Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 11 Mar 2014 06:31

If NaMo cannot become the PM. BJP should sit in the bench. Build its party in all states. Modi or Amit will get a chance very soon. No point in having washy washy leaders who are only a few shades better than Congress.

If these leaders are not real good, if they have done nothing for their constituents or the country, they should be retired. Force them out openly, no shame. Own up and announce that they have all respect for the retiring leaders ' service, wisdom and experience; but give them a golden handshake.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 11 Mar 2014 06:32

I am afraid many are being carried away with minor set backs like old gang resistense etc and predicting doom. We have to understand that much of it will be media creation. While D4 is alive and kicking (unfortunately) they are not in a position to do much damage. We have to understand major issues in BJP are decided by RSS which is fully behind NM. Almost no one I have spoken in MH and UP want to vote to mafia or its b teams like SP, BSP. Educated youth I have spoken from UP are saying that this time it will be Hindu- Muslim vote and minds were already made. Jats, Bramins and other upper caste fellows and huge sections of BCs are in favour of NM and he is a huge hit among youth. Everyone from UP i have asked saying that BSP may be the main rival but with SC vote along she may not be able to do much.

Further there is also the winnability factor. There is almost a universal belief that NM will win 2014 and most of the voters will vote for the winner who they think do something good for them.

BJP always had voters who like it but not vote for it because it is not winning party in their respective places like AP, Kerala etc. Once you brake that and local money bags etc are with you then you have a BJP win.

So no Dhothi wetting yet. Many things may go wrong and even NM could be bumped off ( I believed mafia tried in Patna and failed so that time now passed) Just focus on winning each and every where. Be it thripura or Kerala or UP or in AP. 272plus is still possible.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 11 Mar 2014 06:50

Jhujar wrote:
ramana wrote:Something to chew on.

Muslims may not vote for BJP or Modi this time. But they are not going to be stampeded into voting for the so-called secular parties either. They have abandoned fear and forsaken fear-mongers. When they press the EVM buttons to choose their representatives, this time they may vote more as individual Indian citizens rather than as a collective vote bank.
Read more at: http://www.firstpost.com/politics/why-c ... ef_article
This is the victory for India and person Modi , the instrument of this paradigm shift in mentality , a good sign of democracy maturing at grass root level. Modi have made politics ,election issue based and hopefully cement this gain for posterity sake. Future generations will thank him for this.

Ok, I am going to say something which many may not like. "The day muslims start voting for BJP will be the beginning of the demise of Indian right and the end of India, the farther BJP stays away from them and the farther muslims stay away from BJP, the higher the chances of India surviving in the long run".

gandharva · Post by **gandharva** » 11 Mar 2014 06:56

Anti-Modi campaign has Made-in-UK tag

http://www.dailypioneer.com/columnists/ ... k-tag.html

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 11 Mar 2014 07:01

muraliravi
Sir ji if Voting become truly individual decision as an Indian National and not part of a group consciousness then Indian democracy truly have arrived. Then old prisms, perceptions must be discarded . If Voting remain a Group decision then , then might as well question the very basis of being Indian and all the political 'privileges' along with it.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 11 Mar 2014 07:10

Taking Jaggi's 2nd, 3rd and 4th point - one gets mixed signals. These points do not gel together. The cheque might not really bounce yet.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Mar 2014 07:29

another hit piece on TOI today taunting Guj health and edu figures.

don think it will matter anymore now.

Santosh · Post by **Santosh** » 11 Mar 2014 09:10

Sitting in opposition has not benefited any political party. Ground cadre will get demoralized and party will gradually vanish. Look at commies. They provided outside support in 2004 and got routed in 2009. Come 2014, they will get decimated in WB.

The most optimal scenario for NDA (230) had only 25 in MH, about 3-4 in AP (excluding TDP) and about 15 in KT. BJP stands to lose not more than 10 in the worst scenario from all 3. Given solid performance elsewhere like WB, Asom, NE, NDA will get get home comfortably. I think realistically barring any further snafus we should expect around 210+.

gandharva · Post by **gandharva** » 11 Mar 2014 09:19

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 11 Mar 2014 09:49

http://www.firstpost.com/politics/hate- ... 28605.html

Another article on Muslims and Modi.

