Understanding US thread-III

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 15:26

interview with nasscomm chief in ET today:

Does it apply only to fresh visas or does this also apply to people who are already with an H-1B visa in the US?

I have no sense on that but if somebody is on H-1 and getting $75,000 salary, will you be forced to change the salary upwards? I do not know. But I am assuming that in a level playing field, one would do that. I mean you would hardly send a fresh person on $130,000 salary and keep the existing person on less. So overall there will be a cost pressure on th ..

Read more at:
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/art ... aign=cppst

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 15:27

^^ in the above scenario a lot of H1 could get laid off. if level playing field is demanded with retroactive effect to the 350k of so people in various H1
it might find political support to clear space for locals to find jobs in their stead.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 31 Jan 2017 15:48

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/nri ... 887602.cms

good details , unfortunately now ET is copyright protected.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 31 Jan 2017 15:58

hanumadu wrote:
Suraj wrote:It's not such a bad situation really. Lofgren's bill is probably the best option of the lot. Better than say, Darrell Issa's. The existing $60K wage floor, unindexed for inflation for almost THIRTY years, is an absurd distortion whose responsibility lies entirely upon successive GOTUSes.My guess is that the wage base will be indexed to region, with bay area etc getting the uppermost base and midwest getting lower bases.
Not even 20 years sir. The 60k was set in 1998.

Oh sorry. That's still a very long period of time. Even 5-10 is stretching it as far as inflation is concerned.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 31 Jan 2017 16:04

IndraD wrote:At end of day gut level racism perhaps does not differentiate between Indian & a Pakistani.

we are all "pakis"

hanumadu · Post by **hanumadu** » 31 Jan 2017 16:05

The High-Skilled Integrity and Fairness Act of 2017 introduced by California Congressman Zoe Lofgren prioritises market based allocation of visas to those companies willing to pay 200 per cent of a wage calculated by survey, eliminates the category of lowest pay, and raises the salary level at which H-1B dependent employer are exempt from non displacement and recruitment attestation requirements to greater than USD 130,000.

I think 130k is not the absolute minimum that all h1bs should be payed. You can pay lower if you provide non displacement and recruitment attestation, what ever that is.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 16:09

The new immigration chief will be looking to use his hooks on all violators and send in agents black vans and dawgs to drag off hapless workers in cuffs like they periodically do to poor latinos in farms and food factories

I would suggest any h1 l1 f1 gc uscitizen type to keep a attested copy of papers in the car at all times....

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 31 Jan 2017 16:12

in keeping with the political theatre, there will be a lot of huff and puff for the cameras and then hopefully things will settle down when sensible normal americans start to deal with the real situation on the ground. in the meantime expect chaos and the strong arm of the law... and very little sympathy for your heathen hindu musharrafs

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 31 Jan 2017 16:27

Informal news - not in newspapers - Indian lady held up in immigration, asked for half-an-hour to prove she's not a Muslim.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 16:34

another threat to public safety and secure borders rounded up

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 31 Jan 2017 16:42

Details of Lofgren Bill (congress.gov is so swamped with new bills that they have not posted the text of the bill or a summary of the bill - HR 670)
https://www.americanbazaaronline.com/20 ... ves422045/

Highlights of the High-Skilled Integrity and Fairness Act 0f 2017:

* Increases prevailing wage requirements to protect U.S. workers by replacing the current 4-level wage calculation with a new, more balanced, geographically based 3-level formula which eliminates the lowest wage level and puts upward pressure on the wages in the remaining levels.

Level 1 = mean of bottom 2/3 of wages surveyed
Level 2 = mean of all wages surveyed
Level 3 = mean of top 2/3 of wages surveyed
Prioritizes market-based allocation of H-1B visas as follows:

1) Employers paying 200% of level 3 prevailing wage, then 150% of level 3

2) Employers paying 200% of level 2 prevailing wage, then 150% of level 2

3) Employers paying 200% of level 1 prevailing wage, them 150% of level 1

* Removes the ‘per country’ cap for employment based immigrant visas so that all workers are treated more fairly and to move to a system where employers hire the most skilled workers without regard to national origin.

