Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 23 Sep 2013 05:54

Naidu is actually NOT negotiating from a position of relative strength in AP. that is his greatest weakness.
even after all the mess of INC, TDP cannot confidently claim that it can do what it once did with ease and competence: get a simple majority in the AP Assembly.

and BJP knows this. this is not 1998.

If BJP wants to play a role in AP in the long-term, more than just a TDP-B team, then they will exploit this opening.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 23 Sep 2013 05:56

with near 50 MLAs and barely single digit MP reps, I think it is ideal choice for naidu garu to look at something like yeddi is thinking. jmt

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 23 Sep 2013 06:03

I think TDP has around ~90 MLA's in power post-2009. they did recover quite a bit from the disaster of 2004. But the LS scenario remains more muddled.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 23 Sep 2013 06:04

Devesh garu,

CBN is paying for his mistake. He lost his value proposition with Telugus in 2004 and he blamed it on BJP and Hindus.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 23 Sep 2013 06:07

^^^
in one way, I'm happy that Naidu is now forced to eat his own past words, play good with BJP, and watch his mouth.
it is a lesson for all other non/anti-INC folks in AP. don't throw mud on the one force/power which is actually capable of sustaining a genuine non-INC movement/govt in the short/mid/long-term.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 23 Sep 2013 06:18

Narayana Rao wrote: sorry gurus, I underwent surgery a week back and bed. May have to be like this for two more months. So difficult to do better job with old tab.

Get well soon saar. Wishes for speedy recovery.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 23 Sep 2013 06:30

Any way that KKR can be pulled into BJP to give it a legup in the Seemandhra region? He is a decent guy not so much of a dynasty toad as the others, hence the proposition

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 23 Sep 2013 06:33

Oooooops

KKR would be an asset.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 23 Sep 2013 06:34

he's talking abut KKR, not KCR.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 06:49

what Modi is being quoted for around 15:00?

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 07:25

Desperation is showing!

Can ban opinion polls, says AG

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/can-b ... g/1172901/

Muppalla · Post by **Muppalla** » 23 Sep 2013 07:28

Dear Bengali friends, could some one post the translation of this article. This is Modi's strategy of alliances.

http://www.anandabazar.com/23desh2.html

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 23 Sep 2013 07:32

Sushupti wrote:[youtube]3vsSKlQ5RqQ[/youtube

what Modi is being quoted for around 15:00?

He was talking about a news item where some one said that NM promissed gas supply to Telangana.

The background is that KG basin gas is explored by reliance (IIRC Gujarat stare power corp also has some share) is being pipelined to Gujarat. Now someone is saying some of it will be given to Telangana.

The speaker is asking who is Gujarat to offer the gas drilled from KG basin to separate Telangana state.

***

Lot of nationalism is being built thru the T-Agitation on both sides. The new generations are learning the true history of Andhra Pradesh.

Apparently Sri Lanka national flag is given by telugus in history (remember reading about this story in two Telugu historical novels - Yugadi and SriLekha).

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 23 Sep 2013 07:42

Really hope that we dont end up with a patch work of regional alliances. That is the death knell to policy making and the regional satraps demand a lions share of blood money - 2G was DMK payments

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 23 Sep 2013 08:00

Jarita ji

I am not worried about it. The reason is that BJP asserted its vision for the first time and is prepared to go alone. Anyone joining in now will not have the power to change that vision.

This is the unique contribution of NM

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 23 Sep 2013 08:25

Sushupti wrote:

what Modi is being quoted for around 15:00?

It seems some gas is being shifted to Gujarat. The Gas sale to reliance is an issue for many years and Telugu politicos are making sounds for a long time. Some 7000 MG units are not used due to non availability of Gas and all gas is sold to MH, Gujarat etc and AP going to dogs. For example Rathnagiri plant in MH gets gas even if AP does not. There is a serious feeling that Mumbai fellows are cheating Telugu and not giving gas taken from AP Costha area. Modi may be getting some of this gas I am not sure. Reliance continue to play games and with possible division a move on their gas units by divided AP politicos can not be ruled out. If Vedanta can be stopped so can be Reliance and Modi or central leader can stop Telugu as they lost all authority after kicking Telugu people on their a** with division of AP. They may have to use force.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 23 Sep 2013 08:26

Sushupti wrote:what Modi is being quoted for around 15:00?

http://www.hindu.com/2009/02/22/stories ... 920400.htm
Gas supply assured

Mr. Modi assured supply of natural gas from Gujarat to Telangana and also help to the State’s progress on a par with Gujarat. He said that both Telangana and Andhra should progress like Gujarat on all fronts.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 23 Sep 2013 08:36

Gas is not going to be given to AP fellows.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 23 Sep 2013 09:07

Excellent idea - pack of playing cards being distributed in MP -

But why isn't BJP openly taking credit?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/indiahome/in ... adesh.html

Vamsee · Post by **Vamsee** » 23 Sep 2013 09:15

RamaY wrote: ***

Lot of nationalism is being built thru the T-Agitation on both sides. The new generations are learning the true history of Andhra Pradesh.

