Indian Space Program Discussion

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 19 Jun 2009 12:50

We could go in for joint development with Russia, for example, to defray the costs. We've had success with them on things like BrahMos in the past.

I don't necessarily agree that a nuclear-fueled rocket is less safe, since it could be run on a particle-bed reactor with an extremely high fuel burn-up fraction. The reactor itself could be kept in a solidly designed module that could be quickly jettisoned in the event of malfunction.

India should at least research the particle-bed reactor technology, since it could have broader applications, and it's important to keep abreast of the full spectrum of nuclear technologies as they become more feasible.

In space, you're being exposed to quite a lot of cosmic radiation anyway, so that radiation from a shielded reactor is the least of the concerns.

arunsrinivasan · Post by **arunsrinivasan** » 19 Jun 2009 13:36

Sanjay M wrote:We could go in for joint development with Russia, for example, to defray the costs. We've had success with them on things like BrahMos in the past.

I don't necessarily agree that a nuclear-fueled rocket is less safe, since it could be run on a particle-bed reactor with an extremely high fuel burn-up fraction. The reactor itself could be kept in a solidly designed module that could be quickly jettisoned in the event of malfunction.

India should at least research the particle-bed reactor technology, since it could have broader applications, and it's important to keep abreast of the full spectrum of nuclear technologies as they become more feasible.

In space, you're being exposed to quite a lot of cosmic radiation anyway, so that radiation from a shielded reactor is the least of the concerns.

The risk of nuclear power is during launch i.e. what happens if the rocket fails either at launch pad or during ascent & spreads radiation. This fear is holding back USA & probably Russia from pursuing nuclear rockets, it is also a PR nightmare.

On a more general note, I think ISRO (and Indian Governement) at the moment lacks visionaries, we tend to be reactive, rather than proactive. Only after we realised how much China has progressed its Space Program, have we started thinking big, e.g. Manned Space Program, but it is still a reactive rather than proactive. What we lack is vision, not abilities or talent, in ISRO we have a fantastic & very effective organisation, unlike most government entities. I really wish someone started with a clean slate & thought 40 -50 years ahead & come up with big goals for Indian Space program, the way Vikram Sarabhai, Satish Dhawan etc. did so many years back.

It is high time we moved on from our focus on 3rd world objectives to more 1st world objectives (for want of a better word!). A good way to start would be to ask the questions How can we get ahead of China? How can we contribute to Space Science e.g. Hubble Space telescope or something even bigger? How do we collaborate as equals with NASA, ESA, Russian Space Agency et. al.

SivaVijay · Post by **SivaVijay** » 19 Jun 2009 13:48

It's true that India should work on a Pebble-Bed reactor....With the Fusion prj in France getting stalled as per BBC we need other alternatives.(By the way what happened to the 2nd/third stage of our nuclear program Thorium-Uranium cycle can gurus shed some light? Is it being ignored for this nuklear deal)

The hard part is designing the reactor module strong enough to withstand the stresses involved in liftoff and subsequent stresses during flight and at the same time making it light enough to have enough thrust to lift off...The risk is due to a possible breach in the containment because of these high stress factors...jus my 2 cents

Kailash · Post by **Kailash** » 19 Jun 2009 14:29

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... f=1&t=4955 thats where nuclear discussions happen..

symontk · Post by **symontk** » 19 Jun 2009 16:07

It is high time we moved on from our focus on 3rd world objectives to more 1st world objectives (for want of a better word!). A good way to start would be to ask the questions How can we get ahead of China? How can we contribute to Space Science e.g. Hubble Space telescope or something even bigger? How do we collaborate as equals with NASA, ESA, Russian Space Agency et. al.

This is against the entire vision projected by ISRO. ISRO does not want to compete in Space or do fancy things. It is the organization to provide part in the meaningful development of India.

