Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP), Feb. 26, 2010

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 02 Mar 2010 09:52

Regarding Baluchistan corridor, its a double edge sword. If in future, the pakjabs wags their tails, then the access of Afghanistan and Central Asia will pass through independent, not so much demanding Baluchistan rather than through greedy Pakistan.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 02 Mar 2010 10:05

shynee wrote: We hear of Pakistanis being beheaded frequently in Saudi Arabia and often for crimes which would not carry the same punishment in Pakistan.

We Pakbarians only behead minority Sikhs or Hindus for the crime of being born in Pakistan and anti-Taliban 'informers'...

shaardula · Post by **shaardula** » 02 Mar 2010 10:29

shynee wrote:
But the timing and the symbolism have caused distress in Pakistan

what does not cause distress in TSP? if the clock shows 12 twice a day the pakis cry foul and scratch their limbs and legs at the conspiracy of the hanuds and the yahuds.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 11:05

These last two days has the pakistanis wondering if the Sauds have joined the hanoods and the yehuds.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 02 Mar 2010 11:22

From MMS Majlis address

opportunity to address the Majlis Al-Shura. This august body has come to symbolize participative governance in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia.

Did he mean it as a joke or left handed compliment? More examples..

Its influence today extends far beyond the region.

Islam qualitatively changed the character and personality of the people in Arabia

Indian Muslim scholars went to Mecca in order to learn Islamic theology. Arab Muslim scholars came to India to learn mathematics, science, astronomy and philosophy.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 02 Mar 2010 11:43

I have met any #of PakiJabi RAPE pigs here in US. You have to see the contempt they have for Arabs whom they derogatively refer to as Camel Jockeys. They of course like the Camel Jockey goodies though. I guess the SDRE Saudi Camel Jockey advice was hard to digest by the Mogul TFTA RAPE. Thats all there is to it.

MMS is again bloody irritating with his "Will walk extra mile if Pak acts on terror" garbage. I wonder if TSP laughs or show the middle finger whenever MMS supplicates before them. Or perhaphs they cut him some slack in that in their perverted minds, he has to make routine noises on terrorism to please the "Hindu banias", but eventually he will make joint love to them in Srinagar. Who knows they might even hold back LeT until this come about. And of course Unkil will be doing his bit conferring "great power" status on India, not to mention joint Nobel Piss for MMS & Kiyani or Mush or some other TSPian for equal equal.

Malayappan · Post by **Malayappan** » 02 Mar 2010 11:50

Pakistan holds onto its Taliban from ATWOL.
US will need to figure out how to handle this. This piece suggests that -
- pakis were not in the lead to grab Biradar
- Once they realised, they quicly moved to grab more (potential evidence - my addition)
- They can - a) bump these gents off, b) protect them for ever, c)get them to discuss and pursue parallel tracks of talks with Afghans, or d) hand over to US. (They will do so at the best possible price - my addition)
Whatever US does, in this round tactically pakis will win. Aren't the Pushtuns getting any smarter? or will they behave as the pakjabis normally refer to and deal with them, with derision and scorn?

kumarn · Post by **kumarn** » 02 Mar 2010 12:17

CRamS wrote:eventually he will make joint love to them in Srinagar.

How do you know all this sir? All I can see is that MMS has made the Saudis perhaps see the light, and they are making noises favorable to India. And this is causing massive takleef to the Pakistanis. I wonder why people suspect his loyalties all the time! Is it because he is not from the right community?

kenop · Post by **kenop** » 02 Mar 2010 12:29

kumarn wrote:I wonder why people suspect his loyalties all the time! Is it because he is not from the right community?

Nowhere on BRF do I remember the community being referred to in this context. Not all on BRF think that he is out to compromise Bharat's interests. Those who think he is on this route attribute it to other influences.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 02 Mar 2010 12:34

edit.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 02 Mar 2010 12:35

kumarn wrote:
CRamS wrote:eventually he will make joint love to them in Srinagar.
How do you know all this sir? All I can see is that MMS has made the Saudis perhaps see the light, and they are making noises favorable to India. And this is causing massive takleef to the Pakistanis. I wonder why people suspect his loyalties all the time! Is it because he is not from the right community?

