Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - September 15, 2009

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 20 Oct 2009 22:29

harbans wrote:Sympathy is natural and as human beings there is something wrong if we don't feel compassion at the sight of grief.

Indeed and well said. Suppiah Ji, i agree with some points you make and agree i have little sympathy at Pakistan's plight, specially since this is what they plotted meticulously for us. If you see Paki's recieve very little sympathy even elsewhere in the world. However much we may ridicule Saudi barbarians and their medieval legal system, it grieves to see the Police pushing innocent school girls back into the school collapsing and burning in a fire, because they were not covered. Like all Germans or Japanese were not war criminals or Nazi's, we must remember there were even Army regulars in the German Army that plotted against Hitler and were executed promptly. Humanity exists in all sections of society and they are victims in the true sense. Even the German Army Officers that revolted/ plotted against Hitler. It is always ideology and it's institutional backers that one has to confront. I am appalled at the ideology of kufr, infidel and Jihad against unbeliever, but i won't say most Muslims don't have a humanitarian side. There is a distinction, albeit a subtle one and in the rhetoric or semantics it may be lost. At the end of the day, one reaps what one sows and the Paki's are reaping exactly what they have sown, so no sympathies on that count really. But in Pakistan there are plenty of victims, Ahmedia's, Baluchi's, Hindu's, Sikhs, Christians..and surely Muslims who've worked/ petitioned to release Indian prisoners languishing in Paki jails.

Agree with the above, but this natural sympathy also becomes a slippery slope of, "see we are victims also, so please don't complain when we send terrorists against you." Indians are in this sense more sentimental and tend to buy this fallacy more easily (BRF excepted).

The harsh truth is that, if you brew fire and poison in your house to hurl against your neighbor, it could also affect your own children. It hurts everyone to see children and innocents being hurt, but we cannot forget the basic moral depravity that put these innocents at risk in the first place, purely out of malice against India. These kids, who are victims today, are also being brainwashed to participate in the anti-Indian hate-fest that Pakistan calls its culture.

SBajwa · Post by **SBajwa** » 20 Oct 2009 23:10

Harbans!!

This is simple. You love muslims but hate Islam. You love the people but hate their idealogy and you tell them on their face. You really practice Insaniyat but not Islamiat. Since Islamiat is opposite of Insaniyat people who are practicing islamiat are by definition against insaniyat. They only practice insayniat inside their own group while you practice on a person to person basis without any regard to color, creed, sex, caste, economic, religion, etc classifications.

kshirin · Post by **kshirin** » 20 Oct 2009 23:34

I can't find any discussion on Kerry Lugar and any conclusions about its final shape after the browbeating by the Pukis and the explanatory memo on this august forum . Can anyone guide me please?

kasthuri · Post by **kasthuri** » 20 Oct 2009 23:40

Oct. 20, 2009: A pair of suicide bombers detonated their vests at Islamabad's International Islamic University, killing five.

Oct. 16, 2009: A pair of suicide bombers, including a female, attacked a police station and a building housing an intelligence service in Peshawar, killing 11.

Oct. 15, 2009: Terrorist assault teams attacked the Federal Investigation Agency building, the Manawan police training centre, and the Elite Force Headquarters in Lahore. Twenty-six people, including nine terrorists and 12 policemen, were killed.

Oct. 15, 2009: A suicide bomber rammed a car into a police station in Kohat, killing 11 people, including policemen and children.

Oct. 12, 2009: A suicide bomber detonated a car packed with explosives as a military convoy passed through a checkpoint in a market in Alpuri in Shangla. Forty-one people, including six security personnel, were killed in the attack.

Oct. 10, 2009: An assault team attacked the Army General Headquarters and took 42 security personnel captive. Eleven soldiers were killed, including a brigadier general and a lieutenant colonel, along with nine members of the assault team; and 39 hostages were freed.

Oct. 9, 2009: A suicide bomber detonated a car packed with explosives in a bazaar in Peshawar, killing 49 civilians.

Oct. 5, 2009: A suicide bomber entered the World Food Program office in Islamabad and detonated his vest, killing five UN workers, including an Iraqi.

My guess is that the dooms day inauguration was kicked off on Oct 5

CalvinH · Post by **CalvinH** » 20 Oct 2009 23:50

Shalav wrote:
Singha wrote:...but they seem to be content with status quo instead of aiming for a rich, steaky slice of baluchistan.
Can you think of any better outcome for amir khan than a separation of Irani baluchistan and then the addition of the baki baluchistan in due course of time? There's your direct access to CA's oil and gas right there.

