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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 08 Jul 2013 23:58
by Peregrine
The unraveling -IMF, smokescreens and visions

Going to the IMF for a bailout package suggests a failure in economic management, particularly in terms of fiscal and trade deficits. In this case, it is a failure of the last elected government. That Pakistan is a member of the IMF or that it has secured a loan (at three per cent) above the rate paid on the 10-year US treasuries (currently about 2.75 per cent) does not change the fact that it is a bailout. If five years hence, the new elected government has to go to the IMF, one will be able to safely conclude that the current team of economic managers has similarly failed. For the moment, this administration is been given time to deliver and many are hoping it will not pass the buck like the last government did.

The negotiations with the IMF were a well-managed charade. The smokescreen was that the government would insist in the negotiations to ‘no new taxes’. I call this stand a charade because everyone knew that there would be a bailout and that the government had already made the most of its concessions in the pre-negotiation budget that it rapidly passed on taking office. Other concessions were revealed after the negotiations and the image created was that the government stood its ground. The IMF as usual tried to appease the Pakistani public by saying that the government’s plan is ‘home-grown’ and as usual it took the fall for the hike in power tariffs

There is nothing home-grown about the IMF austerity packages, which have delivered little in Europe or elsewhere. But, at least, the IMF has a vision. Some economist like Joe Stiglitz view it as immune to evidence and that is why they dub this vision as market fundamentalism — the belief that free market reforms and fiscal austerity will deliver economic growth.

Economic globalisation, promoted by international organisations like the IMF, has strengthened capital which can move across borders at the expense of labour, which is less mobile. Governments thus need to buttress labour, which in the current era has this inherent weakness. Even so, neo-liberal economists harp incessantly about ‘structural reforms’, such as labour market reforms and other deregulations and this strengthens capital further at the expense of labour, and other social groups and the environment. Without social safeguards, this is a dangerous prescription.

One does not need a long report to summarise what has worked in the last 70 or so years since development economics was founded as a field; most of this is common sense. Businesses operating in a competitive environment have been an engine of growth. Thus sensible policies that enable them to diversify the economy, move up the technology chain and break into export markets to address the foreign exchange constraint are needed. Governments that have succeeded have addressed constraints (research, infrastructure, credit) to enable this to happen. At the same time, to ensure inclusion and higher productivity, these governments have addressed inequality, invested in humans (education and health) and put safety nets into place. These are structural reforms that are sensitive to social justice compared with the justice blind, neo-liberal prescriptions.

Going back to negotiations with the IMF, the issue of ‘no new taxes’ pushed by the government as a negotiating stance is a red herring. There really is no problem raising taxes on the very wealthy, particularly if the exemption rate is high enough — as it is in Pakistan’s case. This slogan only benefits those, who do not want to pay for the services they disproportionately benefit from. Direct taxes (like income and wealth) are 19 per cent of the revenue budget while indirect taxes, like sales, are 31 per cent of the revenue budget. In this context, the finance minister suggesting that a one per cent increase in the sales tax does not matter is a Mary Antoinette like statement.

The IMF needs to worry about being paid back so austerity from its perspective as a lender makes sense but why does a country producing anaemic growth rates have to put up with austerity? The finance minister stated that “the austerity measures are likely to be painful”. The question is austerity for whom and what does the country get in exchange?

Let us now turn to the ostensible compromise from what has been revealed so far and how this will impact businesses and the poor. Put simply, no new income/wealth taxes in exchange for cutting subsidies and exemptions and increasing the power tariff and sales taxes. Also, the government plans to borrow an enormous amount on the expenditure side, which could crowd out business borrowing if the interest rate rises or if credit is not extended. Alternatively, inflation could be an issue, which again, disproportionately hurts the poor like sales taxes.

If well applied, exemptions and subsidies can be part of a sensible industrial policy; one that could deliver jobs and the foreign exchange that would free Pakistan from the IMF. Of course, if these exemptions and subsidies are granted to cronies rather than as rewards for delivering good performance in a competitive market economy framework, they are better eliminated. This all depends on the quality and reach of economic management.

The power tariff increase will again hurt businesses. Fortunately, there is an exemption for the lowest levels of consumption, although the more important issue is extending service to those still completely deprived and those with connections, excessively deprived.

