Should HH The Dalai Lama be elected India's next President?

[Sanku]

Interesting idea.

I think the most useful suggestion to come out of this thread is the one by Bade that an Arunachali be made President of India, or at any rate, definitely someone from the Northeast.

Hey hey, I had first suggested some one from Tawang area (pref of Buddhist monkhood too) in the countering Chinese threat thread, when RajeshA first floated the HHDL idea there.

I want my credit...

[Arihant]

Would Taiwan accept nuclearisation? Have they ever shown interests in getting nukes?

Yes they have - look up my posts on the topic over the last week. Also this from today:

And the debate in the Taiwanese media today seems to mirror our own...
TAIPEI TIMES: Myth about our nuclear development program

[Klaus]

If you read right after the bolded part, I did mention water.

Yes you did but the tone of your post seemed to indicate that water wasnt serious enough for India to include or plan strategically around.

I disagree that PRC's sole motivation for Tibet is water - been 6 decades and they are yet to tap into that.

Not really. Perhaps, they might be finding it hard to construct dams and carry out diversionary work using pipelines (your argument about costs comes here), so they are bringing their people to the water source. Its like "Since the mountain will not come to the man, the man has to come to the mountain"

[RajeshA]

US pays tribute to Dalai Lama's warriors by Sudeshna Sarkar: IANS

Kathmandu : Hundreds of Tibetan warriors who doggedly fought a 15-year guerrilla war against the Chinese invasion and annexation of Tibet after being trained and armed by the US Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) now have a memorial that is likely to ruffle the feathers of the Chinese government.

The US has, for the first time, paid a tribute to the resistance fighters and acknowledged the CIA's role in training them by erecting a memorial plaque at Camp Hale, a training base in Colorado for US troops during World War II.

Unknown to the local residents, who were told it was an atomic testing site, Camp Hale served as a training camp for nearly 2,000 Tibetan warriors who were taught the art of guerrilla warfare by the CIA from 1957-72 to fight China's People's Liberation Army that attacked Tibet in 1949 and annexed the Buddhist kingdom within two years.

The event last week saw former CIA agents, Tibetans involved in the operation and representatives of the US Forest Service and the Tibetan-American community in Colorado gather at Camp Hale.

The plaque reads: "From 1958 to 1964, Camp Hale played an important role as a training site for Tibetan Freedom Fighters. Trained by the CIA, many of these brave men lost their lives in the struggle for freedom. 'They were the best and bravest of their generation, and we wept together when they were killed fighting alongside their countrymen.' This plaque is dedicated to their memory."

When China attacked Tibet under Mao Zedong, the American government, regarding Beijing as a potential exporter of Communism and threat to US allies and interests in the region, trained Tibetans and air-dropped them into occupied Tibet.

The guerrillas also had the support of the Indian government. Some of them operated from Mustang, Nepal's northernmost district sharing the border with Tibet.

"Like many CIA operations, the US involvement with Tibetan guerrillas, including the training programme at Camp Hale, has not officially been acknowledged by the US government previously," said the New York-based International Campaign for Tibet (ICT).

"The history of this era is increasingly being written about by academics, journalists, and those who participated in it, both Tibetan and American."

"We commend Senator (Mark) Udall for his lead in the US Congress and for working with the US Forest Service to provide proper recognition of the historic US support rendered in the name of Tibetan freedom and the heroism demonstrated by many Tibetans who fought for their country," said Todd Stein, director of government relations at the ICT.

But the tribute is bound to ruffle the feathers of Beijing that still remains suspicious of Mustang, regarding it as a base from where the "Free Tibet" movement could start again and has begun a campaign in Nepal to intensify patrolling along the border.

Beijing has also prevented efforts by the US to offer asylum to Tibetan refugees in Nepal who are especially vulnerable to Chinese attempts to have them deported.

The Tibetan resistance ended after Tibetan ruler Dalai Lama, who fled to India in 1959, sent a message to the warriors, asking for an end to it.

[Klaus]

^^^ Unkil showing us the way to make a statement. This thread is very timely and fast-moving indeed!

Hope GOI is watching and following developments.

[RajeshA]

RajeshA,

For all the above HHDL need not be the president of India.
This is a not a bright idea. We should not involve him in politics of India for now. Let him be the spiritual guide of Tibetans.It can divide Tibetans and Indians when we want unity.

I concede electing HH DL as Indian President is not fundamental to the plan, but it is the crowning of it, and for amplifying the success. It would also be a means of gaining the acceptance of all Tibetans for the Tibetan merger with India.

