Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

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shaardula
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by shaardula »

wonder who this guy is?
Image
Dawn says: Suspected Taliban commander Abdullah, alias Abu Waqas
when was this guy arrested? is he a big fish or some chutka putka guy they caught in 'operations' in the west?

i was wondering if there any photos of baradar and gang who were recently 'caught'.

some of the folks going for r and r:
Ameer Muawiya, a bin Laden associate who was in charge of foreign al-Qaida militants in Pakistan's border areas,
Akhunzada Popalzai, also known as Mohammad Younis, a one-time Taliban shadow governor in Zabul province and former police chief in Kabul, according to Mullah Mamamood, a tribal leader in Ghazni province.

Others captured in Karachi included Hamza, a former Afghan army commander in Helmand province during Taliban rule, and Abu Riyad al Zarqawi, a liaison with Chechen and Tajik militants in Pakistan's border area, Pakistani officials said.
apart from their unfortunate highnesses:
Mullah Abdul Salam (Kunduz, Sindh)
Mullah Mir Mohammed (Baghlan , Sindh)
Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar (Kabul , Sindh)
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by archan »

Pranav wrote:
Chiron wrote: Overt, conventional warfare is not a good idea. Action against non-state actors is OK but preferably it should be deniable.
but how will that be able to placate the angry BRFites? hu knows hu hit hu, hain? :-?
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Sanku »

archan wrote:
Chiron wrote: Overt, conventional warfare is not a good idea. Action against non-state actors is OK but preferably it should be deniable.
but how will that be able to placate the angry BRFites? hu knows hu hit hu, hain? :-?
hu cares as long as hu's hu of terror gets hit, nahi?
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by ramana »

If hu hits hu its not a problem, as it can be passed off as fratricide or gang war.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Amber G. »

Rudradev wrote:.
..Better 10 Janpath than the home of my loved ones. .....
R-ji- I am sure you do and it may sound like goog logic but ...
Stating the obvious flaw in this [lahori] logic:
The relationship here is not "exclusive *or*" that is -[unless you control the terrorists] it is *not* either 10 Janpath or home of "my loved ones" - In fact, most likely those who want to attack 10 Janpath would have no real love for other Indian homes too
Actually not; there is an "or" type relationship in that the terrorists do not have infinite opportunities or resources to expend. What is better? That they expend their (limited) resources and energies on innocent Indian people, or on the people responsible for our abysmal national security situation in the first place?

Meanwhile, hats off on the personal baiting! I see you haven't departed from your penchant for trolling when the facts are inconvenient.....
<Rest ommited >
:
Rudradev -
First, let me be clear and point out the obvious: "you " in "unless you control the terrorist" is a generic you - That is unelss: you (generic you - one could have used the word "one") control the terrorsits and/or know what they will/(or will not) target, it is, without any doubt, lahori logic that to proclaim "THE ONLY HOPE" (as was done by one postor) is "selelecting 10 Janpath". NO ONE is talking about infinite/finite resources of the terrorists... just the shear absurdity of wishing harm on Indian leaders. It is not funny. Past Indian PM's have been vicitims of terrorism, and the this fact alone has not made oridiany Indians safe.
I see you haven't departed from your penchant for trolling when the facts are inconvenient
.


Sir - No I am not trolling. I don't know about convinient or inconvenient facts but I do know that you have (correct me if I am wrong) and still do routinely abuse Indian leaders (eg calling Sonia Gandhi a prostitute - for which, to be fair, you have corrected your post after admin warning ) and talk about "Maino MMS cabal" .. that is between you and admins but I will appreciate if you do not attack me personally. Request that you edit your post.
Thanks
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by dnivas »

Sriman wrote:
Last question on that interview: "Sorry to use a cliche, but you sound hawkish". I despair. It's truly a sad state of affairs when such a position, well articulated is considered hawkish.
wow, I cannot believe the questions shella butt is asking. damm she needs to lose some of her family and then come up with the same stupid questions. Damm the hate this is building in me.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by amdavadi »

I am sad to say sheela bhatt is related to me. :(. It's not that she hasnt lost distance relatives due to paki terror, but this
kissing upto pakis is too much.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Sanku »

JE Menon wrote:The only way to induce a change in the behaviour of the Pakistani defence/civilian elite who run this anti-India jihad bi saif is to target them directly, personally, specifically and in an escalatory fashion, starting with those distantly linked and working our way inwards.
JEM boss, this what a lot of us have been asking for, I will however make one further change to your scheme -- we need to target both the elite as well as the mango abdul.

