Indian Autos Thread

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 04 Oct 2010 07:07

Thanks, so the TTX02 bike is fitted with an Indian made motor, is that it?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 04 Oct 2010 08:32

gearboxes both manual and auto are sealed units I think. and driving slowly in NYC is same as Blr with blr having advantage of a lower temp in summer

I kind of doubt transmissions are tuned to indian conditions , the suspension might be made stiffer and some parts made tougher. some regulatory things like tail lights and headlights might be made compliant with indian laws...

can a village mechanic take apart and repair a manual gearbox, I doubt it. it will need visit to city dealer for sure imo.

I have seen lot of shops on JC road here doing something like 'reconditioning' with truck axles and drive trains though....using lathes and such.
could be a grey market spare business.

Dileep · Post by **Dileep** » 04 Oct 2010 10:33

Isn't the gear ratios adjusted for desh?

Marut · Post by **Marut** » 04 Oct 2010 13:11

Of course, suspension and other components are ruggedized to withstand Indian conditions, but the main things are the engine block and transmission system.

Most engines are derated for Indian use given the sub-87 octane fuel in many parts of the country (big cities are an exception). Thus the whole operation of the engine has to be recalibrated to optimize performance with this fuel. Similarly, gearboxes (transmission ratios) have to matched with the revised output from the engine, since the previous values aren't valid anymore. Autoboxes especially have more work to be done as their chips also need to be updated with the revised algorithm for making the shifts in addition to the gears themselves. Thus the auto used in US will not be the same as in India and will need some testing/trials to ensure the performance is upto the mark. Given the small number of auto vehicles sold, not many go through this process diligently leaving the end user subscribe to a frequent visitor program at the dealership.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 04 Oct 2010 15:07

interesting. you shouldnt face an issue with i10 though....

Sriman · Post by **Sriman** » 06 Oct 2010 23:02

A pristine white Tata Prima 3128 at Auto Expo

Source: sscm at SSC forums

ShivaS · Post by **ShivaS** » 07 Oct 2010 00:48

The fundamental difference between manual and auto is that, in auto transmission you will have torque convertor between engine fly wheel and transmision shaft. The torque convertor is modified fluid coupling. This reason number one that you can not start a auto trans by pushing and engaging gears (which you can not because the gears always meshed aka constant mesh) The torque convertor is connected via fluid ATF (not alcohol Tobbaco Firearms) but by Automatic Transmission fluid. There are clutch packs mounted on the 1st gearshft, 2nd gear shaft etc which engage when servo mechanism activates on the basis rpm/torque requirement. This also one of the reason that you should not jiggle reverse forward when you are stuck in Snow or Mud. There is shock loading on the servo packs and clutch pack. There is part called control cover which has spools that move and cover and uncover the hydraulic oil to engage the correct gear(clutch packs, which are nothing but alternate plates of sintered bronze and ms plates they look like motor laminations in the plan view). The engine tuning because petrol is because of the calorific value and flash and fire point of the fuel. The transducers which monitor the engine rpm torque need to be caliberated but no big deal.

Indian conditions torque is predominat requirement stop start stop start trafic even on high ways, and the reluctance of drivers to down shift but ride the clutch( from auto wallah to innova wallh do this, they think they can save fuel) while most US/EU conditions is that the general speeds being higher on roads they require more power and high rpm to go 0 to 60 in 60 seconds (and there after any time you may get ticket thats different story) which if you try in India few souls will be liberated including a cow, chicken and few aam admi aurath.

Even in Manual clutch there are constant mesh gear boxes in which you slide a spool to lock the gear on the shaft in synchromesh the shifting is smoother because the speeds need to be synchronized and then slide.

