India-US Strategic News and Discussion

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 21 Jan 2014 12:11

VCCR and VCDR provide the diplomat the ability to waive his immunity. The waiver has to be sought on a case by case basis by the receiving state, but the sending state or the diplomat can themselves waive it. The Italian ambassador provided such a personal guarantee on the behalf of the marines that they would return, and he was held until they returned.

In the case of DK, she was asked to waive immunity and face the proceedings. She declined. The SD was therefore obligated to guarantee her immunity and prevent Bharara's stormtroopers from intercepting her before her flight departed.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 21 Jan 2014 12:42

If the 'mali' referred to by the Mays or other local Indian employees files a case with local pulis against the US embassy/consulate staff alleging racism or maltreatment or discrimination or slave wages what will be the status of such a complain?

My question relates to act of crime/injustice committed within the US embassy/consulate grounds. Does such crime/injustice fall within the domain of local Indian law?

vic · Post by **vic** » 21 Jan 2014 14:35

Another factoid:

As per my inquires lot of persons in Lutyens Delhi, are not paid anything by the residents there ie Nada, Nil, Zero, shyoonya and in return they are given a room in servant quarters for their family. That is to say, a family has to provide one person in begari ie serf ie slave labour to stay in servants quarter. It is possible that the Gardner who was worse off then the dog per the Mays, may have been getting paid nothing. Such serf families are passed on from resident to resident.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 21 Jan 2014 14:58

Suraj wrote:Has it been confirmed that the May couple have been fired by the State Department ? The NY Daily News said they had 'been let go'. But any further references ?

Suraj ji,
That is a expectation in vain (they have been let go - from their Indian mission postings is the implication).
Ultimately their offenses are far less egregious(to others commited by their Dilplo corps abroad) and infact deliberately enacted in this case for the sake of Massaland's interests.
The NIE arecals I posted yesterday make it clear that the clique of 4-5 massa diplomutts and their dogs were acting with "tactical directions" from SD officials back in Massalandproper in the Richards family spiriting away OP (away from dutty hands of Indian law). You can even expect a future Ben Afflek Hollywood movie (10 years from now) where the Richards family are shown smuggled to "safety" in a covert Op disguised as some regular airlift of turd world labor being shipped to Massaland on some "special category" Massa visa for bonded labor. There will also be scenes in the movie where the Richards will be shown dancing in joy ,when the plane has left Indian airspace . Simultaneously Preet Bharara will be shown hugging his colleagues in joy at yet another successful overseas Op by the Land of the Free and the Brave (F and B in capitals) in some corner of the accursed turd world. People may also see a pic of SD officials gathered around a real time monitor in Massaland headed by Kerry no less , covering their mouth and awaiting with tension for the plane to clear Indian airspace. 10 years from now the diplomutts in the clique can also be seen getting presented with Intelligence stars by Al-ciada (watch out for this scene in the future Ben Afflek movie) for successfully rescuing and spiriting away an (intelligence ?) asset from the Indians.

Now coming back,
Whatever maybe the assertions here of other forum members (about "firm expectations" of massa taking punitive action on Mays) , actual logic will dictate that Wayne May (who is the sole "offender" explicitly recognised by GOI ) will get a raise of pay grade in the Diplomatic security service. There is this thing called "Morale" to upkeep among their security staff ( ask yourself the question - when was the last time a Marine was punished for offenses abroad hain ji ? be it Okinawa or Rammstein or Bagram ? - you will get an answer in no uncertain terms) and the SD officials will not burn their own , especially when the person belongs to a group tasked with protecting their unwiped (though perfumed) bottoms . Ultimately one must remember that Americans are exceptional beings.

The Mays are Herrows now with a capital H.
Along with Papa May , Mrs May (a senior diplomutt) will probably get a posting in a cushy desk job in Massaland coupled with a similar "rank and pay raise" to stay near her family , near her dogs, near her beef burgers , near her Starbucks , near her pals etc.
Missy Brianna May will get her first job in her fathers diplomatic security service , as was her desire expressed while interning in India.

