Afghanistan News & Discussion

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 15 Jun 2010 01:50

I don't know what you mean by "no lack of minerals." Why do you think China is taking a variety of measures to entrench itself in Africa and Central America? Industrial minerals may not be as close to exhaustion as petroleum, but with the vast uptick in industrialization of Asian and some African and Latin American nations, the demand for them is insatiable. Countries who want to stay competitive as global powers of any sort, must exercise control over as many of these mineral deposits as possible. That's what it's about... not only about gram-for-gram how many minerals are in the ground.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 15 Jun 2010 01:51

satyam wrote:Hi I am new to this forum. I am from IIT kharagpur.

Can you please tell me what is so great about 900 billion $ mineral in Afghanistan? India alone has mineral of about 8 trillion $ at current price. It will take Afghans atleast 40 to 50 years to exploit them.

It is not Afghanistan companies who will be working to extract; no prizes for guessing but it would be Unkil and his chellas. Afghanistan and its people will fully benefit like any other country whose natural resources were exploited by phoren powers.

satyam · Post by **satyam** » 15 Jun 2010 01:54

@Rudradev:

I agree.But Afghanistan would be the last place where one would invest huge amount of money.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 15 Jun 2010 01:57

satyam wrote:@Rudradev:

I agree.But Afghanistan would be the last place where one would invest huge amount of money.

What do you think the Soviet did in the 80s and Unkil has been doing the last 8 years, boots on the ground for no reason?

satyam · Post by **satyam** » 15 Jun 2010 02:00

SwamyG wrote:

What do you think the Soviet did in the 80s and Unkil has been doing the last 8 years, boots on the ground for no reason?

oil pipelines.

Rudradev · Post by **Rudradev** » 15 Jun 2010 02:03

Satyam: controlling a mineral resource is not only about being able to extract it for yourself, it is also about being able to deprive other nations of it, or using your control over it as leverage over other nations who need the minerals.

China would die to have unfettered access to Afghanistan's minerals, right in its backyard. In fact, they have already laid out $3 billion to invest in Afghanistan copper fields. But they can't get unfettered access to Afghanistan as long as the Americans control it.

satyam · Post by **satyam** » 15 Jun 2010 02:07

China is a unique case. It has a trade surplus of 500 billion $ with USA and EU. And doesn't hesitate to show middle finger to them.

Well it will certainly want to have those minerals to control their export market.

ShauryaT · Post by **ShauryaT** » 15 Jun 2010 04:47

Rudradev wrote: China would die to have unfettered access to Afghanistan's minerals, right in its backyard. In fact, they have already laid out $3 billion to invest in Afghanistan copper fields. But they can't get unfettered access to Afghanistan as long as the Americans control it.

All this while the closest largest market to these Afghani assets remains woefully under sold to, as the government of that market is busy collecting goodwill.

ShauryaT · Post by **ShauryaT** » 15 Jun 2010 04:50

satyam wrote:China is a unique case. It has a trade surplus of 500 billion $ with USA and EU. And doesn't hesitate to show middle finger to them.

Well it will certainly want to have those minerals to control their export market.

Not to mention that control of the karakoram is what makes it possible for China to transport these assets and not through the sliver it holds in the Wakhan and it is control of the northern areas that makes the control of Karakoram possible. So the solution is?

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 15 Jun 2010 05:06

Halliburton and Blackwater could teach mining to Afghans (if only Bush & Cheney were still in the Whitehouse)

But where is the mention of the lithium in the map posted above?

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 15 Jun 2010 06:15

On Afghanisthan-
Having lot of minerals is one thing ,
extracting/exploiting it is another in a land with lot of mountains coupled with the likes of pakiban trying to overtake the current regime. what guarantee

is there for the insane to agree on mineral extraction with the help of foreign tech. Religious bandmasters with come into play sooner than later.Likely it will result in prolonged conflicts with more juicy targets.
It will be a looooong term investments before profits can accrue to any party interested in it. Who will foot the bill

Foreign powers-
Can unkil stomach the loss of body bags over time, its economy going downhill( will drag the military machine down also). The prospects dont look bright for exploitation in the long term. Will ombaba oblige the business ventures with military support to help them. what will happen to is election process in 2012. will amrikans oblige him.
What if panda offers a better investment opportunity by undercutting the prices for exploitation. How will it change the dynamics between the 2 powers at least in our backyard.