Why is it actually important that HH DL does become the President of India for the success of such a plan?

1) When two countries unite, it is normally the case, that one needs to find a way to fuse the strengths of both the systems. - just as it during a merger of two companies, so that both can profit from the strengths of the other.

2) There is also a certain imperative for fusing both the systems rather than choosing one of the systems, i.e. if only one system is taken as the common system, then it would be considered more of an acquisition, a take over, one system having conquered the other. So a fusion is necessary. That helps the members of the two organizations to identify themselves with the common new organization, and to pledge loyalty to it.

3) The best the Indian Union has to offer is its democratic multi-party secular parliamentary system and the Tibetans see the Dalai Lama as the most prominent symbol of their land. So it would be prudent for the Indian Union to search for a place for the Dalai Lama in its system. The Presidency would be the right position. The Tibetans take our Political System and we take their Head of State.

4) The Tibetans would be merging their country into India's. However almost all of Tibet lies in China, so the merger of Tibet into India is basically symbolic. The Presidency of India is also mostly symbolic. So it is a fair exchange of symbols.

Also if the Dalai Lama is made the President of India, any voices within the Tibetan community inside or outside India which do not agree to the merger would die down. That is the only way of getting all Tibetans inside and outside Tibet on board with the proposal.

This is how we could win over the loyalty of 5.4 million Tibetans inside China. Instead of accepting the fate that China would lord over them for ever and their people and culture would be consigned to the history books soon, this will give those Tibetans renewed hope, that there is a way out of the prison.

Just some thoughts!

[Philip]

This thread is developing wonderously! What great ideas are now flowing from "BRitons"!
The idea of the Tibetan Govt. in Exile passing a resolution whereby they become an Indian "protectorate" or even "unon" with India,is not an impossibility.Ths might happen during or after the reign of the DL.

Inviting the DL as chief guest to a Republic Day Parade is the first step.This wlll have a tremendous effect worldwide.Which nation ,especially wstern nations will dare not to attend our Republic Day Parade where a Nobel Prize wnner and the acknowledged head of the Tibetan people is chief guest? Even countries who feel that Tibet should be under the Chinese,acknowledge the DL's supremacy over his people.By inviting him,India sends the world a superb message.HH the DL is a "head of state",apart from being a world religious head,much as the Pope is the head of all Catholics and the Vatican is also recognised as a "state".The Pope at this very moment is in Britain on a "state visit".Tibet is far larger than the Vatican city state and hough there are various factions in Christianity,the Pope is still acknowledged as being the most important Chrstian leader,so too is HH the DL in Buddhism!

Now in further strengthening this strategy,we must bring in the Taiwanese.If the Tiawanese can be persuaded to accept HH the DL as temporal and spiritual ruler of Tibe,then the PRC will be really up the spout.India and Taiwan both recognising HH the DL as supreme ruler of Tibet,wih the Tbetan GIEx. "joining" India, will give it a stamp of legality for both Taiwan and Tibet! Therefore,we must begin a covert dialogue wth both the Tibetan diaspora and the Taiwanese in order that this happy event comes about.The TIbetans and Taiwanese have nothing to lose but their "captivity" and India gan a massive diplomatic victory,far greater in scale and immensity than China's in '62.As I said in the "China" thread,we must keep the Chinese within the Himalays and the Pacific,turning around in full measure,China's attempts to
keep India imprisoned below the Himalayas.China thus becomes the "nut" between the Indo-Tibet,Taiwan nutcracke!

PS:Watch how thw two major nuclear powers are slowly restorng ties both afeared of Islamic terrorsm and (unspoken) China's massive military.energy and territorial ambitions.

....especially now when our two countries confront many similar security threats and challenges," Gates said at the signing ceremony

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/ar ... Rhhr25z-rQ

Xcpts:

US, Russian defense chiefs promote deeper ties
By Dan De Luce (AFP) – 19 hours ago

WASHINGTON — US Defense Secretary Robert Gates and his Russian counterpart Anatoly Serdyukov vowed to expand military cooperation on Wednesday, in a sign of improving relations between Moscow and Washington.

In the first visit to the Pentagon by a Russian defense minister in five years, Serdyukov was greeted with military pomp before heading into a full day of talks with Gates.

The high-profile visit carried important symbolism and reflected a much-touted "reset" of relations between the former Cold War foes over the past year, with the two sides forging common ground on the war in Afghanistan, arms control and Iran's nuclear program.

