Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): 29 March 2012

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 02:21

Kabul attack could spark US-Pakistan tension
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/04/16 ... n-tension/

ISLAMABAD – A brazen, 18-hour attack allegedly carried out by Pakistan-based militants on targets in the Afghan capital, including the U.S. Embassy, could spark fresh tension between Washington and Islamabad just as they seemed to be patching up their vital but troubled relationship.The attack, which ended early Monday, will likely re-ignite anger in Washington over Pakistan's unwillingness to crack down on militants using its territory as a base to target neighboring Afghanistan. But the Obama administration must weigh the impact any public criticism of Pakistan may have on the country's cooperation with it in other areas, including getting supplies to troops in Afghanistan and negotiating peace with insurgents there.The potential flashpoint comes days after Pakistan's parliament finally approved new guidelines for the country in its relationship with the U.S., a decision that Washington hopes will pave the way for the reopening of supply lines to NATO troops in Afghanistan.Afghan officials on Monday said a gunman arrested in the attacks told authorities the simultaneous strikes in Kabul and three other cities were carried out by the Haqqani network, a militant group allegedly linked to Pakistan's spy agency. The attacks killed 11 people — eight members of the Afghan security forces and three civilians. Thirty-six insurgents were also killed.
The attacks were the most widespread in Kabul since an assault on the U.S. Embassy and NATO headquarters last September also blamed on the Haqqani network. U.S. officials accused Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence agency, or ISI, of helping with that attack, sparking outrage in Islamabad.

An ISI official said Monday that claims the Haqqani network was behind the latest attacks were "nothing but accusations.""We have no idea who carried out these attacks," the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media. "Whenever something happens, blame is always laid on our doorstep."If the role of the Haqqani network is confirmed, it could place the Obama administration in a tricky position. It could face pressure from Congress and Republican presidential contender Mitt Romney to criticize Pakistan. But the U.S. wants Islamabad to reopen the NATO supply lines, and the country's help is seen as key to negotiating a peace agreement with the Taliban in Afghanistan.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 02:24

http://dawn.com/2012/04/16/haqqani-netw ... -pentagon/
Haqqani network behind Afghan attack: Pentagon

WASHINGTON: The Pentagon said Monday a major attack on Afghan government buildings, military bases and foreign embassies was likely carried out by Haqqani militants who operate from sanctuaries in neighboring Pakistan.“Initial indications are that the Haqqani network was involved in this set of attacks that occurred yesterday in Kabul,” press secretary George Little said of Sunday’s assault.The 18-hour attack was “well-coordinated,” but Afghan security forces “did a very effective job” in quelling the onslaught, Little told reporters.It was not surprising that insurgents had launched an attack with the advent of spring, when fighting usually escalates in Afghanistan, he said.“We thought something like this may very well happen and it did,” he said.
Although Afghan President Hamid Karzai had complained about an intelligence failure by Afghan and especially Nato-led troops, the Pentagon spokesman said it was not realistic to expect coalition forces to know in advance about every insurgent operation.“I don’t believe this was an intelligence failure. We did sense that something like this might happen,” Little said.He also rejected any comparison to the Tet offensive during the Vietnam war, saying it was not a large-scale military operation but instead a series of terror attacks.“I’m not minimizing the seriousness of this but this is in no way” like the Tet offensive, “ he said

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 02:27

Pooch that barked
Zardari expresses concern over Afghanistan attacks

ISLAMABAD: President Asif Ali Zardari has strongly condemned the terrorist attacks in capital Kabul and other parts of Afghanistan.Spokesperson to the president Senator Farhatullah Babar said the president expressed the resolve that people and Government of Pakistan would continue to stand with their Afghan brethren in their time of distress and difficulty.He expressed the hope that peace would prevail in times ahead.The president said that Pakistan has always desired a peaceful, stable and prosperous Afghanistan as it was in Pakistan’s own national interest and assured that Pakistan would continue to extend all possible support to every effort aimed at restoring peace and stability in Afghanistan.he president also directed Pakistan’s ambassador to Afghanistan Muhammad Sadiq to ensure security and safety of the Pakistan’s women parliamentarian’s delegation that are currently on a visit to Afghanistan.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 17 Apr 2012 02:44

shiv wrote: ...
I have absolutely no way of countering these simple truths without complicated arguments that will begin to bore anyone with an attention span of less than five minutes.