Allow me to explain -- our hits are essentially targeted towards the prime movers of the terror and its support apparatus -- but doing only a very selective hit, has two issues

1) It makes them into martyrs -- special sought after etc
2) It leaves the 2nd level to be able to climb up

I believe this is where the US's fairly precise strikes are failing -- there is no terror for number 4,5,6....

We must ensure that the whole jirga fears the outcome, we must also ensure that there is no special feeling towards the "martyrs" let it appear to be irrational frustration on India's part. Essentially keep them guessing.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by dnivas »


Really? I think you have been out of touch with what Indic's wish. Perhaps I should "refresh" your memory

Durbal ko na satayiee
Ja kee mati hai
Muh Khal ke saans le
Loh bhasm ho jaye

Spend some time going around the country and see what people wish for!



Its clear that some are saying we cant do anything and why -- however I insist that the first is a very simplistic rendition of what is asked.

Not bomb the hell out of them (well yes that would not be bad either) but increase the cost for them using a variety of methods that they "Paani ke ek ek boond ke liye taras jaaye" (are in a state of agony for a single drop of water)
I totally agree, if these NSA guys had any ****** common sense, they would do the following

1. Setup a list of pakis to be assasinated.
2. Setup a 50 million USD fund.
3. Hire some "day of the jackal" type assasins. Pay them a retainer or what not. get a list or contract them from the ruskis.
4. Start taking them out one by one.
5. pay those baluchi guys some money to take out one pipe line a day
6. have a list of economic targets. take em out one by one.

How tough can the above be. Seriously. if the pakis start cribbing about involvement, use the same non state actors BS. regarding retaliation from the pukis, they are doing the same anyway and they have a huge list. We take a few important economic / political targets and they will get the message.

Goddam I say take out Dawoods daughter if a message has to be sent. Take out paki generals kids.. This cant be tough .
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by dnivas »

amdavadi wrote:I am sad to say sheela bhatt is related to me. :(. It's not that she hasnt lost distance relatives due to paki terror, but this
kissing upto pakis is too much.
It is not just about kissing to pakis. It is general trend of her questions.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by amdavadi »

That was from my personal interaction with her. I know how far she can go to kissing upto pakis on bhai chara.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by CRamS »

amdavadi wrote:That was from my personal interaction with her. I know how far she can go to kissing upto pakis on bhai chara.
Does she suffer from the Sarmila bose type fatal attraction for TFTA disease? Notice how Paki her Kashmir question was. She declares that India is not "flexible" on Kashmir. Unless you are a Paki or made to think like a Paki due to Stockholm syndrome or the TFTA disease alluded to above, or an Uneven Cohen type charlatan, bereft of TSP terrorism there is no Kashmir issue.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by krisna »

^^^ how many of sarmilas anganas sheilas are due to stockholm syndrome cognitive dissonance or whatever name it is--
I was also at one time talking about peace with pakis chippanda etc .
I did not suffer from any of the above two most often bandied about in BRF. My problem was not able to see the true light or the knowledge which BRF amply supplies. Also lot of brfites help in digging out info about them keeping us aware of it.
IMHO I think many of us(mango abduls) do not have enough information to correlate it. In fact there is growing internet savvy Indians who are able to see thru these---again the information and not stockholm syndrome/ cognitive dissonance. etc
There should be more dissemination of knowledge of these axis of evil.
Being in US, no paki products are purchased- SHQ and family informed about it strictly. My friends have been informed and at one time I was also called as a hindu fanatic hindutwadi etc what not.now there is growing awareness about it.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by JE Menon »

Regarding the matter of dealing with Pakisatani elite's jihad against India through a calibrated targeting, a couple of BRFites have suggested that this approach cuts both ways. This is true. Virtually every approach does. Even in undeclared war, the other side usually fights back. I'm not saying this is foolproof or failureproof. Merely that it is the only option, at least that I can think of, short of a proper war to get the Pakisatanic elites to get with the programme.