Also what do India get if we get ahead of China in space? Do you mean that with current Sapce Technology that India have, we arent ahead of China? How do you know that india is not ahead of China in space? Hubble space telescope is mainly used to spy on other countries rather that taking breath photos of cosmos if you don't know that. Where is the money in India to build a HST at present? We might do it sometime later when the right moment comes. India with the limited resources available, has to go step by step

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 19 Jun 2009 16:49

SivaVijay wrote:It's true that India should work on a Pebble-Bed reactor....With the Fusion prj in France getting stalled as per BBC we need other alternatives.(By the way what happened to the 2nd/third stage of our nuclear program Thorium-Uranium cycle can gurus shed some light? Is it being ignored for this nuklear deal)

The hard part is designing the reactor module strong enough to withstand the stresses involved in liftoff and subsequent stresses during flight and at the same time making it light enough to have enough thrust to lift off...The risk is due to a possible breach in the containment because of these high stress factors...jus my 2 cents

Pebble-Bed Reactor is quite different from a Particle-Bed Reactor. The smaller size of the particle fuel elements allows for more interfacial contact, and thus higher generated power-density, which is important for applications like space launch.

arunsrinivasan wrote:The risk of nuclear power is during launch i.e. what happens if the rocket fails either at launch pad or during ascent & spreads radiation. This fear is holding back USA & probably Russia from pursuing nuclear rockets, it is also a PR nightmare.

On a more general note, I think ISRO (and Indian Governement) at the moment lacks visionaries, we tend to be reactive, rather than proactive. Only after we realised how much China has progressed its Space Program, have we started thinking big, e.g. Manned Space Program, but it is still a reactive rather than proactive. What we lack is vision, not abilities or talent, in ISRO we have a fantastic & very effective organisation, unlike most government entities. I really wish someone started with a clean slate & thought 40 -50 years ahead & come up with big goals for Indian Space program, the way Vikram Sarabhai, Satish Dhawan etc. did so many years back.

Let's face it, for space launch, you need much more muscular power scales than is offered by chemical fuels. Only nuclear fuel offers that. A reusable nuclear SSTO could not only get mankind to the Moon, but to Mars as well. Such a craft could also use nuclear-electric plasma thrust or ion propulsion to cover larger interplanetary distances using much less fuel mass.

Perhaps it could initially be done as a HTHL design, allowing the technology to be tested more safely on an aircraft. Then later on, once the technology is seen as more mature, it could be converted to VTVL.

Shankar · Post by **Shankar** » 19 Jun 2009 17:42

to start with we need a reactor small enough to fit the payload bay -and that is some way off and then make the containment chamber strong enough to with stand lift off stress both mechanical and acoustic and then thermal stress of deep space -that is some way off

pebble bed reactor i think is being tried by south africa -shall post ref if can locate

thorium base reactor work is going on fine but may be a bit slow

Shankar · Post by **Shankar** » 19 Jun 2009 17:45

he Bhabha Atomic Research Centre (BARC), Mumbai, has developed an advanced heavy water reactor (AHWR) to expedite transition to thorium-based systems. The reactor physics design of AHWR is timed to generate about 65 per cent power from thorium. The Chairman, Atomic Energy Commission, Dr Anil Kakodkar, revealed this while talking to PIB Special Services in Mumbai. The design has several advanced safety features. The detailed project is undergoing a review before its construction begins in the next financial year. Dr. Kakodkar said the AHWR design has been carried out with a futuristic vision. The design incorporates several safety features to enhance its operational efficiency. Being a thorium system, the wastage from it is expected to be minimal.

Dr Kakodkar said timely implementation of a programme for thorium utilisation is very crucial to meet the increasing energy demands in the country. A small beginning has already been made by introducing thorium in a limited way in research reactors and in the pressurised heavy water reactors (PHWRS). With sustained efforts over the years India has gained experience over the entire thorium fuel cycle. A research reactor called Kamini is operating in Kalpakkam, Tamil Nadu, based on Uranium 233 fuel which is derived from thorium. This fuel was bred, reprocessed and fabricated indigenously, Dr Kekodkar added.

Kakarat · Post by **Kakarat** » 19 Jun 2009 17:52

what relevance does this have with Indian Space Program?

arunsrinivasan · Post by **arunsrinivasan** » 19 Jun 2009 18:36

symontk wrote:
It is high time we moved on from our focus on 3rd world objectives to more 1st world objectives (for want of a better word!). A good way to start would be to ask the questions How can we get ahead of China? How can we contribute to Space Science e.g. Hubble Space telescope or something even bigger? How do we collaborate as equals with NASA, ESA, Russian Space Agency et. al.
This is against the entire vision projected by ISRO. ISRO does not want to compete in Space or do fancy things. It is the organization to provide part in the meaningful development of India.

