Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): May 21, 2010

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 21 Jun 2010 23:39

Rahul Shukla wrote:This serves only one purpose: to embolden groups like the Pakistani Taliban who use the laws as justification to declare Ahmadis as "wajib ul qatl" or "worthy of death." As long as the state continues to decide who is and is not a Muslim—a personal, private question—we will continue to see attacks on minorities and medieval banners in the public square.

Actually the author got this part totally wrong. The purpose is not what he mistakenly imagines it to be.

Pakistan was created in the name of Islam with explicit protection and benefits for the Muslims. Having created a state this way, it then becomes necessary to define who the beneficiaries are -- if not, what prevents a Hindu from claiming that Prophet Mohammed was an avatar of Vishnu and so he, in fact, is a super-Muslim?

For people who are clearly not Muslims, like Christians, Hindus, Sikhs for example, the nitpicking is not harsh -- because clearly they are not Muslims. For people who are "ambiguously Muslims", a sharp distinction needs to be made. Are Ahmedis Muslims? Are Shias Muslims? Is a Deobandi true Muslim or a Wahabi true Muslim? Such philosophical questions need to be answered in the constitution. So the author needs to mend his sentence to

This serves only one purpose: to support the ideology of founding a state based on religion and to carry it to the logical conclusion: Unambiguously defining the set of people for whom the state has been created

Why blame the telibunnies? They just use this definition as a "roll-call" to find who to bomb to get their 72. That would be anyone who is not a true "Pakistani". Afterall, Pakistan==Islam

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 22 Jun 2010 03:00

. Unrest in Pakistan: Moving Beyond U.S. National Interest
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joshua-br ... 19629.html

The military is the muscle that protects the ruling elite from the wrath of the people," says Pakistani political analyst Dr. Mubashir Hassan. "Right now, people are out on the street; blocking roads, attacking railway stations, etc. If you read the papers, it seems as though a general uprising has started all over Pakistan."Dr. Hassan says that sporadic outbursts of anger in Pakistan won't coalesce into a people's revolution anytime soon. The demonstrators are too disorganized. But, the sheer volume of daily protests shows that many sectors of Pakistani society have pressing needs and priorities that do not include enlistment as foot soldiers in a proxy force for the United States' War on Terror.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 22 Jun 2010 03:06

http://www.aei.org/outlook/100967
Could the Taliban Take Over Pakistan's Punjab Province
( Long Essay)

A History of Punjabi Terrorism
Terrorism is not a new phenomenon in Punjab. Jihadist organizations and sectarian groups have existed in Punjab for nearly three decades. In the 1980s, Pakistan's military dictator, General Muhammad Zia-ul-Haq, nurtured radical Sunni militant groups as terrorist proxies against India over the control of Kashmir, for Pakistan had been defeated in the three conventional wars with India since the 1947 partition. Zia-ul-Haq also used these groups to suppress Pakistan's twenty-Shia minority, whom the Pakistani government saw as a security threat in the wake of the 1979 Islamic Revolution in Iran. Punjabi militants also took an active part in the Afghan jihad against the Soviets and, after 1994, helped the Taliban and al Qaeda establish a puritanical Islamic state in Afghanistan.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 22 Jun 2010 03:13

Satire Gets a Tough Reception in Pakistan

WORLDPakistan's Burqa Drama
For some, "Burqavaganza" is a funny love story in the time of jihad. For others, it mocks Islam. The government's recent ban on the play highlights Pakistan's liberal-conservative divide.

http://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/06/ ... -pakistan/

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 22 Jun 2010 06:33

Anujan wrote:
Pakistan was created in the name of Islam with explicit protection and benefits for the Muslims. Having created a state this way, it then becomes necessary to define who the beneficiaries are

Good post. Just a couple of additional points.