* Raises the salary level at which H-1B dependent employer are exempt from attestation requirements to a new required wage level of 35 percentile points above the median national annual wage for Computer and Mathematical Occupations published by the Department of Labor Occupational Employment Statistics (roughly $132,000), which would be adjusted in the future without the need for new legislation, and eliminates the Master’s Degree exemption for dependent employers.

* Sets aside 20% of the annually allocated H-1B visas for small and start-up employers (50 or fewer employers) to ensure small businesses have an opportunity to compete for high-skilled workers, while still protecting against outsourcing.

* Removes visa hurdles for students and other temporary visa holders by building a bridge from F-1 student status to Lawful Permanent Residence.

* Removes paperwork burdens by streamlining H-1B filing requirements and reducing administrative costs.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 31 Jan 2017 16:50

Singha wrote:well the first shot of neptune spear has been fired. this is not a DT exec order but the pending bill that will be taken up by congress.

-----
Shares of India's top IT companies crashed today after a legislation was introduced in the US House of Representatives which calls for doubling the minimum salary of H-1B visa holders to $130,000. In a brutal one hour, the top four - TCS, Infosys, Wipro and HCL Technologies - saw nearly Rs 48,000 crore wiped out from their market value. The new US bill is designed to make it difficult for companies to use the work-visa programme to replace American employees with foreign workers, including those from India.

Shares of mid-sized IT companies also came under heavy selling pressure - Take Solutions, Mastek, Mind Tree, Mphasis, KPIT, NIIT Technologies, Hexaware and Geometric fell up to 5 per cent. The IT sub-index was the top sectoral loser on the Bombay Stock Exchange, falling 4 per cent.

The High-Skilled Integrity and Fairness Act of 2017 introduced by California Congressman Zoe Lofgren today prioritises market-based allocation of visas to those companies willing to pay 200 per cent of a wage calculated by survey. It also eliminates the category of lowest pay, and raises the salary level at which H-1B dependent employers are exempt from non-displacement and recruitment attestation requirements to more than $130,000.

Just FYI, the Zoe Lofgren bill was introduced January 24th and referred to the House Committee on the Judiciary on the same day. (HR 670). I suppose news about its contents did not leak out until a week later?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 16:52

I think it was "tabled" yesterday given the indian market reaction today.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 16:55

>> Removes the ‘per country’ cap for employment based immigrant visas

does this refer to h1 visas or GC ? I am not aware that h1 ever had any per country cap. if its GC thats good news for indics and sinics, the usual whipping boys.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 31 Jan 2017 16:58

News of Zoe Lofgren's bill was available Jan 25:
http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/25/technol ... e-lofgren/

She also seeks to change how permanent visas are allocated. Currently, there is a limit to how many visas can be awarded to people from each country. Lofgren's bill would eliminate that. She believes that would take some of the pressure off the H-1B program.

There's a huge backlog for visas from Indian and Chinese nationals due to country quotas. As a result, many stay on H-1Bs while they wait. Because H-1Bs are tied to employers, it is difficult for these workers to change jobs.

Vikram Desai, vice president of nonprofit Immigration Voice, estimates there are 1.5 million of those workers in the U.S. He says Lofgren's bill would help them get visas sooner, giving them more job mobility.

komal · Post by **komal** » 31 Jan 2017 17:25

A_Gupta wrote:Informal news - not in newspapers - Indian lady held up in immigration, asked for half-an-hour to prove she's not a Muslim.

I can see how a man can do that -- not sure how a woman does.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 31 Jan 2017 17:27

I wouldn't be surprised if left libs start pushing for burqa as new fashion statement - just to spite or protest against Trump's Muslim ban.

They are seriously THAT stupid !!

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 31 Jan 2017 17:38

well... as I said political theatre... its not actually a muslim ban and its not for ever... but its enough to get everyone all chuddie-twisted - and there is a LOT of political mileage in just making this happen

so agent orange will declare victory in a few weeks and tell billy redneck that he has been made safe and he will make larry liberal happy by saying that he is letting in refugees and everything will be back to normal...

meanwhile... back at the H1 visa queue...

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 31 Jan 2017 18:20

he seemed to hint at the idea of a white nationalist identity with the phrase "civic society."