A combined Baluch region (from Iran and TSP) doesnt have access to CA. Its bound by Iran and Afghanistan in the North. but the region has enough natural resources of its own and provides a good alternative for US to keep it forces closer to CA and Iran.

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 20 Oct 2009 23:55

Oct. 20, 2009: A pair of suicide bombers detonated their vests at Islamabad's International Islamic University, killing five.

Oct. 16, 2009: A pair of suicide bombers, including a female, attacked a police station and a building housing an intelligence service in Peshawar, killing 11.

Oct. 15, 2009: Terrorist assault teams attacked the Federal Investigation Agency building, the Manawan police training centre, and the Elite Force Headquarters in Lahore. Twenty-six people, including nine terrorists and 12 policemen, were killed.

Oct. 15, 2009: A suicide bomber rammed a car into a police station in Kohat, killing 11 people, including policemen and children.

Oct. 12, 2009: A suicide bomber detonated a car packed with explosives as a military convoy passed through a checkpoint in a market in Alpuri in Shangla. Forty-one people, including six security personnel, were killed in the attack.

Oct. 10, 2009: An assault team attacked the Army General Headquarters and took 42 security personnel captive. Eleven soldiers were killed, including a brigadier general and a lieutenant colonel, along with nine members of the assault team; and 39 hostages were freed.

Oct. 9, 2009: A suicide bomber detonated a car packed with explosives in a bazaar in Peshawar, killing 49 civilians.

Oct. 5, 2009: A suicide bomber entered the World Food Program office in Islamabad and detonated his vest, killing five UN workers, including an Iraqi.

Lets compare that to terrorist attack carried out by pakis on India for last several years. What pakis are getting isnt enough,and i am sure pious abdul wants to do more. Let moth eaten place burn in hell and thats what they deserve.

Rahul Shukla · Post by **Rahul Shukla** » 20 Oct 2009 23:57

Indian PM warns of imminent militant attack (Reuters)

"There are regular intelligence reports of imminent attacks in the country. This is a matter of deep concern, and there is no room for complacency," Prime Minister Manmohan Singh told a conference of the country's combined armed forces.

India has always accused Pakistan-based militant groups of orchestrating attacks on India and Singh told defence heads on Tuesday that both "state" and "non-state" actors were involved in militancy, without elaborating.

"We have, therefore, to improve our defensive mechanisms against all forms of terrorism, asymmetric warfare and aggravated militancy," he added.

r_subramanian · Post by **r_subramanian** » 20 Oct 2009 23:59

Now they are paying the price for playing with fire!

Punjab closes all educational institutions indefinitely
Government of Punjab has decided to close all private and government educational institutes without any further notice, Geo News reported Tuesday.
...
A notification regarding closure of the educational institutions will be issued soon.

link

kasthuri · Post by **kasthuri** » 21 Oct 2009 00:05

r_subramanian wrote: Punjab closes all educational institutions indefinitely

The money from KL bill can now be effectively used for buying the locks and bolts for those schools!!

r_subramanian · Post by **r_subramanian** » 21 Oct 2009 00:09

More good news about schools in Sindh and NWFP!
Sindh closes schools, colleges till Sunday
NWFP govt announces schools closure till Sunday

r_subramanian · Post by **r_subramanian** » 21 Oct 2009 00:20

I should have posted this prior to posting the news about scholls closure

Death toll hits 6 in Islamabad Islamic University twin blasts
The death toll in twin blasts at Islamic University Islamabad has hit six where two suicide attackers bombed a women's cafeteria and a faculty building Tuesday
...
At least 21 injured have been brought to PIMS hospital in the federal capital where many of them are in critical condition, authorities said. The injured included 14 girls among four said to be in serious condition.
...

link
The announcement of schools closure in Punjab, Sindh and NWFP is a consequnce of this blast, I believe

Shalav · Post by **Shalav** » 21 Oct 2009 01:29

CalvinH wrote:A combined Baluch region (from Iran and TSP) doesnt have access to CA. Its bound by Iran and Afghanistan in the North.

