Telangana Monitor

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munna
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by munna »

ShyamSP wrote:Unfortunately they are relevant because they have numbers in parliament where this Telangana's formal drama has to start. If they had behaved same way as INC and TDP, i.e it doesn't matter for them which side things go, Telengana would have fizzled out or never would have come to the fore as T-vadis would have realized they didn't have required votes for state formation.
You do have a point! I would also like to be enlightened as to what are the stakes involved for BJP to give up its long established policy of smaller states and whatsoever sympathy it has in Telangana? AP never developed a stake in BJP and hence vice versa they are bereft of an alternative voice in national parliament. I mean the only real authority that does or does not decide the formation of Tstate as of now is INC. Joint AP is responsible for two direct defeats of BJP at national scene!If BJP has no leverage in AP then its the same for AP in BJP. I think the two engage more closely but then .....

PS: V Naidu was a lateral sangh entry in BJP and hence can never establish a base, he is simply not qualified to be anything other than an office bearer.

PPS: I am neither BJP walla nor an INC person but just presenting the idea that a bipolar polity would have helped AP immensely in today's crisis.
ShyamSP
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ShyamSP »

munna wrote:Question instead should be "why did AP keep voting to power those who insulted greatest leader that AP produced and are now dividing the state?"
Look at another irony. T-vadis are saying he was not PM from Telengana but PM from Andhra as he ran from Nandyal when he became PM. PVNR is from a Telengana district.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by vera_k »

The BJP is being consistent in it's support of smaller states. But it would help if they also frame some objective criteria for when they would support such division.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

ravi_ku wrote:
ShyamSP wrote: The broad variation in Telengana Telugu is due to 200 years of Nizam influence and separation. But since beginning, Vengi area (roughly K-G districts and 4 eastern T-districts) that form core of Andhra had same Telugu and poets (Nannaya from Rajamahendri, Bhima kavi from Vemulawada) from there influenced or set direction to modern Telugu.
just a question. how many have read potana's bhagavatam? He is from warangal and was one of the last poets before it passed onto bahmani sultans (to mughal to nizam).

which dialect of today is it closest to?
Ravi_Ku garu,

Some people are not proud of thier native culture, heritage, and history and instead get overwhelmed by few historical aberrations and start believing that the aberration itself is their heritage and identity. Current Telangana agitation is one such issue.

These aberrations are further fueled by the vested interests, that seek to destroy the civilizational roots of this nation.

This is a classic issue that is daunting Indian psyche for the past 60 years. Should India define the 1000+ years of loot and colonization as an external aggression that has to be remembered and learned-from OR an internal evolution that needs acceptance and continuation.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

Coming back to BJP, earlier when they were in power they did nothing because they were dependent on TDP for the support and survival. They are not in power and has no responsibility for what every happens. They do not have any qualms to join Naxals in this agitation. BJP leaders from Non Telangana areas now have no voice in the party policy on the division of the state. Entire policy in hijacked by the T Vadis and central leadership is totally unconcerned with the views of their workers in other areas.

When they have divided the 3 states BJP followed a process of getting a state legislature pass a resolution for the division of the respective states.. Of course it is provided there in the constitution, but they have made it a more formal process. Now their T Vadi leaders are not ready to wait for any resolution from the state legislature.


BJP did have a following in the costal district for a long time though the same is limited to educated class. For example long back Nellore (V Naidu’s district) in M.L.C. elections for the Graduates seat N Ganardhana Reddy (later CM of AP) lost to BJS candidate. Nellore town even elected a M.L.A. of BJS long time back. But they never tried to increase their power and become an alternative to the congress. Later they had tie up with TDP. When TDP dumped them after 2004 defeat they have not tried to increase their base and now with all these over action in T agitation I doubt they will have any future in Non T areas.
Virupaksha
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Virupaksha »

Why is BJP being discussed at all wrt telangana? They have and will have zero role in the formation of telangana and are jokers in the pack.

The only people who are going to decide is Rajmata and her coterie.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

T Vadis also say that Jalagam Vengala Rao is also not from Telangana though he is resident and elected from Kammam District because his ancestors are from Srikakulam in Costal area. But the objection to the Vengala Rao seems to be more because he is instrumental in crushing the Naxals at that time and famed as a very strict administrator. Whereas the Chenna Reddy who is one of the most corrupt politician the state history is a great leader for T Vadis. They do not have any problem with KCR whose ancestors are from Bobbili another costal area place or Vijayashanthi who is not from T Area. (there are statements of TRS leaders themselves to the said effect)
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

^^^

Unfortunately anyone who is against Telangana separatism at this moment is a colonialist and feudalist. The movement went into Maoist influence the day KCR sought their support to win some MLA seats. The OU JAC being the facade of this moment shows the possible outcomes and consequences.

It is really sad that (supposedly) educated Indians are falling for this nonsense.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Virupaksha »

great andhra is a well known site for political rumours, with a good chance of both hit and miss. (I personally felt they were many hits compared to misses).

posting in full as I felt that I would have bolded 70% of it anyway and since it was a short article.
http://greatandhra.com/ganews/viewnews. ... 15&scat=16

A senior Congress leader from Coastal Andhra has made an interesting comment in an off-the-record conversation with a few media friends the other day.

