India-US Strategic News and Discussion

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 15 Nov 2012 00:20

what about the investigator who send one of the chix pictures of himself shirtless? Surely, that adds to this ridiculous farce... Wonder why all the women are silent, so far...

Vayutuvan · Post by **Vayutuvan** » 15 Nov 2012 00:46

JEM saar, that was before the threatening emails.

Did anybody catch the recent SNL? The original title of the book was supposed to be "tip only" but later became "all in"

Nandu · Post by **Nandu** » 15 Nov 2012 01:00

JE Menon wrote:what about the investigator who send one of the chix pictures of himself shirtless? Surely, that adds to this ridiculous farce... Wonder why all the women are silent, so far...

Yes, we need him because that's what makes it a proper Love Pentagon.

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 15 Nov 2012 09:37

JE Menon wrote:what about the investigator who send one of the chix pictures of himself shirtless? Surely, that adds to this ridiculous farce... Wonder why all the women are silent, so far...

Turns out that the investigator was a personal friend of one of the women and had sent her that shirtless pic a long time ago before this whole business started. Apparently the pic from some party they'd both attended a while ago, at least per one of the articles I read. The reason he got involved in the case was because the woman contacted him for help when she got the threatening emails, since she knew that he worked for the FBI.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 16 Nov 2012 14:34

Everybody keeps saying make love not war, and when the jernails listen to them, they get thrown out! Bhwaat to do?!

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 16 Nov 2012 18:32

Rangudu wrote:
Big picture: The very fact that a great big number of us live and thrive here in the US works against this constant claim of racism, to be honest.

Lets look at the big picture. Have you ever watched Fox news for a few minutes? Or listened to fascist talk radio that fills the airwaves every day? If thats not racism,I don't know what is. And BTW, that garbage is listened to and lapped up by a good 35-40% of the population.

BijuShet · Post by **BijuShet** » 16 Nov 2012 21:20

CRamS wrote:Lets look at the big picture. Have you ever watched Fox news for a few minutes? Or listened to fascist talk radio that fills the airwaves every day? If thats not racism,I don't know what is. And BTW, that garbage is listened to and lapped up by a good 35-40% of the population.

CRamSji please stop watching Fox News. All it will give you is an ulcer. Their bias is well known so why keep watching it and getting upset. Your energies are better invested in something more productive.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 16 Nov 2012 21:47

making love is for karnails and not gernails., so what I am suspecting here is some huge kompany like bechtel and others must have had a deep strike connections, to win big time service contracts at afpak region..

some silly indics will be also paid some meager amount to say do patrol duty, under the UN T-shirt or some such thing.. and then huge sum of money is pocketed by some third party kompany. naarmal-din-activities for generic middlemen.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 16 Nov 2012 22:09

Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal: Republicans ‘have to make serious changes’ told you so. so what took him so long ?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 16 Nov 2012 22:23

perhaps hoping Romney would win.... he could not have said it before the election results anyway. so, he is trying to shoot when he can see some target out there.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 17 Nov 2012 02:27

election done. obama won. eat chicken. wait for 2016.

meanwhile enjoy life. forget Romney/Republicans/Democrats/etc. election is over. let them political hacks fret over the details. irrelevant for this thread, anyway.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 17 Nov 2012 04:35

One thing noticeable is once a presidential candidate is defeated, it becomes extremely dificult for him to run again, though not impossible.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 17 Nov 2012 04:38

Rangudu wrote:
Big picture: The very fact that a great big number of us live and thrive here in the US works against this constant claim of racism, to be honest. Yes, ceteris paribus, a non-White person statistically faces more issues in the US criminal court system but I'd be careful with extrapolating that to every case.

Immigrants are not a majority so far. So long as the immigrants just taste economic freedom - there will some sort of equality in certain areas.
If things change-- it may not necessarily be the norm.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 17 Nov 2012 04:48

JE Menon wrote:what about the investigator who send one of the chix pictures of himself shirtless? Surely, that adds to this ridiculous farce... Wonder why all the women are silent, so far...

men fight for the spoils.

wimmin go with the winner.

klinton saab is the greatest of all amorous men-- he lied through all orifices, did all things required to establish his 'credentials".
never did he consider resigning depsite being as president with damning evidence against his deeds. he brazened it out with them.
phuck continues to be ever popular with wimmin min and alike, stays with madam klinton, helps ombaba win elections, will continue to inspire democrats thru elections for years to come.

The men so called 4-5 star generals are mere puff of dust in front of him.

They resign
1) at first sign of leak of sexual adventures under desk
2) for not leaking state secrets,
3) are weak in their knees in both sense of terms.