That is exactly my point, i.e. ISRO needs to change its vision. ISRO's current vision was appropriate for India in the context of a 3rd world economy & limited resources. As India develops economically, & we are projected to become a developed country in the next 20 - 40 years, the vision for ISRO has to change. Dr. APJ Abdul Kalam came out with a vision 2020 to make India a developed country. I think similarly we need ISRO to revisit its vision.

symontk wrote: Also what do India get if we get ahead of China in space? Do you mean that with current Sapce Technology that India have, we arent ahead of China? How do you know that india is not ahead of China in space? Hubble space telescope is mainly used to spy on other countries rather that taking breath photos of cosmos if you don't know that. Where is the money in India to build a HST at present? We might do it sometime later when the right moment comes. India with the limited resources available, has to go step by step

Well China has sent a astronauts into Space, they have destroyed a satellite in space, & we are far behind them. Yes there may be areas we are ahead of them, but in terms of raw power they are far ahead.

There are many reasons to aspire to be ahead of China, first & foremost from a security perspective. The technological benefits of of advanced space technology would help develop our industry, it will inspire more people to study science & technology, and will improve the confidence of our country. Ultimately for the most quintessential nature of being human i.e. curiosity, the desire to explore & learn.

Arunkumar · Post by **Arunkumar** » 19 Jun 2009 21:45

Does India have any plans for space stations?. China already has unveiled its design for its manned outpost earlier this year.

http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/sf ... e-lab.html

After we send our Antrixyatris in 2014 , they would be requiring their 2BHK for long endurance stays.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 19 Jun 2009 22:03

So the game is to crash debris on Moon and pollute it with spent satellites in interests of finding water? Who is going to clean up?

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 19 Jun 2009 22:26

Arunkumar wrote:Does India have any plans for space stations?. China already has unveiled its design for its manned outpost earlier this year.

http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/sf ... e-lab.html

After we send our Antrixyatris in 2014 , they would be requiring their 2BHK for long endurance stays.

Space Station is always a long-term program. ISRO's first priority w.r.t Human Spaceflight Program is to design a safe manned spacecraft. The first generation of OVs will not have any docking capabilities or solar panels (like Mercury Redstone). One of the main reasons being the limited payload capability of the GSLV. It will be able to carry 2 people.

The second gen OVs will have an orbital module and docking mechanisms which will make it more or less similar to the Chinese Shenzhou (upgraded Soyuz). This will have to be launched aboard the Mk-3. The crew capability will be 3 and the first launch could be anywhere between 2017-2020 even if we assume everything happens on time.

The one thing that is possible is that after 2020, the ISS program will be completed and Russia is already planning a new station, both India and China to a lesser extent could be involved in this station considering the budgetary constrains of the Russians and the Indians and Chinese to gain the know-how Space Station construction and operation. I am really skeptical on China being able to construct and assemble a Mir-class Space Station by 2020.

Atleast for now, ISRO hasn't included any Space Station on it's priorities. We will be lucky if the first manned spaceflight of the first gen OV takes place before 2017.

SivaVijay · Post by **SivaVijay** » 19 Jun 2009 23:02

Does India have any plans for space stations?. China already has unveiled its design for its manned outpost earlier this year.

China is becoming too much of a bully pushing always the international community to see how far it can get and yet get away safely and sadly the international community is lately buckling partly aided by this economic crisis...

While the world is talking about demilitarization of space , China is bluntly stating it is putting a military outpost in space

(don't be surprised if they decide to put nuclear reactors or even weapons in space), if India needs to hold on to its deterrence then we have to demonstrate that we can pull down their satellites...either shoot down one of our old satellite or better develop Laser to blind one of their eyes in the sky....

