India-Canada, Mexico and South America: News and Discussion

Ravi Karumanchiri · Post by **Ravi Karumanchiri** » 17 Jun 2010 20:14

FINAL REPORT of the 'Commission of Inquiry into the Investigation of the Bombing of Air India Flight 182'

http://www.majorcomm.ca/en/reports/finalreport/

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 18 Jun 2010 09:03

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/nat ... le1607285/

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/India+ ... story.html

One summer many years ago, I was living and working in Ottawa, and every evening after work I would bicycle to the university nearby to learn some Unix and C. I used to pass through this small park everyday, where there was some kind of memorial plaque - I never bothered to notice what the plaque was for, although it had a lot of names on it.

One evening, I was bicycling back and I heard the sound of somebody sobbing in the darkness, so I stopped to take a look. There was an older guy there, with long grey hair looking very haggard and unkempt, sitting by this memorial holding a candle. It was then that I noticed the words "Air India" on this plaque with all the names on it, and I realized that it was the anniversary of the bombing. So I stayed up for most of the night chatting with the guy, and he told me about his life. He was a chemistry professor at the university, was originally from Chennai, and he used to have a wife and young daughter, who had died on Flight 182. He went on at length about his small daughter, and how she used to play the violin.

The next day I was feeling quite sleepy at work, and was watching TV in the commissary while drinking some coffee. The news was on, showing video footage highlights from the Air India bombing. They were showing scenes of the victims' families grieving on the shores of Ireland interspersed with scenes of stuff floating in the water - wreckage, bodies, etc. Suddenly I recognized on the screen that guy I had chatted with. His hair was jet black and not grey, and he was well groomed, instead of the wild-haired fellow I'd seen the night before.

The news footage then shifted back to scenes of stuff floating in the water. And there, in the middle of the screen, I could see a small, plastic child's toy floating - a violin.

Karan Dixit · Post by **Karan Dixit** » 18 Jun 2010 09:37

Canada needs a security tsar to avoid repeating the "cascading series of errors" by intelligence and police agencies that led to the bombing of Air India Flight 182, an inquiry into the case said on Thursday.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/22/20100617/tp ... f3b62.html

manish · Post by **manish** » 18 Jun 2010 11:21

The attitude of a vast majority the Canadian Mango People towards AI182 seems to be disgusting and downright heartless to say the least. At least that's what it seems like if you go through the comments section of The Globe and Mail.

Apparently AI had sent a telex to the buggers at RCMP saying some sort of luggage-bombing was imminent and they ignored it. The Canadian airport staff put the suitcase bombs on to the planes (vanc + Narita where the deadly cargo thankfully did not make it onboard but killed baggage handlers) despite the luggage concerned having no link to any of the passengers onboard Kanishka. They botched the subsequent investigation. Of course, 280 of the 329 victims were Canadian nationals.

And they have the gall to say things like these - the idiots seem to think that it is all about compensation and $$.

Give them nothing. This happened before I was born and I have 3 university degrees. Their 'wounds' should be healed by now.

Why on Earth are we expected to pay for the tribal barbarism of a third world nation? Send the bill to the Indian government. Deduct our costs of investigating this feud and demand that back as well.

No compensation - I;m tired of these immigrant free-loaders using Canada as their own personal banking account.

Disgusting. Growing up, I had a fairly high opinion of the general populace of Canada.

Education and Internet changed it.

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 18 Jun 2010 17:50

After 9/11, there were plenty of Canadians who felt like it was an attack on Canada itself. But when 329 people were murdered in the Air India bombing, most of whom were Canadian citizens, then of course nobody cares.

At any rate, I think that Stephen Harper is one of the best Canadian Prime Ministers in modern memory.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 18 Jun 2010 20:52

Ravi Karumanchiri wrote

Dear brihaspati, regarding your post of 29 May 2010 16:31;
Quote:
… Bureaucrats everywhere are blamed but those that rise in the hierarchy do so by compromising and fulfilling the innermost desires of the political fat cats.

Don’t take this the wrong way, but I’m not sure that a posting at the Canadian embassy in New Delhi, would rank among the very top picks for most Canadian diplomats who would have fulfilled the “innermost desires of the political fat cats”. Maybe if this had happened in Paris, Rome, Brussels, New York or Washington, or even London – maybe your argument might have a basis for the rationale, but… New Delhi? As a reward for what? Again, don’t take that the wrong way, no offense to Delhi is intended.

I had hoped sharper arguments in defense of the wonderfully unbiased and ethical state called Canada under HM the Quen of United Kingdom's formal rule! Think again, even if ND is a kind of hell-hole compared to the "Mecca" for Canadian diplomats in west Europe as you indicate, it still can mean even more eagerness to please the bosses to get out of that hell-hole!

