India's R&D in Defence DRDO, PSUs and Private Sector

[Karan M]

Ajai Shukla's quote needs to be read in context:

But this CAG audit painstakingly documents how the MoD paid BEL '870 crore for 22 radars in 2007, '41.39 crore more than the cost of buying from the original manufacturer, Italian company Selex. The rationale for this largesse: indigenous production. But then, within three months of that contract, BEL ordered 13 radars from Selex in CKD (Completely Knocked Down) kits, “in gross violation of its own commitment of manufacturing these radars indigenously”.

That means 9 radars are not CKD. But probably made inhouse with TOT. The percentage of local manufacture thereafter is not mentioned by the CAG excerpt quoted.

But this is nothing new. The usual arrangement for any TOT is - SKD, CKD, Raw Materials (again in Phases). For instance, HAL has moved from SKD, CKD to Phase 4 production at which raw materials (sourced locally) will dominate. CAG had issues with Su-30 MKI production as the number of aircraft in Phase 4, was reduced to around 60 from larger numbers earlier, but that had to do with aircraft production time-lines being compressed by 3 years by the IAF (2015 from 2018 earlier). So CAG's statements need to be tempered with the big picture in mind.

So, unless there are more details, the CAG objection in this case could be similar. If Selex puts its foot down on TOT, or if the timelines mentioned were short, then BEL could have very well ordered more radars upfront in CKD fashion.

What a shame. After promising Active Armour "not too far in the future"...he backed out from promising "electromagnetic gun". No doubt we will see the FMBT soon.

Care to point out your interpretation? Because there is nothing wrong in what Saraswat said, as far as I can make out.

Active Armour is already available on several tanks/systems the world over:
Ironfist/Trophy (Israel), some Swedish systems, one from France, theres another (Arena) from Russia. I am sure I have missed a couple - the Americans have something in the works as well, and so does South Korea (for their latest, super-expensive tank) with assistance from Russia.
In other words, the technology has matured enough to be fielded.

In contrast, electromagnetic guns are still in the future. The only service that is somewhat near their deployment, is the US Navy, which notes that its shipboard power generation and volume considerations can allow the employment of such devices. Tanks are a different matter altogether.

[R Nathan]

Stealth, Laser cannon, super cruise, 155mm Gun are all technologies that has matured enough.

EVERYTHING in this world is possible with enough Time and Money.

[R Nathan]

My Bad. I was thinking about ACTUALLY doing Research & Development for developing Active Armour.

"Partnership" that can help us buy Active Armour and integrating it with FMBT can be done in a reasonable time frame.

[Karan M]

Stealth, Laser cannon, super cruise, 155mm Gun are all technologies that has matured enough.

EVERYTHING in this world is possible with enough Time and Money.

Sorry but your statement is inaccurate. Because there is clearly a difference between attaining each of the above mentioned in terms of time and money and nor have all the items mentioned above, matured industry wide. Furthermore, can you point out one program to field a laser cannon on any tank? The only laser weapons that are being spoken of now seem to be ones which can be fielded on semi-mobile installations or unarmoured vehicles with a large assured power supply. In contrast, tanks are compact, highly mobile which have to be armored to boot. The JSF's laser weapon is still at conceptual stage. A lot of gee-whiz stuff which is talked about is actually still at the exploratory stage.

My Bad. I was thinking about ACTUALLY doing Research & Development for developing Active Armour."Partnership" that can help us buy Active Armour and integrating it with FMBT can be done in a reasonable time frame.

Actually doing R&D on any mature technology, even if somewhat leading edge, ie active armour and integrating it is far less problematic than doing R&D on concepts which are still in the exploratory stage worldwide. And partnership can include Joint R&D, with companies which have some if not all of the technologies for such a project.

Can't the same reasoning, also, be used for the FMBT? If a product is to be designed/manufactured in the future, shouldn't it be designed keeping the realistic technologies of the future in mind?

How far ahead in the future is the question.

The advantages that you will gain from improving electrochemical guns (i.e. current) do not warrant the need for electromagnetic railguns for a tank that has to have a prototype ready within a decade. There is a lot of development potential in the current gun, if you see WW development.

If an electromagnetic gun is to be developed, delink it from the FMBT program so that as and when, when ready it can be put in as a technology insertion, in the future or a new platform developed which utilizes it. But if we tie the program to something unrealistic or high risk, then you risk delaying the entire program.

Simply put, R Nathans point does not make sense, wherein he speaks of a "gem" as if the lack of EM gun is an incorrect assertion. In fact, if the FMBT were to include an EM gun, one should be startled, because it would mean a typical case of unrealistic requirements, leading to yet another high-risk effort, with a huge problem re: time, cost and being supplanted by lower performing but available alternatives from imports.