A'stan is already with amir khan.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Oct 2009 01:39

kshirin wrote:I can't find any discussion on Kerry Lugar and any conclusions about its final shape after the browbeating by the Pukis and the explanatory memo on this august forum . Can anyone guide me please?

i dont think the bill was changed. the cover note was there to save H&D, the bill remains the same. TSPA's new tamasha in stirring up the mehsuds and i am sure the iranians is the next ploy to neuter the KLPD

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 21 Oct 2009 01:55

Balochistan is a vital part of the access to Central Asia. But suggestions that the CIA will carve out a balochistan out of both Iran and Pakistan is premature. Such a balochistan will be kept unstable by both Iran and Pakistan for a very long time, and this will only complicate US's access to CA.
The US's best bet is to remain in Afghanistan, make Iran more receptive to US's needs or have the anti militancy stop in Pakistan.
Neither of the two seem to be happening. Although there are no reports to suggest this, but I wonder about the role that China is playing with the pakistan military to keep the anti US terror groups alive. The chinese merely have to fund the Pakistan military with defense goods for free, which they seem to be doing. China doesn't want either the US or India to access the CA oil, so that ultimately only Russia and China will be able to source it.

I think china's role is silent but very prominent within pakistan.

Lalmohan · Post by **Lalmohan** » 21 Oct 2009 02:18

Gagan wrote: I think china's role is silent but very prominent within pakistan.

hence not a huge surprise that the uighurs 'rose up' this year, and that they were brutally put down

Shalav · Post by **Shalav** » 21 Oct 2009 02:32

Gagan,

It's not my contention the US wants to do this. I had posted in response to Singha's musing about why Irani's are not using the Baloch - my theory is maybe because they are wary of stirring up trouble in their part of Baluchistan too.

Just like the Iraqi's the Turks and the Iranians w.r.t. Kurdistan.

animesharma · Post by **animesharma** » 21 Oct 2009 02:41

Lalmohan wrote:
Gagan wrote: I think china's role is silent but very prominent within pakistan.
hence not a huge surprise that the uighurs 'rose up' this year, and that they were brutally put down

I may be speculating, but is it a coincidence, or china's Kashmir card has to do something with instability of their pet?

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 21 Oct 2009 03:01

harbans wrote:At the end of the day, one reaps what one sows and the Paki's are reaping exactly what they have sown, so no sympathies on that count really.

Harbans: I'd like to believe this having been brought up in a belief system (like all of us) where dharma and doing the right thing is inculcated since birth. But the reality is that it is the U.S, wittingly or unwittingly, which is forcing the pukes to fight amongst themselves. This implosion might not have happened otherwise.

So, maybe the dictum needs to be modified to "one must be forced to reap what one sows". It doesnt seem to happen automatically.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 21 Oct 2009 03:38

animesharma wrote:
hence not a huge surprise that the uighurs 'rose up' this year, and that they were brutally put down
I may be speculating, but is it a coincidence, or china's Kashmir card has to do something with instability of their pet?

All of them wanted instability just enough that only India would be affected and that was the plan for 25 years. It worked fine and suited their(US, KSA, China, TSP) foreign policy and trade relations (Oil, goods, mfg).

That instability went out of control by late 1990s when they pushed hard to test how much it will change the social stability in the larger asian region (Central asia). It looks like they underestimated the social turmoil unleashed by the jihad promotion. This monster is now devouring the hand which created it.
Watch to see who is going to blink and give up. If there is no consensus to support afpak policy this can go uncontrolled for 50 years.

SureshP · Post by **SureshP** » 21 Oct 2009 04:08

Only in Pakistan.

Fm Quereshi's son is on Senator Kerrys's payroll.

Let's instead turn to a small housekeeping matter like: is Foreign Minister Qureshi's son working for Senator Kerry? Zain H Qureshi's (ZHQ) business card is circulating the cyberspace these days. It says that he is a legislative fellow in Kerry's Washington DC office. When I called up Kerry's office and asked for Qureshi, the voice at the other end immediately said, "He does not work for us". The woman appeared primed for such a question. She said she had received a similar query earlier that day. Incidentally the cell number on ZHQ's call card has been disconnected; while the mail box belonging to "Zain Qureshi" was "full!" So, I couldn't get to him.

After a number of phone calls to Senator Kerry's office, I finally found out from one of Kerry's male staffers that ZHQ did indeed work for Kerry but had now left. Why has ZHQ gone into hiding? Did he do something wrong? Yes. And the Foreign Office finds itself between a rock and a hard place. How can it condone its boss's act of getting his son a job with Kerry when the KLB talks were at a critical stage? Even if fate smiles upon ZHQ because he's the favoured son of our foreign minister and the doors of the high and mighty in Washington open up for him, we have the right to know whenever the son's job compromises his dad's position. More importantly if it is in direct conflict with Pakistan's interests.