It's just that I choose not to believe these simple connections that are being made about the popularity of Islam and that once a person is islamic he "voluntarily" enjoys doing things that everyone else hates, or at least does under protest. Protest is not allowed against anything that is called "islamic", least of all an Islamic charity. I think Islam is all about coercion, but I cannot force people to believe what I believe. If people buy the story that islamic things are being done with great enthusiasm and no hint of coercion, that is exactly what Islamists want you to believe. I am sure they are right and I am wrong. But I prefer to be wrong here. I am choosing to be described as "wrong".

Surely it is a shame that you can't find anyone intellectually qualified eenough to appreciate your nuanced thesis of pakis being victims of coercion. But I have to ask, granting your thesis is valid, what then? You have suggested in other posts that, therefore, given the chance, mango pakis will rise up and overthrow their oppressive system, thereby neatly solving India's TSP problem. Would you care to explain why this consequence is not naive and ahistorical?

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 17 Apr 2012 02:50

Jhujar wrote: An ISI official said Monday that claims the Haqqani network was behind the latest attacks were "nothing but accusations.""We have no idea who carried out these attacks," the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media. "Whenever something happens, blame is always laid on our doorstep

So they do agree that they are in cahoots with the Haqqanis.

Rohit_K · Post by **Rohit_K** » 17 Apr 2012 03:17

Video: Jernail Gul falling down at duffer-e-Pakistan council meet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gpb76RPyfz8

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 17 Apr 2012 03:42

Repeated ad nauseum,Om-Baba,pl. bring on the B-52s and wipe the sh*t screwing you in Af-Pak off the face of the earth.Otherwise,keep on talking to the Pakis and keep getting shafted.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 17 Apr 2012 04:20

Lord Ahmed suspended from Labour Party after 'offering £10m bounty for capture of Obama and Bush'

Lord Ahmed, a controversial British peer, has been suspended from the Labour Party amid reports that he offered a £10 million bounty for the capture of President Barack Obama and his predecessor President George W Bush.

According to Pakistan's Express Tribune newspaper Lord Ahmed offered the bounty in response to a US action a week ago.
The US issued a $10 million reward for the capture of Pakistani militant leader Hafiz Mohammad Saeed, founder of the Lashkar-e-Taiba group, who it suspects of orchestrating the 2008 Mumbai attacks in which 166 people died as terrorists stormed hotels and a train station.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -Bush.html

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 17 Apr 2012 04:37

Regarding FDI from inimical countries, my perspective is that FDI per se is not a problem. Investment in fixed assets in India is beneficial to us - such investments are sticky and generate jobs and economic benefits to us. Our laws make it attractive for FDI capital to roundtrip or come in via the Mauritius route, so investments from the criminals in the gulf and the RAPE has been happening for a while. What would be an issue is preferential or eased FII access - such hot money flows would be a bigger headache than investments that generate fixed assets in India, with laws incentivizing reinvestment of capital and penalizing it being taken out. It essentially amounts to a money trap or cookie jar of its own, and will gut their own domestic industry from the inside out, accelerating their economic woes.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 05:10

La Whore Khan With Chor Khan

Imran offers Dr Qadir to become patron of PTI

The Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf chairman Imran Khan on Monday offered renowned nuclear scientist Dr Abdul Qadir Khan to become his party’s patron.This offer was made by Imran Khan during a meeting with the nuclear scientist which lasted for an hour.The two national heroes talked about terrorism, law and order situation, price hike, joblessness and other challenges faced by the country.Speaking on the occasion, Imran Khan said that the people like Dr Abdul Qadir Khan should join PTI for the solution of national problems.Dr AQ Khan said that politicians must talk about national issues instead of personal issues. He was of the view that it is necessary to get rid of politics of corruption to find solution of the problems

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 05:18

http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news- ... chen-india
Shia-Chin by Kha Lidh Iq -Ball