Beneficiaries of Islam as defined can only be in Pakistan. A happy or successful Indian Muslim is fatal to the Pakistani identity. Dead, maimed, raped or suffering Indian Muslims are the life-blood of the Pakistani. They are lucky because all Indian Muslims are dead, maimed, raped or suffering. A happy Muslim in India is the biggest threat to Pakistaniyat. To a Paki it indicates: "The reason for my existence and the existence of my country is pure bullshit"

Appeasement in India was part of the process of the bullshitization of Pakistaniyat. But that is OT.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 22 Jun 2010 06:49

Prem wrote:Satire Gets a Tough Reception in Pakistan
WORLDPakistan's Burqa Drama
For some, "Burqavaganza" is a funny love story in the time of jihad. For others, it mocks Islam. The government's recent ban on the play highlights Pakistan's liberal-conservative divide.
http://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/06/ ... -pakistan/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqog1vw3 ... r_embedded

There is an interesting comment in the video which the man says that there are two types of extremists in Pakistan - the Islamists and the liberals both of whom show a contempt for history.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Jun 2010 08:24

US envoy cautions Pakistan over Iran gas deal

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/art ... AD9GF0DCG0

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Jun 2010 08:27

Failed State Index (Pakistan is number 10)

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2 ... _from_hell

V_Raman · Post by **V_Raman** » 22 Jun 2010 08:29

shiv wrote: Appeasement in India was part of the process of the bullshitization of Pakistaniyat. But that is OT.

we have been saying this for a long time. when is the time to go in for the kill? when will GoI feel confident that IM is capable of guiding the pure to fall in line?

dont IM have sufficient incentive now in safeguarding india or we need more space given for them to get there? will they ever get there if given the space or exploit it to make more demands?

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Jun 2010 08:44

Illusions in Punjab

http://afpak.foreignpolicy.com/posts/20 ... _in_punjab

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 22 Jun 2010 08:49

SS-ji what is the meaning of Falah-e-Insanity??

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Jun 2010 08:51

Facebook's Zuckerberg facing the death penalty in Pakistan

http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/201 ... n_pakistan

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 22 Jun 2010 09:04

V_Raman wrote:
shiv wrote: Appeasement in India was part of the process of the bullshitization of Pakistaniyat. But that is OT.
we have been saying this for a long time. when is the time to go in for the kill? when will GoI feel confident that IM is capable of guiding the pure to fall in line?

dont IM have sufficient incentive now in safeguarding india or we need more space given for them to get there? will they ever get there if given the space or exploit it to make more demands?

OT. I have already written my thoughts on this in a BRM/SRR article.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 22 Jun 2010 09:05

abhishek_sharma wrote:Facebook's Zuckerberg facing the death penalty in Pakistan

http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/201 ... n_pakistan

Ho hum. One less tourist in Pakistan.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 22 Jun 2010 09:41

abhishek_sharma wrote:US envoy cautions Pakistan over Iran gas deal

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/art ... AD9GF0DCG0

I wish Unkil does not do this...for one it will give credence to Pakbarian demand for == nuke deal...another thing is a pipeline is much easier for small bands of Abdul's to target and maime, after they spend billions constructing it...even Unkil can do it for $2..

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 22 Jun 2010 09:51

pgbhat wrote:SS-ji what is the meaning of Falah-e-Insanity??

Welfare of the entire humanity ?

Recent reports suggest JuD may have a newer name, Idara Khidmat-e-Khalq. There is also another name under which it re-surfaced in Swat providing services to those affected by the Army operation, Falah-i-Insaniyat (Welfare of the Humanity). It uses the JuD flag and its Emir, Hafiz Abdur Rauf had earlier headed the Jamaat-ud-Dawa’s charitable wing, the Idara Khidmat-e-Khalq. Falah-i-Insaniyat has also been collecting funds for LeT under the banner Tanzeem-e-Azadi-e-Kashmir (Organisation for the Liberation of Kashmir) or also known as Tehreek-Azaadi-e-Kashmir (TAK).