Santosh · Post by **Santosh** » 11 Mar 2014 09:52

MNS backs Narendra Modi, but bugs Shiv Sena
http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report-m ... na-1968259

MNS chief Raj Thackeray has not only announced support to BJP prime ministerial candidate Narendra Modi, but also fielded Lok Sabha candidates specifically against the Shiv Sena in the state - barring Pune.

"Narendra Modi should become the next prime minister. My party MPs will extend full cooperation to him," Raj Thackeray declared amidst applause at the MNS foundation day function here late Sunday.

With this, he partly accepted BJP senior leader Nitin Gadkari's proposal last week - first, not to contest against the saffron alliance in 2014 Lok Sabha elections, and second, to support the BJP candidates.

Based on the above report, MH does not seem to be as bleak as it is made out to be. MNS has put up 6 candidates - 3 in MMR, 1 in Pune, 1 in Nashik and 1 in Shirur. Pune and Nashik may be obvious because he wants to ensure powerful victory. But he has also agreed to provide support to Modi in case he gets MP seats. This could be an indication to marathi votes in Mumbai to vote for NDA. The migrant population in MMR particularly Gujarati, Marwadi and business community will be firmly with Modi. So will UP/Bihari population many of whom are OBC's. I don't see how NDA candidate will lose in MMR with the exception of Kalyan seat where Marathi demography outnumbers migrant demography. But then Kalyan has been a Sena-BJP fortress for a long time. Kalyan is predominantly urbanized and has well read, working class population that is desperate to see growth and jobs. Having seen the ugly side of Congi, I don't think they will touch INC-NCP will a barge pole. MSN will not gain much here.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 11 Mar 2014 10:02

Santosh wrote:Sitting in opposition has not benefited any political party. Ground cadre will get demoralized and party will gradually vanish. Look at commies. They provided outside support in 2004 and got routed in 2009. Come 2014, they will get decimated in WB.

If Advani & Co had won 2009, it would be Congress this time, and India would have continued to be the same old. Not faulting Advani, just that he is old and has different priorities in life/career. Parrikar seems to be promising BJP CM. And then I heard there is a new guy in town...his name starts with the letter 'M', his name slips my mind.

If there is a 'narayan' to lead people will follow.

Sometimes destruction is necessary for creation. In the larger scheme of things, thinking about 30-40 years, if BJP fails to get Modi the PMship, and by sitting if they can achieve an uninterrupted Modi/Parrikar/Amit/ityadi rule from 2016 for 15-20 years, it will set the stage, for another 10 years at least.

Meanwhile, it will be painful and hopefully India does not lose territory or people in religious conversions. But that is all a BIG IF...

BhairavP · Post by **BhairavP** » 11 Mar 2014 11:17

Santosh wrote:MNS backs Narendra Modi, but bugs Shiv Sena
http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report-m ... na-1968259
MNS chief Raj Thackeray has not only announced support to BJP prime ministerial candidate Narendra Modi, but also fielded Lok Sabha candidates specifically against the Shiv Sena in the state - barring Pune.

"Narendra Modi should become the next prime minister. My party MPs will extend full cooperation to him," Raj Thackeray declared amidst applause at the MNS foundation day function here late Sunday.