All beliefs aired here by americans to the contrary are because of the naive and airy belief in the infallibility of American justice system and the so called Massa ideals of freedom equality liberty etc permeating and overflowing through all corners of its institutions including the US State Department so much as to effect its external policy to the World.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 21 Jan 2014 15:10

Hypocrisy, thy name is America

US Embassy to Check Driver’s Case

The US Embassy in Indonesia said it was still studying an order by the Supreme Court issued in April last year, related to the dismissal of Indra Taufiq, a former driver of the US Consulate in Medan, North Sumatra, after ruling that diplomatic immunity did not apply in the case.

The court ordered the embassy to pay Indra severance in accordance with Indonesian labor law — which states a worker is entitled to a year’s salary plus a month for every year’s service — after he was allegedly fired without proper cause.

The embassy said it would study the case in accordance with international law.

“We are still studying the case from the perspective of international law, and we will work with related Indonesian institutions,” US Embassy spokesman Troy Pederson was quoted as saying by Majalah Detik on Monday.

Indra had worked at the consulate for 11 years before he lost his job on July 26, 2011. But the embassy did not pay Indra severance as required by Indonesian law when an employer cuts ties with an employee.

Indra subsequently filed a lawsuit against the US missions in Medan and Jakarta at the Medan Industrial Relations Court (PHI) and eventually won the case in the Supreme Court.

Indra said since the court ruled in his favor on April 2 last year, he had gone to the consulate three times to claim what is due to him, but the consulate refused to comply with the ruling.

“I’m just going to wait. Maybe God has not shown the way,” Indra said.

His lawyer, Parlindungan H.C. Tamba, said the US Consulate in Medan always tried to avoid meeting his client.

“ We went to the Medan consulate three times, but each time they told us to take the matter up with [the US Embassy in] Jakarta,” Tamba said.

But Pederson said the embassy was committed to complying with local laws.

“The US Embassy is committed to the fair and decent treatment of all its local staff and tries to comply with the local laws and regulations,” he said. “The US representative [offices] in Indonesia currently hires more than 1,200 local employees.”

The US embassy committed to complying with local laws has been studying the case in accordance with international law

,from April 2013.

Does local law trump International law or does International law trump local law in case of diplomats? Do ju mere mortals see how a straight forward case of primacy of the local law in US suddenly becomes "highly technical and complex set of questions" when the same rule is applied by other countries wrt US diplomats?

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 21 Jan 2014 15:14

^ Depends on which law was "chosen" by Massa citizens and on which side of the chosen law they are "demanding" Justice.

Theo Fidel wrote:..It will remain unfair that DK was planning to decamp with a green card while SR is not supposed to aspire for this.
......

Theo ji,
for your and our reference above is the unsubstantiated insinuation for the Nth time by you, then why this acting coy hain ji?

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 21 Jan 2014 15:25

Theo_Fidel wrote:^^
But GOI had no hesitation going after the Italian ambassador.

Theo garu That is not correct. Italian Marines hve no immunity and they are being tried for serious crimes attracting death penalty. Italian Amby stood personal surety for both the marine before Supreme Court thereby he agreed to subject himself to Supreme court and abide by its orders if marines failed to return. It was Sc which restrained Amby from leaving and not GOI. No one forced Amby to waive his immunity and that he did in his personal capacity. he is neither arrested not declared PNG by GOI. He discharges his duty as Amby even now without any restrain. So you might be confused by comparing cheese to chalk.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 21 Jan 2014 15:50

krisna wrote:In US of A , I was told by my colleague who is a medico and lawyer both.
he said it is not the truth that wins but who sends the message that the other person is wrong to the right audience.(something like that)

As it is very expensive for ordinary amirkahns, many avoid the legal process-- over 90% never go to the jury. It is all done by lawyers of both sides with the aggreiveed parties shelling out the money. only lawyres of both sides become rich.

saying judiciary is fast and justice done is a misnomer in america.

Krisna ji,
plis to dekhho Hollywood movie- Thank joo for Smoking (2005) and to compare the ideals propounded by the Herrow Aaron Eckhart to another (this time an edumacational movie from the black and white age - Twelve Angry men) Herrow Heny fonda.
In 50s the Hollywood was edumacating massa baby boomers the importance of facts and truth in their Justice systems .Now in 21 st century Arron Eckhart is edumacating his middle school going son that
"Argument matters not the Truth" - and people are in fact lapping this argument since long as the "right" thing to do, considering this "progress" the American way.

Joey Naylor: ...so what happens when you're wrong?

Nick Naylor: Whoa, Joey I'm never wrong.