[R Nathan]

... there is clearly a difference between attaining each of the above mentioned in terms of time and money and nor have all the items mentioned above, matured industry wide.

I agree. There is a difference between attaining each mentioned items in terms of time and money. No one has said otherwise.

Furthermore, can you point out one program to field a laser cannon on any tank?

Neither can i quote any program which provides stealth or super cruise to Tanks. You win again.

Actually doing R&D on any mature technology, even if somewhat leading edge, ie active armour and integrating it is far less problematic than doing R&D on concepts which are still in the exploratory stage worldwide.

Wont that depend on what technology you have access to? Innovation is all about finding out of the box solutions and not trying to recreate a mature technology. This is why LTE is replacing WiMax (Telecom). It will be easier to plug and play Active armour once a "partner" shares interface details.

Simply put, R Nathans point does not make sense, wherein he speaks of a "gem" as if the lack of EM gun is an incorrect assertion.

[chackojoseph]

^^^

You know, we really need to get to the bottom of that. I am surprised that BEL quotes higher than the French companies.

Why the surprise? BEL has no competetion...so why price anything down? What is the BEL share price now? INR 1727.05 must buy some.

The way I know it:

BEL has purchased critical parts and then brought down the cost by some Indian components.

But, if someone says that BEL couldn't develop it, so they purchased from France and changed the label, its unbelievable.

[R Nathan]

....But this is exactly what CAG is Saying !! Other alternative is to call them " ...monkeys who can't find their own asses with their two hands..." (with apologies to vina )

[Raghavendra]

DRDO develops space food for astronauts http://in.news.yahoo.com/139/20100829/8 ... ona_1.html

[chackojoseph]

DFRL Space food venture, we had written that in 2007

Space foods in DFRL menu

[A Sharma]

DRDO Tech Focus on Sonar Systems

[Indranil]

X Posting from the China Military Watch thread:

I don't want to dissect Tony's comment or drift. But he has a point. We should definitely analyse the Chinese threat much more closely ... Their philosophies aside, they are a commendable (in terms of strength) enemy to have ... I must say that the modern Chinese not only have quantity, but a lot of their equipment is quite a lot on the cutting edge ... Don't shoot me down for this, I am just writing down my evaluation as cold bloodedly as I can ... Underestimating our enemy is going to be criminal.

My biggest fear at the moment is whatever they can produce, we can buy equipment on-par and above-par. But how long can we sustain this race by importing? My observation is more keenly in terms of aviation ... I don't care how they (Chinese) can build them (obviously they have been immoral), but at the end of the day they are at the cusp of (or have already mastered) the know-how of building the whole gamut of aviation requirements, be it transport aircraft, helicopters, gunships, fighters, trainers. Heck they are close to building and operationalizing a "F-22" equivalent within the next decade completely on their own (by whatever means). If we went to war with them, nobody will care for the moral things (This was also reflected upon by the VCAM). They would have them, and we would not!

I see the military response against China taking shape ... but I feel it is agonizingly slow ...

I know its another aimless observation which doesn't add anything ... but it will be great to know if the posters have any bright ideas how we could somehow have a faster route for indigenization ... For one I feel this one PSU handles all is not sufficing ... There is no competition, no urgency ... I mean, it seems ok to slip behind schedule for years ... no heads role ... and if the effort fails to bear fruit, we can always import and get "full" TOT.

Even if defense has to stay under the PSU umbrella ... There can't be one NAL, one HAL etc. etc.

One more thing that I feel is this tendency of the GoI to safeguard PSUs should now subside ... The P-75I is a prime example ... I mean let the PSUs gain the market by merit ... They have a huge head start above the private sector at present, in know-how, infrastructure, trained people ... Obviously there is the looming probability of the private companies poaching the trained guys through higher salaries ... Is that a real threat? If yes,would that be bad, if that results in higher turn around time of the projects undertaken? If it is bad, is there a way to stop that?

Is a symbiosis that the government can work out within the private and public industries? It is already in place. For example HAL uses parts made by private companies, and MDL uses L&T. But how could this be amplified/balanced so that HAL churns out aircrafts and MDL churns out submarines faster. Basically, can we possibly grow the private industries to produce stronger feeding lines for the PSUs which specialize in putting these things together at an overall faster rate?

[Indranil]

Is a symbiosis that the government can work out within the private and public industries? .... Basically, can we possibly grow the private industries to produce stronger feeding lines for the PSUs which specialize in putting these things together at an overall faster rate?

Case in point. L&T.

Private sector shipbuilder Larsen & Toubro finds the MoD’s decision to patronise Mazagon Dock inexplicable. L&T sources say the company was given to understand that they would participate in Project 75I as the second submarine line. Now, L&T’s experience and infrastructure would lie idle.