Sanku, I was not suggesting that mango abdul should not be targeted. One should feel free to do so. My point rather was that if Pakistan's jihad against India has to be ended, then the elites - specifically the Westernised elite which controls this whole operation, using a range of gullible morons, while smugly going back in escorted cars to their colony mansions and farm houses - need to feel the pain up close and personal, and the message should be conveyed as to the reason for that pain. In no uncertain terms.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by arun »

US Department of Defense response to a question on the motivation of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan for the recent arrests of senior Afghan Taliban leaders such as Mullah Baradar, Mullah Abdul Salam and Mullah Mir Muhammad there.

Pakistan's past track record of consorting with terrorists has it seems bred some who are sceptical of their actions however good it may look on the surface:
February 18, 2010

DOD News Briefing with Geoff Morrell from the Pentagon ………………

Q: Can I follow up on the Pakistan question? Should we attribute the sweep to increased cooperation by the Pakistanis, or an increased willingness of them to go after the Taliban? Or should we -- is this lucky intelligence?

MR. MORRELL: I wouldn't -- I wouldn't attribute any specific operation to any particular motive. I am speaking generally about the way the Pakistani government and its military and its secure -- intelligence services have responded to this threat over the last several months

Q: What would you say to critics who are saying this -- or the timing of this is almost suspicious? The fact that so many of these big fish are being hooked at the same time is raising questions about Pakistan's motives here. I mean, it comes just days after they say they want to be involved in reconciliation efforts. The New York Times says now that this guy Baradar is one of the most approachable members of the Taliban. People are wondering -- maybe Pakistan has motives to gain political favor here. What do you say to that?

MR. MORRELL: Again, I mean, I think the question was asked in a different way by your colleague to your left. I'm not going to speak to their motives. I'm not going to speak to any of the specific operations or these specific captures.

What I will say to you yet again is that we are enormously heartened by the fact that the Pakistani government and their military and intelligence services increasingly recognize the threat within their midst and are doing something about it.

Yeah, Iraq, you said. Is that right?
Excerpt of an earlier portion of the same briefing dealing with the Islamic Republic of Pakistan:
Q: Yeah, could you talk a bit about the significance of this capture in Pakistan of the Afghan Taliban commander? And then also –

MR. MORRELL: Let me just -- let me just add one thing. And I don't -- I'm sure General Carter did. One of the reasons that we're enjoying the success, I think, that we are thus far into this operation has been the extraordinary cooperation that we are getting from the Afghan locals in -- in and around Marja, who have put us in a position to identify IEDs before we happen upon them. So their cooperation, their assistance is saving American and coalition lives, saving Afghan forces' lives and saving their fellow citizens' lives. And so we are very much appreciative of that, because, after all, it is our highest priority to minimize civilian casualties.

Obviously, we had a -- an unfortunate incident that happened a few days ago in which we did suffer some civilian casualties. That investigation is still under way, although I think it clearly indicates thus far that, although civilians were in that house that was -- that was struck, that there were also insurgents in there who had been firing on our forces.

Yeah, Phil (sp), I'm sorry. So the pickups in Pakistan. I'm not in a position to speak to any one of those with any specificity. What I would only offer is that, between the ongoing operations that we have throughout Afghanistan, but in particularly -- particularly in Taliban strongholds, particularly in RC South and then the border region in RC East, as well as the sustained efforts that you've been reading about in Pakistan by the Pakistani military intelligence services, the Taliban is clearly being squeezed -- being squeezed by our forces, coalition forces, Afghan forces in Afghanistan, being squeezed by Pakistani military and intelligence forces in Pakistan.

And we have to see what the impact of this would be. Our hope is clearly that this is creating a certain amount of discontent, worry, turmoil within the organization, such that it is, that Taliban fighters are going to think twice about remaining loyal to this cause and that this will ultimately adversely impact the momentum that they have enjoyed over the past several months.