Joey Naylor: But you can't always be right...

Nick Naylor: Well, if it's your job to be right, then you're never wrong.

Joey Naylor: But what if you are wrong?

Nick Naylor: OK, let's say that you're defending chocolate, and I'm defending vanilla. Now if I were to say to you: 'Vanilla is the best flavour ice-cream', you'd say...

Joey Naylor: No, chocolate is.

Nick Naylor: Exactly, but you can't win that argument... so, I'll ask you: so you think chocolate is the end all and the all of ice-cream, do you?

Joey Naylor: It's the best ice-cream, I wouldn't order any other.

Nick Naylor: Oh! So it's all chocolate for you is it?

Joey Naylor: Yes, chocolate is all I need.

Nick Naylor: Well, I need more than chocolate, and for that matter I need more than vanilla. I believe that we need freedom. And choice when it comes to our ice-cream, and that Joey Naylor, that is the defintion of liberty.

Joey Naylor: But that's not what we're talking about

Nick Naylor: Ah! But that's what I'm talking about.

Joey Naylor: ...but you didn't prove that vanilla was the best...

Nick Naylor: I didn't have to. I proved that you're wrong, and if you're wrong I'm right.

Joey Naylor: But you still didn't convince me

Nick Naylor: It's that I'm not after you. I'm after them.

[points into the crowd]

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 21 Jan 2014 16:27

Theo_Fidel wrote:
In the mean time don't get arrested. It is no different than defensive driving. Every little power hungry uniform can make your life miserable.

Apart from a few liberals on dailykos.com, I have not seen any outrage about strip searches.

habal · Post by **habal** » 21 Jan 2014 17:24

It's no more 'land of the free' like in times of Abe Lincoln, it's a thoroughly and completely colonized, & subjugated population under threat of state brutality or constantly mesmerised under illusion of technology and gizmo gee-wiz. They have lost the nerve to rebel or organize.

member_22872 · Post by **member_22872** » 21 Jan 2014 17:37

Even during Lincoln's times it wasn't land of the free. If not for the civil war, it can be debated if he had passed Emancipation Proclamation

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 21 Jan 2014 17:48

I note that the lack of published outrage is no indication of how people feel. And no, "cavity searches" and "strip searches" for "arrest" are not compatible with the constitutional presumption of innocence. There was no basis to claim imminent danger, security risk, risk of flight, suicide, or motive to hide anything (like drugs, contraband jewelry, microchips, or cellphones in the case of Pakis) These constitute at minimum a total absence of human common sense, absence of training, absence of leadership. Why were these Einsteins unable to reason that a mother dropping her kids off at school is not likely to have hand grenades up her musharraf? Where was the need for such atrocities? Why were the "police" unable to reason this for themselves? Esp. since the diplomat made it perfectly clear that they were off on a course that violated their own, and international, laws? This was Rakshasa arrogance, and needs to be pointed out and punished in an exemplary manner. As a civilized human I agree that I would not like to see "retaliatory" obscenities visited upon American diplomats, but is there enough civilized sense in the intra-cranial cavities high up in the State Department to understand that Indian reluctance to go that route is not based on weak knees but on mature civilized restraint? This is the matter for concern by lawmakers, to demand accountability and clean out those cavities.

If we don't point it out, who will?

Theo is welcome to hold his view that whatever the government inflicts is fine (and I thank him for posting such arguments here so that we could consider them soberly, and actually he is by no means agreeing with the police actions in these things), but it is not fine with the rest of us, and such fatalistic reasoning is certainly not what created free nations or constitutional protections. Theo is right, bullies in uniform do such things, and everyone else is right, that such behavior is unacceptable.

Also, thanks to the postor who clarified

unsubstantiated insinuation

. Saved me the trouble of repeating what I said about that.

Most of us do not agree with the notorious pronouncement of Edwin Meese (long dead) Attorney General of the United States, so appointed because he had given a loan to some top Republicans under his neighbor Ronald Reagan:

Why would you be a Suspect unless you are Guilty?

I think Meese WAS found guilty of some things eventually, thereby providing an excellent datum on why the presumption of innocence can cause a lot of hardship to a whole nation. But we prefer it to the alternative.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 21 Jan 2014 18:08

No amount of steps taken outside USA will affect issue of USA doing ratification in parts. Today its about payment issue and tomorrow it can be another - again followed by new York style SoP arrest. Please lets not tilt at windmills about it is like that only in USA, the most powerful and first of all first world countries.