Signing an IMF agreement does not necessarily mean buying into the IMF vision. There is always plenty of wiggle room. One hopes the present government realises that it has been elected to serve. For the sake of the political process, I hope it serves out its term. Delivering inclusive growth would be the best service to the country and also the best mechanism to ensure the survival of the political process.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 00:11
by Peregrine
Image

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 08:01
by partha
Amir Khan intelligence afsar to Al Baki deep state chief about Al Bakis -
You are so cheap. We can buy you with a visa or even with a dinner. We can buy anyone.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 08:30
by arun
Committee to Protect Journalist (CPJ) takes up the cudgel for Anita Joshua of The Hindu, Rezaul Hasan Laskar of the Press Trust of India and Declan Walsh of the The New York Times:

Pakistan should allow access for foreign journalists

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 09:51
by Prem
Karachi bleeds; 14( Choddah) dead in target killings
Taking Fryday Off Haiin Jii?
KAR ACHI: At least 14 people, including five activists of the Muttahida Qaumi Movement, a worker of Sunni Tehreek and a policeman, were shot dead in separate incident of target killings across the city, while four bodies were found on Monday. In the first incident, a policeman and an MQM worker were killed, and another worker wounded, in Sector 5L, New Karachi, in the Bilal Colony police precinct. The victims were identified as assistant sub-inspector Ejaz Khokhar, Kamran Ahmed. In another incident, two MQM activists were killed and another wounded at the Dabbu Club situated at Kati Pahari. Police said armed motorcyclists shot Yasin and Majid dead and fled.Meanwhile, an MQM worker and a Sunni Tehreek (ST) activist were killed, and another ST worker wounded in the Surjani Town locality.Police said the armed men opened fire at a grocery store in Surjani, killing Zahid Qadri and wounding Mehmood Qadri. MQM worker Imran was also killed at the same spot. Another MQM’s worker was shot dead in Khawaja Ajmair Nagri. Separately, a man named Jalal Baloch was shot dead in Agra Taj Colony, Lyari. In Baldia, an unidentified motorcyclist was shot dead. Meanwhile, a watchman, identified as Bashir Aslam, was found dead inside a bungalow in Block 2, Clifton. Similarly, a body was found in the limits of the PIB police.Separately, the body of an unidentified man was found in the limits of the Pak Colony police. Another bullet-riddled body of a man was found within the limits of the Nippier police. Moreover, two men –Shakeel and the other yet to be identified – were shot dead in Rafa-e-Aam society, Malir, in a robbery bid. Another man, Pardeep, was gunned down in Korangi’s Sector 48F, while his friend Lakhshman was injured in the assault Another man, Mansoor Abadi, was gunned down in Sector 7D within the limits of Surjani Town police. In another incident, a man named Lal Mohammad, 40, was killed inside his house for resisting a robbing bid in Rais Goth, Baldia.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 16:12
by Peregrine
US SEALs had ground support in Abbottabad operation : report
ISLAMABAD : Terming it a collective failure of authorities as a whole, the Abbottabad Commission Report says no Pakistani institution or individual alone was responsible for the operation, which killed former al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden on Pakistani soil.
"OBL was able to stay within the limits of Abbottabad Cantonment due to a collective failure of the military authorities, the intelligence authorities, the police and the civilian administration," said the report.

"This failure included negligence and incompetence and at some undetermined level a grave complicity may or may not have involved," it added.

"How the entire neighbourhood, local officials, police and security and intelligence officials all missed the size, the strange shape, the barbed wire, the lack of cars and visitors etc over a period of nearly six years beggars belief," the report said.
According to his wives, bin Laden fled the 2001 US-led invasion of Afghanistan, arriving in Pakistan in the spring or summer of 2002, and staying for more than nine years.

The commission also reported that tracing Osama Bin Laden in Pakistan and subsequently sharing this intelligence with the government was solely Inter Services Intelligence's (ISI) responsibility.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 17:01
by Brad Goodman
Comedy in Pakistan: Who’d have thought?
posting in full
I am in the US. I arrived at the US immigration and waited patiently in line. I never ever have problems at Immigration because to the Americans I look Mexican and I have an English accent, the officials get so confused it really doesn't cross their minds that I could be anything of any danger.
:roll: :roll:
This time I flew into Orlando airport, and the kind looking white male officer called me forward.

I passed him my British passport, he saw my US visa inside and he said, “What do you do?”

“I’m a comedian.” He looked at my face and laughed out loud, as though this in itself was the biggest joke.

“Where do you do that?”

“All over the world.”

He laughs again out loud and says, “Really?”

“Yes, really.”

“What type of material do you do?”

“I talk about anything and everything whatever I see, observational.”

There was a long pause. He looked at my passport then looked at me and said, “Are you of Pakistani heritage?”

I said, “No, I’m Indian.” I thought I don’t want to get into some kind of Q&A about whether or not I am related to Osama Bin Laden. Technically, I am Indian. My mother was born in India before partition so it wasn't a lie. :shock:

He says, “So why do you have a Pakistani Visa in your passport?”

“Because I toured there.”

“What, comedy?”

“Yes, comedy.”

Did they get it?” :rotfl:

“Yes.”

“What language did you speak?”

“English.”

“And they got it?”

“Yes.”

“How do you know?”

“Because they laughed.”

“They laughed? Do you specialise in Pakistani jokes?”

“No.”

“So what do you talk about?”

“All kinds of things. Life.”

“So you’re observational?”

“Yes.”

There was another long pause. He looked at my passport, looked at me, and said, “Are you sure?”