Both the countries have gotten used to an interesting pattern and profile package in the context of their bilateral interactions. They work meticulously for years to build a rapprochement framework, or at least an aura of it; then something happens and things are back to square one - generally, a near war situation.
The cycle then reengineers itself under the pressure of compulsions to stay engaged. Under the fear of domestic backlash, leaders from both sides restart through somewhat shying encounters on the periphery of international diplomatic venues, then graduate to meet under the cover of sports, cultural or religious events. Political oppositions of both the countries remain too eager to blame respective governments for a ‘sell out’ without really specifying the commodity. Dr Manmohan Singh was about to lose his job after his meeting with Pakistani counterpart on the sidelines of NAM summit at Sharm El-Sheikh. However, this time it was an enabling political environment; the opposition political parties of Pakistan had wished the President of Pakistan good luck before the visit and the Indian leader of opposition joined him for lunch.
One major setback bilateral relations came as a result of Indian invasion of Siachen in 1984, a glacier that had been respected as a “no man’s land” since independence. Siachen was invaded to pressurise Pakistan amidst the most dense and intense phase of the Afghan war of independence against the erstwhile Soviets. Soon after, it was followed by massive military deployments, all along India-Pakistan border, under the garb of military exercise “Brass-tacks”. Presumably, both these actions were executed by India on the behest of Soviets. During those days, India used to be too happy to play proxy for Soviets. Like these days, during the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan also, India was on the wrong side of popular Afghan aspirations.
Siachen was considered so irrelevant piece of land that the Simla Agreement, while drawing the Line of Control, did not consider it significant enough to demarcate the territory beyond the map coordinate known as NJ9842. The Indian armed forces crept into Siachen in 1984 and moved on to the Saltoro Range to the west. Realising that India had come so close to Skardu, Pakistan too sent its troops up to the Saltoro Range. A misplaced adventure by the Indian army to climb up an undemarcated glacier and to hang-on there sowed a powerful seed of mistrust that has been a cause of later happenings like Kargil. Moreover, unprovoked Indian invasion of Siachen resulted in the activation of highest battle ground of the world.Pakistan did not start this conflict. India moved into the area and occupied the higher peaks on the Saltoro Range. India aggressed; its military should not have been at its present location. Pakistan has all along been trying to end the conflict; but it cannot do it unilaterally. At the same time, India has no incentive to withdraw. Indian army is the main hurdle; to justify its continued occupation, it tries to attach fairy tale strategic significance to the territory that it now occupies. For any meaningful initiative for durable peace between India and Pakistan, demilitarisation of Siachen could be a starting point. Pakistani side has proposed a solution: the undemarcated areas under the Simla Agreement become zones of disengagement with both sides withdrawing their troops without prejudice to their pre-Siachen conflict positions.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 17 Apr 2012 06:10

Sushupti wrote:
Lord Ahmed suspended from Labour Party after 'offering £10m bounty for capture of Obama and Bush'

Lord Ahmed, a controversial British peer, has been suspended from the Labour Party amid reports that he offered a £10 million bounty for the capture of President Barack Obama and his predecessor President George W Bush.

According to Pakistan's Express Tribune newspaper Lord Ahmed offered the bounty in response to a US action a week ago.
The US issued a $10 million reward for the capture of Pakistani militant leader Hafiz Mohammad Saeed, founder of the Lashkar-e-Taiba group, who it suspects of orchestrating the 2008 Mumbai attacks in which 166 people died as terrorists stormed hotels and a train station.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... -Bush.html

You can take the Paki out of Pakistan, but you cannot take the Pakistan out of a Paki.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2012 06:46

Neela wrote: Sirji, end of the day, current GoI came into power despite 26/11 ---> that is also part of the puzzle.

People do not actually vote based on 3 day events like 26/11. When you go to the voting booth you are not even thinking of the "Haath" or "Lotus" - but the person whom you think might work. You are voting for a name. If one party gets most of the names right - that party wins. OT

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 07:08

Siachen bhi Hamara, Balochistan nahi tumahara
Sindh Pakjab lenge larr ke
Bhookha, Nanga , Kamjor , Inbred
Garib, Anparr, Pyasa owrr Bechara,
Hai tuu Paki,
Kya karr legga hamara?

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2012 07:10

KLNMurthy wrote: You have suggested in other posts that, therefore, given the chance, mango pakis will rise up and overthrow their oppressive system, thereby neatly solving India's TSP problem.

I have not suggested anything of the sort. Part of the problem with saying anything is the imagination that people bring in to play to extrapolate words to delusional extremes, possibly based on desperate hopes they secretly harbor in their minds. That Pakistan problem is not going to be solved easily or soon. I have stated that. Perhaps you ignored that statement while you lapped up everything else I wrote.

I offer no solutions. I only offer a viewpoint that brings down Islam and its imagined attraction a notch for the sake of accuracy and honesty. Islam and the LetT/JuD's actions at the core are like a bunch of thugs and there is coercion of anyone who is weak even among their own group. So the idea that all Muslims "voluntarily" do something first needs to be discarded. At least some proportion of them are being forced into doing things that they would avoid if they had a choice.

What is the proportion of people who face this? Who is likely to have access to such information, or how can it be gleaned? Can they ever be given a choice to do something different? What choices can they be given? In what way can they even be approached at split away from the coercion? How can their behaviour be modified?

These are some of the questions that arise from failing to worship Islam the way most people seem to do - imagining that it exerts an irresistible pull that makes a man with 2 Rupees give away half his wealth to "charity"

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 17 Apr 2012 07:17

>> imagining that it exerts an irresistible pull that makes a man with 2 Rupees give away half his wealth to "charity"

And who imagined that?