Quote:
… Outside the country, the political regime can have a freer hand in dealing with foreign entities because it usually does not affect domestic politics…

I’m not sure this applies to the Canadian situation – where foreign and domestic affairs are particularly well-integrated and co-influencing on many levels, not the least of which are politics and trade.

Again, if there are larger political necessities to be seen as a strong critique of India and that brings favour with certain forces in the international arena, then your point of being "well-integrated" actually supports the role of such considerations to shaping diplomat behaviour towards sectiosn of indian society.

Quote:
So, where domestic scrutiny keeps certain aspects of political "racism" towards "perceived other/alien" under the wraps for fear of backlash, such poltical "racism" can be given a freer reign away from the domestic public gaze.

This is the ‘information age’ and we Canadians do have a lot of internet access. Moreover, we are all in what we call ‘the 24-hour news cycle’, wherein any story can be circulated almost immediately, right down to hand-held devices, certainly within 24 hours. Considering that 1 million Canadians descend from South Asian bloodlines, mostly from India, out of a total population of 34 million Canadians – I wouldn’t say that that any of this happened because of any supposed “freer reign away from the domestic public gaze”, IMHO.

What makes it so sure that Canadian "Indians" would actually show their reaction in ways that can hurt the electoral prospects of this or that party in Canada? Look at yourself - your first and foremost concern is to trivialize the incident of the visa "flap" as you dub it, and basically try to minimize the damage as much as possible. Later on you show more concern about the potential damage to the electoral prospects of the contemporary GOI for such Canadian minor "flaps". Nowhere is it a flap on India, or Indians. After all it happened only to some officers in the security forces - not to all Indians! Now if there are one million like you, which side are they going to take - ? So why should any political party in Canada have anything to worry about from such a million?

Quote:
… such a signal kick in the butt of Indian security forces can also win votes from Kahlistani supporting community sections… the LTTE supporting community… the Jihad-e-Hind supporting community… the patriotic Chinese (meaning those who support the CPC and PLA designs on India…)… even those BD expats holding resentment for the IA march on Dhaka.

Please forgive me for saying so, but it seems to me that you are projecting all of you worst fears into the ‘visa flap’, and are hallucinating the hand of your enemies upon the helm of the Canadian ship of state. This is a paranoid state of mind, and creates an immediate blockage to anything resembling strategic thought. To make matters worse, you have shown a grave misunderstanding of ground realities in Canada and the political and security situation over here. Let me explain:

1. If the Sikh population in Canada amounts to 0.9% of the total number of Canadian citizens, and Khalistanis are a subset of these; don’t you think this is a very small voting block to pander to? I do. Moreover, such pandering cannot be done without losing support from other segments – particularly for Conservative governments, who are reliant for support on some groups who would gladly see less immigration and less accommodation of such things as carrying Kirpans (which has been a very controversial issue in Canada, recently set aflame anew by a brawl inside a Gurdwara which followed soon after a man was stabbed by a Kirpan at another Gurdwara http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article ... emple?bn=1). Many Canadians see the tolerance of Kirpan-carrying Sikhs to be one accommodation too far – I mean, any other Canadian found with a knife concealed under his or her clothes, would be charged with ‘carrying a concealed weapon’, and also a ‘weapons dangerous’ charge – perhaps also ‘breach of peace’ if it ever came out from under the clothes – not to mention further charges if it were ever used, even to threaten or menace.

2. Regarding “the LTTE supporting community”, you should know that this is a subset of the Tamil community, and that this larger community of Tamils in Canada are an even smaller population than are Sikhs in Canada. Furthermore, I would like you to understand the political implications of what you are suggesting: During the closing days of the war in Sri Lanka, a number of protests were held in Canada (as in other places), demanding that the Canadian government pull whatever levers it could manage in order to compel the Sri Lankan army to cease its final push of the war (which never happened). Here in Toronto, this eventually included some very disruptive protests that were not well-received by the general public http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/story/ ... 51109.html. Be sure to peruse through the comments section, to get an idea of how this protest was received, and also read this companion article http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/story/ ... otest.html. I would argue that since this happened, over a year ago, it has become less easy for any politician of any stripe, to be seen to cozy-up to what you refer to as “the LTTE supporting community” (with further comment on this to follow). That kind of political pandering to the fringe element of a tiny minority, does not come without a very steep price in other, larger constituencies – that’s a cold, hard, political fact.

3. WRT what you have termed “the Jihad-e-Hind supporting community” in Canada – this takes the cake. Do you actually think that any kind of ‘jihad’ has any political cachet here in Canada? Are you insane? Canada has troops in Afghanistan and they are fighting jihadis. The major terror threat faced by Canadians emanates from jihadis – everyone knows this, most especially every politician. Do you think that any of them are stupid enough to see political gains to be made from sidling up to “the Jihad-e-Hind supporting community”? Understand that I’m not saying that we don’t have any jihadis in Canada, because we certainly do – but they enjoy no political foothold whatsoever, most especially since a group of 18 of them were arrested for plotting, among other things, to storm the Canadian parliament and behead one politician after another until Canada withdraws its troops from Afganistan! Whatever jihadi element does (certainly) exist in Canada, is generally smart enough not to call too much attention to itself (with further comment on this to follow).

