Many dead, including Police SP in Gurdaspur Terror attack

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 11 Aug 2015 18:48

shiv & gagan, If you look at the Kashmiri local news report the LeT has a very big infrastructure in Kashmir valley run by truck drivers as terrorist ferry service. All this was built up over years in a disaffected public. So our anger will demand public retribution in Pakjab but more useful service to India is to rollup these LeT infrastructure within India first.

Hitting Pakjab without cleaning up Kashmir is a wasted thunderbolt.

Brutus Fulmen.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 11 Aug 2015 21:23

WRT truck dirvers,
This is a bit of personal info I am sharing.
When I was in J&K, I was friends with several families who were in the trucking business.
Now there were muslim families too, and they were approached by these overground workers to help them ship their "Goods" for money initially and then threatened to do so.
The truckers refused always, because, well in their words, these guys from pakistan were upto no good.
I guess if one of their trucks got caught, that would be the end of that truck, their business would be in a risky spot, because the whole state's machinery would then start investigating you.

The trucking business works on the basis of reliably delivering someone's goods to their destination. If a trucking company gets a bad name, NO ONE is going to use them in the future. All the hot air about Jihad and Kashmir banega Pakistan is only for the Harried Rats and their followers, ordinary kashmiris don't really buy that crap much.
The educated kashmiris even back in the 90s knew that all this political anarchy in the valley was going to end in a damp squib by the Pakistanis. There would be a lot of fireworks and a lot of people will die, but nothing will come off it in the end.

Now that being said, individual truck drivers will try to take on extra load on their truck on the way, to make some money on the side.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 11 Aug 2015 21:29

ramana wrote:shiv & gagan, If you look at the Kashmiri local news report the LeT has a very big infrastructure in Kashmir valley run by truck drivers as terrorist ferry service. All this was built up over years in a disaffected public. So our anger will demand public retribution in Pakjab but more useful service to India is to rollup these LeT infrastructure within India first.

Hitting Pakjab without cleaning up Kashmir is a wasted thunderbolt.

Brutus Fulmen.

ramana I attended a lecture by a General in Bishop Cotton's school - and he was pointing out that most people do not realize that Kashmir's problems are restricted to some areas of a few districts close to Pakistan. Technically over 80% of the area is free.

Here is a Kashmir district map. Check the names Baramulla, Budgaum, Kupwara, Poonch, Rajauri, Pulwama, Doda

Add this to the fact that General Hasnain in an article last week said that J&K has become so difficult to enter that they are probing Punjab next door. Kashmir will not be sanitized easily without putting teh fera of injury into the Pakistan army's heart.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 11 Aug 2015 21:53

I think a sanitized zone of 5km in POK has to be created by the IA. All noncombatants need to leave that area.

member_23370 · Post by **member_23370** » 11 Aug 2015 21:57

To destroy the tree of terrorism you need to cut the roots. Which means hitting them in pakjab. Hit hafiz suars rally and other LeT & ISI centers.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 11 Aug 2015 22:18

Shiv, Thanks ofr the good map. Puts things in context.

Gagan, Thanks for the goods truckers perspective.
Note the report talks about a specific type of truck : tipper i.e. a dump truck and not a goods transport truck. The report names at least three different tipper truck drivers who were courier the terrorists. So what is the modus operandi of tipper trucks that allows them to be misused?
is it the short haul nature of the work?

With the help of GPS, the group reached Babarishi Gulmarg on June 7. On the same day, a Kashmiri militant of LeT, Ashiq Hussain Bhat alia Obaida of Chursu, Awantipora, received the group in Babarishi area. He called Showkat of Khadarmooh village of Pulwama with his tipper to Tangmarg. On June 9, Showkat left for Khadermooh with the four Pakistani militants. However, on learning by phone that the Kashmir-based LeT chief Qasim’s hideout in Khadermooh had been raided by Army, Showkat at Pampore diverted his tipper to Awantipora and delivered the four militants at Chursu. Naveed disclosed that he and other members of his group stayed at the houses of Javed and Fayaz at Chursu, on Srinagar-Jammu highway, for four days before shifting to Kakpora and Khadarmooh villages on Pampore-Pulwama Road.

