Currency Demonetisation and Future course of Indian Economy

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 13 Nov 2016 05:24

Think the point is that some people are going to lose out in this move to a cashless economy because their money is now worth less if it is worth anything at all. They will not be out spending as they used to because of that. Therefore it would be good to inject some stimulus into the economy to tide things over.

MohdKav · Post by **MohdKav** » 13 Nov 2016 05:27

hanumadu wrote:
MohdKav wrote:
Its for Bribing.
Looks fake to me. No official wants to attract attention to them by stopping so many people for 4 hours. In this day and age, no one will tolerate it.

The guy is a friend, I know him personally. Have you passed through Coimbatore/ Walayar Check post

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/k ... 929161.ece

shyamal · Post by **shyamal** » 13 Nov 2016 05:30

vera_k wrote:Think the point is that some people are going to lose out in this move to a cashless economy because their money is now worth less if it is worth anything at all. They will not be out spending as they used to because of that. Therefore it would be good to inject some stimulus into the economy to tide things over.

Once this exercise is over and any inflation(due to hoarding etc) has been controlled, I am expecting a major rate cut for a start.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 13 Nov 2016 05:31

vera_k wrote:Think the point is that some people are going to lose out in this move to a cashless economy because their money is now worth less if it is worth anything at all. They will not be out spending as they used to because of that. Therefore it would be good to inject some stimulus into the economy to tide things over.

"Stimulus" = all new cash that restores whatever black market just collapsed. Thanks but no thanks. The whole purpose of this exercise was to get rid of the dependency on an opaque cash economy.

shyamal · Post by **shyamal** » 13 Nov 2016 05:34

MohdKav wrote:
hanumadu wrote:
Looks fake to me. No official wants to attract attention to them by stopping so many people for 4 hours. In this day and age, no one will tolerate it.
The guy is a friend, I know him personally. Have you passed through Coimbatore/ Walayar Check post

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/k ... 929161.ece

Asking bribe works as long as it is possible to pay it, even if at great inconvenience. If No one can pay the bribe - no one will have the cash to pay it at this moment - this guy is just risking a public shaming on social media and then a suspension. It just needs one passenger to take a pic and post it on FB/Twitter for the whole thing to get viral. Specially in the current tense atmosphere. People would love to hate someone.

ManSingh · Post by **ManSingh** » 13 Nov 2016 05:37

MohdKav wrote:
ManSingh wrote: Hmm... I get what I deserve. Quite personal but I will take it as a compliment. Karma after all.
It would take too much of an effort to whine about salaried class.
You are job is under a business, it affects you to. The day your boss cant raise finance or make ends meet. He will try to sell his family jewels or mortgage his house to pay your salary, but you will jump to another job, when you get a few thousand more. Your loyalty and effort is just that. The more I see the glee here , absolutely disgusting. the more I am happy about my employee's who is with me.

But You have people here talking like an academician with no understanding of ground realities. As if like the economy is just a paper trail.Cut the black economy, nothing happens to the white.

Assumptions sir?? Dont make it so personal.
For the record, i havent changed employers since i graduated 10 years back.
Also you are not the only one who deals with corrupt officials. I could go on and on about dealing with corruption, false court cases that i have faced etc. I didnt let them get to me.
I dont want to answer any more of your assumptions/comments. Please end it here.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 13 Nov 2016 05:37

The net effect of this purge is the transfer of a lot of purchasing power back to the Indian rupee - with the govt having the option to print more money & restore the purchasing power of rupee to its pre purge level.

All that printed money will go into govt expenditure on infra projects etc.
Those predicting shorterm real estate gloom & doom are ignoring the longterm boom which a govt led infra development binge will bring to real estate sector & all the other sectors linked to it.

roads , railways ,airports, metrorail ,flyovers & other urban transport , powerprojects ,ports & infra ,waterways all these sectors are currently govt led & will remain govt led for the medium term.