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2012 07:35

abhishek_sharma wrote:>> imagining that it exerts an irresistible pull that makes a man with 2 Rupees give away half his wealth to "charity"

And who imagined that?

Not you. What you did was put figures of how many Rupees might be put into the LeTs boxes by different categories of people. I just took that to the limit and thought of what a man with two Rupees might put into an LeT box and wondered if he was really doing that with great enthusiasm. Most of the time the information that I get exposed to tells me that a man who has only 2 Rupees - or for that matter a man who has only 20 Rupees is normally looking for more for himself because that money will last less than a day. Giving away even part of that that money "willingly" and "voluntarily" to "charity" is counter intuitive. And the fact that coercion occurs is documented.

Once you accept the fact of coercion, it offers a theoretical opening where removal of that coercion frees the person and reduces support for the coercive agent. This is only a theoretical opening and I am certain it exists and must be exploited. I have no idea how, but I will continue to look for information about the extent to which coercion is being applied to build up a picture.

National taxes themselves are coercion, but the theory is that government means well and are accountable. The LeT have taken on the mantle of government in that they say they mean well and they coerce taxes out of people. Of course they are not accountable in any way. The government of Pakistan, in turn does not get taxes, but gets money in aid and gifts. It suits the Pakistani "government" to do that. Its suits the LeT to do what they are doing. It seems to suit international aid givers to give Pakistan money. Does it suit all people in Pakistan to be paying money to LeT without tangible gains to themselves? Clearly some of them actually gain from the LeT's activities. Others are 'satisfied" that India and kafirs are being attacked. But in the middle of all this there is one set of people - estimated to be about 30-40% of Pakistan's population who lead desperate lives with shortages of everything. This is an "exploitable" group. The LeT is exploiting them. The Paki government is exploiting them. There are at least two "governments" exploiting a section of Pakistanis. How can we exploit them? Can we exploit them the way Evangelists exploit people in Orissa? Can we "use" them in any way?

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 17 Apr 2012 07:36

SBajwa wrote:

Top

Pak intruder shot dead in Gurdaspur

Sorry, I just had to quote this post and image, on account of the awesome mustache on the Indian soldier's face. It is sure to cause paki shalwar shivering all by itself.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 17 Apr 2012 07:55

But in the middle of all this there is one set of people - estimated to be about 30-40% of Pakistan's population who lead desperate lives with shortages of everything. This is an "exploitable" group. The LeT is exploiting them.

Actually I assumed that people below the poverty line would not contribute anything to LeT. The extent of their exploitation (and how much resentment they feel) is unknown (to me).

OT: In any case, Obama showed in 2008 elections that you can raise millions if you have a wide fan base who are really crazy for you. He got $5, $10 contributions from hundreds of thousands of college students (and other not very rich sections of the society). Since the cost of a 26/11 -type attack is not very huge, LeT can raise sufficient money *without* coercing anyone *if* enough people care deeply for its cause.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 17 Apr 2012 08:01

Suraj wrote:Regarding FDI from inimical countries, my perspective is that FDI per se is not a problem. Investment in fixed assets in India is beneficial to us - such investments are sticky and generate jobs and economic benefits to us. Our laws make it attractive for FDI capital to roundtrip or come in via the Mauritius route, so investments from the criminals in the gulf and the RAPE has been happening for a while. What would be an issue is preferential or eased FII access - such hot money flows would be a bigger headache than investments that generate fixed assets in India, with laws incentivizing reinvestment of capital and penalizing it being taken out. It essentially amounts to a money trap or cookie jar of its own, and will gut their own domestic industry from the inside out, accelerating their economic woes.

I suggested that the hot money could already have been flowing from the gulf. There are two concerns with flows - even officially and in infrastructure for any capital coming out of the Gulf. Saudis are experts at having a nebulous financial network that invests strategically, with profits bankrolling ideological and political ambitions. If Pakis use that strategy, then we would be bankrolling their own terror networks on us.

The second and more important issue is that such investments themselves may have an impact on state policy with interested portions of political elite protecting the investors and their potential role in terror or ideological imperialism. I have indicated a few of these possibilities as scoped for the mighty USA in the West Asia thread. If USA can fall for it, what makes us so sure of non-impact over our own political class?

A third possible angle to my earlier list of potential causes behind GOI's spate of Paki-love is that given the global funding crisis, with European or such possible sources that could be extracted or diverted to party funds and electoral expenses - most likely facing a drying up - the political elite are simply exploring an alternative source of electoral and party funding.