Apparently Sri Lanka national flag is given by telugus in history (remember reading about this story in two Telugu historical novels - Yugadi and SriLekha).

RamaY garu,
When you mentioned Srilekha above, I am assuming that you meant Mudigonda Sivaprasad gari novel Sri lekha.
I have been looking for over a decade to own Srilekha & Sravani (by same author). Do you have them or do you know where to get them?

Sorry for OT.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 23 Sep 2013 09:41

Katare wrote:
brihaspati wrote:I will anticipate the defender of Maulana's image : he was writing this without believing in what he was writing- for it was all a pretense/deception/rhetoric to convince and woo the "fanatical" muslim away from the idea of Pakistan. To be convincing enough he had to write all this stuff. He himself was a "nationalist" who did not think as he wrote.

Apart from this any other invention of lofty motivations would be of interest and most welcome.
There was no deception and there is nothing wrong in what he wrote. If u can write things frm hindu perspective why u deny others the right to do the same?

Oh I surely have every right to point out that he was not a "nationalist" even in the secular sense - because if the first and major part of that article was about how Partition would be about emulating bad-bad-"Brahminism", and how it would weaken Muslim capacity to retain Islamic distinctiveness and "shape" the whole subcontinent. He is entirely thinking of Islamic interests, and he has no space to think of the "Hindu". By experience, the increasing Islamic influence on the subcontinent means rape and genocide of the non-Muslim on the subcontinent. Since you find it all justified and laudable and nothing wrong - then of course you become a supporter of Islamic genocide. Nothing wrong per se with that - since we are according to your demand in an equal equal world onlee - where Islamism and Hinduism must be equated in their respective agenda.

But that was not the original point of debate. The point was the claim that he "had crossed over". He had not - as is clear from that article. His opposition to Partition was the same as that of the Deoband who agreed with the ML agenda of eventual Islamization of the whole of the subcontinent - but differed from ML onlee in the method, because they thought that the ML method would weaken Muslim power over the non-Muslim. So don't push him as a "nationalist" who "crossed over". His agenda was complete Islamization and therefore by long term implication complete Arabization and de-Hinduization of Bharat. His theology makes genocide a divine injunction and every cruelty and sadism and inhumanity known to man a divine sanction. And you are equating his theology with the "hindu"? Are Muslims in India living under Hindu Raj - as per his shrill complain - as exemplified by state protected/supported rape/abduction/murder/coercion/expulsion by Muslim regions within India on "Hindus"? Whom are you defending? More so - why? Masochism in some Hindus do play a role in trying to do a blanket cover up of images and agenda of the mullah - but what is it that is making you defend the indefensible ?

If you are justifying the Islamic agenda as an equally laudable to the Hindu one - would you care to say which value system you are adopting to equate sex-slavery on captive women as divine practice with another theology that does not do so? In none of its texts? or their interpretations? Do you stop and take to think on what two cultures or theological systems you are equating so desperately just to preserve the false claims by others about a Maulana's image?

There were better Maulana's at that period - who should have crossed your radar - and who had a greater stake to claims of "progressiveness" and post-Islamism than him. But of course they will not be discussed or brought up for whitewashing - because they were not around in the MKG/JLN axis.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 23 Sep 2013 09:53

By that logic - Pakis are entirely justified in what they are doing towards India, or the Indian army personnel they catch and mutilate - because after all it is justified for them to think of influencing the "whole of the subcontinent" and "shape" it from the Islamic viewpoint, and this is what Maulana Abul Kalam Azad's agenda was as per Katare ji's interpretation. More so a perfectly laudable and honourable one. A pefect example of why Indian society at the elite ch**** level is so paralyzed by the masturbatory orgasm of aman ki asha.

This is perhaps the chain of logic that angers people against NaMo, as a potential symbol of a force that does not recognize that honourable prerogative of the Muslim of the subcontinent? As laid out by the Maulana?

disha · Post by **disha** » 23 Sep 2013 09:59

ramana wrote:Marten whats the point? Its not like you are under any eye bee watch!!!

I long ago said NN was the PM replacement for MMS for the UPA.
The guy has a big ego with small brain.

I read his autobiography at a friend's house. It was signed copy.
The book is very shallow.