MohdKav · Post by **MohdKav** » 13 Nov 2016 05:37

Suraj wrote:No, you want cash liquidity specifically. That much is clear when you talk of liquidity. There's more than enough liquidity in the system because the banks are receiving BILLIONS in deposits. They can issue loans far more easily than they could before Tuesday. In other words, the white economy is MORE liquid now than it was last week. Quite the opposite of what you're asserting.

You don't need cash liquidity to pay 89 employees who all have bank accounts into which you can transfer their salary out of your business account. You need no cash liquidity to deposit a check from a client, accept a card payment or mobile payment. For any of these tasks, the system works with absolutely no difference before and after Tuesday Nov 9 .

Then you have serious comprehension skills. I dont care about cash or otherwise. My transactions are white. Easy availability of credit,
Have you ever taken a project loan ? Or a Overdraft ? Or a working capital loan ? Do you know how they value the property ( its a joke in itself ), Do you know about the paper work and conditions on it ? Do you know about the time taken to pass it ? Do you know that some paper work asked by the bank literally dont exist in some sectors?
Having Liquidity is one thing, transferring that into the market is another.
For example, for a project loan if it requires construction, they want the building plan approved- Do you know how difficult and cumbersome that is ?
These are the reasons people go for black credit ( not me ) , They start and along the way they get approvals, and then they go for a white loan.
the system doesnt work as before Tuesday - Asset values have dropped, valuations is no longer the same.

Banks are liquid, they remain still tough to get credit and cumbersome
Black money is gone, the babu's are in vengence mood to get it back
Black money is gone , but running a business is still a complicated mess and highly regulated.

MohdKav · Post by **MohdKav** » 13 Nov 2016 05:39

Lilo wrote:The net effect of this purge is the transfer of a lot of purchasing power back to the Indian rupee - with the govt having the option to print more money & restore the purchasing power of rupee to its pre purge level.

All that printed money will go into govt expenditure on infra projects etc.
Those predicting shorterm real estate gloom & doom are ignoring the longterm boom which a govt led infra development binge will bring to real estate sector & all the other sectors linked to it.

All the power goes to the Indian Government.
People are living in a half burned house.
So I have a plot on which the NH 17 is supposed to widened and pass through.
7 years. No movement. They freeze the land when they want, and when the funds lapse they unfreeze it.
Not been able to sell it or even construct anything on it.

MohdKav · Post by **MohdKav** » 13 Nov 2016 05:41

Suraj wrote:
vera_k wrote:Think the point is that some people are going to lose out in this move to a cashless economy because their money is now worth less if it is worth anything at all. They will not be out spending as they used to because of that. Therefore it would be good to inject some stimulus into the economy to tide things over.
"Stimulus" = all new cash that restores whatever black market just collapsed. Thanks but no thanks. The whole purpose of this exercise was to get rid of the dependency on an opaque cash economy.

Quite Anarchist.
This is what I was waiting for.
Why does Stimulus have to be Cash ?

MohdKav · Post by **MohdKav** » 13 Nov 2016 05:43

shyamal wrote:
MohdKav wrote:
The guy is a friend, I know him personally. Have you passed through Coimbatore/ Walayar Check post

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/k ... 929161.ece
Asking bribe works as long as it is possible to pay it, even if at great inconvenience. If No one can pay the bribe - no one will have the cash to pay it at this moment - this guy is just risking a public shaming on social media and then a suspension. It just needs one passenger to take a pic and post it on FB/Twitter for the whole thing to get viral. Specially in the current tense atmosphere. People would love to hate someone.

Its not job, its the job of the government to run a clean house. Not mine. I am not going to be crusader of justice facing the might of organized crime ( police thugs) alone. No Thank you.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 13 Nov 2016 05:44

There is no such thing as 'black credit' . Black money by definition is cash only. If you're dealing with cash and your business associates are having trouble coughing up cash, you are dealing with people who are handling black money, even if you're the agent who converts it from black to white.

