceased pilots were Squadron Leader Ilairaj, Wing Commander Praveen and Wing Commander Shah. "

http://www.livemint.com/2009/03/0621523 ... r-the.html

http://sify.com/news/fullstory.php?id=1 ... vsv=TopHP1

Parachutes must be provided.It is a small aircraft and eight parachutes sets are feasible. The autopilot can buy time to deploy chutes and crash towards the sea.

Lives are far more important than repairable prototypes.

Saras has great potential to compete well in the Very Light Jet market and become a leader.

Hope this event boldens and strenghtens our resolve.

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 07 Mar 2009 02:45

Just to clarify, it's a light turbo-prop and not a jet.

dipak · Post by **dipak** » 07 Mar 2009 02:51

Really unfortunate ...major setback to SARAS program, more unfortunate is the loss of our fine pilots!

abhishek · Post by **abhishek** » 07 Mar 2009 02:57

RIP pilots....I hope we don't let what they did during their lifetime go waste.....

kobe · Post by **kobe** » 07 Mar 2009 04:58

Sad news but hopefully this will kick NAL to be more vigilant about:

- software testing
- aircraft maintenance
- engine maintenance
- safety standards
- etc.

test flying new aircraft is indeed dangerous, but there is someone somewhere who did not do their job and 3 pilots lost their lives.

how come agile LCA can have a "clean" test-flight record while slow-goose saras be so dangerous to fly and test? There must be a reason.

edited later:
NAL link

The buggers at NAL website have no mention of the crash, I was hoping at least a condolences message for the pilots. Had it been a milestone, the marquee would be tickering along immediately to take credit.

Kailash · Post by **Kailash** » 07 Mar 2009 05:24

Very unfortunate. Lives lost...May their souls rest in peace.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 07 Mar 2009 05:50

RIP.

India's prototype Saras push-prop crashes outside Bangalore

Indian reports, quoting the air force, state that the aircraft had been undertaking a test during which the engine power was reduced.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 07 Mar 2009 06:20

Some more details in this report.

Bangalore: A Saras Prototype II, an indigenously developed multi-role transport aircraft, which was on a test flight, crashed near Bidadi, 30 km from here, on Friday killing three Indian Air Force officers. The reason for the crash is yet to be ascertained.

Pilot Wing Commander K. Praveen, co-pilot Wing Commander D.K. Shah and flight test engineer Squadron Leader S. Ilyaraj were charred to death as the aircraft burst into flames soon after it crashed in an open field, a few hundred meters away from Seshagirihalli colony that has around 100 houses.

According to NAL officials, the aircraft lost contact with the Air Traffic Control (ATC) at 3.30 p.m. It was on a routine test flight, officials said.

Sources said that such sorties were done twice a day and the aircraft took the same route for its training sorties.

“We saw the aircraft coming down abruptly and followed the direction in which it went. It turned abruptly and started losing height. After a couple of somersaults in mid-air, it crashed. I could notice smoke from a distance,” said Anand, an eyewitness. “As we went close, we heard two loud blasts. Except the tail-end of the aircraft, everything was burnt,” he added. Mr. Anand, a resident of Ramanagara, who was driving with his friend on the Mysore Road, claimed he informed the Ramanagara police immediately.

Fearing for their safety, a few residents of Seshagirihalli Colony who rushed to the spot did not venture near the burning aircraft as they heard another explosion. The three experienced pilots along with the aircraft had taken part in the recently concluded Aero India 2009.

While Wing Commander Praveen (35) was a resident of Bangalore, Squadron Leader Ilyaraja (33) was from Villupuram in Tamil Nadu and Wing Commander Saha (34) was a native of Mumbai.

Aircraft debris, including the propeller and parachute, were found strewn around the area, and some partially burnt parts were recovered as much as 500 metres away from the crash site.