That might explain the bull-like determination to push through the financial relationship and the urgency. UP elections and the next round of elections may appear to need much larger scales of financing. The only source left with spare cash is the Gulf. But does it come without strings? It never did anywhere - even for sooper power USA [which apparently was made into sooper power by Arabic infrastructural investments and which similarly will make us sooper powers too].

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2012 08:13

abhishek_sharma wrote: Actually I assumed that people below the poverty line would not contribute anything to LeT. The extent of their exploitation (and how much resentment they feel) is unknown (to me).

That they are exploited is beyond doubt, but I have spent so many years collecting general information on "Pakistan" that I now need to turn my attention to internal details in Pakistan to pick up the info when it appears.

One thing that appears to me to be an area of "cognitive bias" is the way in which we are able to recognize that there are "internal traitors" in India and there there are groups in India who can be exploited by foreign powers. We are able to pinpoint such nuances because we know India in detail.

On the other hand we tend to look at Pakistan as a monolith with generalizations most of the time. The best we have done is to see Pakistanis as ethnicities like Sindhi/Pakjabi/Baluchi etc. Or religious minority like Shia/ Ahmedi. But there is an overriding tendency to paint over any gaps in knowledge of detail by the generalization that 'Islam unites the rest of them" and "they are all opposed to India". These have been useful generalizations so far, but if we want to look at exploitable groups in Pakistan we need to find out more detail. There are real exploitable differences in Pakistan that go down to caste and community level, as well as other cracks. We know next to nothing on the forum, but the detail is there. We need to dig that up. I have stated several times that some of this detail will be known to WKKs, diplomats, Intel agencies and people who have travelled widely in Pakistan.

If there are exploitable groups in Pakistan, they must be exploited. The monolith picture has its uses, but looking at the trees in the forest has different uses. Neither can be discarded.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 17 Apr 2012 08:23

The fact that they have internal fights and cracks may have nothing to do with any common hatred of India. The hatred is partly nurtured by the mullahs and the state, and partly by jealousy promoted by viewing the metres of contorting female flesh peddled by Bollywood [wealth is equally splashed on Paki channels and movies onlee the wimmin get displayed less onlee hints hints]. So the hatred is curable - but again onlee possible in the absence of the mullah, and his stick or chopper as well the dissolution of the state - and under Indian sovereignty.

There are cracks yes - but most of those cracks have mullahcracy distributed and hedged well on both sides of the crack. For example there are mullah lobbies both against and for sufi pir and money making systems. There are mullah lobbies on both sides of caste divides etc. One of the few questions where all mullahs unite with the Paki state and army and the feudals is the question of redistribution of land from big-holders to the marginal or landless.

Not every crack will be useful for us - onlee that which pitches Islam together with army and feudals against the aam. The caste and other cracks speculated on do not belong to this category.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2012 08:25

abhishek_sharma wrote: Since the cost of a 26/11 -type attack is not very huge, LeT can raise sufficient money *without* coercing anyone *if* enough people care deeply for its cause.

In fact even before the LeT came into existence, the father of the LeT, the Pakistan army attacked and made life miserable for India in 1965, and created misery in Bangladesh in 1971. But every split that can reduce their funding and wealth and leeway is worth exploiting. Nothing can be left out as unimportant. if the US can be urged to stop paying Pakistan, the LeT and Paki army will only squeeze more money from drugs and extortion of their own people. Those are routes that need attention so that they can be squeezed, putting even more pressure on the LeT and Pakistan army.

One of the fears expressed in the "international community" is that increasing poverty pressure on Pakistan puts more Pakistanis at risk of coercion by groups like the JuD/LeT. This is true. Those groups make their money out of everything that is called "illegal" by others. Extortion, human trafficking, drugs, robberies, abduction and blackmail as well as terrorism. It is another mater that all this gets Islamic sanction. But for them to benefit from all this it is not as if only India is suffering and that every group in Pakistan is perfectly happy. There are groups in Pakistan who are being squeezed and we must identify these groups to see how their behavior can be modified.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2012 08:27

brihaspati wrote: Not every crack will be useful for us - onlee that which pitches Islam together with army and feudals against the aam. The caste and other cracks speculated on do not belong to this category.

Unless we are willing to admit that cracks exist, we will not even look for cracks. An assumption that cracks "cannot exist" somewhere is wilful blindness. We need to identify cracks before we can talk of exploitation. This has rarely been discussed on here and very little detail has appeared on BRF.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 17 Apr 2012 08:53

shiv wrote:
brihaspati wrote: Not every crack will be useful for us - onlee that which pitches Islam together with army and feudals against the aam. The caste and other cracks speculated on do not belong to this category.
Unless we are willing to admit that cracks exist, we will not even look for cracks. An assumption that cracks "cannot exist" somewhere is wilful blindness. We need to identify cracks before we can talk of exploitation. This has rarely been discussed on here and very little detail has appeared on BRF.