His constant begging of TSP is indicative of his approach. Enough said. And I don't understand what it is that he forced Saudis to say that is something to be enamoured about. Forget TSP, India breathes, they get takleef. I don't know much about his loyalty, but you tell me what he means by "walking the extra mile". Obviously there is a quid prop quo. He saying you stop terror, and I will give you this. Such an equivalence itself is shameful. So tell me, what is this extra mile he is talking about especially after he has conceeded that extra mile as a quid pro quo?

kumarn · Post by **kumarn** » 02 Mar 2010 12:38

ravi_ku wrote:All this takleef from Kumarn for an unelected appointed PM

Your comment of 'unelected appointed PM' is the strawman here. He IS the PM of India. Deal with it.

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 02 Mar 2010 12:41

any more whines sirjee

me hiding into my SDRE dark corners

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 02 Mar 2010 12:47

The only ones that should be worried about all this Nobel stuff from MMS is the dynasty because Nobel has been their birthright and goal for many years...they will watch the space for a while and make a bakra out of him if he is either successful or nearly there or fails or nearly there...muddling around is perfectly okay..Stalinist mass murderers and traitors would go along with that because dynasty is so easy to manipulate and enslave or threaten unlike the smart Sardar...

Virupaksha · Post by **Virupaksha** » 02 Mar 2010 12:52

:cough :cough paki bashing dhaaga

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 02 Mar 2010 12:54

The Chamelis of pakistani politics

Includes pics of Fahmeeda Mirza, Fatima bhutoo, Kashmala Tariq, Maiza hameed, Shazia muree, Sassi plejo and of course marvi memon and sherry rahman .

And look at the last pic with playboy salman taseer with his chamelis

I wonder why Meera memsab havent entered the politics yet considering she is no less qualified than other chamelis !

Rony · Post by **Rony** » 02 Mar 2010 13:12

ravi_ku wrote: any more whines sirjee

Arz Kiya hai !

From the link i posted above,

Begging won’t budge India

Those who believe that Hindus will throw anything in our bowl by begging are nonbelievers Muslims!!! The more we beg for the pretentious talks the more they (viz Bharat) will become rigid. Bharat would never ever be able to budge a little in dispute of Kashmir, until & unless we would be able to force them to budge. If the Brahmins have not been able to own and adopt their centuries old; (i) 50 % co-religion and co-region, they calling them with out caste, (ii) the more allied than ally, the Sikhs, (iii) and the only Hindu State, Nepal in her armpit.

Then how they would be so luxurious, lush & push to forget Muslims 1000 years rule and accept us on the basis of equality as an esteemed country. So the imperative lesson we can infer is: to maintain the status quo, without any giving in, till the enemy become worn out (e.g. Portugal and UK) or we become sturdier e.g. China. Then that will be the proper time to talk and dictate. That was the way the China snatched the Macau, Hong Kong and sooner or later she would be able to snatch the Taiwan. And as far as the compulsions of diplomacy are concerned, like Bharat, harping on the tune of dialogue is no harmful.

The overture of waves after waves incoming Hindus delegations of dancers, NGOs, drummers and others of the sort is simply their diplomatic gimmick on one hand and hereditary merchandising compulsions on the other. We & they are as contrasting as the life and death or fire and water have been, so we can’t coexist amicably. We can coexist only in equilibrium, e.g. the US & Russia had/has been.

If the Brahmin Hindus are not willing to give up or give back the stolen Siachen Glacier, which is tip of the iceberg then how and what far they would be willing to donate us the Kashmir, which is skull of the region!!!

