Bharat Rakshak

jaibhim wrote:The circus called kafila.org, a maoist mouthpiece and twice born bhadralok communist paradise dreaming spot they all want to somehow, desperately want to give the land of the pure the cashmere sweater and every atrocity committed by it is okay other than if it's the Indian jawan...Burkha' thats not fair we want piss, na as a big bindi wearning jhola activist would remark as Burkha listened into get some khabar...

Jinhe aitaraaz hai Hind par woh yahan hain....yahan hain, yahan hain, yahan hain....

Rahul M wrote:put some minimum thought into your posts. we are fantasizing about beheading people ? what's this ? pakistan ?
it's tasteless and uncivilized.

Kufr moderator bliss to read this

pgbhat wrote:CIA Birather Bruce Reidel : And we should encourage India to be more conciliatory on Kashmir, by easing border controls and releasing prisoners.

CRamS wrote:This naive BS stands apart from an otherwise reasonable article from Riedel. Does he really believe that the so called "Kashmir conflct" is about border control and prisoners?

Upendra wrote:Easing border controls will aid terrorists in easily crossing over , behead people and go back to pakistan to be honored as ghazis. This will help pakistan revive its flagging economy by spending less on the travel expenses of terrorists. This a worthwhile suggestion to consider. WKK's will enthusiastically volunteer for this exciting new beheading program. Of course for the sake of peace we have to make some sacrifice, so why not sacrifice the WKK? What do you say birathers? Shall we prepare a list of WKK volunteers to urge them to give peace a chance.

List of WKKs who should consider volunteering for Behead4Peace campaign
Kuldip Nayar
Dileep Padgaonkar
Harinder Baweja
Gautam Navlakha
Barkha Dutt

Please suggest more names of WKK's

menon s wrote:http://nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-news ... e-Railways

Awami Muslim League chief Sheikh Rashid Ahmed while saying that railways has not even diesel for one day, questioned what would happen if we have to send supplies to the borders in case of any emergency.
He added that Pakistan’s arch rival India has secured all the time 70 to 90 days additional oil stock for the army.

trains are kufr technology, no need for them. pakistan has goats , these brave servants of mard-e-momin will carry pakarmy on their back to fight the kufr indian army. training exercises have already begun.

abhishek_sharma

>>In any case, people stopped defending B. Raman very soon.

Assuming that by "people" you meant me, since you linked to my post "something very weird is going on" - that was not intended as critical of B. Raman's article. I have no view on that. Like I said B. Raman has done a lot for the country, and he knows what he is doing. So in that sense it was not a "defence" of B. Raman that I'm attempting, rather moderating on BRF to prevent nonsensical and unfounded allegations being taken as fact and the forum being undermined by that.

If by "people" you did not mean me, please ignore the above post.

sum wrote:
Will continue scratching my head in a dark corner trying to understand the == between a pic of a president sitting with some people to help overthrow a 3rd country govt and the pic of a Foreign minister of a govt dealing with some hijackers who have 200 odd citizens under their gunpoint to help get them back home..

Tamasoma jyotirgamaya

Let me throw light into your dark corner

You are puzzled at the connection between US President Ronald Reagan sitting with Afghan Mujahideen in his living room comparing them with America's founding fathers and Indian Foreign minister Jaswant Singh seen hanging out with Afghan Mujahiddeen in Afghanistan where he exchanged three dangerous Pakistani Islamic Extremists for the lives of 200 Indians in a hijacked aircraft?

The connection is the greatness of the superpower USA that helped arm and fund the mujahiddeen who later won a magnificent victory for America in the cold war - making the evil empire, the Soviet Union run back to Siberia with its tail between its legs. Having failed to get the warm water Indian ocean port that they were allegedly seeking.Contrast that with the weakness of India where the Indian government had to beg and give up three terrorist prisoners to the Taliban who accepted them on behalf of Pakistan.It is the US that now controls all those warm water Indian ocean ports room where they will soon give freedom and democracy to Afghanistan and free trade to Central Asia. Those 4 CBGs in ths Indian Ocean are not there for show unlike our ADS.