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 19 Jun 2009 23:52

Let the chinese do what they want to, may be even construct a casino in space. IMO, if the advantages were huge us/russia would have spent any amount of money to put up things up in space, they are not blind when it comes to strategy like us. This announcement of the Chinese is in a way good for us, let them drain their resources and eventually ccp will collapse under its own weight and quoting this statement the indian babus can be convinced to accord sanction to our programs.

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 20 Jun 2009 01:40

Shankar wrote:to start with we need a reactor small enough to fit the payload bay -and that is some way off and then make the containment chamber strong enough to with stand lift off stress both mechanical and acoustic and then thermal stress of deep space -that is some way off

pebble bed reactor i think is being tried by south africa -shall post ref if can locate

thorium base reactor work is going on fine but may be a bit slow

India has already published its design for a Compact High Temperature Reactor, based on fuel particles using thorium fuel cycle. But this is of course not a particle bed reactor. Again, I'm at pains to emphasize that a particle bed reactor is not the same as a pebble bed reactor, as particles are much smaller than pebbles.

As we know, Thorium is inert and harmless until it is transmuted to U233 via neutron radiation. So you could use this fact to make your Nuclear Thermal Rocket safer. The Thorium would be transmuted in-flight, so that its resulting U233 would serve as the fuel for the upper portion of the trajectory. This way, if there was a launch failure early on, then any fuel raining down on the landscape is mainly harmless Thorium. Also, the neutron capture by Thorium would help to act as an extra radiation shield, to further protect the payload.

Perhaps a safer design feature would use HPDM-rubber as the chemical fuel propellant, as with Dick Rutan's SpaceShip One design, since the HPDM rubber has a very high ignition temperature, which would help to avoid any Challenger-style fireball disasters. Yes, the energy yield from this HPDM combustion is much lower than from H2+O2, but that's where your nuclear reactor would be supplementing that with its huge energy dose, to radically boost the Isp. The HPDM also has a higher energy density as a fuel, and would thus occupy a smaller volume, which could cut down on tank/vehicle size.

The reactor would need to be of a very ruggedized solid design, to withstand high impact, and would have to be jettisonable with parachute, in case of any vehicle failure.

As a further safety precaution, you could base your launch/landing site on some tiny island in the middle of the Indian Ocean, much south of our shores. That way you wouldn't have to worry about contaminating populated areas in the event of a disaster.

An early workhorse model could be designed to haul 30 tons to LEO.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 24 Jun 2009 04:56

Indian brains in NASA want to move to ISRO

“Scientists have begun to approach the ISRO. Their requests will be considered on a case to case basis in keeping with our requirements.”

It will be done without disturbing the equilibrium of motivation among the ISRO scientists, Mr. Annadurai said.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 24 Jun 2009 05:25

Satellites help troops in Lalgarh

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 24 Jun 2009 07:30

That's a very heartening piece of news. There was another recent report in the TOI that Maoists are extensively cultivating opium to fund their arms purchases. Hope the satellite imagery is used to map out those areas and destroy these crops too.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 25 Jun 2009 04:28

CRPF to take ISRO help for precision-guided ops against Maoists

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 25 Jun 2009 05:26

I think ISRO should keep out of that stuff. It should be RAW/ARC who do that sort of thing. ISRO is a civilian agency, and we don't want to give any excuses for these dirty b*st*rds to be targeting them.

Omar · Post by **Omar** » 25 Jun 2009 08:36

As if people needed an excuse in the first place...

Link: http://www.business-standard.com/india/ ... se/228947/

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 26 Jun 2009 03:48

ISRO working on database to maximise use of rainwater

Arun_S · Post by **Arun_S** » 28 Jun 2009 01:34

Cross posting due to space dimestion:
Israel's eastward march: Arming India

Tel Aviv, Israel (UPI) Jun 17, 2009
The day Osama bin Laden's suicide squads attacked the United States, Maj. Gen. Uzi Dayan, who in 2001 headed Israel's National Security Council, was conducting a "strategic dialogue" in New Delhi with his Indian counterpart, Brajesh Mishra.

Dayan's presence in the Indian capital on Sept. 11, 2001, was, of course, pure happenstance. But the events of that fateful day cemented a strategic relationship that has never stopped growing and has strengthened Israel's burgeoning influence in southern and central Asia. Today, Israel has overtaken Russia as India's leading defense supplier.