According to him, most of the Congress leaders from Andhra and Rayalaseema regions are blaming it on Sonia Gandhi for the entire fiasco in the state. “She is no more a goddess for the party leaders in our areas. Since she is the party president and we cannot talk openly against her, we are targeting Home Minister P Chidambaram for making the statement on Telangana, which has led to the present crisis in the state. We all know that it was Sonia Gandhi’s decision,” he said.

These Congress leaders are of the view that it would be impossible to regain the confidence of the people as long as the Telangana issue persists. “She has to take a firm decision, this way or that way. Otherwise, we are all doomed,” they said. They are now wondering whether they could stage a revolt against Sonia under the leadership of Y S Jaganmohan Reddy. But they fear it could be a repetition of 1972 episode, when Indira Gandhi disbanded the entire Pradesh Congress Committee, following the revolt by Jai Andhra leaders led by B V Subba Reddy. He had to rush to Delhi and buy peace with Indira. Can Sonia display the courage of Indira Gandhi?
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by anuj »

Telangana 40: Why blame all Andhras?
I consistently use the term Andhras as if it is a monolithic block knowing very well that such a generalization is fraught with many gaps, holes and weaknesses. When I blame Andhras for the plight of Telanganas, am I accusing each and every Andhra person individually for the crimes of discrimination, marginalization and domination? Is Andhra as homogenous as I portray it to be? Is it as monolithic as I portray it to be?

Not really.

I know very well that not all Andhras have participated in the oppression of Telangana people. In fact, most of them, nearly 90% of them must be oblivious to the plight of Telangana. To most of them, it may come as a surprise that these Telanganas who have lived with them in their state are actually accusing them of such heinous crimes – of ruthless suppression and outright discrimination.

They react to Telangana movement very innocently, under the melodramatic slogans of ‘united we stand, divided we fall’, ‘Telugu pride’, ‘kalasi unte kaladu sukham’, etc. Are these people, teachers, college girls, students, farmers, officers, government employees, living in Coastal Andhra and Rayalaseema guilty of the crimes I accuse them of? When did they discriminate any Telangana? When did they marginalize or dominate Telangana? Why do I think this innocent Andhra person is responsible for what happened to Telangana people?

Isn’t Sujai a bigot who is spreading the message of hate when he accuses each and every Andhra person? Isn’t he telling his Telangana brothers to hate Andhras?

Why such generalization?

In all fights, in all wars, in all people movements which pits one kind of people against another, such generalization is not uncommon. When Blacks fight for their rights, they fight for their rights against Whites, knowing very well that many Whites strongly support their movement, knowing very well that not all Whites have discriminated them. When Gandhi fought against British, many British were next to him supporting him in his cause. And yet, his fight was against entire British people, not just the King or the Queen, not just Winston Churchill, not just the British politicians, not just the police, not just the viceroy, not just their administration in India. Indians collectively fought against British collectively for India’s Independence.

In such fights, we talk of only two entities, like Britain and India, as if they constitute one single identity, one set of people, knowing very well that Britain has English, Welsh, Scots, and Irish in them, knowing very well that India has many religions, regions, languages, princely kingdoms in it. And all those constituents may not work together on many issues.

Usually the perpetrators of the actual crime are tiny few. Not all British actually suppressed Indians directly, many of them have never met an Indian in their life. And yet, we seem to blame them collectively for our plight. When US invades Iraq and kills innocent people, Iraqis are angry with Americans, not just the soldiers who have raped, pillaged and murdered, not just the General of the Army, not just the White House or the US Administration, but entire American people. When 26/11 incident happened in Mumbai, Indians blamed Pakistan, the entire country, not just the village that produced these terrorists, not just the terrorist agency, not just the administration, but the entire country.

Why do we blame the entire country, entire race, an entire identity in such fights? Why do we blame everyone of certain group identity knowing very well that 90% of them are innocent? Why don’t we selectively fight our fights against only those who have perpetrated the crimes? Why do we blame them collectively? Why do we get into such generalizations?

Collective responsibility

That’s because when Britain ruled India, the people of Britain were party to it, innocently, ignorantly, or involuntarily. When America invaded Iraq, the people of US were party to it, willingly or unwillingly. When Europe colonized rest of the world, the people of Europe were party to it, knowingly or unknowingly. When we vent our anger, we do it against the entire group. The entire population of the group holds the collective responsibility for the actions of the few because those actions are done in the name of that group.

When US Army invades a foreign land, the size of the army could be less than 300,000, but the entire nation of 300 million takes the blame for it as collective responsibility for the actions of those few. By selecting their leaders, by paying taxes to those governments, by being a silent sympathizers or spectator or bystander, you are being party to the organization, the country, the state, the race, the religion that has committed those crimes. And therefore you get blamed for it, not as an individual but as a group.