As the surging crowd threatened to run over the crash site,

the police cordoned off the area to help the Indian Air Force officials locate the data recorder, cockpit voice recorder and other details that could provide reasons for the crash.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 07 Mar 2009 06:33

I feel so sorry for the three bereaved families. Parents have lost sons, kids have lost their dads

I still haven't figured out whether t was prototype 1 or 2 that crashed. Reports that say that this aircraft had 4000 hours suggests it may have been the older one.

Other reports have stated that they were doing a test in which "engine power was lowered" and one report speaks of an engine restart test. But they would never stop and restart at such a low altitude and over built up areas. There must have been some kind of catastrophic mechanical failure.

Let us wait for the investigation reports.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 07 Mar 2009 06:36

This is the THIRD thread. Info already exists in two other threads and the "Flight Safety" thread was started for the same reason as this thread - but to serve as a record of all accidents - which we used to lose and forget. That is why we have a single long running thread.

I would request moving all info here to the long running flight safety thread where even info that appears a year later can be added.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 07 Mar 2009 06:42

Shiv'ji, while I cannot confirm if it was P-I or P-II, the latest article I posted in this thread does mention it to be P-II. On this note, what is the Indian equivalent of NTSB ?

P.S.: Cybaru's thread has been merged with this one. Thanks.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 07 Mar 2009 07:36

any video of the descent that some body captured? well.. its in a halli, so i just can't think of it.. we have to go by halli people what they saw.

this is really shocking for NAL.. they were doing so good thus far.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 07 Mar 2009 07:40

Some other paper mentioned it was PT2 , VT-XRM

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 07 Mar 2009 07:41

JaiS wrote:RIP.

India's prototype Saras push-prop crashes outside Bangalore

Indian reports, quoting the air force, state that the aircraft had been undertaking a test during which the engine power was reduced.

that is sad indeed.. may be they lost height fast and could not catch up powering up in enough time. NAL will think about improve engines i hope after this..

is there a flight recorder for saras?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 07 Mar 2009 07:55

Pilots presence of mind saves several lives on City outskirts
NAL plane crashes near Bidadi, kills 3 on board
Bangalore:
A National Aerospace Laboratory (NAL) test aircraft, Saras, crashed and went up in flames killing all the three on board, including two pilots, near Bidadi on Mysore Road on Friday evening.

The aircraft took off from HAL Airport around 2:55 pm and, after flying for nearly half an hour, it hovered as low as 50 metres above the ground and came down crashing in an open field in the Mega City area at Seshagiri village near Bidadi, about 26 km from the City.

The two pilots and a flight test engineer on board—Wg Cdr K Praveen (35), Wg Cdr DK Shah (34) and Sq Ldr Ilayaraja (32)—were killed. Police said their bodies were charred beyond recognition. However, there was no official communication from the NAL about the crash. Sources said Praveen was from Banashankari, Bangalore, while Shah and test flight engineer Ilayaraja were from Mumbai and Villupuram, respectively.

According to sources, the pilots in their last bid to save their lives, tried in vain to open the parachutes. The remains of the parachutes were found scattered at the accident spot.

As part of the rescue operation, three helicopters, carrying a team of officials, were rushed to the spot.
Seshagiri villagers were all praise for the pilots for their presence of mind. “Hats off to the pilots for their presence of mind at the time of crisis. There are more than three petrol pumps and hundreds of houses in the vicinity. Imagine the magnitude of the tragedy had the aircraft crashed in the village.

“They averted a major disaster and saved several lives. The pilots sensed the danger and were searching for a vacant plot for safe landing. That’s why they took two rounds, but it came down crashing.”

Deccan Herald caught up with an eyewitness—Rangaswamy, president of Seshagiri Dairy—who first saw the aircraft crashing. He soon alerted the police and the fire department.

“I was taken aback seeing the huge metal bird coming so close to the ground. I called my people, and even as we watched in shock, the aircraft took two circular rounds and came down with a thud. Within seconds, we heard another loud noise followed by a blast and a huge fireball, which went up almost 100 ft high. While the people rushed to the spot, within 5-7 minutes, another blast occurred. The impact of the second blast was three times the first one.