I think it's too soon to say with any certainty that we've -- that it has reversed the momentum trend that they had enjoyed. I think you heard from General McChrystal last week when we were -- two weeks ago, I guess it was, when we were in Istanbul, that he no longer sees the situation as deteriorating. But he was reluctant to go any further than that, so I'm certainly not going to. But between the concerted efforts that you're seeing in Pakistan and the concerted efforts that we are undertaking along with our Afghan partners in Afghanistan, the squeeze is being put to the Taliban.

Yeah, Mike.

Q: Geoff, kind of along those same lines, there's been a concerted effort to grab -- capture or kill, I guess -- some of the local shadow governors of the -- around Afghanistan. Can you talk just a bit about what those captures mean, and exactly what the -- what the shadow governments around Afghanistan have been -- have been doing in terms of –

MR. MORRELL: I -- I think -- you know, again, Mike, I think I fundamentally addressed this point. I mean, I think that we are -- we believe, we certainly hope, that these combined efforts on both sides of the border are going to reverse the momentum that the Taliban had enjoyed.

I can't speak with any specificity to any of these particulars but -- particular cases. I'd urge you to, you know, talk to the Pakistani government about who they have and the significance of who they've picked up.

We are obviously -- and you've heard me say it time and time again now over the last several months -- enormously pleased and gratified and heartened by the fact that the Pakistani government, the Pakistani military, their intelligence services, appreciate the threat that exists within their midst and is doing something about it. That's reflected in the fact that they have an extraordinary number of forces now deployed on the border region in the west. It's reflected in the fact that they are taking action against Taliban leaders. There's a -- there's a host of examples of their recognition that this -- that this threat within their borders is every bit as much a danger to them as it is to us.

Q: Can you talk, though, about what impact these shadow governments have been having on the effort?

MR. MORRELL: Well, I mean, I think I would only -- I would only say, Mike, that clearly any attempt to undermine the legitimate government, the democratically elected government of Afghanistan is counterproductive. And this is a fledgling government as it is; it's a government that has -- has been, you know, trying to get on its feet in the midst of war, in the midst of enormous economic hardships. And the fact that there are those within the country who are trying to undermine it and set up alternative forms of governance are simply not helpful. And so the more -- the more Pakistani leaders and shadow governors and wanna-be future leaders who are picked up, taken out, killed, arrested, whatever it may be, or want to lay down their arms and recognize and support the democratically elected government, the better.

Yeah.
From here:

DOD News Briefing with Geoff Morrell from the Pentagon
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by arun »

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by abhishek_sharma »

Baradar's Game

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2 ... adars_game
What was Baradar doing in Karachi?

...

Could Baradar's capture have actually be a defection? Seeing his life expectancy running short, he might have opted for the safety of capture. Another twist on this scenario is the possibility of a rift inside the Afghan Taliban's leadership; Baradar may have defected to avoid assassination at the hands of his comrades.

...

Does Baradar possess some long-term value to the Pakistani government?

A follow-up story in the New York Times revealed that prior to his capture, Afghan and U.S. officials had indirect contact with Baradar and had negotiated with him, presumably about reconciliation. According to the piece, the Pakistani government was not a party to these talks.

In the long run, U.S. and Pakistani interests regarding Afghanistan diverge. Pakistan maintains a permanent interest in the greater Pashtun region, and a weak Afghan government in Kabul is to their advantage. The United States seeks a strong government in Kabul. Even more important to Pakistan: In the long run the United States will inevitably tilt toward India.


But in the shorter run, there may be some convergance. Similar to the forthcoming U.S. exit from Iraq, the Obama team is hoping for a political settlement in Afghanistan that leads to a relative calm, at least long enough to allow most of the U.S. military forces in the country to gracefully exit. For its part, Pakistan might also prefer a truce. Pakistani leaders may worry that an escalating ground war in Afghanistan and a drone campaign on Pakistan's frontier could eventually obliterate the Afghan Taliban's command structure, crippling Pakistan's influence inside Afghanistan. By this reasoning, both the United States and Pakistan would have an interest in a truce occurring sometime soon.