Gates and Serdyukov signed two documents designed to deepen military ties, including a memorandum on cooperation -- replacing an outdated 1993 accord -- and a plan to form a defense working group that will meet every year.

The memorandum "underscores that defense cooperation is an important element strengthening the wider US-Russian relationship, especially now when our two countries confront many similar security threats and challenges," Gates said at the signing ceremony.

Serdyukov said he hoped his visit "will provide a very powerful impetus to the development of the relationship between our nations."

President Barack Obama's administration needs Moscow's permission to allow the US military and NATO to move troops and supplies across Russian territory for the war in Afghanistan.

The deal has eased the pressure on supply routes through restive areas in Pakistan, and Gates was expected to express appreciation for Russia's assistance, officials said.

The US has also struck deals with countries across Central Asia to allow access to air fields and supply lines for the mission in Afghanistan, where nearly 100,000 US troops are deployed.

The Russian daily Nezavisimaya Gazeta, citing defense ministry sources, said on Wednesday the Kremlin expected Serdyukov to discuss the "division of spheres of influence" in central Asia and the south Caucasus during his visit.

"In particular, Moscow is no longer against a wider presence of NATO military contingents in the post-Soviet space," the report said.

Serdyukov told reporters the sensitive issue of missile defense was discussed, but gave no indication if Moscow might be ready to participate in a US-led system designed to thwart a possible ballistic missile attack from Iran.

US officials have invited Russia to join in the network of anti-missile radars and interceptors, suggesting that Moscow could cooperate in the use of a radar site in Azerbaijan.

Gates and Serdyukov were due to hold three formal meetings as well as a working dinner on a US Navy vessel on the Potomac river, Pentagon press secretary Geoff Morrell said.

With the Pentagon rolling out the red carpet for Serdyukov, analysts said the visit demonstrated the two governments were serious about strengthening ties.

"As a signal of the 'reset,' having the defense ministers meet is huge," said Olga Oliker, senior international policy analyst at the Rand Corporation think tank.

[Pratyush]

Philip + 1

[RajeshA]

We should also consider how all this could affect the CPC, the Chinese people, the netizens, and the Zhonghua minzu (the theory of Chinese people).

The CPC has presented to the people a certain version of Tibet and Dalai Lama - Tibet is rightfully theirs and Dalai Lama is a prick. Its only when Tibet becomes a disputed territory between China and India, that people in China would start debating the legitimacy question, thereby getting exposed to the Tibetan and Indian view as well. Even the most nationalistic of Chinese netizons would be exposed to the conflicting versions of history.

This in fact would create a constituency of dialog between Chinese people and Indians for the first time at this scale, allowing a certain seeding of our demonic, subversive, democratic and Dharmic ideas amongst the Chinese people.

Who knows, this could give way to a both fresh thinking on the question of a new political system for China and promotion of a better understanding between Indians and Chinese people.

[RajeshA]

Now in further strengthening this strategy,we must bring in the Taiwanese.If the Tiawanese can be persuaded to accept HH the DL as temporal and spiritual ruler of Tibe,then the PRC will be really up the spout.India and Taiwan both recognising HH the DL as supreme ruler of Tibet,wih the Tbetan GIEx. "joining" India, will give it a stamp of legality for both Taiwan and Tibet! Therefore,we must begin a covert dialogue wth both the Tibetan diaspora and the Taiwanese in order that this happy event comes about.The TIbetans and Taiwanese have nothing to lose but their "captivity" and India gan a massive diplomatic victory,far greater in scale and immensity than China's in '62.As I said in the "China" thread,we must keep the Chinese within the Himalays and the Pacific,turning around in full measure,China's attempts to
keep India imprisoned below the Himalayas.China thus becomes the "nut" between the Indo-Tibet,Taiwan nutcracke!

+1

Posted earlier

KMT needs to rescind its views on tibet and arunachal first - publicly

I think it would be far easier to revise the policy position on Arunachal, then to pronounce Tibet not a part of China. That would be a big step, as it would carry an anti-nationalist touch. KMT can also simply proclaim, that they recognize all those parts of China as China, over which they ruled, before the KMT were pushed out of China. As KMT wishes to speak for all Chinese - PRC + Taiwan, their proclamation would be looked as anti-national by the mainland Chinese, and any support they may have on the mainland could evaporate.

They may however do it, if India offers them diplomatic recognition.

