UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

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ssmitra
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Helicopters teach themselves to do aerial maneuvers

Post by ssmitra »

Not Exactly military but has very obvious and important military applications. Any idea if any of our engineering institutes are working on defence related technologies. Here they just took commercially available remote controlled choppers and modified them.
Stanford computer scientists have developed an artificial intelligence system that enables robotic helicopters to teach themselves to fly difficult stunts by watching other helicopters perform the same maneuvers.

The result is an autonomous helicopter than can perform a complete airshow of complex tricks on its own.

The stunts are "by far the most difficult aerobatic maneuvers flown by any computer controlled helicopter," said Andrew Ng, the professor directing the research of graduate students Pieter Abbeel, Adam Coates, Timothy Hunter and Morgan Quigley.

The dazzling airshow is an important demonstration of "apprenticeship learning," in which robots learn by observing an expert, rather than by having software engineers peck away at their keyboards in an attempt to write instructions from scratch.

Stanford's artificial intelligence system learned how to fly by "watching" the four-foot-long helicopters flown by expert radio control pilot Garett Oku. "Garett can pick up any helicopter, even ones he's never seen, and go fly amazing aerobatics. So the question for us is always, why can't computers do things like this?" Coates said.

Computers can, it turns out. On a recent morning in an empty field at the edge of campus, Abbeel and Coates sent up one of their helicopters to demonstrate autonomous flight. The aircraft, brightly painted Stanford red, is an off-the-shelf radio control helicopter, with instrumentation added by the researchers.

For five minutes, the chopper, on its own, ran through a dizzying series of stunts beyond the capabilities of a full-scale piloted helicopter and other autonomous remote control helicopters. The artificial-intelligence helicopter performed a smorgasbord of difficult maneuvers: traveling flips, rolls, loops with pirouettes, stall-turns with pirouettes, a knife-edge, an Immelmann, a slapper, an inverted tail slide and a hurricane, described as a "fast backward funnel."

The pièce de résistance may have been the "tic toc," in which the helicopter, while pointed straight up, hovers with a side-to-side motion as if it were the pendulum of an upside down clock.

"I think the range of maneuvers they can do is by far the largest" in the autonomous helicopter field, said Eric Feron, a Georgia Tech aeronautics and astronautics professor who worked on autonomous helicopters while at MIT. "But what's more impressive is the technology that underlies this work. In a way, the machine teaches itself how to do this by watching an expert pilot fly. This is amazing."

Writing software for robotic helicopters is a daunting task, in part because the craft itself, unlike an airplane, is inherently unstable. "The helicopter doesn't want to fly. It always wants to just tip over and crash," said Oku, the pilot.

To scientists, a helicopter in flight is an "unstable system" that comes unglued without constant input. Abbeel compares flying a helicopter to balancing a long pole in the palm of your hand: "If you don't provide feedback, it will crash."

Early on in their research, Abbeel and Coates attempted to write computer code that would specify the commands for the desired trajectory of a helicopter flying a specific maneuver. While this hand-coded approach succeeded with novice-level flips and rolls, it flopped with the complex tic-toc."

It might seem that an autonomous helicopter could fly stunts by simply replaying the exact finger movements of an expert pilot using the joy sticks on the helicopter's remote controller. That approach, however, is doomed to failure because of uncontrollable variables such as gusting winds.

When the Stanford researchers decided their autonomous helicopter should be capable of flying airshow stunts, they realized that even defining their goal was difficult. What's the formal specification for "flying well?" The answer, it turned out, was that "flying well" is whatever an expert radio control pilot does at an airshow.

So the researchers had Oku and other pilots fly entire airshow routines while every movement of the helicopter was recorded. As Oku repeated a maneuver several times, the trajectory of the helicopter inevitably varied slightly with each flight. But the learning algorithms created by Ng's team were able to discern the ideal trajectory the pilot was seeking. Thus the autonomous helicopter learned to fly the routine better—and more consistently—than Oku himself.