Might Baradar be the man in the best position to bring about such a truce? If he was able to convince most of his comrades to cease fire, Pakistan is in a position to reward him. U.S. officials would hardly frown on such a settlement, as long as it lasted long enough for Washington's purposes. The biggest loser might be Afghan President Hamid Karzai. But few in the White House seem concerned for his feelings these days.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by arun »

abhishek_sharma wrote:Talks under way for N-deal with US: Haqqani

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/daw ... 520--bi-01
LAHORE: Pakistan’s Ambassador to US Husain Haqqani has said the government has started negotiating with the United States for an agreement on nuclear technology.

“The US is not sceptical about our nuclear programme. Talks between Pakistan and the US for cooperation on atomic programmes are under way and we want the US to have an agreement with us like the one it had with India on civil nuclear technology,” Mr Haqqani said at a reception hosted by Punjab Governor Salmaan Taseer on Sunday. …….. {Snipped}
Talk of a civilian nuclear deal between the Islamic Republic of Pakistan and the US appear to be heading the same way of that of the civilian nuclear deal with France. That is that all talk is hot air being blown by Pakistan :wink: .

It will be recollected that the Islamic Republic via their Foreign Minister loudly proclaimed to the world in May 2009 that a civilian nuclear deal with France was on after President Zardari’s visit there ( France wants India-style nuclear deal for Pakistan). That turned out to be a lot of hot air being blown by the Islamic Republic (France not for India-like nuclear pact with Pakistan):
US unaware of Pak request for civilian N-deal

Published: February 20, 2010

WASHINGTON – A senior Obama administration official on Thursday appeared unaware of any request from Pakistan about a civilian nuclear deal similar to the one US had with India, but said Islamabad’s concerns regarding its civilian and military needs were being addressed.

“I don’t know,” Assistant Secretary of State for Public Affairs Philip Crowley said when questioned at a news briefing about a statement made last week in Lahore by Pakistan’s Ambassador to the US Hussain Haqqani, saying the Pakistani government has started negotiating with the US for an agreement on nuclear technology. .................

The Nation
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by SSridhar »

The Pune attack has once again ignited the furious discussion here for the n^th time on:
  • Should we attack Pakistan ?
  • Can we even attack Pakistan ?
  • Should we not wait until we become sufficiently stronger economically and militarily ?
  • Won't Pakistan become irrelevant if we continue and accelerate our economic growth momentum ?
  • Shouldn't we hit those countries who protect Pakistan ?
  • If we want to 'punish' Pakistan, how do we do that ? Do we hit ordinary people, or target attack those who help the terrorists ?
May be I have missed a few other. All I am saying 'staying the same course as it now is' is not an option. Let us not argue too much and do nothing in the end, as usual.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by RamaY »

^^^

SS-ji

In all seriousness GOI should negotiate with Taliban and support its claim on Kabul. Once that is done, it should ask taliban to bring pure islam to TSP. Then it should arm Talibani-Afghanistan with nukes so they can take over the holy lands and west.

That can be a fresh change in GOI response.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Virupaksha »

SSridhar wrote: All I am saying 'staying the same course as it now is' is not an option. Let us not argue too much and do nothing in the end, as usual.
which is what we will end up doing anyway
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by RamaY »

Self deleted

Archanullah - Pls see the varna system in it, not CASTE system. Pls think about it when you have time.
Last edited by RamaY on 20 Feb 2010 09:31, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by archan »

^^ closet hindootvawadi. :roll:
What a communal post! there is even caste system in it! already Hindoostan is suffering at the hands of Hindoo terrorists as mentioned by comrade Nayar.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by chetak »

amit wrote:
shiv wrote:
  • MMS is looking for Nobel prize
  • Indians are cowards
  • The US is dictating terms
MMS looking for Nobel is a temporary problem. He will be out of the reckoning within the decade. Indians being cowards is well known to the Pakis and has not changed for millennia and is not looking like it will change soon. We have to attack Pakistan after MMS goes taking cognizance of Indian cowardice.
Funnily enough if I remember correctly there was talk that Vajpayee was also looking for the Nobel Peace Prize during his Lahore bus yatra phase. For example this old Independent report says:
It was, for example, less than a year ago that Mr Vajpayee was plausibly said to be dreaming of getting the Nobel Peace Prize for bringing India and Pakistan together. India, under his government, has moved barely one inch towards achieving a political solution to the festering problem of Kashmir – but that is not for want of Mr Vajpayee's trying. He has repeatedly announced initiatives intended to jolt the stalemate in the direction of peace. Each time the hawks at his side have managed to frustrate him.
What's this with Indian PMs that the moment they get the gaddi in Delhi they look for the Noble Peace Prize by showering love and affection on the Pakis?
Guys,