Being a superpower means not being a weak kneed, spneless, lily livered, yellow bellied bunch. It should have been possible for India to threaten Pakistan like Armitage did and make the Pakis crap in their shalwars and then use bases on Pakistan to take out Afghanistan as the US did in a few weeks after 9-11.

That is how a superpower works. Not by weakness. By strength. India's terrorism problem continues because of India's weakness. We would do well to learn from the US that set the whole thing right in a matter of weeks. The US's military strength is unmatched. A free society that encourages merit and does not like to live in the past, seeing old ghosts and fighting old battles and clinging on to old friends. If India had been like America - the problem would have been solved decades ago. The way the US dominates pipsqueak Pakistan is something to marvel at. The US barks and the Pakistani dog jumps to attention and gives them what they want, and the US gives nothing in return. The US has never had to meekly give Pakistan anything. If anything it was given non meekly with great strength.

Now you can come out of your hole...

Jinhe aitaraaz hai Hind par woh yahan hain....yahan hain, yahan hain, yahan hain....


...Ab meri chand do baten sunen,kumvenpu rutha chinmaya antha ondu haadu helidaru, bendre aaavaga helidru, naanu idu heltini.. jo vatan par martehain aur jan bhi dete hain, har khwab me, haur daur me, har dam me , pal pal, niswarth dard letehain, desh ke bare me sochte hain, jo vatan prem ka shor sharaba nahi karte,bas deskh ki bhalayi bharatvarsh [aapko shayad yajur ved ka shlok yaad hoga [hum jaise log bachpan se sikhte hain wo zehen me hai khoon me hai] par kadr karte hain uhe to airtaraz to hoga hi
Kisse chilaye ki aao meri deskhbakti suno, kisse se munsafi mange,koi peeetha hai kya dhidhora ki maa aur janani se pyar nahi hai zalim ho jhoot bolega, chetana aur satya andar se aati hai who ataman ka hissa hota hai saheb,
Ise behter hai kar ke dikhaye baten to baten hi rah gayi, sab ka waqt ayega, sab ka mauka ayega zindagi me ahbi sikhne ka waqt hai , jo desh ke liya karna hai karlenge, zindagi bhi saakshat hai yeh choti hai haar aadmi keliye yam dev intezar karte hai zahil hai ki woh koi bhi ho, aur kya batyen rig veda ke pankti jo aatman ki khoj ke bare me bolti hai! sab ka expiry date nischit hai, tab tak har waqt desh ki pooja to humkarenge yogi jaise

Janani desh hai uar jyada uspar tippani karna to bewakoofi hai. Bhagat singh ko to koi certificate nahi mila, Netaji ko nahi chan logon ko diya gaya, aur kahi hai Khudiram bose, Balgandahar Tilak, baki jinhone maar khayi zandan ki diwaooron me mare gaye kutton ka maut mara bhi.



Now coming back Mr.Seldon, do you mean by that cryptic statement Mr.Seldon? Is that directed at individuals?
I hope it is not. In all my posts, I have pointed out and ridiculed these guys and lambasted their treachery and i believe commies are as dangerous as jihadis. I am much younger to you in age it would seem to me, in terms of experience on strategic studies and i do not have power to turn policy which you might well have. One can contribute what one sees. I must thank BR however, for giving directions to develop thought in that direction in terms of knowing what to look and what to look and finding discussions that talk of a great India. I can best play the role of whistle-blower.
A strong and powerful nation is every Indian's dream and finding ways to realise that and a visceral hatred for the land of the pure was one of the reasons trying to find like minded people. I don't think any desh-bhakt who will defend the country to the last breath, can function in such a scenario and it sometimes is best to be a silent spectator and that too by certificates on others being awarded with regard to patriotism and loyalty which is more than drawing room activism, based upon mere conjectures of people unknown and never encountered. Sorry for intruding into your freemasonic society, if you think i have it was done with idealistic intentions just like Netaji as a young person to serve India. I will not be deterred i will serve mother India
Karmanye vadhikaraste ma phaleshu kadachna
Karmaphalehtur bhurma te sangostvakarmani.