OK, I hiyar u lyawd & cliyar. I guess that term means the same as "culturally appropriate".
But the cartoon posted above is too

OTOH... the far worse racists etc are the slimy snakes who know what words to use to appear o-so-liberal. Been there, seen that way too much. DT&Co are comparatively honest. An honest racist is marginally better than a slimy snake. Archie Bunker and Fred Sanford, for instance.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 31 Jan 2017 18:21

Trump working to stop H1B fraud that many companies do. Good news for US citizens.

Trump’s Next Immigration Move to Hit Closer to Home for Tech
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... e-for-tech

If implemented, the reforms could shift the way American companies like Microsoft Corp., Amazon.com Inc. and Apple Inc. recruit talent and force wholesale changes at Indian companies such as Infosys Ltd. and Wipro Ltd. Businesses would have to try to hire American first and if they recruit foreign workers, priority would be given to the most highly paid.

“Our country’s immigration policies should be designed and implemented to serve, first and foremost, the U.S. national interest,” the draft proposal reads, according to a copy reviewed by Bloomberg. “Visa programs for foreign workers … should be administered in a manner that protects the civil rights of American workers and current lawful residents, and that prioritizes the protection of American workers -- our forgotten working people -- and the jobs they hold.”

The foreign work visas were originally established to help U.S. companies recruit from abroad when they couldn’t find qualified local workers. In many cases, the companies are hiring for highly technical positions in the fields of science, technology, engineering and math, or STEM. But in recent years, there have been allegations the programs have been abused to bring in cheaper workers from overseas to fill jobs that otherwise may go to Americans. The top recipients of the H-1B visas are outsourcers, primarily from India, who run the technology departments of large corporations with largely imported staff.

komal · Post by **komal** » 31 Jan 2017 18:24

KJo wrote:Trump working to stop H1B fraud that many companies do. Good news for US citizens.

Trump’s Next Immigration Move to Hit Closer to Home for Tech
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... e-for-tech

As if all "U. S. citizens" had the same economic interests!

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 31 Jan 2017 18:29

komal wrote:
KJo wrote:Trump working to stop H1B fraud that many companies do. Good news for US citizens.

Trump’s Next Immigration Move to Hit Closer to Home for Tech
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... e-for-tech

As if all "U. S. citizens" had the same economic interests!

Well, this time it looks highly likely that something will happen.
I have heard for years from people living in desh that Indian IT was not dependent on US and how US work was only 2% of total work in India. One friend of mine even laughed in 2008 when the US economy tanked. This will put all this to a test.

Good or bad, things will change.

India’s technology companies, led by Tata Consultancy Services Ltd , Infosys and Wipro, have argued they are helping corporations become more competitive by handling their technology operations with specialized staff. They also contend the visa programs allow them to keep jobs in the U.S . and that if they have to pay more for staff, they will handle more of the work remotely from less expensive markets like India.

“Inspections and investigations in the past have shown no cases of wrongdoing by Indian IT services companies, which have always been fully compliant with the law,” said R Chandrashekhar, president of Nasscom, the trade group for India’s information technology sector. “The industry is open to any kind of checks in the system, but they should not cause any hindrance to the smooth operation of companies.”

Wipro and TCS declined to comment for this story.

musharraf-browning has begun.

IndraD · Post by **IndraD** » 31 Jan 2017 18:34

The only female Yazidi MP in Iraq’s parliament, who mobilised the world against Islamic State’s assault on her people, is unable to travel to the US to accept a human rights awards under Donald Trump’s visa ban.

Vian Dakhil was set to receive the Lantos Human Rights Prize at the US Capitol in Washington DC on Feb. 8 for her “courageous defence” of the Yazidi people as they faced mass genocide two years ago at the hands of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (Isil).

However, as a carrier of an Iraqi passport she is unlikely to be allowed to enter the country next week despite holding a US visa

komal · Post by **komal** » 31 Jan 2017 18:40

IndraD wrote:The only female Yazidi MP in Iraq’s parliament, who mobilised the world against Islamic State’s assault on her people, is unable to travel to the US to accept a human rights awards under Donald Trump’s visa ban.

Vian Dakhil was set to receive the Lantos Human Rights Prize at the US Capitol in Washington DC on Feb. 8 for her “courageous defence” of the Yazidi people as they faced mass genocide two years ago at the hands of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (Isil).