It's not so much looking for a prize, but the fact that the same is being dangled as a carrot for the gifting away of land. The US and its fanboys are a large part of this plan. They, through their insidious and overarching influence over the nobel proceedings have found it the best and cheapest way to approach the Indian ego.

All surely the part of a deal with the ummah to ease tensions and do some reciprocal land gifting in desert areas!

If the pakis and THEIR sponsors succeed, they will immediately start
ops Junagadh, Hyderbad and some districts of SRK.

They have had their baleful eyes on the Indian Punjab for decades now.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Pranav »

ramana wrote:If hu hits hu its not a problem, as it can be passed off as fratricide or gang war.
So many gangs competing with each other in pakiland (one of them being the paki army). It is only fair that we get a few Paki gangs of our own. Some people can be bought, their rivals can have accidents, still others can get involved in gang wars, so many possibilities.
Last edited by Pranav on 20 Feb 2010 09:49, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Vivek_A »

Out of cycle nuttiness..shrill sees jews under her bed...

Mossad's use of European travel documents

By: Shireen M Mazari | Published: February 20, 2010
A new and dangerous trend for the Muslim states has now surfaced in the form of Israel’s murderous intelligence agency, Mossad’s access into these countries through the use of American and European passports. The murder of Hamas military commander Mahmoud al-Mabhouh in a Dubai hotel has shown how Mossad has been gaining access into the Arab World and beyond, in Muslim states that have still not recognised Israel. The 11 suspected Mossad agents who have been named by the UAE as suspects all travelled on British, Irish, German and French documents and apparently communicated indirectly with each other through a command centre in Austria. Apparently the British had protested to Israel in 1987 also over what it termed as the misuse by Israeli authorities of British passports. It is alleged that the European countries’ documents were forged but the fact of the matter is that many Israelis keep dual nationality in order to travel to countries where the Israeli passport is not recognised. The dual nationalities are normally either European, Canadian or American. In fact, many American nationals of the Jewish faith also hold Israeli passports and some have even served in the Israeli Defence Forces. For Pakistan these startling revelations pose a very serious threat, given how Israel has been targeting Pakistan’s nuclear programme and has evolved an extremely strong strategic partnership with India. While the US has been pressing Pakistan to ease visa procedures for Americans, under the new developments Pakistan will have to scrutinise American and European visa applicants even more closely. It now becomes critical for the Interior Ministry to identify how many Americans were given Pakistani visas in the last few years and where exactly these Americans are now based. Perhaps someone can raise the issue in Parliament as to how many dual national Americans are present within the US military set up in Pakistan, since they have access to the Pakistan military. Already there are major question marks over the American citizens arrested in Sargodha. Were they working for the CIA and trying to infiltrate certain religious groups?

Also, since countries like the US are already doing racial profiling, Pakistan needs to check out the Jewish American citizens to see if any of them have any Israeli connections or dual nationality.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Pranav »

Sanku wrote: Allow me to explain -- our hits are essentially targeted towards the prime movers of the terror and its support apparatus -- but doing only a very selective hit, has two issues

1) It makes them into martyrs -- special sought after etc
2) It leaves the 2nd level to be able to climb up
Martyrdom is a very intangible thing which can only come from moral legitimacy. It is probably correct to say that folks like Hafeez Saeed have no legitimacy amongst 75% of common Pakis (although its a fact that the other 25% are very vocal and rabid). Recall that there is a significant number that support parties like ANP and Jeay Sindh. If Hafeez Saeed were to meet with an unfortunate accident, most Pakis would shrug and say he had it coming.