4. For the record, Canada does have a large Chinese immigrant community, and also a large community of Canadian-born people of Chinese ancestry, BUT I would be very surprised if any more than the tiniest fraction of these people “support the CPC and PLA designs on India”. The overwhelming majority of them want to see China transition into a democracy, and their chief day-to-day concern is economic advancement. Many of them drive nice cars, live in nice homes and wear nice clothes – and I have yet to see anyone resembling a Chinese Communist (which are increasingly hard to find in China too, where the word ‘Communism’ has been watered down more than the Yangtze River! By and large, if readers will allow me a generalization, Chinese people in Canada are in favour of whatever is good for business – and if they can secure Indian customers, believe you me, they’re in favour of that. Where I think your line of thought here came off the rails, was in assuming that the relationship between the Chinese government and the American government (that of creditor and debtor), resembles the relationship between the Chinese government and the Canadian government (where no such economic deference exists). Sure, a visit from the Dalai Lama may raise the hackles of the CPC, but the visit still goes ahead, and China-Canada relations do not skip too many beats in the process. You’re blowing the China-factor waaaaay out of proportion, due to paranoia, IMO.

5. Do you have any idea how many Bangladesh expats there are in Canada? Do you know how many are in elected office or in government positions? Well, I don’t either, because they’re so small a minority here in Canada that I don’t even think anyone is keeping track. Believe me when I tell you that the Bangladeshi community in Canada does not hold the reigns of power, and could never influence policy or administrative procedure the way you would seem to imply. Dear, dear brihaspati; GET A GRIP!

6. Here is something you really need to see: It’s Canada’s official list of ‘Currently listed terrorist entities’: http://www.publicsafety.gc.ca/prg/ns/le ... g.aspx#WTM. (IMHO, many of these groups were listed very late in their reign of terror, but as they say, better late than never.) Kindly note the number of Khalistani terror groups, Tamil terror groups and Jihadi groups, among others – in fact, most of the ‘listed entities’ fall into one of these three categories.

The initial comment was made more in sarcasm than in earnest. But since you really asked me to "get a grip", this also takes the cake. I usually do not even apply sarcasm unless I have already gone through material that show some kind of a basis for me to say so. I will take up each of these ethnicities/social groups and explore their connections and impact on Canadian foreign policy as practised on ground and not as piously declared in "terrorist lists". No problem, I would enjoy that. I think I already posted one link about the CAF casually doing an equal equal between Pakis and India as carrying out terroristic strikes.

By the time I finish, I am not sure you would not like to ask yourself the question about "getting a grip".

Quote:
… It does not have to be that these groups have put pressure on these immigration officers, but simply that undisclosed policy of the political regime had been to use such incidents as leverage for domestic electoral considerations. Now "who benefits" can equally be used in this way - can't it?

No, it cannot – for reasons I’ve explained above. You are waaaay over-estimating the political leverage achievable by tiny minorities, many of whom have come to Canada as refugees – hardly tied-in to the Canadian power structure and state apparatus. I hate to put it so bluntly, and I don’t want to offend anyone when I say that these groups are tolerated in Canada – they are not followed, as you would seem to suggest.

Oh really -- impact is proportional to actual size? Not electorally, always, but in the overall global game with strength elsewhere - outside the country? I will deal with some of the absurd logic you have used in trying to trivialize the various groups mentioned above - when I address each group in the Canadian context.

I think, it is time we exposed a lot of myths about other countries and their "harmless/unbiased/ethical" political-military attitudes towards India, or even their general practises in international arena and treatment of various perceived identities.

I really feel enlightened to see how much Indians identify nowadays and feel the need to defend - forces which have been enemical to India from a long time, even if they have been lovey-dovery with certain Indian regimes or Governments. I have come across one such propaganda that was going on in the context of Palestinians and another here. Without BRF perhaps I would have thought most Indians realized the underlying current of racial and religious prejudice that determined collective as well as long term government/regime reactions towards Indians and India - in many countries and forces constructed as "friendly-increasingly friendly".