That UN is headquartered in NY is why this is an issue for all humanity. That diplomats from all countries are silently supporting India and Indian diplomats is a proof of this - especially when diplomats are representatives of nations. This can't be changed by any amount of lessening importance of diplomats - especially when India has shown tremendous sense of diplomacy and civility by letting 2 or so USA diplomats go in very straight forward manner. This is a concern for entire humanity that Indians can speak of by our good sense of treating foreign diplomats even in face of hostility and insults(by a few) and also by ratifying and following diplomatic conventions in good style and spirit.

habal · Post by **habal** » 21 Jan 2014 18:23

vishvak wrote: - especially when India has shown tremendous sense of diplomacy and civility by letting 2 or so USA diplomats go in very straight forward manner.

this is part of the problem. There is no significant cost payable for misbehavior. All countries are in the 'is it really upon us to bell the cat' mode. Unless one US diplomat is really made to suffer the consequences of their actions, they will continue doing this, not regularly as before, but you can say in biennial mode. Though you can rest assured that the next country to suffer from some US diplomats belligerance and misbehaviour too would be from Asia.

pankajs · Post by **pankajs** » 21 Jan 2014 18:27

Why cant a pandu make a genuine mistake and finger a diplomat even one from the embassy? He can justify his actions based on his own interpretation of the Vienna conventions and Indian SOP.

In all civility we can issue a non-regret post-facto and I would even go to the extent of transferring the pandu.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 21 Jan 2014 18:37

The poor pandu. Look at what happened to the Indian IFS person who (HONESTLY) enforced the law that the Indian Constitution has imposed - and denied a visa to a "spouse" who did not qualify as spouse under Indian Law. When that person is made head of the US desk and rewarded for enforcing the law, I will agree that there is some spine in Dilli.

BTW, the US will just hush up the incident, and deny it if Indian media report it (which they won't unless they have approval from their Masters). Have you seen any public report of all the traffic stops for having illegal tints on windows? BTW, tinted windows are verboten in other places where there are very hot summers as well. I overhead a (loud) ABCD conversing with a co-student, sitting at the Gate in Amsterdam last year:

Yeah man like I got stopped like in (near the s. US destination of the flight ) for like speeding and like the guy then gave me like a ticket for the like tinted screen on my Jeep's like window, over $1000 in all!

As Theo says, one observes the speed limit carefully in such parts..
I bet there have been some new procedures followed at the airports as well - no one seems to have paid attention to the sudden cancellation of the Amby's Nepal boondoggle. I don't think they cancel such things without good reason.

member_28352 · Post by **member_28352** » 21 Jan 2014 18:45

What's the bet that the Mays' and other diplomutts have actually been "searched" while on their way in or out? Given their culture I bet they will never report these in their media. Heck they didn't even report the names of the May couple.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 21 Jan 2014 18:47

UlanBatori wrote:I note that the lack of published outrage is no indication of how people feel.

Right, in this day of blogs, twitter and facebook and instant sharing of each fleeting emotion, we have no indication of how people feel.

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 21 Jan 2014 19:10

As seen in every election.
See all the evidence (some posted on this thread) that sensible opinions on this affair have been systematically suppressed in both the US "free" media such as See Enn Enn, and in the Indian "independent media" such as TOI. While racist xenophobic rants have gone essentially unedited.

The usual dichotomy between FOX and CNN does not apply here. Many of the most passionate Liberals on Huffington Post, even, are so hung up on their Domestic Workers Have Rights Too prejudice, that they have not bothered to think and realize that the issues are completely misframed by the GOTUS in this case. OTOH, the FOX types are exhibiting their own usual misanthropism and xenophobia.

It's a WIN-WIN for the BO WHO and its most extreme liabilities, the far-left commie-pakis who pose as "liberal" Americans.
On the Indian side, all the antipathy against "Rejervashun" act against DK and UK
The Petty jealosies about their wealth amplify that. I mean, why didn't I get an option on an Adarsh phlat, what-what?
Our own view of the Babucracy's imperial hauteur comes in the way of our judgement. Why do they keep saying how a DIPLOMAT can't be strip-searched, because she is not JUST ANY MANGO? Hain?
And the Indian Angreji media's "Eeph the Goras do it it must be right onlee" genuflexion delivers the snap initial false judgement, that then just gets amplified.