Vril · Post by **Vril** » 22 Jun 2010 09:53

we have discussed the yindu-yamreeki-yehudi angle in pakistan but one angle which has yet to be explored to fullest to our advantage is the sunni -shia divide in the country.

it seems the sunni shia crack is more deep seated than hating yehudi-yindoos (per reports that saudi has allowed israel to use its air space against iran is an example)

So my preposition is that can we use this divide to prop up talibunnies, Jems, Lets, Sipah-e-Sahabas etc which market them as sunni saviours to instigate trouble against Infidel Iran, which is pre dominantly shia. Should not be a difficult job for our intelligence agencies. besides anyways pakistanis are losing control over some of them.

If we can ideologically finance these groups to wage jihad against shia iran and do some IED mubaraks ( if possible). rest our ahmadinijad is crazy enough to take the issue forward thus opening another front for pakistan to counter. their military assets would be stretched on three fronts and will give us some respite. plus we canshift theatre of engagement to iran and afghanistan than kashmir,pujab, gujrat and rajasthan.

Even unkil will not mind if there is trouble between neighbours as it will keep iran occupied with pakistan. besides we could help iran with some LACM ( No AshM as unkil could object) Brahmos to keep pakis worried.

just my 2 cents

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 22 Jun 2010 09:59

link wrote:"One has to understand where I'm coming from," Shahzad calmly replied. "I consider myself ... a Muslim soldier."

"It's a war. I am part of the answer to the U.S. terrorizing the Muslim nations and the Muslim people," he said. "On behalf of that, I'm revenging the attack. Living in the United States, Americans only care about their people, but they don't care about the people elsewhere in the world when they die."

"The people select the government. We consider them all the same," Shahzad said during the hour-long hearing.

AdityaM · Post by **AdityaM** » 22 Jun 2010 10:17

x posting from CRPF thread:
Pakistani officer kills CRPF constable in Liberia
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/crpf- ... er/636891/

The incident occurred at 4.45 am on June 8 when constables Jeet Singh and Kaptan Singh were on duty at their posts at the CRPF camp. According to reports, an “unidentified” man in fatigues entered the Indian camp and began firing indiscriminately.
An interim inquiry confirmed that the weapon abandoned at the spot belonged to a Pakistani officer, identified as one Lt Murad.
During investigations by UNMIL, 40 cartridges were found at the spot. These too had been issued to the Pakistani officer.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 22 Jun 2010 10:38

abhishek_sharma wrote:Illusions in Punjab
http://afpak.foreignpolicy.com/posts/20 ... _in_punjab

From the above,

Last week, while addressing a public rally in Lahore, JuD leader Hafiz Saeed described "suicide bombings as attempts at defaming jihad, alleging that the ‘bogey of Punjabi Taliban' had been invoked to justify an army operation in southern Punjab," and issued a warning that "those operations could not continue for long."

The above outburst by the Professor saheb needs some analysis. He blasts at those (the so called TTP and its Punjabi allies like HujI, JeM, Brigade 313 etc.) for indulging in suicide bombing as he has been doing so for a long time now. Nothing surprising there though we know some LeT elements are also embedded within them.

Then he goes ahead to blast the GoP for planning Army operation under the rubric of 'Punjabi Taliban'. He also seems to suggest that some PA operation is currently on-going in the Punjab which is not general knowledge. Why should he fear when the PA is on his side and the action is purportedly against those who 'defame jihad through suicide bombing' ? In fact, he should welcome such PA action because more foot soldiers seem to be joining the 'suicide bomber groups' than the 'fidayeen LeT' and the PA action could turn the tide.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 22 Jun 2010 10:41

AdityaM wrote:x posting from CRPF thread:
Pakistani officer kills CRPF constable in Liberia

Why did India agree to be in the same place where TSP troops were also located ?