During a flight, some of the necessary instrumentation is mounted on the helicopter, some on the ground. Together, they continuously monitor the position, direction, orientation, velocity, acceleration and spin of the helicopter in several dimensions. A ground-based computer crunches the data, makes quick calculations and beams new flight directions to the helicopter via radio 20 times per second.

The helicopter carries accelerometers, gyroscopes and magnetometers, the latter of which use the Earth's magnetic field to figure out which way the helicopter is pointed. The exact location of the craft is tracked either by a GPS receiver on the helicopter or by cameras on the ground. (With a larger helicopter, the entire navigation package could be airborne.)

There is interest in using autonomous helicopters to search for land mines in war-torn areas or to map out the hot spots of California wildfires in real time, allowing firefighters to quickly move toward or away from them. Firefighters now must often act on information that is several hours old, Abbeel said.

"In order for us to trust helicopters in these sort of mission-critical applications, it's important that we have very robust, very reliable helicopter controllers that can fly maybe as well as the best human pilots in the world can," Ng said. Stanford's autonomous helicopters have taken a large step in that direction, he said.
Video

http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2 ... flash.html
Arya Sumantra
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Arya Sumantra »

Pak starts probe into US spy plane crash
24 Sep 2008, 2202 hrs IST,PTI

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Worl ... 523635.cms

Earlier, Unkil crashed some tom a hawk in puristan and out came a reverse engineered version Babur. Any guesses what the reverse engineered version of this latest crashed UAV/UCAV be called? Nadir Shah, Timur Lane..? and how soon it will show up?
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Sontu »

Technology eventually will find it's way to PRC to pave the way for their next UAV WZ-10 :D
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by sanjaychoudhry »

UAVs for Special Forces to hit targets behind enemy lines

India is embarking on a defence project to develop unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) carrying Laser Target Designators (LTDs) to be used by its Special Forces to accurately hit targets inside enemy territory.

The country's premier defence research agency, DRDO, is spearheading the project, in partnership with the Army, Navy and IAF's Special Forces, that aims to reduce the risk of losing personnel operating behind enemy lines.

"We are planning to base LTDs on UAVs to cut down the risk of our troops getting caught inside enemy territory while illuminating targets for attack and save the cost of sending another aircraft for doing the task," a senior Defence Ministry official told PTI.

The LTDs, at present, are carried inside enemy territory by Special Forces troops, who focus it on enemy targets for the Air Force's aircraft to drop a Laser Guided Bomb (LGB) to hit the target.

The other way of doing the special operation is to send in two aircraft -- one to illuminate the target with laser and the other to attack the target -- which turns out to be a costly proposition for the armed forces.

"It was realised that sending troops with the LTDs six to seven km close to highly-guarded targets behind enemy lines and then flying in an aircraft to attack it was quite risky and very expensive," the official said.

It was found that a UAV could fit the bill, as they can penetrate deep into enemy territory with minimal chance of being detected and can be operated from long distances using a remote. Moreover, there would be no loss of lives in the Special Forces troops, he said.
http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/holnus/00 ... 121082.htm
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by sum »

The LTDs, at present, are carried inside enemy territory by Special Forces troops, who focus it on enemy targets for the Air Force's aircraft to drop a Laser Guided Bomb (LGB) to hit the target.
Have we ever done this in the recent past(after Kargil)?
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Arun_S »

A more complete report:
Frontline: UAVs for Special Forces to hit targets behind enemy lines
AJIT K DUBEY NEW DELHI, OCT 12 (PTI)

India is embarking on a defence project to develop unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) carrying Laser Target Designators (LTDs) to be used by its Special Forces to accurately hit targets inside enemy territory.

The country's premier defence research agency, DRDO, is spearheading the project, in partnership with the Army, Navy and IAF's Special Forces, that aims to reduce the risk of losing personnel operating behind enemy lines.