Jai Hind Vande Mataram

A B. Raman article:Many more Abbottabads waiting to be discovered in Pakistan
http://www.srilankaguardian.org/2011/10 ... to-be.html
Find a coalition of the willing within Pakistan to root out terrorists....

upendra, I know quite well how that chain started, thank you. I had to intervene when it went from bad to worse. I stand by my comment. also, try not to do a BENIS-fication of this thread. post pictures with funny captions in BENIS.

Magoo is no match for Jaswant Singh...Jaswant was a true man..It was not his decision to escort the terrorists ..(or freedom fighters if someone might please ) Jaswant singhs little finger is more of a man than whole Khar-loving magoo..

Jaswant did a brilliant job as a finance minister..It is his policies than we saw the rapid growth of the previous decade (which the UPA claims as theres) ..ABV's government reduced public debt and fiscal deficit..the money saved by them was so mindlessly squandered by the Pakophilic geniuses of the NAC...


Reagen or muj hardly deserves credit for the Afghan war.. Soviets decided to leave in 86 itself... It was only later that the mythical "stinger missile" came...And it was hardly successful.. Soviet strikes devastated Afghan...

And dissolution of su or breaking of berlin war too has nothing to do with the success of real-politiks...the soviet economy had miserably failed due to its own faults... People in soviet colonies had to stand in line to get a loaf of bread...such an economy was hardly sustainable.. and had to break...

The americans claiming victory in cold war was similar to musharraf claiming tactical brilliance or paki claiming victory in 65 or 71...no wonder the Paki's have a special relation ship with the Americans ..
Birds of a feather flock together.. Howzzat for ==..

shiv wrote:

sum wrote:
Will continue scratching my head in a dark corner trying to understand the == between a pic of a president sitting with some people to help overthrow a 3rd country govt and the pic of a Foreign minister of a govt dealing with some hijackers who have 200 odd citizens under their gunpoint to help get them back home..

Tamasoma jyotirgamaya
..............
Now you can come out of your hole...

Will take some time to understand and digest all the gyaan given out in the single post full of pisskology...
Will be back when digested and target locked!!

sum wrote: Will take some time to understand and digest all the gyaan given out in the single post full of pisskology...
Will be back when digested and target locked!!

Look at this news item for instance
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/news ... wsid=16035

Pak-based groups funding home-grown terrorists

Now Pakistan is a wealthy country, and is able to afford to pay for all sorts of things. They can afford sophisticated arms like F-16s, AMRAAMs, Huey helicopters and NVGs and they can afford to fund terrorists to attack India. India should do nothing to help the Pakistan army and ISI get money. In an ideal world, no one else should pay Pakistan either. The Chinese are against India and they help Pakistan.

Who else? Well the US too gives money to Pakistan, but the US is a superpower and will do things in its interest. Paying the Pakistan army is in its interest. Houses in Abbottabad cost money. As do AMRAAMs and WLRs. India should learn from America and do what America does to Pakistan. America may be paying Pakistan 3 billion a year but look at the wonderful results they get. Pakis snap up at attention and serve massa when the US snaps its fingers. India should be like America. But India should not pay money to Pakistan. India should be like America without paying jiziya. India paying Pakistan money is jiziya. US paying money to Pakistan is "superpower acting in its interest". Not jiziya. The latter is a sign of strength. the former is weakness.

Comprendez? Not to worry if you don't. I don't either.

shiv wrote:

sum wrote:
Will continue scratching my head in a dark corner trying to understand the == between a pic of a president sitting with some people to help overthrow a 3rd country govt and the pic of a Foreign minister of a govt dealing with some hijackers who have 200 odd citizens under their gunpoint to help get them back home..

