Civil Aviation Development & Discussion

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 14 Oct 2010 22:55

Singha wrote:sheesh and only 43 years old...I am 38 ... RIP brother.

Membership in the mile high club can be strenuous, no?

These guys lives are not all glamor.

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 25 Oct 2010 04:56

(Deleted original.) T3 frankly sucked. Immigration counters all crap. There is going to be major chaos there . It's stupid to think that space will cater to major traffic. i saw people outside the terminal lifting whole pieces of luggage..because there are no ramps once anyone exits!!!!!

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 28 Oct 2010 19:59

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/acts- ... e/703632/0

Acts of independence
Sunil Jain
Thu Oct 28 2010

An independent aviation regulator to replace the Directorate General of Civil Aviation that currently reports to the aviation ministry, and which can even act as an arbiter on disputes over airfare is in the works, the head of the DGCA announced a few days ago. A few months prior to this, almost three years after the Petroleum and Natural Gas Regulatory Board (PNGRB) came into being, the government finally notified the critical Section 16 which allows the board to license gas pipelines and city gas networks — in the absence of this critical section, it was virtually toothless and found its actions being successfully challenged in the high court. The selection committee

for choosing the head of the Competition Commission of India (CCI) is headed by none other than the Chief Justice of India. And, as reported two days ago, there is a move to give a uniform tenure to all regulators.

hnair · Post by **hnair** » 30 Oct 2010 02:32

Nice article on Kerala's civil aviation history

Kerala celebrates 75th anniversary of civil aviation

Kerala is today celebrating the 75th anniversary of the launch of civil aviation service in the State, which started with a royal touch on this day in 1935 when a plane of Tata Airlines flew in here with the patronage of the erstwhile prince of Travancore late Chithira Tirunal Balarama Varma.

The DH.83 Fox Moth aircraft, owned by patriarch of the Tata house, late J R D Tata, landed at the small airport at Chaakka on the outskirts of Thiruvananthapuram, with two passengers and a bundle of mail from Mumbai.

What is sad is the current State Govt and Central govt not inaugurating the new terminal over some political tiffs. Saw the insides recently, TFTA.

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 04 Nov 2010 19:51

QANTAS grounds A380 fleet after engine explosion on SIN SYD flight http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-new ... 17ffh.html

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 04 Nov 2010 19:54

First world Qantas defintely has major problems with maintenance procedures

Of course they will try to blame this on Airbus

But its interesting to note that Qantas has had a bunch of maint issues over the last few months with diff aircraft.

BTW 3 weeks ago I got to fly in the A 380 - loved it- truly amazing how this massive beast makes so little noise

niran · Post by **niran** » 05 Nov 2010 06:20

Surya wrote:First world Qantas defintely has major problems with maintenance procedures

Of course they will try to blame this on Airbus

But its interesting to note that Qantas has had a bunch of maint issues over the last few months with diff aircraft.

Qantas grounds A380s

Australia's Qantas Airways, which has never suffered a fatal jet crash in its 90-year history, said it was grounding all six of its A380s following the incident.

Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce said the plane had experienced "a significant engine failure" to one of its four Rolls-Royce Trent 900 jets. The British engine maker pledged to work with Qantas to identify the problem.

The four other airlines that fly the world's largest passenger plane -- Singapore Airlines, Air France, Emirates and Lufthansa -- all said they had no plans to ground their own fleets.

But Airbus and Rolls-Royce later advised Singapore Airlines, which uses the same engine model as Qantas in its A380s, to conduct technical checks on its aircraft.

and icing on the cake

Airbus, which is betting its future on the commercial viability of the double-decker plane, said the Qantas incident had been "significant" but stressed the A380 was safe to fly on three engines.

oh!yeah! i can hop on one leg, so why i need 2 legs, silly me, getting tense and anxious to lose me one leg.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 06 Nov 2010 16:15

if the 747 can manage it back home in a crisis on one engine, perhaps the A380 can also limp back one one engine - but then whatever misfortune causes the shutdown of 3 engine will likely have other side effects like damaging the wing severely so its a moot point.

will be fun to see the Ukstan(RR) and Aus(Quantas) trying to pin the blame on one another. probably will take SIA + Emirates to crack some heads together and ferret the real truth out.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 07 Nov 2010 09:11

well the German press is siding with the Aussies

http://www.spiegel.de/international/bus ... 63,00.html

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 07 Nov 2010 18:32

That much salary, much better than some IT cos pay, and they still dont work.