4) have trouble with their original wimmin
5) have trouble in their future careers despite awesome record in military

many salute to klinton saab, likes of that never to be seen again for years.

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 17 Nov 2012 05:51

Rangudu wrote: Big picture: The very fact that a great big number of us live and thrive here in the US works against this constant claim of racism, to be honest. Yes, ceteris paribus, a non-White person statistically faces more issues in the US criminal court system but I'd be careful with extrapolating that to every case.

I heard this argument before. My cousin's wife would bring this argument when she doesn't have any logical explanation why I cannot support Jr.Bush as a better candidate to be PoTU in comparison to Al Gore or Kerry.

My point then and now is that the so-called lack of racism is ONLY because the USA needs the immigrants more than the immigrant needs USA. That is why a fresh H1B software coolie makes more than double the per capita income.

The moment this equation changes the immigrants will start seeing all kinds of racism.

One will be well advised to remember the fact that Slavery was legal in USA even after its independence and so-called most humane constipation.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 17 Nov 2012 08:37

BijuShet wrote: CRamSji please stop watching Fox News. All it will give you is an ulcer. Their bias is well known so why keep watching it and getting upset. Your energies are better invested in something more productive.

I don't watch Fox. I don't watch that much TV, except cricket, and CNN for news, and MSNBC for a liberal viewpoint. And Indian channels from time to time including B4U music for some light entertainment. In general, while liberals may have a bias on some issues, they sure are more cerebral and not nut case neo nazis like right wing media. I only gave the example of right wing media to R-man to say that racism is alive and kicking domestically. Foreign policy is essentially an extension of erstwhile colonialism. (As we speak, I puke watching the cheer leading in US as European Israel bombs the living crap out of the poor Palestinians, while when TSP terrorizes India, and India dares to threaten retaliation, its either India TSP equal equal or slimy calibration to make sure India desists from attacking its munna).

Thats said, your advice is well taken. I don't watch Fox news, but I do a lot of other things that I shouldn't be wasting time on, and instead do something more productive during my after work hours besides tending to family. For e.g., learn something new on coursera (https://www.coursera.org/).

.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 17 Nov 2012 09:21

That speaks volumes about how India has zero respect and lobbying power in the corridors of power, while Israel continues to act as a world class bully. Power respects the powerful? Or the squeaky wheel gets the oil. I feel India is good at handling crisis and better at preventing crisis. However, in international politics a country should be able to create crisis. India is always in the mode of preventing and defusing trouble. Is it because the babus feel leaving the sleeping dogs is beneficial? History shows countries and kingdoms that proactively needles other has the potential to capture imagination and respect. Or is India the only civilization all country says 'boss all this taller creation and limelight are just flash in the pan, victory and losses are transient onlee'. Is it continuing to take hits and laughing at the naïveté of the rest of the world? Is it content with what it has and gets?

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 17 Nov 2012 09:30

we should all live in a country where bomb shelters are a routine thing and using them is second-nature. the sound of the rocket up above as it arrives, the uncertainty and wondering when and on whom it will land....what a wonderful experience!!! clearly, we would all then extend our fervent friendship to the perpetrators who aim those rockets at us.

don't see why so much tears for the Islamic Palestinians here? when the Mullah gives the clarion call of Ummah, all these "poor Palestinians" will be cheering the killing of non-muslims at Islamic hands. Israel's actions are aligned to the long term needs of every non-muslim society which wants humanity to progress. any weakness shown by non-Muslims to Islamics will in the long-term lead to more Jihadization. so, any such weakness directly paves the way for Islamic takeover of previously non-muslim lands and societies. so any country or society which will go to any extent to wipe out any vestiges of violent fantasies that Jihadis have, is a country or society whose thinking is aligned to the long-term needs of human civilization.

Israel happens to be one such country. the only one in the current situation.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 17 Nov 2012 10:25

Israel apologists on prowl. Israel or Palestian, they are cut from the same fabric. Rabid monotheism with little respect for others. Jiska laati uska khuladi, abhi laati Israel,Europe, America khe haathon mein hain. All this sympathy towards either one is misplaced. Europe created Pakistan and Israel, and the World suffers.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 17 Nov 2012 12:27

RamaY wrote: The moment this equation changes the immigrants will start seeing all kinds of racism.

The equation has already started changing with economic depression and all that. And racist thinking is increasing at a very fast pace. Immigrants will be very vulnerable. But even among immigrants, PIOs will face the maximum danger. 'Cause they are one of the most affluent communities in US(like jews and chinese) with least amount of firepower/Military skills and minimum political patronage. Plus an Indian kid is raised to be a pacifist* from day 1.This is an extremely toxic combination and has been so since the begining of time. They are going to be shafted by whites,Blacks,Hispanics and probably even the GOTUS.

