Indian Interests

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Dec 2011 22:23

the term I use is nehru-gandhi rate of growth, covers the political era.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 18 Dec 2011 22:50

RahulM, Leads to confusion about which Gandhi. I think Bji's characterization is apt.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 18 Dec 2011 22:55

brihaspati wrote:Guys! you have not had to coin "slogans/catch phrases" on the fly while marching? "Nehruvian" would be Nehru-like, and would make it phonetically difficult to catch on. The "Hindu" rate of growth is so liked because its phonetically simple to munch out. So I feel "Nehru rate of growth" should fit the bill. It makes it a historical period specific so no continued connotations possible. No one should mind - it should be really taken as light-hearted joke and dig, nothing serious really. If he alone and he alone and he alone was responsible for everything positive, surely he must also be alone responsible for what came out of such positive activities for the economy.

Nicely fits into NREGA - Nehru-Rate of-Econimic-Growth Authority

Supratik · Post by **Supratik** » 19 Dec 2011 00:22

"Nehruvian rate of growth" sounds better as the economic thoughts prevalent between 1947-1991 can be directly attributed to him.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 19 Dec 2011 02:20

i change my mind. ramana ji and b'ji got it right. let's stick to "Nehru". shorter the better. easier to say. "Nehruvian" adds a layer of confusion with additional mumbo jumbo.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 19 Dec 2011 03:42

Maya plays Muslim card, raises pitch on quota

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 19 Dec 2011 09:21

probably only a few people on BRF are aware of this, but there is a serious situation developing in Andhra wrt Chinna Jeeyar Swamy. He is a Vaishnava sannyasi who is in the middle of a scandal. His organization and his personality are being smeared ruthlessly. he made a speech few weeks ago about the commercialization of Tirumala Tirupati. his comments are being twisted out of context and he is being insulted and all and sundry allegations are being put on him.

last week, a the wife of a Pujari who works in the Swamy's ashram came out with the allegation that she is being abused by other Pujaris in the Ashram.

the timing of the allegation is very curious. just when some comment he made was being twisted, she comes out with her allegations. it is almost as if somebody somewhere was waiting for some excuse to make such a move. allegations are being made without any proof. there is no investigation into the background of the lady who is alleging this stuff. the convenient timing is being pushed under the rug.

those who are aware of the Andhra situation and who understand Telugu can easily see the smear campaign on all and sundry TV channels.

I don't know about the validity of the allegations, but the timing and the background info on those who are alleging this stuff should be probed. also, all and sundry "social workers" are giving 2-minute interviews about the "un-Dharmic" nature of the Swamy.

once again, how did this coterie of "social workers" line up so quickly to give interviews without knowing any background on the lady?

and the background TV9, and NTV, which are most vociferously airing their smear campaign should also be looked into.

I have spoke with a close family friend back in India who retired from Police service at a mid-level ranking (I hesitate to give more specifics) who has told me that "sources" inside the organization were being cultivated since 2004. I had this conversation about 8 months back, and he seemed to be hinting to me that Swamy should be careful what he says and who he says it to. he didn't say more but said that Swamy's past activities had put him under the scanner.

2004 is the year in which Chinna Jeeyar Swamy raised public awareness about the destruction of the 1000-pillared Hall (a 500 year old structure, which was built by the funding of Krishna Deva Raya of the Vijayanagara Empire) right next to the Tirumala main temple on the hill. he threatened to go on a hunger strike if further demolitions took place.

since 2004, he has pulled no punches in bringing attention to the missionary activity in Tirupati (not on the hill). he has repeatedly made speeches about the slow spread of missionary activity on the hill itself. he campaigned and once went on a walk all the way up the hill with more than 10000 devotees on the issue of missionary presence on the hill.

he criticized YSR regularly for sponsoring the missionary aggression on the hill itself.

needless to say, since 2004, he has not made any friends with the ruling regime.

and very conveniently, just when his comments were ambiguous enough to be twisted around, some lady starts making these allegations, and now there is 24/7 TV smear campaigns on him and his organization.

there is a clear trend here. Kanchi Shankaracharya, Swamy Lakshmanananda, and now Chinna Jeeyar. any sanyasi who has gone against the interests of the EJ aggression is being targeted.