Attitude problem: Staff conduct remains a concern http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 881692.cms

Come September 2011 and Kolkata will get a world-class terminal. But will the service be of a global standard to match the steel-and-glass palace? That's not just a query from a typically cynical Kolkatan disgusted with the way the public sector functions, but is a major concern that even officials at Airports Authority of India are nursing.

"There is absolutely no doubt in our ability to deliver a terminal that can be benchmarked with the best internationally. But that is only in terms of infrastructure. The competence with which airport staff provide service to passengers will actually decide whether it is recognized as a world class facility or not," said a senior airport official.

Given the present work culture, or its absence among a section of the staff, it is a cause for worry for AAI. With less than a year to go for the terminal to be commissioned, staff attitude has been anything but inspiring.

Ever ready to fight for their rights while shirking their duties, work culture in the state sector has assumed a whole new meaning at the airport. Unkempt and shabby, they hang around in union rooms and canteens during work hours, chat loudly and break into guffaws in public, stare at women and pass snide comments at men, and behave as though they are doing a favour and not duty by occasionally attending to work.

"During the morning rush hour, there is an inevitable shortage of baggage trolleys at the departure gate because the attendants will round them up only when they wish to and not when there is a requirement. Once I tried to point it out to a staffer and he snapped back. I did complain to the airport manager but he wasn't apologetic either. I don't think people are sensitized to passenger needs like they are elsewhere," said Burrabazar businessman Raj Singhania.

Inside the domestic terminal, it is a mess in the early morning when 25 flights depart between 5.30 am and 7 am. During this crucial period, there are 14 men and five women for the entire terminal. Around half of them are in the departure area to clean up hundreds of tea and coffee cups and empty packets of snacks littered by 2,500-3,000 passengers. It's a Herculean task. So they don't work at all.

"Till 8 am, the domestic terminal is littered with cups and packets. It is only when officers arrive that things get going," said Shekhar Bose, who frequently travels in the morning. It is only later that the brooms and dusters appear. Till then, its chit-chat time.

Toilets are no better. Most of them were refitted with new sanitaryware a couple of years ago. But they have become stained due to lack of upkeep. In the morning, the floor is wet and dirty. Janitors are present but hang around in corners, discussing politics. "The toilets are always full. By the time we clean up one stall, the next is dirty. It is easier to do a thorough cleaning at the end the rush," said a janitor, adding that the stains were owing to high iron content in the water.

Airport officials are fed up with a section of the staff. "Some employees have to be coaxed as though work is not duty. You can't say anything beyond a point for fear of the union stepping in. A stir can cripple services," said an official. The 800-odd Group C and D staff earn gross monthly salaries of `18,000 to `32,000.

But it is not them who cause the biggest headache for officials. That is reserved for the 500-odd contractual staff, who include trolley attendants and bird chasers. Unlike elsewhere, these unionized contract workers at the airport are better off than permanent employees as they cannot be chargesheeted or their services terminated. "We can change a contractor but not the staff. The employees are simply transferred to the next contractor. Until this nexus is cracked, it will be impossible to deliver quality service," said an official.

This is crucial because AAI needs to engage professionals to manage the new terminal. "The intelligent building we are developing cannot be managed by the current crop of staff unless they change their mindset and upgrade their skills. This huge facility has to be maintained by gadgets like mobile sweeping carts. The men also need to be smart, presentable, courteous and efficient," said an official.

Unfortunately, union leaders refuse the need to move with the times and insist all is well. Airports Authority Employees' Union secretary Dipankar Ghosh said there was no need for a familiarization trip to the Mumbai, Delhi, Bangalore or Hyderabad airport to see how they do the job.

"Our people know the job well. The only problem is staff shortage and the crying need to augment manpower. The number of employees has not changed since the terminal became operational in 1995, though passenger count has gone up from 5,200 a day to 23,000. In October, 28,000-30,000 passengers used the terminal daily. That translates to a six-fold increase in work," he pointed out.

