J & K news and discussion

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 28 Aug 2010 13:35

Arms, ammunition seized from Poonch militant hideout http://in.news.yahoo.com/139/20100828/8 ... h-m_1.html

NGO provides free ambulance services in Kashmir http://in.news.yahoo.com/139/20100828/8 ... ces_1.html

Hardline separatist Andrabi arrested http://in.news.yahoo.com/20/20100828/14 ... ted_1.html

chaanakya · Post by **chaanakya** » 28 Aug 2010 19:36

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 451416.cms

Hardline woman separatist leader Asiya Andrabi, believed to be one of the masterminds of the current unrest in the Kashmir Valley, was arrested from a hideout here on Saturday, police said.

jagga · Post by **jagga** » 28 Aug 2010 19:59

The other Kashmir problem

While the world focuses on the flood-ravaged Indus River valley, a quiet geopolitical crisis is unfolding in the Himalayan borderlands of northern Pakistan, where Islamabad is handing over de facto control of the strategic Gilgit-Baltistan region in the northwest corner of disputed Kashmir to China. The entire Pakistan-occupied western portion of Kashmir stretching from Gilgit in the north to Azad (Free) Kashmir in the south is closed to the world, in contrast to the media access that India permits in the eastern part, where it is combating a Pakistan-backed insurgency. But reports from a variety of foreign intelligence sources, Pakistani journalists and Pakistani human rights workers reveal two important new developments in Gilgit-Baltistan: a simmering rebellion against Pakistani rule and the influx of an estimated 7,000 to 11,000 soldiers of the People’s Liberation Army.

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 28 Aug 2010 20:46

BJP Kashmir Dialogue:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pA9Q_lgDfhk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QK1VGfI_ ... re=related

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 28 Aug 2010 21:05

Family held after crossing LoC from Pakistan occupied Kashmir in Poonch http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_fa ... ch_1430038

Five members of a family were today apprehended by army after they crossed from Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (PoK) to this side of Line of Control (LoC) in Poonch district of the state today, defence sources said here.

A family of five members, including three children, of one Liaqat Hussain were taken into custody by army after they crossed LoC in Gantarian sector of the border district this afternoon, they said.

Hussain, originally belonging to Kerni village of Poonch, had crossed to POK more than a decade earlier via LoC, they said adding the family would be handed over to police after preliminary questioning.

sum · Post by **sum** » 28 Aug 2010 21:09

Hardline separatist Andrabi arrested http://in.news.yahoo.com/20/20100828/14 ... ted_1.html

Congrats to the IB/JKP/<relevant agency> for the good work int racking her down...

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 28 Aug 2010 21:22

India troops thwart Kashmir separatist rally

Key separatists Syed Ali Geelani and Mirwaiz Umar Farooq were put under house arrest after Geelani called upon residents of Muslim-majority Kashmir to march to a football ground in the state summer capital Srinagar for a rally.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 28 Aug 2010 21:22

sum wrote:
Hardline separatist Andrabi arrested http://in.news.yahoo.com/20/20100828/14 ... ted_1.html
Congrats to the IB/JKP/<relevant agency> for the good work int racking her down...

She goes in and comes out after some time.
Same stuff.

vijayk · Post by **vijayk** » 28 Aug 2010 21:47

RoyG wrote:BJP Kashmir Dialogue:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pA9Q_lgDfhk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QK1VGfI_ ... re=related

This has been totally ignored by traitors in the national media whether it is India Today or Outlook or TOIlet. But the same suckers such as Prabhu Chawla would be licking the crap of Rahul Gndu if he had one such meeting. These low-lifers were so busy about "Oh! Rahul picked up a garbage bag or Oh! Rahul said one Oriya statement". But when it came to such an important discussion, it was toally ignored. I came to kno of this by a blog in TOIlet not the news item. This is how low our low-lifers are stooping to.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 28 Aug 2010 22:25

SSridhar wrote:Kashmir, Kashmiris and all that
A very sensible article unlike those of Suhasini Haider.
In 1971, my brother married a Kashmiri Hindu. So after nearly 40 years of discussion and observation, I can claim to have a somewhat better insight into the so-called Kashmir problem than most other commentators. They don't have the home advantage, so to speak.