Both Israel and India, one Jewish, the other Hindu, are locked in deadly combat with Islamist extremists, and after the November 2008 attacks in Mumbai -- India's Sept. 11 -- that killed 165 people, including five Israelis, security cooperation between the two nations has skyrocketed -- literally.

On April 20 India launched its RISAT-2 satellite, built by Israel Aerospace Industries, the state-owned flagship of Israel's defense industry. The craft is equipped with the same multi-spectral aperture radar as the TECSTAR 1 satellite developed for Israel's military.

The launch gave India vital surveillance capabilities to guard against further attacks by Islamist raiders, whose seaborne assault it had not detected. But it also gave Israel an important breakthrough: an Indian satellite that will provide additional surveillance of Iran and its missile-launching zones with its sensors that can take photos with a maximum ground resolution of 1 meter day and night and through cloud cover. {Arun_S: Ahhh Isreali using its own satellite with Indian label }

That kind of spy capability gives India a major edge over Pakistan, and indeed every other Asian state except China and Japan.

Israel has been hampered in its efforts to keep tabs on Iran because, due to the Jewish state's geographical location, it is only able to launch its own intelligence-gathering satellites westward, against the Earth's rotation.

That limits the range of orbits over Iran. Launching from the Satish Dhawan Space Center on the Gulf of Bengal in southeastern India means Israel can launch eastward, adding another dimension to its surveillance of the Islamic Republic.

The 650-pound RISAT-2, delivery of which the Israelis accelerated after Mumbai, also cemented a burgeoning intelligence alliance that has been expanding over the last 40 years -- even though it was a clandestine relationship until India recognized Israel in 1992.

In January India took delivery of the first of three Phalcon all-weather, early warning command and control systems manufactured by Israel Aerospace Industries and mounted on Russian-built Ilyushin Il-76 aircraft under a $1.1 billion deal.

Delivery had been advanced by two months following the Mumbai attacks. The radar systems were built by Israel's Elta Industries.

Negotiations are under way for another three Phalcons, and if that deal goes through it would be the largest defense contract ever sealed by Israel.

As part of the Phalcon deal, the Israelis disclosed on May 22 that they will establish five factories in India to produce artillery shells, a project reportedly worth $250 million.{Arun_S: Not sure if there factories will see light of days now after the IOF bribery scandle }

The Indian air force thus became the first in South Asia with advanced multi-sensor AWACS aircraft capable of providing tactical surveillance of multiple airborne and surface targets and able to gather signals intelligence.

A month earlier India signed a $4.1 billion deal to purchase a shore-based and seaborne anti-missile air-defense system modeled on Israel's Barak long-range naval weapon built by Israel Aircraft Industries.

The new system will be developed with India's Defense Research and Development Organization and will replace the Indian air force's aging Russian-made S-135 Pechora-1 (SA-3) air-defense systems.

In August 2008 New Delhi signed a $2.5 billion contract with IAI and Israel's Rafale armaments company to jointly develop an advanced version of the Spyder surface-to-air missile.

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 28 Jun 2009 02:11

That kind of spy capability gives India a major edge over Pakistan, and indeed every other Asian state except China and Japan.

India's earth observation capability is one of the many areas in our space program in which we are better than the Chinese.

On April 20 India launched its RISAT-2 satellite, built by Israel Aerospace Industries, the state-owned flagship of Israel's defense industry. The craft is equipped with the same multi-spectral aperture radar as the TECSTAR 1 satellite developed for Israel's military.

The launch gave India vital surveillance capabilities to guard against further attacks by Islamist raiders, whose seaborne assault it had not detected. But it also gave Israel an important breakthrough: an Indian satellite that will provide additional surveillance of Iran and its missile-launching zones with its sensors that can take photos with a maximum ground resolution of 1 meter day and night and through cloud cover.

I am really waiting for Cartosat-3. Too bad it will not be equipped with SAR.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 28 Jun 2009 03:19

Cartosat 2B is set for launch this year. For Cartosat 3, we will have to wait 2010 I think. For SAR, we have RISAT-1 also coming up this year.