"We are planning to base LTDs on UAVs to cut down the risk of our troops getting caught inside enemy territory while illuminating targets for attack and save the cost of sending another aircraft for doing the task," a senior Defence Ministry official told PTI.

The LTDs, at present, are carried inside enemy territory by Special Forces troops, who focus it on enemy targets for the Air Force's aircraft to drop a Laser Guided Bomb (LGB) to hit the target.

The other way of doing the special operation is to send in two aircraft -- one to illuminate the target with laser and the other to attack the target -- which turns out to be a costly proposition for the armed forces.

"It was realised that sending troops with the LTDs six to seven km close to highly-guarded targets behind enemy lines and then flying in an aircraft to attack it was quite risky and very expensive," the official said.

It was found that a UAV could fit the bill, as they can penetrate deep into enemy territory with minimal chance of being detected and can be operated from long distances using a remote. Moreover, there would be no loss of lives in the Special Forces troops, he said.

Even if the UAV was shot down, its cost of about Rs one crore was much lower than a Rs 200 crore to Rs 300 crore fighter aircraft, which are also used for the task at present.

"Special Forces can use UAVs with LTDs from bases located either in our territory or at safe distances from enemy locations, as they can be guided and controlled by remote controls," he said.

All the three armed forces of the country are looking forward to have this feature on the UAVs, planned for induction in the near future.

The Israeli-made 'Heron' though has this capability and is used by the Indian armed forces currently, the Defence Ministry's idea is to have the capability on all future UAVs it acquires.

Meanwhile, the Army has issued a Request for Information (RFI) for procuring modern UAVs, which will have this feature.

Military UAVs in India are developed by Bangalore- based DRDO lab Aircraft Development Establishment (ADE), which has developed 'Nishant' UAV for the armed forces.

ADE also has plans of developing armed UAVs in collaboration with foreign vendors, which would be used for combat purposes such as hitting enemy military targets and carrying out surveillance over internal and enemy territory.

It would also be used for networking various communication platforms of the armed forces to provide real-time information of battlefields, as also illuminating enemy targets with laser beams.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by A Sharma »

HAL Newspaper

SKYLARK UAV’S MAIDEN FLIGHT SUCCESSFUL
Nitesh
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Nitesh »

Interesting development

http://blog.wired.com/defense/2008/11/i ... ts-nu.html

Israel Developing Nuke-Hunting Drone

Israel is increasingly worried about the threat of a nuclear, missile-equipped Iran. So the Israeli military is working on "a high-fly­ing, long-endurance unmanned in­frared sensor" that can tell the difference between "nuclear war­heads amid doz­ens of decoys sent to confound na­tional missile defenses," Defense News' Barbara Opall-Rome reports. "If implemented, the Israeli program will mark the first use of an unmanned platform for [n]uclear warhead hunting."
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by SuKan »

Defence collaboration for development of UAV
17:27 IST
LOK SABHA

The Government has allowed the Aeronautical Development Establishment to co-opt a partner from the Indian Industry to join in the development and production of the Rs. 1,000 crore indigenous medium altitude long endurance Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV) programme. In order to reduce the time for design, development and subsequent Transfer of Technology to the Industry for bulk production of Medium Altitude Long Endurance UAV, Defence Research and Development Organization (DRDO) has been authorized to associate with a Production And Development Partner (PADP) from eligible Indian Industries on a competitive basis. The PADP would work with DRDO during the design and development phase and absorb technologies. They would become the System Integrator and provide product support after induction.

DRDO has short listed four Industries Consortia through a transparent process and released Request for Proposal for PADP.

This information was given by Defence Minister Shri AK Antony in a written reply to Shri Ravi Prakash Verma and others in Lok Sabha today.