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 22 Jun 2010 10:47

AdityaM wrote:x posting from CRPF thread:
Pakistani officer kills CRPF constable in Liberia
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/crpf- ... er/636891/
The incident occurred at 4.45 am on June 8 when constables Jeet Singh and Kaptan Singh were on duty at their posts at the CRPF camp. According to reports, an “unidentified” man in fatigues entered the Indian camp and began firing indiscriminately.
An interim inquiry confirmed that the weapon abandoned at the spot belonged to a Pakistani officer, identified as one Lt Murad.
During investigations by UNMIL, 40 cartridges were found at the spot. These too had been issued to the Pakistani officer.

My condolences to the family.

This indicates 2 things about the Pakistan army. Maybe I am generalizing, but here's a data point

1) Hate India indoctrination (well known)
2) Indiscipline to the level of loss of self control at officer level (hmm- that's interesting)

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 22 Jun 2010 10:55

Pakistan, Shi'a and Ahmediyya Stands
Ishtiaq Ahmed, of late, has been doing some blunt talking. First was a couple of articles where he said that Jinnah was aware of the 1947 plan to send tribesmen into J&K to grab it. Then there was an article criticizing Jinnah for pushing Pakistan into Islamism. Now, the above.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Jun 2010 11:17

I don't understand why NDTV is promoting a movie on Benazir Bhutto.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Jun 2010 11:26

Aides to U.S. General In Afghanistan Slam Obama - Report

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2010/06/ ... ystal.html

Some of the strongest criticism was reserved for Richard Holbrooke, Obama's special envoy to Afghanistan and Pakistan.

"The boss says he's like a wounded animal," a member of the general's team is quoted as saying. "Holbrooke keeps hearing rumours that he's going to get fired, so that makes him dangerous."

kancha · Post by **kancha** » 22 Jun 2010 16:28

shiv wrote:
1) Hate India indoctrination (well known)
2) Indiscipline to the level of loss of self control at officer level (hmm- that's interesting)

Another thing to note is that is was a junior officer - a lieutenant. If anything, it points to the fact that the younger lot that is signing up is a true representative of the fcuked up society.

Then there is the utter lack of (for the lack of a better word) "sophistication" in carrying out the "pious" intentions, and thereafter leaving behind the weapon that could be traced back.

One wonders why it took so much time for the incident to be reported ...

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 22 Jun 2010 16:40

Six die in Karachi shooting incidents
Tuesday June 22

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 22 Jun 2010 17:14

shiv wrote: There is an interesting comment in the video which the man says that there are two types of extremists in Pakistan - the Islamists and the liberals both of whom show a contempt for history.

The man who says that is Professor Syed Nomanul Haq.
One can find stuff about him, e.g., here:
http://www.sdpi.org/about_sdpi/research_staff.htm

Haven't found his writings on the web - was looking in case he has other interesting things to say.

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 22 Jun 2010 17:15

shiv wrote:
Anujan wrote: Pakistan was created in the name of Islam with explicit protection and benefits for the Muslims. Having created a state this way, it then becomes necessary to define who the beneficiaries are
A happy or successful Indian Muslim is fatal to the Pakistani identity. Dead, maimed, raped or suffering Indian Muslims are the life-blood of the Pakistani. They are lucky because all Indian Muslims are dead, maimed, raped or suffering. A happy Muslim in India is the biggest threat to Pakistaniyat.

Exactly. This above is a direct example from a movie called "Thank you for smoking" (Briefly: the tobacco companies wanted smokers to live whereas the anti-smoking brigade would want the smokers to die. All to prove a point about who was out to look out for whom). In the pajistani instance, the purpose of pajistan (and its very survival) is hinged on the IM not surviving in India (or being maimed, remaining poor, ignored, rioted against...) whereas, on the other hand, Indian "secularisms and pluralisms" are reinforced if IM survive (read: thrive) by giving IM (according to Indian pseudo-liberals) extraordinary benefits like reservations in daily life. Both parties are actively pursuing their agendas to prove their points. None can afford (or want to) to just leave the IM alone.

anupmisra · Post by **anupmisra** » 22 Jun 2010 17:23

SSridhar wrote:Pakistan, Shi'a and Ahmediyya Stands

This article is a keeper. Some facts will need to be verified. It actually describes the British behind-the-scene machinations to prod India (Read: Congress) into supporting Indian troops entry into WWII.

ajit_tr · Post by **ajit_tr** » 22 Jun 2010 17:31

There is a lady journalist Jana who posts heavily on pdf and blogs for dawn......