Maybe silver lining for yindia with more easy profitable targets for pakiban. nanha mujahids prefer easy ones than sdre military

At least we can grew more economically.

my 2 paise.

Airavat · Post by **Airavat** » 15 Jun 2010 06:46

Baghlan reservoir needs urgent repair.

The walls of the reservoir that feeds the plant are in a poor state and their collapse could lead to a massive electricity shortage, and inundate thousands of acres of agricultural lands, said the head of the hydropower station, Ghulam Qadir.

The 60-year-old power station was constructed by Germany to initially run a textile factory but later on, the power it generated was distributed to the city residents as well. The station produces six megawatts of electricity.

Four months earlier, US armed forces had launched a survey to fund rebuilding the dam, Qadir said, adding they have heard nothing from the US military so far.

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 15 Jun 2010 07:06

its been known since the 70s that Afghanistan had large mineral deposits no its not breaking news.

why are they spinning it as such. Either its to gain public support for a longer stay in afghanistan or to bribe pakistan into being more cooperative with the promise of a cut of the loot?

---

Owing to its geological history, which saw numerous tectonic plate movements as the land mass broke off from Gondwanaland and moved towards the Eurasian plate some 250 million years ago, resource-rich Afghanistan has vast deposits of metals, non-metallic minerals and gemstones.

Every agency working in the country on its economic development has identified the extractive industries as a key area for development in their efforts to repair Afghanistan's war-frayed economy.

Afghanistan's geology had piqued the interest of Soviet geologists still back in the 1970s, before the USSR invaded its neighbor. At that time, the geologists prospected the area around Kabul and rediscovered Aynak.

Previously it had been exploited in ancient times, over 1,500 years ago. Following the Soviet invasion in December 1979, geologists were again sent in to survey the land.

Apart from copper, the country has deposits of zinc, chromium, gold, iron, uranium and rare metals such as lithium and tantalum. According to an advisor with USAID, the iron deposits are most likely to be the next candidates for tender if the copper tender succeeds.

http://www.energypublisher.com/article.asp?id=10643

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 15 Jun 2010 07:29

Setbacks Cloud U.S. Plans to Get Out of Afghanistan

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/15/world ... itary.html

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 15 Jun 2010 07:29

Afghans Giddy Over Mineral Estimate

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/15/world ... fghan.html

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 15 Jun 2010 07:32

Sanjay M wrote:But where is the mention of the lithium in the map posted above?

Here you go: Lithium is on the region marked by the lower left ellipse.

. The image is sourced from Rare Metals document created by British Geological Survey.

please to note the date it is 2009 on these articles/pdf.

http://smarteconomy.typepad.com/smart_e ... istan.html

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 15 Jun 2010 07:41

So the lithium deposits are situated in the Pashtun-dominated areas. This will make Pak feel all the more greedy toward them.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 15 Jun 2010 08:12

More on Afghanistan's mineral riches

http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/201 ... ral_riches

http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/201 ... _resources

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 15 Jun 2010 08:21

Is Afghanistan really the next El Dorado?

http://walt.foreignpolicy.com/posts/201 ... _el_dorado

Color me skeptical.

...

Great powers often convince themselves they have to control some far-flung area because it is supposedly rich with gold, diamonds, oil, etc., and that physical control is essentially to preserving access to them. In most cases, however, the cost of trying to control these areas isn't worth the resources they contain, and it usually isn't necessary anyway.

...

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 15 Jun 2010 08:35

If the mineral wealth of Afghanistan has indeed been determined by satellite surveys, there is no question that the US has known about it for years...

I do not know the source of unkil's information. But you definitely are onto something. It is not in the CT realm. British Geological Survey helped Afghanistan document it in 2009 (see my earlier post).