I mean what a criminal waste in this time of shortage (near crisis)?

[VinodTK]

India's Claim of Laser Weapons: Bluff or Threat?

Other lasers under development include a laser "dazzler" weapon that could be directed at aircraft from up to 10 kilometers away or aimed at people for use as a nonlethal device. The weapons are being developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation, a government agency that develops technology and weapons for the Indian military.

[Varoon Shekhar]

Very brash, arrogant tone to that last article, and an unnecessary, perhaps contrived bringing in of Pakistani perceptions and remarks about Kashmir. If someone wanted to dismiss the idea of an impending Indian laser weapon, they could have just said something to the effect that it's probably not possible for India in the short run, to develop such a weapon.

[Sumeet]

Govt to speed up private sector participation in defence

[A Sharma]

Astra Microwave Annual Report 09-10

1.5 GHz Digital Receiver and DRFM boards using high end Vertex -5 FPGAs are developed for Dual and Quad Channel receivers of Tuners for Various EW programmes of DRDO and Defence PSUs. Boards of this kind were imported at extremely high cost for various DRDO programmes earlier. AMPL has brought break through in this area making the EW systems more sensitive and accurate.

Astra Microwave Products Limited AMPL has developed Radio Proximity fuses in X and KU bands using High end digital signal processing techniques. These design were targeted for accurate measurements using Range correlators and Doppler measurements algorithms on high speed FPGAs and Processors.

At EW (R&D) Department, we developed Ultra Wide Band, High Speed, Clocked DIFM (Digital Instantaneous Frequency Measurement) Receiver for Europeon Defence requirements. Based on this developement, Astra bagged order for few DIFMs with high end features. This has opened a new horizon for several DIFM family products. EW (R&D) Department also developed Low Cost, Miniature DLVAs for Indian and Export market requirements. Both the products are expected to give potential business in export segment.

During the year, the team has developed one single phase shifter solution for the complete EW frequency band of 6 to 18 GHz which very few companies have succeeded in. The performance of this MMIC has received commendation from all the quarters.

The team has also started working on system design and has successfully completed prototyping a system, “Dual Band Command & Video T/R” for helicopter based applications. Most of the critical MMIC components used in this system have been designed and developed by the team internally.

Mode info on page 27-29

[Neshant]

Govt to speed up private sector participation in defence[/url]

they have been saying this since the dawn of time yet nothing happens.

what's worse is anything that's produces has an impossible time getting accepted by the beaurocracy.

who's going to invest tons of money to be given the run around like the Arjun tank?

[SriSri]

INDESEC Expo 2010: Terror, Asymmetric Warfare, Security Major Focus Areas

To safeguard India from the asymmetric threat of international terrorism, the government is readdressing its internal security strategy, markedly increasing the budget allocation and fast tracking procurements of homeland security and defence systems.

It is within this climate that the second edition of the INDESEC Expo series will open in New Delhi on Monday. The three-day INDESEC is the only exhibition and conference held in India, integrating the homeland security and defence sectors with a key focus on homeland & border security, network centric operations and maritime security.

Supported by the ministry of home affairs and organized by Informa in association with Assocham, the expo will have the largest participation from the UK, US, Sweden, France, and Taiwan. "There will be 13 countries and 75 companies from all over the world participating at this event," the organizers told FE On how INDESEC is clearly differentiated from any other defence or security events held in India, Brigadier Raj Manchanda, director, Informa Exhibitions India said, “”As the distinction between security and defence becomes less relevant, the co-ordination between ministries, police, coastguard and the three services becomes hugely important. Their shared knowledge and experience will increase the chance of procuring the right equipment on time and at the right price.”

US-based Northrop Grumman through its UK office will be participating at INDESEC 2010 where it will highlight a range of its key capabilities dedicated to civil defence, national security and resilience. "Northrop Grumman will be exhibiting in the UK pavilion being led by UK Trade and Investment Defence Services Organisation (UKTI DSO) and the trade association ADS and will focus on its UK-based technologies and capabilities. This follows the recent British government visit to India to reinforce trade links," company executives told FE.

Some of the UK companies are exhibiting for the first time, others are returning to seek opportunities in India in the competitive security sector. The global market for security products and services is estimated to be worth between $140-180Bn per annum and is growing. UK security exports for 2009 were around £1.4b. UK security sector has over 8,000 companies specializing in the design, manufacture & supply of equipment.

The US–India Business Council will embark on its inaugural Homeland Security Executive Mission to coincide with INDESEC Expo 2010. This exploratory mission comes on the heels of nine aerospace & defense executive missions to India since 2001 promoting a deeper defense and strategic partnership between India and the US. On the ground, USIBC will engage with AMCHAM-India and Assocham to facilitate industry interaction.