Good one.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 28 Aug 2010 23:21

jamwal wrote:Kashmir, Kashmiris and all that

Very good article based on reality. He even busts Kashmiri pandits:

Also, many Kashmiri Hindus from the Valley used to look down on the rest of us. There is absolutely no historical reason for this but they just felt superior. Maybe they still do. Jawaharlal Nehru's Kashmiri provenance and Indira Gandhi's preference for Kashmiri Pandit political advisors strengthened this sense of superiority.

Probably similar to the "madrassi" condescending attitute of yester year. I have met some Kashmiri Pandits from time to time, but didn't sense any such supriority complex; however in my limited interaction, most of the KPs seem to be moving on in life, and didn't seem to care much for the events the valley; they probably see the fraud: Isalmic fascism masquerading as "secular azzadi"; and no politician in India have the guts to call it like it is.

Venkarl · Post by **Venkarl** » 28 Aug 2010 23:49

vijayk wrote:
RoyG wrote:BJP Kashmir Dialogue:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pA9Q_lgDfhk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QK1VGfI_ ... re=related
This has been totally ignored by traitors in the national media whether it is India Today or Outlook or TOIlet. But the same suckers such as Prabhu Chawla would be licking the crap of Rahul Gndu if he had one such meeting. These low-lifers were so busy about "Oh! Rahul picked up a garbage bag or Oh! Rahul said one Oriya statement". But when it came to such an important discussion, it was toally ignored. I came to kno of this by a blog in TOIlet not the news item. This is how low our low-lifers are stooping to.

Nice...I could see ANI's mic ..could not figure others...strange that a national party's efforts in "Dialogue" process were not covered by major media channels.

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 29 Aug 2010 02:21

Beijing gets de facto control over Gilgit

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 29 Aug 2010 03:48

^^ what are we doing watching show like bunch of jacks !! how is this possible ! why cant India attack this region and put is under Indian control or we dont have capability of putting 10k soldiers and chinki's have it !!

I think Indian leaders are bunch of cowards who can only loose when it comes to china and show bravado when it fights and wins against weak nations like pakis !!

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 29 Aug 2010 07:17

^^^ Since I am not allowed to criticize the motherland, all I can simply do is highlight the below:

At present, it takes 16 to 25 days for Chinese oil tankers to reach the Gulf. After the completion of the high-speed rail and road links through Gilgit and Baltistan are completed, China will be able to transport cargo from Eastern China to the new Chinese-built Pakistani naval bases at Gwadar, Pasni and Ormara, east of the Gulf, within 48 hours.

The article suggests that the PLA soldiers in the region would be working on the “infrastructure projects” in the region. While some would be working on the railroad, others would on extending the Karakoram Highway, which was built to link China’s Sinkiang province with Pakistan. Still some others would be working on dams, expressways and other projects.

“Mystery surrounds the construction of 22 tunnels in secret locations where Pakistanis are barred. Tunnels would be necessary for a projected gas pipeline from Iran to China that would cross the Himalayas through Gilgit. But they could also be used for missile storage sites”, Mr Harrison writes.

sourab_c · Post by **sourab_c** » 29 Aug 2010 08:49

Sanjay M wrote:^^^ Since I am not allowed to criticize the motherland, all I can simply do is highlight the below:

“Mystery surrounds the construction of 22 tunnels in secret locations where Pakistanis are barred. Tunnels would be necessary for a projected gas pipeline from Iran to China that would cross the Himalayas through Gilgit. But they could also be used for missile storage sites”, Mr Harrison writes.

This is a really appalling development. The least GOI can do is publicly criticize any such PLA activity in POK.

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 29 Aug 2010 08:56

I know conspiracy theories are not allowed but wasn't there a theory going around that the "gandhi clan dowager" was paid a hefty sum from China to look away on certain moves?

Sanjay M · Post by **Sanjay M** » 29 Aug 2010 09:35

Madame un-Pandit doesn't have to be paid any sum to look the other way - she simply instinctively doesn't identify with the place. She couldn't care less if there are Chinese troops busily burrowing into the territory which is supposed to be ours.