“Between the two blasts, we saw a young man, with a major portion of his body caught inside the burning metal pieces, trying to crawl out. For nearly half-an-hour after the second blast, there was no visibility, as the area was completely covered with thick smoke,” Anand added.

Many residents echoed the same view saying: “The pilots saved many lives by guiding the faulty aircraft to an open field, but when they (pilots) were burnt alive, right in front of our eyes. We were forced to stand and watch helplessly.”

Some people at the site captured the burning wreckage of plane on their mobile phones and shared the clippings with television channels.

DH News Service

http://deccanherald.com/Content/Mar7200 ... updatenews

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 07 Mar 2009 08:10

SaiK wrote: NAL will think about improve engines i hope after this..

Because you think that the engines were at fault (among a thousand other factors which could be responsible for this) ? Please refrain from idle speculation unless you have solid data to back your assertions.

SaiK wrote:
is there a flight recorder for saras?

Yes, kindly read other posts in this thread for more information.

Dmurphy · Post by **Dmurphy** » 07 Mar 2009 08:19

I sincerely hope that NAL will keep up its efforts to perfect the aircraft in all aspects. Hope this incident doesn't deal a killer blow to the project. I know a lot of efforts and money has gone into it. Besides, for noobs like me its too beautiful an aircraft to abandon. Saras has many hopes riding on it.

rahuldevnath · Post by **rahuldevnath** » 07 Mar 2009 08:35

It's really sad, 30 hours to certification, the second prototype and 3 pilots lost. Indeed a major blow to Saras project. But the fact remain a transport aircraft crashing comes at much higher cost, 3 lives in this case.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 07 Mar 2009 10:33

VT-XRM departed HAL airport at 14:55 (09:25Z) for an "engine off" test with a crew of three. HAL ATC lost contact with the aircraft at 15:30 (10:00Z) and reports the plane crashing were received at 15:40 (10:10Z).

The crash site is in a barren deserted area at 252 radial BBG VOR at 17nm DME, this is near Bidadi and the Wonder La theme park on Mysore Road.
http://www.bangaloreaviation.com/2009/0 ... es-at.html

Kapil · Post by **Kapil** » 07 Mar 2009 11:05

I cant get over this.

I read this in the papers today and time stood still.

I knew Praveen and Dipesh.
Both full of life,their humour masking their brilliance.

I first met Praveen when he was assigned to the Saras team more than one and a half year back.He started out in Hunters,was involved in the Mig27 upgrade and the MKI projects.He could explain the most difficult concepts with a flair that made me wish he ended up as an instructor.
I met him and S/L Ilayraja at the show this time.They had come to the BR Stall along with Soggy Krishna.
The pic shows Ilayraja,Soggy,Praveen and W/C Jaswal.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/media/Aer ... 6.jpg.html

I had met Dipesh at someone's farewell last year.I was thrilled at finding Gujju test pilot from Mumbai.The banter continued for a long time.Common friends were discovered.Favourite planes were discussed.He had just been posted to the Saras team.He hadn't started flying yet,but was looking forward to it as she looked very good.
We had planned on catching up when he would come to Mumbai.

Sadly,Winco Dhaliwal of the Suryakirans was also at that party with Dipesh.Dhali died in Jan.A brilliant instructor,gallantry award winner in Kargil for night bombing.He wasnt a talker,but you always listened when he said something.He was a passionate quizzer and could MC a party with infinite guests with a non-chalance that had to be seen to be believed.

We have lost 4 good men already this year.4 men who saved other lives in the process.The consolation is that they died doing what they loved the most.