Have you ever taken a project loan ? Or a Overdraft ? Or a working capital loan ? Do you know how they value the property ( its a joke in itself ), Do you know about the paper work and conditions on it ? Do you know about the time taken to pass it ? Do you know that some paper work asked by the bank literally dont exist in some sectors?

Yes I know about it, and I also know that none of these are black money issues. They're ease of doing business issues that you insist on REPEATEDLY bringing up here and derailing this thread with. You've already a warning on record for it. Please STOP. Next step is a ban.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 13 Nov 2016 05:45

MohdKav wrote:
Lilo wrote:The net effect of this purge is the transfer of a lot of purchasing power back to the Indian rupee - with the govt having the option to print more money & restore the purchasing power of rupee to its pre purge level.

All that printed money will go into govt expenditure on infra projects etc.
Those predicting shorterm real estate gloom & doom are ignoring the longterm boom which a govt led infra development binge will bring to real estate sector & all the other sectors linked to it.
All the power goes to the Indian Government.
People are living in a half burned house.
So I have a plot on which the NH 17 is supposed to widened and pass through.
7 years. No movement. They freeze the land when they want, and when the funds lapse they unfreeze it.
Not been able to sell it or even construct anything on it.

^Are you against widening of roads or are you just venting ?
Thats how cashstrapped public infrastructure development led by govt works . We are not China.
Anyway the GOI flush with cash from Jan 2017 will not go slow anymore. So fate of your plot will see resolution one way or the other soon.

MohdKav · Post by **MohdKav** » 13 Nov 2016 05:51

Suraj wrote: Yes I know about it, and I also know that none of these are black money issues. They're ease of doing business issues that you insist on REPEATEDLY bringing up here and derailing this thread with. You've already a warning on record for it. Please STOP. Next step is a ban.

Which is why people go for private credit - which is black. Unless you are in the community , which you arent no wonder you dont get it

shyamal · Post by **shyamal** » 13 Nov 2016 05:54

MohdKav wrote:
shyamal wrote:
Asking bribe works as long as it is possible to pay it, even if at great inconvenience. If No one can pay the bribe - no one will have the cash to pay it at this moment - this guy is just risking a public shaming on social media and then a suspension. It just needs one passenger to take a pic and post it on FB/Twitter for the whole thing to get viral. Specially in the current tense atmosphere. People would love to hate someone.
Its not job, its the job of the government to run a clean house. Not mine. I am not going to be crusader of justice facing the might of organized crime ( police thugs) alone. No Thank you.

You are not on that bus. So how would you do that anyway

I didn't mean you. If you got this news and this pic so many others would have got it too.

You are frustrated and disappointed. Try to get some sleep.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 13 Nov 2016 05:57

Mohdkav ji,
you talk of regulatory vicegrip & constricted ease of doing business in India.
May be you can start a thread on the ease of doing business with one of your first posts there detailing the general issues you have faced in course of your business.
Knowing the problem better will always lead to a solution set.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 13 Nov 2016 05:59

MohdKav wrote:Which is why people go for private credit - which is black. Unless you are in the community , which you arent no wonder you dont get it

You're using black money via money lenders and claiming your entire business is white. Yes, when you contradict yourself so prominently, no one will 'get it'. Switch to white money. Now's your chance to do it. There are dozens of news reports, like the one by Rahul M, to quote:

jewelers were heard discussing "enough is enough, we will even survive on daal-bhaat (daal & rice) but not going black anymore."

These are people who were in the same boat as you - ekeing out a living for their families while compelled to deal with black money, now determined to kick that entirely. You should too, rather than derailing this thread by bringing up other issues that you shouldn't be derailing this thread with.

The more time you spend wishing for the past, the further you set yourself back.

Rishi Verma · Post by **Rishi Verma** » 13 Nov 2016 06:09

Very naive school kid question. If gov is exchanging old with new currency how do banks get more liquidity? Net inflow is zero right?
I think only the burned or composted BM is net gain. Gurus Pls explain.