"US industry's participation in, and support of, India’s security sector will not only provide India with the best equipment, but will also boost job creation in both countries through technology sharing, partnerships, and high-end manufacturing."

[Vipul]

Maini Global bags $10-mn Boeing deal.

Maini Global Aerospace (MGA) has bagged an outsourcing contract worth up to $10 million to make structural components for the extended range fuel cells of the Boeing P-8A Poseidon multi-mission maritime (MMR) aircraft.

MGA — owned by the Maini group, which pioneered the manufacture of the country’s first electric car Reva — said it bagged the multi-year contract from the UK-based aerospace major Marshall of Cambridge Aerospace.

Marshall is among the major subcontractors for Boeing P8 Poseidon military aircraft currently being developed for the US Navy. It is intended to conduct anti-submarine warfare and shipping interdiction and to engage in an electronic intelligence (ELINT) role. India has also placed orders with Boeing for the supply of eight P-8I Poseidons at a total cost of $2.1 billion.

“We will invest around $30-40 million in the next 4-5 years to scale up our infrastructure and capacity. We expect to reach to a turnover of about `200-250 crore by 2015,” said Naresh Palta, CEO, Maini Global Aerospace.

This contract is expected to open newer opportunities for Maini Aerospace as Marshall is currently engaged in a number of major manufacturing projects, including the lightweight fuel tanks for commercial planes such as Boeing 747-400 ER aircraft, and Boeing 777 ER aircraft.

The firm also designs and manufactures engine housing structures for Honda Jet. Maini Aerospace which has developed more than 900 build-to-print parts has also bagged contracts worth Rs 50 crore from global customers such as Safran, BAE Systems, Eaton, Goodrich and Magellan Aerospace.

These orders deal with making critical components for wings, fuel pumps, pylons and cylinders that go into fighter jets and civilian aircraft.

It is also working with state-owned aerospace firm Hindustan Aeronautics (HAL) to make components for projects such as SU-30 fighter aircraft, Dornier aircraft, Intermediate jet trainers, Cheetah and Chetak helicopters.

“We are moving up the value chain and creating the ability to develop full wings, slats, tails, longerons, pylons, flaps, winglets and cabin doors,” said Mr Palta who was earlier an executive director at public sector major, Hindustan Aeronautics.

Defence experts say that emerging firms such as Maini Aerospace have an opportunity to tap around 15-20% of the $10-billion offset contracts. An offset agreement is a stipulation made between a foreign supplier and a company which requires the supplier to purchase a certain amount of goods from that country in exchange for a contract.

“The opportunity was more but has reduced, as foreign players are getting a wrong notion that partnering defence public sector units (DPSUs) will be safer. The chances of SMEs increase if they pass the financial due diligence muster of OEMs. Further, they can gain if foreign direct investment (FDI) limit is increased or if banking time limit is increased from the present two to 10 years,” said Rajiv Chib, associate director, aerospace and defence practice at consulting firm, PricewaterhouseCoopers.

“Maini has signed a couple of memorandums of understanding with some aerospace firms. They are also utilising the opportunity from sub contracts from DPSUs and providing components to tier 1 and tier 2 suppliers of major aerospace firms,” he added.

[chackojoseph]

Mahindra satyam to focus air and land-based defense systems

[Raghavendra]

India's defence research agency eyes export markets http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20100912/81 ... yes_1.html

[shukla]

DRDO plans to form commercial arm by year-end

[shukla]

Lockheed Martin to support innovation programme for 2 more yrs

US defence major Lockheed Martin today announced a two-year extension of its support to the Indian Innovation Growth Programme, which helps innovators commercialise their technologies. "In collaboration with the Indian Ministry of Science and Technology, Lockheed Martin is extending support for the programme through 2012," company officials said here.

The India Innovation Growth Programme was launched in March 2007 and aims at helping Indian innovators to transition their technologies to both the Indian and global markets.Speaking on the occasion, Lockheed''s Chief Technology Officer Ray Johnson said, "Innovation is a key driver to solving these global challenges, and this program will nurture the new ideas that will become these solutions."
Department of Science and Technology, the IC2 Institute of the University of Texas, FICCI and the Indo-US Science and Technology Forum are the other partners in the programme.

So far, 240 innovators have received training on commercialisation strategies and advanced training in areas such as technology commercialisation strategies, venture formation and finance, and marketing has been provided to 120 innovators, officials said.