South is going down the drain. if Islam destroyed the North, now the other Abrahamic twin is destroying the South.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 19 Dec 2011 10:07

also, I've been informed that it has become difficult for the organization to buy land in Coastal areas. it wasn't the case before, but these past few years, they're saying Govt is putting more and more hurdles if they want to buy land.

I made the above comment on Dec 9, wrt the Swamy's organization. in retrospect, the organization leadership and he Sannyasi himself should have realized that his activities would not go "unpunished". these AP sanyasis/peethadhipatis still operate under a lot of naivete and ignorance about the nature of politically motivated covert ops.

hard to believe that a significant section of AP was part of a state that was continuously and heavily militarized for more than 200 years...

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 20 Dec 2011 00:26

an update:

NTV is owned by Jr. NTR's father-in-law. apparently the virus has spread to TDP too. there really is no force in Andhra which represents Dharmic interests.

johneeG · Post by **johneeG** » 20 Dec 2011 01:12

devesh wrote:an update:

NTV is owned by Jr. NTR's father-in-law. apparently the virus has spread to TDP too. there really is no force in Andhra which represents Dharmic interests.

Devesh,
I think you are mistaken. NTV's chairman is Narendra Chowdhary Tummala. His picture below:

Ntv has a sister channel called Bhakti Channel. It airs devotional programs, mostly(if not all) Hindu programs. However, there was a controversy some time back. NTV targeted Swami Swaroopananda and unleased a smear campaign. Swami, on the other hand, revealed a tape of NTV anchor blackmailing the Swami to give discourses on NTV's sister channel Bhakti TV. Swami was supported by ABN(Andhra Jyothi). ABN is owned by Radha Krishna. This lead to an open media tussle with both parties throwing allegations on each other. Eventually, there were rumours that then CM Rossaih intervened and stopped NTV from going after the Swami. I thought, NTV was caught with its hand in the cookie jar. Link to the story.

Swami Swaroopananda(He claims to be a follower of Sringeri Shankaracharya Sri Sri Bharathi Theertha):

Radha Krishna, owner of ABN channel.

ABN promoted Chiranjeevi a lot. Generally, it is a pro-TDP channel. However, before one gets the hopes too high, it needs to be pointed out that the channel is not shy of going after the Swamis. But the saving grace is that they are the only ones daring atleast give spotlight to EJs. In recent times, ABN and Sakshi also went after each other.

Jr NTR's wife is Lakshmi Pranathi. She is the daughter of Narne Srinivasa Rao. He is the owner of Studio N channel and Narne estates. I think both families were already relatives before marriage. CBN, it is said, played a key role in the alliance.

I am not sure, but I am guessing that he is the person to the extreme right:

Studio N and NTV are different channels with no relation. Studio N is a TDP channel just as Sakshi is a YSR channel. Studio N had several programs exposing the corruption of YSR and Jagan gang. Even investments in Sakshi were questioned by Studio N.

But, it seems to me that what you said was true: there is no political force in AP that represents Dharmic Interests.

CBN is not affected by EJ virus. But, he is, at best, a secular guy. He is not going to promote dharmic interests. And, he is not going to hurt them either, atleast not wantonly(like YSR/Maino). Of course, the situation is such that not doing any harm itself is being considered a great help. By those standards, CBN is good.

Otherwise, AP would be much better with a political party/leader working for Dharmic interests.

PS: Correct me, if I am wrong...

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 20 Dec 2011 01:55

JohneeG,

there is some confusion then. let me check which channel it is and come back to you.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 20 Dec 2011 02:08

Can you guys follow up in the media thread and not this one?
Thanks, ramana

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 20 Dec 2011 02:15

sorry ramana ji, will take it to that thread.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 20 Dec 2011 07:47

Arun Jaitley Interview

kmkraoind · Post by **kmkraoind** » 20 Dec 2011 09:05

Temple to school, VHP shifts focus

The Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP), known for its shrill anti-minority stand and alleged role in 2002 riots, now plans to stay away from political issues like the Ram temple movement to keep its shrinking base intact.