...

The US barks and the Pakistani dog jumps to attention and gives them what they want, and the US gives nothing in return. The US has never had to meekly give Pakistan anything. If anything it was given non meekly with great strength.

Now you can come out of your hole...

sum-saar and Doc-saar, that bolded line above is the key!

The geniuses at Monty Python has a sketch for understanding that statement......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbPWt5yzDLE

If you have minstrels like US media (and some posters here), Sir Robin always remain brave. Anyone who says "nay" shall be outsung

The Quetta Shura are the the three headed creature who is discussing purity amongst themselves and is looking around for where Sir Robin went, feeling a bit cheated.

Such hue and cry was raised when PNS Babur saved Indian sailors from MV Suez and the whole media and the sailor's family members were all gung-ho about Govt./IN inaction and how PN was an angel in disguise. Their act of transgression and the fact that INS Godavari had reached there earlier was swiftly passed under the carpet and people were highlighting all peace with the Pakis. Makes me think what would have been the reaction if the GOI had acted tough on the hijackers or taken any other action?? The whole Govt. would be made to fall and people would vie for their blood I suppose!!! Whatever they did was the only option and was the best one, and came after many discussions and brainstormings! Btw the US also has opened its doors to peace talks with the Haqqanis who have the blood of so many US soldiers on their hands!

Altair wrote:

shiv wrote: Hence the effete "pinprick attacks" by unmanned ("womanned?"/chudiyan type) UAV attacks against two or three people at a time. I am guessing that one Predator mission against one Talibunny must cost at least a million daalahs.

Shiv
I think that US does not want to see beheading of US soldiers on camera. They simply do not want to see those images on youtube and broadcasted in US. The damage to morale and H&D would be much higher than million dollars. Even if he is not beheaded the ransom demand would be more than 10 times the average predator op. Its economics and H&D.
JMT
Altair

There are two ways to defeat the enemy.

1. Invade the nation, kill the enemy and occupy the lands and rule the defeated nation.

2. Kill the enemy leadership and keep doing it until the local leadership and population submits. Trade can be built to ensure the total domination (in governance, policy, and economy) later.

Massa is going with strategy 2 as it is cheaper than strategy 1. Iraq war cost ~$1T. At $1M per attack USA can organize 1 million predator attacks in Pakistan with $1T budget while not losing a single US life.

At 2 pigs per attack, Pakistan will be have 2 million less jihadis and jihadi leaders. That is more than TSPA + ISI + Good Taliban.

Self deleted

Shiv wrote: You are puzzled at the connection between US President Ronald Reagan sitting with Afghan Mujahideen in his living room comparing them with America's founding fathers and Indian Foreign minister Jaswant Singh seen hanging out with Afghan Mujahiddeen in Afghanistan where he exchanged three dangerous Pakistani Islamic Extremists for the lives of 200 Indians in a hijacked aircraft?
The connection is the greatness of the superpower USA that helped arm and fund the mujahiddeen who later won a magnificent victory for America in the cold war - making the evil empire, the Soviet Union run back to Siberia with its tail between its legs. Having failed to get the warm water Indian ocean port that they were allegedly seeking.Contrast that with the weakness of India where the Indian government had to beg and give up three terrorist prisoners to the Taliban who accepted them on behalf of Pakistan.It is the US that now controls all those warm water Indian ocean ports room where they will soon give freedom and democracy to Afghanistan and free trade to Central Asia. Those 4 CBGs in ths Indian Ocean are not there for show unlike our ADS.

a different perspective. After 20 years of their great history, those very forces that they created pulled US into a $T war.

After 10 years of that submission to Taliban, India signed a strategic partnership treat with Afghanistan.now it is unto India if it want to avenge the events of 2000.

Upendra wrote:[this

pgbhat wrote:CIA Birather Bruce Reidel : And we should encourage India to be more conciliatory on Kashmir, by easing border controls and releasing prisoners.