Would you not call this a conflict of interest? Should the foreign minister resign? And if Zardari cannot afford to let him go, then the FM must seek a public apology.

The Boston Brahmin, Senator Kerry is complicit in this act. Boston Brahmins are New England's aristocracy like the Makhdooms of Multan, i.e. Shah Mahmood Qureshi and his tribe. These guys claim to fame is blue-blooded ancestry, wealth, influence and the right to rule.

http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=204217

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 21 Oct 2009 05:08

I resonate with members who think we need to keep our emotions under control when innocents are dying - even if they are dying in Pakistan.

And one must. Because that keeps you on the right side of Dharma. Thanks for the thumbs up Swamy Ji.

Agree with the above, but this natural sympathy also becomes a slippery slope of, "see we are victims also, so please don't complain when we send terrorists against you." Indians are in this sense more sentimental and tend to buy this fallacy more easily (BRF excepted).

Rao Ji, that sympathy i don't dole out to the Paki establishment and state. WKKs and left liberals doctrinally confuse the issue. BRF is not a left liberal site. Left liberalism is apt naturally in an environment where the right veers to unknown factors on it's right fringes. But where established parameters of doctrines and behavior prevail, left liberalism and associated attitudes play into the wrong hands.

This is simple. You love muslims but hate Islam. You love the people but hate their idealogy and you tell them on their face. You really practice Insaniyat but not Islamiat. Since Islamiat is opposite of Insaniyat people who are practicing islamiat are by definition against insaniyat. They only practice insayniat inside their own group while you practice on a person to person basis without any regard to color, creed, sex, caste, economic, religion, etc classifications.

Bajwa ji, the battle will always be ideology. Ideology defines which side of Dharma one is. Drona refused to teach Eklavya i am reminded by many who talk on India's caste..yet Drona however brilliant a Military strategist ended on the wrong side of Dharma. Yudhistra OTOH, was asked a last question on how a Brahmin is defined..a multiple choice type one. Y said on the basis of his deeds alone. That got him a ticket to heaven. The question was put IIRC by Yama in disguise himself.

Yes i believe Chinese are inherently wonderful people too, at the mercy of an ideology that brutalizes them too. Muslims are too and victims of an ideology that commits a minority of them to acts of violence against a humanity that has nothing against them except being and believing in something different. The individuals on all sides are victims too. Read again in this light what Krishna says in BG.."i am doing all this. You are just playing a role. I only take those on the side of Dharma to mine. And whenever Dharma is being destroyed, i shall manifest myself time to time to destroy Adharma. That is natural..Arjuna, you're just a tool"..

Once one understands that, one will understand who exactly is the enemy. Who exactly is the victim. And what exactly is Dharma. And what force levels are required to project the Dharma of compassion. And you know the irony of it all..my countermeasures against a nuke attack that kills a million of those that follow dharma, are infinitely more damaging than anyone here can imagine. I have put those views here once. Arjuna balked at Krishna advising him on that pending destruction. Lets define our compassion, our humanity..which by our Dharmic standards is more immense than any other creed on Earth has tolerated in it's history. We have and do have our aberrations, but we don't and will not politically implement those and strive to eliminate those from our society by law, education, literacy. These however unlike what the Western and Islamic media would like to project our exceptions and not the rule. The difference is becoming stark to all. US included.

Violating and trying to destroy the Dharmic path that Indic civilization has laid out in favor of half baked ideologies has to come to an end. India must develop economically to show that we can do what you do with more humane means than a cultural revolution the type that has killed a 100 million more than both WWs combined. It is not for no reason that India is in the roughest neighbour hood in this era at this period of time. It's not for no reason that Indians all over are disgusted by the wimpish leadership that we have today. We know we deserve better, and the nature of things says we will get it one day. Thats my article of faith..

*Sorry i originally posted this on the wrong thread*

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 21 Oct 2009 05:18

Harbans ji
You will be glad to know that no innocent has died in Bakistan so rejoicing at the demise of evil doers is very much khalis Dharmic.

kasthuri · Post by **kasthuri** » 21 Oct 2009 06:34

Troops face stiff resistance in South Waziristan

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 21 Oct 2009 06:47

SureshP wrote: Fm Quereshi's son is on Senator Kerrys's payroll.