With this, he partly accepted BJP senior leader Nitin Gadkari's proposal last week - first, not to contest against the saffron alliance in 2014 Lok Sabha elections, and second, to support the BJP candidates.
Based on the above report, MH does not seem to be as bleak as it is made out to be. MNS has put up 6 candidates - 3 in MMR, 1 in Pune, 1 in Nashik and 1 in Shirur. Pune and Nashik may be obvious because he wants to ensure powerful victory. But he has also agreed to provide support to Modi in case he gets MP seats. This could be an indication to marathi votes in Mumbai to vote for NDA. The migrant population in MMR particularly Gujarati, Marwadi and business community will be firmly with Modi. So will UP/Bihari population many of whom are OBC's. I don't see how NDA candidate will lose in MMR with the exception of Kalyan seat where Marathi demography outnumbers migrant demography. But then Kalyan has been a Sena-BJP fortress for a long time. Kalyan is predominantly urbanized and has well read, working class population that is desperate to see growth and jobs. Having seen the ugly side of Congi, I don't think they will touch INC-NCP will a barge pole. MSN will not gain much here.

Absolutely.. MNS posturing will affect the SS+BJP directly in 6 seats max. All this rona-dhona is not necessary IMO.

prahaar · Post by **prahaar** » 11 Mar 2014 11:35

gandharva wrote:
SwamyG wrote:Why this much churn in seats distribution? Man, I am so afraid of BJP screwing themselves again and again. Why this insistence of fighting in UP? What is the gain?
It's like Arjuna performing "Khandav Prastha" Dahan(burning) for building "Indraprastha". Obviously, Nehruvian snakes will run here and there with hissing sound. No need to get worried.

Just a nitpick, you can call MMJ anything but Nehruvian, other than the aspect of "Big talk No walk" aspect. First Ekta Yatra 1990 and then 1993 water-cannon assault would have never been used against MMJ, IF he were Nehruvian.

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 11 Mar 2014 11:37

So Congress trying to trend #BrahminMuktBhajaPa

"BJP member?A brahmin frm Bihar/UP? Ticket hopeful?Bhool jao.Maha se MNS alliance hone nahin dega, aur home state se NaMo #BrahminMuktBhajaPa"
https://twitter.com/priyankac19/status/ ... 9748369408

The secular/liberals have come a long way...

Chandragupta · Post by **Chandragupta** » 11 Mar 2014 12:06

deleted by mod

Mod note: Who are"we" in your original post? BRF does not wish to get involved in planning of any such agitations. While there is overwhelming support for Modi and it reflects here as well, we do not intend to support activism, definitely no the violent type.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 11 Mar 2014 13:34

Dr. Murli Manohar Joshi's only connection to Varanasi has been that he was allowed by BJP to stand from Varanasi as a LS candidate in 2009 and he won from there.

Other than that MMJ has no connection with Varanasi. He wasn't born there. He didn't grow up there. He did not go to college there. He did not work there. He did not start his political life there. And even after being elected MP from there in 2009 he did not contribute to any civil works or development there, giving rise to strong anti-incumbency against him in Varanasi.

It's not like Lalji Tandon's relationship with Lucknow.

Asking MMJ to move to a different constituency and making way for NaMo to take over is a no-brainer!

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 11 Mar 2014 14:24

DMK releases poll manifesto; not for Rahul, Modi as PM, Karunanidhi says - TOI

vish_mulay · Post by **vish_mulay** » 11 Mar 2014 16:27

Bipolar C Fair compares Modi with Klansman

https://twitter.com/CChristineFair/stat ... 1386441728

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 11 Mar 2014 17:35

From Reddit:
http://www.reddit.com/r/india/comments/ ... dered_the/

http://guruprasad.net/posts/part-3-modi ... r-reality/

In part 2 of the case study, we came across several facts & official reports which suggests the presence of anchoring effect and this part (part 3) will focus on that effect.

Previous parts of the study can be found in the following links:

Part 1:
http://guruprasad.net/posts/modi-phenom ... r-reality/

Part 2:
http://guruprasad.net/posts/part-2-modi ... r-reality/

UPDATE:
Part 4 is uploaded:
http://guruprasad.net/posts/part-4-modi ... r-reality/

As we had found in the earlier parts, most of the facts are already available in the public domain but the main stream media (like NDTV, CNN IBN, Tehelka etc) seem to be suppressing these and instead of being neutral, have been taking sides, thereby intensifying the “Anchoring Effect”. As I began to explore in depth into this topic, I realized that such media channels are not only taking sides but there seems to be a cottage industry working overtime and churning out false news & misleading opinions against Modi with so much of animosity.