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 13 Nov 2016 06:11

Suraj wrote:"Stimulus" = all new cash that restores whatever black market just collapsed. Thanks but no thanks. The whole purpose of this exercise was to get rid of the dependency on an opaque cash economy.

It does not have to be cash. Stimulus can be interest rate cuts, relaxation on loan terms, or giving money back to every tax payer in their bank account.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Nov 2016 06:13

MohdKav wrote:I keep hearing this " little inconvenience" , You think Bus service provider's with passenger's not allowed to pass a check point without bribing the cops with the right kind of money is little inconvenience, if refuses to pay, they will stop all his buses playing by putting false charges, and then who will answer to the passengers, who pay money he might have borrowed to run the business, who will pay the salaries ?

ESI Hospitals - Run by the government, 8 years ago decides even though it is for factory workers to include my industry into it, they publish a gazette which nobody see. If you see the law regarding ESI, it is meant for factory workers not professionals. I get no letters or intimations nor does anyone in my sector, 8 years passes, suddenly I get a notice from ESI that I need to pay ESI for my staff, and I am supposed to come to their office with rolls. They come up with a figure of 39 lacs as penalty for 7 years insurance that my company or my staff havent used, or I havent collected, which my staff doesnt want ( nobody wants ESI, they rather have National Insurance ) or something they have intimated me either. So some idiot in Kerala, decided that they cant close down ESI hospitals, and they need money for it, so they decided to put some new sectors into it, which werent even part of the original esi mandate. Now I have to pay 39 lacs insurance, which I or my employee's never even knew existed. I am not the only one, they have done to ALL the companies in my sector. We went to the courts and lost, why because the system is gamed.

Please pardon me - I have never employed more than 4 people at any one time in my life. But I do recall that the government has a requirement that anyone who employs 10 people or more (I think 10 is the current number, it used to be 25 in the 1970s) must bring those employees under the Employees State Insurance (ESI) scheme. I was not aware of any sectors that are exempt but I was concerned when I realized that my SHQ was running a business that might have touched 10 employees - and she had no clue about ESI. etc.

Stopping buses for bribes at checkpoints is something I have seen from the 1970s. Generally the passengers are not exposed to this - the money exchange is between the bus owner and cops. The fact that is wrong and that it has gone on for decades only means that the rotten system needs cleaning. These are the very people who will start making black money from new notes

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 13 Nov 2016 06:15

Rishi Verma wrote:Very naive school kid question. If gov is exchanging old with new currency how do banks get more liquidity? Net inflow is zero right?
I think only the burned or composted BM is net gain. Gurus Pls explain.

None of that black money was in the banks. They had been withdrawn and had been floating outside formal banking system all this while. Banks never had access to that cash to lend out themselves and earn an interest for deposit holders.

In the last few days, the banking system has been receiving tens of billions in deposits as people hurriedly put that cash back in back accounts. All that is cash that fed the black economy until now. And now it's coming back into the formal banking system, giving banks a deposit infusion that improves their ability to lend out.

I agree that the RBI should cut rates. They should also enhance the capital base of the MUDRA scheme enabling entrepreneurs to obtain loans easily. On the other hand, they're pretty busy with the logistics of just sending new cash out to the banks.

It's been 3 days since this action. I'll give them more time . Right now they're busy fighting fires.

hanumadu · Post by **hanumadu** » 13 Nov 2016 06:20

Suraj wrote:
MohdKav wrote:Which is why people go for private credit - which is black. Unless you are in the community , which you arent no wonder you dont get it
You're using black money via money lenders and claiming your entire business is white. Yes, when you contradict yourself so prominently, no one will 'get it'. Switch to white money. Now's your chance to do it. There are dozens of news reports, like the one by Rahul M, to quote:
jewelers were heard discussing "enough is enough, we will even survive on daal-bhaat (daal & rice) but not going black anymore."
These are people who were in the same boat as you - ekeing out a living for their families while compelled to deal with black money, now determined to kick that entirely. You should too, rather than derailing this thread by bringing up other issues that you shouldn't be derailing this thread with.