So far UN Security Council resolutions on Kashmir are concerned, one must remember the Divine Law, discovered by Sir Isaac Newton, known as Newton’s first law of motion: which states that, “if a body is at rest or moving at a constant speed in a straight line, it will remain at rest or keep moving in a straight line at constant speed unless it is acted upon by a force”.

Facing a beat is no defeat but surrendering to a beat is the defeat!!!

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 02 Mar 2010 14:50

^^ China snatching Macau and Hongkong !! Fuddugiri aur Stupidity mein Pakistani's will top the race to Pluto !! hahaha...never heard China snatching both terretories which as far as I know were on lease to British and Portugese and the lease expired. I hope a few stupid journo's care to check something about history of Honkong and Macau !!

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2010 14:59

ashish raval wrote:^^ China snatching Macau and Hongkong !! Fuddugiri aur Stupidity mein Pakistani's will top the race to Pluto !! hahaha...never heard China snatching both terretories which as far as I know were on lease to British and Portugese and the lease expired. I hope a few stupid journo's care to check something about history of Honkong and Macau !!

ashish raval ji,

Why are you getting your dhoti in a twist, saar?

The article is meant onlee for goat chugging, khat chewing, unwashed abduls.

Must have been difficult for the writer to manage the goat and write article at the same time, given his limited attention span and demonstrably low IQ.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2010 15:03

CRamS wrote: His constant begging of TSP is indicative of his approach. Enough said. And I don't understand what it is that he forced Saudis to say that is something to be enamoured about. Forget TSP, India breathes, they get takleef. I don't know much about his loyalty, but you tell me what he means by "walking the extra mile". Obviously there is a quid prop quo. He saying you stop terror, and I will give you this. Such an equivalence itself is shameful. So tell me, what is this extra mile he is talking about especially after he has conceeded that extra mile as a quid pro quo?

Not to mention that the pakis now think that their jeeeehad theory has succeeded wonderfully.

So why should they not continue more of the same until India completely capitulates??

DevS · Post by **DevS** » 02 Mar 2010 15:37

Hi to all BRFites from my side.

After 3 years of lurking around, i've finally taken the plunge!

A question for the gurus :

India let go 90,000+ Paki POWs in 1971 so that Pakistan could thenceforth be committed to keep the Kashmir issue strictly under the bilateral framework as per the Simla Agreeement.Then should not Pakistan be advised to first let India have back 90,000 Pakis as POWs ( 45000 from serving Pak Army soldiers) and only then proceed with ever raising the Kashmir issue internationally?

Also India can tell Pakistan that selective application of Bilateral Agreements cannot be permitted and if the present Paki regime finds the Shimla Agreeement unacceptable,then India will very well extend this precedent to the Indus Water Treaty also and scrap it.

arun · Post by **arun** » 02 Mar 2010 16:04

Insidious Indian conspiracy to lead the pure women of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan into un-Islamic practices:

Pak women taking up Bollywood dance classes

skaranam · Post by **skaranam** » 02 Mar 2010 17:05

"It is true that most of these women belong to the upper strata of society but this definitely is a new trend that Bollywood dance classes are being held," said Zeenat, a trainer.

damn, it is the RAPE class preparing the ground work to enter India as an artist

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 02 Mar 2010 17:43

deleted - copyright

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 02 Mar 2010 18:10

US will have to sign nuke deal with Pakistan
Such arrogance can come only from two sets of people that I know of, one is definitely Pakistanis and the other is citizens of West Asia.

Pakistan has complete command and control over its nuclear weapons and the US will have to sign a nuclear pact with the country, Pakistan’s Ambassador to the US, Hussain Haqqani said while talking to Shahzeb Khanzada in his programme Newsline Plus on Monday.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 02 Mar 2010 18:30

kumarn wrote:
ravi_ku wrote:All this takleef from Kumarn for an unelected appointed PM
Your comment of 'unelected appointed PM' is the strawman here. He IS the PM of India. Deal with it.