CRamS wrote:This naive BS stands apart from an otherwise reasonable article from Riedel. Does he really believe that the so called "Kashmir conflct" is about border control and prisoners?

Forget about Kashmir,I think Pakunkstan will easily settle the dispute if USA offer Kalifornia to them. Plus this will make the only true allie come close to remove any doubt. Bruce Reidel can be US Consel general in in this neighboring State of Poakanistaniat. Thie new territiory can be renamed Kiyanifornia and SMF as Sucker-me-into-bad.

Reagen or muj hardly deserves credit for the Afghan war.. Soviets decided to leave in 86 itself... It was only later that the mythical "stinger missile" came...And it was hardly successful.. Soviet strikes devastated Afghan...

Won't go in the specifics for the above, but your direction is right. Too many people are awed thinking that real politik drive what happens around us. People tend to underestimate how events have their own momentum pushing decision making and leaders or nations up and down the ladder of greatness. These imperatives again are derived from core value systems, ideologies and doctrines though in the actual theater of conflict, exceptions and alliances based on them are quite the norm. The ability of a great civilization/ nation/ empire is the ability to understand that. Those who don't stand for something, fall for just about anything. The impulse to jump the quick bandwagon to making use of exceptions to further the rule, without a sustained attempt to solidify the core value and alliances that stand by your value system is fraught with danger for the very people one professes to lead are confused by what the Nation stands for, leading to an inevitable cacophony of interests and thus jeopardizing the value systems one wants really to stand for. India's weakness is seen in that light of failing to lead and must not be dismissed. Everyone is cqpable of seeing things through the prism of truth, everyone is also capable of distorting the perspective when seeing things through the prism of real politik.

It' the Paki RAPE that play real politik which everyone here is familiar and much too aware a failing game. Real Politik in Afghanistan which stands daily exposed even in an otherwise sympathetic West. OTOH The Taliban, AQ don't play real politik. They play up exactly what they believe in, however grotesque. There is nothing 2 faced about the Taliban honestly. They don't want women to be educated, or men too for that matter. They want beards and chopping hands and legs and a complete literal interpretation of the 7th century manifesto. India or for that matter any country will have difficulty dealing with a 2 faced hypocritical entity playing real politik, than a straight up Talib type entity in power in Pakistan. I think many have exposed this aspect quite well here.

^^
California for Pakistanis to solve nuke flash point of the world. Bring Pakis home, end GWOT.

shiv wrote:That is how a superpower works. Not by weakness. .....
.....The US has never had to meekly give Pakistan anything. If anything it was given non meekly with great strength.

Hakim F Paracha garu, that was simply awesome.

^^^
I look at Jaswant Singh's eyes and I see fear. He is genuinely terrified for himself and the people involved in that situation. Yet he still went, because it was his duty. There was courage demonstrated there that all these massaland worshipers won't understand. This is a consequence of the region of the world we live in. We don't get to walk away, or take time outs or speculate airy-fairy unfair thoughts or even tune it out. The missiles, both human & nuclear are aimed directly at our hearts and this is something no one who lives in massaland long term can understand either.

India, all cowardly, refusing to spoil for a fight, gets pushed around, is not a real nation, has no balls, etc around to the massaland crowd on this board. Courage is easy when you call NPR to complain about TSP. When it is your children and family in the crossfire courage is for fools. No one in India wants a situation where we are at war with TSP. No matter the provocation.

As Monty Python says..

He was not at all afraid to be killed in nasty ways.. Brave Sir Robin...

...When danger reared its ugly head,
He bravely turned his tail and fled.