I have tried to raise the issue of land and land ownership with references for a long time. I specifically mentioned it as one that clubs the mullahcracy together with the army and the feudals on one side against redistribution.

arun · Post by **arun** » 17 Apr 2012 08:58

Jhujar wrote:Kabul attack could spark US-Pakistan tension
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/04/16 ... n-tension/
ISLAMABAD – A brazen, 18-hour attack allegedly carried out by Pakistan-based militants on targets in the Afghan capital, including the U.S. Embassy, could spark fresh tension between Washington and Islamabad just as they seemed to be patching up their vital but troubled relationship.The attack, which ended early Monday, will likely re-ignite anger in Washington over Pakistan's unwillingness to crack down on militants using its territory as a base to target neighboring Afghanistan. But the Obama administration must weigh the impact any public criticism of Pakistan may have on the country's cooperation with it in other areas, including getting supplies to troops in Afghanistan and negotiating peace with insurgents there.The potential flashpoint comes days after Pakistan's parliament finally approved new guidelines for the country in its relationship with the U.S., a decision that Washington hopes will pave the way for the reopening of supply lines to NATO troops in Afghanistan.Afghan officials on Monday said a gunman arrested in the attacks told authorities the simultaneous strikes in Kabul and three other cities were carried out by the Haqqani network, a militant group allegedly linked to Pakistan's spy agency. The attacks killed 11 people — eight members of the Afghan security forces and three civilians. Thirty-six insurgents were also killed.
The attacks were the most widespread in Kabul since an assault on the U.S. Embassy and NATO headquarters last September also blamed on the Haqqani network. U.S. officials accused Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence agency, or ISI, of helping with that attack, sparking outrage in Islamabad.

An ISI official said Monday that claims the Haqqani network was behind the latest attacks were "nothing but accusations.""We have no idea who carried out these attacks," the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to talk to the media. "Whenever something happens, blame is always laid on our doorstep."If the role of the Haqqani network is confirmed, it could place the Obama administration in a tricky position. It could face pressure from Congress and Republican presidential contender Mitt Romney to criticize Pakistan. But the U.S. wants Islamabad to reopen the NATO supply lines, and the country's help is seen as key to negotiating a peace agreement with the Taliban in Afghanistan.

Nothing for the sort is going to happen. The US seems to be prepared to find any excuse to absolve the Islamic Republic of Pakistan of any responcibility for the attack.

So much for the lectures of the Ra Ra US Brigade on BR

. CNN on what the Chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff has to say:

While the Haqqani group is based in Pakistan, at the moment the United States does not have evidence that the attacks emanated from there, Gen. Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said Monday.

CNN

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 09:23

Protest demo in US against killing of Shia community in Pakistan
http://pn.com.pk/details_en.php?nid=21454
( Pakistan is dream land of the Muslims of South Asia who speak better Pinglish than English )

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 17 Apr 2012 09:28

Why is the c silent?

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 09:29

Pakistan trusts India more than ever: Hina
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news- ... -ever-hina

ISLAMABAD - Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar has said that Islamabad now trusts New Delhi more than ever before and believes the Kashmir dispute cannot be a roadblock.“We will trust India more in whatever we do. We are clear on this,” Khar told Hindustan Times. She said although the Kashmir issue needed to be resolved, it needed not be the point of start.“Our intention is to solve the Kashmir problem. But let us start with the less complicated problems. We will deal with our differences in a different mode,” Khar said.
On Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh’s much-anticipated but yet undecided trip to Pakistan, she said: “This only states the clear direction of our foreign policy that we will not let go any desire from India unattended.”Hina said the time had come to not get bogged down by the old mindset.She said Pakistan was turning a new leaf. “Should the political mindset adopt or co-opt the military mindset? Issues are dealt with military mindset alright, but the problems are ultimately solved by a political mindset.”The foreign minister said Pakistan and India should take a lesson from the recent avalanche that buried 138 people in the Siachen sector and review troop deployments on the Himalayan glacier.

( I dont like this political BS pitch)

Sriman · Post by **Sriman** » 17 Apr 2012 09:29

sanjaykumar wrote:Why is the c silent?

Because it's the majority.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Apr 2012 09:44

Sriman wrote:
sanjaykumar wrote:Why is the c silent?
Because it's the majority.