The sliding mesh ther is is a possibility gear gnashing. If you closely watch Ashok Leyland/tata Bus drivers of SRT (not sachin R Tendulkar) but state road transport, they will press clutch twice while shifting gears (like VVS does)

I think I should stop here

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 07 Oct 2010 01:03

ShivaS wrote:The sliding mesh ther is is a possibility gear gnashing. If you closely watch Ashok Leyland/tata Bus drivers of SRT (not sachin R Tendulkar) but state road transport, they will press clutch twice while shifting gears (like VVS does)

The days of double de-clutching is long gone, at least in TN. I came out of the auto industry in 2003 and even back then I could not see a constant mesh gear box in the field.

Added later: I did see a few in service..like modified stuff put together and running in remote areas. State corporations tend to be Ashok Leyland heavy and AL has introduced syncro's many years before TATA.

nandakumar · Post by **nandakumar** » 07 Oct 2010 13:51

Gus wrote:
ShivaS wrote:The sliding mesh ther is is a possibility gear gnashing. If you closely watch Ashok Leyland/tata Bus drivers of SRT (not sachin R Tendulkar) but state road transport, they will press clutch twice while shifting gears (like VVS does)
The days of double de-clutching is long gone, at least in TN. I came out of the auto industry in 2003 and even back then I could not see a constant mesh gear box in the field.

Added later: I did see a few in service..like modified stuff put together and running in remote areas. State corporations tend to be Ashok Leyland heavy and AL has introduced syncro's many years before TATA.

Don't know about Ashok Leyland having introduced synchromesh gear boxes ahead of the Tatas. But i do know for a fact that synchromesh gear boxes were introduced as optional item in tata trucks as far back as 77/78. Indeed the then director and general manger of the tata motors' (or Telco as it was known in those days) Pune complex S.Y. Jakatdar got his recognition as a technical wizard because of his singular contribution to the design and development of the GBS 40 gear box that was being fitted in the Tata 1210 vehicles in those days.
Old timers would recall how Mr Jakatdar who joined Telco as a draftsman in the production engineering department in the mid 60s from Ashok Leyland (where he was a production control assistant having arrived there from the UK armed with a engineering diploma from one of the UK automotive polytrechnics) was quickly elevated over the years at the plant in Jamshedpur for his technical prowess. So much so, when the decision to launch a a new manufacturing facility in Pune was taken in the late 60s/ early 70s was sent in as the head of the project. However, the digression apart, constant mesh option was also available and my guess is that state road corporations would opt for it long after synchromesh gear boxes were indigenously developed and available simply because it was a tad cheaper.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 07 Oct 2010 21:33

^ I am pretty sure AL was the one who introduced syncro's first. I was in TATA motors, then Telco, for about 4 years. Constant meshes where phased out even before I joined the company. We were shown a few on display..IIRC GBS 30 and GBS 40..not sure.

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 11 Oct 2010 00:04

Google tests driverless car
Google has built a car that can drive itself and tested it on more than 100,000 miles of public roads.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 11 Oct 2010 16:13

May be 100,000 miles in northern california, Arizona etc. Wonder how such a car would do in Indian cities. Must be sensor overload very soon.

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 11 Oct 2010 16:26

What if a cow jumps across from other side exactly when an autorikshaw takes a u turn in front of it?

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 11 Oct 2010 22:08

Tata Motors drives in its first cross-over car

MUMBAI: Auto major Tata Motors rolled out the Tata Aria , which the company claims is the country's first ever cross-over car that straddles a sport utility and multi-utility vehicle .

The company said the car would shortly be exported to Europe followed by Latin America and Asia.

"The car has been designed to be in line with European standards and meets the Euro V emission norms," said Tata Motors Managing Director for India operations P M Telang .
...
...
Positioned to take on Toyota Innova and Mahindra Xylo, the Aria with its three row of seats attempts to blend the benefits of a family-friendly luxury tourer with the dynamics and visual cues of an activity-oriented sports utility vehicle.

The in-dash satellite navigation system shows the way to anywhere through an interface. Rain sensing auto wipers switch on with a drizzle.