Would you not call this a conflict of interest? Should the foreign minister resign?....
http://thenews.jang.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=204217

Yes, it is a major conflict of interest (if true). However, the CoF does not lie with Qureshi, but with John F Kerry, who employed the son of Pakistan's foreign minister to write a piece of legislation that gives billions of dollars to Pakistan.

I am hoping this gets picked up by the likes of Fox News.

BTW, nice tying the whole thing in with Boston "Brahmins".

(yes, I know what it means)

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 21 Oct 2009 06:48

Well one can be gratified by death visiting those who plan and send murderers and terrorists to kill and maim.

But I feel that for the people who's only guilt is sympathy with the Islamic causes - these days in pakistan that is terrorism, should not receive death as retribution. It is morally wrong.

The ordinary packee needs to have his wet dreams squeezed out of him by the very same terrorists turning on them and making life hell for them, but I personally don't like the killing that's involved in doing this.

Shalav wrote:Gagan,

It's not my contention the US wants to do this. I had posted in response to Singha's musing about why Irani's are not using the Baloch - my theory is maybe because they are wary of stirring up trouble in their part of Baluchistan too.

Just like the Iraqi's the Turks and the Iranians w.r.t. Kurdistan.

You're right and I concur.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 21 Oct 2009 07:17

Pakbarians can be classified as follows

Terrorists - ie those that explode themselves or use guns
Para-terrorists - those that provide shelter, do minor jobs but dont kill
Organisers/Financiers - those that identify themselves with the cause and fund them, provide ideological cover, moral guidance and so forth..
Sympathisers - those that identify themselves with the Islamist 'green flag in red fort and elsewhere' cause but have no money to finance so they come out in meetings and show their ugly faces that get captured in world media
Silent sympathisers - the office clerk, secretary, executive type that quietly or even openly rejoices when killings of kufrs take place but to preserve an 'image' among friends or public, they issue meaningless statements or words of sympathy to victims of terror. Sometimes they dont even bother, and try to justify it in terms of 'suffering/depravation/injustice' etc. I am sure everyone of us came across this type after 7/11 in offices across the globe.
The neutral - these are personally against terror but go along with the agenda because it is delivering them 'results' in terms of keeping India busy counting bodies. Once in a while they can issue 'we are a religion of peace' statement and wash their hands off the matter
The oppressed minority - you know who..the sikhs, hindus, christians who are stuck there without any power
The innocente - The real civilised amongst Paki Muslims who genuinely feel TSP's agenda, strategy, tactics and present course are wrong and either weep alone or try and do something about it. I do not deny this group exists, but it is so small, it is statistically a rounding error. Do not classify cricket players, movie stars, singers etc., automatically in this category, they could very well belong to 'Silent sympathiser' category, forced to put up public face of 'innocent'

Other than the last two, I have no sympathy for any of the other group. And statistically it is not wrong to assume that the victims are not in the last two category unless proven otherwise..just like, when there is a road accident happens in India, you assume the victim is an Indian and not a blue eyed Norwegian blond

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 21 Oct 2009 07:18

^^^^

Agree 400% Though all terrorists are bakistanis, not all bakistanis are terrorists. So please dont blame them all.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 21 Oct 2009 07:47

Suppiah wrote:Pakbarians can be classified as follows

Terrorists - ie those that explode themselves or use guns
Para-terrorists - those that provide shelter, do minor jobs but dont kill
Organisers/Financiers - those that identify themselves with the cause and fund them, provide ideological cover, moral guidance and so forth..
Sympathisers - those that identify themselves with the Islamist 'green flag in red fort and elsewhere' cause but have no money to finance so they come out in meetings and show their ugly faces that get captured in world media
Silent sympathisers - the office clerk, secretary, executive type that quietly or even openly rejoices when killings of kufrs take place but to preserve an 'image' among friends or public, they issue meaningless statements or words of sympathy to victims of terror. Sometimes they dont even bother, and try to justify it in terms of 'suffering/depravation/injustice' etc. I am sure everyone of us came across this type after 7/11 in offices across the globe.
The neutral - these are personally against terror but go along with the agenda because it is delivering them 'results' in terms of keeping India busy counting bodies. Once in a while they can issue 'we are a religion of peace' statement and wash their hands off the matter
The oppressed minority - you know who..the sikhs, hindus, christians who are stuck there without any power
The innocente - The real civilised amongst Paki Muslims who genuinely feel TSP's agenda, strategy, tactics and present course are wrong and either weep alone or try and do something about it. I do not deny this group exists, but it is so small, it is statistically a rounding error. Do not classify cricket players, movie stars, singers etc., automatically in this category, they could very well belong to 'Silent sympathiser' category, forced to put up public face of 'innocent'

Other than the last two, I have no sympathy for any of the other group. And statistically it is not wrong to assume that the victims are not in the last two category unless proven otherwise..just like, when there is a road accident happens in India, you assume the victim is an Indian and not a blue eyed Norwegian blond

An interesting analysis.