By the way, it would be better not to project treatment of a GOI at Canadian hands with the treatment of an Indian. By one-sidedly attributing unfounded and unprovable allegations on defense forces personnel, Canada has committed a crime. You perhaps cannot even feel this because you do not identify with the defense forces as being an integral part of what is India and therefore part of every Indian individual. When crimes go unpunished for long it generates complacency in the criminal. And the weak and the confused vacillate and side with the criminal - a better hedge in fact than identifying with those who did not dare to punish the criminal. For the repeat criminal is an "attitude" which will never go away unless beaten out of him.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 19 Jun 2010 03:48

http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110007760

From the WSJ Opinion Archives
THE CENTURY AHEAD
It's the Demography, Stupid
The real reason the West is in danger of extinction.

by MARK STEYN
Wednesday, January 4, 2006 12:01 A.M. EST

Then September 11 happened. And bizarrely the reaction of just about every prominent Western leader was to visit a mosque: President Bush did, the prince of Wales did, the prime minister of the United Kingdom did, the prime minister of Canada did . . . The premier of Ontario didn't, and so 20 Muslim community leaders had a big summit to denounce him for failing to visit a mosque. I don't know why he didn't. Maybe there was a big backlog, it was mosque drive time, prime ministers in gridlock up and down the freeway trying to get to the Sword of the Infidel-Slayer Mosque on Elm Street. But for whatever reason he couldn't fit it into his hectic schedule. Ontario's citizenship minister did show up at a mosque, but the imams took that as a great insult, like the Queen sending Fergie to open the Commonwealth Games. So the premier of Ontario had to hold a big meeting with the aggrieved imams to apologize for not going to a mosque and, as the Toronto Star's reported it, "to provide them with reassurance that the provincial government does not see them as the enemy."

Could this really be true for Canadians immune to manipulation by Islamists?

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 19 Jun 2010 04:22

The Canadian Secret services had some interesting foundations in connection to India - immigration officers+undercover operatives+Britain+Canada.

"In the years from the outbreak of World War I until the start of World War II the major structure of the Canadian Secret Service, as it functioned until the creation of CSIS in 1984, were established, as was its underlying ideological logic. From the outset this ideology was nativist, anti-Semitic, and above all, anti-communist. Initially imperialist, and closely identified with the interests of the British Empire, the service later swicthed metropolitan allegiance from London to Washinton.6

[Dominion Police] Thus William Hopkinson, a former Indian police officer, served simultaneously as a Canadian and British secret agent on the west coast from 1909 to 1914, when he was assassinated by Sikh nationalist Mewa Singh in the aftermath of the Komagata Maru incident[...] Hopkinson worked openly as an Immigration inspector and was also paid as a secret operative by both the Dominion Police and Indian intelligence. 8 "

Whose national security? Canadian state surveillance and the creation of enemies. Gary Kinsman, Dieter K. Buse, Mercedes Steedman. Between the lines. 2000. p19

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 19 Jun 2010 04:57

I am failing to understand the logic here justifying the erasure of the wiretap:
http://circ.jmellon.com/docs/view.asp?id=1146

CSIS slammed for destruction of crucial evidence in Air India bombing
Sep 18, 2007

OTTAWA (CP) — The erasure of key wiretap tapes by Canada's spy agency punched a hole in the evidence later needed to prosecute the Sikh extremists responsible for the Air India bombing, a public inquiry was told Tuesday.
[...]
"Those tapes would have been a very helpful piece of evidence, either to demonstrate a person's involvement or to demonstrate that a person was not involved," Jardine told the inquiry headed by former Supreme Court justice John Major.

In fact, he recalled, one of the first requests he made to the RCMP when he was assigned to the case was to make sure any pre-bombing wiretaps of the suspects were retained. Previous evidence has shown the Mounties thought they had a deal with CSIS to do just that. But the security service erased more than 150 tapes of Talwinder Singh Parmar...
[...]
As police and prosecutors continued to pursue the case over the next several years, Jardine said they were repeatedly frustrated by the spy agency's reluctance to allow its secret intelligence to be used in court, where its information-gathering methods would be exposed to the glare of publicity.

CSIS, for its part, insisted in a series of memos and letters that it wanted to be as helpful as possible, but said its co-operation couldn't go so far as to compromise legitimate national security interests.

So, they could have refused to place the evidence in court, but allowed the judge to listen in camera. Why specifically "erase" - and why was that erasure so important and so much required or Canadian "national security"?

Ravi ji, I was reading through your general reply. You suggest greater cooperation and interaction between Indian intelligence and Canadian secret services? Given the ongoing murmurs of accusations of "indirect intimidation" of anyone who appears to be protesting or deviating from the expected ruling regime political lines - of course such expertise may help the corresponding regimes in power in India (the negative effects on whom you were so concerned about in one post about the "damaging" impact of the visa "flap"). But on the "flap" side, does it not open up India to possibly racist, and anti-India elements working under Canadian secret service legitimacy, establishing networks and connections within India? People like Hedley who will use their legitimacy to gather intelligence about targets and pass it on to the "right" quarters?

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 19 Jun 2010 08:11

We can all be proud of the work done by Justice Major.
http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Report ... story.html

BTW, please change the thread title to 'Non-US Americas' or something else less unwieldy.

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 19 Jun 2010 10:37

Major chastised successive Canadian governments for treating the relatives of those who died in the nation's deadliest terrorist attack as "adversaries, as if they somehow brought this calamity upon themselves."