The Hindu outfit, which announced an overhaul in its top leadership on Sunday in which Praveen Togadia was appointed its international working president in place of Ashok Singhal, now plans to focus on socio-religious activities instead of getting entangled in political issues like Ayodhya in which it once played a key role.

“We felt that because of our focus only on the political issue of Ram temple over the last 20 years, we became a victim of hatred politics and started losing base in the Hindu society. We have decided to engage in socio-religious activities. We are focusing on starting good schools across the nation, increasing our membership, training new priests and preachers etc,” said Kaushik Mehta, the newly appointed president of VHP’s Gujarat unit.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 20 Dec 2011 17:00

Rajiv Malhotra, on Being Different, the roots of the Indian civilization.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... rs0XEoFHAM

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 21 Dec 2011 05:30

http://www.forbes.com/sites/mobiledia/2 ... -in-india/
Telephones For Toilets In India

An entrepreneur is developing a startup that will offer mobile customers in India rewards for using public restrooms, a novel idea intended as a way to improve both the country’s public health and mobile business.
The winner of the recent business competition “Startup Weekend Delhi,” Swapnil Chaturvedi’s unforgettably named program “Poop Rewards” is geared to increase both demand for and supply of public toilets in India — by rewarding people who use specially designated toilets with mobile minutes and other discounts from a partnering cell phone provider.Chaturvedi got the idea by linking two unrelated statistics: 800 million of the country’s 1.2 billion citizens have a cell phone, but only half — about 600 million — have ready access to a clean bathroom. This lack of access to proper sanitation is a key reason the country suffers from many water-borne diseases, causing unnecessary sickness and death.The program’s mobile providers will help cover the expense of building more public toilets, and then hopefully reap their own rewards by decreasing India’s high mobile customer “churn” rate. Price-conscious cell phone customers in the country regularly switch providers whenever a better deal comes along. As a result, mobile companies spend significant sums of money just trying to retain as many customers as possible.

Pranav · Post by **Pranav** » 21 Dec 2011 12:48

If only Advani were a Sonia
MD Nalapat

Despite its occasional posturing — usually only after sustained prodding from the permanent residents of the RSS HQ at Nagpur — the BJP leadership admires Congress president Sonia Gandhi. Given the retirement of A.B. Vajpayee, L.K. Advani can be cast as the "CP" (Congress President), while Arun Jaitley would — aspirationally at least — fit the role of UPA Heir Apparent Rahul Gandhi, leaving Sushma Swaraj to play the role of the attractive Priyanka Vadra. Informal briefings to friendly newspersons invariably refer to the troika in the regal tradition of the Third Person, and to their being the "BJP High Command". We all know that despite the frequent sightings of a Digvijay Singh or the invisible presence of an Ahmed Patel, it is Sonia, Rahul and Priyanka who alone comprise the "Congress High Command". The rest are, in the words of satirist Aubrey Menen as applied to the Indira Gandhi period, "either clerks or peons". While clerks have the right to make notings and even to proffer advice when asked, peons are there only to carry out orders made from On High.

Even in the 1950s, a period when Jawaharlal Nehru was making mincemeat of the RSS and its philosophy of Hindu primacy, Atal Behari Vajpayee was an admirer of the then Prime Minister, modelling himself on him in a manner that was obvious. This feeling of awe towards the Nehrus was extended to Indira Gandhi, who too was treated with deference and attention by Vajpayee. Although the current father figure of the BJP did not evince much reverence for Rajiv Gandhi, like many others who were turned off by Rajiv, he has become an admirer of his widow. Vajpayee has not hidden his regard and respect for Sonia Gandhi, neither to this columnist nor to others. Not surprisingly, during his time, the effort by Murli Manohar Joshi to enquire into the functioning of the "cultural trusts" headed by Sonia Gandhi resulted in Joshi losing the Culture portfolio. The protective hand of Vajpayee, reinforced by the ministrations of the formidable National Security Advisor, Brajesh Mishra, and the charming son-in-law Ranjan Bhattacharya, extended over the Congress president for each day of Vajpayee's term as PM.

