RamaY wrote:No need for allies. BJP should try and will get simple majority on its own under NM.
Can you please tell us RamaY ji how 272 seats will be taken? I certainly would like to see what you have in mind.
Everyone is fear mongering of NDA allies loosing Muslim vote bank to Congis because of NaMo, but no one is paying attention towards new Hindu vote "bank" that can be brought back to polling booth for voting first time should BJP decides to go in Poll campaign with NaMo as their PM face.
As is being discussed in the GDF thread(s). Where is this vote bank?
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 17 Apr 2013 19:19
by Vipin_Upadhyay
Sanku wrote:
As is being discussed in the GDF thread(s). Where is this vote bank?
If "tall" leaders of BJP keep doing what they are doing fat chance. Take out NaMo from BJP for a moment & you will notice Tarrel that mountain leaders look no different than Congis. Why average undecided Hindu will vote for BJP under LKA? Loh Purush credibility has gone down drain after Hawala & his ranting of Jinnah is sickoolar onlee. Even a dedicated Congressi like AK Antony as PM gives more hope than him.
You want to know where is vote bank for NaMo, you just need to see at ground, wherever NaMo goes, the way he pulls the crowd. If one member of a family gets to hear NaMo speech should be enough for him to convince whole family to vote for BJP under NaMo. His speech connects with average Bharatiya & their lost pride, brings fresh breath of self belief & national pride.
But to achieve this, big question is, when BJP 'toll" leaders will throw their weight behind NaMo & take him to campaign In UP where projecting NaMo as a man from OBC background will go a long way in consolidating Hindu votes that are divided in UP-Bihar. His OBC background has never been highlighted enough by BJP elites.
If BJP decides to campaign under NaMo they have one year, at least 200 large gatherings of NaMo & Rajnath addressing together rallies in UP-Bihar land will do the trick & number outcomes close to 200. Post poll alliances can be made afterwards.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 17 Apr 2013 20:03
by Vipin_Upadhyay
BJP goes in UP-Bihar with NaMo as PM, full projection of his humble OBC background among rural UP Hindus following result possible:
Maharashtra (combine SS) = 28
Karnataka =20
Chattisgarh = 10
Jharkhand =9
Himachal =3
Punjab (BJP+SAD) = 10
West Bengal =2
Dilli = 5
Central Territories = 3
This gives close to 200. Now go for post poll alliance with AIADMK, BJD etc..
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 17 Apr 2013 23:41
by Sanku
Vipin_Upadhyay wrote:
Sanku wrote:
As is being discussed in the GDF thread(s). Where is this vote bank?
If "tall" leaders of BJP keep doing what they are doing fat chance..
Circular logic. First claim there is a vote bank, then ask where it is, say that it wont be if you keep doing what you are doing.
I have said this before and I will say this again, having these discussions without the numbers to back them up will not mean anything. It will be your word vs my word etc. Unless there are hard numbers which can be used for discussion, making such conjectures does not get too far.
Since we have beaten this to death in the NaMo thread, I will stop.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 00:01
by Sanku
Vipin_Upadhyay wrote:
This gives close to 200. Now go for post poll alliance with AIADMK, BJD etc..
Without getting into the sanctity of those numbers, and whether, they need NaMo or whether they can also come without NaMo -- please answer this.
Orissa has 21 seats, TN has 39.
Are you giving them all to BJD and Amma? Because your numbers do not add up to 272.
Also you have 372 seats left out. Why will a third front not come into existence propped by congress? After all, if Nitish does not go with BJP, isnt assuming that BJD and Mamata would prefer BJP over third front far too tenuous?
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 05:36
by Victor
The thing that bothers me about NaMo is so many hopes and prayers riding on just one guy. I feel he should have leveraged his record and groomed and showcased at least a couple of trusted replacements who could step into his shoes if needed without too much trouble.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 05:50
by Satya_anveshi
^^ unfortunately the succession plan in Indian politics is weakly executed. I am sure there are good reasons behind it. In opportunity/ alliance based situations, overt/declared succession could be a weakness; the successor becomes an object of bidding game. It is also a function of maturity of voting public, which "Gandhi" family deliberately cultivated around personalities. That is really the biggest gripe most folks have with die-nasty politics.
That means, in the current dynamics we have to make choice based on "less/least evil" principle.
Ideally, for example, instead of Advani vs Modi debate/contest, it should be Advani who needs declare Modi as one of his top x (x<=3) choices and get as much support to Modi as possible.
Similarly, Modi needs to emphasize that he will have a good succession plan in place and use that to call for support from the geriatrics within BJP/NDA.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 05:55
by shiv
Come on people Give Advani a chance. last chance...Why finish off Modi by saddling this whole country on him? Everyone comes out injured.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 06:14
by nachiket
If Modi is to be shielded (which I don't agree with), then SS, Jaitley or even Rajnath Singh is a better PM candidate than Advani. Advani should campaign during the elections to gather more support for the BJP using his residual popularity. But an 85 year old has no business running the country. He'll end up like the BJP version of MMS. He would have made a good PM, 10-15 years ago. But not anymore.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 07:10
by pentaiah
LKg is a failure model
Na pickup na milage gadi ek dam jam ka nahi
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 08:02
by Satya_anveshi
When Hajpayee was PM, real rulers were his chamchas. His PMO was comprised of people with questionable loyalties.
