The RN's new Astute SSNs claim that their sonars are sensitive enough to detect a cruise ship laving NY harbour from UK waters!
It is achievable in theory, but is practically impossible.
The RN's new Astute SSNs claim that their sonars are sensitive enough to detect a cruise ship laving NY harbour from UK waters!
hmm, is that the only information available as open source ?negi wrote:Wiki says it is PAYAL .Kanson wrote: According to the available open source information the expected Sonar for the ATV will be Indian.
Kochi people too claimed that they could hear a heart beat more than 100m underneath the sea.RN's new Astute SSNs claim that their sonars are sensitive enough to detect a cruise ship laving NY harbour from UK waters!
Maybe we should start understanding from the fact that did under any military construction around the world a capital ship of the type such as Arihant or even a military class sailable object is termed as TD. My memory is not very perfect on this but i can assure there is no such case in the recent history. OTOH, i willing to hear if any such case exists. Pls note, here, we are using the term TD as the product being constructed only to prove the technology and not for active use. Navy when they constructed for the first time a destroyer they never called her as TD nor when they started constructing their first Aircraft Carrier. So one wonders what parameter was set this ATV apart from rest to be called as TD? I am as curious as you to find out why they(Navy) are making such a gesture.chackojoseph wrote:Did anyone ever say that Arihant is not a TD? Just curious.
SNaik missed this message ,I was thinking these submarines are all digital Akula subs , so they need not add or remove actual hardware but limit the potential of sonar/sensor , signature/noise and other capabilities of submarine ,can be quite easily done with suitable software locks or performance restrictions.SNaik wrote:This depends, Austin. The standard Russian issue of MGK-540 Skat-3 sonar suite which is the sonar on last pr.971 (Akula) subs includes Ajax-M digital library of acoustic signatures. This library may not be included in the transfer, because of the controversy of the sonar on Nerpa - is it Skat-3 or is it MGK-400EM Irbis (upgraded export version of Rubikon from Kilos). Ajax-M certainly is not a part of the upgrade package for Indian Kilos carried out by Sevmash.
.Propulsion: The class was designed with a “monoblock” reactor; meaning the entire propulsion system (PWR, coolant loops, turbines, generators, coolant pumps) is contained within the reactor compartment. The advantage is the obvious space/weight savings, the disadvantage is that any repairs can only be done in-port with the reactor shut down and the compartment ventilated. The reactor is intended to have a lifespan as long as the submarine’s (about 25 years). Initially, the class was intended to have a PJP but later Russian navy display models show a traditional skewed 7-bladed propeller. Then in early 2010, a drawing showing a PJP again was released. Two small maneuvering thrusters are included.
Weapons: Eight launch tubes for SS-NX-26 Yakhont cruise missiles are carried, each housing three missiles. Some cutaway drawings show them angled (as on the sole “Charlie III” class Novgorod Velikiy) while others vertical. The supersonic, anti-ship SS-NX-26 has a range between 69NM - 161NM depending on the flight profile selected. Early drawings with the spherical sonar array (see “Sensors” section below) showed eight 21” torpedo tubes amidships in the American style. More recent models showed six amidships 21” tubes and two large 650mm tubes atop a cylindrical bow array, but in 2010 a new sketch appeared showing eight 650mm tubes, all amidships. Loadout would be thirty weapons: torpedoes (types SAET-60, UGST, TEST-71ME, and the new type TE-2 if it is actually in fleet service). If 650mm tubes are installed, the SS-N-16 “Stallion” ASW missile could also be supported. Finally several sources state that tubes linered down to 21” could also fire the “Klub” family of missiles, specifically the 3M51 Alfa (Klub-S) land-attack model. The MDS mobile mine will also be carried, as will the MG-74ME tube-fired decoy.
Several defense-industry websites have stated that the Russian navy is working on a “Project Grom (thunder)” strategic cruise missile as an alternate to the endless problems experienced by the SS-NX-30 Bulova SLBM. The stated range for the proposed missile is 2400NM, which would be astonishing for a cruise missile. The Project 885 would likely carry this missile, if it is ever built.