Brave Sir Robin...

shiv ji, others - You are quite correct in equating Indian folding over in face of terrorism born in the paki with the US bending over to accomodate the same, other than, in absolute $$ terms, the US pays a lot more (maybe not in PPP terms, then India maybe pays the same amount). But then, while there may be an eqeq between India and the US, there is none between the paki and the US, any more than there is between India and the paki. As I follow the dumb US policies towards the paki streaming out of Dawshington WeSee, so also, at least once a week, I get over to the NASA & other sci, arts, tech. web sites and check out, among other things, the breath taking images straming in from the moons and the planets to appreaciate what the US does so well. No, there is no eqeq between the US and the paki, anymore than there is between the paki and India, and indeed, India, in its own modest way contributes just as well to expanding knowledge as the US does. Let us not get confused on who is on the side of expanding human knowledge and civilization here.

Another perspective one has to factor in when talking to Pakistan is the growing bacteria in the bottle scenario. Paki decadal growth rate is around 25%. Now imagine bacteria inside a bottle doubling every second and filling the bottle up in 60 seconds. At the 58th second the bottle is just 1/4th full. A complacency amongst the 'bacteria' oh the bottle is 3/4th empty..plenty space. 59th second it's half full..and yes half empty. After 60th there's no place to grow..one has to eat another to survive.

For sustainable development, Paki's have no place for growth now. They are past the 59th second figuratively. 300 million Paki's are projected by 2050! There's no place really, not enough water or food to sustain that many there. Pakis are neither the bacteria in a bottle with no place to move out..they will seek to expand, collaborate with bacteria elsewhere..set up expansion zones. I think the Paki RAPE know this aspect much better than most Indian WKK type page 3 socialites. Thinking solutions in a status quo'ist mould of things won't help finding clues to solving the Paki problem either. Imagine when the IWT was made..Paki's were just 30 million. India itself has added in the last decade what the world population was in 1300. IF one takes decadal growth of Muslims in the subcontinent is outstripping anything we've witnessed in scale before.

We may not be on the 59th second for the bacteria in the bottle, but solutions just don't develop in the 57th or 58th second also. For India control of river water systems originating in the Tibetan plateau the Kailash Mansarover regions is a must. For that India must start to derecognize China's claim on Tibet and openly declaring it's legacy on Kailash Mansarover region. We don't stand a chance 100 years from now if we don't do that for starters now.

abhishek_sharma wrote:

Nandu wrote:ramana, that poster of Reagan is simply wrong.

As I said before, without knowing the identity of those people, how can you call them terrorists? And the associated quote by Reagan was definitely not made regarding anybody in Afghanistan (it was about Nicaraguan contras).

I am just correcting misinformation posted in this thread. If you consider this off topic, then so should the original picture be.

It is easy to find at least two sources:

From The Atlantic

Ronald Reagan, welcoming Afghan mujahideen to the White House in 1985, referred to his guests as "the moral equivalent of America's Founding Fathers."

And this is from a book link

The myth has been circulating on the internet for a long ime, especially after 2001-9-11, so it is not surprising that it would show up in a few places like a monthly or a book, but that doesn't make them "sources".

A real source would be a newspaper report from 1985 itself. But here is an even better source. Reagan was PotUS, and all his speeches during his presidency are recorded. Here is the "moral equivalency" speech.
http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=38274


Af for the the turbaned people who we see with Reagan in that pic, all I said is, we don't know their identities, and in particular whether they can be considered forerunners of the Taliban, as opposed to being forerunners of our allies, the Northern Alliance.

If they rated a WH visit, they can't be unknowns, so why not figure out who they are before running with an internet myth?

And to bring this back on topic for this thread, I want to point out that this pic, and that quote, are used by CT minded Pakis (which is most of them) as proof that American is duplicitous in using them like a condom and discarding them.

Nandu wrote: The myth has been circulating on the internet for a long ime, especially after 2001-9-11, so it is not surprising that it would show up in a few places like a monthly or a book, but that doesn't make them "sources".

Maybe. If "books" and "reports" print and publish "myths", then I don't have much to say. Since you are the self-appointed arbiter for separating wheat from chaff, maybe you should start a thread and we will religiously read it.

Nandu wrote: A real source would be a newspaper report from 1985 itself. But here is an even better source. Reagan was PotUS, and all his speeches during his presidency are recorded. Here is the "moral equivalency" speech.
http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=38274

So? Each word spoken by him is recorded there? And how many newspapers had an online version in 1985?