After staying in Kakpora for three days, Naveed's group shifted to Let's hideout in Khrew forest area and stayed there for 40 days. He claimed that three fresh recruits joined his group there and many of South Kashmir-based militants visited the hideout during the month of Ramzan.

On July 23, tipper driver Naseer of Wuyan picked up five militants-----Naveed, Dujana, Shahin Gulzar, Showkat Lone and Abu Ukasha---- and carried them from Khrew to Kakpora. He droped Naveed and Dujana at Kakapora and took three more of the group towards Pulwama where they were intercepted by police. However, all the five militants managed to escape.

Naveed disclosed that during his group’s stay at Kakpora, he was in company of the local LeT militant Talib Shah who got killed in an encounter with Army and Police at his village in 24 hours of the Samroli fidayeen attack. He and other militants also met an important contact called 'Mantri' who looked after their planning and movement. 'Mantri', Naveed disclosed, runs a bakery. Another contact called Tanna, who is Dujana's "overground worker", arranged the vehicle of one Riyaz of Khaderpora by which Dujana went all the way to Lalchowk in Srinagar to receive money from a shopkeeper. About a week before the Samroli action, Naveed and Dujana were guided from Kakpora to Khudwani village of Kulgam by Tanna and another local militant Hamza. They stayed at the house of one Riyaz who runs a welding shop near the school at Redwani. It was there that they met with the Kashmir chief of LeT, a Pakistani militant most wanted in South Kashmir. While Tanna and Hanza went back to Pulwama, Qasim assigned the group a high profile fidayeen attack in Jammu region.

After six-day stay in Khudwani, during which they also met Talha, Momin alias Kachru, Muzamil and a civilian contact, Feroz Zargar, Naveed disclosed that he, Noman and Majid left for Jammu in a truck of Showkat alias Setha and conductor Khursheed who separately operates his own truck which met with an accident in Jammu about a month back. Khursheed was injured in that accident. Naveed mentioned registration number of Setha's truck as JK13-2586.

He narrated that on August 4, their truck crossed Lower Munda Toll Post at 2.15 pm. At Ramban, he got down and purchased two bags and some eatables. He said that they put up at Tamatar Morh near Kudh for the night after cooking and eating dinner. Early morning they proceeded towards Udhampur and carried out the attack on the BSF convoy at Samroli after taking Namkeen Chai at a wayside restaurant.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 12 Aug 2015 02:04

we had a group to take care of such issues (in our village), we were out-casted by GoI policies on reservations. many turned out to be poor priests died and their families left on the streets. we setup a fund, and anytime we could contribute and get a receipt for tax purposes. Is that possible by BRF or an entity supported by BRF solely for such purpose?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 12 Aug 2015 02:28

Jhujar wrote:If possible, We need to quietly take one of their Navy ship out , hopefully with few hundreds sailors.

why one? think big!

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 12 Aug 2015 05:41

This map gives an even better idea of how proximity to Pakistan correlates with violence

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 12 Aug 2015 06:06

I have been reading a few Raj era books and it suddenly occurs to me that when British garrisons stayed in Rawalpindi, the route to Srinagar was vai Muree in current day shitistan, and the route south was via Lahore.

This fits in well with another titbit that my own late cousin Suresh used to tell me and what the Indian Army has frequently pointed out after Kargil. The route to Srinagar - or to Kashmir in general slopes gently upwards from the Pakistan side. In the old days people used to go to Lahore first and then go Lahore-Rawalpindi-Murree-Srinagar to get to the Kashmir valley.

Going via Jammu towards Srinagar means Zoji La pass. Jammu and Pathankot are close to the Shitland border and the area between crapistan and Jammu-Pathankot has been the site of great tank battles. People of my generation and older will remember newspaper reports with names like Chhamb, `Sialkot and Shakargarh which would appear every day in the papers during the 1965 and 1971 wars.

So there is a geographical issue that gives Pakistan an advantage in sending across people into J&K. Of course this is now being neutralized by better roads and tunnels - but the geography remains the same.