Though AAI has a training schedule lined up for the staff as some of them can be deployed at the integrated terminal once the current international terminal shuts down, there will still be a need for several hundred service personnel at the new facility. AAI officials are keen on engaging professional facility management firms for the terminal's upkeep.

"The work culture in a government office is different from a private one, primarily due to job security in the former. It also varies from region to region. The output of an airport staffer is 35-40% less than at Mumbai or Bangalore airport. And there is no comparison whatsoever in attitude and presentation," said an airport official.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 07 Nov 2010 20:49

^^
They can solve this problem quite easily. Get rid of the "Hire but don't fire" policy. If someone is not doing their job right, warn them once, then fire them if they don't improve. The arrogant airport staff will shape up in no time.

Sachin · Post by **Sachin** » 07 Nov 2010 22:44

nachiket wrote:They can solve this problem quite easily. Get rid of the "Hire but don't fire" policy.

The whole catch here is that if some one is fired the union would step in and start creating so much ruckus that the Airport may not even be able to function. I don't think there is a "Hire but don't fire" policy especially with regards to contractors. But nobody can do the firing part avoiding the wrath of the unions. Looks like people in West Bengal (and unfortunately the passengers who land at the air port) are now getting the just medicine for repeatedly voting in communist governments

.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 08 Nov 2010 12:28

Visited the T3 Delhi, last night. Majorly disappointed with the concept and execution of the multi level Parking lots.

1) You have to make the payment insede the lot.
2) on the exit you need to insert the parking ticked in the slot.

The grouse is that if there is some problem with the slot on the exit then you have no ability to redress the situation. ie you will have to reun 1/2 Kms and then re do the whole transaction.

The parking of T1 is much better.

Another issue is the link between the T3 and the parking. The human conveyour belt system is nice. But for those inclined to walk. The tiles installed are so smooth that ones shoes don't get any grip. Mind you was wearing the Power shoes for running. Feet kept on slipping.

Would have prefered the SDRE cemented floor. But since Yndia id going the TFTA way. They are justified in puting the tiles.

Now, coming to the terminal it self. It looks a whole lot TFTA as compared to the SDRE T2 but at some places the ramps are begining to crumble. In that respect the old T2 was a better structure. A whole lot more rugged for ze Indian public.

Many of the stalls on the ground floor were unoccupied. But the place was clean and spacious. In that respect it was great. Would love to see it operate at full capacity.

Vasu · Post by **Vasu** » 11 Nov 2010 13:23

meanwhile, back at the farm.......

Revised Navi Mumbai airport plan likely to get green nod

The Navi Mumbai airport project appears to have passed the Environment Ministry's scrutiny after a key panel expressed satisfaction over the revised proposal submitted by project developer CIDCO (City and Industrial Development Corporation of Maharashtra Ltd.).

It now remains for Environment Minister Jairam Ramesh to take a final call.

Senior CIDCO officials also indicated that they were positive about an approval as no further issues remained pending, after months of going back and forth trying to formulate a project proposal that would meet green norms. Ecological concerns about the destruction of 400 acres of mangrove forests and a small hill, as well as the diversion of two rivers had delayed the environmental clearance.

Over the past year, the Environment Ministry were under pressure from the Civil Aviation Ministry and the Maharashtra government to push through the proposal. In early September, the Prime Minister's office intervened, forwarding a request from the Maharashtra Chief Minister to the Environment Ministry to expedite the project.

Accordingly, CIDCO was persuaded to compromise and draft a revised proposal, shifting non-aeronautical facilities such as hotels and shopping areas away from the original site. This meant that the mangroves, which provided crucial protection to Mumbai's coastal ecosystem, would be safeguarded.

Reducing the distance between the two runways from 1,835 metres to 1,500 metres will also ensure that the Gadhi river will not have to be diverted.