The link posted by you is not "the" moral equivalency speech. Why do you believe that he used the phrase just once?

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index ... z1ayuplBHS

To watch the courageous Afghan freedom fighters battle modern arsenals with simple hand-held weapons is an inspiration to those who love freedom. Their courage teaches us a great lesson—that there are things in this world worth defending.

Yes, it is. Did you actually read it, because he also refers to the Afghan resistance in it.

I have not found the identities of the people in that photo, though if people want to do further research, here is a video of it, which might be helpful. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3f9mlUQzJA

In the speech I linked above, notice that Reagan refers to one Afghan resistance fighter by name and says, "Abdul Haq, we are with you".

Here is how Abdul Haq died: http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2001/oct ... fghanistan

shravan, the claim was about that particular quote. It is not in dispute that Reagan actually supported the Afghan mujahideen.

harbans wrote:For sustainable development, Paki's have no place for growth now. They are past the 59th second figuratively. 300 million Paki's are projected by 2050! There's no place really, not enough water or food to sustain that many there. . Imagine when the IWT was made..Paki's were just 30 million. India itself has added in the last decade what the world population was in 1300. IF one takes decadal growth of Muslims in the subcontinent is outstripping anything we've witnessed in scale before.

Afghans disinfecting Poak Bacteria will make sure they eat each others in Poakbottle . Btw, Poaks are gonna be 385Million by 2050 unless they go on Purifying spree to clean the polluted ones among them to reduce their Nafri. Statistically ,They will suffocate before they die with thirst.By 2020 , their 3.5 Maassas will have to dole out 40-50Billion a year and then double of this amount by 2035 thus becoming the most expensive Bichon Frise in the whole world.

Nandu wrote:because he also refers to the Afghan resistance in it.

It does not imply that he did not talk about Afghans before/after that speech. samjhe?

nandu:

re:

as opposed to being forerunners of our allies, the Northern Alliance.

"our allies"? not if you mean bush/clinton who tried all means of trying to wipe them out, and clinton, particularly, tried to make all kinds of deals with the talibunnies. "our allies" refers to allies of India, Russia & Iran until 9/11.

As for the paki complaining of being used as a condom, that is how they feel. They signed on to do a job for the US. They negotiated a price (remember al huk complaining to Carter that his offer was "peanuts"). They were paid to carry out a contract. They did the job, got paid for it. If they feel like condoms, that is their own deal. Nothing wrong with it as far as the rest of the world is concerned. No one owes the paki the time of day after the contract is done. Why are you adding your whine to their's.

As to who the turbaned guys are, matters not. The issue here was that those guys got flipped good/bad (talibunnies), or bad/good(northern alliance) depending on US policy needs, both freely chosen, not under compulsion of a hijacking, or under blackmail for hijacking hostages.

How true is this? Can someone verify its veracity?

Pakistan’s role in Afghanistan’s reconstruction

Nandu wrote:
And to bring this back on topic for this thread, I want to point out that this pic, and that quote, are used by CT minded Pakis (which is most of them) as proof that American is duplicitous in using them like a condom and discarding them.

Cut the crap.

Are you one of those Indian Americans who follow in the footsteps of their white American compatriots who like their Jihadi counterparts blindly worship Regan, alongside the founding fathers and believe they are nothing short of demi Gods who are imbued with righteousness? And the political correctness is so cast in stone that anybody dare challenge this myth is un-American.

It is true that US has been utterly duplicitous in the manner in which GWOT is conducted and discussed at home. Any half-arsed introspective people will question US policies in hob knobing with the very same terrorists who they are fighting now. A good reasonable 10the anniversary of 9/11 that concluded recently would have at least touched upon this with some determination to never again repeat such a collosal mistake of colluding with such evil scum. Instead, all we saw is cart loads of self-obsessed, replulsive, emotional self pity focused on who did what and who ate what and who wore what on 9/11. I was so disgusted that everytime another one of those sob narratives was on, I would switch the TV or radio off.