Another thing ... we should establish ties with second level folks before the 1st level folks get accidented.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by shiv »

I think it's simple.

Pakistan is doing bad things to India. We want to do bad things to Pakistan, but we are ourselves powerless and start looking around for people whom we think have power.

We look at armed forces and they say "Sorry - we will do the job - but ask the leadership"

But we just looked at the leadership and they are not doing the bad things that we want them to do to Pakistan. Then we start looking for explanations

1) Prime minister is a bureaucrat economist and does not understand geopolitics
2) Prime minister wants a Nobel Prize
3) Indian government is a foreign government
4) America controls India government and does not want India to attack Pakistan

This is a shame because no other government is like this. Only in India.

But folks - don't you think that given the adverse circumstances we face in punishing Pakistan, it is clear that India cannot punish Pakistan. I mean why speak of war and punishment when there are too many reasons why India will not punish Pakistan. We have all the explanations recorded on here for posterity and nobody has any solutions. What does that mean? It means Pakistan shall remain untouched by India.

Ok people may feel anger and in that anger they may demand that the terrorists stop hitting some Indians and start hitting Sonia Gandhi's residence. In USA you cannot wish for a terrorist attack on Obama. You will get arrested. So people in the US are scared of saying "Obama should face a terrorist attack". But you can say "I wish that Sonia Gandhi's residence is attacked by terrorists' on Bharat "Rakshak" forum.

That statement makes me laugh. It is an ironic laugh. On the one hand we accuse the govenment of cowardice. We also accept that the Government is led by a foreign woman Sonia Gandhi and is therefore traitorous. But no Rakshak is brave enough to himself go and plant a bomb in No 10 janpath. We sit behind computer screens in far off places, too sacred to wish for Obama's death although he is paying Paki terrorists and we make a post on Bharat Rakshak that some terrorist should bomb that woman's house . The people making the wish do no have the guts to do that. They want some other brave bakra to do it for them. That is amusing. I mean the hypocrisy is amusing.

India is made up of Indians. The Indian government is as cowardly as bharat rakshaks who wish for a bomb on a woman's house in India. The truth is
1) We are no more brave than GoI
2) GoI can do nothing about Pakistan
3) Some of us wish for terrorist attacks on people we dislike because we don't ourselves have the guts to do anything.

I am not sure if this is OT, but sure as hell the wish for No 10 janpath to be attacked/bombed has not yet been declared OT as far as I can tell.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Pranav »

shiv wrote:We also accept that the Government is led by a foreign woman Sonia Gandhi and is therefore traitorous.
Please no strawmen. I would say that this government is displaying extremely suspicious behavior on EVMs, which is why it needs to be closely scrutinized.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by KLNMurthy »

RamaY wrote:^^^

SS-ji

In all seriousness GOI should negotiate with Taliban and support its claim on Kabul. Once that is done, it should ask taliban to bring pure islam to TSP. Then it should arm Talibani-Afghanistan with nukes so they can take over the holy lands and west.

That can be a fresh change in GOI response.
Something like this was tried by Vijayanagar with the Bahmani kingdoms. We ended up with Tallikota. I am sure you are being sarcastic, but we as a nation seem to have a tendency to be too clever by half.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by shravan »

Suicide blasts rock Balakot, Mansehra police stations
MANSEHRA: Two police stations in Balakot and Mansehra were rocked with suicide bombings killing an SHO of Balakot police station and injuring several other personnel, Geo News reported Saturday.

The gunshots are still being heard from Mansehra police station. There are reports that the suicide bomber at Mansehra police station had various accomplices, who are hiding in various offices. Contradictory reports are pouring in regarding the gunshots.

There are also reports that police have arrested some accomplices in Mansehra.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by Rudradev »

No TSPA/ISI backed terrorist would ever bomb Sonia Gandhi's house anyway. Why would TSPA/ISI want to bite the hand that feeds them?

Most recently that hand has fed TSPA/ISI with a lavish meal of surrender and sellout. For dessert, that hand has now served the TSPA/ISI with a media coup... ready made deniability and propaganda rolled into a sweet mouthful for Zaid Hamid to regurgitate.