Aria is also packed with an auto climate control and darkness sensing auto headlights. The car has a reverse guide camera to help in parking.

Safety features include 6 airbags and Electronic Stability Program (ESP), offered by an Indian manufacturer for the first time.
...
...

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 11 Oct 2010 22:10

We did have a Hatchback-SUV crossover called Ford Fusion didn't we? The name made sense too even if the car wasn't a hit with the masses. When I came to massaland, I was surprised to see that the "Ford Fusion" here is a regular sedan. What is the "Fusion" then?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Oct 2010 22:38

aria looks good...somewhat similar to dodge grand caravan. the fairly unrefined Innova has been ruling the roost for long. time to step up the game for tata and take bull by the horns! per tv reports today ex-showroom minimum is 14L in delhi, tata needs to
find a way to bring that down to 11 to compete with Innova in volume.

another guy ruling roost is Swift and its newer avatar is coming shortly...9cm longer.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Oct 2010 22:54

hopefully toyota will be forced to bring in something sharper looking like venza - anything with smooth
independent rear suspension.
http://www.autospectator.com/cars/files ... nza-24.jpg

innova is one vehicle darling of both the taxi operators and itvity munna's who have kids/parents.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 14 Oct 2010 23:09

India's Mahindra, distributor fight, delaying trucks' debut

Post a Comment By Sharon Silke Carty, USA TODAY
DETROIT
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Bud Robke is in the process of closing down his Chevrolet dealership in northern Kentucky, and has been searching for ways to continue earning money in the same location.

His solution? To sell used cars and to become one of the first U.S. dealers for a small, cheap diesel pickup from Indian automaker Mahindra.

But he's still waiting for the trucks: They were supposed to be on sale this fall, but a legal battle between Mahindra and the company that signed on to be the U.S. importer and distributor has stalled the process.

"We dealers are innocent third parties in this," he says. "The dealers who have paid for a Mahindra franchise are innocent. ... We are just frustrated about the whole thing."

Dealers who've signed up believe the trucks will hit a sweet spot in the U.S. market. The Mahindra trucks will be the only small diesel trucks for sale in the U.S. Unlike with U.S. ambivalence about diesel cars, a lot of truck buyers prefer diesel engines because of higher load and towing capability and fuel economy. The Mahindra TR20 pickup is compact-size, but can carry up to 2,765 pounds — more than many standard full-size pickups — while getting about 30 mpg.

Plus, they're cheap: The TR20 two-door cab will be priced around $20,000. The TR40 four-door crew cab could go for around $22,000.

The dispute holding up sales is between Mahindra, which would be the first automaker to bring an Indian-brand vehicle to the U.S., and Global Vehicles, the importing company it hired to set up a distribution chain here.

Mahindra issued a press release saying the two companies were no longer working together, and did not respond to requests for comments.

John Perez, CEO of importer Global Vehicles, says that was news to him.

"We had no idea there were issues until they stopped taking our calls," Perez says.

Perez accuses Mahindra of trying now to cut out the middle man (Global) and distribute directly to dealers. Perez says his company spent $8.5 million just to get the contract with Mahindra, invested millions more signing up 348 U.S. dealers and even helped Mahindra find a container ship equipped to bring the trucks here. He says they also worked with J.D. Power and Associates to make sure the trucks were up to American consumer standards and worked with a consulting firm to make sure it had dealers in the right spots. Total cost, he says: about $100 million.

"We have put together a distribution system for Mahindra that's on a silver platter," he says. "Now they want it, and they want it for nothing."

The contract between the two sent the dispute to arbitration, but Global Vehicles believes Mahindra is legally compelled to fill orders for trucks while that is underway. It tried to test that theory last week by sending Mahindra a $35 million order for TR20s and TR40s. Global also sued Mahindra in federal court seeking enforcement of their deal.

But Tuesday, Mahindra said it would not fill Global orders and would contact dealers directly.