I suspect it will be no different with Hajvani.
Further, let's not forget that some leader are better off not being #2/#3s. They feel chocked and get blunted. Failure in lower positions will guarantee that he will never have a chance at No1. The exact problem that Hajvani has.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 13:04
by harbans
There is one way Loh Purush can make history as PM and fade away as possibly India's greatest PM of steel/ loh. But for that an elaborate plan has to be hatched and conducted with finesse. NM should manifest openly and loudly his plank on development/ governance/ improving justice system/ bringing law and order in order/ increasing investments etc. Loh should campaign on issues like great power status etc of making India a military superpower. Loh must reiterate he will be like ABV in power and he must be like ABV was for the 1st 3 months. NM and Loh must create a charade of not liking each others agenda about differences in approach. The TN device must never be mentioned. Loh should be crowned PM and detonate a string of lightweight TN devices one after the other and get the deterrent right. Sanctions will be declared rightaway, markets will go down..NM then must make some noises that the focus on development and governance are key and within intraparty meetings handled with full open press cover, make cause for retirement of Loh and takeover by NM. NM should get back India into mainstream and promise no more TN tests and moratorium and focus on development. Sanctions are lifted and markets back where they belong..NM becomes PM by Sept 2014. Loh goes down as the Loh himself. Anyways just loud thinking..
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 13:20
by harbans
Another deal that can be done with Niku is this, that BJP will go with NM as projected PM. If they succeed vastly then it will make sure still they will hand over CMship of Bihar (and no interference from non secular PM NM) to Niku plus some Central ministries. If NM does not succeed then it's business as usual between JD and BJP. So if NM led BJP to come into power needs seats then NM gives way to Loh, but if BJP wins majorly because of NM then for Niku all is not lost, he still retains options, possible CM ship and some central ministries. A win win for him both ways and some challenge for Modi, which i am certain he will relish. JMT/
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 14:00
by Sanku
harbans wrote:..NM becomes PM by Sept 2014. Loh goes down as the Loh himself. Anyways just loud thinking..
Good plan, but damages NaMo's "hard man" credentials. That might be counter productive.
But that is a nitpick on the detail, broad strokes, I like.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 14:19
by RajeshA
harbans wrote:There is one way Loh Purush can make history as PM and fade away as possibly India's greatest PM of steel/ loh. But for that an elaborate plan has to be hatched and conducted with finesse. NM should manifest openly and loudly his plank on development/ governance/ improving justice system/ bringing law and order in order/ increasing investments etc. Loh should campaign on issues like great power status etc of making India a military superpower. Loh must reiterate he will be like ABV in power and he must be like ABV was for the 1st 3 months. NM and Loh must create a charade of not liking each others agenda about differences in approach. The TN device must never be mentioned. Loh should be crowned PM and detonate a string of lightweight TN devices one after the other and get the deterrent right. Sanctions will be declared rightaway, markets will go down..NM then must make some noises that the focus on development and governance are key and within intraparty meetings handled with full open press cover, make cause for retirement of Loh and takeover by NM. NM should get back India into mainstream and promise no more TN tests and moratorium and focus on development. Sanctions are lifted and markets back where they belong..NM becomes PM by Sept 2014. Loh goes down as the Loh himself. Anyways just loud thinking..
Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi faces an assassination attempt, writer-academic Madhu Kishwar said on Twitter, creating a flutter on social media and political circles.
"Yesterday met some senior govt officers who said Modi's assassination real possibility if Teesta Congress fail to get fraud FIR against Modi," the senior fellow at Centre for the Study of Developing Societies tweeted on Wednesday.
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harbans wrote: Loh goes down as the Loh himself. Anyways just loud thinking..
There's a lot of Arun Jaitley's mode of thinking here. There is such a precedent of paying a political price within the BJP because of lack of manoeuvring room on the national stage, hence a lot of trade-offs within the party to ensure optimal medium term outcomes. Eminently doable but they need to make sure that the sordid chapter of succession rows in Karnataka does not repeat at the Centre.
@ RajeshA: could you modify the poll by removing Sonia Gandhi and adding Sharad Pawar?
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 18 Apr 2013 21:29
by ramana
err, MHA and Shinde have hardly any credibility regarding terror attacks. Most likely they will blame BJP and saffron bandits if NaMo is attacked and assing the NIA to cover up the case going by track record so far.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 19 Apr 2013 16:47
by RajeshA
Klaus wrote:@ RajeshA: could you modify the poll by removing Sonia Gandhi and adding Sharad Pawar?
Klaus ji,
can't edit now. It is too late! One can of course, express one's support for another candidate as a post. Not as good, but ...
However I think it is important that Sonia Gandhi remain on this poll, and one can gauge her immense popularity among Indians.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 19 Apr 2013 17:00
by KJo
Which 2 sajjans chose Amul Baby?