But you may be under-counting the civilized fraction, since their voices tend to get drowned out. Take a look at this: http://www.ndtv.com/news/blogs/hidden_a ... kistan.php (also look at the comments).

There is also the phenomenon of schizophrenia. A single individual may have multiple personalities or identities. For example even AQ Khan has lately taken to writing nostalgic newspaper articles talking about the harmonious Hindu-Muslim in the erstwhile princely state of Bhopal.

Innate human nature (generally) wants to be good. Evil ideologies can turn people into raving madmen, but it is not sustainable. Human nature tends to reassert itself over time.

I'm not arguing that evil-doers need not be ruthlessly put down. But we need to have a nuanced understanding of the situation.

How do you encourage Dr Jekyll, and, over time, destroy Mr Hyde? That is the question. There is a tendency to get swept away by the side that appears to be winning. So getting rid of the bad guys is a very important part of it, so that Dr Jekyll can feel it is safe to come out. Over the longer term, demolishing the intellectual edifice that justifies and sustains Mr Hyde may be more important.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 21 Oct 2009 08:16

Suppiah wrote:Pakbarians can be classified as follows

Terrorists - ie those that explode themselves or use guns
Para-terrorists - those that provide shelter, do minor jobs but dont kill
Organisers/Financiers - those that identify themselves with the cause and fund them, provide ideological cover, moral guidance and so forth..
Sympathisers - those that identify themselves with the Islamist 'green flag in red fort and elsewhere' cause but have no money to finance so they come out in meetings and show their ugly faces that get captured in world media
Silent sympathisers - the office clerk, secretary, executive type that quietly or even openly rejoices when killings of kufrs take place but to preserve an 'image' among friends or public, they issue meaningless statements or words of sympathy to victims of terror. Sometimes they dont even bother, and try to justify it in terms of 'suffering/depravation/injustice' etc. I am sure everyone of us came across this type after 7/11 in offices across the globe.
The neutral - these are personally against terror but go along with the agenda because it is delivering them 'results' in terms of keeping India busy counting bodies. Once in a while they can issue 'we are a religion of peace' statement and wash their hands off the matter
The oppressed minority - you know who..the sikhs, hindus, christians who are stuck there without any power
The innocente - The real civilised amongst Paki Muslims who genuinely feel TSP's agenda, strategy, tactics and present course are wrong and either weep alone or try and do something about it. I do not deny this group exists, but it is so small, it is statistically a rounding error. Do not classify cricket players, movie stars, singers etc., automatically in this category, they could very well belong to 'Silent sympathiser' category, forced to put up public face of 'innocent'

Other than the last two, I have no sympathy for any of the other group. And statistically it is not wrong to assume that the victims are not in the last two category unless proven otherwise..just like, when there is a road accident happens in India, you assume the victim is an Indian and not a blue eyed Norwegian blond

Brilliant stuff - a keeper! Someone please preserve it for posterity where it is accessible online!

Vivek_A · Post by **Vivek_A** » 21 Oct 2009 08:20

Admins: With your indulgence, I'm posting the (almost) complete article from the nutty nation.

shrill v/s scumbag ratfight gets interesting..