And remember, the party's traditional position has always been that "not a blade of grass grows there"

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 29 Aug 2010 09:43

Well as per Subramanium Swamy on twitter

China is banking on India's weak leadership to lump it. Top leaders have secret accounts in Macao. So not much protest.

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 29 Aug 2010 10:30

Kashmir's stone-pelters may be released before Eid http://sify.com/news/Kashmirs-stonepelt ... jbeib.html

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 29 Aug 2010 10:40

India is the bigger victim, not the Kashmiris - Kanwal Sibal

The Jammu and Kashmir problem has imposed heavy political, diplomatic and military costs on India for the last 63 years. It has excessively conditioned our external relations, with much of our diplomacy occupied over the years with explaining to other countries our position on J&K, warding off criticism, countering propaganda, opposing moves or resolutions in international forums adverse to us. India has faced a general lack of understanding for our predicament in J&K from the West for several reasons: the complexity of the problem, the issue of self-determination, political clouding of the issue in the UN because of cold war currents, the pro-Pakistan disposition of key Western countries because of Pakistan’s membership of western military alliances and India’s non-alignment and perceived pro-Soviet policies, etc. Our relations with the Muslim world have remained constricted because of our seeming ill-treatment of Kashmiri Muslims.

The recalcitrance, narrow-mindedness and insularity of the Kashmiri people have aggravated their own plight and the problem for the Indian government. They make a fetish of autonomy even while enjoying more autonomy than any other Indian state. It simply does not make sense for India to give more autonomy to a region that is externally coveted, is blighted with separatism, is plagued by terrorism and is prey to Islamic radicalism. The normal reaction of a state would be to secure and stabilise the situation first before releasing control. India has nevertheless respected Kashmiri autonomy in large measure, but this is not appreciated by the Kashmiris. They exhibit no commitment to the country’s integrity and show no understanding of the grave consequences for the rest of the country of azadi for them. The separatists confabulate openly with Pakistani leaders, align their political action and strategies to Pakistani interests, fly Pakistani flags, reject dialogue with Indian leaders, engage in campaigns against India in the OIC etc. They blame India for their sense of alienation, even though they have emotionally rejected their Indian identity from the beginning. They are complicit in destroying progressively their ‘Kashmiriyat’ — already in question after the expulsion of the Kashmiri Pandits — by absorbing radical Arabised Islamic ways. The stone-pelting spree inspired by the Palestinian intifada suggests a linking up of the struggle in Kashmiri to a wider Islamic agenda.

The dismissal of the prime minister’s recent well-meaning address that reached out to the Kashmiri youth and promised more job opportunities to them shows the intractability of Kashmiri attitudes towards India. Whatever the Indian mistakes in Kashmir, the sense of victimhood of the Kashmiris is politically engineered. The bigger victim of the Kashmir imbroglio is India

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 29 Aug 2010 11:39

SSridhar wrote:India is the bigger victim, not the Kashmiris - Kanwal Sibal
Whatever the Indian mistakes in Kashmir, the sense of victimhood of the Kashmiris is politically engineered. The bigger victim of the Kashmir imbroglio is India

[/quote]

What a magnificent narrative. This is a keeper. TSP knows exactly what KanwalJi is saying and hence their irredentism. The US-led white west also knows this and hence their vile games against India.

For once, without pontificating pompously over the internet, I can only empathize with the leadership of mother India; every one of them, BJP or Congress have tried to be reasonable, have begged, cajoled the KM perverts to let bygones be bygones and make a new beginning. But all to no avail.

The only mistake if at all India has made is to mask its enormous, colossal pain and suffering it continues to endure in building a great counrty (and Kashmir is crucial and vital in that endeavour) under the garb of "impending super power" horse manure. India must not shy away from highligting the pain and suffering it is enduring but with a sense of self-belief, a sense of pride, and never forgetting the sacrifices brave Indian jawans and officers have made in protecting India in Kashmir from medival Islamic barbrains; all of that in and itself is indicative of India's greatness.