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 28 Jun 2009 07:06

Pardon my ignorance, if our space programme especially our earth observation programme is as advanced as it is proclaimed, then why take the help of israel ? The above article makes an impression as if Israel is 'arming' India in everything related to spy satellites. If we are dependent on israel to such an extent, that is a cause for concern.India dependent on Isreal and Isreal dependent on America.Ultimately we get dependent on americans which is not good.The day we get self sufficient in strategic areas is the day we can really call ourselves a great power.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 28 Jun 2009 07:45

Sanjay M wrote:I think ISRO should keep out of that stuff. It should be RAW/ARC who do that sort of thing. ISRO is a civilian agency, and we don't want to give any excuses for these dirty b*st*rds to be targeting them.

Tooooo late: April 4, 2009 :: LeT plans to target Isro scientists

Rony,

IIRC, the Israeli sat is capable of seeing through clouds, etc. Indian sats have the same capabilities otherwise (resolution seems to be the same, etc)

Also, unrelated to your concern, Israel will have to "depend" on India to launch (eastward launch) sats so that they can orbit in orbits that cannot be done via a launch from Israel itself (westward launch)

Jamal K. Malik · Post by **Jamal K. Malik** » 30 Jun 2009 20:56

ISRO to co-host Science Congress in Thiruvananthapuram
http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/00 ... 302078.htm

The 97th Indian Science Congress will be held here from January 3 to 7 next year with Indian Space Research Organisation and the University of Kerala co-hosting the event.

Jamal K. Malik · Post by **Jamal K. Malik** » 30 Jun 2009 21:27

India plans to develop reusable spacecraft with Russia: Nair
http://www.ddinews.gov.in/Homepage/Home ... s/isro.htm

Arun_S · Post by **Arun_S** » 30 Jun 2009 21:50

Cross posting from International thread because delays and cost over run are not just Indian bane.

Also looks like IRNESS is just timed well, because Galileo woulnt have bring teh service any sooner even if India did commit the investment 6 years ago.

Arun_S wrote:Good that India bailed out of this while China sunk in $$$ into it.

Galileo : EU satnav project ill-conceived: auditors court

by Staff Writers
Brussels (AFP) June 29, 2009
The EU's much delayed satellite navigation network project Galileo has been ill-prepared and badly managed, the European Court of Auditors charged Monday.

"The programme lacked a strong strategic sponsor and supervisor: the (European) Commission did not proactively direct the programme, leaving it without a helmsman," the auditors' court opined after carrying out an audit of the ill-starred project.

As well as the commission -- the EU's executive arm -- the 27 member states came into criticism for promoting their own industries first and foremost.

"Owing to their different programme expectations, member states intervened in the interest of their national industries and held up decisions. The compromises made led to implementation problems, delays and, in the end, to cost overruns," the official auditors declared.

The 30-satellite network is meant to challenge the dominance of the US-built Global Positioning System (GPS), which is widely used in navigation devices in vehicles and ships. The EU aims to have it up in space by 2013.

The EU has struggled to secure financing for the project's budget, originally 3.4 billion euros (5.4-billion dollars) -- and has had to release unused funds from the bloc's massive agricultural budget.

The audit examined the factors in the failure of the concession process and for delays and cost overruns of technological development.

It concluded that the original public-private partnership plan was "inadequately prepared and conceived" not to mention "unrealistic".

The Galileo Joint Undertaking -- a body set up in 2003 and scrapped in 2006 -- was given the task of supervising Galileo's technological development activities but "was seriously constrained by governance issues, an incomplete budget, delays and the industrial organisation of the development and validation phase," the report said.

If the Galileo project is to succeed, the European Commission "must considerably strengthen its management of the programmes," the Court of Auditors said.

"Finally, should the EU resolve to engage in other large infrastructure programmes, the commission must ensure it has access to the appropriate management tools," it added.

The report makes grim reading for the European Commission not least because the Galileo programme was the first of its kind.

"We acknowledge that there were delays and cost overruns," a European Commission spokesman said.

"In hindsight things could always be done better... but we are happy to accept the recommendations of the court in order to be able to get on with the project," he added.

While unable to quantify the cost or time overruns, he said the first operational satellites should be launched next year.