You have to understand that when I blame Andhras, I do not blame them on an individual basis. I don’t look at Andhra person and think, ‘This guy discriminated us’. The blaming happens only at a group level. Though it is not targeted at an individual level, I expect that blame to be shared by everyone who calls himself Andhra. On your name, certain people are committing certain crimes against us, taking your support and you are being held responsible for that.


When you come out onto streets fighting for ‘united state’, you are being party to it; when you talk about ‘Telugu pride’, you are being party to it; because all these actions are being used by your leaders to suppress us further. They are using you as a clout to suppress us.

Can you be silent?
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing
– Edmund Burke.
When you remain silent, you extend your support to those perpetrators, and hence you are party to it. The only way you can fight such a generalization is stop your own people from perpetrating those crimes. It is your duty not to let anyone commit those crimes on your behalf, on your identity, with your support. And when you relinquish that duty, you become a sympathizer, a supporter and hence party to the crime. You cannot be silent on issues when your own people have done harm to others on your name.

When some Nazi Germans rounded up Jews and herded them into ghettos and then into concentration camps to slaughter them by thousands per day, many Germans, even those who didn’t like what these Nazis were doing, kept quiet, were silent. After the war, we punished entire Germany holding them responsible collectively.

Right now, most of Andhra is silent, or is silently supporting their leaders, or is silently playing neutral. Your silence is no longer innocent. Your silence is culpable, like the silent majority which allowed the Holocaust.

Blame the individual or the group?

I am accusing you as a group that has perpetrated these acts that suppressed Telanganas. I am not accusing any individual directly.

And I would not describe my feelings for Andhras as hate. If ever, I think I am angry for what you did in the past, and for what you are doing now, not to me, but to my people.

We are angry with you for what you did in the past:
  1. For continuously supporting the sustained discrimination, marginalization and domination of Telangana people in the united state called Andhra Pradesh, stealing our water, our funds, our resources, our jobs and our opportunities.
  2. For going back on every promise that you made, every agreement that you signed, and for breaking every safeguard that was designed to protect our interests.
  3. For humiliating and ridiculing us, making us second-class citizens in our own state and in our own region, treating us as incompetent, illiterate and uncivilized brothers.
We are also angry with you for what you are doing now:
  1. For being insensitive to our plight, our backwardness, our dry fields, our lost opportunities; and instead constantly harping on the loss of your vested interests and business opportunities in and around Hyderabad.
  2. For not taking time to learn what our movement is all about; and instead trying to malign it, calling it naxal-led or extremist-led.
  3. For opposing our movement by raising the slogans of ‘united state’ and doing everything in your capacity to thwart our movement.
Apologizing is the first step

We can’t go back in time and change things. But we can apologize for what our people did to others and hope that we don’t repeat those mistakes. As Hindu, I take blame for things Hindus do against Muslims or Sikhs and I apologize for actions that someone else did with whom I have share common identity. As a man, I take blame for the discrimination that is meted out to women, and I apologize for the actions of men. As a privileged class, I apologize to underprivileged for the discrimination we mete out to them though I might not have done it personally. As Indian, I take blame for what happens in Kashmir. As human, I take blame for what we do to this planet. I hope Andhras will apologize to Telangana brothers for what happened in the last fifty three years.

I want you to take collective responsibility for what you did in the past and for what you are doing now. I want the educated and rational Andhras to come forward and sympathize with us and support us in our movement.

Telangana will be formed. It is an eventuality. How we get there is up to you. Will you make it really hard for us or will you make it easy for us? We want to part with you on a good note, without animosity. I want you to let us go. I promise you that there won’t be any animosity towards any Andhra person once the separation happens. Look at our history of 53 years – how many times have we targeted you, though we were angry with you all this while? Why should we do it in future when there is no more a reason to be angry with you?

Right now, I accuse Andhras collectively, not individually, of protracted crimes against Telanganas. Only when Andhras oppose their own leaders, fight the actual perpetrators of these crimes against Telanganas, disassociate themselves from those who are opposing the formation of Telangana, shall we absolve you of the crimes. Till then you are party to it. And I will continue to refer to all of you collectively as Andhras.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by vera_k »

They are now wondering whether they could stage a revolt against Sonia under the leadership of Y S Jaganmohan Reddy. But they fear it could be a repetition of 1972 episode, when Indira Gandhi disbanded the entire Pradesh Congress Committee, following the revolt by Jai Andhra leaders led by B V Subba Reddy. He had to rush to Delhi and buy peace with Indira. Can Sonia display the courage of Indira Gandhi?
Seems like kite-flying. Since it is not 1972, they could always join the BJP. What compels them to stay with INC if their electorate is not with them?
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Virupaksha »

anuj

I would be grateful if you could just post the link and some quotes which you think are important.

TIA
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

Mr Anuj has a capacity to post very ingenious arguments and lift all kinds of postings from god knows which site or paper in favour of T Land.