Hilariously, if you look at Google maps and ask for Amritsar to Lahore distance and road map, you will get a map going through New Delhi, Nepal, Tibet and Xinjiang with a distance of 5000 km and a travel time of 108 hours without traffic. Try it

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 12 Aug 2015 06:17

Going via jammu towards srinagar means Zojila pass? not true.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 12 Aug 2015 07:17

Shiv,

Maharaja Hari Singh tardiness in accession was the historical route to Kashmir was via areas now known as TSP. And he got no assurances from JLNgaru about restoring access via India.
Told to me by an old soldier who is no more but served in all 3 wars.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 12 Aug 2015 07:20

It means Jawahar tunnel.
Now there is a rail tunnel functional.
A much longer, straighter and much lower altitude road tunnel is almost complete across the Pir Panjal into the valley.

Actually the natural path from Poonch to Uri in the valley was through the Haji Pir pass, which Lal Bahadur Shastri-ji returned in Tashkent hoping for land for peace deal with Pakistan.
The result is that going from poonch to srinagar via the Haji pir which was a 4 hour trip by road is now an 18 hour trip by road going from poonch->Jammu->Udhampur->Pir Panjal via Jawahar tunnel->Vale of Kashmir

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 12 Aug 2015 08:01

manjgu wrote:Going via jammu towards srinagar means Zojila pass? not true.

Sorry typo. There is a highway (or something) that is close to the Pakistan border which Pakis have tried to cut off in 65. Is the pass Srinagar-Leh? Not sure of the geography myself.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 12 Aug 2015 08:06

Gagan wrote:
Actually the natural path from Poonch to Uri in the valley was through the Haji Pir pass, which Lal Bahadur Shastri-ji returned in Tashkent hoping for land for peace deal with Pakistan.
The result is that going from poonch to srinagar via the Haji pir which was a 4 hour trip by road is now an 18 hour trip by road going from poonch->Jammu->Udhampur->Pir Panjal via Jawahar tunnel->Vale of Kashmir

That damn Haji Pir pass was occupied by us and returned to shitland both in 1965 and 1971. In 1965 Kargil and the Haji Pir pass were infiltration routes. India occupied them - in fact in 1965 IA did samesame thing as 1999 to occupy Kargil heights

I can't imagine why we have shown so much goodwill. The only explanation is that Indian leaders have been deliberately blind to the thinking in Pakistan and have made no move to set up think tanks and advisory boards to study other nations and the world. The insularity and blindness of Indians of AD 600 still continues.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 12 Aug 2015 08:37

could be economic blackmail/carrots by the 3.5 fathers too..."just restore the pre-war boundary". our economy was not exactly great in those days and we needed foreign aid and tech in all sectors back then.

in any future conflict, territory should be retained or exchanged for other areas only...like the chicken neck can be made fatter.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 12 Aug 2015 09:00

FBI offers to crack GPS devices obtained from terrorists in Gurdaspur & Udhampur - Aman Sharma, Economic Times

The US Federal Bureau of Investigation has offered to crack the global positioning system (GPS) devices seized from the terrorists in Udhampur and Gurdaspur, NIA chief Sharad Kumar told ET. Details from the GPS may officially confirm Pakistan's role in both attacks.

"Some of the data has been erased from the GPS devices found on the dead terrorists in Gurdaspur. GPS devices used by Mohammad Naveed to sneak into India have also been found after the Udhampur attack. FBI has offered us expert help to crack the GPS devices," Kumar said.

Scientific evidence from FBI on GPS coordinates could help India conclusively prove that in both the incidents, terrorists had come from Pakistan, sources in the government said. NIA has been asked to compile a dossier on the Udhampur strike for the NSA-level talks with Pakistan expected later this month.

NIA will also be sending a letter rogatory through the court to Pakistan asking for confirmation of the address and family details of the captured terrorists in Udhampur, Mohammad Naveed.