Nandan N is a shallow person is given (read his interviews on Adhaar and actual experiences for eg.). However an observation., hopefully the friend of yours is not flaunting the signed copy of NN's autobiography., if not then it appears your friend is also shallow. The product of the same 'C-System'.

The point I am trying to raise above is that we talk of the 'C-System' as if we are separate from it. It is not., we *are* the 'C-System'. Some participate in it willingly and make money out of it and others have no choice but to participate in it unwillingly.

So what differentiates "them" vs "us"? My POV., it is basically "India First". However the CongIs do not think in terms of "India First"., they have morphed into a caricature of a mafia organisation. Case in point - treatment of Baba Ramdev. Isn't Baba Ramdev citizen of India? Or he is citizen of Bharat and that is why he was detained?

Anyway, somebody asked me on this forums, why I personally have so much hatred towards CongIs?

But before we come to that can anybody tell what "Hyderabad Mirchi" is in the context of Emergency?

arindam · Post by **arindam** » 23 Sep 2013 10:24

Chiddu with "mine is bigger" statistics and lots of garbage. MSM is going gaga over this.

If there was a golden period of growth, it was the five year period under UPA 1: Finance Minister Chidambaram

The two worst years since the turn of the century were 2000-01 (4.3%) and 2002-03(4.0%): P.Chidambaram

By contrast, average for UPA1 was 8.4%, first 4 yrs of UPA2 average has been 7.3%: Finance Minister Chidambaram

I wonder why Shri Narendra Modi should stage a fake encounter with facts. Ultimately, facts will prevail: Chidambaram

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 10:32

Just in case one didn't know how deep are the roots of Dynasty

https://twitter.com/ambkcsingh/status/3 ... 1118607361

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 10:35

FYI onlee

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Sep 2013 10:43

See no pain on Modi’s face when he talks about riots: Mahatma’s granddaughter

This is the level of discourse in this country.

prahaar · Post by **prahaar** » 23 Sep 2013 10:55

Regarding the statement by MKG's grand-daughter.
The Indian political discourse is dominated by the following trickery by the so-called intellectuals, who want to back the current decrepit establishment:

1.Disregard explicit statements as unintentional if they are inconsistent with the purported high principles
2.Insinuate insincerity about valid statements made by inconvenient individuals/entities.

To maintain a facade of credibility, dynastic acolytes are cultivated and given undue importance, not in consonance with their contribution. Thus Numero-Uno dynasty utilizes subservient dynasties to keep hold on the masses.

To put in a more current language, the line management shown in company phone-books, having not much relation with how actually the work gets done. Our institutions represent those phone-books

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Sep 2013 11:09

Narendra Modi skips NIC meet, sparks Twitter war

I fail to see the purpose of this body itself.

But some of the twitter posts are hilarious.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Sep 2013 11:11

Must find a way to stop misuse of social media, PM says

This govt will do every thing in its power to muzzle free speech. But will not take the steps necessary to solve the basic problem.

All the more reason for this corrupt govt to go.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 11:13

Sanghvi, Thapar, Rajdeep, Barkha, Agniwesh , Amar Singh,John Dayal, Owaisi all part of National 'Integration' Council.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 23 Sep 2013 11:28

The biggest bunch of crooks in India.

Hari Seldon · Post by **Hari Seldon** » 23 Sep 2013 11:49

RahulM saar asked, show me some links about the development in Gujarat for rhetorical and persuasion purposes.

Here goes, saar, in easily digestable chunks too:

First 24x7 electricity, now 24x7 water (TOI, June 2008)
Madhya Pradesh goes the Gujarat way for power (May 2013, Biz Standard)

There is more in common between Gujarat and Madhya Pradesh than the fact that they are ruled by BJP governments. Both these states want to ensure uninterrupted power supply to their people.

In March 2006, Gujarat completed its Jyoti Gram Yojana to provide round-the-clock electricity to all consumers and at least eight hours of supply to farmers. This year, the Madhya Pradesh government has decided to undertake a similar programme, but with the promise of 10-hour supply for agricultural use. To begin with, Madhya Pradesh adopted the strategy of feeder separation (different distribution lines for farmers and other users), just as Gujarat did, and then steadily tied up long-term power supply.

There was another exercise that the states took up simultaneously: the unbundling of the power business to bring in corporate efficiencies. In 2005, the Gujarat government created Gujarat Urja Vikas Nigam Ltd (GUVNL) out of Gujarat Electricity Board as the holding company for seven entities with functional responsibilities of trading, generation, transmission and distribution. The same year, Madhya Pradesh also unbundled its power business and created government-controlled companies. Later, Madhya Pradesh also restructured Rs 11,491 crore of debt and took over the short-term exposure of banks to its distribution companies.