The more time you spend wishing for the past, the further you set yourself back.

He has been all over the place. He started with not being able to sell his land and its value getting reduced by 50%.
Then he said no loans from black money lenders.
Then he claimed he is all white and the black money loan is not for him.
He says he wants liquidity but doesn't say what kind of liquidity or how it is affecting his business.

Rishi Verma · Post by **Rishi Verma** » 13 Nov 2016 06:23

Suraj wrote:
Rishi Verma wrote:Very naive school kid question. If gov is exchanging old with new currency how do banks get more liquidity? Net inflow is zero right?
I think only the burned or composted BM is net gain. Gurus Pls explain.
None of that black money was in the banks. They had been withdrawn and had been floating outside formal banking system all this while. Banks never had access to that cash to lend out themselves and earn an interest for deposit holders.

Thank you. Ok so there are five possibilities?
1. BM deposited in accounts (gets liquid)
2. BM exchanged for new notes (zero effect)
3. WM deposited in accounts (gets liquid)
4. WM exchanged for new notes (zero effect)
5. BM burned (Gets greatly liquid)
(case 5 would be majority BM)

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Nov 2016 06:40

MohdKav wrote: I want liquidity in the market, the government has decided to burn black economy, which has direct negative impact on a legitimate businesses like me, even though I dont own, borrow, transact or produce black money.
There needs to be serious liquidity ( cashless or whatever ) into the market.

Some businesses - including mine - have come to a grinding halt because no one has cash to pay up front for small services - a blood sugar or even a doctor's consultation fee. The only patients I saw were those with plastic money. Shops ran empty for 2-3 days but the cashflow is picking up.

I don't think there is any problem of cashless cashflow. One of the reasons why I did not feel anything was that 90% of the value of my transactions is cashless. I have a self inflicted problem of trying to shift from car to public transport which means I must have Rs 100 and Rs 10 notes/coins. I got rid of most of my 500/1000 notes by simply filling up tanks of cars which will not need a refill for a month now. So far the limit of my inconvenience was the inability to get my shirts ironed because there was no change to pay the lady who does the job until SHQ stood in bank queue and got some 100s. I also paid for dog biscuits by credit card which is a new one for me. Several autos that I travelled in had drivers with no clue about what the problem was. they knew that black money hoarders were taking a hit - but a few were initially puzzled as to why there were so few people travelling by auto and so few customers in the busiest areas of the city.

It seems like there are thousands of hoarders who have taken a serious hit, but collateral damage is the lack of circulation of large denomination notes which ran part of the "cashflow" economy.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 13 Nov 2016 06:45

2 Lakh crores has been deposited till now according to Jaitley. That's $30B

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 13 Nov 2016 06:51

In India Long term (36 months) Capital gain is only 20%
ST is your income tax.

What don't we pay tax? The IT itself is not bad (10, 20, 30).

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Nov 2016 07:22

vijayk wrote:In India Long term (36 months) Capital gain is only 20%
ST is your income tax.

What don't we pay tax? The IT itself is not bad (10, 20, 30).

I need to refer back to a fantastic quote by Suketu Mehta - in his book "Maximum City". In India we have a culture wherein hoodwinking the system itself is considered smart and the heroes of the system are those who use it for personal gain. I think it stems from the fact that those in power get there to milk the system.

Many years ago a newly elected state government was due to be sworn in around these parts. The man who was to be the CM's chief secretary is my relative - a man from a family of rock solid integrity. I met him on the day before the swearing in and he remarked that the cabinet had a one-point agenda - how to make money.

A now deceased uncle of mine recalls meeting Karnataka CM Dharaam Singh about permission for Birlas to start a project. Dharam Singh was aman whose eyes were permanently half-closed, but my uncle recalls that they opened an lit up when he heard the proposed value of the investment - 1500 crores. He then met them privately at his home

My kids went to a school started by a swamiji was was into the education sector - starting hundreds of educational institutions. We used to get invited to a birthday celebration of this man and his devotees would place large bundles of notes at his feet. Using temples and swamis for money to store black money is a time honoured tradition. I think both Ramakrishna Hegde and Jayalalithaa had run ins with the swamis who stored money for them. The theory was that black money would be dumped in the ashram/temple. But the money was always unaccounted with no paper trail. this meant that the swami could use it as he wished and did not always reimburse the politician. This led to trouble.