Sekoolar Media mouthpieces Kuldip Nayar and Pravin Swami have speculated that the Pune blasts were carried out by Hindoo Extremists. While doing so they have confirmed that Hemant Karkare was also murdered by the Bajrang Dal and the VHP.

If you recall, the murder of Karkare by Hindoo Extremists resulted from Karkare investigating Hindoo Extremist Col Prohit's carrying out the Malegaon blast and the Samjhauta Express bombing. Col Prohit's guilt in the Samjhauta Express bombing was another delicious treat relayed to the TSPA/ISI/Zaid Hamid by the Maharashta ATS.

How generous is the Hand that Feeds the Pakis! Why would they ever want to bite her?
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by JwalaMukhi »

shiv wrote:This is a shame because no other government is like this. Only in India.

But folks - don't you think that given the adverse circumstances we face in punishing Pakistan, it is clear that India cannot punish Pakistan. I mean why speak of war and punishment when there are too many reasons why India will not punish Pakistan. We have all the explanations recorded on here for posterity and nobody has any solutions. What does that mean? It means Pakistan shall remain untouched by India.
Punishing pakis (personified evil), when circumstances are not adverse, aka when India has grown its economy, all the stars are lined up with no chance of failure whatsoever even if India screwed up the process, would not be called as punishing.
Its simply that India will not only see aurangzeb's time. It will also see the times of chatrapati Shivaji, Krishnadevaraya etc. It is not that India has become barren to only produce compromisers. It will not always produce people so they can be sacrificed as nara bali to monsters. There always will be people who would want India to believe that India cannot punish pakistan. That kind of challenge existed even during Shivaji, Krishnadevaraya's period and will continue to do so in future too. What matters is; their(compromisers) success or failure is always dependent on what non-compromisers allow them.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by rajpa »

can we shift track a bit from all the r&d and simply see that ahimsa, non-cooperation etc will save us from our mortal enemy? :roll:
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by RayC »

How many have seen Mani Shankar Aiyer on TV on Indo Pak relationship.

I believe he was born in Pakistan.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by rajpa »

it seems to me that the only reason that indian babus refused to talk to tsp was because they were afraid of coming up with another ses type statement in support of tsp. it has been an indian weakness to yield to tsp in diplomatic talks. there is nothing else stopping india from getting ses type concessions from tsp.

on the other hand the media pressure on babus to reveal discussions with tsp forces them to reveal our weak negotiating tactics or paki aggressive or gubo tactics and ensure that our babus put serious effort into doing better.

they should start revealing the contents of these talks to expose tsp tactics as well as ours. and then brfites can give crash courses to babus on how to negotiate better! :D
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by chetak »

RayC wrote:How many have seen Mani Shankar Aiyer on TV on Indo Pak relationship.

I believe he was born in Pakistan.

Your belief about the genetic contamination of this "gentleman's" gene pool is a hundred percent correct.

I use the word gentleman advisedly, his anti Indian rants are tasteless and tactless as are his chadi dosts from across the border.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by chetak »

rajpa wrote:it seems to me that the only reason that indian babus refused to talk to tsp was because they were afraid of coming up with another ses type statement in support of tsp. it has been an indian weakness to yield to tsp in diplomatic talks. there is nothing else stopping india from getting ses type concessions from tsp.

on the other hand the media pressure on babus to reveal discussions with tsp forces them to reveal our weak negotiating tactics or paki aggressive or gubo tactics and ensure that our babus put serious effort into doing better.

they should start revealing the contents of these talks to expose tsp tactics as well as ours. and then brfites can give crash courses to babus on how to negotiate better! :D
If you have observed the pattern closely, it seems like the Indian DDM has been paid off to behave like this, as though the world will come crashing down if we don't talk to the pakis.

Two particularly nasty english DDM channels have taken the lead in this obsequious kow towing to the pakis. Both are commie oriented.
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Jan. 29, 2010

Post by rajpa »

talking itself is not a major problem. the question is of objectives.

babus end up giving in to tsp. you can talk because of bhaichara but not shave off your family jewels just for that.
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