“Sure about what?” I replied.

“Sure about everything you've told me.”

“Yes, of course I am.”

He then sat there and laughed out loud for about three minutes.

He said, “I've heard it all now. I've heard everything. This is something else. Comedy in Pakistan, who’d have thought, hey?”

I said, “Are you going to let me in, or are you just going to sit there chatting me up and laughing in my face all day.”

“Since you've made me laugh, I think I’ll let you in. Have a nice day.”

When I arrived at my show and told the Pakistani’s there what had happened they couldn't believe it.

“What? They didn't believe that Pakistani’s laugh? Do they think we are inhuman? Is this what they think of us?”

I had to tell them, that the Immigration Officer had actually laughed all the way through my time at passport control. So he must at least have found something about me funny. I was quite surprised at his reaction, because it had never happened to me before in all the years I have been coming to the US.

I have never flown into Orlando before; maybe its just Florida that thinks like this, maybe it’s just Orlando, or maybe it’s just him. I wouldn't want to judge all immigration officers in the US in the same way, that one man thinks that all people with Pakistani visa’s in their passports are humourless, comedy unfriendly, backward individuals that wouldn't know a joke if it shot them in the face with a handgun.

I hope that I in someway changed his mind about something, anything. We certainly had a laugh together and I quite liked him. I just think he hadn't travelled very far. Probably beyond the immigration booth in which he sat.

Not his fault then. You can’t blame him. Let me be a bit thick, a bit stupid and a bit ignorant.

He probably gets all his information from CNN, thinks that everyone in Pakistan lives in a cave and has never laughed, and the last time he saw a brown funny woman was on South Park, and she was imaginary.

But we both liked each other, we both got on, neither of us felt any animosity towards each other and most of all, he gave me some great new material.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 17:03
by Brad Goodman
Pakistan's Wasim to marry Australian girlfriend
Legendary Pakistan paceman Wasim Akram said Monday he will marry his Australian girlfriend, who has converted to Islam and will settle in his home country.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 17:13
by Brad Goodman
It’s Pakistan, Not a Jungle
A line I have heard several times from people in Canada over the past one month. I was a bit taken aback the first time I heard it. My first instinct was to rudely respond, “Of course I know English- I come from Pakistan and not a jungle”.


But then I used to smile politely and just walk away.


It all started when I took a plane to Canada last month for a medical internship. I traveled on the plane with my head held high searching for a dream in this foreign land. Having topped my university my spirits were sky high. I would make Pakistan proud. They will be saying nice things about Pakistan when I leave. I was proud of where I was coming from unconsciously forgetting the bad things that invaded my land.


A week into Canada, my bubble was built up and steady. I used to straighten up my back and tell everyone I met “I am from Pakistan”. They used to smile back and get to the next question. No words exchanged on Pakistan. I was still walking on the streets with my head held up high. I was as good as any other person there. There were beautiful buildings, friendly people and exotic nature to explore. I was having the time of my life.


Second week, I started creating conversation. So what do you know about Pakistan? Some would shake their heads in ignorance, some in denial of passing comments. A few came up with interesting answers. “ALL I know is that Musharraf is not a happy man”


“I would never live in Pakistan. You can’t travel on the roads alone if you are a girl. It’s so hard to do anything in Pakistan. I don’t know how people live there”




“Me: Hi I am from Pakistan.
Miss XYZ: Oh so you are from India.
Me: No I am from Pakistan.
Miss XYZ: (Ignores)…..So many of my students are from India
too…..”
“Do you really pay the cop off to get a driving license; I watched
a show on TV about a Pakistani driver that’s all I know”
My third week, I started getting opinions without me asking for them. “I am surprised when I saw you in western clothes. Don’t you come from a fundamentalist country where they shoot you if you don’t wear a scarf on your head?




Me: No, I come from one of the metropolitan cities of Pakistan. It doesn’t happen there.


You have moderate Muslims in Pakistan but why do we never hear them speaking against extremism. Cancer is not tragic. The terrorist activates in your country are tragic”


“International students fall flat here, because they don’t know how to communicate, they don’t have team building skill and management skills. They might read the same books but they lack all
these qualities. In Pakistan or India Doctors sit in their chairs all day, here we are running around. If you want to settle here leave that part of yourself back home”


By this point in time, I constantly defended myself. I spoke good things about Pakistan. I tried to prove myself. My bubble had been broken. My head no longer high. They didn’t like where I was from no matter how big their smiles were. And it was not even their fault.

They knew the right things. I could no longer be misled. I was in a constant struggle to prove myself.


Until the Fourth week when I was stumped.