A few years ago, Tehelka had carried out a “sting operation” and showed us shocking revelations of Babu Bajrangi who alleged Modi’s hand and even went on to say that Modi changed judges several times to protect him.

Tehelka news report:
http://www.tehelka.com/to-get-me-out-on ... es-thrice/

Tehelka sting operation:
http://www.tehelka.com/video/the-truth- ... -bajrangi/

This was one of the allegations which was investigated by the Supreme Court appointed Special Investigation Team (SIT) and the report has much more shocking revelations. Here is the excerpt from the report which quashes the Tehelka sting operation :

tehelka_sit_273

Full report of SIT:
http://ibnlive.in.com/news/full-text-si ... 419-3.html

In another shocking revelation from SIT report, a journalist from Times of India was in constant touch with Sanjiv Bhatt and helped him in arranging/drafting the affidavit against Modi. It might come as a surprise to find that journalists who are supposed to be neutral have gone to the extent of even hatching false complaints as proven in this case. He not only helped but also advised Bhatt to incorporate a few more paragraphs as the following excerpt from SIT report says:

toi_manoj_sanjiv_bhatt

Full report of SIT:
http://ibnlive.in.com/news/full-text-si ... 419-3.html

A few years ago, there was a widespread report of Modi making “objectionable” statements like “defending the riots as a result of Newtonian logic of action & reaction”. It was alleged that Modi had carelessly stated that the reaction against Muslim community was due to Newton’s law. This was investigated and the SIT found that Zee TV, which had taken the interview, had edited his statements to make it appear provocative and careless. While Modi had said that a specific case (Jafri’s firing) was an action for which the massacre in Jafri’s neighborhood was a reaction, he also continued to say there must neither be any action nor any reaction (i.e He did not justify any action/reaction but had said that he was against any such action/reaction). But the crew at Zee TV had edited and chopped off his last line which gave a completely different meaning altogether and the seemingly provocative statements were broadcast and reported all over. During the investigations, Zee TV did not cooperate with the SIT and inspite of repeated reminders, failed to provide the original CD of the interview. However, the interviewer upon summoning testified that Modi’s statement actually included the last line as well (which was cut by the editing team).

zee_tv_interview_sit_report

Full report of SIT:
http://ibnlive.in.com/news/full-text-si ... 419-3.html

Over time, several journalists, news anchors & media houses which are supposed to be neutral and unbiased, have been planting false stories about Modi being against Muslims, showing favoritism towards certain leaders, manipulating people’s minds and pushing down their biased opinions to millions of Indians, as shown in the following snapshots:

media_tweets

Twitter links:
https://twitter.com/pallavighcnnibn/sta ... 0753944576
https://twitter.com/pallavighcnnibn/sta ... 8019191808
https://twitter.com/sagarikaghose/statu ... 1366268929
https://twitter.com/sagarikaghose/statu ... 1102782464
https://twitter.com/BDUTT/statuses/299139907232878594
https://twitter.com/BDUTT/statuses/292961695788302336

Here is a recent news report which was a planted story by ToI trying to mislead readers while a message from another news journalist suggested that the ToI story was false. This false news could have instigated communal tension.

toi_eid_false_news(http://guruprasad.net/wp-content/upload ... e_news.jpg)

TOI news link:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city ... 737568.cms

Rajdeep’s twitter update link:
https://twitter.com/sardesairajdeep/sta ... 0004969472

toi_rambo_clarification

During the recent Uttarkhand floods, Times of India had carried out a false story about Modi which had gone viral and after a few days, the newspaper, due to pressure from social media tendered an apology in the form of a “Clarification”. (On the left side).

http://www.sify.com/news/rambo-modi-sto ... acbje.html

Just a few weeks ago, when a British MP showed some interest in inviting Modi to UK for a speech, some of our news anchors appeared to be desperate (and inspite of the SIT report exhonirating Modi of all the allegations), had tried to act like spokespersons of certain parties and it was a matter of great shame that an MP from Britain had to chide them for disrespecting their own Supreme Court.