Posted earlier

KMT needs to rescind its views on tibet and arunachal first - publicly

Somewhat complicated for the KMT to do - as I was saying some days back, it is tied up in historical binds, and undoing one requires undoing others (remember that not too long ago, the KMT maintained a fictitious Chinese senate in Taiwan - with senators representing provinces of China that they had never set foot on). Which is to say that a pragmatic engagement with right shade of KMT types is feasible. Having said that, KMT is not the best option for India - the DPP is infinitely better....

India should offer Taiwan an enhanced political recognition in lieu for their recognition first of Tibetan Independence and then Tibetan Accession to India. They may accept!

[munna]

A very subtle and unique hit as of now will be to allow the Taiwanese Economic and Cultural Centre officials to apply for CD and CC series blue diplomatic number plates for their official cars.

[RamaY]

Allow me to clarify. First I said Karma is not real. Then what I meant was, even if it is real, by your epics, it doesn't give collective punishment.

But I agree, we digress. Last OT post from me.

TM: you are getting confused (intentionally or by belief) between basic intolerance and intolerance against that intolerance. This thread is against the first kind of intolerance.


the whole Asura race paid for what Ravana did.

That is a building block of Indic family system. YOU ARE NOT ALONE. You = you as in your ego + your past and future lives + your family + your clan + your lineage + whole humanity + all visible and invisible universe + PARAM.

That is the root of the emphasis on Dharma. That is why it is one's dharma to fight against evil and destroy (killing is temporary in this concept) it forever by reestablishing Dharma.

For example, Mao's cultural revolution is an Adharmic implementation of it. Why it is adharmic? Because it begets intolerance by it's very existence.

P.S: I hope I am in topic as we are taliking about a Dharmic HHDL. That is why HHDL sounds the way he sounds.

[RajeshA]

P.S: I hope I am in topic as we are taliking about a Dharmic HHDL. That is why HHDL sounds the way he sounds.

Like for any Presidential 'Candidate', it is fully appropriate to shed light on HH DL's beliefs and achievements.

[Venkarl]

..That is a building block of Indic family system. YOU ARE NOT ALONE. You = you as in your ego + your past and future lives + your family + your clan + your lineage + whole humanity + all visible and invisible universe + PARAM....

RamaY garu.....a bunch of Indian spiritual books condensed in one line....well put..thanks.

[krisna]

^^^^
RajeshA,

For all the above HHDL need not be the president of India.
This is a not a bright idea. We should not involve him in politics of India for now. Let him be the spiritual guide of Tibetans. It can divide Tibetans and Indians when we want unity.

WRT to the instrument of accession who will sign the treaty-
1) HHDL- he wants autonomy or independence. Not merger. Even if he agrees what then--- because of 2)
2) Tibetans should agree to this proposal-- ie both from in India ,Tibet(under chinese control) and Tibetans all over the world. They will likely not agree. We don't want a war among Tibetans in India. India will have one more problem along with others. China will gladly meddle in Indian affairs instigating some tibetans against this. Some tibetans want full independence and some agree with HHDL. No one wants Indian interference other than helping them in freedom. They will be friendly to us no doubt but asking for merger-
we want to cause takleef to chinese and not to India.

Overall this is not another bright idea. The time has not come now. This is another self goal.

Question to all BRFites who agree on making HHDL as president of India and sign the instrument of accession to Indian union
1) Is HHDL a citizen of India?
2) what is the status of Tibetan refugees wrt to Indian citizenship?
3) How many have got the citizenship?
4) what is the reason behind this?

The reasons might be helpful in delineating our dealings with Tibet and china.

I will answer some of the questions I posed here. Answers are from google chacha.
1) HHDL is not a citizen of India.. Hence he cannot be the president of India as he is not a citizen of India.The day he acquires Indian citizenship it will be betrayal of Tibet issue. Though he is revered by milions of tibetans, they feel betryaed if he accepts Indian citizenship. His hold will lessen on them which will be detrimental to India Tibet relationship in the long run.
2) Tibetan refugees are around 100000 and more. As per the Indian citizenship act many are eligible for Indian citizenship.
3) Less than 3% are Indian citizens.
4) There is a general belief among Tibetans that they are in India temporarily and they will eventually return to Tibet.
Despite staying in India for over 2 generations they still consider themselves as temporary guests and eventually want to return to Tibet. Asking HHDL to join Indian union is a bit premature.
Yes we can help them in many ways as many of you have posted but not the above 2 ones.
wishes are one and realities are another. Hoper we dont mix the two and muddle ourselves.