We have not seen this kind of abuses hurled at any one on any forum here. Now we regularly read all kinds of abuses, allegations, insulting things hurled at Andhra people by T Vadis in television, newspapers, forums etc. Suddenly I realized how it must be living in Nazi Germany. We also see how difficult it must have been for the congress leaders to have any sane discussion with Jinna. T Vadis just like Nazis have found an enemy and do every thing to paint them bad. They like Jinna are not willing to hear to listen to any reason or argument. We can be certain that the fate of the Andhra people living in Hyderabad and other Telangana areas will be that of Hindus in Pakistan once the Telangana is formed.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

Let us see some of the T Vadis points:

1. When they do not want to live in a combined state how they can be forced.

Is it not the same argument Jinna has put forward? We all know what happened after that. What is the difference between Jinna and KCR? Let us not forget ‘Andhra Bhago’ is the slogan given TRS and its leader KCR. Is it not a fact that they are not asking for a separate state but asking all other Telugu people to get out of Telangana? Will they allow same kind of freedom to Hyderabad City if the people of the city want to become a Union Territory? (Of course not) How mere separation of the state can stop any other Indian citizen to come and live in Telangana. Are they going to beat up any costal people who remain in Telangana and kick them out of Telangana (just like Hindus are kicked out of Pakistan) after the Division and raise walls around Telangana? What is next? Another Article 370 for Telangana wherein Telugu people from Non Telangana are prevented to come inside Telangana.

2. Most of the Tax collected in Telangana but used not in Telangana areas.

Development and tax collection go hand in hand. If Telangana has huge tax collection then it must also have lot of commercial, industrial activities. How come then it can be termed as backward area? Why Telangana leaders then oppose any white paper on the income and expenditure district wise from 1956?

3. Most of the encatchment area for Krishna, Godavari is in Telangana but water is being stolen by Costal people.

There are lot of questions that has to be answered in this matter by people like KCR. Can Maharastra, Karnataka people put forward the same argument??? What will happen then ? What all the 119 MLA’s are doing all these years if the water is really being stolen. What numerous Ministers in charge of Major irrigation projects from Telangana are doing all these years? How people in the down stream can steal water of up stream people. What about the Bachavath commission recommendations in this matter? How much water is wasted in Godavari now? Why people in Godavari Delta who are victims of repeated floods want steal water from Telangana. What is the height of the land from the water level and if any project in reality provide water for the telangana lands? How much it will cost to provide water to an acre of land under lift irrigation in Telangana. It is very difficult to answer these questions.

4. All the agreements like 6 point Gentleman Agreement are not implemented.

Can we know what are these points which were not implemented so for? No one from Telangana is ready to give the details of what was not implemented and what their representatives were doing for all these years.

5. Their language is not respected by people of other areas.

It is a sudden invention. T Vadis now say that many villains in Telugu Movies are speaking in Telangana dialectic. They conveniently forget that same treatment is given to Rayalaseema people also. For a long period villains were speaking only in costal Telugu. What costal people can say? Now the argument for the division of the state is the dialectic of the villains in the movies. What more we can say.

They forget that Telugu itself was never allowed to be used under Nizam for all the centuries they were in power. Telugu was not taught in the schools during this period. Telugu people under Nizam were forced to learn Urdu by Nizam. Yet KCR and his goons are all praise for the Nizam. Now let us ask what medium of language leaders children are studying. English, of course. KCR’s son is US returned. In AP most of the government functioning is in English. Courts also use only English. When Telugu itself is not respected anywhere and by anyone in AP where is the question of not respecting a particular dialectic of Telugu?
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

Anuj says

As Hindu, I take blame for things Hindus do against Muslims or Sikhs and I apologize for actions that someone else did with whom I have share common identity. As a man, I take blame for the discrimination that is meted out to women, and I apologize for the actions of men. As a privileged class, I apologize to underprivileged for the discrimination we mete out to them though I might not have done it personally. As Indian, I take blame for what happens in Kashmir.
(end quote)

Now it means

1. Hindus have done so many evil things to Sikhs and Muslims.
2. They have discriminated against under privileged people.
3. They have oppressed women.
4. They are doing evil things in Kashmir

Basically they are evil people(just like Andhra people) Where do we hear this kind of thoughts. I wonder.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

2. Most of the Tax collected in Telangana but used not in Telangana areas.

Development and tax collection go hand in hand. If Telangana has huge tax collection then it must also have lot of commercial, industrial activities. How come then it can be termed as backward area? Why Telangana leaders then oppose any white paper on the income and expenditure district wise from 1956?
Another data point.

We have a new quote in the previous page (it gives some number, even though it is huge approximation) that says the Telangana tax revenues excluding Hyderabad city are ~6,000 crore per year. I am sure Telangana is allocated more than that amount in the annual budget of ~1,00,000 crore.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

5. Their language is not respected by people of other areas.

It is a sudden invention. T Vadis now say that many villains in Telugu Movies are speaking in Telangana dialectic. They conveniently forget that same treatment is given to Rayalaseema people also. For a long period villains were speaking only in costal Telugu. What costal people can say? Now the argument for the division of the state is the dialectic of the villains in the movies. What more we can say.