The Ulwe river is likely to flow underneath the airport site, according to the revised CIDCO plan.

joshvajohn · Post by **joshvajohn** » 15 Nov 2010 18:34

Minister wanted Rs 15-cr bribe for aviation permit: Tata
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/minis ... ta/711610/

There is an need for a war against bribe culture in India. Without which India will never grow and these individuals will never let grow. I hope Congress government will come heavily on those who take bribes at large scale and making the investor's life difficult to be part of investment in India.

sarkar · Post by **sarkar** » 15 Nov 2010 19:50

The mobile charger at Delhi Domestic terminal destroyed my Nokia N73's battery.
The battery swelled, and i guess few minutes more and it would have exploded.

Do not use the installed Multi Mobile Chargers there. Instead keep your own charger with you and plug it to any available socket.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 15 Nov 2010 22:58

joshvajohn wrote:Minister wanted Rs 15-cr bribe for aviation permit: Tata
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/minis ... ta/711610/

There is an need for a war against bribe culture in India. Without which India will never grow and these individuals will never let grow. I hope Congress government will come heavily on those who take bribes at large scale and making the investor's life difficult to be part of investment in India.

The three aviation ministers involved were

ghulam nabi azad

cm ibrahim

jayanthi natrajan.

Take your pick.

Not supporting Singapore airlines, but single individuals can and do still play a role in stymieing the economic progress of an entire nation a la spectrum raja.

We really do need a system of recalling our non performing or rogue MPs.

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 16 Nov 2010 00:26

^^^ Thats how they do things in desh.

I dont know if i should post the incident that happen during 92-94. Telco ministry is the most currupt

Vasu · Post by **Vasu** » 16 Nov 2010 18:12

amdavadi wrote:^^^ Thats how they do things in desh.

I dont know if i should post the incident that happen during 92-94. Telco ministry is the most currupt

Sure, why not??! Post it in the Telecom thread. Its a season for CONgress scandals. The more the merrier.

Sriman · Post by **Sriman** » 16 Nov 2010 21:30

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Pilot-doz ... 27183.aspx

Pilot dozed off, caused Mangalore air crash: report

The pilot of the Air India Express plane that crashed in Mangalore in May 2010 dozed off while flying the Boeing 737-800 aircraft, an investigation into the tragedy that killed 158 people has found. TV reports say the official probe into the crash found that one of the two pilots fell asleep on his
related stories

* Pilot error led to Mangalore crash
* 'Human error possible cause of crash'

seat on the flight on May 22.

I find it very hard to believe that the pilot was asleep during descent into the airport

Surely the other pilot would have noticed?

niran · Post by **niran** » 17 Nov 2010 06:58

Sriman wrote: I find it very hard to believe that the pilot was asleep during descent into the airport
Surely the other pilot would have noticed?

the report says

The Pilot was suffering from Sleep inertia

English translation the pilot was not fully awake during descent, as one grows
old one takes longer to be fully awake from deep sleep.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 17 Nov 2010 20:55

chetak wrote:
joshvajohn wrote:Minister wanted Rs 15-cr bribe for aviation permit: Tata
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/minis ... ta/711610/

There is an need for a war against bribe culture in India. Without which India will never grow and these individuals will never let grow. I hope Congress government will come heavily on those who take bribes at large scale and making the investor's life difficult to be part of investment in India.
The three aviation ministers involved were

ghulam nabi azad

cm ibrahim

jayanthi natrajan.

Take your pick.

Not supporting Singapore airlines, but single individuals can and do still play a role in stymieing the economic progress of an entire nation a la spectrum raja.

We really do need a system of recalling our non performing or rogue MPs.

Guilty conscience?? or seeking another 15 minutes of fame on TV

We should all demand that Tata stays quiet and does not name anyone. We may at least get rid of some cockroaches.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/audio-new ... 27118.aspx

Name minister or I’ll commit suicide, Ibrahim to Tata
November 16, 2010

CM Ibrahim, who was civil aviation minister in the HD Deve Gowda-led United Front government in 1996, on Monday reacted sharply to Ratan Tata's statement that he wanted to start an airline but could not because a minister demanded Rs15-crore bribe to clear his proposal. Ibrahim further claimed that it is because of his policies, the other domestic airlines were doing well but Tata criticized them during his tenure.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 18 Nov 2010 10:47

കോഴി കട്ടവന്റെ തലയില്‍ തൂവല്‍!! (The guilty one (of stealing a chicken) have a feather in his hair!)