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 29 Aug 2010 14:23

Hizbul militant surrenders with family in Kashmir http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20100829/81 ... ami_1.html

Jammu, Aug 29 (IANS) A Hizbul Mujahideen militant has returned from Pakistan- administered Kashmir and surrendered at the Line of Control (LoC) in Jammu and Kashmir's Poonch district along with his family, saying life was becoming increasingly difficult across the border, police sources said.

Liyakat, of Surankote area of Poonch district, surrendered before the Indian Army at the Gotrian post at the LoC Saturday evening. He also handed over his AK-47 assault rifle and some ammunition.

He was accompanied by his wife, Khalida, whom he had married when he had first returned from Pakistan-administered Kashmir in 2000, and three children.

The army handed over the militant and his family to the police.

He had first gone to the other side in 1999, returned in 2000, and after staying on in Jammu and Kashmir for two years, went back along with Khalida in 2001, police said.

Police sources disclosed that Liyakat revealed that the life for Kashmiri militants was becoming increasingly difficult across the LoC.

The sources quoted him as having told the interrogators that Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) officials were regularly visiting the training camps and exhorting them to cross over to the Indian side and step up subversive activities.

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 29 Aug 2010 14:46

Raghavendra wrote:Hizbul militant surrenders with family in Kashmir http://in.news.yahoo.com/43/20100829/81 ... ami_1.html

Jammu, Aug 29 (IANS) A Hizbul Mujahideen militant has returned from Pakistan- administered Kashmir and surrendered at the Line of Control (LoC) in Jammu and Kashmir's Poonch district along with his family, saying life was becoming increasingly difficult across the border, police sources said.

Liyakat, of Surankote area of Poonch district, surrendered before the Indian Army at the Gotrian post at the LoC Saturday evening. He also handed over his AK-47 assault rifle and some ammunition.

He was accompanied by his wife, Khalida, whom he had married when he had first returned from Pakistan-administered Kashmir in 2000, and three children.

New modus operandi to ensure return to India?

Surrendered militants are given lots of financial assistance and sometimes govt jobs.

The slimeball had the time to produce three little slimeballs too.

Kamboja · Post by **Kamboja** » 29 Aug 2010 15:09

Seems to me that the simplest long-term solution to Kashmir is demographic change. Repeal article 370 and open Kashmir up to immigration and investment from the rest of India. Encourage immigration and make KMs a minority, and therefore irrelevant. Then hold a plebiscite and bury the issue once and for all.

It mystifies me why demographic change in Kashmir has not been engineered by successive governments in New Delhi -- any insights on why this is, gurus?

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 29 Aug 2010 15:36

Kamboja wrote: It mystifies me why demographic change in Kashmir has not been engineered by successive governments in New Delhi -- any insights on why this is, gurus?

The demographic change has been earlier stealthily and now openly engineered by the sunnis in the valley. Arabisation is in current progress.

That andrabi banshee openly says that she is arab and not kashmiri. So much for kashmiriyat, what ever bull that is.

The sunnis have become emboldened by the passive namby pamby attitude of the centre.

Just let them pay realistic prices for the goods they get from the mainland India. A kick in the batwa sorts out any joker, roper or roler.

Anindya · Post by **Anindya** » 29 Aug 2010 19:58

Madhu Kishwar has been running a high pitched campaign on behalf of the secessionists and ethnic cleansers from Kashmir valley. But noticed that she'd taken an extra step in her latest threats on behalf of these secessionists - she actually seems to have started collaborating her activities with people who have admittedly been mules or collaborators of the ISI...

From http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?266882 we hear her say...

Show That We Care
....It is time that we, as citizens of India, show that we stand by the people of Jammu and Kashmir

Madhu Purnima Kishwar
.....
Imtiaz Ahmed Bazaz

Above she actually has no intentions of supporting the people of Leh in their travails, but she's actually shrieking in support of the stone throwers urban Kashmir - but, that is besides the point -

Who EXACTLY is Imtiaz Ahmed Bazaz?