But despite all this, no one I know approves of what happened, and most are deeply disturbed. And we get more disturbed as the facts come out. This is rogue operation, but it seems to have occurred because of gross lack of sense or control in the US administration. Impeachment material.

The parallel I see is with the See Tee Bee Tee scam collapse courtesy of Arundhati Ghosh, and the May 1998 new clear bum tests. Same initial barking and yowling. Op-Eds. Editorials by Moni Basu (the present equivalent is what Parthiv Parekh did in his "Khabar" rag). Official Statements making the US position seem oh-so-reasonable. Expert comments from Former Diplomats working at (US-funded?) Think Tanks in Dilli, like Nitin Pai. The usual Sagarika Ghose type JNU Experts holding forth.

But the Truth Triumphs eventually because some of us don't give up or allow ourselves to be shut up by the tsunamis of pakistan put out by the above.

OK, so pls start Tweeting the truth, it has to start somewhere?

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 21 Jan 2014 19:25

Nitin Pai (of acorn/takshila and their amatur/independent policy think tank Shenanigans) is a known poseur who is these days a "most interested" proponent of allowing more Western(aka Massa) FDI in Indian defence sector .

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 21 Jan 2014 20:48

Lilo: I'm not referring to any personal expectation about the Mays. I'm referring solely to a news article claiming they have been let go. If anyone has seen further references to their being let go by the SD, please post it.

Lilo · Post by **Lilo** » 21 Jan 2014 20:58

^ Suraj ji,
I guessed so too , as my post was addressed more for others who were expressing such. Sorry for using the shoulders of your post to fire some shots - more to do with laziness in digging up old posts by others.

saip · Post by **saip** » 21 Jan 2014 22:02

Arjun wrote:
Theo_Fidel wrote:It will take a while but eventually Americans will tire of this and outlaw it.
I agree...& am glad India is assisting in this process by taking up the Dharmic responsibility of kicking the US in the butt until it realizes its responsibility towards its citizens.

Only two states have legalized (these are the states whose teams will be playing Super Bowl -- may be others too will consider it now!) and even there the Federal Law trumps the state law, that Fed has said it would not actively pursue marijuana cases for minor infractions not withstanding.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 21 Jan 2014 22:26

The marijuana law in Colorado and Washington state is on shaky ground. Remember this, even if you smoke pot and live there, doing so legally, NEVER admit it to a federal officer. For example, if you arrive in Denver or Seattle on an international flight, don't say yes if the immigration officer asks you that. You just admitted to breaking a federal law and will be deported; it doesn't matter if the state is ok with it.

There was a recent story in Seattle of a European student at UW who was deported after he admitted casually during immigration that he had smoked within Washington state. They put him in the local deportees Gitmo overnight and send him back to Copenhagen or wherever he came from.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 Jan 2014 22:29

Suraj, After the NY Daily News report I have scanned many US papers but found no other corrobration of the "let go". I think it was creative reporting license like "artist's license" to stretch the story.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 Jan 2014 23:06

Philip Richard's father works as driver for US embassy and the mother Agnes worked at the Mays residence.

From Outlook.

Theo_Fidel · Post by **Theo_Fidel** » 21 Jan 2014 23:47

-delete-

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 Jan 2014 23:50

Theo, When we want an "agony advice" column we will open a thread for you. Till then give it a rest.
Thanks, ramana

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 21 Jan 2014 23:58

ramana wrote:Suraj, After the NY Daily News report I have scanned many US papers but found no other corrobration of the "let go". I think it was creative reporting license like "artist's license" to stretch the story.

It helps to track their whereabouts since their expulsion. It's not really worthwhile to waste our time defending DK in a stream of articles, when the May family issue is allowed to die quietly. Instead of long whines about the May couple, could someone please dig up their history ?

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 22 Jan 2014 00:42

^^^ Ramana, Suraj et el
Chances are virtually nil that that that kind of story (that May have been "let go") will have ANY credibility. Such "let go" things simply don't happen.

Short of May's getting convicted in a Visa fraud case ,in an American court, no SD official is going to mess with a DS (or DSS) person (who provides security to consulate) in an open way. Even if May's bosses become very unhappy, unless WM wants to leave, he is likely to stay or in worst case scenario let go quietly after a good severance pay.