Look at this report's, produced in 1985, conclusion {linky: http://www.gems-afghan.com/articles/status.htm}

Significant quantities of a variety of high-quality gem materials are now emerging from northeastern Afghanistan. More material than ever before has reached cutting centers in Thailand, Hong Kong, Germany, Brazil, and the U.S. While the present hostilities and war-like conditions in Afghanistan have made mining and subsequent transportation of the gem materials difficult, the need for capital appears to have stimulated mining operations to their greatest heights in many years. For example, greater amounts of fine-quality lapis lazuli are available now than at any time in recent decades. The reserves of tourmaline and spodumene, in particular - and to a lesser extent also emerald - appear to be good. Political conditions permitting, Afghanistan should continue to supply significant quantities of these gem materials for several years to come.

According to Handbook of Lithium and natural calcium chloride, Afghanistan was known to have mid-sized lithium deposits in 2000). {see page 54}

According to Industrial minerals & rocks: commodities, markets and uses published in 2006, Afghanistan was considered as one source of a lithium mineral.

As per World and Its Peoples: The Middle East, Western Asia, and Northern Africa
By Marshall Cavendish {page 360}

Afghanistan also has an estimated 73 million tons (66 million metric tons) of coal reserves, most of which are located near Herat.
<snip><snip>
Other mineral wealth includes high-grade iron ore, copper, uranium, lead, zinc and chrome ore, as well as rock salt, beryl, barite, flourite, bauxite, lithium, tantalum, gold, silver, asbestos, mica and slufur.

Skimming through the Internet, I suspect Bear and the Bald Eagle had a rough idea of the various natural resources of Afghanistan. It is probable that they did not have the direct access to assess the quantity and quality of these resources from a far from away place. Hence the need for boots on the area. But Russies had indirect access before they rolled their tanks. All of them wanted unfettered access to validate/corroborate their previous research work. With direct access they have probably are just confirming what they always knew/believed.

It is clear they had some info as far as 2006/2007; but the big news is only now in 2010. They knew something even before 2006/2007 - I don;t know when though - one of the date is as early as 2000. But there are talks about gems as far as 1985. Nothing points to all this being an accidental discovery. Did it take 2-3 years for them to get a real solid confirmation/assessment? Or did they wait for 2-3 years for some planets to align?

Daal me kuch lithium hain jee.

naren · Post by **naren** » 15 Jun 2010 09:37

Or it could be just a big hype to drag other parties (India/China..) to pitch in for handling the mess.

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 15 Jun 2010 15:25

Presence of minerals, and the quality of deposits to be commercially viable (including the extraction costs) are two very different things. Nothing is known about the second, and even if we assume a "blood diamond" like scenario, that adds costs, substantial costs, especially for mineral which are not needed by pocketfuls but by kilos. Way too many uncertain data points.

At this juncture, the question is more "why say this now?"

satyam · Post by **satyam** » 15 Jun 2010 20:19

Indian cos, Rio, BHP keen on developing Afghan mines

Afghanistan today said Indian mining companies and global majors like Rio Tinto and BHP Billiton are keen to develop the war-torn country's mineral resources, estimated at $1 trillion.

After calling on Indian Mines Minister B K Handique, visiting Afghanistan Mines Minister Wahidullah Shahrani told PTI, "Indian and global companies like Rio Tinto and BHP Billiton are keen to develop mines in Afghanistan."

Taking its plans forward, Afghanistan will launch a road show in London later this month in which 200 companies, including global majors like Rio Tinto, BHP Billiton, Vale and many Indian companies, are expected to attend.
"We will invite bids for development of mineral deposits in the country in the next few months," Shahrani said, adding that the mineral wealth in Afghanistan is valued at approximately $1 trillion.

"We have invited 200 companies, including global majors like Rio Tinto, BHP Billiton, Vale and many Indian companies, to attend the road show on June 25 in London," he said.

He sought India's assistance for exchange of know-how and expertise in the mining sector, besides help from the Geological Survey of India for mapping its resources.

"Afghanistan is rich in minerals like iron ore, copper, cobalt, chromite and the whole country is yet to be fully explored," he said.

Indian firms like Essar had earlier evinced interest to bid for iron ore mines in Afghanistan when the Afghanistan government had invited a global expression of interest (EoI) for its Hajigak iron ore mines, said to be having 1.8 billion tonnes of reserves. The country's iron ore deposits, as per reports, are estimated at between 5-6 billion tonnes.