I cee

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 17 Apr 2012 12:53

Jhujar wrote:Pakistan trusts India more than ever: Hina
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news- ... -ever-hina
ISLAMABAD - Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar has said that Islamabad now trusts New Delhi more than ever before and believes the Kashmir dispute cannot be a roadblock.“We will trust India more in whatever we do. We are clear on this,” Khar told Hindustan Times. She said although the Kashmir issue needed to be resolved, it needed not be the point of start.“Our intention is to solve the Kashmir problem. But let us start with the less complicated problems. We will deal with our differences in a different mode,” Khar said.
On Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh’s much-anticipated but yet undecided trip to Pakistan, she said: “This only states the clear direction of our foreign policy that we will not let go any desire from India unattended.”Hina said the time had come to not get bogged down by the old mindset.She said Pakistan was turning a new leaf. “Should the political mindset adopt or co-opt the military mindset? Issues are dealt with military mindset alright, but the problems are ultimately solved by a political mindset.”The foreign minister said Pakistan and India should take a lesson from the recent avalanche that buried 138 people in the Siachen sector and review troop deployments on the Himalayan glacier.
( I dont like this political BS pitch)

They are reaching the beginning of the endgame in afghanistan.

They need a very quiet India whose attention is diverted elsewhere and MMS will oblige for sure.

This FDI pappi jhappi will keep the whole DDM, specially the dorky ELM wet and excited and constantly slobbering over non issues like FDI and Siachin withdrawal and what not, exactly like "VEER" sangvhi and his foodistan shows. Why does he not organise a Indo pak jerk off contest?

Too bad that we never had a leadership who ever thought strategically and with the welfare of the Indian state uppermost in their tiny minds. We should trust the pakis like we can trust a black mamba.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 17 Apr 2012 13:06

The longer the danda up in Pakistan's musharraf, the more they will trust. It is only when others start giving them money like USA has been doing since the past many years, that trust goes down. Pakistan needs deep penetration.

Yogi_G · Post by **Yogi_G** » 17 Apr 2012 13:16

Jhujar wrote:Pakistan trusts India more than ever: Hina
http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news- ... -ever-hina
ISLAMABAD - Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar has said that Islamabad now trusts New Delhi more than ever before and believes the Kashmir dispute cannot be a roadblock.“We will trust India more in whatever we do. We are clear on this,” Khar told Hindustan Times. She said although the Kashmir issue needed to be resolved, it needed not be the point of start.“Our intention is to solve the Kashmir problem. But let us start with the less complicated problems. We will deal with our differences in a different mode,” Khar said.
On Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh’s much-anticipated but yet undecided trip to Pakistan, she said: “This only states the clear direction of our foreign policy that we will not let go any desire from India unattended.”Hina said the time had come to not get bogged down by the old mindset.She said Pakistan was turning a new leaf. “Should the political mindset adopt or co-opt the military mindset? Issues are dealt with military mindset alright, but the problems are ultimately solved by a political mindset.”The foreign minister said Pakistan and India should take a lesson from the recent avalanche that buried 138 people in the Siachen sector and review troop deployments on the Himalayan glacier.
( I dont like this political BS pitch)

This is what Indians have been saying for a long time, let's solve the other problems first and then address the Kashmir issue once enough confidence has been built. Pakistan always said Kashmir is the only problem and let's get to that first.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 17 Apr 2012 13:36

brihaspati: the Saudi's have effectively unlimited nominal capital and are the most influential member of a cartel controling the price of a critical commodity that they were until recently the largest producer of (Russia appears to be the largest now, but isn't as much an OPEC influence).

Yes, the RAPE class has some wealth, but lets be realistic here - their ability to peddle influence in India is limited by their relative lack of wealth, compared to the sheer amount of wealth being generated in India today. They're no HK or Taiwan funding early Chinese economic growth, or the Saudis investing in US - both examples are comparatively far more substantial in both relative and absolute terms. On the other hand, Pakistan has a GDP less than the annual increase in Indian GDP. GoI's central tax revenues will soon exceed Pakistan's GDP.

Further, by design, the babudom makes liquidation and repatriation of fixed asset based investments painful. GoI was never and will probably never be a paragon of efficiency or excellence in implementation. But while it does a lot wrong, it also does a lot right. There's a certain tendency on BR to bemoan the failures and not credit the successes enough. Sure there's plenty of bad guys and plenty of dirty money floating about. As a case study, there's been a consistent effort to undermine the economy via counterfeit currency. Yet, RBI M0/M2 data does not bear out claims that they've driven inflation.