“You speak such good things about Pakistan. Why do you want to move here then?”
Me: Silence”
:mrgreen:

My decision has been made easier now. I am going back. Going back to the home where I belong. Only to come back when I can hold my head high and talk about the country where I was born.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 17:57
by ashvin
^^^
I get the impression that these yahoos suffer from an incurable Nero complex: everything and anything is burning around them but they are oblivious or are in extreme denial. And this thing about being Indian because my mother or father was born in India before partition is being played out. I had one fella in Brussels claim to be Indian because his father was born in India before partition and then he moved to TSP. I promptly corrected him and said, "You are not Indian!" End of discussion. My big concern is that the more they play this tune the more the WKK brigade will open their arms to them.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 18:08
by vinod
“You speak such good things about Pakistan. Why do you want to move here then?”
Me: Silence”
:mrgreen:
When I get this, I answer back, saying most of the money was stolen by you guys! :D

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 18:42
by Peregrine
vinod wrote:
“You speak such good things about Pakistan. Why do you want to move here then?”
Me: Silence”
:mrgreen:
When I get this, I answer back, saying most of the money was stolen by you guys! :D
vinod Ji :

Suggest, please delete your post as "Pak Lurkers"will use this to gain sympathy from the "hosts"

Cheers Image

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 19:23
by arun
The full text of the report by a commission appointed by the Islamic Republic of Pakistan’s legislature on the US extermination of Mohammadden terrorist Osama Bin Laden has been leaked to Al Jazeera and is available in its entirety at the below link. Do note it is a hefty 115 MB file:

Leaked Abbotabad Commission Bin Laden Dossier

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 19:25
by sanjaykumar
I once told a Pakistani that because he was born in pre-partition India that he was Indian.

He was Parsi-he knew exactly what I meant. (Posted especially for Palurkers).

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 19:43
by SSridhar
China to the rescue - Edit in DT
The Chinese locomotives case in the Lahore High Court asserts that the Chinese sent poor quality engines and rolling stock for the railways. The Chinese side of the story is that Pakistan provided the wrong specifications, hence the problems. One is at a loss sometimes who or what to believe. Despair at such shenanigans is justified, but even more important, such bottlenecks and inefficiencies have to be put firmly in the past. We should not test Chinese goodwill and friendship beyond breaking point.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 19:46
by Raja Bose
^^^That's why those locomotives have been provided as they are, so that they can bear the stress of the relationship.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 20:24
by rajanb
Received via email on the FP Morning Brief, a snippet from the Abbotabad Report
Asia

A leaked report from Pakistan's independent Abbottabad Commission revealed that the Pakistani air force learned about the U.S. raid that killed Osama bin Laden from a television news report.
:mrgreen: :(( :rotfl:
http://killerapps.foreignpolicy.com/pos ... raid_on_tv

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 20:28
by Lilo
Saba Fatima Ali: My decision has been made easier now. I am going back. Going back to the home where I belong. Only to come back when I can hold my head high and talk about the country where I was born.
Pretty rich eye say, coming fram a paki rapette who has two shia sounds in her name. Next she will write an artecal on how Shia doctors like harself are the most blessed citizens of her 'home' land
(As they keep getting martyred onlee)

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 20:47
by member_22872
A leaked report from Pakistan's independent Abbottabad Commission revealed that the Pakistani air force learned about the U.S. raid that killed Osama bin Laden from a television news report.
CBS reported that they came to know the next day of the raid, when one of the PAF's top brass daughter who was studying in the US called to report about it.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 20:50
by fanne
BS..TSP planes/Heli had even crashed that night (either electronic death signal or overt shot, take your pick), hint it was near a big dam, which is the home to es es ji.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 22:16
by Prem
Lilo wrote:
Saba Fatima Ali: My decision has been made easier now. I am going back. Going back to the home where I belong. Only to come back when I can hold my head high and talk about the country where I was born.
Pretty rich eye say, coming fram a paki rapette who has two shia sounds in her name. Next she will write an artecal on how Shia doctors like harself are the most blessed citizens of her 'home' land
(As they keep getting martyred onlee)
She might belong to Home L.nd by birth but not the land because the land is ours and do not belong to her and her co religioists.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 23:00
by Anujan
arun wrote:The full text of the report by a commission appointed by the Islamic Republic of Pakistan’s legislature on the US extermination of Mohammadden terrorist Osama Bin Laden has been leaked to Al Jazeera and is available in its entirety at the below link. Do note it is a hefty 115 MB file:

Leaked Abbotabad Commission Bin Laden Dossier

I read through all of it. First 1/3 of the report is bull sh1t and blames local cops, traffic police, Abbottabad cantonment board etc for not catching Bin Laden! They are whining why no FIR was filed (because all cops were unceremoniously bundled out by the army/ISI and asked to stay out of the scene) they ask why police did not protest and take over the investigation (Why didnt any policitians "protest" the coups?) Randomly pass a few statements about low-level abduls making a few bucks of baksheesh.