An Essar official, however, when contacted said that the company had participated in the EoI, but did not receive any response.

http://www.business-standard.com/india/ ... s/98041/on

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jun 2010 08:39

Helmand: anatomy of a disaster

http://afpak.foreignpolicy.com/posts/20 ... a_disaster

Pretty good article.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jun 2010 08:50

Fainting Spells
Gen. Petraeus' collapse is a grim metaphor for the prospects of the Kandahar offensive.

http://www.slate.com/id/2257058/

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jun 2010 08:59

Are Rare Earth Elements Actually Rare?

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2 ... ually_rare

AdityaM · Post by **AdityaM** » 16 Jun 2010 11:02

news of mineral deposit brings back memory of the Frederick Forsyth book - "The Dogs of War"
now when is a coup happening?! oh, there is no need for a coup, the powers are already there!

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 16 Jun 2010 11:12

Indian cos, Rio, BHP keen on developing Afghan mines

For the sake of Afghanistan, I hope the mining industry takes off.

Otherwise I can't see Afghanistan being economically self-sufficient ever.

AdityaM · Post by **AdityaM** » 16 Jun 2010 11:17

all output will have to travel through pakiland. windfall for pakis

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 16 Jun 2010 11:17

The Minister of Mines, Afghanistan, Mr. Wahidullah Shahrani calls on the Union Minister for Mines and Development of North Eastern Region, Shri B.K. Handique, in New Delhi on June 15, 2010.

http://pib.nic.in/release/phsmall.asp?phid=29004

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 16 Jun 2010 12:03

AdityaM wrote:all output will have to travel through pakiland. windfall for pakis

Or through Iran!

shyamd · Post by **shyamd** » 16 Jun 2010 16:23

Very interesting article. This is a translated version of Saleh's comments in other afghan newspapers, put together by MEMRI

Former Afghan intelligence chief lashes out at Karzai

http://bit.ly/blRlXO

Former Afghanistan Intelligence Chief Says He Quit Because of President Karzai's 'Soft' Policy on Taliban, Says: 'This Soft Behavior Makes the Enemy's Intention Even Stronger and Makes the Confidence of Friends Shaky'