*******

PK/RAJ
http://pib.nic.in/release/release.asp?relid=46021&kwd=
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by aditp »

SuKan wrote:Defence collaboration for development of UAV
17:27 IST
LOK SABHA

The Government has allowed the Aeronautical Development Establishment to co-opt a partner from the Indian Industry to join in the development and production of the Rs. 1,000 crore indigenous medium altitude long endurance Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV) programme. In order to reduce the time for design, development and subsequent Transfer of Technology to the Industry for bulk production of Medium Altitude Long Endurance UAV, Defence Research and Development Organization (DRDO) has been authorized to associate with a Production And Development Partner (PADP) from eligible Indian Industries on a competitive basis. The PADP would work with DRDO during the design and development phase and absorb technologies. They would become the System Integrator and provide product support after induction.

DRDO has short listed four Industries Consortia through a transparent process and released Request for Proposal for PADP.

This information was given by Defence Minister Shri AK Antony in a written reply to Shri Ravi Prakash Verma and others in Lok Sabha today.

*******

PK/RAJ
http://pib.nic.in/release/release.asp?relid=46021&kwd=
Any idea which 4 private sector companies have been selected. Tis is indeed a ground breaking departure from DRDO's traditional product / technology development practice.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by somnath »

Any clue on how UAV data is transmitted to ground stations? Do we use satcoms to download the data real time in distant command posts/naval ships?
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by chetak »

somnath wrote:Any clue on how UAV data is transmitted to ground stations? Do we use satcoms to download the data real time in distant command posts/naval ships?
Somnathji,
For line of sight operations ie up to around 250 Kms, the data link is generally in the UHF, L, S, C, X and Ku bands. The bandwidth is around 6Mhz and real time B/W video(Radar and optical sensor data) can be downloaded.
The range can be extended to 500kms plus by linking two UAVs in flight.
This data link serves both the up and down links.
For the US GlobalHawk type of UAVs the link is generally satcom.
Ground control stations and ground data terminals can be located anywhere including on board Naval Ships.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by k prasad »

Re the LTD on UAVs, from what ADE scientists have told me, Nishant has already been configured and tested in this role, specially in the tank-busting role, in sync with Nag and other ATGMs.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by KiranM »

k prasad wrote:Re the LTD on UAVs, from what ADE scientists have told me, Nishant has already been configured and tested in this role, specially in the tank-busting role, in sync with Nag and other ATGMs.
Nag can be laser designated? I thought it was a fire and forget missile. Did i miss something?
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by k prasad »

KiranM wrote:
k prasad wrote:Re the LTD on UAVs, from what ADE scientists have told me, Nishant has already been configured and tested in this role, specially in the tank-busting role, in sync with Nag and other ATGMs.
Nag can be laser designated? I thought it was a fire and forget missile. Did i miss something?
Yes, but how does it get the target info first?? the LTD lazes the target and sends to the Nag carrier, which feeds the data, and Nag is fired...

Anyway, this was what the ADE ppl told me.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by KiranM »

k prasad wrote:
KiranM wrote: Nag can be laser designated? I thought it was a fire and forget missile. Did i miss something?
Yes, but how does it get the target info first?? the LTD lazes the target and sends to the Nag carrier, which feeds the data, and Nag is fired...

Anyway, this was what the ADE ppl told me.
Thanks Prasad. I took LTD verbatim. Now it makes sense.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Brando »

Compared to what we need - which is something like the MQ-9 Reaper - to what we are "planning" to get -something akin to the UK Watchkeeper- the gap is HUGE!!!

We need a proper UCAV; a stealthy UAV with a pair of 500lb'ers and a half dozen or so fire and forget missiles capable of staying in the air for about 15-20 hours. If we had something like that we could fly outselves into the "northern areas" or what ever the Pakis call it and deliver some pain without too much hassle.