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 22 Nov 2010 16:49

GVK and GOI/MHG need to deliver on this bigtime...already delayed....Mumbai needs a shakinah card on the high table.

Navi Mumbai airport gets environment clearance
Published on Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 15:11 | Updated at Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 16:24 | Source : CNBC-TV18

The much-awaited second airport in Mumbai is not a distant dream anymore. The proposed international airport at Navi Mumbai has got environment clearance, reports CNBC-TV18.

Addressing a press meet, Environment Minister Jairam Ramesh said that 85% of the people are happy with the environmental issues solved. Ramesh added that 161 hectares of mangroves will fall under Navi Mumbai Airport.

Navi Mumbai airport gets environment clearance

However, Gadhi river will not be diverted as length of runway is shortened.
“Impact of recoursing of Urmi river will be kept minimum while 90 metre high hill has to be removed,” Ramesh clarified.

On an optimistic note, Aviation Minister Praful Patel also said that the ministry had got a speedy disposal of pending issues. Patel said sternly that no compromise has been made on safety issues.

“Our joint responsibility is to address environment concerns. Shortening of runway is well within guidelines,” Patel reiterated.

---
and we need that trans harbour link across the upper end of the harbour being talked about for ages now. no more 2hr train ride to get to navi mumbai. peace and pragress must extend all the way down to alibaug (and damn the rich elites who have their farmhouses there) and all the way down to Ratnagiri !!

manish · Post by **manish** » 22 Nov 2010 20:50

Singha wrote:GVK and GOI/MHG need to deliver on this bigtime...already delayed....Mumbai needs a shakinah card on the high table.

Navi Mumbai airport gets environment clearance
Published on Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 15:11 | Updated at Mon, Nov 22, 2010 at 16:24 | Source : CNBC-TV18

The much-awaited second airport in Mumbai is not a distant dream anymore. The proposed international airport at Navi Mumbai has got environment clearance, reports CNBC-TV18.

Addressing a press meet, Environment Minister Jairam Ramesh said that 85% of the people are happy with the environmental issues solved. Ramesh added that 161 hectares of mangroves will fall under Navi Mumbai Airport.

Navi Mumbai airport gets environment clearance

However, Gadhi river will not be diverted as length of runway is shortened.
“Impact of recoursing of Urmi river will be kept minimum while 90 metre high hill has to be removed,” Ramesh clarified.

On an optimistic note, Aviation Minister Praful Patel also said that the ministry had got a speedy disposal of pending issues. Patel said sternly that no compromise has been made on safety issues.

“Our joint responsibility is to address environment concerns. Shortening of runway is well within guidelines,” Patel reiterated.

GD, GVK has nothing to do with the Navi Mumbai airport - they are in charge of CSIA and I don't think the same operator would get the second airport which would create a monopoly. The new one is supposed to go the PPP route with 74% going to a 'private partner' and the rest being held by GoMH and CIDCO(the nodal agency doing all the difficult/dirty project development going on now).

If you see Jairam 'I Love Huawei' Ramesh's statements above, it is clear that an H&D saving exercise for MoEF is underway - the initial objections to the airport from them were pretty strong and despite the presence of mangroves within the limits, the project got rammed down MoEF's throat. So much so that a special meeting of the concerned committee had to be convened and the approvals fast tracked.

These events should be indication enough that the 'private partner' is more or less firmed up and some sham tendering will be held to 'choose' the same later, once CIDCO finishes off the work that could potentially lead to bad PR.

The speed and the manner in which MoEF approval was won should open some eyes - especially when compared to the fiasco that less 'reGime-friendly' corporates like Vedanta faced.

You see, Delhi and Hyderabad are in GMR's kitty, Bangalore and Mumbai 1/CSIA is with GVK and Chennai is/will be under the 'other' Family (Marans/SpiceJet will defacto control the show - it will be their hub and knowing the way they operate in other businesses, nothing much to do there for others. Even if the proposed Sriperumbudur airport comes on stream, they will probably get it) - so that leaves....Mumbai. Now I wonder which other major industrial house would be so interested in aviation while having sufficient 'pull' required at various levels to pull off something of this magnitude

I wonder...

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 22 Nov 2010 20:59

The NaviMumbai Airport already yielded good money to builder lobby much before any serious work has started.