I only wish that the media highlights such stories.We are still full of stories about foreign stuff.The Saras crash shows that we are doing cutting edge stuff in our own country.The people who lose their lives in the process are no less than the IPL cricketers,Bollywood stars etc.
Sorry guys,can't talk anymore.
I will put up pics of Dhali and Dipesh when I can.

manju · Post by **manju** » 07 Mar 2009 11:26

My fears were just confirmed. Got a call from Blore from a freind, it is the same Praveen that went to school with me. We all went to same school- Ramakrishan Vidyashal Mysore. He was very good in studies and could have made it into any of the medical or engineering college in Karnataka but he was always interested in being a pilot. I always envied him becuase he followed his passion and I could not (my parents did not want me to join the military), though I was very keen on it.

He flew many sorties during the Kargil war.

I cant believe that this guy is no more. A handful of our buddies were to getogether in Blore and Iwas supposed to call them.

He is survived by his wife and a daughter.

May his soul rest in peace.

sum · Post by **sum** » 07 Mar 2009 11:30

So, they were all serving pilots?

I thought NAL employed ex-IAF to do the flight testing given that Saras is a civilian plane?

Sad how life twists and turns in a few days!!!! All the SARAS crew smiling away in the AI-09 pic and now tragically lost forever...

Kapil · Post by **Kapil** » 07 Mar 2009 11:43

Hi Manju,

Pass my condolences to the family if you can.

He was so into flying was that as a test pilot,one who has done so much-his head would still tilt if he heard the sound of an aircraft while he was talking to you.

Gems.All of them.

Kapil · Post by **Kapil** » 07 Mar 2009 12:07

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/media/Aer ... h.JPG.html

Winco Dipesh Shah.He's at the right.In white.

K Mehta · Post by **K Mehta** » 07 Mar 2009 12:24

Rest in Peace

m mittal · Post by **m mittal** » 07 Mar 2009 13:40

My heartfelt condolences to the family of the deceased.

I think every country who has been involved in aircraft development has had accidents and they learned from such accidents grew wiser and came out even stronger.

I hope the life of the IAF pilots does not go waste and Saras becomes a big reality.

I am a bit concerned about the schedules of Saras being delivered to IAF as a replacement to An-32.

kobe · Post by **kobe** » 07 Mar 2009 14:06

m mittal wrote:My heartfelt condolences to the family of the deceased.

I am a bit concerned about the schedules of Saras being delivered to IAF as a replacement to An-32.

I think you are wrong about AN-32 replacement.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 07 Mar 2009 14:20

Kapil wrote:

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/media/Aer ... h.JPG.html

Winco Dipesh Shah.He's at the right.In white.

vina · Post by **vina** » 07 Mar 2009 18:22

Very tragic. Heartfelt condolences to the families of the three brave men.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 07 Mar 2009 18:45

<deleted by self> Don't want to speculate.

There was a parachute seen outside. Does the Saras have an anti-spin parachute?

krishna_j · Post by **krishna_j** » 08 Mar 2009 00:58

Heard the tragic news from Shiv yday - the loss of a prototype is a setback to any program me

At that time it didnt register that 3 of the test pilots had also perished tragically - which is a double whammy

as a coincidence HAL's Pilot magazine issue of Feb had an excellent and rare article lauding the leading Indian test pilots and their contributions - will scan and put it up

the pilots have to be eulogised for steering the Saras prototype away from the densely populated areas and petrol pumps and hence needing two sorties to identify an open area - the delay was probably fatal

There is an article on a Chinese Aviation forum of the Chinese test pilot saving the Chengdu J-10 prototype in 1999 after the engine flamed out and refusing to bail out in order to save the machine ; inspite of orders to the contrary (from "benevolent" Chinese authority no doubt

) - but that had a happy ending as Salyut's Russian AL-31 FN (same stable on the Su-27/30 series) is a lot more rugged and a few "proverbial kicks" reigniting the engine.

in fact the world wide fraternity of test pilots acts with a uniform code viz in times of catastrophic distress and imminent loss of control of the prototype , machine preservation and public safety gain precedence over saving own lives

The Saras team no doubt imbibed the same code - though I wish there was a Happier ending.