Haqqani on Pakistan, Islam, Saudis

Washington DC - Ambassador Haqqani has been appearing on many fora in the US before and after he became ambassador for Pakistan. A study of his remarks reveals an interesting perspective he has on Pakistan and the Muslim World. For instance, on April 1, 2005, Cleveland Jewishnews.com quoted Haqqani as having stated: “Muslim world’s problems are much bigger than antagonism to Israel, Jews and Militancy.” He went on to hold the Saudis responsible for almost every problem.
Given how Saudi Arabia is one of Pakistan’s most critical allies, apart from the deep emotive bond between the two Muslim nations, this statement would hardly have gone down well before either Pakistanis or Saudis. But this anti-Saudi theme has been a particular favourite of the ambassador’s. For instance, on an earlier occasion, on March 2, 2004, at the Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs he declared that “ Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are two of the US’s most difficult allies ... They are not allies at all ... but sources of trouble ... The fact that (an al Qaeda terrorist) feels so comfortable with Pakistani intelligence officers ... is a source of worry in itself.”
Again, at the same meeting, he explained, “India has 23 national languages but Pakistan was pressing hard for Urdu. Pakistan’s elite decided Islam would be unifying and India an enemy.” He also went on to deride Pakistan further by declaring that “Pakistan is a rent seeking unit from the US, may it be Russia or terrorism, they are available as the most allied ally.” Finally, he attacked the settlers of Balochistan, now the target of killings in that province, by demanding that “Punjabis in Balochistan should learn to respect Balochis and should not side with the government. The way the Army did not help Biharis who took the wrong side and are still there at the mercy of Bengalis. Either you can come back on tanks or on trains as POWs.”
A month later, on December 5, 2006, at the CARR Center for Human rights Policy, Haqqani again gave his view that “Pakistan has become a rented state; it is benefiting from its geographic location. As per the declassified documents, Ayub Khan said, ‘Our army can be yours, if you pay the right price’. We perform certain services and in return get economic benefits.”
Much later, at the Asia Society, New York, on March 27, 2007, with reference to military aid to Pakistan, he expressed the view that “military aid, none of the arsenals, has any relevance to countering Al-Qaeda.” He did state the obvious when he said, on the same occasion, “US pressure is there to do more, which is being resented by people of Pakistan. They see it as American’s war.” Now which of these quotable quotes of Haqqani’s made it apparent to the Zardari regime that he would be the ideal representative of Pakistan’s interests in the US?

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 21 Oct 2009 08:21

I see the 'Who is Sita syndrome' here.

Vivek_A · Post by **Vivek_A** » 21 Oct 2009 08:23

Shrill....nuttier than ever

Pakistan: trapped in the US game plan

First, through shifting the centre of gravity of the war in Afghanistan to Pakistan. This has finally been accomplished through a number of interesting tactics. The beginning was made by allowing the Al-Qaeda and Taliban to escape from Afghanistan during the Tora Bora bombings. Then the internal destabilisation of Pakistan began through drone attacks, which caused the traditionally highly patriotic tribal population of FATA to gradually turn against the state especially when the US pressured the army into moving into this area. Also, India was given a free run in Afghanistan so money and weapons for terrorists flowed in from Afghanistan into Balochistan and FATA as well as NWFP. In addition, a new entity emerged with its own violent agenda - the TTP with a huge stock of weapons that clearly had come from across the border since some of them were of US origin. Meanwhile, the US gradually increased its covert presence in Pakistan - beginning with Tarbela and the so-called “trainers” as well as the private US security concerns that have traditionally worked as mercenaries for the US government in places like Iraq. Balochistan also saw an increase in the US presence, especially as the US also sought to operationalise its covert operations against Iran through this province and the bases Musharraf had so generously handed over to the US. There was also the Bandari air base in an area 78 kilometres south of Kharan, near a place called Shimsi - not Shamsi base which is on the border with Iran near Dalbandin - from where the drones have been flying. This is the only airport that is not listed as being under CAA control.

The second phase of the US implementation strategy has now begun to be operat-ionalised - that is, to destabilise Pakistan from within by increasing acts of terror carried out in Pakistani cities through well-trained and well-equipped groups centring on TTP - which finds no mention in the Kerry-Lugar Act. Alongside, the military has been tied down in military operations, first in Swat and now in SWA - which has its own fallouts in terms of terrorism and displacement of the population. It has also become necessary to isolate Pakistan from its neighbours and hence the extensive terrorist attacks on Iran’s security forces in Sistan province bordering Pakistan’s Balochistan, so that Iran-Pakistan relations are destroyed - Iran being the only friendly neighbour apart from China. The US covert presence in Pakistan has also now been put in place like a web - beginning from Sindh and Balochistan in the south and southwest, to Punjab to the Capital to Peshawar. There are now US armed covert operatives along with overt marines surrounding the Pakistanis and their nuclear assets. The Kerry-Lugar Act merely gives formal recognition to what has already happened in practice - submission to US diktat.
Only one last phase of the US agenda has to be operat-ionalised, but that will be the toughest. This is to push the country into a civil war-like situation by threatening to target Quetta and southern Punjab as well as Muridke. First there was pressure on the army to move into Swat; now it is SWA and the new mantra of moving the army into southern Punjab has already begun! Overstretch the military and create civil-military fissures so as to totally destabilise the country. When there is a state of total chaos, the US can pressure the UNSC into allowing it to takeover Pakistan’s nuclear assets - what will euphemistically be termed “under international control”. But the big problem now is that too many in the corridors of power in Pakistan are beginning to see the light while the people have also woken up to the lethal American agenda for Pakistan. Unless we can see the whole US game plan, and connect all the dots we will continue to fall prey to this destructive design.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 21 Oct 2009 08:25