His problem will be if he is charged with breaking a us law etc. The FB posts, as ugly as they are are, are not that uncommon. In fact, some will say that they are mild as compared to what some people write on social media , (or even other kind of media).

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 22 Jan 2014 00:49

http://www.samachar.com/US-may-suspend- ... igebe.html
"U.S. may suspend A-3 visa issuance to India
Narayan Lakshman
When U.S. President Barack Obama signed a $1.1 trillion umbrella spending bill last week to avert another federal government shutdown, a number of less-noticed provisions appeared to have been inserted quietly, including making aid to Pakistan conditional on its counterterrorism cooperation and preliminary steps towards reform of the National Security Agency’s spying programmes.
It appeared that while most nations in New Delhi’s neighbourhood found prominent mention in the report, India was notable for its absence – but that was only the appearance.
In reality a key provision of the bill that did not get much attention may result in the suspension of all A-3 or domestic worker visas for Indian diplomats coming to the U.S., in the wake of the Khobragade controversy.
For deep within the text of the bill was also a requirement that U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry implement section 203(a)(2) of the William Wilberforce Trafficking Victims Protection Reauthorisation Act of 2008, the George-W-Bush-era policy that cracked down on diplomats abusing their domestic workers on U.S. soil.
It was principally due to this Act, passed initially in 2000, that diplomats of all countries are required to sign labour contracts promising fixed terms of employment including salaries consistent with minimum wage law, the legal instrument that ultimately proved to be the undoing of former Deputy Consul General Devyani Khobragade.
Her December 12, 2013 arrest over visa fraud charges and subsequent strip search in the custody of U.S. Marshals led to compounding diplomatic hostilities, with India’s Ministry of External Affairs enacting retaliatory measures back home, including removing security barriers around the U.S. embassy in New Delhi and abolishing privileges extend to U.S. diplomats.
Although matters appeared to calm down after Ms. Khobragade was asked to leave the U.S. under the protection of diplomatic immunity derived from a her reassignment to India’s Permanent Mission to the United Nations, the crisis seemed to fester after New Delhi raised questions about whether employees of the U.S. Embassy School in the capital allegedly misstated their visa status and evaded certain taxes......."
Gautam

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 22 Jan 2014 00:51

Careful. Once out of Dilli they are "none of our business" and any attempt to dig may be misconstrued by ppl who are probably not thrilled at what some ppl can do with public-domain info.

Example. Circa 2003 there was a big and sudden realization of what Professor Paul ("Limp P***lus") Courtright had published in his book "Ganesa: Lord of Obstacles". Ppl were enraged, of course, and demanded action. MANY angry and well-reasoned, calm letters went to Emory U. President, Dean etc, all ignored.

A Petition was started by students of U. La or somewhere, giving some precise quotes from said Book. Collected 50,000 signatures within a week. The new President was pole-axed (figuratively) on NPR in his grand introductory interview, asking why his dump was being accused of *orn peddling. Baad PR problem for Emory with their $4B endowment and Methodist background, to be accused with such clear evidence of esp. child *orn peddling which is felony.

Solution: An anonymous post appeared on the Petition. Demanded hanging the author etc. Within 30 minutes, the Phree Biscoot Interviewers had been called - BY THE EMORY DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC RELATIONS. They dragged in the students who initiated the Petition and accused them of making terroristic threats. Petition shut down.

Hope lesson is clear (NEVER start a petition without insisting on moderating posts b4 publication!) So be careful. I assume that they have been effectively sent to Vladivostok for R&R until the snow melts and the mosquitos come out there. But let it rest there.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 22 Jan 2014 00:55

UB, So right. You should have seen my post which I deleted.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 22 Jan 2014 01:55

Interesting powerplay history. So the Khobragades - daughter AND father - are fair game for constant examination into their character, even by our own members, not to mention the gratuitious press they've received from pakistans like NyTimes, but the May couple are now out of bounds.

At the very least, this means we have no business dissecting the antecedents of the Khobragades any further, particularly not by BRF members themselves.