Next 1/3 of the report expresses outrage about how US successfully flew in and took out OBL. Pasha's statements here are very revealing -- he is more extreme than Hamid Gul!! He is one beard and a vest away from being a Bin Laden himself. Actually tells the commission "Those who fear the ISI should fear the ISI". Also says ISI took on the role of counter terrorism though nobody asked it to -- because ISI really believes in serving Pakistan and other institutions cant :rotfl: Pakistan Army Board of inquiry finds traffic cops, utility companies, site inspectors, local people (actually calls them out for not reporting suspicious activities) guilty and calls it "total failure of everything and everybody".

Next 1/3 has Miscellanious complaints about how incompetent various intelligence agencies are (IB chief presented a report which is a collection of newspaper clippings :mrgreen: ISI chief has met the PM only once. IB chief does not know what the charter & mandate of IB is. FIA chief, a honest humble fellow says he and his organization know nothing about Abbottabad because they arent kept in the loop. Foreign minister says they missed OBL in Pakistan because "Pakistan was too focussed on the outside world and not on itself" :roll: ityadi)

Nowhere is there any serious inquiry on whether OBL was helped by the Pakis, as to how he stayed in Pakistan for 9 years!!

As a comic relief: One retired major says Abbottabad is a pretty safe and peaceful place because families of prominent terrorists live there and there are no suicide attacks because of that :mrgreen: :rotfl: Then he goes on to speculate that there is no way OBL could have lived in the compound. :shock: Pakis seem to have 2 brains. A pea sized one in their head, a bigger one in their musharraf. Both dont communicate with each other and say contradictory things. Apparently none of OBL's neighbors believe he was in the compound.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 23:29
by Comer
"Those who fear the ISI should fear the ISI".
:rotfl: What a namoona! In Tamil movies any two bit hero mouths something called punch dialogue. Bakis are past masters in that.
Pakis seem to have 2 brains. A pea sized one in their head, a bigger one in their musharraf. Both dont communicate with each other and say contradictory things.
:rotfl:
That tusharaff brain is for controlling the horse while travelling from Central Asia.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 09 Jul 2013 23:35
by Comer
I am sure most of you folks have seen this by now, but did a search didn't find any hits, so posting it for record. Behold the Baki mard


http://vimeo.com/62864610

http://vimeo.com/64466846

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 00:07
by Prem
saravana wrote:I am sure most of you folks have seen this by now, but did a search didn't find any hits, so posting it for record. Behold the BC retard Inbred Baki mardhttp://vimeo.com/62864610http://vimeo.com/64466846
Correction made to decribe Inbredorrist Mushwormulla Mirrasi Chakka.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 00:17
by MurthyB
This whole "leaked Abbotabad report" etc is all just eyewash designed to absolve them of all sins by claiming incompetence. They haven't really revealed anything from what those women told them, or what the ISI knew; it's all just the usual whining about failing institutions etc. With the new government in place, Kerry as sec. state, and the wind-down in Afghanistan looming, this is good strategy to rebuild relations with Unkil to keep the bakshish flowing. The IMF bailout also shows how all this works: new government claims old government responsible for previous back peddling on promises, IMF (Unkil) agrees, and bailouts resume.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 00:25
by Amber G.
Anujan wrote:
arun wrote:The full text of the report by a commission appointed by the Islamic Republic of Pakistan’s legislature on the US extermination of Mohammadden terrorist Osama Bin Laden has been leaked to Al Jazeera and is available in its entirety at the below link. Do note it is a hefty 115 MB file:

Leaked Abbotabad Commission Bin Laden Dossier

I read through all of it. First 1/3 of the report ..<snip>.
Thanks for putting it here, and commenting ...

I think one should also add this one from our ISI ("Those who fear the ISI should fear the ISI".. :rotfl:) Those who fear the ISI should fear the ISI..
The former spy chief Ahmad Shuja Pasha told the commission ..
"We are a failing state even if we are not yet a failed state." :rotfl:

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 00:29
by vishvak
No matter how much $$ is given by clients to pukis it is going to be no good. Reminds of quote from Africa- when Europeans came to Africa, they had bible and we had land. Soon enough Africans had bible and Europeans had lands. Pukis are going to slide to 7th century soon in spite of 3.5 but Indians should be watching out. Pakistan kaa matlab kyaa - same perhaps as matlab of Somalia.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 01:22
by putnanja
Anujan wrote:
arun wrote:The full text of the report by a commission appointed by the Islamic Republic of Pakistan’s legislature on the US extermination of Mohammadden terrorist Osama Bin Laden has been leaked to Al Jazeera and is available in its entirety at the below link. Do note it is a hefty 115 MB file:

Leaked Abbotabad Commission Bin Laden Dossier

I read through all of it. First 1/3 of the report is bull sh1t and blames local cops, traffic police, Abbottabad cantonment board etc for not catching Bin Laden! They are whining why no FIR was filed (because all cops were unceremoniously bundled out by the army/ISI and asked to stay out of the scene) they ask why police did not protest and take over the investigation (Why didnt any policitians "protest" the coups?) Randomly pass a few statements about low-level abduls making a few bucks of baksheesh.
...
I think the report was deliberately leaked. It exhorts all the main players (PA/ISI etc) from any blame. It would have been a true leak if the report had blamed the actual people who were responsible for hosting OBL in there. This is just an eyewash to claim "we are bungling idiots onlee, we didn't know OBL was among us." BS. Western media have already picked up on this. So the leak has achieved its objective.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 02:17
by Anujan
Another choice quote. There was one Maryam, the wife of Ibrahim who was OBL's bodyguard. She spoke of "guests" in Bin Laden's house. Apparently ISI did not investigate who the guests were because Maryam's statement was "Ignored as the nonsense of a woman" :rotfl: (exact quote)

Also no question it was deliberately leaked. It was leaked by Al Jazeera owned by the Qataris who are also arranging talks with the taliban and opened a taliban office there.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 02:41
by Anujan
Here are the choice parts so you fellows dont have to waste time reading the full report.

* First two questions the commission sought answers for (i) Was OBL present in the compound (ii) Was OBL Killed?. To their credit they say yes and yes. For the second they say "most probably yes" because a bucket of Osama's blood and Osama's brain was found on the floor of the house :rotfl:

* 52 hearings, 201 witnesses, 7 field visits. 35 civil servants interviewed, 14 army, 13 airforce and 11 ISI.

* Response from general public to the invitation from the commission to share information was disappointing. Possibly because they feared being bull cuttled :mrgreen:

* The report refers to Osama at several places as "The Shaikh". Actually has the sentence "It was a dark and moonless night (May 2)"

* Osama's daughter Sumayya says it was less than 10 minutes between hearing the helicopters and OBL getting his 72

* Osama's wife Hamza was in custody in Iran for 8 years -- from 2002 to 2010, she was let go, traveled to Kandahar, Quetta and Waziristan and then Abbottabad. Not clear why Iran held her. Not clear why they let her go. Not clear how she knew where OBL was. There is speculation about prisoner switch by Al Qaeda

* Khalid Sheikh Mohammed visited OBL with his wife and kids. They had a nice little terrorist reunion. The two bodyguards of OBL had grown up with KSM.

* In Haripur they stayed in a big house with 2 hallways, 3 bedrooms and a Lawn. Osama got busy and his wife Amal had 2 kids

* OBL's kids wore purdah as soon as they turned three. His wives would observe purdah even if there were men on TV. :rotfl:

* Raid launched from Jalalabad. 4 helicopters involved. 2 Chinooks, 2 black hawks, 24 SEALs. The strike group seemed to know the terrain, RADAR locations and range. Report speculates US flood relief op of 2010 probably did all the mapping.

* During the attack, there was no power in the compound and nearby areas. Nobody knows why. Attack lasted 36-38 mins. Most of it spent collecting stuff from the house. As mentioned before within 10 mins OBL was enjoying drinks in crystal cups from peachy bottomed mujs in heaven. And indulging in "Pindaliyon Ka Gooda"

* Speculation that there were ground controllers. Bunch of landrovers went from Islamabad consulate before the attack. There were people on the road who kept onlookers away. Trees around OBL house was cut for helis to swoop in, the other direction had high tension cables. Nobody knows who cut the trees or why.

* One of the helis landed in Abdul Munaf resident of Kandar's field, it refueled the other helis on their way out. He denied the helis landed in his field but later accepted that he went to greet the americans, who tied him up :rotfl: and he was ashamed to admit this GUBO.

* There were 4 Gas connections to OBL house and 4 electricity connections and meters. Nobody wondered why. The gas was in name of one Sahib Khan who "lost" his NIC which was "found" by OBL's body guards and used. :mrgreen:

* Cable operator did not provide OBL with Discovery channel, which OBL was videotaped watching :mrgreen:

* Commissioner of Hazara division, responsible for law & order, is personally of view that OBL was not present during raid. Director, Military Land & Cantonments said there was no conspiracy as to how the land was acquired without ID, an illegal construction of the house was made and no taxes paid. Said it was routine negligence and corruption rather than something sinister. :P :mrgreen:

* Bali Bomber Umar Patek was caught in Abbottabad. Likely same Al Qaeda network helped OBL too. But nobody wondered what Umar was doing in Abbottabad or who was helping him there.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 03:01
by Anujan
Next part:

* Abu Faraj Al-Libbi lived one Km away from OBL compound. So Al Qaeda popped into Abbottabad, but people didnt care (or most likely sheltering them) remember that Abbottabad has Pakistan Military Academy "West point for camels" :mrgreen: which seems to be Al Qaeda central. Kayani frequently visited, so did higher ups of the Army.