They forget that Telugu itself was never allowed to be used under Nizam for all the centuries they were in power. Telugu was not taught in the schools during this period. Telugu people under Nizam were forced to learn Urdu by Nizam. Yet KCR and his goons are all praise for the Nizam. Now let us ask what medium of language leaders children are studying. English, of course. KCR’s son is US returned. In AP most of the government functioning is in English. Courts also use only English. When Telugu itself is not respected anywhere and by anyone in AP where is the question of not respecting a particular dialectic of Telugu?
As discussed many times here, it is upto Telangana population to keep or get-rid of the urdu influence in Telugu. Since it has a different slang, people will use it in movies to gain some milage out of it. It is no different from some people making jokes about Srikakulam Telugu or West Godavari Telugu (Ande, Aaaany etc).

People may not like it but it is the ideal case of Dhimmitude that is in show here :(
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by joshvajohn »

Telangana state creation should be done peacefully: Swaraj
http://news.oneindia.in/2010/01/25/tela ... waraj.html
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by anuj »

I won't be posting any of sujai's blogs here anymore. I appreciate that he supports telangana but his bizarre references were getting too outrageous for me to continue visiting there.

Rgds,
Anuj
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

anuj wrote:I won't be posting any of sujai's blogs here anymore. I appreciate that he supports telangana but his bizarre references were getting too outrageous for me to continue visiting there.

Rgds,
Anuj
Bireder Anuj,

Please bring T-vadi POV from external sources and summarize (Pls do not post them as is) them for our discussion. We will learn the truth in those arguments as we try to accept/reject them with "known" facts.

At this point it is in our (all parts of Andhra Pradesh) best interests to solve this problem once and for all. As we gain (near) complete knowledge about the history, divisions, prejudices, issues, concerns etc in our state, we will be better equipped to solve them for our betterment.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ShyamSP »

Narayana Rao wrote:3. Most of the encatchment area for Krishna, Godavari is in Telangana but water is being stolen by Costal people.

There are lot of questions that has to be answered in this matter by people like KCR. Can Maharastra, Karnataka people put forward the same argument??? What will happen then ? What all the 119 MLA’s are doing all these years if the water is really being stolen. What numerous Ministers in charge of Major irrigation projects from Telangana are doing all these years? How people in the down stream can steal water of up stream people. What about the Bachavath commission recommendations in this matter? How much water is wasted in Godavari now? Why people in Godavari Delta who are victims of repeated floods want steal water from Telangana. What is the height of the land from the water level and if any project in reality provide water for the telangana lands? How much it will cost to provide water to an acre of land under lift irrigation in Telangana. It is very difficult to answer these questions.
From the same angle, one can argue AP people are stealing water from Maharastra and karnataka. If we use “protection of existing uses” principle I wonder Telengana can get lion share of water? They may have much more restrictive use of waters and also less financing for heavy-duty lift irrigation projects.

With Hyderabad shared, I'm not sure how they are going to lift Telenagana out as T-vadis promised. GOI will have to divert money from Hyderabad to finance capital cities and other development projects in non-T areas in case of seperation.

===========================================================================
In the comments section, some Rohit wrote.

http://beta.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/article80961.ece
....
I have strong objections regarding two issues. 1)About SRC's recommendation: They simply put the case for and against unification of two states. Claiming that SRC was against formation of AP just because they mentioned the case against formation in the report is only to misguide the people. It can be interpreted that the committee strongly advocated the formation of AP. It is for this reason, formation of AP happened in the first place. So I request Mr. Kishan Reddy to explain on what basis he came to such conclusion. The report can be found here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Para_369_to_389_of_SRC 2)Regarding river management: A excerpt from Bachawat Tribunal report 'In determining what is equitable utilisation where existing and contemplated uses are in conflict, while other factors must be considered and weighed, the most important single factor is the preferred position of the existing use; thus, an existing use which is beneficial and not wasteful will ordinarily prevail over a contemplated use.' Though the catchment area is one of the factors to calculate the allocated water, it is not the only factor as explained by the Tribunal. Bachawat then attempted to determine the quantity of available water in the River Krishna. After reviewing the data available from 1894 to 1969, the tribunal determined, based on 75% dependability, that the river has 2,060 TMC (thousand million cubic feet) of water. After four years of further study, Bachawat awarded 560 TMC of Krishna River water to Maharashtra (27.2%), 700 TMC to Karnataka(33.9%), and 800 TMC to Andhra Pradesh (38.9%). Maharashtra, Karnataka, and Andhra Pradesh have 26.81%, 43.74%, and 29.45% of the Krishna River catchment areas in their states. Maharashtra and Karnataka protested that the tribunal's award was unfairly beneficial to Andhra Pradesh despite it having a smaller share of the catchment area and requested reconsideration. Bachawat, while admitting that Andhra Pradesh received a larger share of the river water when compared to its catchment area, ruled against Maharashtra’s and Karnataka’s claims. He relied on the “protection of existing uses” principle in his ruling. This principle guaranteed water to existing projects such as the Nagarjun Sagar and Krishna Delta system. Similar principle was used to distribute that 800TMC inside the state too. So I request Mr. Kishan Reddy to explain how a separate state can get huge water share showing 'catchment area' as a basis to get it. There are two possibilities: either Karnataka objects and gets the water share it is bound to get using catchment area as basic principle which will reduce Telangana's and rest of AP' water share anyway or another tribunal upholding Bachawat's principle says even now those 800TMC allocated to AP should be distributed the same way as it was before. So a separate state can't possibly help the water share problem mentioned. I hope these questions reach Mr. Kishan Reddy.
from: Rohith
Posted on: Jan 17, 2010 at 14:42 IST
===========================================================================
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ShyamSP »