Working in Mahindra's favor is a walk-away clause Perez agreed to after contract talks had ended. He says Mahindra representatives called him out of his hotel room, where he was already in his pajamas, to sign an addendum saying they could walk away if they could not make their trucks meet U.S. rules by a certain deadline.

"I thought they were trustworthy," he says.

Mahindra missed three deadlines to meet U.S. standards, the last on June 11. But it says the trucks now are in compliance.

Meanwhile, Robke is busy freshening his showroom in red and gray colors. He says it just happens that those are the colors of Mahindra's logo.

"I sure would like to know if we're going to have Mahindras, but I'm not ... anticipating this fight ends soon," he says. "If these boys get together and make me a Mahindra dealer, then yippee."

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/indias-m ... 245&page=1

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 14 Oct 2010 23:14

Paul wrote:India's Mahindra, distributor fight, delaying trucks' debut

"We dealers are innocent third parties in this," he says. "The dealers who have paid for a Mahindra franchise are innocent. ... We are just frustrated about the whole thing."

The dispute holding up sales is between Mahindra, which would be the first automaker to bring an Indian-brand vehicle to the U.S., and Global Vehicles, the importing company it hired to set up a distribution chain here.

"We had no idea there were issues until they stopped taking our calls," Perez says.

Perez accuses Mahindra of trying now to cut out the middle man (Global) and distribute directly to dealers. Perez says his company spent $8.5 million just to get the contract with Mahindra, invested millions more signing up 348 U.S. dealers and even helped Mahindra find a container ship equipped to bring the trucks here. He says they also worked with J.D. Power and Associates to make sure the trucks were up to American consumer standards and worked with a consulting firm to make sure it had dealers in the right spots. Total cost, he says: about $100 million.

The market changed so much in the last 3 years that there is more dist who are willing to work direcly with Mahindra.

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 31 Oct 2010 20:42

Without verifying, at first glance, The TATA Prima looks like a DAEWOO Heavy.

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 01 Nov 2010 08:33

There were news reports many years ago on a TATA DRDO tie up for developing Hydrogen engines and since then not much was heard.

Well it now makes an appearance on the Marco Polo range TATA's Hydrogen powered bus with a CAD drawing of the engine

manish · Post by **manish** » 02 Nov 2010 09:12

Marten wrote:Tata seems to have used the Prima as a badge for both the concept sedan and the global truck. Manishji, could you please help us out here?

Marten ji, I think you have confused me for someone else - I have no links whatsoever with TTML, but I think bart used to be an employee. I am just a keen follower of the industry onree.

BTW, you are indeed right about the Prima badge - the Pininfarina penned concept car came out in 2009 and in the same year (May IIRC) the World Truck range was launched with the Prima badging.

The trucks that look very much like the Daewoo heavies are the Tata Novus (2005) range, which are basically built upon the Daewoo platform. The World Truck/Prima range are all new, but I am sure Tata-Daewoo would have had an important role to play as well.

Sriman wrote:A pristine white Tata Prima 3128 at Auto Expo

Source: sscm at SSC forums

A Novus from SA:

A Daewoo badged Novus:

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 02 Nov 2010 09:13

I have seen one of these beautiful trucks on ORR in blr recently. eagerly waiting for when we fit containerized Agni3 on it.

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 02 Nov 2010 17:01

The stacked design look has been used by some other manufacturer before.Can't remember who.

bart · Post by **bart** » 02 Nov 2010 17:16

manish wrote:
Marten ji, I think you have confused me for someone else - I have no links whatsoever with TTML, but I think bart used to be an employee. I am just a keen follower of the industry onree.

No Sir, you have me confused as well, I have never worked for TTML, I too just enjoy watching good indigenous products from TTML and M&M. I vaguely recall that a couple of forum members had worked for TTML or were still working for, one of them had worked on the Nano design as well.