Rangudu wrote:Many moons ago, I made a post here asking for sympathy for TSPians following the earthquake that killed many in TSPOK and NWFP.

We all know what those same "victims" ended up doing and we all know that the "refugee camps" in Mansehra, Balakot and Muzaffarabad etc. were camps of another kind (Hint: Read Ajmal Kasab's confession).

Sympathy is natural and as human beings there is something wrong if we don't feel compassion at the sight of grief.

But once the fleeting sense of regret passes over, remember the reality of Mumbai, Kabul, Kaluchak, Varanasi, Hyderabad, Delhi etc.

I was wondering if we could nominate the date 26th November as "Sympathy for Pakistan day". 26th November should be reserved for remembering the events and thinking of Pakistan and then calling up any sympathy you can feel for Pakistan and its ethos - which has been so succinctly described by Suppiah in his poignant post above

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 21 Oct 2009 08:36

Vivek_A wrote:When there is a state of total chaos, the US can pressure the UNSC into allowing it to takeover Pakistan’s nuclear assets

Reminds me of the man who was convinced that is his testicles were about to fall off. When his wife ran away - he was too busy feeling himself to make sure the worst had not happened. One day his house was broken into by burglars. He had the option of calling the police - but he was too busy holding on to what the thought he might lose any moment. It is said that failed to defend himself against attack despite being armed because he was too busy holding on to his future generations and was found dead with his hands cupping his jewels in front of him.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 21 Oct 2009 08:48

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 21 Oct 2009 08:52

I have no sympathy in me for pakis. I belive one dead paki is one less terrorist India has to deal with.
I have lost good friends & family friends in 93'attack, 26/11 & Ahmedabad attack. All those attack were
carried out by pakis on innocent Indians whose lives where cut short by hatred pakis have for India.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 21 Oct 2009 09:03

geo tv.

Countrywide schools, colleges closed
Updated at: 2322 PST, Tuesday, October 20, 2009

Countrywide schools, colleges closed ISLAMABAD: All the educational institutions of Sindh and the NWFP province including Azad Kashmir will remain closed till October 24 following the bombings at Islamic University of Islamabad. But, the Punjab government announced to close indefinitely all the educational institutions.

In the twin cities of Islamabad and Rawalpindi, Fatima Jinnah University, Barani, Allama Iqbal Open University, FAST University and Bahria University will remain closed till Sunday.

A meeting held here with Sardar Zulfiqar Ali Khosa in chair, decided to keep all the educational institutions closed till further orders.

According to Sindh government announcement, all private and government institutes of the province will remain closed till October 24.

Announcements regarding keeping the universities closed tomorrow (October 21) have been made by Sindh Governor Ishratul Ibad and the chancellors of universities in the province.

Azad Kashmir Education Secretary announced that all the educational institutions including Azad Kashmir University will remain closed till Sunday.

Balochistan education minister said all the educational institutions will remain closed till Sunday. However, all the educational institutions being run under Defence Ministry and those established in the cantonment area have already been closed for a week.

The sources privy to Interior Ministry said threats have been received to target the educational institutions especially those being run under Pakistan Army.

negi · Post by **negi** » 21 Oct 2009 09:05

Fwiw sympathy for innocents and a common Pakistani getting affected in all this is obvious and not to be ashamed off ; imho this is what differentiates us from those nutcases in TSP.

arun · Post by **arun** » 21 Oct 2009 09:06

The “IT” being referred to here is not the national pastime of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan namely “International Terrorism”, but rather the “IT” is a reference to “Information Technology”:

Pakistan’s IT industry shrinking

disha · Post by **disha** » 21 Oct 2009 09:09

arun wrote:The “IT” being referred to here is not the national pastime of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan namely “International Terrorism”, but rather the “IT” is a reference to “Information Technology”:

Pakistan’s IT industry shrinking

Did not know that they had this "IT" Industry!