Here is the video clip of a prominent news anchor of a popular news channel speaking like a party spokesperson and disrespecting Supreme Court, and rebuked by the British MP:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-twGoTBkc-Q

On the same day, an experienced anchor from another news channel also was rebuked by the British MP: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whG1E9v8JBw

UPDATE:
Part-4 of the case study is uploaded in the following link:
http://guruprasad.net/posts/part-4-modi ... r-reality/

EDIT: Please go through the other parts of the case study as well (1, 2, 4). It answers a lot of points raised by Modi's detractors.

muraliravi · Post by **muraliravi** » 11 Mar 2014 17:58

Does anyone have the audio/video link to the Interview Modi had with Shahid Siddique. I need the full video (it was about 40 mins). Everything I see online is the 25 minute one which is abruptly cut at 25 mins. The last 15 mins had stuff about history, akhand bharat vagera..

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 11 Mar 2014 18:06

Jamwal sir, thanks for painstakingly gathering links and presenting them in a logical fashion. I think the above post should go to "collection of good post".

sooraj · Post by **sooraj** » 11 Mar 2014 18:14

vish_mulay wrote:Bipolar C Fair compares Modi with Klansman

https://twitter.com/CChristineFair/stat ... 1386441728

now she compares LEJ and RSS

Christine Fair ‏@CChristineFair · 28m
@omufrench Xenophobic haters are the same at the core: be it the KKK, LeJ/SSP or RSS, Different flavors of the same basic hate.

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 11 Mar 2014 18:50

''Wave' now seems a mild word, it is more like a BJP tsunami' - Rediff

Its a long, 4-paged article. For the past few months, many pro-Modi/BJP articles are coming from Rediff.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 11 Mar 2014 19:06

sooraj, Ask her about BDS agents posted in India? Shouldnt they be categoriesd as xenophobic?

gandharva · Post by **gandharva** » 11 Mar 2014 20:05

prahaar wrote:
gandharva wrote:Why this much churn in seats distribution? Man, I am so afraid of BJP screwing themselves again and again. Why this insistence of fighting in UP? What is the gain?

It's like Arjuna performing "Khandav Prastha" Dahan(burning) for building "Indraprastha". Obviously, Nehruvian snakes will run here and there with hissing sound. No need to get worried.
Just a nitpick, you can call MMJ anything but Nehruvian, other than the aspect of "Big talk No walk" aspect. First Ekta Yatra 1990 and then 1993 water-cannon assault would have never been used against MMJ, IF he were Nehruvian.

I didn't mean him.It was about those in BJP leaking internal meeting details to media.

KLNMurthy · Post by **KLNMurthy** » 11 Mar 2014 20:09

vish_mulay wrote:Bipolar C Fair compares Modi with Klansman

https://twitter.com/CChristineFair/stat ... 1386441728

It is not C Fair but one Thane Richard.

SanjayC · Post by **SanjayC** » 11 Mar 2014 20:16

vish_mulay wrote:Bipolar C Fair compares Modi with Klansman

https://twitter.com/CChristineFair/stat ... 1386441728

My Twitter exchange with her:

Christine Fair ‏@CChristineFair 7h
Word. India crosses the moral line of no return if Narendra Modi becomes prime minister http://qz.com/178362

Indian Realist ‏@IndianRealist 2h
@CChristineFair The Whites crossed the moral line long ago by adopting a religion that says "Our God is true, your God is false."

Christine Fair ‏@CChristineFair 2h
@IndianRealist FYI: ALL believers contend that their god is true and others' gods are false. For me, I believe only in the grace of Dog.

Indian Realist ‏@IndianRealist 11m
@CChristineFair Yet to hear anyone accuse Hindus of claiming "Our God is true, your God is false."

-------------------

Christine Fair ‏@CChristineFair 2h
@omufrench Not the point; rather, his supporters lack any commitment to basic human rights. Disgusting IMHO. We have Klansmen. You have him.