Guj provides *all* its villages in all its tehsils in all its zillas 24x7 power. Show me which comparable size UPA ruled state does so. And why not in so long?

#
This next one is about the fact that despite rising demand (farmers are now going for 3 crops instead of the earlier 2 because of water availability), ground water levels held stable and actually increased in some areas in Guj thanks to active water harvesting measures such as check dams.
A green rising (India Today, June 2010)

More than indifferent monsoons, this scarcity of water has been caused by over exploitation of groundwater and lack of water conservation measures at the micro level. The answer to this monumental challenge that stares at an otherwise resurgent India comes from Gujarat. The state shows the way in the form of a unique government-people partnership model for water conservation. There results are here to see.

In 2004, the water table of 112 tehsils of the total 225 tehsils in Gujarat was in semi-critical to over-exploited condition. But a satellite based survey done last year by the Central Ground Water Board (NGWB) found that as many as 60 of these 112 tehsils have regained their normal water table. What's more, the water table is rising further in many of these tehsils. Most of these tehsils are in Saurashtra and Kutch where the farmers and the government together have started a unique check dam revolution.

In the mid-90s, large parts of Saurashtra used to get water through train tankers from water-abundant areas of central and south Gujarat. Today it is a thing of the past. Earlier, many small rivers and rivulets in this region used to go dry by the end of monsoon. Now they have become almost perennial and several villages have become self-sufficient in water.
In the past 10 years, 1,05,000 check dams costing Rs.1,480 crore have been built in Gujarat under the government-people scheme. The villagers have contributed between 10 and 15 per cent of the cost in the form of labour while the Government has done the rest. Around 70,000 of these dams have been piloted by the state irrigation department and the rest by the state rural development department. These dams have a cap of Rs.15 lakh in terms of investment.

The mechanism for these check dam scheme is very simple. As and when a village committee wants to make a dam, it takes the local irrigation engineer to the selected spot. After seeing the spot, the engineer helps them select one of the six technical designs for a check dam. The six designs are finalised by the Government depending on the local geological conditions. Once that is done the department releases funds and the work on the dam begins.

#
This last one is on the third part of the bijli-sadak-pani trio. On Roads. Here's what the world bank said in 2011:
Gujarat roads closer to international standards: WB (TOI)

GANDHINAGAR: A top Planning Commission study, supported by World Bank, has said that Gujarat offers an example of international best practice in roads management. Authored by Clell Harral, Graham Smith and William DO Paterson, the study 'Lessons from International Experience: Road Asset Management' provides guidelines to the National Transport Development Policy Committee of Planning Commission on how reforms in Gujarat in the roads sector come closer to international standards for other states and developing countries to follow.

Yes, there's more on other "development" issues such as HDI. I best refer to Messrs J Bhagwati and A panagriya for that one:
Gujarat promises continued, accelerated and all-around progress: Jagdish Bhagwati & Arvind Panagariya (ET, Jan 2013)
This is an interview in which the noted economist authors explain their book's take on the Guj model and what it means for HDI among other things. Its a must read and in full (hard to excerpt from this one).

Hope that goes some way in resolving the Guj development model confusion. Of course, I notice google chahcha is throwing up eNREGA links a lot that try to "debunk" and "myth-bust" Guj's claims. I can see why they're so scared, having had nothing much to show in UPA ruled states in so long.

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 23 Sep 2013 12:10

General is unraveling unholy nexus of Dynaty-MSM and their castle seems to be crumbling.

The last tweet is the icing of the cake. Classic military tactic, leaving a bait. Now if UPAor Shekhar Gupta starts to wag their tails, then he will bring out CWG scam details. Then both UPeeAway and Shekhar Gupta will have no place to hide. Still this time, I am admiring him, now I am loving him.
P.S. The tweet series starts from down.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 12:14

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 12:17

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 23 Sep 2013 12:18

malcha marg..wow...very tier1 imo. all I get when walking around such locales is a scowl from the gangs of drivers/guards/malis, letting me know I dont belong there.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 23 Sep 2013 12:27

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Sep 2013 12:29

On the Subject of Kejeriwal, I am seeing Huge canvas hoarding on various traffic intersection in Delhi. Suggesting who a Delhite wants as the CM.

The interesting thing is that, he constantly is placing the BJP in the 3rd spot i preferences, with himself in the first position. Also, when I say BJP, he is specifically targeting Vijay Goyal.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 23 Sep 2013 12:30

http://indianexponent.com/forums/topic/ ... h-politics