If L.K. Advani objected to such solicitude shown to an individual who has never deigned to hide her antipathy to saffron, he would have done so in silence or in his sleep. The record shows that Advani and Heir Apparent Arun Jaitley were as attentive to the concerns of the formidable occupant of 10 Janpath as was Vajpayee. As for Sushma Swaraj, although she once threatened to make a fashion statement by trimming her locks, while in office (even as I&B Minister), nothing was done that could disturb the sleep of the Congress supremo and her progeny. Indeed, cosy personal links were formed between the "BJP High Command" and the "Congress High Command", although the intensity of feeling on the side of the Congress troika seems to have dimmed after the party came to power in 2004, and their factotums entered South and North Blocks in a triumph that seems these days to be fated to end in tragedy.

http://www.sunday-guardian.com/analysis ... re-a-sonia

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Dec 2011 08:25

Views from the Right

Always the capital
An article titled ‘Celebrating slavery’ in the RSS journal, Organiser, has sharply criticised the celebrations marking a hundred years of Delhi as the nation’s capital. Saying it is “disgusting and dispiriting” to watch the celebrations, it contends that Delhi has been the seat of power for hundreds of years, since the time of the Pandavas, Anangpal Tomar and Prithviraj Chauhan, and even later after the Muslim invasions. The rejoicing, therefore, is meaningless except to who are still pining for the colonial past, says the article.

“Centenary of the shifting of the capital from Calcutta to Delhi by the colonial rulers is hardly a matter for cheer. If the British were ruling today and they were spearheading the celebrations, one can understand. But now, one can only believe that the present day rulers think that they are only carrying on the colonial legacy and hence the reason to rejoice,” it says.

It claims that the move only underlines the UPA dispensation’s penchant, ever since it has come to power, to assiduously try and cultivate an image of India without its Hindu moorings, ethos and strength. “Whether it was Commonwealth, foreign dignitaries’ visit or celebrating various anniversaries, the emphasis is not on a shared identity but an isolated, exclusive image,” the article says.

Bill of wrongs

The lead story in the Organiser focuses on the Sant Sammelan held last week by the Bharatiya Sanskriti Sabha and attended by RSS chief Mohan Bhagwat as well as a host of seers, VHP leaders and politicians like Subramanian Swamy. The key demand of the gathering was to seek immediate dissolution of the National Advisory Council headed by UPA chairperson Sonia Gandhi, and immediate withdrawal of the communal violence bill.

Appealing to the seers who had gathered, to use their influence in getting the bill abolished, Bhagwat contended that it is not only aimed at minority appeasement, but would also weaken the nation. These seers, including the Kanchi acharya, Swami Jayendra Saraswati, and Swami Satyamitranand Giri Maharaj spoke against the bill and favoured an effective campaign against it, claiming that it went against Hindu society. The gathering also included several former government officials, including a former Punjab DGP, P.C. Dogra, a former chief secretary of UP, Venkat Sekharan and former attorney-general of Rajasthan, Gursharan Gill, who discussed the various provisions of the bill. A resolution adopted by the gathering demanded that the government apologise to Hindu society for bringing such a bill.

Stalling the Lokpal

The Panchajanya lead editorial has attacked the Manmohan Singh government on the Lokpal Bill question, alleging that it is trying to give the impression of being sincere about the legislation, but is in fact looking for ways to extricate itself from the mess it has landed itself in. The article says that on the one hand, Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said his government was committed to bringing the Lokpal, but on the other, Finance Minister Pranab Mukherjee refused to commit at the last all-party-meeting to bringing the legislation in this session of Parliament. “On the pretext of finding a consensus on various aspects of the bill, the government is actually trying to stall it”, the editorial claims.