It tuns out from http://www.satp.org/satporgtp/countries ... htaran.htm

The Jammu & Kashmir Police in May 2002 while ascertaining an Islamabad-London-Srinagar linked hawala (illegal money transfer) network arrested Imtiaz Ahmed Bazaz of Batmaloo. Bazaz, editor and publisher of a Srinagar magazine Mountain Valley reportedly confessed that he had approached Ayub Thakur, the London-based president of World Kashmir Freedom Movement for funneling Inter Services Intelligence (ISI) funds to the Dukhtaran-e-Millat chief Andrabi

If this is the same Imtiaz Ahmed Bazaz - then How low can Madhu Kishwar get?

Venkarl · Post by **Venkarl** » 29 Aug 2010 20:13

Kamboja wrote:Seems to me that the simplest long-term solution to Kashmir is demographic change. Repeal article 370 and open Kashmir up to immigration and investment from the rest of India. Encourage immigration and make KMs a minority, and therefore irrelevant. Then hold a plebiscite and bury the issue once and for all.

It mystifies me why demographic change in Kashmir has not been engineered by successive governments in New Delhi -- any insights on why this is, gurus?

Hajaar sweets to you for saying that Sir...a complete ban on media in J&K will settle everything down by itself.....everything you said in your post will happen naturally.

Bade · Post by **Bade** » 29 Aug 2010 20:49

Kamboja wrote: It mystifies me why demographic change in Kashmir has not been engineered by successive governments in New Delhi -- any insights on why this is, gurus?

Because New Delhi believes in Kashmiriyat/Pakistaniyat deeply. If any other Indian were to define similar cultural memes like Keraliyat or Bengaliyat we would be hounded out as anti-nationalists. But not so for even the leaders of Kashmir forget the mango abduls seeking azaadi from everything except dole.

sum · Post by **sum** » 29 Aug 2010 20:56

Madhu Kishwar has been running a high pitched campaign on behalf of the secessionists and ethnic cleansers from Kashmir valley. But noticed that she'd taken an extra step in her latest threats on behalf of these secessionists - she actually seems to have started collaborating her activities with people who have admittedly been mules or collaborators of the ISI...

Did anyone see the "We the people" 15 minutes back ( 8 PM IST)?

It had Madam Burkha with a few youngsters from all over the state ( mostly KMs with few KMs from Jammu and 1 person each from Pandit, Sikh and Ladakh).

The only thing which there was a consensus was that Azadi is the way out and it might not be too far. The chosen non-KMs also wholeheartedly spoke in favour of Aazadi ( seems that they visited the valley and felt the genuine feelings of the people there whereas they were against the KMs earlier)!!!! Truely felt like a show from PTV.

Since NDTV and Barkha are known to be virtual mouthpieces of the UPA-II ( Like SV is the print mouthpiece in the Hindu), is this a trial balloon being floated by GoI?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 29 Aug 2010 21:04

I think so. stage is being prepared for some 'statesmanlike' initiative during the obama visit - aka 'spineless cave in to american/paki demands'

afterall we would not want obama sir to leave IGI without a nobel peace prize opp under his belt?

Carl_T · Post by **Carl_T** » 29 Aug 2010 21:07

chetak wrote:
Kamboja wrote: It mystifies me why demographic change in Kashmir has not been engineered by successive governments in New Delhi -- any insights on why this is, gurus?
The demographic change has been earlier stealthily and now openly engineered by the sunnis in the valley. Arabisation is in current progress.

That andrabi banshee openly says that she is arab and not kashmiri. So much for kashmiriyat, what ever bull that is.

The sunnis have become emboldened by the passive namby pamby attitude of the centre.

Just let them pay realistic prices for the goods they get from the mainland India. A kick in the batwa sorts out any joker, roper or roler.

What would be the end result of a "demographic change"? All these things are superficial solutions.

IMO we just need to get used to the violence unless we develop the will to dismantle the regime next door.

Raghavendra · Post by **Raghavendra** » 29 Aug 2010 22:02

Another wanted leader of Geelani's Hurriyat faction held http://www.newkerala.com/news2/fullnews-30879.html

Srinagar, Aug 29 : Police on Sunday arrested Muhammad Shafi Rishi, the acting chairman of separatist Democratic Political Movement (DPM), an important constituent of the Syed Ali Geelani-led Hurriyat group.