He said they deserved an apology and compensation -- something Prime Minister Stephen Harper immediately accepted.

Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Report ... z0rH1fnMcQ

We must give credit to Harper, yet castigate rcmp/csis in strongest terms.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 19 Jun 2010 12:56

chaanakya wrote:
We must give credit to Harper, yet castigate rcmp/csis in strongest terms.

Yes, it seems Harper did what he could. One is not convinced that it was all an unintended failure, especially since Khalistanis were getting support from the west, in those days. One cannot blame the Canadian agencies entirely - the lower-level staff were doing their jobs. It was at the higher level that things were derailed. One cannot expect the Canadians to admit anything more of their own accord.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 20 Jun 2010 03:15

http://www.siliconindia.com/shownews/Ca ... 54354.html

'Canada's bureaucracy spoiling ties with India over Kashmir'
By IANS
Sunday, 29 March 2009, 19:17 Hrs

Toronto: Indian Canadian leaders have slammed Canadian Foreign Minister Lawrence Cannon for his recent statement about playing a role in the Kashmir dispute. They said Canada must recognize the recently held "free and fair" polls in Kashmir and say that it is an integral part of India.

Alleging an institutionalized bias against India in the Canadian bureaucracy since the 1974 Pokhran nuclear tests, these leaders said the statement might have bene the handiwork of bureaucrats who are trying to undermine the "good work'' by the political leadership to promote ties with India.

In his letter to Mushtaq Jeelani, executive director of pro-Kashmiri Peace and Justice Forum (PJF) who had recently written to the Canadian government about alleged human rights violations by India in Kashmir, Cannon had reportedly said: "Through the Canadian High Commission in New Delhi, Canada has established an ongoing dialogue with the Government of India on human rights issues.

"Canada regularly presses India to ensure that human rights, including the rights of Kashmiris, are respected..."
[...]
Taking exception to the minister's reported remarks in the letter that "Canada also engages in dialogue with like-minded partners to promote sustainable peace in South Asia...,'' Koul asked, "Since when have a jihadist group and Canada become like-minded?''

He said just three years ago, the Canadian spy agency CSIS (Canadian Security and Intelligence Service) had closed down Jeelani's previous organization called Kashmir-Canada Council (KCC).

Demanding that the minister's letter be publicly released, Koul said: "Jeelani (who hails from Indian Kashmir) is working in tandem with Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front (JKLF) leader Farooq Siddiqui in Canada, and still the foreign minister calls him a like-minded partner.''

Ashok Kaput, political professor and foreign policy expert, said: "Just when free and fair elections have been completed in Kashmir, the foreign minister's statement has only muddied the waters. He is squandering the goodwill Canada gained in India by backing the Indo-US nuclear deal.''

Kapur, who has written a number of books on India-Canada relations, said: "There is an institutionalized bias against India in Canada's Department of Foreign Affairs after the 1974 nuclear explosion. Bureaucrats must have put the statement in front of the minister and he would signed it.''

He sad, "They (Canadian bureaucrats) are playing the 'spoiler role' which is hampering Canada-India relations.''

Another Indian Canadian leader, who didn't want to be named, said:"The foreign minister's letter to Jileeni must be released, considering that his (Jeelani's) previous organization was closed down by the spy agency, yet the minister wrote to him.''

Now what makes this hypothesis - about "bureaucracy" "spoiling" everything, and somehow the "political leadership" is blameless - most interesting, is that Canadian political leaders are assumed to "sign" things blindly and without understanding the implication of what they are signing.

Now which Canadian bureaucrats have taken it upon their shoulders to malign India? The Canadian political leadership take India so lightly that they feel they have to play up to Kashmiri Jihadis? It appears the "spy agency" which would also be considered part of the very same machinery as the bureaucrats - career government servants - closed down an org, but other bureaucrats find it imprtant to placate people connected to such orgs? So if bureaucrats determine foreign policy and actual implementation in Canada, and they are showing consistency in various spheres in anti-Indian activity, why should we consider such an act to be motivated by purely random vindictiveness, political activism to discredit "local regimes"?

sunnyP · Post by **sunnyP** » 22 Jun 2010 14:50

CANADA TO BAR ISLAMIC PREACHER

An Indian Muslim televangelist who was banned from Britain last week for "unacceptable behaviour" will not be allowed into Canada to speak at an upcoming conference in Toronto, sources familiar with the situation have told the National Post.

http://www.nationalpost.com/CANADA+ISLA ... story.html

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 23 Jun 2010 08:37

Heh, actor William Shatner (Captain Kirk of Star Trek fame) could be named Governor General of Canada:

http://www.cbc.ca/arts/media/blogs/popc ... neral.html

vina · Post by **vina** » 24 Jun 2010 12:38

Finally, a decent government in Canada and a courageous Prime Minister who has done the right thing.