http://beta.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/article80961.ece...
Social dynamics of water

About 70 per cent of the catchment area of the Krishna and close to 80 per cent of the catchment area of the Godavari is located in the Telangana region.
...
>About 70 per cent of the catchment area of the Krishna and close to 80 per cent of the catchment area of the Godavari is located in the Telangana region.
Can anybody confirm truth in it.

If you look at Godavari, only Nizambad, Karimnagar, Warangal flow can be considered belonging to Telengana. Khammam's Godavari was part of Circar belonging to Godavari districts. How was 80% calculated.

Also coming Krishna flow, a section of flow that is in Mahubnagar can be considered belonging to Telengana. How was 70% calculated?
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Virupaksha »

ShyamSP wrote: Can anybody confirm truth in it.

If you look at Godavari, only Nizambad, Karimnagar, Warangal flow can be considered belonging to Telengana. Khammam's Godavari was part of Circar belonging to Godavari districts. How was 80% calculated.

Also coming Krishna flow, a section of flow that is in Mahubnagar can be considered belonging to Telengana. How was 70% calculated?
Shyam,

The trick is in the word catchment area. It signifies the area of land from which water drains into the river. So the final delta regions can never have a decent catchment area.

and I think 80% is 80% of APs catchment area.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ramana »

The idea of linguistic identity came up in the decades 1910-1930. We need to understand why was this form of identity was chosen? It finally fructified two decades later. From cursory looks it seems to be the creation of Telugu identity was the first of these efforts. Why was this the case?
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ShyamSP »

Another regional demand for Manyaseema which is older than Telengana. Forest belt in Eastern and North Eastern AP and South-western orissa fall under this seema. Alluri Sita Rama Raju led the rebellion against British from the area and so he was called Manya Veerudu.

http://newsofap.com/newsofap-4358-21-de ... sofap.html
Demand for Manyaseema state from Andhra Pradesh

Tribal leaders from 11 districts of Andhra Pradesh have renewed their demand for a separate state. Incidentally these 11 districts are spread over Telangana and the Andhra regions of Andhra Pradesh which includes Adilabad, Warangal, Karimnagar, Srikakulam, Vizag, Vizianagaram, East Godavari, West Godavari, and Khammam.

Though the demand is not new, the demand is gaining prominence with the ongoing Telangana agitation. It is a point to note that the tribal areas of these districts are very underdeveloped and the tribals in these districts form a good majority.

The JAC comprising ‘Manya Seema Rashtra Sadhana Samithi’ and ‘Manya Seema Adivasi Girijana Sanghalu’ would represent its demand to Governor, Chief Minister, political parties in the State and the power centres in Delhi soon.

Except the lip service of governments, tribal areas were not developed in any aspect like food security, drinking water, health, education and irrigation, they alleged. “We are not against Telangana or Andhra, but what about us,” they sought to know.

They traced the origins of their demand for separation to 1890, when one Thimmanna Dora had led a movement for ‘Rampa Desam’. The tribal areas covering 170 mandals in the 11 districts measured about 33,000 square kilometres with 38 lakh tribals and an equal size of non-tribal population.

Date : 26/01/2010. News by Newsofap.com
Last edited by ShyamSP on 26 Jan 2010 10:14, edited 1 time in total.
ramana
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ramana »

Virupaksha
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Virupaksha »

new things are floating about, the latest fashion is rayaltelangana.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

Kalingadhra is also new one at least to me.

Comming back to Telangana agitation KCR and his maoist gang has to do something after 28th Jan otherwise they will lose their grip on the agitation and it may be cooled down. All said and done without Congress support they will not have any power to get the saparation of the state and BJP in opposition at Delhi can not on its own do nothing. TDP has no real gain in singing T song now for a long time. They may want to keep quite after making lot of noise.

So KCR has to do something. Hope it will not be some thing really bad than what has happend in the last 2 months in AP
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

^^^

They will HAVE to do something, otherwise the game is up for them.

The $m question is will they be allowed to stir the pot, yet again? If GOI wants to close this chapter (either way) post-1/28 is the window of opportunity.

The administration can successfully close down this nonsense if it wants to, similar to how NTR, CBN, and YSR put an end to religious-riots in Hyderabad.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

APJ Kalam on Telangana

Answering a question on Telangana, Kalam replied that if it were the people's mandate then Telangana will be a reality. He also opined that regional-disharmony can be removed by acheiving economic development.