"Rishi was arrested from Bab Demb area of old city today (Sunday) along with four of his associates whose identity we are presently establishing," a senior police officer said here.

Rishi's arrest comes barely a day after the arrest of Syeda Asiya Andrabi, the chief of women's separatist group Dukhtaran-e-Milat (Daughters of the Faith) who was arrested from Zakura area of summer capital Srinagar Saturday.

Rishi, along with Andrabi and Masrat Alam, another leader of Geelani's Hurriyat faction has been on the wanted list of the police since the last two months.

The authorities here believe these three separatist leaders have been playing an important role in carrying forward the "Quit Kashmir" campaign announced by their group.

Alam is, however, still yet to be traced.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 29 Aug 2010 23:10

sum wrote:Did anyone see the "We the people" 15 minutes back ( 8 PM IST)?

It had Madam Burkha with a few youngsters from all over the state ( mostly KMs with few KMs from Jammu and 1 person each from Pandit, Sikh and Ladakh).

The only thing which there was a consensus was that Azadi is the way out and it might not be too far. The chosen non-KMs also wholeheartedly spoke in favour of Aazadi ( seems that they visited the valley and felt the genuine feelings of the people there whereas they were against the KMs earlier)!!!! Truely felt like a show from PTV.

If I were an anchor, I would have said in response that Indian govt and rest of India will not allow "azaadi" in a secessionist sense and would ask the perverst gathered as to what would their response be? Did Bakara present this viewpoint?

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 29 Aug 2010 23:59

^^^ From what I see Bakara is getting a major beating from people on Twitter and other social media. She must be either strongly ideologically aligned or her moolah is contingent upon this line.
If we pobably connect the money flow of the so called intellectuals tomtoming the terrorist line of thought, I am certain we will see interesting trajectories.
Maybe the gurus can illustrate how this works.

krisna · Post by **krisna** » 30 Aug 2010 00:21

Kashmir: youth bulge, peace deficit

From 1971, Jammu and Kashmir began to record growth rates far in excess of the national average. From the time of the 1971 census, decadal population growth in the State hovered around 30 per cent, significantly higher than the national average. In the build-up to the insurgency, the 1981 census found, over 40 per cent of the Kashmir region's population was made up of children under 14. Put simply, the economic gains of the first decades of independence had run up against a demographic wall.

In a 1987 study of Kashmir's demographics, Kanan Kusum Sadhu found that despite their relative affluence “the Kashmiri Pandits and Muslims of Srinagar and Sopore are under more economic stress than the population of India as a whole.” Sadhu's findings were based on what demographers called the dependency ratio — that part of society dependent on economically-productive individuals aged between 15 and 59. The populations Sadhu sampled in Sopore and Srinagar had dependency ratios ranging between 91.5 to 94.9. The all-India ratio was 78.

Kashmir's jihadist movement emerged from urban centres like these: homes of artisans and small traders who had constituted the region's traditional middle-class but had lost both political power and economic muscle because of the economic policies adopted after independence. There was, as scholar Thomas Marks has argued: “a demographic tidal wave of unabsorbed youthful males appearing in the late 1980s, especially in Kashmir, just as political issues … called into question the legitimacy of the existing order.”

Today, over 70 per cent of Jammu and Kashmir's population is estimated to be under 35. Reliable figures are hard to come by but there is evidence of chronic unemployment and under-employment. Earlier this year, the State government invited young people to register with an entrepreneurship project targeting the unemployed; more than 6,00,000 have so far signed up.

Historians have long known this: too many young people with too little to do mean trouble.

India's ability to transform the youth crisis it faces in Kashmir could prove a testing ground for how it will face the challenges that lie ahead for the country as a whole. In the next two decades, India's working-age population will increase by a staggering 240 million people — in stark contrast to China, where the working-age population will begin to decline from 2015, or Russia, where it will have shrunk by 20 million. It is far from clear if India will be able to create opportunities for these enormous numbers of people; to educate and equip them to deal with the kinds of skills needed to capitalise on new economic opportunities.