Areas that would cost Rs 300 - 600 sq feet is now any way around Rs 5000 - 6000 sq feet , the builder-politician lobby made a huge sum from this new airport.

It was almost impossible the Navi Mumbai airport would have moved any where and the way all party protested to this.

Who cares about the environment any way ?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 22 Nov 2010 21:09

isnt bangalore airport now with gmr rather than gvk - after stake sale by zurich apt corp ?

manish · Post by **manish** » 22 Nov 2010 21:29

Singha wrote:isnt bangalore airport now with gmr rather than gvk - after stake sale by zurich apt corp ?

Zurich sold its stake to GVK. GMR was never in the picture IIRC - Zurich, L&T and Siemens were the main players there.

GVK bought stakes from Zurich and L&T and plans to buy out Siemens too once their minimum lock-in period for their 40% stake expires. So they are currently the second largest stakeholder with 29% stake but with them doing most of the funding for the planned expansion works, their stake will only go up.

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 22 Nov 2010 21:32

I believe GVK will have the first right of refusal for the Navi Mumbai airport bidding. This had come up during privatization of mumbai airport, when there was apprehension that if a new airport came up at Navi Mumbai, those who bid with huge amounts for mumbai airport would lose out on their investment

manish · Post by **manish** » 22 Nov 2010 21:44

^^ You are right saar as that and the 'no second airport within 150km' thing was used by the greenfield airports such as BIAL/DIAL to deny new entrants a chance. But it is unlikely to be awarded to GVK so easily this time IMHO - perhaps it will go to a 'consortium' that includes GVK with other 'strategic' investors involved who are likely to buy them out later.

At this point it is purely uninformed CT-like speculation, but there have been some indications that some domestic corporate biggies are very interested. It is sure to get interesting!

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 22 Nov 2010 21:55

putnanja wrote:I believe GVK will have the first right of refusal for the Navi Mumbai airport bidding. This had come up during privatization of mumbai airport, when there was apprehension that if a new airport came up at Navi Mumbai, those who bid with huge amounts for mumbai airport would lose out on their investment

GVK will have the first right of refusal only if its bid is within a certain percentage (10% i believe) of the winning bid. Anything less then GVK will loose out.
From the initial 40 Million capacity envisaged the reports now have upped the capacity to 60 Million. With more then twice the CSIA area and two runways i think the ultimate capacity would go upto 80 Million.

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 22 Nov 2010 22:14

With the airport clearance coming in and work starting next month on the Navi Mumbai metro corridor, it will be interesting to see the rates for Kharghar area over the next couple of months.This Node in Navi Mumbai has been hyped up too much in the last 5 yrs with lot of new construction taking place.

neerajb · Post by **neerajb** » 27 Nov 2010 20:48

Three disk fragments damaged Qantas A380 systems

Two of the three sections of disk debris cut through two wiring routes and this damage subsequently prevented the shutdown of the adjacent outboard engine after the aircraft landed at Singapore.

Sources familiar with the investigation state that the crew "had to manage a dynamic situation" as the A380 sustained structural and systems damage in several other areas.

While all flight-control surfaces remained available in the pitch and yaw axes, roll control was affected although it continued to be available through the inner aileron on the left wing, and the mid- and inner aileron on the right wing.

Several spoilers - four on the left wing, and five on the right - were also able to contribute to roll control. These spoilers were those activated by the 'yellow' hydraulic channel, one of two hydraulic systems on the type.

Slats on the aircraft - which are linked to the 'green' hydraulic channel - were jammed in the retracted position but the flaps, which are connected to both channels, were available to the pilots.

Loss of the slats and partial degradation of the roll control led the A380's flight-control laws to revert to 'alternate', while 'normal' law was retained in the longitudinal and lateral axes.

"Flight envelope protections were still active," the source states.

As the aircraft returned to Singapore following the engine failure, the autopilot remained engaged until the jet descended to about 700ft at which point the crew took manual control of the aircraft, with the flight directors on.

This also included manual control of the three remaining operational engines on the stricken aircraft. Flaps were in position '3', one stage from full deployment, the normal configuration for approach. The landing took place about 1h 40min after the failure.