While presently we havent even been able to mature the nishant or Lakshya technologies, we have a LONG LONG way to go and with DRDO, it will just take longer. Best bet would be to buy a couple of Reaper system off America or develop one with the Russians - Yesterday! :|
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Ananya »

Nag's arial version is Helina ,which i trust is dangled in red tape and would be a equivalent of hell fire missiles and would do the job.

wonder why we are not using UAV for the current 45hrs stand off at poonch or against LTTE !!!!
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Brando »

Ananya wrote:Nag's arial version is Helina ,which i trust is dangled in red tape and would be a equivalent of hell fire missiles and would do the job.

wonder why we are not using UAV for the current 45hrs stand off at poonch or against LTTE !!!!
What stand-off at poonch and Why would India use it against the LTTE ?

I doubt the Nag is anything as good as the hellfire. If it was, they would have inducted it already and touted it as a great achievement.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by somnath »

Can the UAVs used by the IN takeoff or land on any of the ships? I remember reading an article by Adm Arun Prakash where he said that a couple of old ships were refitted with the control terminals for the UAVs (I am guessing these are the Leanders). Can the UAVs takeoff from the Leanders? Or do they take off and land from a shore based establishment and "controlled" by the ship based controls?
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by vavinash »

IF the hangars are removed then Nishant can be rail launched from these ships. Not sure if they ever tried it though.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by vivek_ahuja »

somnath wrote:Can the UAVs used by the IN takeoff or land on any of the ships? I remember reading an article by Adm Arun Prakash where he said that a couple of old ships were refitted with the control terminals for the UAVs (I am guessing these are the Leanders). Can the UAVs takeoff from the Leanders? Or do they take off and land from a shore based establishment and "controlled" by the ship based controls?
A few comments:

a) UAVs for the naval role are required for two very different types of roles. One of these roles is of course common to the Army and Air Force requirements. This role is the long range surface reconnaissance. Here you need long range and long endurance UAVs that are therefore quite large and heavy. They need runways to take off from or catapults similar to those on aircraft carriers. Small Destroyer based catapults won't cut it for these birds. But by and large these aircraft are highly capable of deploying from land bases and covering vast portions of the ocean so that unless you have a carrier group deep out in the ocean, your needs are met. And in the latter case you can deploy similar UAVs (at least in concept) from that CBG. So looking to deploy these UAVs from smaller surface ships like Destroyers etc is the wrong way to look at the operational scenario.

b) Of course, suppose you have a situation where you have a Destroyer etc out on patrol by itself and you want to provide it with aerial reconnaissance. In this case, the overhead cover (so to speak) must still be provided by the HALE types UAVs or manned LRMP platforms from land bases. Alternatively, a MALE type UAV launched from a supporting CBG must be provided in case the ship is out in deep ocean.

c) In addition, suppose that using a variety of sensors, the ship identifies a particular target and wants close in identification without risking its helicopter. In this case a short range UAV such as the Nishant etc can be used. Using the Nishant type UAV from ship catapults is possible because of their small size and weight. Recovery is of course a problem but in this we must look back to WW2 for inspiration. There, Destroyers would launch reconnaissance aircraft which were essentially sea-planes. In the case of Nishant, where the recovery is by parachute, the UAV must be equipped with flotation gear and the ship must be equipped with a crane or some other recovery equipment on board in addition to the catapult.

d) Here enters the use of the Rotary-UAV. Already is prototype stages across the world, it will replace the need for the catapult type system for Naval ships and still provide the role envisaged as in case (c). It will not, however, replace the need for land based UAVs.

e) In addition, the second role mentioned in (a) is that for ASW operations. Here, one can argue that both catapult launched or R-UAVs can do the job similar to the fixed wing LRMP and manned helicopters of today.

f) Any UAV that is being controlled using SATCOM can be controlled by any ship out at sea even if the aircraft is launched from the land base. The problem comes when something other than SATCOM is being used which places a limitation on the range etc other than those dictated by purely aerodynamic considerations.