Death wish

The Panchajanya has also commented on the UPA’s failure to hang Afzal Guru, the key accused in the Parliament attack, despite the court having given its verdict five years ago. The article reiterates the charge that votebank compulsions are the main reason behind the Manmohan Singh government’s inability to take any decision on the issue. The argument that the mercy petition is still pending with the Rashtrapati Bhawan will not work, it says, as she will ultimately have to go by the recommendation of the Union cabinet. It alleges that Health

Minister Ghulam Nabi Azad and other senior ministers openly caution against any precipitate step, saying that it would lead to trouble in Jammu and Kashmir. This approach only strengthens the impression that the UPA government is unable to fight the battle against terrorism, it says. Only when the UPA government itself is hanged, will justice be done to Afzal Guru, the article says.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 22 Dec 2011 08:31

Pranav wrote:
If only Advani were a Sonia
MD Nalapat

Vajpayee has not hidden his regard and respect for Sonia Gandhi, neither to this columnist nor to others. Not surprisingly, during his time, the effort by Murli Manohar Joshi to enquire into the functioning of the "cultural trusts" headed by Sonia Gandhi resulted in Joshi losing the Culture portfolio. The protective hand of Vajpayee, reinforced by the ministrations of the formidable National Security Advisor, Brajesh Mishra, and the charming son-in-law Ranjan Bhattacharya, extended over the Congress president for each day of Vajpayee's term as PM.

http://www.sunday-guardian.com/analysis ... re-a-sonia

Just confirms that Windbag, along with many other, has always been (e.g. Brajesh Mishra son of DP Mishra) the sleeper cell of dynasty in RSS-BJP.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 22 Dec 2011 08:46

who is "windbag"? and is it possible that "message" was conveyed to Vajpayee that he better "protect" the "high family" or else some matter of national importance might become compromised??? is it possible that foreign hands have other levers of control other than just personal "dark material"?

either way, BJP's activities in protecting High Family on several occasions are a cause for concern. it means that in the future, the BJP itself might become a proxy to drain "energy" of "saffron".

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 22 Dec 2011 09:20

^^^ Or does this have to do with some close relationships Vajpayee had

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 22 Dec 2011 09:45

For those who can read Hindi, this is quite funny. A subset of the article has been translated in nukkad.

Sushupti · Post by **Sushupti** » 22 Dec 2011 09:57

^^

राष्ट्रीय पुरुष…अर्चना पूरन सिंह
राष्ट्रीय महिला…करण जौहर

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 22 Dec 2011 10:14

राष्ट्रीय रहस्य…सोनिया गांधी
राष्ट्रीय खुजली…महेश भट्ट
राष्ट्रीय गाल…शरद पवार
राष्ट्रीय चुगलखोर…स्वामी अग्निवेश
राष्ट्रीय दामाद… कसाब, अफज़ल गुरू और रॉबर्ट वढेरा के बीच टाई

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 22 Dec 2011 20:18

Mexico disbands Veracruz-Boca del Rio police force

Something Bharat need to do city by city, area by area, department by department to be truly free of colonial influences.

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 22 Dec 2011 22:18

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/22/world ... ables.html

This story is a 3-of-5 column wide front page story in the print edition of the NYTimes and continues with a full interior page.

Scaling Caste Walls With Capitalism’s Ladders in India
By LYDIA POLGREEN

PED, India — On his barefoot trudge to school decades ago, a young Ashok Khade passed inescapable reminders of what he was: the well from which he was not allowed to drink; the temple where he was not permitted to worship. At school, he took his place on the floor in a part of the classroom built a step lower than the rest. Untouchables like him, considered to be spiritually and physically unclean, could not be permitted to pollute their upper-caste neighbors and classmates.

But on a recent afternoon, as Mr. Khade’s chauffeur guided his shimmering silver BMW sedan onto that same street in a village in the southern state of Maharashtra, village leaders rushed to greet him. He paid his respects at the temple, which he paid to rebuild. The untouchable boy had become golden, thanks to the newest god in the Indian pantheon: money.