As Afghan President Hamid Karzai was delivering his inaugural address on the opening day of the June 2-4 National Consultative Peace Jirga in Afghanistan, Taliban militants fired several missiles on the venue and engaged in gunfire in the Afghan capital.[1] Nearly 1,600 community and religious leaders from across Afghanistan were in attendance at the meeting, which was organized to end the Taliban-led violence in the country.
Given the presence of the country's top leaders and foreign diplomats at the venue, the attacks were seen as a major security failure. A few days later, Karzai held a meeting with Afghan Interior Minister Hanif Atmar and Amrullah Saleh (pictured above), the chief of the National Directorate of Security (NDS). According to a report on the Afghan website tolafghan.com, during the meeting Karzai expressed anger and demanded their resignations.[2] According to a report in the Pashtu-language daily Wrazpanra Eradu of June 7, Atmar and Saleh resigned.[3]
A few days after his resignation, Amrullah Saleh added a new dimension to the security failure issue, saying that he quit because of his differences over the Karzai government's policy of holding peace talks with the Taliban. The former spy chief noted that he quit after the three-day jirga (meeting of the elders) approved President Karzai's proposal for peace talks with the militants.[4]
In a recent interview with the Afghan website Quqnoos.com, Saleh revealed more details about his position on the Karzai government’s policy on the Taliban. The interview is given below, followed by another article, titled "The Afghan spy chief's resignation" in which renowned Taliban affairs expert Rahimullah Yusufzai explains the significance of questions raised by Saleh’s resignation. Yusufzai’s article is important in view of Saleh’s recent statement that the Pakistani military’s Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) has been causing destruction in Afghanistan. Saleh, who has several years of experience in intelligence work in Afghanistan and abroad, remarked, "The ISI is part of the landscape of destruction in this country, no doubt. So it will be a waste of time to provide evidence of ISI involvement. They are part of it."
Following are excerpts from the interview:[5]
"The… Main Reason for My Disagreement with the President is that… [President Karzai] Ordered the Remission of the Taliban [Prisoners]"
Quqnoos: "What were the main reasons for your resignation?"
Saleh: "I want to clear up two issues that I have discussed with the media. First, the president did not accept the evidence about the Taliban attack in which the Haqqani network was involved. We discussed the evidence from the Peace Jirga. I consider this act by the president an insult to the hard work of the Afghan security forces. We sincerely expressed apologies to the Afghan nation and President Karzai for our failure to maintain security during the Peace Jirga, and we accepted our failure, but we will not allow others to question our intentions."
Quqnoos: "It is believed that some internal motives were also involved in these attacks. Don't you think that some internal [government] hands were involved in these attacks, since the attackers were able to easily penetrate the area – and one of them had even entered the Peace Jirga pavilion?"
Saleh: "The arrest of the man inside the Peace Jirga was the result of the efforts of our fellow police officers. I do not know more about its details."
Quqnoos: "What about some internal elements being involved in the incident?"
Saleh: "According to our investigation, the attackers had rented a house in the area 45 days ago. These attackers, who were disguised in burqas [veils], had carried weapons and rocket launchers covered in clothes under their burqas. We searched the suspected areas and found a telephone number in the house from which rockets were launched. Through their mobile numbers, we found and arrested the organizers of these attacks within two days. They were planning to escape to Pakistan, and they are in government custody now, but the president ignored all of this evidence."
Quqnoos: "There were also some security problems in the past. But the president's behavior was too strict this time. It is believed that the difference in views between you and the president was the main reason for your resignation."
Saleh: "It has been some time that President Karzai's and my visions in analysis and ideas toward the situation and the definition of the enemy and friend have differed; and I was thinking that I would break this stalemate by bringing evidence and other information. But when I realized that this stalemate was unbreakable, it was my moral duty to resign. I am not at all regretful that I have resigned. The interesting point is that, a few days ago, someone told me that I was sacrificed. I told him that contrary to that, my voice has become more open. Now I have freedom of movement, I am at my home and among my people. The pain of a Kandahari martyred is my pain; the pain of a wounded Helmandi is my pain. The pain of a Kunari martyred is my pain, and I want to talk on behalf of all these pains and wounds. I don't dream to become a small region's hero… There is no reason for my resignation based on discrimination."
Quqnoos: "You pointed out that you are talking on behalf of the pains of the Afghan people. Don't you think that the government represents all these pains?"
Saleh: "I will mention a political program held by Lemar TV in which a Kochi lady from the northern Balkh province was talking. I agree with that lady's comments, in which she said that President Karzai must not destroy the determination of the majority of Afghan people by pleading to a small group of terrorists. We must hold a Jirga that will respond to the will of 97 percent of Afghans. We must not hold a Jirga in which the will of 97 percent of Afghans will be dealt with for a small group. Karzai became president with the people's votes. Why does the president force this nation to weaken its determination? Why doesn't the president use force?