This supports my view point (as I refered Hebbar Nageswara Rao garus article) -

• Elected representatives (MLAs or MPs) should not automatically represent "Peoples Mandate" beyond their election manifestos. For example current UPA govt. at the centre or INC Govt in the state do not have the "Popular Mandate" beyond their 2009 election manifestos. Any issue outside the manifest must be decided based on referendum (However expensive or inconvenience it is). Perhaps they can plan for issue based referendums every 2 years or so.

• GoAP should release a white paper on all the concerns T-vadis have and encourage public debate for 2-3 years before picking up this issue for referendum in 2014 elections.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by anuj »

Sweet news on Telangana soon: Congress T-leaders
Two formers ministers K Jana Reddy and R Damodar Reddy said the Centre would announce a "positive decision" in a day or two on the creation of a separate state. Jana Reddy and Damodar Reddy, who are leading the Congress MLAs and MLCs in the struggle for Telangana, told their colleagues upon their return from Delhi this afternoon that the Centre would soon announce a "sweet news" on the statehood issue.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by a_kumar »

ramana wrote:Sounds iike Nukkad compliant

Andhra People have distanced us from kallu and natu kodi! :(( :((
:rotfl: He can come to my part of Andhra and savor both!!
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ShyamSP »

anuj wrote:Sweet news on Telangana soon: Congress T-leaders
Two formers ministers K Jana Reddy and R Damodar Reddy said the Centre would announce a "positive decision" in a day or two on the creation of a separate state. Jana Reddy and Damodar Reddy, who are leading the Congress MLAs and MLCs in the struggle for Telangana, told their colleagues upon their return from Delhi this afternoon that the Centre would soon announce a "sweet news" on the statehood issue.
Moily also asked party MLAs and MPs in Andhra Pradesh not to resign.

"A decision on the mechanism will taken immediately.

The frequent visits by party leaders from Andhra Pradesh would only complicate the issue," he said in New Delhi.
Is that quote from the same link the sweet news on Telengana?

They may be instituting a judicial committee to go over the Telengana issues for state seperation. If they are going to bring out facts, it is actually a good news.

Any other announcement will cause protests in non-T areas again and tug-of-war will continue.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Muppalla »

Is Telangana part of Second Republic idea?

Kingshuk Nag, TNN, 27 January 2010

HYDERABAD: As India celebrates the diamond jubilee of its Republic, analysts and watchers are increasingly veering to the opinion that the GOI announcement on December 9 last year to create Telangana is part of an idea that can lead to - what can be termed - as a Second Republic. Of course there is no articulation of this idea from official quarters, but in the first stage of building the Second Republic there could be creation of many new states in the country.

In the second stage, there could be an overhaul of the distribution of powers between the Centre and the state. As a component of this rejig, there could also be creation of a third level of government -local self governments at the district level. These ideas set into motion, would, of course, take years to be finally implemented. On the way there will be many flip-flops- as can already be seen in the case of Telangana. Thus it will be long before a consensus is reached and the concerns of all stake holders satisfactorily answered.

But what is the raison d'etre for a Second Republic? At a philosophical level, the life of a Republic is like that of a human being. With the passage of time it is confronted with new problems and new challenges. To face up to these new realities, the Republic - much like an individual - has to constantly reinvent itself and bring about paradigm shifts in the values that governs its existence. At a concrete level, though overall the growth and development pattern of India in the last sixty years has been satisfactory and impressive in parts, it is being felt that there are substantial regional imbalances and disparities. A significant part of Indians live below the poverty level. Also corruption has permeated India's political life making governance an increasingly different proposition. In fact corruption has become a national security issue that threatens the integrity of the country.

All this -and other reasons - has led to a “have not” syndrome in many parts of the country that is finding expression, among other ways, by demands for more states. At the last count, there were demands for at least 10 more new states including Telangana, Gorkhaland, Vidarbha, Bundelkhand, Mithalanchal, Harit Pradesh and Kutch-Saurashtra. The increasing dispossession of tribals in their heartland in central India is also leading to increased strength of Maoists in these areas and in large swathes of the country the writ of the government does not run. It is felt that smaller states will bring governance closer to the people.

If not the people, then for the Congress party it makes good political sense to root for a Second Republic, which entails more states in the country, redistribution of powers between the Centre and the state and devolution of powers to the local level. This is because at the end of 58 years of Parliamentary democracy, the Congress party finds itself as the only national party in the country (in the real sense and not as per the definition of the Election Commission). That's how it started in 1951, when the first elections were held as per the then new Constitution.

From the late 1960 onwards there was a rise of opposition parties but with the conclusion of the 2009 election that saw the cutting down to size of the BJP (the party that came closest to the Congress in terms of influence), the grand old party is back to its position of being the sole national party in India. Along with the Congress, a galaxy of small regional parties like the BSP, DMK, AIDMK, Trinamool Congress and TDP shine on the political firmament. But the influence of these parties are confined to one single state and even the CPM -with pretensions of being a national party -is restricted to two states. At the national level, there can be a serious challenge to the Congress only if the regional parties can combine together and weld themselves into a homogeneous group. But going by past experience, the prospects for this are remote.