Persevering at her own peril

Peshawar-based journalist Farzana Shah fires back with a weekly blog from the Frontier.

Two days after I celebrated my birthday with friends and colleagues at my workplace, I received the following message on all my email IDs.

Farzana Begum,
We have been noticing your movements in and around Peshawar and see that you are going around in western dress and not dressing as per Islam. We want to see you in Hijab, else we will take suitable action like throwing acid or giving you lashes.
Hukum,
Taliban-i-Peshawar

This is her website
http://www.janashah.com/?p=17

James B · Post by **James B** » 22 Jun 2010 17:40

ajit_tr wrote:There is a lady journalist Jana who posts heavily on pdf and blogs for dawn......

Persevering at her own peril

Peshawar-based journalist Farzana Shah fires back with a weekly blog from the Frontier.

Two days after I celebrated my birthday with friends and colleagues at my workplace, I received the following message on all my email IDs.

Farzana Begum,
We have been noticing your movements in and around Peshawar and see that you are going around in western dress and not dressing as per Islam. We want to see you in Hijab, else we will take suitable action like throwing acid or giving you lashes.
Hukum,
Taliban-i-Peshawar
This is her website
http://www.janashah.com/?p=17

Looks like a porki publicity stunt. This skunk belongs to the Zahid Hamid, Ahmed Qureshi, Moin Ansari mould - full of conspiracies. This Porki also reads BRF.

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 22 Jun 2010 18:14

abhishek_sharma wrote:I don't understand why NDTV is promoting a movie on Benazir Bhutto.

Let me try.
Whoever killed such a charismatic personality is bad and are enemies of democracy>> Enemies of democracy in Pakistan are enemies of "piss in south asia" >> Pakistan and India face common enemy >> India must trust Pakistan "more" and act like an "impending super power" and make piss.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 22 Jun 2010 18:19

Pakisan to go ahead with Iran gas import defying the US

That is a good strategy. One of the biggest problems faced by Pakistan is lack of electricity. Their over-dependence on hydro power, lack of vision, poor distribution network and an expectation (some call it 'entilement') that the 3½ will always come to its help with money & oil has led to this situation. To rub salt into the gangrenous wound, the IMF has forced GoP to raise the electricity charges by a whopping 40%. Still, there cannot be any immediate solution to the power crisis as there is no investment going into this sector and it takes 4 to 5 years to build them anyway.

The next best thing is to accuse the Yankee-Yehudi-Hanadi satan of depriving the Muslims of their 'power'. One Muslim nation (eventhough it is a much hated Shi'a) is willing to help the other Muslim nation but the American satan is coming in between. The PPP can also shore up its dwindling support by defying the Americans. Nothing stirs up a Pakistani mind like defiance or hatred shown to the US.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 22 Jun 2010 18:32

Pakistan needs a nuclear deal with the US: Christine Fair

The study titled “Counterinsurgency in Pakistan” notes the vitality of “politically valuable initiatives” that Washington should take towards ensuring Pakistan’s sustained cooperation in the high-stakes’ struggle.

These initiatives should also include a free trade agreement between the two allies.

The nuclear deal for Pakistan “could be based on an exclusive relationship with the US, rather than seeking broad accommodation with the Nuclear Suppliers Group and other regimes that limit the proliferation of nuclear technology and access to materials for nuclear programs”, the authors suggest.

“Such a deal would confer acceptance of Islamabad’s nuclear programme and reward it for the improvements in nuclear security it has made since 2002,” the study notes.