Naveed could be flown to Delhi in a special aircraft and subjected to lie-detector tests as he has been constantly changing his statements and citing four different routes which he along with three other accomplices took to infiltrate into India

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 12 Aug 2015 16:27

I hope they decode the devices not "Crack" them as they've done before

Also hope they can track down who bought those GPS sets. Someone's bought them in bulk

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 12 Aug 2015 18:17

i just came back from J&K.... we hired a tavera and the driver swtiched on the vehilce and went out for some work... the CD started playing .. it was some sermon in hindi of the most virluent kind... preaching jihad.. lot of bull crap... musalman ye musalman wo... bollywood picture haram hai... heroine haram hai... musalman ka imaan kharab karne ke liye hai.. bla bla ... the driver came back and sheepishly switched off the CD.. and we used to think of the driver as a very mild chap... i heard the same sermon on mobile phone in a shikara which was passing by... there is a strong propoganda war being run to imbible the kashmiris with jehadi bullcrap...

shaun · Post by **shaun** » 12 Aug 2015 19:05

nothing surprising ....got a keshmere idiot in fb profile , a college mate. He too posts and make BS comments though he stays in a southern state..well felt like deleting him from my profile...but than thought , "leeme see, how far he can go "!!.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 12 Aug 2015 19:48

FBI will destroy the evidence and will fail to return the captured GPS. protecting their munna

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 13 Aug 2015 01:46

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMBYzYegj5M

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 13 Aug 2015 02:14

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXaXrsn1sas

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 13 Aug 2015 04:37

shiv wrote:I can't imagine why we have shown so much goodwill. The only explanation is that Indian leaders have been deliberately blind to the thinking in Pakistan and have made no move to set up think tanks and advisory boards to study other nations and the world. The insularity and blindness of Indians of AD 600 still continues.

I just watched the video posted by Gagan "Kasab Part 2". I felt that but for the tweed blazer wearing RAPE General, Dr. Huma and the third guest Mr. Imtiaz came across as genuinely wanting "aman". Yet Dr. Huma is in denial mode. General of course was quite transparent in his dhamkis to India. I think some of these guys and some of their near and dear need to be hurt in one way or the other for them to come to their senses and fly the coop.

disha · Post by **disha** » 13 Aug 2015 04:55

shiv wrote: I can't imagine why we have shown so much goodwill. The only explanation is that Indian leaders have been deliberately blind to the thinking in Pakistan and have made no move to set up think tanks and advisory boards to study other nations and the world. The insularity and blindness of Indians of AD 600 still continues.

Not necessarily. 1960s - precisely 1965 - was prior to "Green Revolution" and I believe that India became dumping ground for an over harvest of American wheat.

The fact is the concept of "minimum support price" was introduced by an American and the GOI of that day had to follow. Americans insisted that India is going to face a horrible famine and lot of wheat needs to be 'exported' to India and was exported.

I am not so sure about the american story anymore now - but at least in 1965 - from what I heard from my grand parents was that a single morsel was not allowed to go to waste and all adults over the age of 16 were supposed to eat only once a day. To conserve food. So yes there was a very genuine fear of famine.

Given this, Indian strings could have been easily pulled.

1971 was another story. India did not had the vision of breaking apart bakistan then. It was content to break the B'Desh away and then fight to live another day. Given the American debacle in 1971., I am of the opinion now that Americans purposely chose to standby with closed eyes (and ears) so that baki can acquire nukes. If not approvingly giving them one.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Aug 2015 05:59

disha wrote:
shiv wrote: I can't imagine why we have shown so much goodwill. The only explanation is that Indian leaders have been deliberately blind to the thinking in Pakistan and have made no move to set up think tanks and advisory boards to study other nations and the world. The insularity and blindness of Indians of AD 600 still continues.
Not necessarily. 1960s - precisely 1965 - was prior to "Green Revolution" and I believe that India became dumping ground for an over harvest of American wheat.

The fact is the concept of "minimum support price" was introduced by an American and the GOI of that day had to follow. Americans insisted that India is going to face a horrible famine and lot of wheat needs to be 'exported' to India and was exported.

I am not so sure about the american story anymore now - but at least in 1965 - from what I heard from my grand parents was that a single morsel was not allowed to go to waste and all adults over the age of 16 were supposed to eat only once a day. To conserve food. So yes there was a very genuine fear of famine.