In this situation with changes in the structure of the Republic, the Congress can lord over the Centre, almost permanently. The creation of a third tier of government at the district level - would mean devolution of power away from state governments. This will disempower regional parties and regional satraps and lead to creation of many sub-regional parties at district levels. This will strengthen the national government at the cost of the state governments also. In the long run, it could lead to a US type of government, with chief executive of the country (whatever name you may call it by - President or Prime Minister) being directly elected.
But when that happens there will be a Third Republic!
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

^^^

Interesting perspective.

The Forth Reich could be the 100+ city states :D
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

Now our people want to disrupt IPL. What relation a private club type tamasha matches have any relation to their agitation we do not know. Other than getting some publicity they are not going to achieve any thing. Hyderabad city will get some bad name for poor law and order situation. I wrote earlier that KCR and his gang will do some things nasty if they don’t get their way by 28th Jan. I think it has already started. If this kind of senseless actions are the start we have to see where it goes.

It seems Rajamatha called Damodar Reddy and Jeveevan Reddy of congress to Delhi for a meeting. These two leaders are the most vocal and militant among the congress leaders for pressing for Telangana. Is she going to signal for the surrender of Delhi to them or is the going ask them to be silent and behave properly is the question. Just like any palace in royal era we will not hear anything from Rajamatha and no official statement will be there on what has transpired in the meeting. It is going to lead more speculations more rumours, more disappointments, more fears which marked the situation in the AP state for the last two months.

Who is this Prof Jaya Prakash ? it seems that he has made some rubbish statement.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by RamaY »

^^^

I thought I read a news item that said it differently. That T-JAC will not stop IPL matches. Let me double check.

People may not like it. But the fact is that this very T-JAC was making all kinds of "right" noices w.r.t Christmas celebrations. And then they made the comment in early January that they would not allow Andhras returning from Sankranthi (Pongal) celebrations in to Telangana.

Let us keep these facts so our Telangana brothers can see this gang of garbage for what it is!.
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Venkarl »

RamaY wrote:^^^

....

Let us keep these facts so our Telangana brothers can see this gang of garbage for what it is!.
All this is not the work of any gang of garbage any more. Initially, I thought that all this would die with exchange of some suitcases to which the name "Gang of Garbage" can be applied. It seems to me that this is being handled by well educated & intellectual minds meticulously for something else God knows what it is. TRS activists/ABVPs are only the face with Telangana cause. Regarding students, I stay on Alwal route and whenever there is a call for bandh or meet, I see truck loads of youth being taken to heart of Hyd and when the bandh is over, they are taken back. Not to talk about Suicides, may their souls rest in peace. Though I was seriously thinking about pros and cons for separate Telangana initially, and at one point I got convinced that separation would develop both the sides. But leadership isn't strong in both the areas. It confuses me a lot to whom will the T-Vadis and rest of Andhra Pradesh State people Vote after seeing all this junk by actors like TRS, Congress, BJP and TD. Now, I have stopped batting for Unified Andhra or Separate Telangana as it is becoming dog fight between TRS and Rest which is not making any sense. TRS has not made clear what will be done after separate Telangana. Everybody from universities to singareni coalaries to political parties are just saying "We want Telangana". But nobody talks about what after getting Telangana. No one has laid out a road map for the development of new state. From low class to high class, I couldn't see a single VISIONARY in this whole episode. Same applies to Unified Andhravadis, they bat for unity and conveniently forget to how the problems of underdeveloped districts in all areas can be addressed if united we stay . So many discussions on TV9, NTV and HMTV I see daily with a hope of ORIGINALITY in both the causes, everybody says, you did that to us, and other says you also did this to us. No maturity among leaders spearheading both the causes. I have no solid base for this--> I feel that its just chaos what is wanted here and there might be hidden stakes for hidden players in this region which might be restricted to this region or even hit at national level. Separate or Unified, its not showing any positive signs with the resultant.

Just my thoughts or exaggeration if it seems so...
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by Yagnasri »

There is no drastic vision is needed for AP. AP has better growth rate than many states and taking steps on improvement in small and village level irrigation, primary education, health care and other social sector spendings, serious control on corruption law and order would have made AP improve further. What was needed is Strict admin that is all.

But now that we have all this rubbish going on. furture is GOK
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Re: Telangana Monitor

Post by ramana »

The problem is the political core of the INC at Center is at the root of this division. So the separation agitation refuses to die down as they know that the cabal running INC wants it. BJP is also parroting the "small states" chant for they know the scoop and dont want to be left out in case the split does happen.
Its a case of all heading towards the cliff for they know the core of the herd is going that way.

As the generation that saw Partition said "Patha nahin kaise hua Partition!" : Dont know how Partition happened!"
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