They are going to be on wrong side wrt Class war.
They are going to be on wrong side wrt any religious conflict.
They are going to be on wrong side of any racial conflict
They are going to be on wrong side of any renewed tax collection and anti business efforts from GOTUS.

*Euphemism for wimp

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 17 Nov 2012 12:39

Bade wrote:Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal: Republicans ‘have to make serious changes’ told you so. so what took him so long ?

Republicans and conservatives have already lost the culture war. America is now a nation which leans towards the left. Plus the left controls the media and academia in order to influence the popular culture. There is very less hope for conservatives until unless they are willing to explore Extra-electoral means to achieve power.

Any way America is no longer bipolar polity as it used to be. I mean if one looks at state level it will be amply clear. California will always elect democratic party. Texas will always vote Republican.Ditto for most of the other states(except the swing states). The only things that will improve from such a scenario are Cronyism, Corruption and nepotism. American Democracy is finally dead. Long live Democracy

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 17 Nov 2012 13:14

^^ American left is not left leaning by world standard. It is in fact considered right by Indian and European standard while American right the republicans are extreme right.
So the notion that America is leaning left is a myth at best it is Right centre with majority being right leaning with sprinkled centred policies in it.
By London standard, I found America a little racist country with strong undercurrent amount dissatisfied non white population. Things may be changing though.

Suppiah · Post by **Suppiah** » 17 Nov 2012 13:31

SwamyG wrote:Israel apologists on prowl. Israel or Palestian, they are cut from the same fabric. Rabid monotheism with little respect for others.

But only one of those rabid monotheists threaten India and its very existence. We need Israel to survive, at least until end of oil era or take out the entire ME, including Pakabaric animals using its nukes so that the curse of jehadi terrorism is gone, once for all.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 17 Nov 2012 13:41

Israel == Pakistan is a false equivalency and should be done only when one is skilled enough to use it for rhetorical advantage for Indian talking points. IMHO onlee

shyam · Post by **shyam** » 17 Nov 2012 15:02

Republican Party is now going to handle the Latino demographic issue in US

Now Meet The Unstoppable Half-Hispanic, Veteran Son Of Jeb Bush

George P Bush.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 17 Nov 2012 15:15

SwamyG wrote:Israel apologists on prowl. Israel or Palestine, they are cut from the same fabric. Rabid monotheism with little respect for others.

Judaism is not into proselytism.
Israel is not holding onto Indian territory.
Jews and Indians do not have any historical ax to grind.

Since you mentioned monotheism ...!

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 17 Nov 2012 15:32

Gus wrote:Israel == Pakistan is a false equivalency and should be done only when one is skilled enough to use it for rhetorical advantage for Indian talking points. IMHO onlee

When common Jews from Israel show tendency to fire rockets at Mecca and Medina, at that time one could think of ==. A small minority of the globe can hardly be == to Islamics which are in global majority along with Christians.

vishvak · Post by **vishvak** » 17 Nov 2012 15:45

About social scene in the finest of the first world country, USA
Tampa Is Seen as Social Link for Unfolding Scandal

the social link between Tampa’s military and civilian elite is at the center of an unfolding Washington scandal
..
according to a report in The Tampa Bay Times, which said the Kelleys owed a bank nearly $2.2 million, including attorney fees, .. They also ran a cancer charity
..
Their parties, though, were the talk of the town
..
The couple appeared to be well regarded at MacDill, home to the Central Command, which runs the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and hosts officers from more than 50 foreign countries, and the Special Operations Command, which trains commandos for missions like the one that killed Osama bin Laden. The two sit side by side on the base
..
MacDill Air Force Base is a driving force behind the Tampa economy. The local Chamber of Commerce estimates that $6.7 billion a year flows into the Tampa Bay area from the base. Military contractors and other defense-related companies dot the city. Business deals are often made in the plentiful strip clubs and steakhouses.
..
The community, meanwhile, welcomes commanders who are outsiders when they arrive.
..
Ms. Kelley worked hard to develop that closeness, and functioned as a kind of social liaison between the military commanders and the community. But some here were a bit suspicious of her.
..
Tampa is, at heart, a conservative Southern city(??) whose most prominent citizens have lived here for decades. Ms. Kelley, a daughter of Lebanese immigrants who grew up in Philadelphia, and her husband, Scott, a cancer surgeon, are still regarded as newcomers.
..
When foreign dignitaries visited the Central Command, the command’s generals could count on the Kelleys to host a dinner in the dignitaries’ honor. Even as news of Ms. Kelley’s connection to the emerging Petraeus scandal began spreading Sunday evening, the deputy commander of the Central Command, Vice Adm. Robert S. Harward, was attending a party at her bayside home.