Hats off to Stephen Harper and his govt. They have done what 5 previous waffling governments and Prime Ministers in Canada did not do. Acknowledge Canada's role in the terrorist incident and offer apologies for errors of omission and commission.

PM issues apology to relatives of Air India victims

Karan Dixit · Post by **Karan Dixit** » 25 Jun 2010 09:40

The Prime Minister’s visit also coincides with the end of a 25-year-long Canadian investigation into the Air India ‘Kanishka’ tragedy in which 331 people were killed, mostly of Indian origin. While pro-Khalistan Sikh extremists living in Canada and fighting against the Indian state were held responsible for the crime, Indian opinion has been hugely critical of the manner in which the wheels of justice have ground so slowly in Canada.

With the nuclear deal under its belt, however, Indian officials were not willing to be drawn out either on the Canadian Parliament’s condemnation of the 1984 Sikh riots as “genocide” or on the pro-Khalistan terrorists who continue to live in Canada.

http://www.business-standard.com/india/ ... ny/399132/

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 25 Jun 2010 10:59

Canada having a bureaucracy that has an anti India bias is a little paki-esque.
It is in the same league as the Pakistanis having the so called "non state actors", the Canadian counterparts are the "Bureaucratic state actors".

It seems that the media has taken up the cudgels on behalf of India. The Canadians will sheepishly back down and tone down their rhetoric.

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 25 Jun 2010 12:47

don't blame it on Canada.

the beurocracy keeps getting misled by khalistanis, pakistanis and various other axe grinders who are leading the country's foreign policy astray and into unnecessary friction with India. These folks are sneaking in bits and pieces of propaganda to damage ties with India. Its like a virus in the system so much so that even Canadians are getting fed up of their antics.

most of Canada wants good ties with India and more over is eager to diversify their clientel for natural resources from their giant neighbour to the south.

India's emergence as an economic power is seen as a good thing for business.

Ameet · Post by **Ameet** » 25 Jun 2010 22:36

Lumping the Caribbean in this thread. PIO becomes Trinidad's PM.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/south_ ... 341771.stm

Kamla Persad-Bissessar, a devout Hindu, she swore on the Bhagavad Gita - the Hindu holy book - to do her duty to her people.

A descendant of Indian indentured labourers who came to Trinidad to work the sugar plantations from Uttar Pradesh and Bihar between 1845 and 1917, Ms Persad-Bissessar grew up with traditional Indian values and strong religious ties.

anchal · Post by **anchal** » 26 Jun 2010 21:52

Finally some spine by MMS

http://news.rediff.com/report/2010/jun/ ... gly-pm.htm

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 27 Jun 2010 21:38

Dracut wrote:Finally some spine by MMS

http://news.rediff.com/report/2010/jun/ ... gly-pm.htm

That's only because it's of particular concern to Kaangress, the rest of India's feelings notwithstanding. He might just as easily have complained about LTTE extremism from Canadian soil.
If it specifically concerns the Kaangress, it'll be complained about, regardless of whether this happens to incidentally benefit India. He's there to represent his party first, and his country second.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 29 Jun 2010 04:48

India, Canada sign civil nuclear deal

TORONTO: India and Canada on Monday signed a civil nuclear cooperation agreement and Prime Minister Manmohan Singh described it as “breaking new ground in the history of our cooperation in this sector.”

Dr. Singh said both nations also agreed to try and take the bilateral trade up to $15 billion in the next five years, up from the current level of around $5 billion. A comprehensive economic cooperation agreement is being envisaged and the initial work on it was on.

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 01 Jul 2010 06:51

Economies in Latin America Surge Forward

While the recovery remains fragile in the United States and Europe, Latin America is benefiting from strong commodity demand and past economic measures.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 01 Jul 2010 11:16

MMS would have read out a line prepared earlier by the Group of Ministers along with the Babus about what all points to raise during the canada trip.

In MMS (The current post SES version) we have a predictable PM who will not deviate from the script decided and laid out earlier by the Netas and the Babus. It must be comforting and relatively tension free for them rather than having to deal with a head strong PM who can make promises that they'll all have to deal with later.

That Khalistan line is possibly because the Khalistani movement is surging forward again. In the US I have seen signs of this. There are now regular rallies being taken out, new groups are being formed. What happens in the US also usually happens in Canada. Some of the old rabble rousers who left India's shores for fear of being taken out by KPS Gill and his men upto no good these days.

I don't know exactly how things are in Punjab, everything seems calm on the outside, perhaps some BRFite from there might shed some light. I know there were some minor churning taking place during the BJP days.

Karan Dixit · Post by **Karan Dixit** » 01 Jul 2010 12:34

I support Manmohan Singh. He is a great Prime Minister. The country is doing great under his watch. He has straightened out many troubled spots for India.

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 01 Jul 2010 12:49

Gagan wrote:MMS would have read out a line prepared earlier by the Group of Ministers along with the Babus about what all points to raise during the canada trip.