[ShivaS]

I agree with Indrani

While our OFB are useless and suck up national funds at least some PSUs do good, like BHEL, DLW, Chittaranjan HEC etc. If only their leadership was a little more dynamic but not time scale promotions or brothers in law and aunties of our netas we can easily build the Subs we are going to import or the Ak-47 rounds, or the Tanks. or the Artilery that tenders are being floated.

example go here to see what HEC is doing and it can easily do even more...

http://www.hecltd.com/hec_products_stra ... ector.html

Propeller Shaft for Navy



Super Conducting Cyclotron Magnet

[Vipul]

Heavy Industries Ministry mulls HMT-HAL tie-up.

In an effort to revitalise sick public sector units, the Ministry of Heavy Industries is working on a partnership between the loss-making HMT's Bangalore unit and Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL).

Mr B. S. Meena, Secretary, Department of Heavy Industries, told Business Line that the model currently being worked on would involve manufacturing some components by HMT for HAL's recent big-ticket aircraft orders, including production of the Hawk advanced trainer and the Dhruv helicopters. Besides, HAL has just signed a joint venture with Russia to produce 205 military transport aircraft.

“The discussions are on with HAL as to what kind of components HMT can manufacture for it. We are trying to see whether this kind of a synergy can work. HAL has large orders for helicopters and jet trainers, but does not have the adequate capacity to manufacture them. We feel that they can use HMT's facilities and capabilities in this regard,” he said.

While talks are at an initial stage, it is possible that HAL may be asked to invest in the new tooling and machinery required for the manufacture of some components. “HMT will not invest anything and we're looking for HAL to put in the money, since we have to upgrade the machines,” said Mr Meena.

The HAL Chairman, Mr Ashok Nayak, said that the full details of what was on offer for HAL was not known. “There has been some thinking like that for revival. We have to first get together, understand their aspiration and see where and how we can get this done. We do want capacity unlimited as we have major projects coming up,” he said.

[tsarkar]

From my experience, when a healthy unit is married with a sick unit, the expectation is the healthy unit will nurse the sick unit to health, but the practical consequence is the sick unit infects the healthy unit.

[Craig Alpert]

Indian Navy Allocates Kamov-25 Helicopter for Study to Amrita University

[SriSri]

Mahindra Aerospace to Purchase Aircraft Manufacturing Parts from Boeing Australia

Mahindra & Mahindra Ltd. has signed a deal to buy aircraft parts-making machinery from Boeing Co.'s plant in Melbourne, Australia, a senior executive from the Mumbai-based company said.

"I believe the equipment will be shipped to India by the end of this (calendar) year," Hemant Luthra, president of Mahindra Systech--a group entity that incorporates all of Mahindra's component manufacturing units--, told Dow Jones Newswires recently.

The company hopes the deal between unit Mahindra Aerospace Pvt. Ltd. and Boeing will boost orders as it will likely help improve the quality of aircraft parts it produces and attract clients that need to fulfil their offset obligations in India. Under Indian law, foreign companies selected for government defense contracts have to source about 30% of the project value from local vendors if the project is worth 3 billion rupees or more.

The Indian government put an offset clause on a $15 billion, 111 aircraft deal signed in 2005 by national carrier Air India with Boeing and European manufacturer Airbus, so about 30% of the ongoing project will have to sourced locally. Boeing also last year signed a $2 billion deal with the government to supply eight long-range maritime reconnaissance and anti-submarine warfare P-8I aircraft to the Indian Navy. Mahindra plans to invest 2.5 billion rupees in its aerospace business over the next few years, with 1 billion rupees earmarked for aircraft manufacturing and the rest for making components.

Last year, Mahindra purchased 75.1% stakes in two Australian aerospace companies--Gippsland Aeronautics and Aerostaff Australia--for a total of 1.75 billion rupees ($37.9 million) to expand its aircraft and aerospace-component manufacturing capabilities in Australia. Asked about the value of the deal to buy machinery from Boeing's Melbourne plant, Mr. Luthra said: "It's a slightly complex deal and I wouldn't want to get into a specific value." A senior executive at Boeing India confirmed the deal, but didn't provide any more details.

Mr. Luthra said Mahindra is in talks with several other companies for possible acquisitions to expand its aerospace business, but he declined to elaborate. The company also plans to establish an aerospace facility in India, possibly in the south Indian state of Karnataka, he said. "We are on the verge of finalizing the land deal to set up the plant. It should hopefully be commissioned by late next year," he said. Mr. Luthra added that Mahindra's aerospace business is expected to post revenue of $100 million a year once the new plant in India starts production.