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 24 Apr 2013 14:11
by RajeshA
Cross-posting from the "Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India" Thread
Pranav wrote:
RajeshA wrote:
Would RSS allow it?
Politicians don't really work in void and isolation. A politician is a politician only if he has a few people supporting him! Would Advani do anything where he is the lone voice standing?
Right now, nobody and I mean NOBODY can really stop Modi, as long as the Karyakartas of BJP have embraced him in their hearts!
See RajeshA ji, you talk about Karyakartas tearing people and embracing Modi in their hearts etc but you need to think through the sequence of events and the timeline.
Advani still thinks of himself as the tallest leader. He has a brute force majority in the parliamentary board and he is certainly not in the mood to step aside any time soon.
Sure Advani could be having many in the Parliamentary Board who are his supporters, but Advani is almost 86 and so they have to think about a time when he is not around, about a time when he cannot shield them anymore, about their own future careers and position in the party.
It would be suicidal for them to go ahead against the wishes of all Karyakartas and RSS and take Advani's side, proclaiming him PM, should he insist on it. Advani too knows that even if some are his proteges, they have to look after their own interests too.
Sure they may fear that if Modi becomes PM, they can hang their ambitions for PMship on a hanger and pack them away for ever. There is fear whether Modi would continue to work with them when he indeed becomes PM or would he ride roughshod over them.
And as such it would take some time for their egos too to adjust to the dawning reality of Modi and try to work with him, rather than against him.
Modi would finish off anybody who stands against him. This he has shown in Gujarat. But otherwise he too is a team player.
So either others adjust to the new reality, let go of their own ambitions, be satisfied with their number two positions, and thus retain some semblance of dignity and continuation, or they would become non-entities, if they choose to stand against Modi. Modi isn't going to throw them out, if they are willing to cooperate and help and take responsibility.
Otherwise it is political suicide!
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 24 Apr 2013 15:32
by RajeshA
Cross-posting from the "Narendra Modi vs the Dynasty: Contrasting Ideas of India" Thread
Carl wrote:Another angle I was thinking of was how both Britain and China have courted Modi in the recent past.
Usually it is shown to be an offer of peace and cooperation, with a little hint that they would like to help if they can as they are "friends". The initial help comes as token gifts - using their global network to influence an individual here, a businessman there, a journalist here, or bring out a positive piece in a "reputed" publication, perhaps let some businessmen in India, who have business relations with China, know that the "friend" needs some help, etc.
However often it is the same parties who create further obstacles for the "friend", so that the "friend" can come and seek their help!
As this "credit" is given on easy terms or no explicit terms other than building good relationships, often the "friend" ends up taking too much on this "credit line" and while at it, exposes too much of one's worries to these power-brokers.
At some point the "friend" ends up compromising himself by doing something which is outside the "books", asking a favor, whose evidence can later prove damaging if exposed.
Later due to such implicit blackmail potential, the "friend" ends up becoming part of the same network.
That is the trajectory, power-brokers aim at! And most certainly they would try something similar with Narendra Modi as well.
It is possible that he may not be averse to these power-brokers giving him some leeway initially thinking that later on they could net him as well.
It is however a different thing to think he would give in.
Actually Modi would be getting many offers from people who would be offering him different favors, and promising him to ease his path to power.
It is possible that many are paranoid about him, because he has defied their offers of favors till now.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 24 Apr 2013 15:43
by member_20317
KJoishy wrote:Which 2 sajjans chose Amul Baby?
One is Atri ji. He confessed.
Other one is RAA Agent.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 24 Apr 2013 15:45
by RajeshA
Finally somebody gave Manmohan Singh a vote as well!
'Why should allies interfere in BJP's choice of PM candidate?'
Unlike the JD(U) which has sought a "secular" prime ministerial candidate, the Shiromani Akali Dal (SAD) is willing to support whoever the BJP selects.
Speaking at the Express Adda organised in Mumbai on Tuesday, Punjab Deputy Chief Minister Sukhbir Singh Badal said, "BJP is the largest party of the NDA and it is their right to decide who the prime ministerial candidate should be. Why should the allies interfere?"
Describing Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi as a "very fine man... dynamic and decisive", Badal said, "we have sent our teams to Gujarat a number of times to learn the best practices followed by that state."
However, he said "nobody can replace" former prime minister A B Vajpayee. "I think we need to preserve the qualities of the old leadership. Their commitment to the cause and struggle cannot be found in the current leadership," he said.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 27 Apr 2013 17:40
by chaanakya
Well I took pity on poor powerless widow.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 27 Apr 2013 19:21
by RajeshA
chaanakya ji,
I always looked upon them as the Virgin and the Son. The virginity!
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 27 Apr 2013 20:16
by chaanakya
That Riddle I have not been able to solve yet.
RajeshA ji.
Re: Who Should be India's PM in 2014?
Posted: 27 Apr 2013 21:00
by RajeshA
chaanakya ji,
I was just joking! Only zero votes means virginity, but once one clicks in the "circle" in order to vote, the "virginity" is gone!
It was simply a joke! No need to dwell too much on it!