Measures: Arguing for a criteria-based nuclear deal for Islamabad, the two researchers point to the fact that Pakistan has put in place a series of measures to improve its nuclear security since the revelation of Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan’s proliferation activities.

In exchange for fundamental recognition of its nuclear status and civilian assistance, Pakistan would have to meet two criteria, the scholars suggest, having to provide access and cooperation on nuclear suppliers’ networks and demonstrating sustained and verifiable commitment in combating all terrorist groups on its soil.

The deal, the researchers say, “would offer Pakistan benefits that it actually values and that only the US can meaningfully confer”.

The report also takes into account Islamabad’s call for a US nuclear deal and a non-discriminatory approach on the issue vis-à-vis Pakistan in the backdrop of the US-India nuclear deal. Pakistani officials argue that its sacrifices in cooperating with the US should merit comparable consideration.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 22 Jun 2010 19:17

Holding a gun to the Islamic head does pay off.

R Vaidya · Post by **R Vaidya** » 22 Jun 2010 19:33

http://www.spiegel.de/international/wor ... 09,00.html

A fascinating write -up -- It tells about Xerox Khan's role in Iran attempts to get the bomb and Pak duplicity

R.Vaidya

arun · Post by **arun** » 22 Jun 2010 19:36

ajit_tr wrote:There is a lady journalist Jana who posts heavily on pdf and blogs for dawn......

Persevering at her own peril

Peshawar-based journalist Farzana Shah fires back with a weekly blog from the Frontier.

Two days after I celebrated my birthday with friends and colleagues at my workplace, I received the following message on all my email IDs.

Farzana Begum,
We have been noticing your movements in and around Peshawar and see that you are going around in western dress and not dressing as per Islam. We want to see you in Hijab, else we will take suitable action like throwing acid or giving you lashes.
Hukum,
Taliban-i-Peshawar
This is her website
http://www.janashah.com/?p=17

James B wrote:Looks like a porki publicity stunt. This skunk belongs to the Zahid Hamid, Ahmed Qureshi, Moin Ansari mould - full of conspiracies. This Porki also reads BRF.

James,

IMO more the instinct of self preservation kicking in rather than a publicity stunt.

The individual Farzana Shah aka Jana Shah was reportedly a close acolyte of that bigoted Zaid Hamid. See this post here.

Zaid Hamid is now tainted with the guilt of associating with a blasphemer. In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan that puts you firmly in the cross hairs of a whole bunch of people with extermination on their mind.

With no discernable protection likely forthcoming from the ordinary Abdul and Ayesha’s of the Islamic Republic looks to me that Farzana Shah aka Jana Shah is making a bid for protective sympathy from the West by playing up “liberal” credentials of not wearing a hijab .

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 22 Jun 2010 20:09

arun wrote:Zaid Hamid is now tainted with the guilt of associating with a blasphemer.

And, also of killing Maulana Jalapuri, a noted Khatm-e-Nabbuwat leader. Zaid saheb is in trouble, very deep trouble.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 22 Jun 2010 21:27

Something to watch:
http://www.khudipakistan.com/

Why it might be of interest?
http://blog.dawn.com/2010/06/22/the-extremist-mindset/
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/u ... 459969.ece

E.g.,
http://maajidnawaz.blogspot.com/

Muslim scholars have traditionally viewed the Shariah as seeking to preserve certain fundamental goals (Maqasid) as vital necessities, upon which the whole of the Shariah is built and in fact the rest of the rules are just means (Wasail) to realize them.

These would be the preservation of religion, intellect, family/lineage, life and property. Muslim theologians also believe that these are universal values. Muslim scholars have explained that these aims are fundamental interests (Masalih) that societies seek. And the rest of the rules were means to do so.

Maajid Nawaz argues that laws that maintain these goals are compatible with the Sharia and so Muslims can shed their medieval mode of thinking, and come up with modern laws that preserve these values.