Normal braking was available on the fuselage landing-gear bogies, including anti-skid, while alternate braking without anti-skid was available on the wing landing-gear. "The crew modulated braking in order to stop close to emergency services," says the source.

Balls of Steel Required for Investigation of A380 and Its Engines
The Anatomy of the Airbus A380 QF32 near disaster
Comments section is real intresting.

Cheers....

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 27 Nov 2010 23:13

Marten wrote:Austin, your memory runs long since those rates are from 25 years ago. afaik, CIDCO owns almost all the land other than the 12.5% land given to the original villagers. Are you referring to areas in Gaothan plots or in Panvel? There has never been any area where residential plots were available at Rs 300. The lowest bid prices even in the gaothan plots were much higher. The lowest CIDCO allotment price in the past decade has been Rs 1,800. Society plots sold for much more.

The builder-politician nexus is very strong. While Ganesh Naik is the unchallenged king of the reti bandars (through either blasting earlier or by sand dredging later), there are a few other politicians who earned a large sum colluding with builders to soften the same environmental rules. They managed to build the famous Palm Beach Road in contravention of the then laws (since modified to accommodate more construction). Along this stretch, almost all builders rumoured to have paid Vilasrao large sums. RR has also been the beneficiary of a few plots further down in Khargar. btw, the rates on Palm beach for at least one building is quoted at Rs 7500psf. The older ones are slightly lower. In Kharghar, the AWHO quarters have long since been transferred to civilian buyers at huge profits (iirc the original allotment was at Rs. 1,200 + a few escalations and other charges that were levied out of sheer greed).

The prices in Panvel are up to Rs 4,000! India Bulls has a superb land bank in this area and smart folks benefited from the earlier Rs 2,250 booking rate. Not sure how much it is now, but those handful of integrated townships are excellent investments regardless of what people say. The area is close to future commercial hubs (with an agricultural produce airport coming up within 100 kms and of course JNPT so close by, and the Hinjewadi corridor in Pune growing richer by the year). Here's the disclosure as well: My family owns three properties that stand to gain very much from the airport and resultant improvements in an already well-planned and comfortable city.

PS: Palm Beach was sanctioned much earlier -- before VRD's time, but the sanctions and approvals for several builders came with his blessings.

Yes I think the 300 to 600 sq feet rate is almost 20 years old now , seems to me it was just yesterday

Indeed property prices in Navi Mumbai has touched and even crossed property prices in Mumbai suburbs and if one does not have to travel to Mumbai regularly then its good place to be ( minus the electricity and water problems that can get from bad to worse in summer ) but it is just a matter of time these thing will be resolved. I have yet to see the Palm beach road but have heard good things about it

Its a wise thing to invest in those areas and as years go by the prices will just go up exponentially , Navi Mumbai will just turn out to be a well planned mumbai.

I love plane spotting would love to have a place that just over looks the new Navi Mumbai Airport but that would just come at a premium.

Marten you seem to have good insight on Mumbai , so do you have any association with this place ?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 27 Nov 2010 23:28

heres another future concept from Russian stable ,Ecojet

Ecojet promises economy with three aisles

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 28 Nov 2010 09:23

IL-76 with all russian crew burst into flames after takeoff at Karachi , perhaps a terrorist attack ?

Russian-made cargo plane crashes in Pakistan, 8 crew dead

A Russian-made Il-76 cargo plane crashed early Sunday in a Karachi residential neighborhood, killing all eight crewmembers and destroying several buildings under construction, CNN reported.

The plane burst in flames shortly after a takeoff from the Karachi International Airport heading for Khartoum, Sudan, CNN cited local authorities as saying.

The Associated Press and Reuters later said that all eight crewmembers on board the plane were Russians,

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 28 Nov 2010 13:27

Austin wrote:IL-76 with all russian crew burst into flames after takeoff at Karachi , perhaps a terrorist attack ?

Russian-made cargo plane crashes in Pakistan, 8 crew dead

A Russian-made Il-76 cargo plane crashed early Sunday in a Karachi residential neighborhood, killing all eight crewmembers and destroying several buildings under construction, CNN reported.

The plane burst in flames shortly after a takeoff from the Karachi International Airport heading for Khartoum, Sudan, CNN cited local authorities as saying.