"This is the point of my disagreement with the president, and I am not keeping it secret. There are hundreds of other reasons for my disagreements with the president, which I do not want to talk about now. The second main reason for my disagreement with the president is that he ordered the remission of the Taliban [prisoners] under a decree. I cannot forgive the murderers of the martyred Dr. Abdullah [Mr. Saleh's colleague], and I also cannot work in a government that forgives the Taliban."
"Showing a Soft Stance with a Murderer Who has Killed More than a Thousand Does Not Seem Like an Honorable Peace"
Quqnoos: "You said 'a small group.' Why does the government, which has about 200,000 Afghan security forces and more than 140,000 foreign forces, allow itself to be slighted by this small group?"
Saleh: "This is my question as well. Why are we unable to make a clear political path laid out by the majority of our people with strict decisions, unable to act strongly, to make our judiciary system powerful and make the Taliban apologize to our nation – not our nation apologize to them. I recommend that you go to Afghanistan's provinces and take a survey. When the people see the government's decisions about fighting terrorists, they hesitate.
"On the Kandahar trip, I was with the Afghan president. None of the Helmand tribal elders backed the idea of making an apology to the Taliban. So on behalf of whom does the president seek [to offer] an apology to the Taliban? In a time when the government is against the Taliban, the nation is against the Taliban. President Karzai won the election by the Afghan people's vote, so why should he apologize to the Taliban?"
Quqnoos: "You talked about an opposition of views; so what was your presence in President Karzai's government based on?"
Answer: "There was a specific time when the President was supporting us. He was supporting the reform in the NDS and was praising our improvements and achievements. During that time, when the president was backing the fight against insurgents and improvements in the NDS, I proudly was his employee. I had no political connection with President Karzai's opposition group. I'm honest about it.
"When the president chose a soft policy [on Taliban], we had no problem with it if this policy resulted in honorable peace. I think this policy will not bring honorable peace. Showing a soft stance with a murderer who has killed more than a thousand does not seem like an honorable peace. Even I do not think that this soft stance results in peace. This soft behavior makes the enemy's intention even stronger and makes the confidence of friends shaky.
"It is not only that I say this now, after stepping down, go to your archives and see [that I have said so earlier].
"I support peace and I'm not an element against peace, but gaining peace through soft behavior and expressing humility has not brought about results in human history. Any nation that wants to achieve something must speak louder than a whimper."
Quqnoos: "What are your thoughts about the President's soft behavior?"
Saleh: "Whatever the motive is, I know one thing – that the president does not trust the abilities of the defense forces."
Taliban Affairs Expert Rahimullah Yusufzai: Saleh's Resignation… not Only Exposed the Strife in President Hamid Karzai's Laboriously Built and Complex Ruling Coalition but Also Thrust Pakistan into the Limelight [over Its Role in Afghanistan]
Following are some excerpts from the article by Rahimullah Yusufzai, a renowned Taliban affairs expert who is the Resident Editor of the Pakistani daily The News and is based in the Pakistani city of Peshawar.[6]
"Such is the level of mistrust of Islamabad and the hatred against it among many Afghans that Amrullah Saleh, until recently Afghanistan's intelligence chief, described Pakistan and its Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) as his country's 'enemy number one.'
"Saleh is so convinced, on the basis of the intelligence that he and his men have been gathering about the ISI's work in Afghanistan, that he doesn't feel the need to provide proof to back up his claim. He was quoted in a recent interview as saying: 'The ISI is part of the landscape of destruction in this country, no doubt. So it will be a waste of time to provide evidence of ISI involvement. They are part of it.'’
"If Saleh hates Pakistan so much and considers the ISI responsible for Afghanistan's destruction, one could safely presume that this is the dominant feeling about Islamabad in his country's intelligence setup, the National Directorate of Security (NDS) that he headed since early 2004. And since Saleh is an ethnic Tajik from the Panjshir Valley, the native place of the late Afghan mujahideen commander Ahmad Shah Masood, it would not be wrong to say that all other Masood followers and supporters grouped in his Shura-i-Nazar faction of the Jamiat-i-Islami party of former president Burhanuddin Rabbani share the same feelings of hostility toward Pakistan and the ISI.
"This sentiment of mistrust and hatred cannot be one-sided. It is, therefore, natural that the ISI people also don't like Saleh and his men. In fact, a running battle has been going on for years between the ISI and Afghan intelligence, which has functioned with different names, including KHAD and WAD during the rule of Afghan communists, and partnered new allies such as the KGB, the CIA and RAW at various stages of the conflict in Afghanistan. Given the state of their animosity toward each other over the years, it would be impossible for them to cooperate even in facing a common threat."
"Americans would Surely Want the ISI and Afghanistan's NDS to Join Forces with the CIA to Defeat Al-Qaeda and the Taliban, But the Mistrust Keeps the Afghan and Pakistani Spies Apart…"
"The Americans would surely want the ISI and Afghanistan's NDS to join forces with the CIA to defeat Al-Qaeda and the Taliban, but the mistrust keeps the Afghan and Pakistani spies apart and prevents them from cooperating with each other. Asking them to work together is like wanting ISI and RAW agents to join hands after their having conspired and plotted against each other throughout their existence.