Surya · Post by **Surya** » 02 Nov 2010 18:01

What a beautiful truck - I would start with Brahmos 2 on it

manish · Post by **manish** » 02 Nov 2010 19:05

bart wrote:
manish wrote:
Marten ji, I think you have confused me for someone else - I have no links whatsoever with TTML, but I think bart used to be an employee. I am just a keen follower of the industry onree.
No Sir, you have me confused as well, I have never worked for TTML, I too just enjoy watching good indigenous products from TTML and M&M. I vaguely recall that a couple of forum members had worked for TTML or were still working for, one of them had worked on the Nano design as well.

Ayyo sirjee, sorry - it is confusions galore then!

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 02 Nov 2010 19:28

Missiles need All terrain ruggedised trucks. TATRA is still the king.

manish · Post by **manish** » 02 Nov 2010 19:36

Ajatshatru wrote:The design of Tata Prima 3128 from the front looks like one truck stacked over another.

Yup, seems to be the constant theme with the entire range.
The other (smaller) members of the family.

Singha wrote:I have seen one of these beautiful trucks on ORR in blr recently. eagerly waiting for when we fit containerized Agni3 on it.

The newer offerings from all the major Indian players are certainly upping the as far as trucks are concerned. Just take a look at the sampling below (will post only smaller thumbnails in the interest of conserving bandwidth and avoiding the need for scrolling):

First up, Tata - If you thought the white 3128T was imposing, here's the real biggie - the Tata Prima 4938S at the Auto Expo '10, which even has a cool 'Long Vehicle' board at the back for those still in doubt of its dimensions

may be we can have a desi terminator remake with one of these monsters hassling the kind-hearted cyborg and his protectees.

The interior - far cry from the days of the 1210SE don't you think? All very TFTA onree...Its even got steering mounted ICE controls!

Making it clear...

All images CC sscm @ SkyScraperCity India forums.

manish · Post by **manish** » 02 Nov 2010 19:55

manish wrote: The newer offerings from all the major Indian players are certainly upping the as far as trucks are concerned. Just take a look at the sampling below (will post only smaller thumbnails in the interest of conserving bandwidth and avoiding the need for scrolling):

All images CC sscm @ SkyScraperCity India forums.

Continuing:
Ashok Leyland U-Series U-4932 with a U-series tipper U-2523 in the background:

Ashok Leyland Avia - an offspring from the acquisition of Czech firm Avia's truck unit.

Mahindra Navistar MN series - shown here is the 49 tonner MN49:

Eicher has been making some giant strides in the HCV segment recently, and the strategic stake sale to Volvo has only boosted them further. Here is a Volvo-Eicher VE25 Terra tipper. May be it is time to do a more comprehensive overhaul of their age old 80's Mitsubishi LCV derived front end.

Also interesting to note that the tipper market seems to be booming - note how many new and improved TFTA models are coming in especially in the higher end heavy tippers - everyone from Tata (Prima range), AL (Unitruck range), AMW, Volvo (FM series), Eicher (VE Terra) to MAN (it should have been Force MAN and not MAN Force

Bajaj Tempo must be regretting the outcome of their forced name change decision). I guess the booming mining, ports, road buildout and the heavy infrastructure industry must be fueling this trend.

That's enough I guess. If mods feel that the above post has one picture too many, I shall remove the inlining.

manish · Post by **manish** » 02 Nov 2010 20:21

rahulm wrote:Missiles need All terrain ruggedised trucks. TATRA is still the king.

Can't deny Tatra's domination. But IA seems to be deploying a fair number of AL/Tata TELs as well. For example I have seen an AL Agni - II TEL as well as a Tata Akash TEL.

But as you rightly said sir, I too feel that they are the exception rather than the norm. But some of the mining focused heavies from domestic players would also make for decent TEL candidates I believe, but then I am no expert.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 02 Nov 2010 20:46

Questions about the Tata Prima:
* What are the available engine outputs (HP/torque) ?
* Does Tata make these engines themselves ?