Mahindra Systech's component manufacturing units include Mahindra Aerospace Pvt. Ltd, as well as Mahindra Forgings Ltd., Mahindra Composites Ltd. and Mahindra Ugine Steel Co. Ltd. Mahindra & Mahindra is India's biggest sport-utility vehicle maker by sales.

http://www.india-defence.com/reports-4532

[sunny y]

Wind Tunnel Test Facilities In India

Part 1 : http://www.icast.org.in/Resources/Dwttfi1.pdf
Part 2 : http://www.icast.org.in/Resources/Dwttfi2.pdf

[chetak]

From my experience, when a healthy unit is married with a sick unit, the expectation is the healthy unit will nurse the sick unit to health, but the practical consequence is the sick unit infects the healthy unit.

Chairman, Mr Ashok Nayak has just lined up a padma shri or bhushan.

[shukla]

Chilli-grenade into action...

CRPF gets ‘chilli grenade’ to tackle stone pelters in J&K

As stone-throwing mobs in the Valley continue to be a pain in the neck of security forces, the Central Reserve Police Force (CRPF) has got a new non-lethal weapon to deal with violent crowds — ‘chilli grenades’. The first supply of the oleo-resin-based hand grenade, developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), has reached the CRPF and has already been used on a few occasions in the Valley.

Having chilli as one of its ingredients, the grenade, on explosion, emits a smoke that causes extreme irritation. “It is much more efficient than the normal tear-gas we use. Because of the level of irritation it produces, it is an ideal medium for mob-dispersal operations,” a senior CRPF official said. There is another advantage. Since the body is made of plastic, the grenade melts when it explodes, making it very difficult for a protester to throw it back. Instances of mobs throwing back tear-gas shells on security forces are common in J&K.

Also, unlike a tear-gas shell, it can be lobbed manually, officials said. “Since they are fired from a gun, tear-gas shells can potentially injure or kill a person. The chilli grenades can be thrown by hands and cannot cause serious physical harm even if they hit somebody,” the official said.

[SriSri]

Cross posting - Potential HAL, Honeywell tie-ups..

Honeywell Develops New Engine for Indian Air Force Jaguar Fighters

Honeywell's aerospace division is exploring opportunities for forging partnerships with Indian companies that are keen to address the demand for offsets in defence deals, said Pritam Bhavnani, President of Honeywell's Aerospace Division in India, on Tuesday.

Speaking to reporters here, Mr. Bhavnani said, Honeywell had developed a new engine for the Jaguar aircraft. "We have provided the new engine to Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. (HAL) and the Indian Air Force," he said.

About Honeywell's sourcing agreement with HAL for engines for turbo prop aircraft, Mr. Bhavnani said the first phase of the project was almost over. In the second phase HAL is to supply 400 additional parts. The third phase is likely to be completed in 2011, he said.

The sourcing agreement between the two companies requires HAL to supply Honeywell 600 aircraft engines over a 10-15-year period, Mr. Bhavnani said. Referring to the role played by Honeywell's facilities in Bangalore, Mr. Bhavnani said employees here had contributed to the development of the smart runaway landing and smart landing system.

He said the newly developed system would help aircraft pilots have "better situational awareness, especially in adverse weather conditions." He said Emirates airline and Alaska Airlines, among others, had shown interest in procuring the new system.

Honeywell employs 11,000 persons in India, constituting 8 per cent of its global workforce.

http://www.india-defence.com/reports-4544

[dinesha]

The Confederation of Indian Industry (CII) in association with the Directorate General of Information System (DGIS), Indian Army is pleased to announce the 3rd International Seminar & Exhibition on Battlefield Management System with the main theme “The Power to the Edge” on 21 – 22 September 2010 at Hotel Taj Palace, Sardar Patel Marg, New Delhi. Honorable Raksha Rajya Mantri Shri MM Pallam Raju has kindly consented to be the Chief Guest and Chief of the Army Staff General VK Singh, PVSM, AVSM, YSM, ADC will be the Guest of Honour.

A Battlefield Management System provides an integrated Common Operating Picture (COP) using collaborative planning tools for tactical commanders to make responsive and knowledge based decisions and exercise highly effective control over operations in a dynamic and fluid battlefield. The two earlier seminars organized by Confederation of Indian Industry (CII) in association with the Directorate General of Information System (DGIS) gave an insight into the concept of BMS and the communication challenges. The aim of this seminar is to benchmark the architectural requirements for the BMS being developed for the Indian Army. The two-day International Seminar will focus upon:

Challenges in Developing Applications to Support BMS
Exploiting Advances in the Field of Navigation and Mapping Technologies for BMS
Communication Infrastructure and Data Security
Soldier at the Network Edge: Finding the Right Balance in Form Factor, Weight, Power And Performance
Integration of Diverse Technologies - Interoperability Challenges, Past Experiences and Way Ahead

The seminar will provide an opportune platform for the Army, Academia, Industry and eminent experts from India and abroad to exchange their views and ideas.