As the founder of a successful offshore oil-rig engineering company, Mr. Khade is part of a tiny but growing class of millionaires from the Dalit population, the 200 million so-called untouchables who occupy the very lowest rung in Hinduism’s social hierarchy.

“I’ve gone from village to palace,” Mr. Khade exclaimed, using his favorite phrase to describe his remarkable journey from the son of an illiterate cobbler in the 1960s to a wealthy business partner of Arab sheiks.

The rapid growth that followed the opening of India’s economy in 1991 has widened the gulf between rich and poor, and some here have begun to blame liberalization for the rising tide of corruption. But the era of growth has also created something unthinkable a generation ago: a tiny but growing group of wealthy Dalit business people.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 22 Dec 2011 23:00

We need to examine the roots of instability in the peripheral states around India. If you look at it objectively all from sri Lanka to Afghanistan to Myanmar all are risky states. States reflect the society which froms the state. What is going on?

Altair · Post by **Altair** » 22 Dec 2011 23:21

ramana wrote:We need to examine the roots of instability in the peripheral states around India. If you look at it objectively all from sri Lanka to Afghanistan to Myanmar all are risky states. States reflect the society which froms the state. What is going on?

All the states are not stable economically. The reason can be a mix of various factors. Greedy leaders,lack of proper educated masses,Meddling by western countries,large populations etc..
It may take another 3 to 4 decades for all the peripheral states around India to stabilize. India can be the center of gravity if we show some real intent and set some things straight in our neighborhood. India must start thinking for the next 50 years in our vicinity and plan for solutions. Independent Baluchistan is one to start with.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 23 Dec 2011 00:43

Its good tactics not to worry the dynasty so much so that all the political, financial investments made into the structure feel threatened. Whoever wants to do with less bloodshed, has to induce belief in the networks that their "interests" will be preserved. Whether that belief is justified or not - of course are a matter of the future! Look the one who promises protection even if they abandon the dynasty - might himself be eliminated - so the successor need not be under obligation.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 23 Dec 2011 01:21

I am tired of Stories depicting Dalits walking miles to get to school.

I too, being a Brahmin, had to walk 3 miles each way to get to high school and go 15 miles each way on bicycle tO college.

That didnt make me a wise sh*t nor a condemned Xalit.

Phukin nonsense. I blame every Indian (who calls himself an indian) who believes this nonsense for this Christian West propaganda.

svinayak · Post by **svinayak** » 23 Dec 2011 01:58

Bull*hit stories and Bull*hit narratives must thrown out and branded as Bull*hit

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 23 Dec 2011 02:45

brihaspati wrote:Its good tactics not to worry the dynasty so much so that all the political, financial investments made into the structure feel threatened. Whoever wants to do with less bloodshed, has to induce belief in the networks that their "interests" will be preserved. Whether that belief is justified or not - of course are a matter of the future! Look the one who promises protection even if they abandon the dynasty - might himself be eliminated - so the successor need not be under obligation.

Anna is challenging Sonia directly. not a good strategy if he wants to stick around for some more time and continue to show the Indian masses how futile it is to fight the regime. for better or worse, as an initial declaration of "war", Anna's way is the best one. it makes it difficult for dynasty to directly "fight" him without inviting outrage of the masses. so, they are forced to wage a long war against his ideas, but this is a war they will loose. the amount of disconnect of "masses" is directly proportional to how long Anna's fight continues. this should be his goal. to prolong the "insurrection" to increase the "disconnect". if he challenges Sonia at this stage, he will be taken out b/c of some "heart condition" or "diabetes" or some such nonsense.

either way, I think Anna's way will eventually run into the same problems that MKG did. but good thing is this time, Anna is much older than MKG at a similar stage. so, the tactics of Anna will ultimately be realized as "futile" and tactics will change. but he has started the fight. and that is good. this time around, b/c of his age, the right people can bring the fight to conclusion, unlike the last time.