* Major Aziz, neighbor of OBL says any family would need atleast 20 basic services like cook, barber, carpenter etc :P TFTAs need so many people, it is you SDREs who dont have 20 people to serve you. TFTAs also buy mangoes by the basket. :mrgreen: Major Aziz also adds that Abbottabad is a peaceful place with families of many terrorists living there, which prevents suicide attacks :rotfl: :mrgreen: And Bodies of terrorists were buried with great honor in Abbottabad!! But he is not sure if OBL really lived there 8) One Lt Col Saeed Iqbal was Aziz's friend. Tried to buy Aziz's house, seemed to have lot of money, scouted area before the raid, and left Pakistan immediately after the raid. Saeed Iqbal's son works as Musharraf's aide and Saeed Iqbal himself served in MI and ISI. But ISI says he is all clean and stuff 8)

* Someone climbed a pole next to OBL house in 2010 and was fired upon. No investigation conducted by the Police. AK Phyrr in Air is Pakistani tradition :mrgreen:

* One Constable Nazar Mohammad first police to reach the place. The army asked him to go away. So he stood in duty on the roadside a kilometer away from the house :mrgreen: :(( Regional Criminal Investigation Officer believes only OBL's family was in the house. OBL was killed by US somewhere else and then brought there. Chief Minister of KPK when asked why he didnt do anything about OBL in his province immediately replied that he strongly condemned US raid :mrgreen:

* PAF board concluded US aircraft werent detected due to "combined failure in all levels in assessing intentions of USA" They look for intentions and not for aircraft apparently :P Report: Pakistan Army Board of Inquiry blames NADRA, Revenue Department, Utility company, Abbottabad cantonment board, Traffic Police etc for failure to detect OBL :mrgreen: {Traffic police also blamed for Bangladesh Liberation}

* Nobody filed an FIR on the raid because police were kept away from it. Police wants to know from the commission if they should file an FIR :D

* ISI when asked about US allegation that they leak raid info to terrorists says they it might happen in FATA but definitely not in Abbottabad :rotfl: So unfair of US to accuse ISI of tipping off terrorists :mrgreen: Acting director general, IB prepared a report on May 2 raid. It was a collection of newspaper articles. :rotfl: DG IB instead of answering the commission's questions complained how IB got low pay but Punjab police had better benefits and pay :D Acting Director, FIA said his agency had no evidence or information relating to Abbottabad. Honest fellow.

* Pasha says counter terrorism is not in the charter of ISI, but ISI took counter terrorism responsibility because "President of the country often happened to be the COAS" :rotfl: Pasha adds, Unlike the IB, ISI is not politicized. :mrgreen: Pasha further adds "Main agenda of CIA is to get ISI declared a terrorist organization" and says "Many Pakistani media persons are bribed with money, women and alcohol" 8) And says "There is no culture of reading among the political leadership. Thinking process is also non-existent." :mrgreen: He also says Pakistan society is "deeply penetrated" :rotfl:

* Apparently good Haqqani handed out visas left and right under Ambassador's discreetion. When commission asked for numbers he did some Peshawar bookkeeping, which didnt tally with the Sialkot statistics submitted by his own embassy. :mrgreen: My speculation -- Haqqani is probably CIA. His wife is a US citizen and is most probably a CIA recruit.

* Foreign Minister (Probably Birkin Babe) "Pakistan is an accident-prone country where every 5 years, incidents like May 2 tend to occur" :D Aviation operation of Ministry of Interior handled by the US and its security managed by DynCorp.

And thats all the report has. Basically no attempt at finding how OBL was able to hide in Abbottabad. Just a few statements on how Police, IB, FIA are all pathetic. A comic appearance by Major Aziz, Sad story of constable Nazar Mohammad who stood on the road and a few dhamkis and "Saaransh" style rant by Pasha.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 03:07
by ramana
They will most likely say report is fake and leaked to defame TSP H&D.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 03:09
by Nandu
^^That explains haqqani's tweet.
https://twitter.com/husainhaqqani/statu ... 4806456320
So did the Abbottabad Commission answer the question: Who gave Osama bin Laden his visa for #Pakistan? :)