"Saleh has spent years doing intelligence work in Afghanistan and abroad. He was based in Peshawar for sometime during the Afghan jihad against the Soviet occupying forces when Masood, Rabbani and the rest of the Afghan mujahideen leaders enjoyed Pakistan's hospitality and received support from the ISI, CIA and other intelligence agencies. Saleh also operated out of Tajikistan's capital Dushanbe to coordinate the Northern Alliance's battle against the Taliban with assistance from countries seeking to oust the regime led by [Taliban leader] Mulla Mohammad Omar in Afghanistan. Following the Taliban defeat as a result of the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan in late 2001, he was made deputy head of the NDS, with Muhammad Arif Sarwari taking over as its director.
"In fact, the entire intelligence setup of the anti-Taliban Northern Alliance was installed in the NDS, bringing it to all those who hated Pakistan and considered the ISI responsible for Afghanistan's woes. In due course of time, many former Afghan communists and mujahideen who had done intelligence work and were always suspicious of Pakistan's role in Afghanistan were in control of the NDS. As always, the Afghan intelligence agency and the ISI were in rival camps and, in Saleh's words, Pakistan's premier intelligence agency was the foremost enemy of Afghanistan. Afghanistan's fine ethnic balance that is so crucial to the country's stability also wasn't maintained in the NDS, or subsequently in the Afghan National Army, the police and other institutions, as the majority Pakhtuns remained underrepresented. This obviously had its own pitfalls and the Taliban fully exploited it to find recruits from among Pakhtuns dissatisfied with their circumstances.
"Saleh's enmity with Pakistan has its origins in the Afghan jihad. His leader, Masood, was critical of Pakistan and the ISI at the time for preferring his rival Gulbuddin Hekmatyar over him and providing him greater resources. [Former Pakistani military ruler] General Ziaul Haq had clear preference for the more fundamentalist Afghan mujahideen groups, such as those led by Hekmatyar, Rabbani, Yunis Khalis and Abdur Rab Rasul Sayyaf, not only because of his own conservative choices but also due to the better battlefield performance of their committed fighters against the Soviet forces in Afghanistan.
"Masood and his party leader Rabbani belonged to fundamentalist Jamiat-i-Islami, but it seems they were less willing to take orders from Islamabad than the others. This became evident in later years when Masood and Rabbani defied Pakistan and built up their own alliances with Iran, Russia and France and, in the post-9/11 period, with the U.S. and its Western allies. Ziaul Haq and the ISI at that point in time felt more comfortable working with Hekmatyar than Masood and Rabbani.
"Though Ziaul Haq was wise enough not to say it publicly, it was obvious that Islamabad's policy in Afghanistan was, and always has been, generally pro-Pashtun. It was felt that befriending Afghanistan's Pakhtuns was in Islamabad's interest because Pakistan has a significant Pashtun population of its own and the Pashtuns lived on both sides of the Durand Line [the disputed border between Afghanistan and Pakistan]. General Pervez Musharraf, an impulsive man keen to take credit for his forthrightness, on at least two occasions publicly declared that Pakistan's Afghan policy was pro-Pashtun. It was irresponsible on his part to make this statement as it alienated the Tajiks, Hazaras, Uzbeks, Turkmen and other non-Pakhtuns in Afghanistan and made them realize that their friendship wasn't a priority for Pakistan. In fact, many Afghan Pakhtuns also found Musharraf's statement offensive. Some of them at the time commented that they didn't need Musharraf's or Pakistan's support as they were themselves capable of winning their rights and maintaining Afghanistan's unity, being the founders of the Afghan state named after them."
"[Saleh] is Unhappy with Karzai for Going Soft on Pakistan after Criticizing It All These Years and is opposed to His Plans to Release Taliban Prisoners and Reconcile with Mulla Omar"
"Saleh's resignation on June 6, along with that of Interior Minister Muhammad Hanif Atmar, following the audacious attack four days previously in Kabul on the occasion of the landmark Consultative Peace Jirga, not only exposed the strife in President Hamid Karzai's laboriously built and complex ruling coalition but also thrust Pakistan into the limelight. Though Saleh and Atmar's resignations were linked to the security lapse that enabled the suspected Taliban militants to come close to the venue where about 1,500 jirga members were meeting, despite the presence of 12,000 soldiers and police, there was more to it than meets the eye. Atmar, a former communist official who earned praise from Western governments for his effective style of leadership and honesty, isn't talking after quitting the interior minister's job. But Saleh, who too was praised by Western authorities for his work, is all over the place, granting interviews in which he is blaming Pakistan for Afghanistan's problems and raising questions about Karzai's motives. He is unhappy with Karzai for going soft on Pakistan after criticizing it all these years and is opposed to his plans to release Taliban prisoners and reconcile with Mulla Omar and his men.
"Saleh's views represent those of many Afghans who are non-Pashtun and supporters of the erstwhile Northern Alliance. Some Pashtuns who have stood up to the Afghan Taliban and suffered as a consequences are also against bowing to the militants and giving Pakistan a role in Afghanistan's affairs. Such divergent views have exposed the rift in the Karzai-led ruling coalition with regard to reconciliation with the Taliban, ties to Pakistan and the relationship with the U.S.-headed NATO forces bent upon an elusive military solution of the Afghan conflict. Though Karzai has managed to get support for his policy of reintegrating the Taliban into the political mainstream from the Consultative Peace Jirga, his government would encounter problems and suffer from further splits as he proceeds on the path of peace and national reconciliation."