Interesting read with demographics economy and unrest with examples of history.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 30 Aug 2010 00:55

sum wrote:Did anyone see the "We the people" 15 minutes back ( 8 PM IST)?

. . . Truely felt like a show from PTV.

I happened to see the programme though I normally avoid NDTV like plague.

One of her approaches was to shape an opinion, by putting words into the mouth of people. The other was to nod vigorously when secessionist feelings were expressed and cut short that lone guy who said otherwise. He said that the old mindset must change and the Kashmiris were not the only Muslims and there were millions in the whole of India etc. There was another Ladakhi who said that earlier the J&K government was completely neglecting the development of Ladakh whereas the Ladakh Autonomous Council has changed all that. He was also not allowed to speak much. Burkha Dutt cleverly picked on his 'autonomous' word and said Kashmir also needed autonomy (as Marten has posted above) !

The Kashmiri Hindus and the lone Sikh (I thought he was from Jammu) were also voicing the Kashmiri opinion. Then, there was a Kashmir-based Brazilian couple, a football coach, who said all those things that would please a Kashmiri. I was plainly surprised to find this Brazilian family living in Kashmir for three years now.

One sore point seemed to be the ID card issue. A KM lawyer asked why he should show his ID card, in his own motherland, to a Bihari or UP soldier. The Brazilian woman said that she felt irritated when she and other Kashmiris are asked to show the ID cards on the street.

Then, there was some emotional content too like children dying, women being raped etc. For her part, Ms. Burkha Dutt, of the your-terrorists-are-their-freedom-fighters fame, recalled some deaths whenever the participant was stumbling. If the idea of the programme was to really find the reasons behind the violence, there were enough opportunities for her to ask probing questions. She did not do so and allowed vagueness and azaadi-feelings, which are the hallmarks of Kashmiris (which seems independent of religious affiliations), to prevail.

On the whole, I realized the full meaning of the article I posted earlier. Please do read it to understand the Kashmiris. No wonder, the Abdullahs, the Muftis and the Hari/Karan Singhs behave(d) in the way they behave(d).

Venkarl · Post by **Venkarl** » 30 Aug 2010 02:05

sum wrote:Did anyone see the "We the people" 15 minutes back ( 8 PM IST)?

It had Madam Burkha with a few youngsters from all over the state ( mostly KMs with few KMs from Jammu and 1 person each from Pandit, Sikh and Ladakh).

The only thing which there was a consensus was that Azadi is the way out and it might not be too far. The chosen non-KMs also wholeheartedly spoke in favour of Aazadi ( seems that they visited the valley and felt the genuine feelings of the people there whereas they were against the KMs earlier)!!!! Truely felt like a show from PTV.

looks like NDTV etc are forcibly framing an opinion in an aam aadmi's brains that J&K will go tomorrow if not today....so no surprises please........a perfect stage is being set nicely for the secession....

It'd be interesting what GoI folks are doing to counter such things Or it may....?(don't want to read out MMS/Sonia chalisa)

Anindya · Post by **Anindya** » 30 Aug 2010 07:10

Jarita

There may be another connection that we need to look at:

Some time ago, Sandhya Jain had published this snippet about Haseeb Drabu - who clearly comes across as a secessionist:

Dr. Haseeb Drabu, a PDP admirer and ideologue, who was appointed as Chairman, Jammu & Kashmir Bank, just three days after he appeared on a popular television show and declared he is “neither for autonomy nor for Pakistan, but for an Independent Jammu and Kashmir,” by the PDP-Congress coalition government. He was recently granted another three years extension by the NC-Congress regime, perhaps to help fulfill the unfinished agenda of the State's secession.

Recently, Haseeb was asked to resign by the OA government.

Who is Haseeb Drabu and what is the connection to Barkha? Cannot confirm but at least a couple of mentions about the two being married.

Dipanker · Post by **Dipanker** » 30 Aug 2010 07:26

Venkarl wrote: It'd be interesting what GoI folks are doing to counter such things Or it may....?(don't want to read out MMS/Sonia chalisa)

As usual not much which is really frustrating for most Indians...