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 02 Nov 2010 22:27

These trucks are all fine. I am just wondering about how fast the market adopts these.

In places like Salem, Namakkal, Sankari etc (the TN trucking hub which probably is the biggest in all of South India) the norm was to get a bare chassis, sell of even the cowl that comes with TATA trucks (AL was smart in not supplying one which TATA would due to the other markets) and build their own bodies. I had a hard time selling the cabin version of trucks to these folks. Their drivers would always complain and whine and crib.

Most of these people are very superstitious and 'let's do the same thing' types. There where a few 'leader' types who would experiment with new models and only based on their words, the others would take the 'risk'. Talk to the general truck owners directly is as effective as banging head against the wall. Of course, the 'leaders' would demand great discount and service extras, ego massaging and you would still have to wait for a lengthy period for the truck to 'prove' its worth. In the meantime, competitors would just spread rumors that you have to counter with lots of energy.

Just yesterday, I was talking to an old colleague...it was a brutal world and I am happy for the 'toughening up' I got there...but boy am I glad I am out of that now..

Sriman · Post by **Sriman** » 02 Nov 2010 23:08

Gus wrote: In places like Salem, Namakkal, Sankari etc (the TN trucking hub which probably is the biggest in all of South India) the norm was to get a bare chassis, sell of even the cowl that comes with TATA trucks (AL was smart in not supplying one which TATA would due to the other markets) and build their own bodies. I had a hard time selling the cabin version of trucks to these folks. Their drivers would always complain and whine and crib.

Complain about having to drive in a non-cabin truck or the other way around?

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 02 Nov 2010 23:13

Sriman wrote:Complain about having to drive in a non-cabin truck or the other way around?

They didn't like the cabins at all. The cabins had a leaf spring underneath and I guess it takes some getting used to for folks who drive these wood-body cabins for years. A lot of these small truck owners (less than 20 trucks) would never ever deviate from what is accepted wisdom.

The truck market needs to consolidate. It is very fragmented...at least when I bailed out.

Sriman · Post by **Sriman** » 02 Nov 2010 23:40

Gus wrote: They didn't like the cabins at all. The cabins had a leaf spring underneath and I guess it takes some getting used to for folks who drive these wood-body cabins for years.

Aren't these cabins safer than the wood-body cabins? Strange that the drivers complain about them. That said, they drive it for a living, so there must be a reason.

manish · Post by **manish** » 03 Nov 2010 00:00

Marten wrote:Would be nice to see say a hundred of these ruggedised TELs in the N/E at prospective "mines".

Manish ji, I was only referring to your knowledge, sorry for calling you out and making it appear you worked for them. I do remember our previous conversation.

Marten ji, please do not apologise, I would have loved to be a part of TTML!

Gus saar, sorry I did not recall you, I always somehow thought of you as someone on the trucking industry side thanks all those anectodes that you used to post about the truckers down south - my bad - looks like you were in TTML CVBU?
Correct me if I am wrong.

Suraj wrote:Questions about the Tata Prima:
* What are the available engine outputs (HP/torque) ?
* Does Tata make these engines themselves ?

I think the engines are all Cummins made, with upto 560 BHP being pumped out by the top end variants. I think the base 40 tonner model had about 280 bhp. Tata IIRC sources engines from two vendors - the Tata-Cummins JV as well as Cummins India.

Perhaps Gus can help us out here.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 03 Nov 2010 01:05

Sriman wrote:Aren't these cabins safer than the wood-body cabins? Strange that the drivers complain about them. That said, they drive it for a living, so there must be a reason.

IMO, the major reason is inertia.