Yayavar · Post by **Yayavar** » 23 Dec 2011 03:02

RamaY: There was, and in pockets, is discrimination. Therefore such a narrative will stay for some time. It is not just outsiders but lots of 'insiders' who tell similar stories. Just see Chandrabhan Prasad (columnist from Dailypioneer) who describes his grandfather or granduncles going to Rangoon, making money enough to build the tallest house in the village. The local 'zamindar' came to their house to request them not to build the house taller than his house but they refused and did make it higher. It was, he claims, the first brick house in the village. Even before this, his family were the strongmen of the village if I recall correctly. Therefore, at least his family should not be 'dalit' (downtrodden). Certainly not for the last 80-100 years.. One could call him out on claims of discrimination, but then he is also representing the folks who actually face the injustices. The issue is really economic even if linked to caste lines. He too very often emphasises such stories.

NYtimes and others possibly have other propaganda in mind.

Walking so many miles is but a function of lack of infrastructure. Growing up in those remote defence stations, whatever be the caste, child of officer or nco, girl or boy - we all trudged multiple miles to the school every day.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 23 Dec 2011 03:18

Not allowing people into temples and schools is discrimination. Having to walk barefoot to school is not. That is gut-wrenching poverty which everybody in India had to deal with in those days and many still do. The NY Times article makes it seem as if the Dalits were the only ones artificially kept poor while all Brahmins were rich. Everybody was poor in those days including the Brahmins. Those who went to school in cars were a small minority. They still are. But such truths are inconvenient for propagandu masters like ny times.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 23 Dec 2011 03:42

First and foremost : discrimination was there in all other societies at one period or another, and hence by the standard argument - as was once argued on the "West-Asia-thread", "Hindu" society cannot and should not be blamed for discrimination.

Since Romans/Babylonians/Christians/Crusaders all supposedly persecuted and discriminated against the Jews, Islamic "discrimination" was not an "exceptional" deal, and not much ado should be made out of it. Similarly, "discrimination" in Indian society should not be made into big issue either. Muslims discriminate on the basis of Barelvi or Deobandi, Shia or Sunni, Ahle-Hade or Ahmadyia, Ajlaaf or Ashraaf. Christians in the south appear to discriminate along sectarian lines. In the NE, one tribe discriminates against another. Since many others do it - and those discriminations are not an "issue" - why should this particular discrimination be so much of an issue? Under Islamic rule, Hindus and Sikhs were blatantly discriminated against - if they cannot be highlighted, why highlight alleged "Hindu" discrimination onlee?

Second, even if the Goan inquisition was carried out under the banner of the Catholic Church, or sundry other atrocities and discriminations were carried out by other Christian sects too in India - nowadays - the church itself and most importantly -it is demanded that "Christianity" itself cannot be and should not be blamed for and associated with such discriminatory practices. Same goes for every atrocity committed by people who solidly claim with proof that their atrocious actions are sourced from authentic Islamic claims/text/practices - and it is demanded of us to parrot the truism - that "Islam" itself has nothing to do with such atrocities.

All such atrocities/discriminations are the result of "distortion" and "misrepresentation" and has "nothing to do with the pure religion or culture or ideology" [and as claimed by one Christian apologist in case of Goa - that it was due to local politics and local on-spot representatives but "Christianity" itself is not responsible]. Therefore any discrimination on the abstract category of "Dalits" is a matter of local politics and local on-spot representatives, who call themselves "Hindu" - but has nothing to do with the "pure religion/ideology of Hinduism", and such "demonization" should not allowed on "Hinduism" as it hurts "religious sentiments".

In fact no so-called much-maligned Hindu "law texts" mention the word "Dalit", and therefore "oppression of Dalits by the Hindus" is defamatory.

Chalega?

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 23 Dec 2011 03:54

Another thing is that this article is talking about how he was made to sit on the floor in his school in the 60s. Well several states in the Oh so liberal and tolerant US of A practiced racial segregation in the 60s. Pot calling the kettle black.