Endnotes:
[1] http://www.quqnoos.com (Afghanistan), June 2, 2010.
[2] http://www.tolafghan.com (Afghanistan), June 6, 2010.
[3] Wrazpanra Eradu (Afghanistan), June 7, 2010.
[4] http://www.taand.com (Afghanistan), June 8, 2010.
[5] http://www.quqnoos.com (Afghanistan), June 12, 2010. The text of the interview has been slightly edited for clarity.
[6] The News, Pakistan, June 15, 2010.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 16 Jun 2010 17:53

RajeshA wrote:
AdityaM wrote:all output will have to travel through pakiland. windfall for pakis
Or through Iran!

does it mean Afghanistan and Iraq are part of next round of colonization?

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 16 Jun 2010 18:24

RamaY wrote: does it mean Afghanistan and Iraq are part of next round of colonization?

Ray Sir understood this war from the beginning.

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... PG#p674511

http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... PG#p741102

....Whatever has happened in Iraq and in Afghanistan is a fall out of Cheney’s DPG 1992 read in conjunction with the NEP that brazenly underscored the removal of political, economic, legal and logistical obstacles in accessing petroleum sources including that of CAR.
....
The DPG also went on to state that the U.S. should aim "to address sources of regional conflict and instability in such a way as to promote increasing respect for international law, limit international violence, and encourage the spread of democratic forms of government and open economic systems."

Interestingly, to avoid being labelled ‘colonialists’, ‘neo colonialists’ ‘imperialists’ etc, they disguised the intent with the garb of spreading ‘Freedom and Democracy’, which in actuality, was patently bogus because there were worse regimes than Saddam’s which were dictatorships and tyrannical. Indeed, in the axis of evil, how come Pakistan was missed out when it was and is a proved womb of international terrorism and had both the WMD and delivery means – the two criteria that were essential to be labelled axis of evil. Iran and Iraq did not have the delivery means, even if they were suspected to have WMD.
...

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 16 Jun 2010 20:44

Slaeh's interview shows there is deep resentment in some of the Afghans at the peace with Taliban at any cost approach of Karzai govt. The quote from the lady from Balkh is a pointer taht common folk also think like that.

Yusufzai is a TSP Pashtun and that should be taken into consideration while reading his analysis.

Looks like Karzai is forced into this approach due to outside forces most liekly US and self interest.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 16 Jun 2010 21:02

AdityaM wrote:all output will have to travel through pakiland. windfall for pakis

Do not jump to that conclusion. Windfall for the Paki Armee onlee, not for the abduls and ablaas.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 16 Jun 2010 21:05

ramana wrote:Looks like Karzai is forced into this approach due to outside forces most liekly US and self interest.

True to an extent with desh too; or for that matter several countries on this planet. All governments dances to the tunes of Uncle Sam. Uncle Sam dances to the tunes of the MNCs.

satyam · Post by **satyam** » 16 Jun 2010 21:09

Interesting report here
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/16/world ... shkar.html

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 17 Jun 2010 00:46

News from good old yonders years !!!
Taleban in Texas for talks on gas pipeline

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/37021.stm

senior delegation from the Taleban movement in Afghanistan is in the United States for talks with an international energy company that wants to construct a gas pipeline from Turkmenistan across Afghanistan to Pakistan. A spokesman for the company, Unocal, said the Taleban were expected to spend several days at the company's headquarters in Sugarland, Texas.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 17 Jun 2010 04:11

India invited to join Afghan mineral hunt