Yes. He is our (non-elected) PM, and INC won majority vote (30% votes & 200/544 MP seats) and has POPULAR mandate to kiss and make up with TSP, sign pollution treaties, reduce budget allocations to Indian atomic energy commissions while making favorable deals on phirangi nuke-reactors...

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 19:01

Read in full
The Karachi Project

Sandeep Unnithan with Bhavna Vij-Aurora and Amarnath K. Menon

The Karachi Project is responsible for the deaths of over 500 Indians in 10 bomb blasts since 2005.

Trail of Death

Shramjeevi Express, near Jaunpur, Uttar Pradesh, July 28,2005 IED kill 10 passengers and injures 79 on the Patna-New Delhi train.
Delhi, October 29, 2005 Three serial blasts before Diwali kill 62 people.
Varanasi, March 7, 2006 Three explosions at Sankat Mochan temple and railway station kill 21.
Mumbai, July 11, 2006 Seven bomb blasts in six local trains at peak hour kill 209.
Hyderabad, August 25, 2007 Twin blasts at garden and snack stall kill 42 people.
Lucknow, Varanasi, Faizabad, November 24, 2007 16 people killed in blasts in court complexes in the three cities.
Jaipur, May 13, 2008 Nine blasts in market place kill 63 people.
Ahmedabad, July 26, 2008 22 IED blasts at 17 places kill 53.
Delhi, September 13, 2008 Five blasts in various locations kill 30 people.
Pune, February 13, 2010 Eleven killed as IED explodes in a popular restaurant.

Dangerous Nexus

* Conceived in 2003 as a joint strategy between the ISI, Pakistan Army, Lashkar and HUJI to use fugitives given sanctuary in Karachi to Indian youth and bring them to Pakistan for arms and explosives training via Bangladesh and Nepal, where they are indoctrinated by videos of Babri Masjid and Gujarat riots.

* Underworld dons and fugitives like Riyaz and Iqbal Bhatkal are used as spotters to ensure a steady supply of recruits from India for the project. By using Indians, it gives Pakistan the fig leaf of denying involvement.

* The project was conceived as a crucial element in Pakistan's strategic arsenal to counter India's military and economic advantages.

* Original strategy was to send the trained recruits back to India to plant bags with bombs at strategic locations. Pune shows it is now aimed at foreigners in India. Detailed information about Karachi Project has come from Abdul Khwaja, Bilal's No. 2, who was clandestinely arrested by Indian intelligence operatives in Bangladesh late last year. The other major source of information on the project has been David Headley, who has given the FBI additional details about the project and his role in it as well as the interrogation of Amjad Khwaja, a leading IM operative, arrested recently.

* The recruits are being trained by the ISI in a remote region of Balochistan, not far from the Iranian border. They were taught to construct IEDs from locally available explosives. They are allowed to play games and watch satellite television, unlike militants in the camps in PoK.

* After completion of the training, the agents are infiltrated into India as sleeper cells, waiting for the command to strike.

* First strike on the Shramjeevi Express in 2005, and the most recent one suspected to be in Pune. The project can only be stopped if Pakistan hands over fugitives or India neutralises the operatives.

* Resumption of strikes linked to pressure being taken off Pakistan by the international community.

No Indian has so far been used to carry out fidayeen attacks like the one in Mumbai, which calls for a level of indoctrination and brutality that has so far been seen only in Pakistani jihadi recruits. "But who knows what the future holds?" asks a senior intelligence official.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 19:03

India concerned over 42 terror camps existing in Pak

Tue, Mar 2 01:50 PM

Pokhran, Feb.28 (ANI): Defence Minister A.K. Antony on Sunday said India is concerned about the 42 terror camps existing across the border even after Mumbai terror attacks and Pakistan's non serious approach to dismantle them.

Speaking during the Operation Vayu Shakti 2010 programme organized here, Antony said: "Our real concern is existence of terror camps intact across the border after 26/11 attack. There are 42 terror camps. And there has been no serious effort to dismantle these camps."

...