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 23 Dec 2011 04:42

UP polls ahead, govt clears 4.5% minority quota within OBC 27%

The Gita and the Manifesto

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 23 Dec 2011 04:52

From the Urdu Press

Lokpal politics

A large section of the Urdu press has expressed pessimism and fatigue on the Lokpal question, and its capacity to fight corruption. Jamaat-e-Islami’s Daawat writes on December 9: “There is less effort being applied to solving the Lokpal problem, and more to playing politics... Anna Hazare’s team is playing politics, there are apprehensions of it benefiting the RSS and the BJP... The opposition parties are also playing politics. The government’s intentions are also suspect, but in the process, it has exposed everybody concerned. Gradually, people’s interest is declining.”

Siasat, published from Hyderabad and Bangalore, writes: “Efforts are being made to foil the efforts to bring the CBI under the Lokpal... because the CBI is conveniently used by governments while dealing with cases of corruption.” It cites the Taj Corridor case, the fodder scam, the Vajpayee government’s harassing of Jayalalithaa (compelling her to support the Centre), and other instances. Munsif, in its editorial on December 16, writes: “Most political analysts and intellectuals are of the view that if the Lokpal bill demanded by Hazare gets passed, it will result in lowering the importance of the courts, state assemblies and Parliament.”

a hard-hitting column, Hisam Siddiqui, the editor of Lucknow-based weekly Jadeed Markaz, writes on December 18: “Today, Hazare occupies V.P. Singh’s place and his target is Rahul Gandhi, instead of Rajiv Gandhi. The only difference is that the RSS and the US realised that Rajiv was not going to be a toy in the hands of these forces, three years after his becoming PM. The RSS has realised this about Rahul much earlier. The slogan is the same: ‘corruption’.” Siddiqui says: “If we do not try to understand Anna or deliberately remain uninformed, we will harm the country greatly.”

Wrongly accused

Applauding the Andhra Pradesh government’s decision to compensate 70 persons acquitted in the Mecca Masjid bomb blast case, Hyderabad’s leading daily, Munsif, writes in its December 10 editorial: “The payment of compensation to innocent Muslim men on the recommendation of the National Commission for Minorities is a historic act by the state government. The compensation will, to a great extent, provide relief to the affected families. But it is also important that more effective steps are taken to remove the scar of humiliation they have suffered. Issuing testimonials of good conduct is one such step, and the government has promised early action in this regard.”

The daily Inquilab, published from Mumbai, Delhi, Kanpur, Lucknow and Bareilly, writes in an editorial on December 9: “In our view, compensation is the right step. It is a different matter that neither the amount of compensation (Rs 20,000 or Rs 3 lakh, depending on the case) is adequate, and nor will it help solve other problems that these young men face.”

Condemning security agencies for indiscriminately “associating Muslims with terror attacks before conducting any credible inquiries”, Rashtriya Sahara writes in its editorial on December 9: “It has also come to be known that some of these beastly acts are linked with right-wing communal and extremist organisations.”

Food for all

Welcoming the Union cabinet’s clearing of the food security bill, Rashtriya Saharawrites in its editorial on December 20: “Granting 63.5 per cent of the population the right to get subsidised foodgrain would definitely be a good decision... But it will have to be seen how and where the government will manage the huge amount of Rs 6 lakh crore that would have to be spent in three years as subsidy. The cabinet has not given any clarification on this point while approving the draft bill. And in view of the present drawbacks in the PDS, it is doubtful if the subsidised foodgrain will reach the poor.”

Delhi-based daily Hamara Samaj, in its editorial titled

“Tahaffuz-e-khurak bill, nek mansooba ya jhunjhuna?” (Food security bill, a noble mission or a toy?) writes: “We have doubts about the intentions behind the bill. It appears less a welfare scheme and more a way to bolster Rahul Gandhi’s Mission UP.”

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 23 Dec 2011 05:26

viv wrote:RamaY: There was, and in pockets, is discrimination. .........

My response in my dark-abode: Off Topics thread.