Everything is private in USA. The bank may have to deal with unrecoverables of course however. The nation as a whole may not get credit of hosting foreigners, considered 'dignitaries' by default in Tampa Bay area. I expect not much is known about the deals made by private corporations in Tampa Bay of course.

Can someone throw light on this:

“Tampa is the kind of community where, if you’re new to the community, you can carve out your own niche,” said Pam Iorio, the city’s former mayor, who recalls mingling with Mr. Petraeus and his wife, Holly, at the Kelleys’ home. “They decided to carve out a niche with the military.”

Sanku · Post by **Sanku** » 17 Nov 2012 15:57

SwamyG wrote:Europe created Pakistan and Israel, .

Err Europe did not create Israel, it has been around for over 3000 years now.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 17 Nov 2012 16:36

SwamyG wrote:Israel apologists on prowl. Israel or Palestian, they are cut from the same fabric. Rabid monotheism with little respect for others. Jiska laati uska khuladi, abhi laati Israel,Europe, America khe haathon mein hain. All this sympathy towards either one is misplaced. Europe created Pakistan and Israel, and the World suffers.

If the Palestinans had the kind of Miltary superiority which Isreal enjoys, there would be no Isreali alive.

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 17 Nov 2012 19:26

the comparison between Jews and Muslims is there only to an extent. they are both monotheists. they are both Abrahamic ideology followers.

the comparison ends there. the Judaic branch doesn't have proselytizing. this makes them much much much less rabid. it is the proselytizing Abrahamics who are always the most rabid. EJ's and Islamics are both cut from the same cloth in this aspect.

sympathy for Israel is both practical and also natural in today's world, if one clearly understands the difference between the proselytizing and non-proselytizing branches. and the fact that the non-proselytizing constantly keeps the proselytizing Islamics unstable and off their expansion game makes the Israelis a vehicle of human progress. there is no exaggeration here. Every word is meant fully. any force which fights the proselytizing Abrahamics and their penchant for universal domination is a "good" force. either willfully or inadvertently, they are helping humanity.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 17 Nov 2012 21:51

SwamyG wrote:That speaks volumes about how India has zero respect and lobbying power in the corridors of power, while Israel continues to act as a world class bully. Power respects the powerful? Or the squeaky wheel gets the oil. I feel India is good at handling crisis and better at preventing crisis. However, in international politics a country should be able to create crisis. India is always in the mode of preventing and defusing trouble. Is it because the babus feel leaving the sleeping dogs is beneficial? History shows countries and kingdoms that proactively needles other has the potential to capture imagination and respect. Or is India the only civilization all country says 'boss all this taller creation and limelight are just flash in the pan, victory and losses are transient onlee'. Is it continuing to take hits and laughing at the naïveté of the rest of the world? Is it content with what it has and gets?

Come on India is not even a bit power worth listening to. Lobbyists will take India's money and some senator Congressman will say some soothing words. India also does not have the European lineage like Israel does to be a natural US ally.

India is on its own. But who will take India seriously when entire elite chatter class in New Delhi invite a terrorist like Musharaff to Hindustan Times summit and listen to him do equal equal and make outrageous demands like bigger country must compromise. Compromise what? This man dispatched terror squads into India, he invaded India in Kargil, and yet he gets a red carpet welcome in Delhi. As I mentioned once before, I won't be surprised as part of pee-pee contact, next India will invite Hafeez Pig on one of these summits and Bharka Dutt will interview him. Thoo.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 17 Nov 2012 22:07

Forget about all this history, the winners write history anyway, Palestinians have been robbed, cheated, bludgeoned, and de-humanized by the US-led European colonialists. But thats not what "history" will tell you because the European victors wrote it.

Leaving history aside, the India-TSP-US and Israel-Palestinian-US equations differ in many aspects. In the former, TSP has launched savaged terrorist attacks and challenged India to a nuke war, with US pretty much on its side, with the initial motive of getting India to negotiate as equa equal, which they have achieved. Plus we have gone through this many times, the abundance of 5th columnists and WKK cowards on the Indian side. So in in the India-TSP-US equation, the deck is heavily in favor of TSP.

In the Israel-Palestinian-US equation, the power disparity is so lopsided, I mean US slavish support to Israel is so complete, that if Palestinians are viewed as human beings by Israel and US, they will be lucky. Israel can annihilate every Palestinian, man, woman, and child and yet face not even a whiff of an admonition from US and its western lackeys. The WWII holocaust of Jews that Palestinians had nothing to do with, will always be used to justify any barbarity by Israel. Also, unlike India, Israel has nothing but contempt at the very idea of sitting with Palestinians in an equal footing to talk; all they want is total subjugation of Palestinians.