Exhibition: Industry may also exhibit to project their capabilities and products to a very high level of audience/officials.
Excellent sponsorship options are available.

Source:CII
http://www.ciidefence.com/events/Intern ... ochure.pdf

[Indranil]

X-POSTING from LCA thread !

The government should give a tender for engines of MCA - to be 100% indigenous manufacturing . Two lowest bidders to be selected - highest for 60-70% of the order and the second for the rest. Engines to be manufactured within 10 years. Assured order book of XXX numbers. If one of them fails, the other would get 100% orders. 100% of the engine to be manufactured in India; the entity can be foreign owned (but with an Indian partner having minimum 26% holding). This way, the manufacturing technology would lie within India even if IP is with a foreign entity.

Let us see whether private sector or government sector can rise up to the challenge.

Much of India's private sector is a joke in this regard..they would simply run to some foreign company that builds gas turbine engines (GE, P&W, Snecma, RR or the Eurojet consortium) and dress up a foreign designed, foreign developed engine as an "Indian engine" and try to pass it off. This was openly stated as a fear by the MoD regarding allowing more FDI in defence firms in India.

They've done this kind of thing in the name of JV, in the automotive sector for a long time and considering the ridiculously small sums of money they invest in R&D, things are unlikely to change in a cutting edge field like gas turbine engines.

besides, India is not rich enough nor has the trained technical manpower to run 2 simultaneous turbofan engine development efforts. The only way to do it is to harness the advantages of both PSUs and private industries. Either one on its own has drawbacks that will mean a failed effort.

I agree in principal and add that we would have to come with a structure for IP control as well.

Let me add another example. Let us take the example of the basic trainer. If it was easy enough to build it, then how come the private parties are not getting into it? There is an assured market there (nationally and internationally). Everybody knew about this for the last 2 decades. The fact is that a modern basic trainer is also quite complex to build and it is not a five year job to set up the complex. I don't think our private sector is there yet!

On the other hand, departments in US universities build two seaters and infact Saras sized planes! So, it is just a matter of know how. We can't start by asking, "can you build LCA, or the engines for it?" I don't think that it is the right question to ask, right now. I think we are asking the wrong questions. We have to stop looking at the pvt. vs PSU. We should see how we can marry them.

For example, we know that we would need many utility planes. Throw a RFI to co-design a utility plane of certain tonnage. Set up HAL and NAL as a consultant in the project. Choose the private firm who is closest to be able to absorb the know-how required. Whatever HAL/NAL can't provide and the company can't design, they are free to get it whichever way they choose/can. Why should we be averse to get foreign knowhow. If the private firms can buy it, so be it. I am sure that it is very lucrative for the private industry. Such a plane is very open ended and has huge market. Here's a chance for a private player to get the know-how from HAL. We should have a framework to safeguard the IP. HAL/NAL gets consultancy fees (from whom? may be the government as part of national spending on defence. May be from the private firm which wins the deal). We would have brought up one player upto a point where he can absorb more.

This is what happened with L&T in the submarine case right. They were building parts. Now they believe they can learn how to put 2 and 2 together.

[manum]

most of companies of the countries we quote, have research cells in the universities and they fund those researches...and programs in Universities are running by private funding...or else companies approach to professors and students to work on their idea...and so on...

we don't have that culture yet...either researches are government funded or...there are private small fundings for small things...basically our universities are still not ground for research, with every student putting up their thesis...thesis means research, means no taken up work...all new...Imagine how many graduates, post-graduates and PHD's Indian universities shell out...out of em how many thesis's are even worth while to look at...and in that how many of them are being looked at...or being funded for broader use...

and so on...

there is no private sector company in India which is independent of foreign research base..some are learning the art, through continuous practice...we have a big gap with quality of our education...or else every student would have given something more to think and work on ...

private companies can get the job done, with bit backing and support from research based institutions...

I see how motivated they are...they get trash ideas to work...all because of their worldly motivations(Intellectuals only seek for world changing ideas, but these little bellied entrepreneurs, get Nirma famous in village) ...i think, if our private firms get a level ground, they will be able to do...the desired...

issue is government is still not able to give the leveled the ground...first we need good institutes, on national scale in numbers...proper segmentation of courses...there is huge amount of lag...all the leaders or visionaries are foreign educated (mostly)...we need world class institutes for those results...

we need those hygiene standards in place...

that is why software firms could run so fast and not all others...mostly it required brains and management skills...so they could jump that gap our institutes do have...anyways we all know these software firms train these guys, even after hiring them to make them useful...

[SriSri]

BAE Systems accepts System Integration Facility Clause enabling 74 per cent FDI in Defense

PTI wires...