Indian Realist ‏@IndianRealist 3h
@CChristineFair @omufrench What happened to the right of Native Americans to live outside reservations? Charity begins at home.

Christine Fair ‏@CChristineFair 2h
@IndianRealist You are preaching to the converted. And I'm an atheist. And American crimes don't absolve Modi's. So you're kind of lame.

Indian Realist ‏@IndianRealist now
@CChristineFair So when are you starting a campaign for the right of Native Americans to live in Manhattan?

vivek.rao · Post by **vivek.rao** » 11 Mar 2014 20:33

Ask her where she was when Clinton killed 500,000 Iraqi children and 100,000 by Bush in Iraq

Anindya · Post by **Anindya** » 11 Mar 2014 21:03

vivek - I was going to suggest the same thing. "How many Iraqi children need to die in an useless war, before American Presidents get compared to Hitler?"

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 11 Mar 2014 21:13

SanjayC: Good going!!!!

While you are at it: Ask her to fix the issue with the millions of black youth incarcerated for non-violent victimless crimes that is nothing short of new Jim Crow.

archan · Post by **archan** » 11 Mar 2014 22:02

Her point is, there can be 10000000 things wrong about America and Americans, that does not make the "alleged" misdemeanors of Modi right. So if you want to confront such people, the open fly torn shirt approach probably isn't the best. You can tear them apart by facts instead.

Abhijit · Post by **Abhijit** » 11 Mar 2014 22:17

cfair needs to be corrected - it is downright stupid to equate klan with RSS - that is like equating Klan with the Libertarians.

member_22733 · Post by **member_22733** » 11 Mar 2014 22:18

archanji,

These folks are beyond reason. They are gung-ho Murica folks. The last time I tried discussing Iran with one of them I thought he would bust a blood vessel in his brain. The more contrary evidence you present to their beliefs the more they firm up their beliefs. There was a piskological study regarding this relating to Democrats and Republicans, I will post it here when I find it.

ManjaM · Post by **ManjaM** » 11 Mar 2014 22:19

vivek.rao wrote:Ask her where she was when Clinton killed 500,000 Iraqi children and 100,000 by Bush in Iraq

Why are you comparing Modi with these genocidal maniacs?
You are unwittingly creating a ==

Chandragupta · Post by **Chandragupta** » 11 Mar 2014 22:26

Ask the bimbo to produce a list of 'Human rights violation' by Modi.

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 11 Mar 2014 22:26

Abhijit wrote:cfair needs to be corrected - it is downright stupid to equate klan with RSS - that is like equating Klan with the Libertarians.

She doesn't need to be corrected. She needs to be openly mocked patronizingly. This is a power game, not errant but diligent student being taught. SanjayC has already made an excellent start.

Her tweets need to be saved and quoted online independently because she'll probably delete them soon.

Chandragupta · Post by **Chandragupta** » 11 Mar 2014 22:30

And why is Bhagwat ji putting his foot in his mouth at such an important junction? When he knows he will be quoted out of context and this has happened before already, he still willingly puts his foot in the mouth. I'm beginning to wonder whether all the Brahmin top brass of RSS unwillingly yielded to OBC Modi just to appease the rampaging ocean of foot workers who would not have taken a no for an answer.

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 11 Mar 2014 22:34

Suraj wrote:She doesn't need to be corrected. She needs to be openly mocked patronizingly. This is a power game, not errant but diligent student being taught. SanjayC has already made an excellent start.

Her tweets need to be saved and quoted online independently because she'll probably delete them soon.

She is suffering from "Rudyard Kipling syndrome" and she thinks its her white women burden to educate us. In that process, if you ask some uncomfortable questions or confront her with logic, she will get easily irritated. Today she blocked me. But SanjayC approach is very interesting, more power to his tribe.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 11 Mar 2014 23:09

AAP is a distraction. The real combat for Modi is with Congress. The BJP internals are also small distractions which he allows lest they sabotage.