.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 19:04

Pune blast: 2 more groups said they did it

Mumbai, Feb. 28 -- Two little-known groups, SIMI International and Mujahideen Islami Muslim Front, have claimed responsibility for the blasts that ripped through a well-known Pune bakery two weeks ago, following claims by two other groups.

The day after the blast, two unknown terror groups, the Lashkar-e-Tayyeba al-Almi and the Indian Mujahideen Kashmir, had claimed responsibility. In a handwritten letter that the Pune police received on Tuesday, these two new groups dared the authorities to track down their members, claiming there were now in Ahmedabad, Lucknow, Delhi, Ghaziabad and Nizampur, police sources said.

...
.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 19:42

I post two videos, there are many others on the net, that should go to understanding pakistan. It is important to understand how religion is being used to divide people, inflame passions in that nation. Here the maulanas are having debates on the holy book and the various fatwas.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdlN061WcUw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78xbFNHK_CM

Only for serious watchers of Islam and Pakistan though.

Sen_K · Post by **Sen_K** » 02 Mar 2010 20:00

Pakis behind Afghan attack:NDS

An Afghan intelligence official is blaming the Pakistan-based militant group Lashkar-e-Taiba for last week's car bomb and suicide attacks that killed 16 people in the heart of the capital, Kabul.

The Afghan Taliban have already claimed responsibility.

Lashkar-e-Taiba is the same group India blames for the 2008 Mumbai terrorist attacks that killed 166 people, further souring relations between nuclear-armed rivals India and Pakistan.

Saeed Ansari, a spokesman for Afghanistan's National Directorate of Security, said Tuesday that his agency has evidence that Pakistanis were involved in the attacks on Kabul guest houses frequented by Indians and other foreigners. Six Indians were among the dead in the attacks.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 20:32

Why is the LET being increasingly relied upon to conduct attacks in Afghanistan?

Has the Haqqani group been co-opted by the khans? I know Gulbudin Hekmatyar is a two timing warlord, who will just as easily dump the ISI-Pak army if the US gives him protection, but the Haqqanis are the ones who were truly hardline.

Weren't the haqqanis the ones who facilitated OBL's escape from Tora Bora into parchinar and beyond?

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 02 Mar 2010 20:38

Gagan,

You need to understand that LeT involvement is not mutually exclusive with Haqqanis. In fact, LeT role actually means Haqqanis were also involved. LeT is the official Pakjabi proxy for TSPA whereas Haqqanis are the preferred proxies for TSPA on the Afghan side.

Just like in the 2008 Embassy attack, it is likely that Haqqanis provided the logistics whereas LeT provided the manpower, all under the supervision and coordination of ISI.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 20:40

SSridhar wrote:US will have to sign nuke deal with Pakistan

I suspect a nuke deal will eventually be offered to the paksitanis, which they'll tout as ==. But this will be CRE of pakistan's bomb (provided massa has already not done so), in return for some crumbs.

Pakistan does not have the money to build any N plant except the deferred payment method that the chinese employ. Pakistan lacks the diplomatic depth to convince the IAEA, NSG states to give it an exemption like the one they've given India. The US is not going to do that kind of heavy lifting for the pakistanis, and certainly not BHO.

So no tech transfer, no fuel, no money either to buy plants.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 02 Mar 2010 20:45

Rangudu wrote:Gagan,

Just like in the 2008 Embassy attack, it is likely that Haqqanis provided the logistics whereas LeT provided the manpower, all under the supervision and coordination of ISI.

But why? Why is pakistan giving the LET this greater role in Afghanistan? They were supposed to focus on India purely.
Is it because the haqqanis are lying low after the CIA station attack? Or that the pakis can't trust the Haqqanis as much as they did earlier?
Giving a greater role to the LET is dangerous for Pakistan also, those buggers will get ideas of their own and that's bad for the generals ultimately.