[RajeshA]

Question to all BRFites who agree on making HHDL as president of India and sign the instrument of accession to Indian union
1) Is HHDL a citizen of India?
2) what is the status of Tibetan refugees wrt to Indian citizenship?
3) How many have got the citizenship?
4) what is the reason behind this?

The reasons might be helpful in delineating our dealings with Tibet and china.

I will answer some of the questions I posed here. Answers are from google chacha.
1) HHDL is not a citizen of India.. Hence he cannot be the president of India as he is not a citizen of India.The day he acquires Indian citizenship it will be betrayal of Tibet issue. Though he is revered by milions of tibetans, they feel betryaed if he accepts Indian citizenship. His hold will lessen on them which will be detrimental to India Tibet relationship in the long run.
2) Tibetan refugees are around 100000 and more. As per the Indian citizenship act many are eligible for Indian citizenship.
3) Less than 3% are Indian citizens.
4) There is a general belief among Tibetans that they are in India temporarily and they will eventually return to Tibet.
Despite staying in India for over 2 generations they still consider themselves as temporary guests and eventually want to return to Tibet. Asking HHDL to join Indian union is a bit premature.
Yes we can help them in many ways as many of you have posted but not the above 2 ones.
wishes are one and realities are another. Hoper we dont mix the two and muddle ourselves.

There is a gap in our understanding of the context, in which the proposal for HH DL's candidacy is being made.

1) It is of course clear to both of us, that HH DL is not an Indian Citizen. So dwelling on this fact is a non-issue. It is not relevant to the proposal. Relevant is how can he become an Indian Citizen. Now your assumption is that it is through the standard procedure of naturalization, that exists in the Indian Citizenship Act. That is not what I am saying. I am showing a different path to Indian Citizenship.

3) So there may be just 3% Tibetan Refugees who are Indian Citizens. Others are not. But I am not asking anybody to become Indian Citizen through the Indian Citizenship Act. There is a different path.

4) The Tibetans consider themselves as temporary guests, because we too consider them temporary guests, and considering that Tibet is a different land outside India, there was no reason to think otherwise.

The path to Indian Citizenship for all Tibetans goes not through the current Indian Citizenship Act but through a formal Merger Act between Tibet and India, overseen by the Tibetan Parliament in Exile, DD HL himself, perhaps a referendum amongst expatriate Tibetans and Indian Parliament. Once the merger is done, the Leader of the Tibetan People, HH DL can be elected as the President of India (Union of India and Tibet).

There are many aspects of such a proposal that need critical analysis, but citizenship is not an issue if the above mentioned proposal is implemented. If it is not, well then the question of HH DL's candidacy becomes mute.

[vera_k]

In the current context, the biggest hurdle in for Dalai Lama as President is that he is not a secular individual. Given that, there is no chance that Congress will accept such a proposal.

[RamaY]

Sri BR Ambedkar chose Buddhism against RoP and RoL in spite of many goodies they offered him.

HHDL is as secular as secularism can get. Even Rajmata cannot live if she denies HHDL on the basis of secularism.

[Atri]

This will be biting more than what we have. Secondly, this can be used as an example to make Sonia Gandhi as PM too. The highest positions should not be given to people who have acquired citizenships. The accession of Tibet to Indian union is an event for which India isn't ready.

When we are strong enough, I would then recommend ascension of Karmapa Lama to the post (after due accession act formalities). Till then, no. HH Dalai Lama has too many western interests vested in him. Dangerous for such person to make a president. Instead groom Karmapa for a decade or so, then make him whatever is best of long-term benefit of India and Tibet. I would trust that groomed Karmapa more than this HH Dalai lama.

[JwalaMukhi]

In the current context, the biggest hurdle in for Dalai Lama as President is that he is not a secular individual. Given that, there is no chance that Congress will accept such a proposal.

Pardon the bluntness, his age is also impediment. Wish he was younger. India should also be working with the next rung of leaders from Tibet. Dalai Lama is ok, but the next rung is critical in capitalizing and consolidating on any gains that may occur with the parleys. Strategy implementation is done over long periods. Basing on a single individual is only good for beach head. The subsequent cycles are done by working with the system and not individual who has been leveraged by other western powers.
P.S: Atriji, beat me to it. Precisely, that should be the thurst.