-Vivek
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Post by Raj Malhotra »

I personally think that NURAV will be ordered in massive numbers by IA also.Theoratically it is heavier than say Nishant and Searcher but it needs no catapault and landing strip to take off. It also easier to land compared to recovery of conventional UAVs. NURAV will have limited use as UCAV also, say armed with Nag missile.
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Post by vivek_ahuja »

Raj Malhotra wrote:I personally think that NURAV will be ordered in massive numbers by IA also.Theoretically it is heavier than say Nishant and Searcher but it needs no catapault and landing strip to take off. It also easier to land compared to recovery of conventional UAVs. NURAV will have limited use as UCAV also, say armed with Nag missile.
That may very well be true. However, my question is: in what form?

The Chetak based modification is both too bulky and too heavy to operate effectively. In order to operate with the IA, the main rotor assembly will have to be replaced for high altitude operations (I understand there was an issue with the spacing cables etc), the engines will have to be up-powered, drive assembly changed etc. In other words, either you end up with a virtually new build helicopter with all the flaws of bulk size etc or you end up with an R-UAV that is incapable of effective operations in the high mountains.

In addition, once you consider the composite structured LCH coming along with the required power, drive systems and blade design customized for high altitude and in a much smaller form, it becomes clear why the IA might consider a custom built R-UAV rather than spending years modifying the NR-UAV, for which the Chetak design is cost efficient (Since the IN already uses these birds, and they work fine in this domain, the idea is to attach a modular "strap-on" flight control system instead of the manned cockpit with the minimum of other structural modifications and time consumed).

In my view, the LCH design is the way to go for the future of IA rotary UAVs.

In any case, however, only time will tell...

-Vivek
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Post by Ajay K »

vivek_ahuja
Post subject: Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

The Chetak based modification is both too bulky and too heavy to operate effectively. In order to operate with the IA, the main rotor assembly will have to be replaced for high altitude operations (I understand .....................
Think Chetak would be just a validation platform. May be IA would like the Chetah to be the platform at a later stage.
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Post by vivek_ahuja »

Ajay K wrote:Think Chetak would be just a validation platform. May be IA would like the Chetah to be the platform at a later stage.
The NR-UAV requirement for the Navy can be met by the Chetak, though that too could be improved with a brand new design. In this case I believe the IN will adopt the design as such until a dedicated off the board NR-UAV is designed and built years from now.

But for the IA, there has been no stated requirements as of yet IIRC. In this case all we can do is speculation. But having said that, the use of strap-on FC modules to convert standard helicopters to R-UAVs (as has been proposed for the Chetak NR-UAV) is better applied to designs of this century than of the last. In this case, it is better applied to designs such as those of the LCH type models than the Chetak and Cheetah models. Besides, the LCH meets (or will meet when it rolls out three months from now) all altitude perfromance requirements of the IA/IAF. So if a strap-on design is going to be used in lieu of a dedicated design, it might be better to do so on the LCH IMHO.

But as you say, initially we might see testing and evaluation done on the NR-UAV based on the Chetak to see how effective (if at all!) the strap-on modules are.

-Vivek
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by chetak »

KiranM wrote:quote="k prasad", quote="KiranM" ,
k prasad wrote:Re the LTD on UAVs, from what ADE scientists have told me, Nishant has already been configured and tested in this role, specially in the tank-busting role, in sync with Nag and other ATGMs.
Nag can be laser designated? I thought it was a fire and forget missile. Did i miss something?
Yes, but how does it get the target info first?? the LTD lazes the target and sends to the Nag carrier, which feeds the data, and Nag is fired...

Anyway, this was what the ADE ppl told me.[/quote]

Thanks Prasad. I took LTD verbatim. Now it makes sense.[/quote]

Guys,
Nag uses Imaging Infra-Red (IIR) guidance with day and night capability. Mode of launch for the IIR seeker is LOBL (Lock On Before Launch) :)
Truly fire and forget.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by Aditya G »

somnath wrote:Can the UAVs used by the IN takeoff or land on any of the ships? I remember reading an article by Adm Arun Prakash where he said that a couple of old ships were refitted with the control terminals for the UAVs (I am guessing these are the Leanders). Can the UAVs takeoff from the Leanders? Or do they take off and land from a shore based establishment and "controlled" by the ship based controls?
Lakshya Navy is fired from ships.
Sanjay M
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Remote-Controlled Beetle

Post by Sanjay M »

Here is the smallest UAV, and it could be quite mass-produceable:

http://www.technologyreview.com/computing/22039/?a=f

This is another sign that microelectronics and insects may be a very compatible mating.