On a sidenote: One piece of info I've heard is that, the reason why LET camps are so close to the pakistani military garrisons in POK is that the Pak fauj promptly disarms the LET cadres the moment they cross back across the LOC and get debriefed. The caders are armed only when they are to go on a mission, and the arms are handed over to them very close to the LOC. Shows how much the Pak fauj trusts these abduls.

Rangudu · Post by **Rangudu** » 02 Mar 2010 20:54

LeT is Pakjabi and therefore TSPA has more direct control. If they want to be sure that a job will get done, they will use trusted resources.

Despite the closeness with the ISI, Haqqanis are Afghans. Plus Haqqani elements have cooperated with Baitullah Mehsud types. OTOH, LeT is a "sarkari" jihadi group. They will do as they are told.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 02 Mar 2010 21:20

DSB wrote:Hi to all BRFites from my side.

After 3 years of lurking around, i've finally taken the plunge!

A question for the gurus :

India let go 90,000+ Paki POWs in 1971 so that Pakistan could thenceforth be committed to keep the Kashmir issue strictly under the bilateral framework as per the Simla Agreeement.Then should not Pakistan be advised to first let India have back 90,000 Pakis as POWs ( 45000 from serving Pak Army soldiers) and only then proceed with ever raising the Kashmir issue internationally? Also India can tell Pakistan that selective application of Bilateral Agreements cannot be permitted and if the present Paki regime finds the Shimla Agreeement unacceptable,then India will very well extend this precedent to the Indus Water Treaty also and scrap it.

You've just been lurking around, you need to learn the details. The problem India has with TSP is no longer about TSP being wrong, or any other legal issue. TSP openly claims that you give us what we want or we bleed you with our "non state actors". India has no answer to this, except that path of appeasement bordering on surrender that MMS/Sonia have chosen, which might very well buy India "peace" but at a huge cost to Indian nationhood (I for one believe that if MMS agrres to joint soverignty over Kashmir as he allegedly did with terrorist Musharaff, it is the beginning of the end of India as we know it). For every legality India harps on, TSP will pull one from their rectum. The mere existance of India is illegal as far as TSP is concerned. All one needs to say is India and that will propel TSPians into a tizzy and it becomes a "core issue". They are fighting with words and terrorists, India is responding only with words. Thats the simple equation. Making this equation even more intractable are racist policies of the white colonial powers US and its western lackeys like UK. They can never take their racist blinkers and no matter what horrible crime TSP commits against India, it is always India TSP equal equal or "tensions between India and TSP". These are the realities, everything else is hot air.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 02 Mar 2010 21:33

Gagan wrote
ref:
No Indian has so far been used to carry out fidayeen attacks like the one in Mumbai, which calls for a level of indoctrination and brutality that has so far been seen only in Pakistani jihadi recruits. "But who knows what the future holds?" asks a senior intelligence official.

It could also be a lack of assessment as to what would be the political consequences if an Indian Muslim youth turns up as perpetrator of spectacular terror. For the Pakjabis, the best strategy is to maintain a foggy overlap. So that existing frameworks within India that help in gathering sympathy for Islamism or justify protection of Islamic intolerance and exclusivity, are not jeopardized. Such sympathies will be crucial for continued maintenance of terror infrastructure and networks within India, including the mafia. Perhaps the remnant D-company networks in western provinces of India cannot be eliminated because of fear that any such action will be representated as an attack on Islam in India as well as internal or external pressure to preserve the networks for valuable intelligence or covert action partnerships.