The auditors' report said that the stalling of negotiations with private sector companies in 2007 means "technological development has been set back five years".

While test satellites have been launched none of Galileo's 30 operational satellites have been put in space yet.

The project was the first close collaboration between the European Space Agency (ESA) and the commission on such a large space programme, the first industrial programme to be managed at European level and the first time the commission was to participate in a public private partnership scheme.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 30 Jun 2009 23:29

Jamal K. Malik wrote:India plans to develop reusable spacecraft with Russia: Nair
http://www.ddinews.gov.in/Homepage/Home ... s/isro.htm

Will this be Kliper , low cost reusable spacecraft

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 01 Jul 2009 15:23

Interview: Madhavan Nair: India cooperates with Russia in many fields of exploration and peaceful uses of outer space

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 01 Jul 2009 17:40

Austin wrote:
Jamal K. Malik wrote:India plans to develop reusable spacecraft with Russia: Nair
http://www.ddinews.gov.in/Homepage/Home ... s/isro.htm
Will this be Kliper , low cost reusable spacecraft

Russia itself is not invest in Kliper as it demands too much their resources. They are designing the PPTS/Rus/Orionskii, a spacecraft similar to the Orion. After government financing from Kiliper in the favor of the joint Russian-European ACTS (this was again canceled), NPO Energia kept the program alive only for a small period of time with it's own resources.

I think that this proposal of ISRO would be to design a joint SSTO vehicle. Afterall, the USSR had designed the Energia-Uran, whose boosters would fly back and land like an aircraft after being jettisoned.

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 01 Jul 2009 19:29

That link didn't work, but these links do:

http://www.timesnow.tv/India-plans-to-d ... 320934.cms

http://news4u.co.in/?p=28175

Reusable SSTO is hard to do, but to me it seems like the best way to achieve routine space travel.

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 02 Jul 2009 00:54

European flavour to India's Oceansat-2 August launch

India's indigenous Oceansat-2 satellite will be launched next month from Sriharikota spaceport on the east coast and will also carry with it a set of six nano satellites, all of European origin.

Besides Rubin 9.1 and Rubin 9.2 nano satellites from Germany, the four cubesats lined up for the mission on board India's workhorse rocket Polar Satellite Launch Vehicle are: Beesat, built by Technical University Berlin, UWE-2 (University of Wuerzburg Germany), ITU-pSat (Istanbul Technical University Turkey) and SwissCube-1 (Ecole Polytechnique Federal de Lausanne, Switzerland).

Oceansat-2 weighing around 970 kg, is an in-orbit replacement to Oceansat-1, which has completed 10 years of service, ISRO Spokesperson S. Satish said.

"It (Oceansat-2) will carry an OCM (Ocean Colour Monitor) and a Ku-band pencil beam Scatterometer. In addition, it will carry Radio Occultation Sounder for Atomospheric studies (ROSA), developed by the Italian Space Agency (ASI)," he said.

Oceansat-2 would help identify potential fishing zones, assist in coastal zone studies and significantly enhance expertise in understanding surface temperature and winds.

"Earlier, we had launched Oceansat (Oceansat-1) which essentially could look at (only) the colour of the ocean. Now, colour alone is not sufficient, we should look at the temperature and surface winds and so on," ISRO Chairman G. Madhavan Nair told PTI.

Nihat · Post by **Nihat** » 02 Jul 2009 01:11

Sorry for taking this a bit OT but can submarine be tracked through satellites?

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 02 Jul 2009 02:50

There was a related discussion on this thread earlier. Go to page 31

vavinash · Post by **vavinash** » 02 Jul 2009 11:27

Vipul wrote:
"Earlier, we had launched Oceansat (Oceansat-1) which essentially could look at (only) the colour of the ocean. Now, colour alone is not sufficient, we should look at the temperature and surface winds and so on," ISRO Chairman G. Madhavan Nair told PTI.

Not bad..IRS-P4 (oceansat-1) had a design life of 5 years but worked for 10+.

http://www.isro.org/irsp4.htm

Jamal K. Malik · Post by **Jamal K. Malik** » 04 Jul 2009 19:52

India to launch indigenous Oceansat-2 satellite next month