Under the circumstances, I don't understand what it is that Hamas is hoping to achieve by lobbying a few rockets every now and then. Unlike India shivering in its dhothi at the thought of TSP pigLeTs and nukes, Israel is waiting for each opportunity that Hamas presents to achieve its goal of complete subjugation. So whats Hamas trying to achieve?

devesh · Post by **devesh** » 18 Nov 2012 00:00

Israel has been fortunate that it is located in a geography which makes it useful for US to support them. rest of the factors like European lineage, etc, are meaningless. if it was beneficial to get rid of Israel, US would have done so long ago, notwithstanding the Ashkenazi European links.

Israel will continue to be supported by US, b/c otherwise, Sunni Islamics will take over the middle east. I don't understand why Indians can't see the simple point here: do we want a Middle East that is totally dominated by the Sunnis? do we understand what that means?

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 18 Nov 2012 00:50

CRamS wrote:Forget about all this history, the winners write history anyway, Palestinians have been robbed, cheated, bludgeoned, and de-humanized by the US-led European colonialists. But thats not what "history" will tell you because the European victors wrote it.

CRS ji, I think you have very less knowledge about Israel's history and under what conditions it was formed. Try to find out which colonial power was in charge of territories which currently form Israel and Palestine and its bias against jews.Find out what were Haganah,Irgun etc and who they were opposing and why. Also find out the timelines of various wars that Israel fought and won against against arabs and then check when GOTUS actually started supporting Israel. Check out the difference in size wrt both population and area between arabs and israel. Also read on the history of Arab-jew riots during 1920's and later. Also you must have heard how palestinians were driven from their lands.Please also try to find out how many jews were driven out from Arab lands in late 1940's. Infact also go ahead and try to learn how those jews were treated by Arab majority before that.

You have a lot to learn wrt Israel's history. I could have answered all of the above but for your learning sake it would be better if you found out.

And by the way do try to brush up on Islam by reading Quran + Muhammad's biography. That will make you amply clear who was and still is in the business of Robbing, Cheating, Bludgeoning and Dehumanizing the other. Add enslavement, Rape and Castration too.

Here is one link for an online English version of Quran( by three translators. all of whom were Muslims ).

http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 18 Nov 2012 06:20

Forget history crap yaar, there is enough on both sides. This being Indo-US thread, I only wish India would be like Israel in dealing with TSP, and US shower a faction of the love that it showers on Israel, on India

.

Incidentally, can Israel share some of those rocket busting missiles with India or will US make sure that does not happen when its TSP munna cries foul?

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 18 Nov 2012 06:30

Friends,

Does India really need someone's help to solve its problems and address its interests?

Now we are comparing ourselves with Israel (with due respect to that great nation)?

What next, afghanistan's independent streak?

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Nov 2012 09:55

Broad Continuity in India-US Ties expected
Among other things,

Overall India’s exports to the U.S. were said to have increased by a healthy 13.5 per cent in the first nine months of the year, with exports in goods touching $47.1 billion. While India continues to enjoy a net export surplus with the U.S. so far as goods are concerned, contrary to expectations it is the U.S. that has a surplus vis-a-vis its net services exports to India.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Nov 2012 10:03

CRamS wrote: I only wish India would be like Israel in dealing with TSP, and US shower a faction of the love that it showers on Israel, on India

India may not need Israel-like love from the US. TSP has survived for so long and had the audacity to terrorize India because of the US support (especially in the 80s and 90s as far as terrorism went). India needs US to back off from propping up Pakistan diplomatically, politically and militarily (and of course India needs to effectively have a policy and show some much wanted spine).

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 18 Nov 2012 11:16

Sridhar:

In any organization a person has to make efforts to be noticed and ask for more responsibility. The superiors assign the responsibility either when you have shown the capability to earn the job or if there is no other option.

The same parallels apply in foreign policy also, especially in a world without two well-defined camps. Indian foreign policy is very reactive. It does not take the lead in defining or defending her national interests. It does not show the capability, the intent, or the will to chart its own course.

India has to show that it is willing to assert for her interests and is willing to step out of its historical comfort zone for it to be "assigned" that larger role in the region. India's strategy seems to be earn the job when there is no alternative. Attitudes will change, and India will likely get greater control of her destiny, once she shows the willingness to assert for power. But as long as she acts supine, powers will cultivate alternatives for their own needs. Once it is clear that she is the top-dog of the region, the powers will go through her.