In MMS (The current post SES version) we have a predictable PM who will not deviate from the script decided and laid out earlier by the Netas and the Babus. It must be comforting and relatively tension free for them rather than having to deal with a head strong PM who can make promises that they'll all have to deal with later.

That Khalistan line is possibly because the Khalistani movement is surging forward again. In the US I have seen signs of this. There are now regular rallies being taken out, new groups are being formed. What happens in the US also usually happens in Canada. Some of the old rabble rousers who left India's shores for fear of being taken out by KPS Gill and his men upto no good these days.

I don't know exactly how things are in Punjab, everything seems calm on the outside, perhaps some BRFite from there might shed some light. I know there were some minor churning taking place during the BJP days.

Heh, what do you mean "also happens in Canada"?? Canada is the main home of the Khalistani and LTTE movements, more than any other country.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 01 Jul 2010 13:51

Well you're correct. More than any country (amongst UK, USA, Canada) it is Canada that can be singled out, other than Pakistan where the most wanted Khalistanis reside and recoup, and get funding from.
Good that MMS was sent there to tell the canadians to crack down on these guys. The canadians will have to take more responsibility of what people in their boundaries do. I am sure that the Lankans will cry their throats dry, but not a lice will move on the canadians head (Canadians ke sir pe joon nahi sarke gi

), but when MMS, a sikh and PM of India says this to the canadians, they will have to do something about it.

Compared to Pakistan, Canada is solvable.

lsunil · Post by **lsunil** » 01 Jul 2010 20:07

Pride is a liability. What good is an apology going to do to the families of the victims? Im aware of the vote bank politics of canada as it is prevalent all across india. There are right ways and wrong ways. Then there are those "middle" ways which are just, "evil". Being "pragmatist" to the situation is the middle way. The simple fix. The quick solution to the most complex problem.

I would have actually felt sorry for canada if there pragmatist nature didn't hurt india.

munna · Post by **munna** » 01 Jul 2010 20:45

Gagan wrote:I don't know exactly how things are in Punjab, everything seems calm on the outside, perhaps some BRFite from there might shed some light. I know there were some minor churning taking place during the BJP days.

Gagan saab some tazaa maal.

In had a chat with a very senior political scientist and prolific author from Punjab. As per him the P landers had moved in to open the khalistani front against India ever since the loss of strategic depth in Afghanistan. Some of the key operatives that were sheltered in P-land during the early 2000s such as Rode, Panjwar, Neeta, Wadhawa Singh and Gajinder Singh were ordered to get active or be ready to be "betrayed". These chaps apparently got in touch with the families of the ex-militants who had suffered under the police in some cases. Such folks were then asked to indulge in sporadic (big time failures) acts which were foiled by an alert internal intelligence set up of police.
There IS money, smuggling and weapons but not enough footsoldiers or extremism and on top of that the police has managed to do its job admirably well. This is the good news.

Now the bad news. People may remember that about a few months ago there was violence in Ludhiana where the migrant wrokers had suddenly mobilized and fought pitched street battles with authorities on streets.

Naxals ‘fuelled’ Ludhiana arson

Ludhiana, June 26
The migrant violence in Ludhiana, that shook the entire state in December last, could have been fuelled by Naxalites. The state police has received strong indications of a Naxalite hand behind the arson, said Director General of Police, PS Gill.
The state police head, who was here to flag off the Queen’s Baton relay, said Maoists were spreading their tentacles in Malwa region.

Indicating the involvement of a particular group of Bharti Kisan Union (BKU) in Naxal operations, the DGP said: “The Naxals make their mass base by harping on social issues. They are trying to rope in kisan bodies.”

Gill said Pakistan’s ISI was still training militants to strike in Punjab. ‘‘We have confirmed reports that many militants were being trained there. The latest case is that of Bakshish Singh, a dreaded militant arrested in Amritsar recently,” he said.

The DGP, however, said the police was well equipped to handle any eventuality arising out of the situation. ‘‘Being a border state, the police is keeping a strong watch on all such activities. We are well aware of the enemy within the country and across the country. We would not allow anybody to hold the state to ransom,” said Gill.

Refusing to comment on the importance of dialogue between India and Pakistan vis-a-vis terrorism, the DGP said it is entirely a political issue. ‘‘The leaders have to decide how to go about it,’’ Gill said.

So the danger lies in a tie-up between the various Kisan Organizations, Naxalites and Khalistanis. The Punjab Police is well aware of the danger and has doubled its efforts to penetrate and bring under control any new variety of fundoos out there. However over the years some kind of rural stress is visible in the Southern districts of Punjab and that are may be a vulnerable place form the position of Mao-pests especially since these very areas have a history of naxalite violence in the 1970s.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 23 Jul 2010 23:19

I guess we havent been watching this region.