[Kanson]

Ok there is so much discussion on theory of electing HH DL as president. How about some facts..field facts about the willingness of Tibetian elites in annexing Tibet with India as Autonomous Region ? It is not a one way route.

In this aspect, i vaguely remember, Tibetian Prime Minister articulating the mutual prospectus of India & Tibet working together.

[Dhiman]

The path to Indian Citizenship for all Tibetans goes not through the current Indian Citizenship Act but through a formal Merger Act between Tibet and India, overseen by the Tibetan Parliament in Exile, DD HL himself, perhaps a referendum amongst expatriate Tibetans and Indian Parliament. Once the merger is done, the Leader of the Tibetan People, HH DL can be elected as the President of India (Union of India and Tibet).

I would just change the law explicitly stating that a person who can reincarnate himself as an Indian citizen is eligible to become president of India provided he otherwise meets all requirements for being an Indian citizen. Surely this is a unique situation, as the framers did not have a person who can reincarnate in mind while considering presidential eligibility requirements. That should rule out any Paki's for sure while allowing HHDL a path to president ship.

[RajeshA]

Secondly, this can be used as an example to make Sonia Gandhi as PM too. The highest positions should not be given to people who have acquired citizenships.

In the proposal, from a certain PoV HH DL does not 'acquire' Indian citizenship. Formulated differently, we are not changing his citizenship, we are changing the Indian State, so that it is India+Tibet.

Goa or Sikkim became parts of India on 19 December, 1961 and 16 May, 1975 respectively. The citizens of Goa and Sikkim became Indian citizens automatically. As far as I know, there is no impediment for any Goan or Sikkimese to become Indian President.

As far as Sonia Gandhi is concerned, she is a naturalized Indian citizen, and our Constitution as yet does not proscribe any naturalized Indian from holding any public office. Politically however it is not acceptable.

This will be biting more than what we have. The accession of Tibet to Indian union is an event for which India isn't ready.

Anybody watching the curve of relative strength of China and India, would not be holding his breath for India to get ready. The Accession of Tibet to India is a direct attack on that curve, to make it run differently. In fact Accession of Tibet is precisely for the purpose of giving India more teeth to chew better as we bite more.

When we are strong enough, I would then recommend ascension of Karmapa Lama to the post (after due accession act formalities). Instead groom Karmapa for a decade or so, then make him whatever is best of long-term benefit of India and Tibet. I would trust that groomed Karmapa more than this HH Dalai lama.

Karmapa Lama would just be the religious head of the Tibetan Buddhists. India is not interested in making the head of a religious order as President of India. He would never have been a regent in power. HH DL was in fact in power in Tibet before he had to leave and seek asylum in India. Karmapa Lama brings no legitimacy of a head of state, in a way that Dalai Lama brings to the table. Where Karmapa Lama may carry out some Buddhist ceremonies, only Dalai Lama stands for the symbolism of a subjugated Tibet, a Tibet forcefully occupied by China. HH DL really made that escape from Lhasa into India over the Himalayan mountains. Only he can be the connection between India and that land.

So in that sense Karmapa Lama is useless for India.

Till then, no. HH Dalai Lama has too many western interests vested in him. Dangerous for such person to make a president.

Soon West is not going to be our biggest worry, but rather China. It is in fact good that he has such good relations with Western leaders. That would give Tibetan Accession to India a lot more legitimacy. Anyway, Presidency of India is a symbolic position mostly, so there is a limit to the damage a person in that position can do. That HH DL would really want to do damage to India is, if I may say so, actually absurd.

[RajeshA]

In the current context, the biggest hurdle in for Dalai Lama as President is that he is not a secular individual. Given that, there is no chance that Congress will accept such a proposal.

Being the Head of the Tibetan Order of Buddhism, HH Dalai Lama has tried to become as secular as possible - not by rescinding his religion, or distancing him from it, but by leading a very active life in the service of inter-religious harmony. He has been an active participant in many world meets espousing religious tolerance. If anybody truly captures the essence of Indian Secularism, i.e. “equal respect for all religions”, then it is HH Dalai Lama.

Congress may have a problem with choosing an outwardly religious Hindu Leader as its nominee for President, but a preference for a Buddhist would not dent Congress's electoral considerations.

[James B]

For those who are asking if HHDL is a citizen of India or not, please see which passport he is using to travel to other countries - an Indian one or a special Govt-in-exile of Tibet's passport. That should settle any citizenship issues.