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 04:14
by Prem
Nandu wrote:^^That explains haqqani's tweet.
https://twitter.com/husainhaqqani/statu ... 4806456320
So did the Abbottabad Commission answer the question: Who gave Osama bin Laden his visa for #Pakistan? :)
Blanket Visa for Arabs was granted by MA Jinnah himself with thank you note for is great gaanfather Muhammad Bi Qasim. Abbu Arabs are allowed free access in the home, bedroom of converted Miskeens.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 04:30
by Prem
Delhi by Heart: Writing ‘home’
http://tribune.com.pk/story/571876/delh ... ting-home/
ET: Were you concerned about the fact that writing about the Indian capital might be viewed unfavorably in Pakistan?
Rumi: My book is not about India-Pakistan relations, Kashmir or other disputes the two countries have wasted their energies on, nor is it about the invincibility of one nationalist narrative [over] the other. In fact, a brush with history only sheds the absurdities of the present.
How can we write off nearly a thousand years of co-existence with non-Muslims in the Indian subcontinent? What about Amir Khusrau, Ghalib, and other cultural references that are still shared and refuse to follow initial state mantra? In my book, I have been critical of the way the Indian nation state has also distorted the narrative and how we need to move beyond that.
ET: There is a lot of emphasis on sufism in your book. Any particular reason for that?
Rumi: To understand the spread of Islam, and the construction of Hindu Muslim identity, an exploration of the sufi thought and how it discovered a fertile indigenous culture in South Asia is most important. Contrary to the common misconceptions, Islam did not spread in India due to kingship and the policies of Sultans or Mughals. Instead, the plural and tolerant methods of sufi engagement were most helpful in propagating the simplicity and equality inherent to Islamic thought. :rotfl: Delhi, also known as the ‘courtyard of the sufis’, was a special area of my interest. In every corner of the city, there is a visible or hidden shrine. Some of them I explored with my sufi soul mate Sadia Dehlvi, while others I discovered through older books and texts. There is still so much to know and discover and it would take time for me to fully know about the treasures that lie hidden under the seemingly busy chaotic and powerful capital of India.
ET: What about the modern city? You are not too impressed with post-1947 Delhi?
Rumi: Really? Did I give that impression? Of course post-partition Delhi has a different history and its architecture, values and trajectory have pulled it into the rise of democratic India, struggling with an imperial past and a colonial state. The most fascinating part, not unlike [in] other cities [of] South Asia, is the emergence of different cities within one metropolis. I have mentioned these stories in my book, yet I am cognizant of the [problematic] that an ‘outsider’ will never be able to write it all.

( A convert, Poaqer canot peek out of the tight Mush of Dogma)

In the days to follow, twenty-one Mughal princes were condemned, hanged and eliminated in a flash. Many more were shot dead and their corpses were displayed in Chandni Chowk to inform the public as to what would happen to rebellious subjects as well as to remind citizens about the brutal capabilities of the new imperial order. The British contemplated demolishing the Jama Masjid and the Red Fort. However, the exquisite Fathepuri mosque was sold to Lala Chunna Mal, a Hindu merchant, as his private property and the Zinatul Masjid was converted into a bakery. Buildings within a radius of 500 yards of the Red Fort were razed to ground. Structures around the Jama Masjid were also cleared in the name of martial orderliness. Quite symbolically, the buildings blocking the new wider roads and the planned railway line were also demolished.
The kuchas, galis and katras erased in the process represented a larger metaphor—the erasure of not just bricks, mortar and marble, but a centuries’-old way of life. An entire tehzib was dismantled and replaced. For Delhi this was nothing new though; each episode of human suffering is real and unique. Delhi’s melancholy was to stay, but counterpoised by the inner zest of its residents who had seen much worse and reinvented themselves like their beloved city.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 05:34
by anupmisra
Anujan wrote:Pasha's statements here are very revealing -- he is more extreme than Hamid Gul!! He is one beard and a vest away from being a Bin Laden himself. Actually tells the commission "Those who fear the ISI should fear the ISI".
Pasha is also Im the Dim's control and source of inspiration.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 05:39
by anupmisra
Jhujar wrote:Delhi by Heart: Writing ‘home’
http://tribune.com.pk/story/571876/delh ... ting-home/
Buildings within a radius of 500 yards of the Red Fort were razed to ground.
So Indians have the brits to thank for clearing up the mess around Lal Qila so that Independence Day can be celebrated with dignity and hundreds and thousands are able to attend that event.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 06:36
by Anujan
ramana wrote:They will most likely say report is fake and leaked to defame TSP H&D.
Actually no. The report has been leaked, I feel, as a step towards rehabilitating Pakistan. Now that Qatar taliban talks are nearby, Pakis want it as a package along with IMF loan, Unkil long term commitments and hegemony over Afghanistan (Afghanistan given to Pakistan as a munna) as a package. The report simply laments how "institutions are not functioning in Pakistan" and how they need nurturing, funding, leadership, political direction ityadi. It reads more like a report on why some flood disaster recovery didnt go according to plan rather than how a terrorist was hiding in the country, who concealed him, who supported him, why nobody was looking for him etc.

The report itself reads like some kind of babu-dom criticism about organizational structure rather than any criticism about Paki propensity to fund and nurture any and all kind of terrorists. So despite the few unkind words about Abbottabad Cantonment board, Traffic police, local police ityadi, everyone comes out smelling like roses. And it seems they would do better with more foreign aid and exchange visits.

Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - May 13, 2013

Posted: 10 Jul 2013 07:46
by ArmenT
Anujan wrote: * The report refers to Osama at several places as "The Shaikh". Actually has the sentence "It was a dark and moonless night (May 2)"
Seriously? It actually says that? You know what... this report should be submitted as a contender for the Bulwer-Lytton Bad Fiction Contest!! :D