Given this, Indian strings could have been easily pulled.

1971 was another story. India did not had the vision of breaking apart bakistan then. It was content to break the B'Desh away and then fight to live another day. Given the American debacle in 1971., I am of the opinion now that Americans purposely chose to standby with closed eyes (and ears) so that baki can acquire nukes. If not approvingly giving them one.

The wheat export was under US PL 480. I cannot confirm or deny the "one meal a day". I was old enough to remember 1965 and I was getting 3 meals a day but I do recall 1965 and 66 as among the worst years in India. I am sure there were a lot of starving people in India - I may have been one of the lucky ones

I have been having (concurrently with this discussion) an argument with a Paki or a Paki-like person on DFI who claimed that Pakistan's economy in the 1960s was "second only to Japan in Asia". This is actually bullshit but Pakis did call themselves the original Asian tigers back then. 33% of their economy was US aid (this fact can be Googled). Nehru had died in '64 and Shastri was an unknown entity.

America did help Pakis and America may well have put pressure on India. But the point I am getting at is that there are international rules and nations do not necessarily play by those rules. Some nations make new rules and impose them. The US was making up its own rules in supporting Pakistan, opposing communism and giving away free wheat. Pakistan in1965 was making up its own rules - sending infiltrators/terrorists into India and readying to attack India. China made up its own rules in 1962 and later in giving Pakis nukes. None of these nations have "played by international rules" and none of them have faced any serious consequences for not following "international laws". That is because there is no real international policeman to impose those rules. It's the wild west.

Why does it appear to me that only India looks like the idiot good boy - the wimp that follows rules made by others. We send out dossiers, white papers, letters rogatory and red corner notices and announce these acts like Little Jack Horner pulling out a plum and saying "Look what a good boy am I". It looks like Indians are naive and think that "International order is made by someone else and we need to follow what someone else says". International laws are made by the big boys who behave like big boys. Following those laws is done by the little pipsqueaks. India behaves like the little pipsqueak. We punch far faar below our weight. We are a strong nation who think we will be punished by teacher if we misbehave in the international class

habal · Post by **habal** » 13 Aug 2015 08:04

Why does it appear to me that only India looks like the idiot good boy - the wimp that follows rules made by others. We send out dossiers, white papers, letters rogatory and red corner notices and announce these acts like Little Jack Horner pulling out a plum and saying "Look what a good boy am I". It looks like Indians are naive and think that "International order is made by someone else and we need to follow what someone else says". International laws are made by the big boys who behave like big boys. Following those laws is done by the little pipsqueaks. India behaves like the little pipsqueak. We punch far faar below our weight. We are a strong nation who think we will be punished by teacher if we misbehave in the international class

Indian foreign policy is run by bureaucrats, career bureaucrats especially the nitty gritty of it. Bureaucrats by nature do not take great risks and Indian politicians usually do not want to be bothered with this messy work. Bureaucrats are usually top students who take tests and pass exams that are set by others, all their lives they have to ace games the rules of which are set by someone else and top the game that has been established elsewhere. They do not make any rules. They cannot take risks or anger western govts because they have to park their son or daughter over there or have extended family in west like most third world countries have. Carry over this behaviour into diplomacy and we have what we have today. This could explain the punching below weight bit, esp when past politicians had hands off approach to foreign policy. A Natwar Singh and a MSA tried to be different but they were booted out, so everything came back to square one.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Aug 2015 08:20

habal wrote: Bureaucrats are usually top students who take tests and pass exams that are set by others, all their lives they have to ace games the rules of which are set by someone else and top the game that has been established elsewhere. They do not make any rules. They cannot take risks or anger western govts because they have to park their son or daughter over there or have extended family in west like most third world countries have. Carry over this behaviour into diplomacy and we have what we have today.

Absolutely. Part of the problem is that the elected politicians themselves know very little and depend on bureaucrats who will advise them just enough to conform to what you have stated.