However, as a carrier of an Iraqi passport she is unlikely to be allowed to enter the country next week despite holding a US visa

Too bad she is a Shia. If she were Sunni, getting a passport from KSA or Pakistan would not have been a problem and DT would have welcomed her with open arms (no pun intended).

komal · Post by **komal** » 31 Jan 2017 18:41

KJo wrote:
komal wrote:

As if all "U. S. citizens" had the same economic interests!
Well, this time it looks highly likely that something will happen.

Nothing will happen. U. S. IT jobs are not coming back (and neither are coal mining jobs or manufacturing jobs). The economy of Jersey City will get hit. And that is about it.

darshan · Post by **darshan** » 31 Jan 2017 19:06

Hit on H1 visas would be useless without the strike on US universities that rip off students with their tuition earning curriculum and do not offer two year education options that will train and allow many to pick up any void left by H1 visa restrictions.

ShyamSP · Post by **ShyamSP** » 31 Jan 2017 19:16

darshan wrote:Hit on H1 visas would be useless without the strike on US universities that rip off students with their tuition earning curriculum and do not offer two year education options that will train and allow many to pick up any void left by H1 visa restrictions.

US university economy collapsed. Democrat House rep stabbed on the back of Telugu pride.

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 31 Jan 2017 19:25

komal wrote:
IndraD wrote:The only female Yazidi MP in Iraq’s parliament, who mobilised the world against Islamic State’s assault on her people, is unable to travel to the US to accept a human rights awards under Donald Trump’s visa ban.

Vian Dakhil was set to receive the Lantos Human Rights Prize at the US Capitol in Washington DC on Feb. 8 for her “courageous defence” of the Yazidi people as they faced mass genocide two years ago at the hands of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (Isil).

However, as a carrier of an Iraqi passport she is unlikely to be allowed to enter the country next week despite holding a US visa
Too bad she is a Shia. If she were Sunni, getting a passport from KSA or Pakistan would not have been a problem and DT would have welcomed her with open arms (no pun intended).

Yazidi are not Muslims. Why keep repeating the same

ad nauseum, everyone heard you the first time.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 31 Jan 2017 19:31

http://www.timesnow.tv/india/article/tw ... cies/55023

- 2 j&k people denied visa citing 'current policy'...

- makes sense when looked along with Arun's post about a woman asked to prove not a Muslim, despite being not in the list of countries.

Is this unannounced unofficial policy?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 19:31

actually with enterprise IT slowly migrating most of the worldload into the public cloud , with SMEs sometimes owning no IT infra at all, I guess the future is remote IT depts managing these virtual machines from anywhere and fielding calls and tickets over the web and ip phones - which anyways they do, the days of calling a IT admin to fix something physically at ones desk (virus infected muh desktop) are long over.

anything involving coding will obviously be tougher with the team entirely remote, perhaps massans will have to travel to bengaluru kerala to stay for months in chalu service apts teaching the wogs what to do. tsk tsk - too bad the corporate cafetaria will onlee have napalm grade bisibele bath which will keep tender tummy of massan always on boil well throw in some mutton vindaloo as well - napalm grade ofcourse

its the smaller outsourcers who have no real presence and delivery capability in india (bodyshoppers) who are probably buttered toast

I heard krakow in poland is also doing well in this line of work. and ukraine was looking up before they put their hand into the donetsk beehive.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 31 Jan 2017 19:39

IndraD wrote:The only female Yazidi MP in Iraq’s parliament, who mobilised the world against Islamic State’s assault on her people, is unable to travel to the US to accept a human rights awards under Donald Trump’s visa ban.

Vian Dakhil was set to receive the Lantos Human Rights Prize at the US Capitol in Washington DC on Feb. 8 for her “courageous defence” of the Yazidi people as they faced mass genocide two years ago at the hands of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (Isil).

However, as a carrier of an Iraqi passport she is unlikely to be allowed to enter the country next week despite holding a US visa

aren't certain categories like politicians, for instance, exempted from this ban.??

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 31 Jan 2017 19:40

The Truth About Trump's 'Muslim Ban'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNu4xU9qOEM

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 31 Jan 2017 19:42

Question - how does this affect diplomatic passports of those countries?

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 31 Jan 2017 20:27

komal wrote:
KJo wrote:
Well, this time it looks highly likely that something will happen.

Nothing will happen. U. S. IT jobs are not coming back (and neither are coal mining jobs or manufacturing jobs). The economy of Jersey City will get hit. And that is about it.