It is also true that US used TSP and then discarded them in this sense. TSP correctly argues that US used them, along with other terrorists like them including Bin Ladin & Talibunnies in fighting the Soviets. And now US is fighting the same scum. And TSP is demanding from US to apply the same standard, namely, support TSP in its use of the same scum aginst India and deliver India, "freedom for Kashmir" as TSP calls it. US has not had the b@lls tostand up and say, yes, we did side with the terrorists against the Soveits, but we have paid a huge price. But it is now time to make amends and get rid of all terrorists, and there is no such thing as good terrorists and bad terrorists. And India is the world's largets democracy, and US will not support TSP's use of terror as an instrument of state policy against India. Let US come out and say this.

Btw, Poaks are gonna be 385Million by 2050 unless they go on Purifying spree to clean the polluted ones among them to reduce their Nafri.

My error, but that 385m figure is a poor estimate IMHO. If one just takes the present decadal growth one arrives at 500 million poakroaches by 2050. The 385 m figure is possibly assuming decadal growth amongst the roaches will decline. They have no planning programs like India has had last 60 years or so. Nothing and nothing is happening towards that. Not a single paki media article focusses on that aspect. Education, literacy, economy are going down the drain..all indicators to high growth rates not reduction in decadal terms..so we are talking over 500m by 1050 for Paki's..but then something big has got to give under such a scenario. Something bigger than what has happened all over the last 1500 years in the subcontinent..and this is about in our lifetimes. Not much beyond it. Yet it doesn't quite get the attention it deserves.

Rohit_K: check out your link before posting. It is, as usual, hilarious.

lies

pakistan^^today

CRamS, please be civil.

Second book



Third Book



And this article is about Hekmatyar

Afghans, in contrast, remember very well. Many I know, therefore, dread a return of "Engineer Saheb," the former Kabul university engineering student turned Islamist militant who started his career on the campus of Kabul University during which he was accused of the murder of a left-wing student activist. He was so militant that he even snubbed President Ronald Reagan and did not attend a White House reception for visiting mujahedin leaders in 1985 (when the president called them "the moral equivalents of America's founding fathers"). But he lost U.S. support only after he took Saddam's side during the First Gulf War and even announced that he would dispatch some fighters there.

Of course, these articles/books are based on "myths". Unless Nandu gives certificates, we should stop reading books and articles.

parsuram wrote:nandu:

re:

as opposed to being forerunners of our allies, the Northern Alliance.

"our allies"? not if you mean bush/clinton who tried all means of trying to wipe them out, and clinton, particularly, tried to make all kinds of deals with the talibunnies. "our allies" refers to allies of India, Russia & Iran until 9/11.

Why would I mean bush/clinton when I say "our"?

If you have a point to make, try to make it rationally. I am not going to bother reading posts that start by making insinuations about me.

bye


abhishek_sharma, I usually consider books to be credible, but when doubts are raised, it is necessary to go to original sources. I did so.

You know there are a few books by now that claim India is sending arms to the Baloch from its consulates in Afghanistan. There will be a few more books published in the future who will make this claim. Yet, we know it is a myth spread by the Pakis, don't we?

Nandu wrote: abhishek_sharma, I usually consider books to be credible, but when doubts are raised, it is necessary to go to original sources. I did so.

I don't understand why you believe that the website contained everything he said. It is also not clear that he met people from Afghanistan just once. So you did not go to the original source. You just chose a speech which was consistent with your world view.

Nandu wrote: You know there are a few books by now that claim India is sending arms to the Baloch from its consulates in Afghanistan. There will be a few more books published in the future who will make this claim. Yet, we know it is a myth spread by the Pakis, don't we?

Yes, that is why I did not post article written by Pakis (or even Muslims, or people like Chomsky).

Anybody seen this?

Its a little old...but hilarious