[Philip]

The citizenship issue is just mere technicalities.I give you the former Soviet Union.What was it?A union of several dfferent staes with different diverse ethnic and religious entities.They all accepted a supremo as head.Today these entities are now independent republics,but still most are part of the CIS.The SU route in a much smaller fashion,just between India and Tibet is what I popose.But what will give it extra teeth is if Taiwan also joins in in recognition ,establishing diplomatic relations wth Indo-Tibet and Taiwan is the "pretender" to the whole of China let's not forget and a truly democratic country unlike the PRC who rule through the jackboot and barrels of their guns! Taiwan's accepance of Indo-Tibet also gives it great strength in its claim to be representative of all of China.After all the KMT did rule over mainland China not too long ago and history has a knack of repeating itself in time.

[RajeshA]

Pardon the bluntness, his age is also impediment. Wish he was younger.

Here is a list of Presidents of India
NAME....................................SWORN AT AGE OF............HELD OFFICE TILL.............DIED AT AGE OF
Dr Rajendra Prasad..............................63..................................76................................78.........
Sarvepalli Radhakrishnan......................73...................................78................................86........
Zakir Hussain.....................................70...................................72................................72........(In Office)
Varahagiri Venkata Giri.........................75...................................80................................85.........
Fakhruddin Ali Ahmed...........................69...................................71................................71........(In Office)
Neelam Sanjiva Reddy..........................64...................................69................................83.........
Giani Zail Singh...................................66...................................71................................78........
Ramaswamy Venkataraman...................76...................................81................................98........
Shankar Dayal Sharma.........................73...................................78.................................81........
Kocheril Raman Narayanan....................76...................................81.................................85........
A. P. J. Abdul Kalam............................70....................................75................................**.........
Pratibha Patil.....................................72....................................**................................**.........

On 25th July, 2012 Dalai Lama would be 77, i.e. 7 months older than when R. Venkataraman became President, and being in good health, there is every chance that HH DL will live just as long.

When on 22 May 2009, Manmohan Singh was sworn in as Prime Minister he too was 77, and the job of a PM is by far more taxing.

So age is not an issue.

India should also be working with the next rung of leaders from Tibet. Dalai Lama is ok, but the next rung is critical in capitalizing and consolidating on any gains that may occur with the parleys. Strategy implementation is done over long periods. Basing on a single individual is only good for beach head.

Without the beachhead, nothing is going to work. The beachhead is crucial. And only Dalai Lama can give us a good beachhead. Otherwise I agree completely with you.

The subsequent cycles are done by working with the system and not individual who has been leveraged by other western powers.

HH DL has very good relations with most Western Leaders. Those relations would be crucial for India, when we want to sell to the world, that Tibet is legally a part of India. That is all the more reason, why the Western countries would not be able to refuse his standpoint.

[shiv]

"Yes" has more votes no

I voted no, BTW

[RajeshA]

"Yes" has more votes no
I voted no, BTW

Votes are changeable till 24th July, 2012. You have plenty of time to change your mind.

[RajeshA]

Ok there is so much discussion on theory of electing HH DL as president. How about some facts..field facts about the willingness of Tibetian elites in annexing Tibet with India as Autonomous Region ? It is not a one way route.

In this aspect, i vaguely remember, Tibetian Prime Minister articulating the mutual prospectus of India & Tibet working together.

Kanson ji,
the angle of Tibetan wishes and their thinking has not been dealt with yet. It is still an open issue.

Tibetans perhaps know best that wishing means little when one sees no support from others. Before anybody can put the offer to them, we Indians need to have given some thought to offering HH Dalai Lama the Indian Presidency and have built up some consensus amongst us - amongst Indians.

I mentioned in an earlier post:

HH DL did comment once, that India had a bigger right to Tibet than China.

[RamaY]

RajeshA ji

You got one more convert

[jamwal]

Voted yes. It's stupid as hell, but better than current posture taken up by India

[RajeshA]

Published on June 4, 2010
President Patil’s China Visit - Looking through the Bamboo Curtain by Bhaskar Roy: South Asia Analysis Group

The message from China is, therefore, the first shot impressing upon India to review its position on hosting the Dalai Lama and his Kashag (Cabinet). {Putting Pressure on India to throw out Dalai Lama} India has been given time to address this issue as China views, notwithstanding India’s recognition of Tibet as an integral part of China (2003), New Delhi is responsible along with the US and other Western countries, in keeping the Dalai Lama’s, “autonomous status for Tibet” argument alive. The critical issue is that India and Tibet share a common border which gives the Dalai Lama and his supporters in India access to Tibet.