Really? Then why is the TCS CEO

ing so much?
If Trump does what he says and he looks likely to do, the days of easy jobs and easy promotions and easy bonuses for foreign nationals on the backs of US citizens is over.

It's not a race or religion thing, it is just fair. When US citizens pay taxes here, they can expect that their country provide a fair environment to compete for jobs. How can a US citizen compete with people who can take $40k and live a decent life with wife and kids? No wonder US citizens over the last 15 years have moved away from tech jobs and this has given rise to the lie "There is a shortage of tech workers in US!".

I am told that H1B income limit has been changed to $130k. So a company needs to pay $130k in order to hire someone as H1B, no longer the $60k coolie wages as earlier.
Ab aayega mazaa.

A coworker who used to work at United just told me that they terminated a whole bunch of TCS people.

There will be a lot of changes in the community and housing prices may fall. This is no different from the surgery that Modi is doing in India with black money. It will cause housing to fall there also but it was propped up by false money anyway.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 20:30

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/26/worl ... icle-click

International students typically pay more than domestic students, and many, particularly from China, come from affluent families eager to establish a toehold in North America. The money these students bring helps subsidize education for domestic students, but can also distort local economies.

About half of Canada’s inbound students come from China and the government wants even more. Former Immigration Minister John McCallum, recently named ambassador to China, met with Chinese officials in August, hoping to double or even triple the number of Canadian visa application centers in mainland China from the four the country has now, not including Hong Kong.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 31 Jan 2017 20:30

ShyamSP wrote:
darshan wrote:Hit on H1 visas would be useless without the strike on US universities that rip off students with their tuition earning curriculum and do not offer two year education options that will train and allow many to pick up any void left by H1 visa restrictions.
US university economy collapsed. Democrat House rep stabbed on the back of Telugu pride.

I think the University economy will adjust too. It is a rip off, I agree. But it's just a cog in the corrupt system. When the number of international citizens reduce, the prices have to go down and the super salaries will have to go.

US citizens (mainly goras) are to blame too. Today's kids hate math and science unlike in the past. They want to go for something easy like "eastern religion".

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 20:34

I am told that H1B income limit has been changed to $130k. So a company needs to pay $130k in order to hire someone as H1B, no longer the $60k coolie wages as earlier.
Ab aayega mazaa.

^^ I believe a_gupta has posted some of the contents of the draft bill a few posts ago. 130k is if you want to hire with no questions asked. their are lower pay tiers where the employer has to show some effort...down to whatever will be the inflation adjusted new bar >60k for sure but perhaps well south of 100 for most of the US, barring a few high cost pockets like boston/bay area/seattle.
it is just one of the bills in congress. DT may also have pass some of his own edicts that differ on the details.

anyway the wide scale abuse of the L1 system also needs to be stopped. the L1 people are equally exploited by low wages and unlike the H1 they cannot even change employer and cannot apply for GC if they want. L1 was for executives, it became just a defacto H1 with no quota.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Jan 2017 20:36

for certain communities where I heard h1b status commanded prestige and a fat unearned dowry, its a disaster and H&D loss of epic proportions if DT follows through.

saip · Post by **saip** » 31 Jan 2017 20:38

Singha wrote:^ Komal wow - didnt know about the old days. folks like you should share more such hidden tales. in the media the 50s and 60s are always projected as an era of plenty, unlimited budgets, big cars, neat suburban houses, moon shot projects ... a golden era of amrika .

My sister an BiL were forced to spend a night in their car because no motel would give them a room even with 'vacancy' signs lit. This happened early 60's in Texas. But people who came after 80's or mostly to NE never had this experience.

Zynda · Post by **Zynda** » 31 Jan 2017 20:40

^^L1A is for executives onlee. L1B has always been intra-company transfer. L1A folks get access to EB1 category GC filing. Nien on L1B. Both L1A & L1B spouses can work though. And L1 folks can change to H1 visa and switch employers. They just can't change employers on L1 visa.

Per NDTV, the EO is supposed to be signed today or some time this week. Any fresh news? I see no American news network covering this at all. They are all focussed on refuge restrictions. I guess, there is no human factor with legal H1 immigrants. H1 folks are economic immigrants...I guess it is hard to find sympathy among US populace.