When I started practice in Blr 25 years ago it was normal for hospitals to collect in cash and pay essentially what in Bangalore is black money. Doctors are soft targets for tax and a few raids in the 90s ensured that cash collection and unaccounted transactions were scotched. I had a colleague who used to mock me for talking about submitting tax returns - a habit that I was introduced to by my late father in law who was a rock of integrity. By brother in law - equally honest used to mock his own father as a joke saying that others who had the same job as my father in law had acquired 20 houses while his father got one.

Local govt in Blr is a model of public private partnership in black money . Funds are set aside for garbage collection and roads. For garbage collection a favoured private contractor has to carry 25 lorry loads of garbage per day (example). Who counts? He does 15 loads and collects money for 25 and pays a kickback to the local corporator/MLA. As regards roads a tender is sought for asphalting 1 km of road for say 2 crores. The road is done and it looks good. But what people don't realise is that asphalting needs to be done to a particular thickness. You will have a good looking smooth road even if you put just a 5 cm thick layer as opposed to the 15 cm layer that should be the norm.

Government is about making black money and Modi is seen as a "traitor" of sorts - hitting at the heart of the black money business. I suddenly realized last night what Mamata didi means by "anti-people". I think Mamata' model and the Tamil Nadu model is to use thousands of crores of black money to distribute to people. Since the money is not directly for personal gain ergo it is "for the good of the people" and killing that is "anti-people". What is hidden is that this is a parallel economy to ensure that power and money making ability are retained by bribing voters

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 13 Nov 2016 07:30

BM Holders are in panic mode. Most don't understand the wide ranging implications of this move. ,any think they are smart Alecs, smarter than everybody. Having evaded the law for generations, I guess they are justified in their sense of smugness intellect.

People don't realise that once the money hits formal financial channels the government has a long time to slowly cook,their sorry arse while the BM holders chew their finger and toe nails every day fearing a notice in the post or at night fearing a knock on the door.

This 49k in JDY is too rational and scientific. The BM holders should consult their astrologers to get the best possible deposit combinations to save them. Astrology will best data analytics. I am surprised there are no queues outside astrologers.

The export route can potentially convert large amounts of BM into white. Don't know what can be done about this as the counter party is in another jurisdiction.

If somebody knows anybody committing an illegal act it's time to be Mr goody two shoes and dob them in.

saip · Post by **saip** » 13 Nov 2016 07:43

This microchip business. May be there is. No not for tracking but as a security feature. The microRFID has unique trackable number and if it is linked to the serial number of of the note does it not become virtually impossible for our friendly neighbor to duplicate.

The µ-Chip is Hitachi’s response to resolving some of the issues associated with conventional RFID technology. The µ-Chip uses the frequency of 2.45GHz. It has a 128-bit ROM for storing the ID with no write-read and no anti-collision capabilities. Its unique ID numbers can be used to individually identify trillions of trillions of objects with no duplication. Moreover with a size of 0.4mm square, the µ-Chip is small enough to be attached to a variety of minute objects including embedding in paper.

[url=ttps://norfiden.wordpress.com/2010/12/06/µ-chip-the-worlds-smallest-rfid-ic-radio-frequency-identification-intergated-circuit/]Hitachi[/url]

hanumadu · Post by **hanumadu** » 13 Nov 2016 07:52

Even if there is any mechanism to track or identify a bill, it need not be in all the bills. Even if it is in a fraction of the bills, it will lead to all bills stored along with it.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 13 Nov 2016 07:54

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Nov 2016 07:59

Among Black Money hoarding politicians there seems to be the attitude that "Everyone makes black money, but I use my black money for social causes - i.e giving freebies while the other guy uses it for personal luxuries" The fact that they are subverting the system and taht it is definitely personal gain for them seems to be ignored.