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 22 Jan 2014 02:04

'US envoy runs American school'

The charter of the elite American Embassy School (AES), which is under scanner for alleged visa fraud, makes it clear that the US ambassador to India is responsible for its administration, though Washington has recently sought to dissociate its mission in New Delhi from the institution.
...
...
“The Association (American Embassy School Association) is being formed pursuant to the American Ambassador’s responsibility, on behalf of the Government of the United States of America, for the administration of the School; said responsibility being recognised in a bilateral undertaking dated June 28, 1973 between the Government of the United States of America and the Government of India,” says Article II of the charter of the association that manages the school.

Article II of the charter spells out the “purpose, objectives and powers” of the association.

The charter also states that the association was being set up “under authority of Sections 921 and 1081 of the Foreign Service Act of 1946 (of the US), as amended.” It also makes it clear that the US ambassador to India reserves the right to dissolve the association. Daniel P Moynihan was the US ambassador to India when the charter was adopted on March 7, 1974. Its most recent revision was approved by Washington’s current envoy to New Delhi, Nancy J Powell.
...

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 22 Jan 2014 02:09

Lilo wrote:Nitin Pai (of acorn/takshila and their amatur/independent policy think tank Shenanigans) is a known poseur who is these days a "most interested" proponent of allowing more Western(aka Massa) FDI in Indian defence sector .

Yup...many of his claims re: BMD were similarly flakey.. he posed as some mega analyst on the interwebz though.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 22 Jan 2014 02:27

This is strange (emphasis - the bold part - mine)

Suraj wrote:Interesting powerplay history. So the Khobragades - daughter AND father - are fair game for constant examination into their character, even by our own members, not to mention the gratuitious press they've received from pakistans like NyTimes, but the May couple are now out of bounds.
.

Why May couple is out of bound? Who says (or said) they are out of bound? More importantly, what is fair or not (to be posted here), ought to be determined by it's forum moderators so why this kind of of talk that "we are victims onlee"... As far as I can see, no one stopping anyone and even if someone did they have no real power to control or dictate who is out of bound.

I only hope people do not go overboard in their misunderstanding..

***

FWIW May couple were booted out of India not because of their FB posts, but their role regarding enabling the "evacuation" (okay, officially GOI did not even gave a reason - no need to - or even identified the people).. FB posts came to light only afterwords .. a good fall out which no one feels bad about (I don't think they need sympathy for that)

Mihir · Post by **Mihir** » 22 Jan 2014 02:39

Nitin Pai hasn't said/written anything that makes the US look oh-so-reasonable, has he?

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 22 Jan 2014 02:51

Some recent news caught my eye. This is noteworthy. Please share/save/ for reference

The International Court of Justice ruled in 2004 that the United States had violated the Vienna Convention on Consular Relations, the treaty that lays out rights of people detained in other nations,

The Link: ICC.ORG

This is in news, and it is Mexico which is mad at US.

Case is in some way, if you want to call it that, similar to DK affair, as far as, a non-US citizen (of Mexico) was charged and convicted in US court, without honoring his rights per Vienna convention.

It is an order of magnitude different though. Unlike DK, this guy is/was not a diplomat. His crime was murder (of a policeman at that). He is sentenced to death.

Yet, Mexico is mad because this man, who is Mexican citizen, did not get consular access. ICC agrees with that.

Kerry is worried too. (IMO he is learning fast from DK affair) ., arguing that setting an execution date is

extremely detrimental to the interests of the United States. (and can put american in danger)...This is a process issue I am raising because it could impact the way American citizens are treated in other countries.

(As they say "दूध का झला छाछ को भी फूँक फूँक कर पीता है" or my friend in Japan said - If you get burnt on a hot miso soup, you blow on even a cold shushi)

Texas Deputy Attorney General Don Clemmer said he would meet with representatives from the Justice Department and the State Department over the matter.

Added later: CNN link for above news:
Mexico to Texas ....Don't execute our citizen

UlanBatori · Post by **UlanBatori** » 22 Jan 2014 02:51

All I said is "careful" and why... I didn't imply that the Emory types got away with that, but the Petition effort did get destroyed because the organizers were not careful.

Looking at the SR

, don't you think these ppl have fertile imaginations when it comes to inventing "offense" and "harassment" and "torture" and victimhood, even when there is absolutely none of that in reality? And they have the full might of the GOTUS to misuse on their side, until someone puts a stop to that from within the GOTUS. Right now it is in their interest to shut us up, just try not to facilitate that.