The other point I want to make is that in the absence of an active study of Pakistan (as most of us have done) and in the absence of a specific government think tank to analyse and advise about Pakistan (which the government has not done) every elected representative is like the average aam aadmi who will watch Bajrangi Bhaijaan, enjoy it and imagine that Pakistanis will cooperate if given enough rope

So we suffer from the millstone of unimaginative plodder diplomats who are good at passing exams and ignorant politicians slung around our collective national neck. Ultimately we have to move out of the paradigm of getting hit by Pakis and sending white papers, dossiers and letters rogatory while blowing hot and cold on talks.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Aug 2015 08:42

shiv, The Civil services are the think tank. They don't allow anyone else to get to think. Krishna Menon setup over 27 Area Studies centers all over India to allow this think tank culture. Not one of them had a single project given by MEA. And now many are shut down by UGC.

Individually the IAS/IFS are very nice people but have a collective bias. They cant think and wont let others think for them.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 13 Aug 2015 09:27

shiv wrote:
habal wrote: Bureaucrats are usually top students who take tests and pass exams that are set by others, all their lives they have to ace games the rules of which are set by someone else and top the game that has been established elsewhere. They do not make any rules. They cannot take risks or anger western govts because they have to park their son or daughter over there or have extended family in west like most third world countries have. Carry over this behaviour into diplomacy and we have what we have today.
Absolutely. Part of the problem is that the elected politicians themselves know very little and depend on bureaucrats who will advise them just enough to conform to what you have stated.

The other point I want to make is that in the absence of an active study of Pakistan (as most of us have done) and in the absence of a specific government think tank to analyse and advise about Pakistan (which the government has not done) every elected representative is like the average aam aadmi who will watch Bajrangi Bhaijaan, enjoy it and imagine that Pakistanis will cooperate if given enough rope

So we suffer from the millstone of unimaginative plodder diplomats who are good at passing exams and ignorant politicians slung around our collective national neck. Ultimately we have to move out of the paradigm of getting hit by Pakis and sending white papers, dossiers and letters rogatory while blowing hot and cold on talks.

This is exactly why expensive presents, greasy 5 star hospitality and abundant mehman nawazi pays such rich and disproportionate dividends. It all appeals to the ego and reeks of selling the country down the river for a few shiny baubles.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 13 Aug 2015 17:22

These jihadi terrorists take some drugs during their ops don't they?
Is there any report that gives details?

AjayKK · Post by **AjayKK** » 13 Aug 2015 17:39

Gagan wrote:These jihadi terrorists take some drugs during their ops don't they?
Is there any report that gives details?

One report on 26/11:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... sault.html

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 13 Aug 2015 17:56

Spinster wrote a very long email about the conditions in India during the 60s. Will post during the weekend as I don't have access.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 13 Aug 2015 17:58

Cocaine and LSD
They could also be on stuff like Amphetamine or PCP
They appear to be crazed, possibly on something like PCP

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 14 Aug 2015 06:02

per ramana's request

spinster spinning from email wrote:The credibility of BRF will go down if un substantiated information is posted as gospel truth as is of late happening and that too very often. It will be field day for posters like TSJ/ Ralphy ( alias)

Consider the thread "Many dead i including SP in Gurdaspur ... " Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

It is a fact that after 1962 debacle the GOI was near bankrupt ( to start with in 1947 very little was in treasury thanks to HMG loot and WWII financings)

In 1964 when JLN died India was food deficit that is staple food like wheat / rice edible oil sugar and pulses just to name.

We were entirely rain fed monsoon dependent agriculture and when there was bumper crops in parts of the country there was no long term storage or logistics to move and distribute the grain.

Under PL 480 India was given wheat by U.S. In subsidized prices along with deferred payments as well.
Under the commonwealth aid program Canada UK Australia New Zealand also sent in wheat milk powder oil at nominal prices. the Scandinavian countries like Netherlands Denmark also contributed dry milk powder in very large quantities.

We were very vulnerable to say the least and depended on good will of many western countries for survival.
While food which was surplus in western countries was easy to flow and donate and as a captive market India was sink hole . They wanted market and money we needed food to stay on feet and be an independent country. irony of sorts.