A good strong blow by GoI. But it must be followed up

vera_k · Post by **vera_k** » 13 Nov 2016 08:18

vijayk wrote:What don't we pay tax? The IT itself is not bad (10, 20, 30).

I remember reading something a while back. The Indian government is not considered legitimate, so people do not feel obliged to support it with tax. This might have something to do with our colonial history and later extended single party rule.

manjgu · Post by **manjgu** » 13 Nov 2016 08:23

Shiv..pl dont say that politicians use BM for freebies and they dont use it for personal use... probably u r not aware of benami properties of politicians...mayawati and her no good family has huge houses all over delhi and UP ..etc etc. what freebies does mayawati and her ilk give to people except bottle of liquor at election time?

saip · Post by **saip** » 13 Nov 2016 08:31

Telengana got formed with a bottle of liquor and a packet of briyani. Don't knock the value of the bottle of liquor. That according to KCR is good for the common man.

ManSingh · Post by **ManSingh** » 13 Nov 2016 08:39

http://www.rediff.com/news/report/pix-m ... 161112.htm

Upping the ante against Bharatiya Janata Party, Trinamool Congress supremo Mamata Banerjee on Saturday said she is not averse to working with Community Party of India-Marxist and other opposition parties like Congress, Samajwadi Party, Bahujan Samaj Party to fight against the “anti-people” Modi government which has imposed an “undeclared emergency”.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Nov 2016 08:41

https://twitter.com/nistula/status/797634320332533760

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Nov 2016 08:48

manjgu wrote:Shiv..pl dont say that politicians use BM for freebies and they dont use it for personal use... probably u r not aware of benami properties of politicians...mayawati and her no good family has huge houses all over delhi and UP ..etc etc. what freebies does mayawati and her ilk give to people except bottle of liquor at election time?

No I did not say that.

But let me translate my statement that you misunderstood

For example Mamata Banerjee appears poor and she certainly uses black money for personal benefit and for voter freebies. But the "appearance of poverty" allows her to claim that she is doing things for the aam junta. There are other politicians who go about in luxury cars. A Laloo or a Mayawati or a Mamata can point at those people and claim "Those people in luxury cars use black money for personal gain. We don't. Look at us. We belong to the side of the people."

This charade worked perfectly well as long as black money kept flowing. When it was stopped there is no more money to bribe voters. Those voters are going to ask the Mamatas and Mayawatis and the Laloos and the Mulayams "Where is the money you promised us? Where are the freebies?" Mamata is now blaming Modi for the anger that he freebie recipients will show.

Note that the bottle and liquor is only the fag end of the black money trail. What politicians do is to fund (and be funded by) criminal mafia who exert political power over people in a feudal set up. The actual voters get only a small gift, but getting them to vote and coercing them on the ground is done by criminal mafia. Elimination of political dissidents and ensuring that money flow goes only towards party supporters - eg people who print pro-party signboards and flyers, transport people who pull in crowds for meetings from surrounding villages for a day out, a meal and Rs 10 Maybe Rs 100 now) - rent a crowd

kvraghav · Post by **kvraghav** » 13 Nov 2016 08:55

Avoidable rant deleted.

ManuJ · Post by **ManuJ** » 13 Nov 2016 09:08

This move has to be seen as part of a historic social reform.
Every social reform ends up negatively affecting a class of people, normally a privileged class at that.
As such, it always faces stiff opposition and doomsday predictions. Until It is validated by the people and by history.
Abolition of princely kingdoms and abolition of zamindari are two such examples.
This social reform is about the abolition of black money.
This is affecting an unusually broad and powerful section of privileged and monied people and hence the visceral reaction against it.
Will need a lot of perseverance and patience and support by the dharmics for it to succeed.
But once it's effects take hold, it will literally be a new golden age for India.