The Wu Bangguo’s message suggests that China is aware of India’s core interest, that is Kashmir, and China can play with it. In a recent visit to Pakistan (May 24), Chinese Defence Minister Wu Guanglie assured Pakistan’s Defence Minister Ahmed Mukhtar that China would “continue to support Pakistan’s stance on different issues at every international forum”. {China wants to use pressure tactics}

It was a significant commitment from China. In the international fora, Pakistan’s positions are mainly on India – the Kashmir issue in particular, and the newly created water issue.

The Sino-Indian border issue is not an immediate issue for China. They are aware that they hold the key, and India has fallen into a mode to be dictated by Chinese designs. {The Chinese believe they have already subdued India on the border issue}

Whether India subscribes to the policy of the Dalai Lama card or not, China believes he is an instrument that India could use to destabilize Tibet seriously and break China’s integrity. And if one part breaks out of China the others will follow quickly especially Xinjiang, and Taiwan will be recognized as an independent country by the international community. China’s assessment to this extent may be correct because its integration of minority regions has been by force of arms to which the minorities do not subscribe. Taiwan has its own legalistic position to be an independent country.

India has to design its own response and be aware that it has to fight its battle on its own. It would be disastrous if Indian policy makers rely on powers like the US for arbitration. Washington has its own priorities with Beijing which does not include any other country and least India.

The Dalai Lama is an emotional issue with people of India and no Indian government can change this status. If China tries to force this issue on India, there will be no “win-win” situation between the two, but a “lose-lose” situation.

India and China are two gorillas living in the cage of Asia. There is enough room for the two, but not enough if one tries to usurp all the space.

China has to think beyond the Dalai Lama to upgrade relations with India, and wait for the post Dalai Lama scenario. Till now, there is no evidence that Beijing has been successful in winning over the minds of the Tibetans.

After relations 'improved' between India and China, the Chinese have drawn first blood in PoK on the question of Indian Territory. It is time for India to pay back.

[RajeshA]

His Holiness the Dalai Lama and Dr APJ Abdul Kalam sharing their thoughts
during a meeting at His Holiness's residence in Dharamshala, India,
on 2 January 2009.

The Two Presidents - Past and Future!

[shiv]

I still think "no" because I think Dalai Lama for President is like voodoo doll to give China takleef. It's an irritant - like stapled visa - but nothing more.

[RajeshA]

I think Dalai Lama for President is like voodoo doll to give China takleef. It's an irritant - like stapled visa - but nothing more.

It is also to laugh in the faces of the Chinese when they make claims on Indian land based on their claim that Tibet belongs to them. The ungali goes much deeper than a irritation.

[shiv]

I think Dalai Lama for President is like voodoo doll to give China takleef. It's an irritant - like stapled visa - but nothing more.

It is also to laugh in the faces of the Chinese when they make claims on Indian land based on their claim that Tibet belongs to them. The ungali goes much deeper than a irritation.

True - but I think India needs to perform a whole slew of things to irritate China in the same genre as the bench-odd behavior of stapled visas. Making shrill noises about Tibet, releasing a stamp in memory of those people China has suppressed and other symbolic things.

The other thing I would like to see - but OT here is a strong protest aimed at Pakistan regarding Chinese troops in POK. They have been there for a decade and no protest? Why the big hullabaloo now?

[RajeshA]

OT here is a strong protest aimed at Pakistan regarding Chinese troops in POK. They have been there for a decade and no protest? Why the big hullabaloo now?

"whine start"
The problem is GoI seems to be obsessed with a world-view of

• "By the Book"
• "Status Quo"
• "Peace at all Costs"

Because this is the path that requires the least Leadership Qualities amongst our Leadership. This is the straitjacket the GoI wears and passes on to the next government. Selig Harrison type reporting can bring their and the nation's whole man ki shanti to an abrupt shock, and then the public will demand some leadership qualities from them, whose absence is their little secret.
"whine end"

So knowing that the GoI cannot think beyond this thinking, the proposal on this thread is to give GoI a slightly bigger straitjacket, so that they have a little more space for maneuvering, and may be, just may be they can wiggle themselves out.

[RajeshA]

yogi ji,

Please vote as you like. I would request you to read the thread though, in case you have not done it. Similar concerns were raised earlier as well.

[BijuShet]

I dont agree with the premise of this vote but still voted yes. I am enjoying the takreef caused by this flight of fantasy.