The technology for industrial out put was selectively given to us from western countries.
Here are some examples
indioAmerican Joint text books program ( fantastic prices General Chemistry by Linus Pauling Rs 5, Physics by Zeemqnsky Rs 10.00 mind you dollar at that time was INR 1.65 paise and Pound sterling nearly INR 2.00 )
Even that was big deal of money.

Nearly 8 or 9 Agricultural universities were started by USAID program two were in AP one in Rajendra Nagar near Hyderabad one in Ongoe in costal AP there were two set up Punjab as well. these colleges had exactly the same Yellow school Bus that you see in U.S. today same front enterence near the driver seated lefthand side .

The Indian Rice research institute along with International rice research institute were established by U.S. aid

Dr. Normal Borlaugh was the first to develop wheat hybrid strain at that time which benefited us in India very much which was rust disease resistant.

Apsara reactor was under Colombo plan (IIRC). There were many good projects even sounding rockets from Thumba were of US origin.

Many such good things happened, but also
There was rationing of wheat, sugar, Chena dal oil . ( my extended family were all in armed forces IAF IA IN and MES)

My sister who worked in CSDI used to be flooded with requests for Goaxo/ Amul/ Horlics tins as there was severe shortage and black market for them.
That's when LBS started the campaign Jai Jawan Jai Kisan and fasting on Mondays was asked of the citizens and every body complied with it ( fore go one meal on Monday night) watch Upkar movie ( staring Manoj Kumar and Asha Parekh to get a feel of times of those days)

He died and as soon as Ig took over there was severe drought in Bihar 1967 and that's when our delicate financial back broke and INR was devalued and the pre eminence of INR in West Asia came to an end.
There wer Gold bonds, National defense fund bonds you name it we had every bond...all kinds of import restrictions started to conserve Foreign exchange...
Save a Bihari was global slogan to raise funds to cope with drought, the films division used show foreign aid agencies serving morsel to malnutrioned kids , animals dying for want of water...
The slowly things started turning around lot of the. Multipurpose hydro projects started earlier ( Bakra Nangal, Nagarjuna sagar etc) helped us bring more under cultivation. Along with Hybrid rice like Tiechung Nite from Taiwan ( rice verity maturation of 90 to 100 days instead of native variety like Akkulu which were 80 days crop) Hybrid wheat.
New tractor plants in coloration with international Tractors , Massey Furgueson , Japanese power tillers like Kunoto / Krishi made in Hyderbad ) for mechanized farms, of course Zetor tractor plant form Czechoslovakia (then, now Czech and Slovakia) and also Russiantractors imported under Rupeee Rouble pact with USSR
Amul milk revolution by Dr. Kurien Fertilizer factories in private sector by U.S. Collaboration, in public sector USSR factories , programmers for farmer education on AIR of course family planing

All this contributed to a turn around... But the sad thing is even today we have not achieved 20% of what nation can do.
The loot continues all the more because we are no longer poo folks ( we never were but as always poorly managed and governed with no nationalism)

We do owe some gratitude for timely help by east and west ( nations) even the world s largest check was handed over to Mr. subramniam our finance minister ( then) by U.S. Ambassador Chester Bowles IIRC. it was a maaf of our debt under PL480.
We have wealth now, it's just being a massed by few and stowed away to far far lands with no productive use.

A million mafia ruling Billion people

Public money is like holy water everybody helps himself to it

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 14 Aug 2015 09:21

Very heart rendering...
Can this be archived as a br monitor article?
This is the historical background that our leadership operate under, which the current generation loses sight of.
What the british did to India can not be forgotten.

arshyam · Post by **arshyam** » 14 Aug 2015 09:34

+1000

Can't even imagine these things, compared to that, us later generations grew up in privilege.

gakakkad · Post by **gakakkad** » 14 Aug 2015 12:50

why does not he resume posting?

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 15 Aug 2015 03:59

Not to mention that the Red color wheat under PL480 was of such low quality that it was not fit for human consumption.Early morning long lines were common with rumor of Wheat, Pulse, Ghee delivered at PDS shops.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 15 Aug 2015 04:04

And a weed was also introduced later known as Congress weed.

Jhujar was 1967 an El Nino year?