For ex, in all HCV segments AL beats the pants out of TATA in TN. But only in Sand transporting segment, TATA SE 1210s (with older TATA engines) rule the roost. The same guys won't consider a new TATA Cummins engine fitted vehicle and chase after older vehicles in used market. Only reason is that the driver would say he feels safer and is comfortable only in driving the 1210 SE. When the sand trucking market exploded, the 1210 SE was a nice fit and drivers were very accustomed to it, with the semi-forward that gave him a perceived clearance advantage and better vision in the dark and road less sand excavation areas. This 'wisdom' becomes so accepted that even newer drivers continue believing in it and owners often times just go with what the driver wants....lest the driver wrecks it (at worst) or does not put in that extra care and effort that typically these truck owners in a fragmented market need (at best).

Plus there is a cost factor. And body builders typically operate at lower costs (boys work there for peanuts) and can give custom options that cabins lack.

I am not knocking down on these new products. IMO, products need to be standardized and markets need to be consolidated. But a visit to a real trucking market will definitely be a good eye-opener for most who just look at cool pics. I remember the times I had to explain low volumes to my regional and LoB bosses in Jamshedpur and Mumbai.

manish wrote:looks like you were in TTML CVBU? Correct me if I am wrong.

you are correct. I was selling and servicing TATA trucks in AL territory

I think the engines are all Cummins made, with upto 560 BHP being pumped out by the top end variants. I think the base 40 tonner model had about 280 bhp. Tata IIRC sources engines from two vendors - the Tata-Cummins JV as well as Cummins India.

Trucking division does not source Engines from Cummins India. The TATA-Cummins plant in Jamshedpur (a world class one btw, beats other Cummins plants elsewhere in the world) is the sole supplier of Cummins engines to TATA trucks. TATA also improved their older engines by thickening the engine blocks, adding a turbo and numerous other improvements, I am not sure if this is a second line of trucks from their stable..I left them at this point.

Cummins India supplies engines for Industrial generators..used to be...or still called as Kirloskar Cummins.

Interestingly, as an Oracle consultant in my next career..I was with Cummins USA for a year. Fun times.

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 03 Nov 2010 11:46

Do any current Indian truck cabs have sleeping facilities in the back of the cab? Here in America, bigger truck cabs have this feature so that you can have one driver sleeping in the back, while the other one is driving.

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 03 Nov 2010 13:49

There seems to have been a point where TATA more or less abandoned its quest for high power indigenous engines & transmissions and went for foreign technology. From memory, the 1516 or 2416TC was the maximum power truck with a TATA engine.

I always wondered why the TATA engines maxed out at 160 HP.

Earlier this decade TATA introduced the EX series, the higher power variants of these were equipped with Cummins engines and the trend has continued since then including for gearboxes.

The highest power Novus (Daewoo) has a Cummins diesel while the lower powered trucks sport Daewoo engines. At the time of the TATA buyout, Daewoo had higher powered inhouse diesels than TATA.

I suspect none of the PRIMA's will be engined with TATA's inhouse diesels instead will sport Daewoo and Cummins.

The same story on the car front. TATA has all but abandoned its inhouse diesels for the Indica & MANZA instead choosing to go with the excellent FIAT burner. I suspect this was in response to the competition the Indica was facing in the market.

TATA's inhouse engines power the Safari, SUMO(engine is derived from the TATA 407 LCV), the 1210 family and derivatives and some defence vehicles.

One can understand TATA's strategy as a commercial player and it has done well so far.

However, engines seem to be a a stumbling block for us whether it is automobiles, jets, tanks or ships.

Moving away from TATA, the worst engine has got be be the Greaves which powers the Piaggio Ape & Tempo 6 seater (called TUM TUM in Pune) at a top speed of no more than 30 kmph.Its a noisy. smoky, vibrating diesel burner guaranteeing a formidable teeth rattling experience whichever vehicle it powers. Its sound and fury alone scares the living daylights out of the otherwise fearless street dogs. No suprises, it has a agricultural pumpset legacy.

Long distance Indian trucks & buses have sleeping facilities in the cabin.