Sensors: Initially this class was to have the Irtysh-Amfora combined spherical/hull/towed array system (as tested in the “Yankee Pod“ SSAN), however later display models show a “Shark Gill” cylindrical array. The “Shark Tail” towed passive array is streamed from the upper rudder, rather than a “bullet” housing (however a 2010 drawing showed the towed array streamed from a fairing on the lower port-side hull). Models have shown a “Pert Spring” SATCOM and two periscopes extended, it can be assumed that a “Snoop”-series radar is included plus most likely the “Amber Light” and “Rim Hat” EW masts, a RDF (likely “Park Lamp”), and Kremmny-2 IFF
The realization of the need for a nuclear submarine came a little late to India. One would recall the time, when the government was not willing to consider acquiring even a conventional submarine for the purpose of training anti-submarine crews on surface ships. For this purpose, the Navy had to make do with RN submarines during annual Commonwealth exercises. The reason given was that the submarine was an offensive weapon and ours is a defensive navy. Only in the late 1960s a change of mind took place and the first squadron of I641 submarine was inducted into the Navy from the Soviet Union (USSR). After two decades, the HDW submarine from Germany, followed by 877EKM submarines from USSR were also added to the inventory.
The aspirations for a nuclear powered submarine surfaced soon after the Bangladesh war. Presumably, Indira Gandhi, the then Prime Minister, was traumatized by the unexpected entry of the US Aircraft Carrier Task Force into the Bay of Bengal. To counter this move and demonstrate their solidarity with India, Admiral Gorshkov is believed to have ordered one of the Soviet nuclear submarines in the vicinity to surface. This had a salutary effect on the situation. This one single incident demonstrated to the Prime Minister the overbearing significance of a nuclear submarine in the strategic scenario.
The prototype Pressure Water Reactor (PWR) for the submarine became critical inside the submarine pressure hull capsule at Kalpakkum on 11 November 2003 and was declared operational on 22 September 2006.
Transcript Page 11 wrote:Stephen Cohen: I think it would be disastrous, however, if India squanders its money on that white elephant of a weapons system, the Arihant, which is a seagoing, nuclear-powered, nuclear weapons delivery vessel. The book and my own view is I’m really quite skeptical about the Arihant as a practical weapon. They may make one demonstration model of it, but I doubt if they’ll go beyond that.
You should realize Cohen is seeing us with american eyes. In American Eyes they have one of the finest defense procurement systems. Though some people in america claim, that the defense procurement is broken, due to cost overruns, delay in getting projects completed on time, project scope creep, etc, it is still considered by and large by everybody in america that is one of the better procurement systems.RajeshA wrote:Some propaganda by Uneven Cohen
Arming Without Aiming: India's Military Modernization Book by Stephen P. Cohen, Sunil Dasgupta
ARMING WITHOUT AIMING: INDIA’S MILITARY MODERNIZATION: Book Launch Event on September 9, 2010 @Brookings Institute (pdf)Transcript Page 11 wrote:Stephen Cohen: I think it would be disastrous, however, if India squanders its money on that white elephant of a weapons system, the Arihant, which is a seagoing, nuclear-powered, nuclear weapons delivery vessel. The book and my own view is I’m really quite skeptical about the Arihant as a practical weapon. They may make one demonstration model of it, but I doubt if they’ll go beyond that.
Yes, and you Ravi from AS?ravi_s wrote:Are you Pankaj Chitkara?
The Navy will need three or four nuclear-powered submarines for this arm to be a viable force. Will you build more LWRs for these submarines?
We are already doing that. I will not be able to tell you the number, but it is a fact that we are in that game. The next nuclear steam generating plants are getting ready for future applications.
Are both of you paanwalas?P Chitkara wrote:Yes, and you Ravi from AS?ravi_s wrote:Are you Pankaj Chitkara?
No, dont even know a paanwala Wish I did...Dilbu wrote:Are both of you paanwalas?
That's a wonderful interview. Lot of information:
Has the Light Water Reactor (LWR), using enriched uranium as fuel, on board the submarine been started up?