US sides with Colombia in escalating row with Venezuela

I heard about this on the weekend but couldn't make out what it was about.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 27 Jul 2010 11:25

IDB report says:

India Latin America have massive trade potential

India could become a major trade partner for Latin American and the Caribbean if governments can cut trade barriers and shipping costs are reduced, a study by the Inter-American Development Bank said.[/b

India’s 0.8 percent share of Latin American trade in 2008 compares with 7.7 percent for China, the bank said in a statement. Since Latin America is rich in the natural resources that are lacking in India, with a population of 1.1 billion, there is potential for “massive bilateral trade,” IDB President Luis Alberto Moreno wrote in a foreword to the study.

“Even though India is not yet on the radar of most Latin American and Caribbean policy makers and businessmen, at least not to the same extent as China, the region cannot afford to continue to ignore the implications of its emergence,” Moreno wrote.

China’s trade with Latin America and the Caribbean has been growing, with its 2008 share having climbed from 6.3 percent in 2007. India’s share has remained much lower partly because governments have yet to address trade obstacles, the IDB said.

India’s average tariff on Latin American agriculture goods is 65 percent, more than five times China’s tariffs, the study showed. Latin American tariffs on Indian goods reach as high as 9.8 percent for manufactured products, well above the range of 4 percent to 6 percent imposed by developed nations in the Organization for Economic Cooperation & Development, the IDB said.

Trade Talks

Transport costs are another major impediment to Latin American trade with India, the IDB said. Unlike China, India has no direct shipping service to Latin America, so goods must travel to Singapore or Europe first, it said.

A 10 percent cut in freight rates would probably boost imports of Indian goods by as much as 46 percent in Chile and 47 percent in Argentina, according to the report.

The study also urges countries in Latin American to address their “well known deficiencies” in education, access to credit, and infrastructure as India is poised to become a larger competitor to the region’s manufacturers.

Latin America needs to increase productivity and move away from labor-intensive goods, the report recommended.

“Governments in the region would be wise to acknowledge a scenario in which India joins China as a major exporter of manufactured goods,” the IDB report said. “It has become abundantly clear that the manufacturing ‘road’ to development has become highly congested and particularly hazardous for countries that cannot count on an abundant supply of skilled workers."

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 28 Jul 2010 00:45

Trinidad marks 1990 coup attempt

Trinidad and Tobago is marking the 20th anniversary of one of the bloodiest and confused periods in its history. On 27 July 1990, more than 100 members of an Islamist radical group, Jamaat-al-Muslimeen, stormed parliament. Everyone inside, including the prime minister, was held hostage for several days, as violence and looting erupted in the capital.

Karan Dixit · Post by **Karan Dixit** » 29 Jul 2010 09:51

India wants the Canadian company Research in Motion (RIM), makers of BlackBerry, to address its security concerns or face closure. Essentially, India wants the handset-maker to allow it to set up a monitoring facility here with Indian access to its encryption technology, which it needs for security reasons, a fact recently flagged by security agencies.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 230859.cms

michael T · Post by **michael T** » 25 Aug 2010 05:01

One does not have to go far to find purveyors of that theory, anyone remember Deepan Gill (though I dont know if he had Khalistani leanings) ?

Tanaji,

I can assure you that Deepan Gill has no leanings towards Khalistan or Khalistanis. However, the Canadian Sikhs have no interest in Khalistan anymore. However, majority of them are in the Red Book [found at every Indian Counslate] thus cannot get a visa. The only reply left for GoI is to tell the Canadians to behave or else no nuclear business.

VinodTK · Post by **VinodTK** » 27 Aug 2010 00:04

Indian in Al-Qaeda bomb plot nabbed in Canada

Operation Samosa

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 27 Aug 2010 01:12

one of my ex roomate's uncle was big time involve with khalistani movement out in yuba city. He couldnt get Indian visa & was arrested once he tried to visit India. He finally gave up the cause few years ago. He used to get invites from two california senators to visit him & calls from their office.They even attended his son & daughter's wedding

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 27 Aug 2010 01:35

amdavadi wrote:one of my ex roomate's uncle was big time involve with khalistani movement out in yuba city. He couldnt get Indian visa & was arrested once he tried to visit India. He finally gave up the cause few years ago. He used to get invites from two california senators to visit him & calls from their office.They even attended his son & daughter's wedding

It is about the money. There is huge money industry for the khalistani project and the parties and the senators tap into that. One of the campaign staff indirectly told me. It works

amdavadi · Post by **amdavadi** » 27 Aug 2010 01:46

^^^ yes same game is being played with kashmir issue. There is money to be made & money is flowing in the name of moderate islam. There are whole of people walking around with money bags looking to donate & invest.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 27 Aug 2010 01:48

amdavadi wrote:^^^ yes same game is being played with kashmir issue. There is money to be made & money is flowing in the name of moderate islam. There are whole of people walking around with money bags looking to donate & invest.

Same thing happened for the IUCNA deal also. It was the money