[dinesha]

X-post

With no govt deals L&T's defence unit may face loss
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/art ... 681021.cms

Larsen & Toubro (L&T), which has invested Rs 2,500 crore to manufacture ships for the defence sector in Kattupalli in Tamil Nadu, faces the prospect of loss on its investments in the absence of orders, says a senior executive. The government is placing the order for manufacturing warships to public sector firms and importing submarines from foreign countries.

"If the government does not buy products of our shipyard, we will have to look at options for capacity utilisation of our new facility and also think on deploying manpower at other operations," said senior executive vice-president (heavy engineering) MV Kotwal.

The Kattupalli facility is scheduled to start commercial operations by December this year. The facility, which will have a total investment of Rs 3,000 crore, has 3,500 employees.

The Indian defence sector opened up for private participation in 2001 with the FDI limit capped at 26%, prompting companies like L&T, Tata, Ashok Leyland , Mahindra and Mahindra and Bharat Forge to enter the sector. However, L&T and Tata are among the few, which have developed capabilities to manufacture strategic equipment and acquired standard qualifications.

L&T's heavy engineering division had received licences for manufacturing submarines, warships and some of the strategic equipment in 2002.

It had also supported government agencies in manufacturing India's first indigenous nuclear powered submarine, INS Arihant, in June last year. But it is yet to get any government order for submarine. "It came as a rude shock," said Mr Kotwal. "Our facility at Hazira was evaluated and cleared for this purpose way back in 2001," he added.

Industry bodies - Federation of Indian Chambers of Commerce and Industry (Ficci) and Confederation of Indian Industry (CII) - have proposed restructuring the defence procurement policy to encourage greater private sector participation.

"Similar to other sectors, defence sector, too, needs more private participation. It will help the country to bring down expenses," said Vivek Pandit, director for energy and defence at FICCI. According to a latest report released by CII and KPMG, the defence ministry does not provide long-term equipment procurement plans to even big private companies, thereby denying the private players the lead-time to develop the equipment needed in the future.

The Indian defence sector has planned to spend Rs 4,50,000 crore on military equipment in the next 10 years. India imports 70% of its defence requirements, while the remaining is produced by Defence Public Sector Undertakings (DPSU) or its collaboration entities.

[Nihat]

PSu's are the cancer of India and yet our defence forces continue to depend on them only or what are a lot of the times unreliable foreign suppliers. When the Pvt. sector has proved its worth and beaten back the PSU's in almost everything ranging from Aviation , Telecom, Banking, Insurance, Real Esate , Power generation etc etc etc.

It's not like the Pvt. sector has some magical technology to roll out ultra mordern ships but what they do have in an efficiant system which should ensure minimal delays, the kind of delays we have in developments of Subs and Frigates is criminal to say the least.

[vic]

X-post

With no govt deals L&T's defence unit may face loss
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/art ... 681021.cms

Larsen & Toubro (L&T), which has invested Rs 2,500 crore to manufacture ships for the defence sector in Kattupalli in Tamil Nadu, faces the prospect of loss on its investments in the absence of orders, says a senior executive. The government is placing the order for manufacturing warships to public sector firms and importing submarines from foreign countries.
"If the government does not buy products of our shipyard, we will have to look at options for capacity utilisation of our new facility and also think on deploying manpower at other operations," said senior executive vice-president (heavy engineering) MV Kotwal.


It had also supported government agencies in manufacturing India's first indigenous nuclear powered submarine, INS Arihant, in June last year. But it is yet to get any government order for submarine. "It came as a rude shock," said Mr Kotwal. "Our facility at Hazira was evaluated and cleared for this purpose way back in 2001," he added.

This gives strong indication that there is go slow on nuclear subs for SSNs and SSBNs also. There were rumours that after 3 ATVs, we will order 3 ATV+ and another 3 SSBNs but it seems that L&T is starving for any orders.

[Kailash]

Five Nobel laureates to attend Indian Science Congress

"For the Science Congress, five Nobel Laureates -- Dr Venkataraman Ramakrishnan, Dr Thomas A Steitz, Dr Ada E Yonath, Dr Martin Chalfie, Professor Tim Hunt have confirmed their participation," Indian Science Congress Association (ISCA) General President K C Pandey told reporters on Monday...<snip>....About 50 eminent scientists from Japan, Europe and United Kingdom would participate in the four-day event which begins on January 3 at the SRM University, Kattankulathur, near here.

The focal theme of the Congress would be "Quality Education and Excellence in Scientific Research in Indian Universities", he said.

I hope these interaction lead to closer ties between Indian and foreign universities. If some of this crowd can influence their students and colleagues to be visiting professors, guest lecturers to Indian colleges, would have a profound impact on the younger generation. We may possibly see more of them picking up science and research.