Our nuclear steam supply system is ready 100 per cent. From our (DAE) side, everything is ready. We are only waiting for other systems to become operational so that we can start the commissioning activity of the reactor. I really do not know when the harbour trials will be done.
Where will the enriched uranium for these boats come from? There is only one Rare Materials Plant at Ratnahalli, near Mysore, to produce enriched uranium. Will the proposed Special Material Enrichment Facility in Chitradurga district in Karnataka be helpful?
Chitradurga will come a little later, not immediately. Our Ratnahalli plant capacity has been enhanced. But more than that, there is significant improvement in our technology. Usually, a term called Separating Work Units (SWUs) defines the technology level that we have achieved in this, and I can assure you that there has been considerable improvement in SWUs of our next generation caskets of centrifuges. The separating capacity of our centrifuges has improved. So total capacity enhancement at Ratnahalli has been done. We are confident of supplying the entire fuel for the set of….
You cannot say anymore that India does not have enrichment technology. India has its own technology and we can produce [enriched uranium]. We have not started doing it for large-scale commercial nuclear power stations, which require a much larger quantity of enriched uranium. We will be able to do that once we go to Chitradurga.
Where is Chitradurga ? Sound it is somewhere in South India. Any coordinates please ?dinesha wrote:OT:
As far as India’s strategic R&D is concerned, Chitradurga distt. is going to be place of action in few years time. Four Major activities there:
1. DRDO has acquired 4,290 acres for an advanced R&D complex, a 3.5 km runway and test centre for long-endurance ( 48-72 hours) UAVs and UCAVs
2. BARC has acquired 2000 acres for "Special Material Enrichment Facility".
3. IISc has acquired 1700 acres to develop Energy Research Centre and Advanced Aerospace Research Centre, whatever that means..
4. Indian Army is seeking 10000 acres to establish some “top secret facility” and also to station a Brigade there
Chitradurga is in central Karnataka. Check out this mapKersi D wrote:
Where is Chitradurga ? Sound it is somewhere in South India. Any coordinates please ?
K
Singha wrote:my prediction - the goras are past experts at moving the goalpost just on the verge of someone scoring a goal.
1."india cannot be a great power without settling cashere"
2. "india may have sent a orbiter to moon but 750 mil yindu live on less than $1 a day"
3. 300,000 ROP genocided in gujarat, how can india be considered a secular democracy
4. india may have a bulging middle class but they do not enjoy the urban services of um berlin or osaka due to korrupt govt
5. indians do not contribute billions to alumni institutions => indians are cruel and uncaring
6. yindu has only small bums, china has bigger and more bums
now to add for 2015
7. india has a 1000km GLCM but yindu bum is weak
8. indian lacks own GPS sats
9. indians are *still* short, dark, rice eating and pray in dark, moist temples
10. indian A5 cannot put 10 mirv on target (onlee 5). hence A5 < DF31B & india < cheena < usa
11. india doesnt have 'instant strike' hypersonic stealth weapons to raze terrorist goat sheds within 30mins of POTUS pressing the green button
12. india doesnt GUBO, GUBO is doctor recommended for intestinal health
13. Arihant can only do 23 knots submerged while virginia can do 35, hence arihant is a white elephant and yindu cruelty to deprive the poor of their schools/hospitals/meals.
the way to upset this game is
[a] develop our own forums, blogs, media management - the internet is facilitating that
release a loud fart in the direction of these psyops operators.
[c] keep doing the good work.
dinesha wrote:OT:
As far as India’s strategic R&D is concerned, Chitradurga distt. is going to be place of action in few years time. Four Major activities there:
1. DRDO has acquired 4,290 acres for an advanced R&D complex, a 3.5 km runway and test centre for long-endurance ( 48-72 hours) UAVs and UCAVs- No guess required
2. BARC has acquired 2000 acres for "Special Material Enrichment Facility". No guess required
3. IISc has acquired 1700 acres to develop Energy Research Centre and Advanced Aerospace Research Centre, whatever that means.. I think it should be things like Kali, Durga, Avtaar etc
4. Indian Army is seeking 10000 acres to establish some “top secret facility” and also to station a Brigade thereNuclear missiles ?