The latter could be beneficial for USA, but so far such "partnerships" with criminal networks appears to be only benefiting POGWI and Islamism in India.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 02 Mar 2010 21:36

CRamS wrote: For every legality India harps on, TSP will pull one from their rectum. The mere existance of India is illegal as far as TSP is concerned. All one needs to say is India and that will propel TSPians into a tizzy and it becomes a "core issue". They are fighting with words and terrorists, India is responding only with words. Thats the simple equation. Making this equation even more intractable are racist policies of the white colonial powers US and its western lackeys like UK. They can never take their racist blinkers and no matter what horrible crime TSP commits against India, it is always India TSP equal equal or "tensions between India and TSP". These are the realities, everything else is hot air.

http://www.dnaindia.com/opinion/comment ... il_1353963

Monday, March 1, 2010 19:01 IST
Bargaining with the devil
Rajeev Srinivasan

As India sits down for talks with Pakistan and with Communist insurgents, an observer may wonder why its track record is so poor in negotiations. As Churchill said, "jaw-jaw is better than war-war", but there is a make-believe quality to it in India, as the mandarins appear to just go through the motions. There is no recognition that there is a logic and a structure to parleys, there is a difference between positions and interests; and that ends and means must be separated.
........................

Mnookin focuses on situations in which two parties that may consider each other evil sit down at the bargaining table. There should be a combination of intuitive as well as analytical approaches, he suggests. This is where India fails: negotiators depend entirely on intuition, when a cold-blooded decision-tree analysis would help. Some Indian negotiators are seduced into accepting the other side's perspectives, for instance through judicious use of Urdu couplets and sob-stories about poor villagers.

There are several major problems. First, a serious, core issue: the lack of a clarity about objectives. Nobody knows what the goals are, what is absolutely non-negotiable, what the 'don't-cares' are that can be thrown in as concessions to clinch a deal. Therefore they do not know when to hold and when to fold. When talking to Communist terrorists, theobjective is to prevent their violent overthrow of the State; their civil rights are not the main concern. (We also have to be hard-nosed: the human rights of the insurgent and the terrorist are no greater than the human rights of the average citizen).

Second, the negotiators do not distinguish between positions (some of which may be posturing for domestic consumption), and fundamental interests. China always takes extreme positions, probing for weaknesses. However, if there is credible push-back, China will retreat. To be deterred, they have to believe that India is prepared to fight if the talks fail. They don't; nor do Pakistanis or Communist guerillas.

Third, because they do not internalise core interests, India's negotiators are sidetracked into peripheral and trivial matters. An example was the panic-stricken insistence about Indo-Pak rail links, which were jeopardised by a terror attack on the Samjhauta Express. There were pious pronouncements: "The rail links must not be affected". Why? What is so sacred about it?

Negotiation and game theory are taught in business schools (Getting to Yes by Roger Fisher and William Ury is a favourite) and schools of government the world over, but apparently not to India's mandarins. One of the cardinal principles taught is that you must be fully prepared with three alternatives: a) the desired goal, b) the compromise you can live with even though it is less than ideal, and c) the walk-away position. These alternatives are decided on ahead of time, and negotiators will not deviate from them. They will be prepared to walk away if the only thing they can get is worse than the compromise situation. Indians attempt to wing it and figure out their alternatives on the fly, and get confused and rattled. And lose out.

What Indians do is to cooperate all the time, which means there is no penalty to Pakistan for betrayal; their payoff is better if they betray, so they will do it every time. Exhibit A: the 91,000 prisoners India released after the Bangladesh War. Exhibit B: Sharm-al-Sheikh where the unfair equivalence of Baluchistan with Kashmir was accepted. Similarly, Communist insurgents have learned that they can offer 'talks' and 'ceasefires', use the respite to re-arm themselves, and then turned around and betray. There is no consequence to them for bad-faith behaviour.

In other words, India's negotiation skills are extremely poor. It is best to not expect any miracles from these palavers.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 02 Mar 2010 21:37

Another example of western "experts" hoodwinking India with their sophistry and hair-splitting TSP's terrorist policies against India to make it look good. The bloody cretins lie with a straight face: TSP terror is not state sponsored because its not directed against the lily white west, of course anything directed against the west is state-sponosred terror without a doubt

But, let us not get away from the fact that this is not the State-controlled terror of the kind, which we saw in Libya, in Iraq and in a lesser way in Iran. It is a different kind of terror, much more complex.