The Associated Press and Reuters later said that all eight crewmembers on board the plane were Russians,

More boxes of mangoes?

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 28 Nov 2010 14:03

Have some southern regional political party management techniques found its way into airline operations?

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 002955.cms

To pack in more, airline seats older kids on laps
Saurabh Sinha, TNN, Nov 28, 2010, 02.29am IST

NEW DELHI: Can an airline allow passengers to seat children on their laps – like infants – to pack in flyers beyond capacity? Shocking as it may sound, the government's aviation safety regulator warned a leading low-cost carrier after finding seven children had been seated on their parents' laps on a flight.

The Directorate General of Civil Aviation (DGCA) asked the airline to sack staffers who let grown up children fly as infants. While children up to two years of age can fly seated on a parent's lap, those between two and 12 years of age have to be given a seat as per safety norms and also for the comfort of fellow passengers.

The first-of-its-kind breach was brought to the DGCA's notice when a passenger on the flight complained to the DGCA that the plane had more people on board than seats. An inquiry, based on which the regulator has acted now, reveals that the situation arose on SpiceJet's Mumbai-Delhi flight (SG 103) on June 2, 2010. The airline was supposed to operate a Boeing 737-900 (VT-SGB) with 212 passengers and nine 'infants' at 12.45pm. At the last moment, the aircraft developed a snag and was replaced with a smaller Boeing 737-800 (VT-SPF), which has a seating capacity of 189.

As a result, 23 passengers were offloaded – 15 were adjusted in other airlines and eight cancelled their tickets. The plane took off with 189 adults and nine 'infants' at 4.46pm — a delay of four hours. A passenger did a manual count and mailed a complaint to the DGCA.

Sources in the new management of SpiceJet, recently taken over by Sun TV chief Kalanithi Maran, said: "The new management has acted on the DGCA report that fixed responsibility and heads of some senior people have rolled.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 28 Nov 2010 18:12

chetak wrote:More boxes of mangoes?

No it was on a humanitarian mission and Bird Strike is the likely cause { quite surprising for a 4 engine aircraft to just fall off the sky due to bird strike specially a rugged military aircraft }

Bird strike likely cause for cargo plane crash in Pakistan - airline

A bird strike is the likely cause for the crash of a Russian-made Il-76 cargo plane in Pakistan that killed all eight crewmembers on board, Dzhemal Tamazashvili, director of the Georgian airline Sun Way, the operator of the aircraft, said on Sunday.

The plane crashed early on Sunday in Pakistan's largest city Karachi. The plane burst in flames shortly after a takeoff from the Karachi International Airport heading for Khartoum, Sudan, and went down in an upscale housing complex for naval officers.

"Two weeks ago, in accordance with maintenance procedures, the aircraft underwent a technical check. It was in an ideal condition while the crew had an 18-hour rest before the flight. The likely cause was the damage of the aircraft engine caused by a bird strike," Tamazashvili said.

Tamazashvili said the plane had been leased by Sun Way and performed flights under the Individual Partnership Action Plan (IPAP) worked out jointly with NATO.

"The Il-76 plane, which carried a humanitarian cargo, fell 500 meters from the takeoff run," he said.

Pakistani TV channels reported on Sunday that at least 12 people had been killed on the ground as a result of the plane crash. Pakistani officials, however, have not yet confirmed this information.

A spokesman for Russia's consulate general in Karachi said that one of the crewmembers killed in the air crash was a Russian national while the other crewmembers were presumably Ukrainians.

ravar · Post by **ravar** » 01 Dec 2010 01:15

Lone co-pilot 'panicked' after putting Indian 737 into dive

Investigators have detailed an extraordinary event in which an Air India Express Boeing 737-800 was put into a steep dive moments after the captain was locked out of the cockpit.
India's DGAC attributes this to the co-pilot's adjusting his seat forward and inadvertently knocking the control column.
It adds that the 25-year-old co-pilot - who had 968h on type - claimed to have forgotten the procedure to return to the assigned flight level.
While none of the 113 passengers was injured during the 26 May event, there had been a commotion in the cabin as a result of the upset, with items spilling into the aisle.