That beetle could carry useful sensors.
Or high explosives.

Here's an interesting video to watch:

http://www.technologyreview.com/video/?vid=217&a=f
kit
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by kit »

sanjaychoudhry wrote:Board index » Discussion Forums » Military Issues & History Forum

All times are UTC
Wont it become easier for the enemy forces to realize that they are being targeted once a laser 'paints' them.I think laser warning receivers are dime a dozen !!! Whats the surprise element is wide spread use of LTDs... might be good against groups/terrorists but against regular well equipped military formations ? Is India going to use only special ops :D
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by krishnan »

rustom UAV is so big, link at livefist
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by K Mehta »

krishnan wrote:rustom UAV is so big, link at livefist
here's the link
This was one of the four models that were shown as future rustom uav at aerosem 2008
K Mehta wrote:The Rustom prototype is huge, I havent seen any UAV this big.
krishnan touche, i said so before you. but this model is even bigger than the one shown at aerosem.

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... f=4&t=4413
shiv wrote:Also theer seem to be several UAVs planed - Med altitude long range and HALE as well .
Mysteriously all were named Rustom - including the fullscale Rutan- design one in the photo - which was also Rustom.
K Mehta wrote:The confusion I mentioned was that I was told that the prototype is the final version of the UAV according to the demonstrator near the Rustom prototype, while it is not the final version according to the demonstrator on the ADE stall and one of the models displayed were going to be the final version. The demonstrator at the stall said that this was a single engine system which did not have the endurance or payload that would meet the SQRs and a twin engine system was needed. The control laws, software testing and other tests were being done on the current model. The models displayed at the stall were all twin engine ones and looked similar to heron or predator. If that is the case, then I find it a bit strange that why they have come this far if this is not going to be the final model.
So the lady at the stall inside was indeed right and the guy outside was a ghonchu. everything she said is shown in this model, twin engine etc. But this is a model and not a prototype. And ofcourse this model doesnt seem anything like the rustom at aerosem.
Last edited by K Mehta on 10 Feb 2009 18:54, edited 1 time in total.
narayana
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by narayana »


Hope there were lot of UFO sightings reported in Russia these days :)
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by AmitR »

Compare this with the global hawk and the similarities in external appearence seems striking.

Image

and

Image
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by K Mehta »

amit
G Hawk and Predator(reaper) are single engine UAVs, rustom is twin engine. so increased survivability, ceiling, range, payload etc.
we will have ample opportunity to compare it to the BAe UAV Mantis,Herti at AI-09.
Mantis is a twin engine UAV.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by AmitR »

K Mehta wrote:amit
G Hawk and Predator(reaper) are single engine UAVs, rustom is twin engine. so increased survivability, ceiling, range, payload etc.
we will have ample opportunity to compare it to the BAe UAV Mantis,Herti at AI-09.
Mantis is a twin engine UAV.
Does Rustom fly?
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech

Post by fanne »

But few things I do not like in this Rustum is (and it may not be production variant, I believe this is still Tech Demo, and things may change), I do not like propellers, very un-stealthy, and also non canted vertical stabilizer, they are also big radar signature returnee. So this UAV flying on its own, can be easily spotted, and then can be shot down (as it would not have means to fight back). I guess in certain tactical scenario, like where we have local air superiority (like in Kargil, or in Counter insurgency operations in JK or NE), Rustom would come useful, but in all out war, a stealthy UAV is better (as once spotted, any UAV is metal heap).

rgds,
fanne
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