My point is that by enabling them to invest via the FDI route their capital will be sunk into the Indian economy in a manner that they cannot take out easily, and to an extent that they're simply not influential enough to accomplish much. The arbitrariness of the babudom combined with the blow hot/cold nature of bilateral ties means they face a significant investment risk, plus little general ability to channel the money out to fund whatever terrorist actions they want to. In effect it gets their hand stuck in the cookie jar. They can take it out of course - but they have to let go of the cookie in the form of the sunk investments in India...

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 17 Apr 2012 13:55

I would appreciate the Paki RAPE class not so much as investing money in India as much as just living the lavish lifestyle in India with all the booze and beaches. It is good if they boost luxury consumption in India.

The feudals in Pakiland can sell India all their agricultural produce and from the money they can live a life of luxury in India. The extra food would reduce food inflation in India and the money stays in India.

We need to suck Pakistani economy dry.

Neela · Post by **Neela** » 17 Apr 2012 14:08

shiv wrote:
Neela wrote: Sirji, end of the day, current GoI came into power despite 26/11 ---> that is also part of the puzzle.
People do not actually vote based on 3 day events like 26/11. When you go to the voting booth you are not even thinking of the "Haath" or "Lotus" - but the person whom you think might work. You are voting for a name. If one party gets most of the names right - that party wins. OT

I do not agree with the inference you have made which is quite broad. Since it is OT I will leave it at that.

But what I intended to say was this: every party wants to come into power and the events of 26/11 did not affect the Congress party's prospects - this means that there is no incentive for them / it does not matter to them if TSP is whacked or not - they can still come into power. And since this is a coalition, they will lack the traction necessary too . The greater common good is the last thing in their minds.

What does all this mean: well, I am not sure if there is clear,well-defined, bordered, flow-charted GoI's TSP policy - there seems to be some blob where the general belief is (a) attacking TSP will hurt us economically and (b) there is no (b)* . The rest is merely chai-biskoot. There - that is the grand official GoI's TSP Policy with sections (a) and section (b).

Small print:
* The joker in this is MM "bent-over-backward-so-much-that-his-a$$-has-taken the-place-of-his-face" Singh. At a time when Afghanis would be counting on India to tame this ugly creature called TSP, we seem to have , as usual, lost the plot and offering TSP with incentives even as they wreak havoc on Kabul.
But hey - this fits well with GoI's TSP policy section (b). Proof? TSP is hurting Indians through b@llless operations for 30 years and counting. if it were a issue for the party that was most in power during this time, it would have solved it. Apparently , it is not! .

abhijitm · Post by **abhijitm** » 17 Apr 2012 14:21

How much money they have to help the monstrous economy like India? Recently Karachi stock ex collapsed by around 100 points just because one FII sold a stock worth of 5 mil $. So how much capital pakis have for investment? But irrespective of that I am against paki investing here and taking back any sort of profit back home.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 17 Apr 2012 17:28

the investment teenie meeinie pak economy can't really help India .. For instance in 2010 there were only 8 BMWs sold in the whole pakistan.. There exist more people with the bmw in my residential society in Ahmedabad .

.but Suraj does have a point.. Once you invest money in India , it is incredibly difficult to get out. The only thing tougher than establishing a business in India is to stop the business and get out of India...in the ease of doing business index , India is ranked the toughest country in the world to end a business..

So whatever little change the RAPE has , can be invested in India and you can be rest assured that it ll be more than a pain-da-butt for them to get out.. So it ll further de-stabilize the almost non-existent Pak economy hastening their disintegration..

FIIs from Poaqraoches must however not be permitted...

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 17 Apr 2012 17:38

brihaspati wrote:
shiv wrote:
Unless we are willing to admit that cracks exist, we will not even look for cracks. An assumption that cracks "cannot exist" somewhere is wilful blindness. We need to identify cracks before we can talk of exploitation. This has rarely been discussed on here and very little detail has appeared on BRF.
I have tried to raise the issue of land and land ownership with references for a long time. I specifically mentioned it as one that clubs the mullahcracy together with the army and the feudals on one side against redistribution.

Brihaspati land ownership is definitely an issue. I saw your posts but did not have any ideas then. I recall reading that the LeT/JuD has aligned itself as a sponge to support and suck up landless people who are beholden to feudals. I think there may be some detail there that is usable. Maybe I need to look out for reports of feudals who are being "strong-armed" by the LeT/JuD. If such people exist - they could do with some support. I don't know - the whole idea is too "raw" (pun unintended) in my head. I do not have enough info as things stand about he nature of large landowners and their relations ships with their vassals on the one hand and the JuD on the other hand.